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Simple question about Daniel Jones this past Monday

NoGainDayne : 9/28/2022 10:26 am
I do think he played his best game of the season and showed some serious grit. However I found this lingering after the game.

Did anyone have any confidence that he was going to lead the team down the field on the last drive?

I didn't, not even a little. I was always confident in Eli no matter what kind of game it was, his protection etc.

Players can feel that too, our players, the other teams. I think that's really what it comes down to for me and DJ. I want to be able to watch a team on that kind of drive that I'm amped up to watch because I know they have a good shot. His receiver did fall down, that isn't his fault, but that doesn't change the fact that I was expecting a bad play to happen involving him.

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He's playing with JV recievers  
cjac : 9/28/2022 10:28 am : link
and a freshman O-line

I thought with analytics you don’t go on feelings?  
steve in ky : 9/28/2022 10:31 am : link
.
he hasn't the magic since his first start  
GiantNatty : 9/28/2022 10:31 am : link
but hard to blame it on him when he's getting absolutely no help. like none. he's playing his nuts off but he has no one to throw to.

every time - EVERY time - they showed the behind angle, he had a guy in his face with no one even looking at him, never mind open. how can you blame him for that?

i was impressed that he got the FG score the possession before to make it a on-score game, but a TD in that scenario was a longshot for anyone.
I didn’t have confidence in the team overall  
10thAve : 9/28/2022 10:32 am : link
Not specifically with Jones. I was expecting him to have a long scramble or two, but most likely on my mind were drops, more QB pressure, dumb penalties, or poor field awareness (players not getting out of bounds).
RE: He's playing with JV recievers  
NoGainDayne : 9/28/2022 10:32 am : link
In comment 15836343 cjac said:
Quote:
and a freshman O-line


It's not about that, to my point Eli could get hammered all day and had some real bad OLs but he had a different gear.

But to address the other thing. How is it that people can look at 4 years of college and 4 years of the NFL, have him never put up good numbers and it's always the fault of his teammates? It can't be everyone else's fault only, always.
I didn’t have confidence in the team overall  
10thAve : 9/28/2022 10:32 am : link
Not specifically with Jones. I was expecting him to have a long scramble or two, but most likely on my mind were drops, more QB pressure, dumb penalties, or poor field awareness (players not getting out of bounds).
RE: I thought with analytics you don’t go on feelings?  
NoGainDayne : 9/28/2022 10:33 am : link
In comment 15836349 steve in ky said:
Quote:
.


I post about lots of different things, seems like you just mostly like to grumble at people about BS. Congratulations on all the value you provide
RE: RE: He's playing with JV recievers  
cjac : 9/28/2022 10:34 am : link
In comment 15836352 NoGainDayne said:
Quote:
In comment 15836343 cjac said:


Quote:


and a freshman O-line




It's not about that, to my point Eli could get hammered all day and had some real bad OLs but he had a different gear.

But to address the other thing. How is it that people can look at 4 years of college and 4 years of the NFL, have him never put up good numbers and it's always the fault of his teammates? It can't be everyone else's fault only, always.


I'm not really defending him, i actually agree with you 100%, and i cant wait for him to not be on the Giants anymore.

I was just quoting Sy on his game review.

Even at 2-0 i was sticking to my 6 wins prediction, the Giants roster is awful
RE: RE: He's playing with JV recievers  
TrustTheProcess : 9/28/2022 10:36 am : link
In comment 15836352 NoGainDayne said:
Quote:
In comment 15836343 cjac said:


Quote:


and a freshman O-line




It's not about that, to my point Eli could get hammered all day and had some real bad OLs but he had a different gear.

But to address the other thing. How is it that people can look at 4 years of college and 4 years of the NFL, have him never put up good numbers and it's always the fault of his teammates? It can't be everyone else's fault only, always.


Actually, it’s literally the other way around. The narrative of Jones is he’s a turnover machine, and doesn’t have what it takes. The guy previous post is right. If he’s playing this well with a JV receiving core, and a “freshman” offensive line, and under a new system once again that he’s still getting comfortable with…. Why do people doubt him when ONE DAY, he might actually have established offensive line, a receiving core he can count on and their reliable, and a system he feels comfortable with? Has anyone even thought of that?
They’re*  
TrustTheProcess : 9/28/2022 10:39 am : link
.
He has no real receivers to throw to.  
johnnyb : 9/28/2022 10:42 am : link
This was mentioned a few times above. A leaky OL and receivers that would struggle to be on other NFL rosters stack the deck against him. Eli had some talent at the WR position- DJ does not.
with the way we were blocking  
UConn4523 : 9/28/2022 10:43 am : link
and no Shepard, no. This has been discussed ad nauseam this week, what's different about this thread?
No I do not have  
section125 : 9/28/2022 10:44 am : link
confidence he will lead them on a late drive, yet he did it in the 1st two games.
If Sills does not slip, they are out to the 40/45 yard line.

Whereas, before I though he had no chance, now I think he has a "chance." Hi legs alone is a great equalizer.
under pressure all night, receivers can't catch a ball let alone  
Dinger : 9/28/2022 10:49 am : link
get open or stay on their feet and the OL couldn't do a thing right, sans Thomas. Yet I felt like DJ could keep that drive alive. It was the recievers and the red zone I worried about. His feet alone would have gotten us to the dallas 20.
what Daniel Jones did in high school and college  
UConn4523 : 9/28/2022 10:55 am : link
is completely irrelevant. In fact, what he's done up until this season is also fairly irrelevant. I'm answering this question based on the 3 game sample size we've had under Daboll/Kafka's leadership and Jones has definitely improved, IMO. He's led us to 2 wins already and did what he needed to do to get a 3rd win against Dallas - it just didn't work out for a whole slew of reasons. While he doesn't have that "it" factor, he did enough on Monday night, the rest of the team did not.
Same question  
Big Al : 9/28/2022 10:56 am : link
if Aaron Rodgers was the qb with that personnel.
That throw to Sills looked to be on time and if Sills catches it  
Snablats : 9/28/2022 10:58 am : link
the Giants are near midfield with plenty of time left, and if he gets past Diggs it could be a long gainer

I would say we had no confidence in the OL to hold up for an entire drive to give Jones a chance to win the game
He did it in the first two games...  
KingBlue : 9/28/2022 11:00 am : link
So yeah, I believed he could. If Sills didn't fall down, who knows? There was plenty of time.
He did it in the first two games...  
KingBlue : 9/28/2022 11:00 am : link
So yeah, I believed he could. If Sills didn't fall down, who knows? There was plenty of time.
You cant compare him to Eli  
Rudy5757 : 9/28/2022 11:03 am : link
thats not fair. Eli always had above average to very good WRs. There are a lot of recent analytics that suggest that good WRs is greater than a good OL. Right now Jones has neither. Our OL performance and WRs are at the bottom of the league.
I was more concerned with the talent around him on last drive  
Blue21 : 9/28/2022 11:07 am : link
Than on him. I felt he could do it. Dropped passes and Sills slipped is what killed it. But we ll never know.
I was more concerned with the talent around him on last drive  
Blue21 : 9/28/2022 11:08 am : link
Than on him. I felt he could do it. Dropped passes and Sills slipped is what killed it. But we ll never know.
I did and he did it the last 2 games, so why wouldn't you  
PatersonPlank : 9/28/2022 11:11 am : link
believe he could? Plus he hit 2 WR's right in the guy and they both dropped the ball. Lets not rewrite history and forget he lead winning drives vs the Titans and Panthers. I get not wanting to keep him, but this constant drumbeat to invalid any positive result is maddening
Like OP said  
LawrenceTaylor56 : 9/28/2022 11:13 am : link
When Eli had the ball in the 4th quarter, I expected us to score some points. Every single time.

Jones, I expect at best a 35-45 yard FG.
RE: I did and he did it the last 2 games, so why wouldn't you  
UConn4523 : 9/28/2022 11:13 am : link
In comment 15836427 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
believe he could? Plus he hit 2 WR's right in the guy and they both dropped the ball. Lets not rewrite history and forget he lead winning drives vs the Titans and Panthers. I get not wanting to keep him, but this constant drumbeat to invalid any positive result is maddening


Its drivel at this point. Why should we act like week 1 and 2 didn't happen, along with putting them in position to win (or tie) in week 3 because he didn't lead Duke to more wins? Lol.

I don't think Jones is the long term answer either, but i'm going to be open minded about him and base his level of play on...gasp, his current level of play.
...  
broadbandz : 9/28/2022 11:16 am : link
I cant believe Jones didnt catch those passes and slipped trying to catch the ball on the last drive. Mahomes makes those catches in crunch time.
Really very little chance. Giants are not built whatsoever to go  
NYGgolfer : 9/28/2022 11:17 am : link
90 yards in less than 2 minutes. Dallas did exactly what they should have, play soft coverage, let time drain and wait for Giants to make a mistake. And that's what happened as Neal jumps offside and then the WR falls down for the int.

And even if Sills catches that ball, the Dallas defense would change how they played for the remaining 50+ yards. Do you have confidence the Giants score a TD in the red zone with just a few seconds?

Best chance Giants had on that drive was to start off sending everybody deep a few times and see if they could sneak Jones through for a couple of big QB runs and get to midfield. Then figure it out from there. Once he started passing, it was just a matter of time before they self-destructed.
If he had Plax  
mittenedman : 9/28/2022 11:19 am : link
Toomer and Steve Smith - maybe you'd feel differently.

Eli lost the late game magic at the end of his career too. I wonder why?
RE: If he had Plax  
Samiam : 9/28/2022 11:22 am : link
In comment 15836440 mittenedman said:
Quote:
Toomer and Steve Smith - maybe you'd feel differently.

Eli lost the late game magic at the end of his career too. I wonder why?

Because he was old?
RE: He's playing with JV recievers  
Gatorade Dunk : 9/28/2022 11:33 am : link
In comment 15836343 cjac said:
Quote:
and a freshman O-line

One of my favorite parts about BBI is when posters glom onto one line in one of Sy's reports and repeat it over and over again.

It really helps show the capacity for critical thought vs. parrot-like repetition.
i don't get this  
LG in NYC : 9/28/2022 11:35 am : link
didn't he literally just do this in Game 1?

I personally didn't have much confidence on Monday night b/c their defense had been kicking our butts all game and it was obvious we did not have a dynamic passing game... but to act like DJ has never done this before (you know, like in Week 1) seems a bit odd.
i don't get this  
LG in NYC : 9/28/2022 11:35 am : link
didn't he literally just do this in Game 1?

I personally didn't have much confidence on Monday night b/c their defense had been kicking our butts all game and it was obvious we did not have a dynamic passing game... but to act like DJ has never done this before (you know, like in Week 1) seems a bit odd.
RE: RE: RE: He's playing with JV recievers  
Gatorade Dunk : 9/28/2022 11:39 am : link
In comment 15836357 TrustTheProcess said:
Quote:
Actually, it’s literally the other way around. The narrative of Jones is he’s a turnover machine, and doesn’t have what it takes. The guy previous post is right. If he’s playing this well with a JV receiving core, and a “freshman” offensive line, and under a new system once again that he’s still getting comfortable with…. Why do people doubt him when ONE DAY, he might actually have established offensive line, a receiving core he can count on and their[sic] reliable, and a system he feels comfortable with? Has anyone even thought of that?

That's a lot of if's and might's and maybe's and someday's to base a new contract on. If DJ needs everything to be perfect, then none of it is about DJ and there's no reason to keep him.

But just keep hoping as hard as you can, Tinkerbell.
RE: RE: If he had Plax  
mittenedman : 9/28/2022 11:39 am : link
In comment 15836441 Samiam said:
Quote:
In comment 15836440 mittenedman said:


Quote:


Toomer and Steve Smith - maybe you'd feel differently.

Eli lost the late game magic at the end of his career too. I wonder why?


Because he was old?


Nope.
RE: i don't get this  
Gatorade Dunk : 9/28/2022 11:39 am : link
In comment 15836456 LG in NYC said:
Quote:
didn't he literally just do this in Game 1?

I personally didn't have much confidence on Monday night b/c their defense had been kicking our butts all game and it was obvious we did not have a dynamic passing game... but to act like DJ has never done this before (you know, like in Week 1) seems a bit odd.

Did DJ do that in game 1, or did Barkley?
Why so irritated by people bringing up the supporting cast?  
UConn4523 : 9/28/2022 11:51 am : link
maybe you should be irritated at that actually being true?

If you aren’t convinced it matters then look around the league. Which QBs are performing at a high level through 3 weeks despite playing with a bottom tier OL and WR corps? Brady/Rodgers/Wilson and a slew of others have been fairly pedestrian. While I expect that to course correct it isn’t a guarantee and you are going to see atleast 1 of them struggle to score compared to earlier in their careers with better teams.
RE: He did it in the first two games...  
Reale01 : 9/28/2022 11:53 am : link
In comment 15836402 KingBlue said:
Quote:
So yeah, I believed he could. If Sills didn't fall down, who knows? There was plenty of time.


Agree with this.
If this is your bench mark -- I would say that Jones gave you a chance  
gidiefor : Mod : 9/28/2022 11:53 am : link
to get there. It's really not on him that no one made plays for him. He put the plays out there that could be made.
Gatorade  
LG in NYC : 9/28/2022 11:55 am : link
Barkley was a major part of it but unless my eyes were mistaken DJ was under center.

which again goes to the idea for many here that DJ is the cause of all of our hardships (and god forbid anyone talk about the supporting cast) but when good things happen everyone else gets the credit.

I am no DJ fan boy. He is what he is... and it ain't great. we can debate some of the reasons for that but really, who cares at this point. He won't be here next here so all that matters (to me) is getting the most enjoyment out of this season as possible and hoping this coaching/front office staff are the read deal.
If Sills doen't fall down (Jesus H. Christ) we would have been at  
gtt350 : 9/28/2022 11:56 am : link
mid field, so DJ was getting the job done.
I said this in another thread, if DJ was playing for Dallas he would have looked like Josh Allen light
My point has been illustrated  
NoGainDayne : 9/28/2022 11:56 am : link
lots of excuses, as is typical. And people talking about other games. But no one saying they were confident.

And to answer someone else, yes, you put Aaron Rodgers back there I'm at the edge of my seat expecting a tie game.

RE: RE: He's playing with JV recievers  
knowledgetimmons : 9/28/2022 12:01 pm : link
In comment 15836352 NoGainDayne said:
Quote:
In comment 15836343 cjac said:


Quote:


and a freshman O-line




It's not about that, to my point Eli could get hammered all day and had some real bad OLs but he had a different gear.

But to address the other thing. How is it that people can look at 4 years of college and 4 years of the NFL, have him never put up good numbers and it's always the fault of his teammates? It can't be everyone else's fault only, always.


So is it fair to say in game 3 of 2007 you believed Eli would drive the team to win the game in the final minutes? If i recall correctly, most people were ready to show him the door and I strongly doubt you had that level of confidence in him so early.

Lets compare apples to apples here...
Aaron Rogers would have thrown the same interception i'm afraid.  
gtt350 : 9/28/2022 12:01 pm : link
no reciever
RE: Aaron Rogers would have thrown the same interception i'm afraid.  
UConn4523 : 9/28/2022 12:02 pm : link
In comment 15836502 gtt350 said:
Quote:
no reciever


That’s just an excuse.
I'm not like that I loved Eli from the start  
NoGainDayne : 9/28/2022 12:09 pm : link
I spent many years defending him when people didn't like his facial expressions.

All of this comparing Jones to the best NFL QBs is so odd. All of you know that Rodgers would have made that same throw I guess? Not choose another receiver?

Some of you are really good at predicting events that are impossible to speak on!

Part of this is Eli did it in college. He came to the NFL with a reputation for coming up big. DJ had zero of that, kind of the opposite. The mental gymnastics around this stuff is A+ though.

You don't inspire with arguments around "doing fine for what you have" it is almost always about getting more of what you have.

Jones in his pro and college career has little to no experience as the difference maker, especially when it most counts and that's pretty damning, or at least it should be for everyone.
RE: RE: He's playing with JV recievers  
section125 : 9/28/2022 12:12 pm : link
In comment 15836451 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 15836343 cjac said:


Quote:


and a freshman O-line



One of my favorite parts about BBI is when posters glom onto one line in one of Sy's reports and repeat it over and over again.

It really helps show the capacity for critical thought vs. parrot-like repetition.


You mean as opposed to those that glom onto what happened under previous regimes and what is said by mundane BBI posters and refuse to see the improvements?

Yeah, I agree...
I thoguht the chance was slim  
Now Mike in MD : 9/28/2022 12:13 pm : link
but mostly because you were asking a team to drive 90 yars in a little over a minute against a top 7 defense with an OL that had repeatedly failed to pass block and a group of WRs who alternated between getting no separation or dropping easy passes. But I guess for most people it all comes down to an indictment of Jones. Whatever
RE: Gatorade  
Scooter185 : 9/28/2022 12:15 pm : link
In comment 15836491 LG in NYC said:
Quote:
Barkley was a major part of it but unless my eyes were mistaken DJ was under center.

which again goes to the idea for many here that DJ is the cause of all of our hardships (and god forbid anyone talk about the supporting cast) but when good things happen everyone else gets the credit.

I am no DJ fan boy. He is what he is... and it ain't great. we can debate some of the reasons for that but really, who cares at this point. He won't be here next here so all that matters (to me) is getting the most enjoyment out of this season as possible and hoping this coaching/front office staff are the read deal.


No one thinks Jones is the cause of -all- the Giants problems

Those of us who want to move on recognize the cast around him is bad. We just believe he's part of the offensive issues on the whole and not a victim of them

Also to drive  
Now Mike in MD : 9/28/2022 12:16 pm : link
90 yards with no timeouts. But again I'm sure that is irrelevant.
RE: My point has been illustrated  
PatersonPlank : 9/28/2022 12:16 pm : link
In comment 15836493 NoGainDayne said:
Quote:
lots of excuses, as is typical. And people talking about other games. But no one saying they were confident.

And to answer someone else, yes, you put Aaron Rodgers back there I'm at the edge of my seat expecting a tie game.


Literally 10+ people said they did. Its amazing how you look at everything through this make believe negative lens. These threads bashing DJ are so ridiculous at this point
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