Regardless of how Jones plays the rest of the year, unless he turns a true true corner and starts playing incredibly well - it is likely that Daboll and Schoen move on from him. Everything points to that and would likely be the smart thing to do. That being said, let's say Giants finish 8-9, miss the playoffs, and have anywhere from 15-17th overall pick in the 1st round. I think 8-9 is fairly realistic the way we started and how the schedule plays out.
Do you sell the farm to move up to get your QB? Or do you continue to stay patient, maybe take a player in that spot or even trade down to collect a lot more picks like Schoen did in 2022? And move forward with Taylor in 2023? As we saw in that draft, more picks = better chances of success to building a roster. I actually don't really like Taylor at all, but there's an argument to be made that if they continue to rebuild even further and push the QB decision down the road again for another year, that would actually be pretty smart.
My opinion as it stands right now is that Schoen should continue to build the team if it shakes out that way. This roster is incredibly bare at high level talent at a few key spots, mainly WR, LB, and interior OL, I guess you could say CB as well depending on what happens with Jackson.
What say you?
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they used when they decided not to exercise the 5th year option...
And you know this because! Because my understanding from a source pretty close to the Giants was that that decision had mostly to do with concerns about Jones' health status. At the time, there was no guarantee that he'd even be cleared to play this year much less next. And if they decided they did want to resign him almost any contract extension was going to be more cap friendly than the 5th year option which would have locked them into $22M. Again that's what I heard from a reasonably reliable source. If you heard something different I'm all ears.
Then there's also the minor detail that having passed on the option they didn't take a QB anywhere in the draft even though that even as late as their 3rd round pick all the top guys were still on the board.
Yeah, that’s not the case though. Daboll was talking at the NFL spring meetings, a full month or so before the deadline, that Jones was completely healed and was beginning to do full workouts. His health wasn’t an issue.
And having low evals on that QB class wouldn’t be a surprise. Giants already had Taylor signed and Jones paid for so no need to press for a QB when the entire roster was in a shambles.
So...
I also find it very odd that if the Giants really did know that they'd be looking at QBs sooner rather than later that they would not have taken a shot at one this year. After all Atlanta took Ridder 6 picks after the Giants took a developmental OG with one of their 3rds and they took an undersized slot corner 5 picks before Tennessee took Willis with their other #3. Maybe in fact they just didn't like either guy but man if I know I'm looking for a new QB its a tough case to make.
As to whether Schoen was serious about drafting a QB after doing all their evals I do not know. But with 2 guys already on the books, a weak class and plenty of talent needed everywhere, I figured he would just “punt” that addition until 2023. Being a new GM and all and not wanting to go scorched earth.
But maybe your contact can fill us in on which QB prospect(s) he wanted.
Attached below is article Daboll commenting on March 30 that Jones is "ready to go" for spring practices and the offseason program that was going to start in a day or so. And I already commented that wasn't going to be contact as those spring offseason events never are, at least not for the QB. And by the way, does Daboll really sound in that article like a Head Coach that wants to take things cautiously with Jones neck ON MARCH 30?
https://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/ny-owners-meetings-mara-schoen-daboll-20220330-3qtxu3ditbhkdnrfixqetu57ma-story.html
Now if you want to debate the logic of not exercising the 5th year option for hopefully better reasons go ahead. But passing on that option was extremely meaningful...
Phil Simms. Wasn't until his 6th year, 1984, that he really established himself. Before that, he was inconsistent and injury prone. In 1983, Parcells chose Brunner to start over Simms which he later regretted and said it was his worst decision he ever made as a HC. [maybe you are too young to know this]
Read that last night and couldn’t get it out of my head. In particular, couldn’t help but wonder if the poster realized that if the season actually did end now the Giants would be picking 28th at the 2023 draft. So good luck finding the next elite QB picking that late. (Which isn’t to say it doesn’t happen. It does, but only about once every 20 years or so.)
But the season doesn't end today.
I wasn't wishing that it did. I was making the point, rather clearly, that Jones has done NOTHING yet to make the case he should be retained.
I hope that adds color to your world.
the only time you don't get aggressive for a franchise qb within reach is if you have pat mahomes and he's signed for 10 years, but even then if you are on the clock and there's a guy you love you may as well make the pick. as we saw with russ and watson qbs can bring back a franchise altering trade return and assuming it's the first round you'd have 4 years. if mahomes never misses a game even better - you can probably still recoup a pick for the player if he's looked good in preseason. even a marginal starter like wentz brought back a first then a second, darnold brought back 2 seconds and he was a bust.
the only reason this doesn't happen more often is because there are very few qb prospects good enough to have a conviction about outside the 1OA pick.
And even more comical, there are people here on BBI that believe the team can go 16-1 with Jones...
I don't think that's impossible.
The Ravens won the 2000 SB and moved on from Trent Dilfer. Which was the correct move.
And that is not an impossible hypothetical. It's literally what is happening.
Then there was a team, around 2007 I think, won an improbable Super Bowl with a QB with a 56% completion mark, who led the league in interceptions and finished the regular season as the 25th rated passer. Eli something or ruther! Can you believe it the team kept him!!!
And that is not an impossible hypothetical. It's literally what is happening.
The Giants have had the worst offensive line, receivers and coaching in the nfl over the last 4 years and there are people on bbi who don’t think that that should effect the qb’s stat line. That is literally happening.
What if the Giants don't get a QB better than Jones? How does it make sense to argue that the team will be better signing a worse player at the most important position in football and pretend like it's an improvement?
I'm all for signing a better QB. But when you talk about what you are saying - it is highly possible that you are getting a worse QB; how can you logically say that move puts the Giants over-the-top also?
Anybody who thinks that needs to check the strength of the weed they're smoking. And I wouldn't want to speak for others, but I believe that the Giants (the current team) are capable of making the playoffs with Jones this year and I'd really like to see him play in an offense with a couple or three decent receivers. Now the Giants get a shot at a top QB prospect with elite potential you go for it. And I just don't see it in this draft unless you want to take a flyer on someone like Hooker of Tennessee or WSU's Ward, but that's really iffy. In the end my sense is based on where we are today that ultimately the Giants best option in the immediate future will be to stick with Jones and work over the next 2-3 years to build up the rest of the roster. And that's not necessarily what I think they should do, but what I think at this time is the most likely path they do follow based on where we're at today.
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The Ravens won the 2000 SB and moved on from Trent Dilfer. Which was the correct move.
Then there was a team, around 2007 I think, won an improbable Super Bowl with a QB with a 56% completion mark, who led the league in interceptions and finished the regular season as the 25th rated passer. Eli something or ruther! Can you believe it the team kept him!!!
Wow...this is where you want to take this? Maybe the counter is we should take a flyer in the 6th round of the 2023 draft because he could be the next Tom Brady.
Your serve if you really feel Jones is on the cusp of a Hall of Fame career.
Go ahead- look that the rest of the schedule and take off the Giant fan blinders. The Giants SHOULD beat the Bears, built after that its really hard to find many wins. The Jags are much improved and that’s probably a 50-50 game to win.
After that, maybe the Commanders games are winnable- but we seem to play down to them lately. Let’s say they win all 4 of the games listed above- that’s a 6 win team- and I’m not convinced that they will win all 4.
I said it before the season started- this is a 5 win team- a team that is better than last year’s squad and on its way upward- but its still a 5 win team.
Bottom line- if they want a QB, they will be in a prime position to get one.
Go ahead- look that the rest of the schedule and take off the Giant fan blinders. The Giants SHOULD beat the Bears, built after that its really hard to find many wins. The Jags are much improved and that’s probably a 50-50 game to win.
After that, maybe the Commanders games are winnable- but we seem to play down to them lately. Let’s say they win all 4 of the games listed above- that’s a 6 win team- and I’m not convinced that they will win all 4.
I said it before the season started- this is a 5 win team- a team that is better than last year’s squad and on its way upward- but its still a 5 win team.
Bottom line- if they want a QB, they will be in a prime position to get one.
The Giants can’t possibly beat Houston or Detroit or Seattle???
Anybody who thinks that needs to check the strength of the weed they're smoking. And I wouldn't want to speak for others, but I believe that the Giants (the current team) are capable of making the playoffs with Jones this year and I'd really like to see him play in an offense with a couple or three decent receivers. Now the Giants get a shot at a top QB prospect with elite potential you go for it. And I just don't see it in this draft unless you want to take a flyer on someone like Hooker of Tennessee or WSU's Ward, but that's really iffy. In the end my sense is based on where we are today that ultimately the Giants best option in the immediate future will be to stick with Jones and work over the next 2-3 years to build up the rest of the roster. And that's not necessarily what I think they should do, but what I think at this time is the most likely path they do follow based on where we're at today.
Can you write any more unclearly. Make a point and stand by it.
What do YOU think the Giants should do with respect to Jones if it were your decision?
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The Ravens won the 2000 SB and moved on from Trent Dilfer. Which was the correct move.
Then there was a team, around 2007 I think, won an improbable Super Bowl with a QB with a 56% completion mark, who led the league in interceptions and finished the regular season as the 25th rated passer. Eli something or ruther! Can you believe it the team kept him!!!
leAh yes, the BBI, the place where nuance and subtlety go to die! I am being facetious. Didn't think I had to spell it out!!
Wow...this is where you want to take this? Maybe the counter is we should take a flyer in the 6th round of the 2023 draft because he could be the next Tom Brady.
Your serve if you really feel Jones is on the cusp of a Hall of Fame career.
Ah yes, the BBI, the place where nuance and subtlety go to die! I am being facetious. Didn't think I had to spell it out!!
Ah yes, the BBI, the place where nuance and subtlety go to die! I am being facetious. Didn't think I had to spell it out!!
Nobody knows what you are trying to say unless you haven’t seen the replies. You are all over the board and mincing words.
I will ask again, if it were your decision today - what do you do with Daniel Jones with respect to his future?
What if the Giants don't get a QB better than Jones? How does it make sense to argue that the team will be better signing a worse player at the most important position in football and pretend like it's an improvement?
Let me help here. If the Giants ditch Jones, and the next guy is just as poor, you look for another QB.
And you keep doing it until you solve the problem.
Everyone who is so gung-ho on Schoen should expect him to have the skills to find solution on QB. That's why he was hired.
But the first order of business should be getting rid of the guy who is not the solution as of right now - Daniel Jones.
There was a poster on BBI at that time named Britt in Va whose argument for keeping Manning in the face of obvious decline and an obvious need to rebuild was -- "why not us?"
At that time no one could ever muster the words “I think Manning can lead this team to another championship.”
When I read the reason the Giants should keep Jones is because improbable things have happened in the past, I reminded of that time.
Of course Manning stumbled on for a few years and got his teeth kicked in until he was benched and retired.
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I feel they need to go out abd get a QB in order to continue to grow. Re-signing Jones means committing anywhere from $20-30+M to him, which greatly decreases our ability to go out and get better players. For me, even an improved Jones doesn't put us over the top as a team.
What if the Giants don't get a QB better than Jones? How does it make sense to argue that the team will be better signing a worse player at the most important position in football and pretend like it's an improvement?
I'm all for signing a better QB. But when you talk about what you are saying - it is highly possible that you are getting a worse QB; how can you logically say that move puts the Giants over-the-top also?
Because unless the guy you have is going to win you a Super Bowl, there's very little cost attached to the risk of getting worse at the position. Certainly less cost attached to getting more expensive for the status quo, and much more potential upside.
Do you really think it's disastrous to go from the third quartile to the fourth quartile at QB? Enough to preclude the potential of getting to the top quartile instead?
DJ is never getting to the top quartile and the most efficient part of his career, in terms of cap value, is already already gone to waste. The combination of potential upside and cap value outweighs the risk of the next QB being worse than the status quo, which we can say with strong likelihood isn't good enough anyway.
And that is not an impossible hypothetical. It's literally what is happening.
The best part is this group will only concede moving on from Jones if it's a 100% guarantee his successor is better.
Since that is impossible to predict - outside of signing Mahomes, Rodgers, etc- that is how they keep hope alive...
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For 4 consecutive years and there are people on BBi who would want to keep him
And that is not an impossible hypothetical. It's literally what is happening.
The Giants have had the worst offensive line, receivers and coaching in the nfl over the last 4 years and there are people on bbi who don’t think that that should effect the qb’s stat line. That is literally happening.
No, we recognize that the team around DJ has sucked, but we also believe he's not very good.
As opposed to recognizing the team around DJ not being very good and using it as a reason to hand wave away every bad play.
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In comment 15840015 Jerry in_DC said:
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For 4 consecutive years and there are people on BBi who would want to keep him
And that is not an impossible hypothetical. It's literally what is happening.
The Giants have had the worst offensive line, receivers and coaching in the nfl over the last 4 years and there are people on bbi who don’t think that that should effect the qb’s stat line. That is literally happening.
No, we recognize that the team around DJ has sucked, but we also believe he's not very good.
As opposed to recognizing the team around DJ not being very good and using it as a reason to hand wave away every bad play.
It's funny. Every year the same people say, the OL was bad last year but now it's even worse, when they were saying it was the worst last year. If you believe them, the Giants OL, which statistically has been bad but not always the worst in the league, is categorically the worst OL, in the league by a wide margin, every year, and getting worse. Soon, they'll say the Giants OL plays like a high school team. But it's not true. They are certainly very bad, but Daniel Jones is also very bad at helping his OL. He holds the ball too long and is indecisive. When he feels pressure, he panics. I think they should consider that this OL might look a little better with a better QB.
There are a lot of possibilities as far as how the Giants approach the QB position this offseason, but it basically boils down to two basic sets of possibilities: stick with DJ, or start the QB search over with a draftee (for argument's sake, I am eliminating the stop gap possibilities because that's not a solution, it's a delay).
Here are the assumptions: the rookie will be cheaper than DJ, and that DJ will not regress (that is, in an effort to simplify the argument and to be fair to DJ, let's assume that DJ either stays the same as he is or improves). We do not know if the rookie will be better or worse than DJ.
I am scoring the options as +1 for the more favorable outcome, 0 for status quo, -1 for the less favorable outcome. Here are our simplified outcomes (and the eliminated options) - note that while the possibility of the rookie being exactly the same level as DJ is plausible, I'm eliminating it because I think it's basically meaningless:
DJ gets cheaper = +1
DJ stays the same price = 0
DJ gets more expensive = -1
Rookie is cheaper than DJ = +1
Rookie is same price as DJ = 0
Rookie is more expensive than DJ = -1
DJ gets worse = -1
DJ stays the same = 0
DJ gets better = +1
Rookie is worse than DJ = -1
Rookie is exactly the same as DJ = 0
Rookie is better than DJ = +1
So this leaves us with four combined outcomes:
1. DJ gets more expensive (-1); DJ stays the same level of play (0) = -1
2. DJ gets more expensive (-1); DJ's level of play improves (+1) = 0
3. Rookie is cheaper (+1); Rookie is worse than DJ (-1) = 0
4. Rookie is cheaper (+1); Rookie is better than DJ (+1) = +2
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There are FAR too many people buying into this being a good team. They are an IMPROVED team- but an improved team doesn’t guarantee wins.
Go ahead- look that the rest of the schedule and take off the Giant fan blinders. The Giants SHOULD beat the Bears, built after that its really hard to find many wins. The Jags are much improved and that’s probably a 50-50 game to win.
After that, maybe the Commanders games are winnable- but we seem to play down to them lately. Let’s say they win all 4 of the games listed above- that’s a 6 win team- and I’m not convinced that they will win all 4.
I said it before the season started- this is a 5 win team- a team that is better than last year’s squad and on its way upward- but its still a 5 win team.
Bottom line- if they want a QB, they will be in a prime position to get one.
The Giants can’t possibly beat Houston or Detroit or Seattle???
Have you watched them play? Detroit has become a legitimate offense that can rack up 30 points a game. They gave the Eagles all they could handle- the only team to do that to date.
Seattle may not have a QB anymore, but their defense can still hold its own. Remember that the game is in Seattle. That’s no easy place to go and win. THe Giants can’t throw the ball, so they will have to win on the ground- hard to do when the OL can’t hear the snap count.
Houston- I’ll give that one as a possibility.
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In comment 15840051 rich in DC said:
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There are FAR too many people buying into this being a good team. They are an IMPROVED team- but an improved team doesn’t guarantee wins.
Go ahead- look that the rest of the schedule and take off the Giant fan blinders. The Giants SHOULD beat the Bears, built after that its really hard to find many wins. The Jags are much improved and that’s probably a 50-50 game to win.
After that, maybe the Commanders games are winnable- but we seem to play down to them lately. Let’s say they win all 4 of the games listed above- that’s a 6 win team- and I’m not convinced that they will win all 4.
I said it before the season started- this is a 5 win team- a team that is better than last year’s squad and on its way upward- but its still a 5 win team.
Bottom line- if they want a QB, they will be in a prime position to get one.
The Giants can’t possibly beat Houston or Detroit or Seattle???
Have you watched them play? Detroit has become a legitimate offense that can rack up 30 points a game. They gave the Eagles all they could handle- the only team to do that to date.
Seattle may not have a QB anymore, but their defense can still hold its own. Remember that the game is in Seattle. That’s no easy place to go and win. THe Giants can’t throw the ball, so they will have to win on the ground- hard to do when the OL can’t hear the snap count.
Houston- I’ll give that one as a possibility.
I’ve seen them all play. They’re all beatable.
Don’t bet on those 5 wins. I don’t want yeti lose your money
Said in another way, what are the Giants willing to bet everything will come together with Daniel Jones. I’d argue very little.
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For 4 consecutive years and there are people on BBi who would want to keep him
And that is not an impossible hypothetical. It's literally what is happening.
The Giants have had the worst offensive line, receivers and coaching in the nfl over the last 4 years and there are people on bbi who don’t think that that should effect the qb’s stat line. That is literally happening.
It's amazing isn't it how thick these Jones blasters are?
Amazing that so many Ginats fans that pounce on Jones so much can be this dumb.
It's not whther they will be right or worng if Jones make sit - just the increidble dumb reasons given.
And what's even more laughable they feel a need to isolate one reeson in a box instead of looking at everything:
1--- Lousy coaching (prior years).
2--- Lousy Offensvie Line
3--- Lousy Wide Receivers
4-- Lousy Tight Ends
5-- The star RB usually hurt and the backups a bust (which backups have been picked up and done well by other teams?)
========================
Remember - according to the nutjobs none of these things count. Only Jones Only Jones. Only Jones.
=========================
Here is what the nutjobs believe:
1- Coaching doesn't count. It doesn't matter if an OL can provide holes or not provide protection. Further it doesn't matter that the WR's and Tight Ends are amongst the worst in football. And it doesn't matter if you are usually riding backup RB;s with no ability.
It's only the QB. It's only the QB. It's only the QB because they say so.
There are a lot of possibilities as far as how the Giants approach the QB position this offseason, but it basically boils down to two basic sets of possibilities: stick with DJ, or start the QB search over with a draftee (for argument's sake, I am eliminating the stop gap possibilities because that's not a solution, it's a delay).
Here are the assumptions: the rookie will be cheaper than DJ, and that DJ will not regress (that is, in an effort to simplify the argument and to be fair to DJ, let's assume that DJ either stays the same as he is or improves). We do not know if the rookie will be better or worse than DJ.
I am scoring the options as +1 for the more favorable outcome, 0 for status quo, -1 for the less favorable outcome. Here are our simplified outcomes (and the eliminated options) - note that while the possibility of the rookie being exactly the same level as DJ is plausible, I'm eliminating it because I think it's basically meaningless:
DJ gets cheaper = +1
DJ stays the same price = 0
DJ gets more expensive = -1
Rookie is cheaper than DJ = +1
Rookie is same price as DJ = 0
Rookie is more expensive than DJ = -1
DJ gets worse = -1
DJ stays the same = 0
DJ gets better = +1
Rookie is worse than DJ = -1
Rookie is exactly the same as DJ = 0
Rookie is better than DJ = +1
So this leaves us with four combined outcomes:
1. DJ gets more expensive (-1); DJ stays the same level of play (0) = -1
2. DJ gets more expensive (-1); DJ's level of play improves (+1) = 0
3. Rookie is cheaper (+1); Rookie is worse than DJ (-1) = 0
4. Rookie is cheaper (+1); Rookie is better than DJ (+1) = +2
Well done, but the DJ Fan Club was told there wasn't going to be any math...
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And even more comical, there are people here on BBI that believe the team can go 16-1 with Jones...
Anybody who thinks that needs to check the strength of the weed they're smoking. And I wouldn't want to speak for others, but I believe that the Giants (the current team) are capable of making the playoffs with Jones this year and I'd really like to see him play in an offense with a couple or three decent receivers. Now the Giants get a shot at a top QB prospect with elite potential you go for it. And I just don't see it in this draft unless you want to take a flyer on someone like Hooker of Tennessee or WSU's Ward, but that's really iffy. In the end my sense is based on where we are today that ultimately the Giants best option in the immediate future will be to stick with Jones and work over the next 2-3 years to build up the rest of the roster. And that's not necessarily what I think they should do, but what I think at this time is the most likely path they do follow based on where we're at today.
Can you write any more unclearly. Make a point and stand by it.
What do YOU think the Giants should do with respect to Jones if it were your decision?
Agree chick. Let's see if I can parse up Colin's stance(s) as of today in that paragraph...
*The Jones-led Giants are a potential playoff team.
*But if Giants can get a top prospect in the next Draft then they should draft him.
*However, on Oct 2 it doesn't appear there are any top QB prospects that will be available to Giants.
*So the best option per Colin is to keep Jones in place.
*But it's also not ultimately what Colin thinks they should do.
*But it's the path the Giants likely follow.
okay...
2) Given that the Giants still have lots of needs, I would not trade up to get a franchise quarterback in 2023. It's possible the Giants can find a "franchise quarterback" on the 2nd or 3rd round next year. If one is not available, draft a quarterback in 2024 and draft for need in 2023.
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In comment 15840036 Colin@gbn said:
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And even more comical, there are people here on BBI that believe the team can go 16-1 with Jones...
Anybody who thinks that needs to check the strength of the weed they're smoking. And I wouldn't want to speak for others, but I believe that the Giants (the current team) are capable of making the playoffs with Jones this year and I'd really like to see him play in an offense with a couple or three decent receivers. Now the Giants get a shot at a top QB prospect with elite potential you go for it. And I just don't see it in this draft unless you want to take a flyer on someone like Hooker of Tennessee or WSU's Ward, but that's really iffy. In the end my sense is based on where we are today that ultimately the Giants best option in the immediate future will be to stick with Jones and work over the next 2-3 years to build up the rest of the roster. And that's not necessarily what I think they should do, but what I think at this time is the most likely path they do follow based on where we're at today.
Can you write any more unclearly. Make a point and stand by it.
What do YOU think the Giants should do with respect to Jones if it were your decision?
Agree chick. Let's see if I can parse up Colin's stance(s) as of today in that paragraph...
*The Jones-led Giants are a potential playoff team.
*But if Giants can get a top prospect in the next Draft then they should draft him.
*However, on Oct 2 it doesn't appear there are any top QB prospects that will be available to Giants.
*So the best option per Colin is to keep Jones in place.
*But it's also not ultimately what Colin thinks they should do.
*But it's the path the Giants likely follow.
okay...
I see there seem to be some reading comprehension issues when things which aren't black and white aren't expressed in black and white terms.
I was going to rephrase to help out the reading challenged but then I sort of figured out the reading challenged were just being recalcitrant (hope that's not too big a word) because what I am suggesting doesn't fit their narrative.
Here's your chance...
Daniel Jones is a free agent, so this debate is really quite simple. It’s the same question many of us asked about Eli Manning in his waning years.
1) Do you believe Daniel Jones is a championship-level QB
2) How many years and dollars should the Giants be on that
Anyone who can’t answer those questions just simply isn’t debating in good faith.
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In comment 15840066 Ron Johnson said:
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In comment 15840051 rich in DC said:
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There are FAR too many people buying into this being a good team. They are an IMPROVED team- but an improved team doesn’t guarantee wins.
Go ahead- look that the rest of the schedule and take off the Giant fan blinders. The Giants SHOULD beat the Bears, built after that its really hard to find many wins. The Jags are much improved and that’s probably a 50-50 game to win.
After that, maybe the Commanders games are winnable- but we seem to play down to them lately. Let’s say they win all 4 of the games listed above- that’s a 6 win team- and I’m not convinced that they will win all 4.
I said it before the season started- this is a 5 win team- a team that is better than last year’s squad and on its way upward- but its still a 5 win team.
Bottom line- if they want a QB, they will be in a prime position to get one.
The Giants can’t possibly beat Houston or Detroit or Seattle???
Have you watched them play? Detroit has become a legitimate offense that can rack up 30 points a game. They gave the Eagles all they could handle- the only team to do that to date.
Seattle may not have a QB anymore, but their defense can still hold its own. Remember that the game is in Seattle. That’s no easy place to go and win. THe Giants can’t throw the ball, so they will have to win on the ground- hard to do when the OL can’t hear the snap count.
Houston- I’ll give that one as a possibility.
I’ve seen them all play. They’re all beatable.
Don’t bet on those 5 wins. I don’t want yeti lose your money
If you believe that, I’m not the one who shouldn’t be betting. This is a 5 win team whether Giants homers want to believe it or not.
The debate about whether they will be in a position to pick a QB is academic- they’re going to have another top 5 pick
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I feel they need to go out abd get a QB in order to continue to grow. Re-signing Jones means committing anywhere from $20-30+M to him, which greatly decreases our ability to go out and get better players. For me, even an improved Jones doesn't put us over the top as a team.
What if the Giants don't get a QB better than Jones? How does it make sense to argue that the team will be better signing a worse player at the most important position in football and pretend like it's an improvement?
I'm all for signing a better QB. But when you talk about what you are saying - it is highly possible that you are getting a worse QB; how can you logically say that move puts the Giants over-the-top also?
Jones is playing for a second deal. The market for a QB with his drsft position is around $20M or more and the franchise tag is over $30M. Can you confidently and honestly say Jones is worth nearly that much, especially when they already have a lot invested in Williams? I've said it over and over, I order for Jones to warrant a new deal here, I think he needs to have an other worldly season, which is highly unlikely.
We've already seen some improvement from him, which is great. But, some.big deficiencies in his game still remain. I just can't see any scenario in which Jones is a top 5 or even top 10 QB this year. Can you?
For me, I doesn't mean I don't like Jones. I do. But, it is about investing so much cap space ona QB who is not making anyone around him better when we still have a lot of work to do on the roster. It just doesn't make sense to me.
So, how do you foresee Jones thriving without better players? Does anyone sincerely want to pay him.anywhere between $20M and $30+M for more show me seasons in hopes we can make everything perfect for him?
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In comment 15840066 Ron Johnson said:
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In comment 15840051 rich in DC said:
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There are FAR too many people buying into this being a good team. They are an IMPROVED team- but an improved team doesn’t guarantee wins.
Go ahead- look that the rest of the schedule and take off the Giant fan blinders. The Giants SHOULD beat the Bears, built after that its really hard to find many wins. The Jags are much improved and that’s probably a 50-50 game to win.
After that, maybe the Commanders games are winnable- but we seem to play down to them lately. Let’s say they win all 4 of the games listed above- that’s a 6 win team- and I’m not convinced that they will win all 4.
I said it before the season started- this is a 5 win team- a team that is better than last year’s squad and on its way upward- but its still a 5 win team.
Bottom line- if they want a QB, they will be in a prime position to get one.
The Giants can’t possibly beat Houston or Detroit or Seattle???
Have you watched them play? Detroit has become a legitimate offense that can rack up 30 points a game. They gave the Eagles all they could handle- the only team to do that to date.
Seattle may not have a QB anymore, but their defense can still hold its own. Remember that the game is in Seattle. That’s no easy place to go and win. THe Giants can’t throw the ball, so they will have to win on the ground- hard to do when the OL can’t hear the snap count.
Houston- I’ll give that one as a possibility.
I’ve seen them all play. They’re all beatable.
Don’t bet on those 5 wins. I don’t want yeti lose your money
After today’s game do you SERIOUSLY want to argue that those clubs are “beatable”?
I hope there is a coming back to earth moment for all the “with this schedule we’ll win 7-9 games” crowd. Again, as I have said since the draft- this is a 5 win team- and that might be optimistic.
The next QB will be a draft pick because we will have another high pick
I hope there is a coming back to earth moment for all the “with this schedule we’ll win 7-9 games” crowd. Again, as I have said since the draft- this is a 5 win team- and that might be optimistic.
Look, I'm part of that crowd based on assessing the schedule and overall play around the league thus far.
I think we are below average team overall, but the defense is doing a terrific job limiting PPG. And there is a chance we can milk that for more wins than most think.