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NGT..Tua asshat rumor I am hearing

1st and 10 : 10/2/2022 3:46 am
Morning all, as some of you know, I have a few sources in the NFL, non associated with any team. One has been more reliable than the other and with that said, this rumor is from the less reliable source.

With that said, he hears Tua will go on season ending IR. To a lesser degree, he is hearing there are internal discussions within the Fins organization that this might end the career of Tua.

Hope none of it is true, but just to pass along what I am hearing.
While I am not saying this is flat out wrong  
jvm52106 : 10/2/2022 6:13 am : link
It would seem to be VERY premature considering we are talking about an injury less than a few days ago.

Now, if they found something else wrong- like the neck issue (which was part of his injury Thursday according to multiple reports) is actually a narrowing of the spinal column, then that certainly could be a career ender without argument.

I just think a diagnosis of this magnitude, career ending belief, wouldn't be possible already.

Either way I hope that is not the case for a guy who was just starting to show his true ability.

We'll see  
Lines of Scrimmage : 10/2/2022 6:58 am : link
One of the posters said he his career would be over. Whatever it is I hope it does not impact him long term.

I was wondering if this was  
section125 : 10/2/2022 7:05 am : link
as much spinal as concussion.

Best wishes to him.
As someone who has had a concussion  
AnnapolisMike : 10/2/2022 7:14 am : link
It shocks me how quickly guys come back. Considering the severity of the concussion, it would not surprise me at all if he is done for the season. He should be out at least a month
I'd be shocked if that was the case  
ZogZerg : 10/2/2022 7:42 am : link
I think it's way to early for that decision.
We will see.
with the NFL, Congress & the media  
Giantsfan79 : 10/2/2022 7:57 am : link
So focused on this and the doctor already being fired, if Tua did go on IR right now shit would really hit the fan.
not from my asshat  
1st and 10 : 10/2/2022 8:09 am : link
but me personally, this situation is really f''ed up.

He does not have the best medical history, something like 5 surgeries in college to go along with the string of injuries he has had recently.

Hope for the best for him.
Maybe the best thing for him is to leave football. It's too rough a  
Ira : 10/2/2022 8:31 am : link
sport for many.
That they fired the consultant  
Matt in SGS : 10/2/2022 8:43 am : link
I think lends to that fact that

A- he screwed up when everyone knew he was concussed
B- There is a MASSIVE lawsuit coming up on this one

I wouldn't at all be shocked if the Dolphins IR him, if nothing else looking ahead to litigation and public pressure for how badly they screwed up initially.

That said, I wouldn't be stunned if Tua walked away. Not only for his health, but he is going be in line for a huge payday via a lawsuit and a settlement, since he knows the NFL will never want to have this ever see the inside of a court room. He will get all his money, plus what would have been assumed lost future pay (look at the QB contracts now) and not have to take another hit or put himself at any more risk.
RE: That they fired the consultant  
1st and 10 : 10/2/2022 8:47 am : link
In comment 15840422 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
I think lends to that fact that

A- he screwed up when everyone knew he was concussed
B- There is a MASSIVE lawsuit coming up on this one

I wouldn't at all be shocked if the Dolphins IR him, if nothing else looking ahead to litigation and public pressure for how badly they screwed up initially.

That said, I wouldn't be stunned if Tua walked away. Not only for his health, but he is going be in line for a huge payday via a lawsuit and a settlement, since he knows the NFL will never want to have this ever see the inside of a court room. He will get all his money, plus what would have been assumed lost future pay (look at the QB contracts now) and not have to take another hit or put himself at any more risk.


I agree with you, I think all the above are realistic possibilities.
If true this would be terribly unfortunate.  
Producer : 10/2/2022 9:40 am : link
.
 
christian : 10/2/2022 9:49 am : link
This consultant’s career will be damaged by this. I’m sure these consultant’s have limited financial liability if there is a legal action, but they just put the rest of these doctors on notice.

We’re going to see the burden of proof turn from, prove he likely has a concussion, to prove he almost certainly doesn’t. That’s a good thing for the NFL.
Trust me  
Carl in CT : 10/2/2022 10:04 am : link
We have a few guys we would call JELLO also years back.
So, the independent consultant is not independent?  
HomerJones45 : 10/2/2022 10:33 am : link
Lots of hot takes here with no one hearing from the independent consultant or the team doctors (who have to make the call). Not saying this is good or bad or not good for player safety long term. Just saying the union was able to blow up the notion of an "independent consultant."

Be prepared for everyone going into the tent being declared concussed and done for the game. There is no "independent consultant" who is going to go out on a short limb and let someone back in the game.
RE: That they fired the consultant  
Matt M. : 10/2/2022 10:55 am : link
In comment 15840422 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
I think lends to that fact that

A- he screwed up when everyone knew he was concussed
B- There is a MASSIVE lawsuit coming up on this one

I wouldn't at all be shocked if the Dolphins IR him, if nothing else looking ahead to litigation and public pressure for how badly they screwed up initially.

That said, I wouldn't be stunned if Tua walked away. Not only for his health, but he is going be in line for a huge payday via a lawsuit and a settlement, since he knows the NFL will never want to have this ever see the inside of a court room. He will get all his money, plus what would have been assumed lost future pay (look at the QB contracts now) and not have to take another hit or put himself at any more risk.
I think this is very plausible. For me, the doctor alleged and apparent screwup s one thing. The team doctors, coaches, and management relying solely on that apparent mess up, with no further testing, monitoring, or consideration is equally as negligible.
The official label for the consultant is unaffiliated not independent  
shyster : 10/2/2022 11:09 am : link
and it signifies that he is not affiliated with any one NFL team.

But he's jointly paid by the NFL and NFLPA and subject to termination by either side if dissatisfied with his performance. The NFLPA exercising that right is not inconsistent with the job description.

The NFLPA's statement on the termination mentions "hostility during the investigation process" as well as dissatisfaction with the consultant's application of the protocol in this instance.
link - ( New Window )
after seeing what we saw  
Greg from LI : 10/2/2022 11:12 am : link
I would not be surprised at all if Tua hangs up his cleats for good. That was scary.
^  
ColHowPepper : 10/2/2022 11:34 am : link
that's (Greg's) the question that I have with MattSGS post: it doesn't take into account the heart and soul of the athlete who loves the competition
RE: So, the independent consultant is not independent?  
LakeGeorgeGiant : 10/2/2022 11:41 am : link
In comment 15840490 HomerJones45 said:
Quote:
Lots of hot takes here with no one hearing from the independent consultant or the team doctors (who have to make the call). Not saying this is good or bad or not good for player safety long term. Just saying the union was able to blow up the notion of an "independent consultant."

Be prepared for everyone going into the tent being declared concussed and done for the game. There is no "independent consultant" who is going to go out on a short limb and let someone back in the game.


Good point here. There will be a lot of hesitation about clearing players from now on.

Maybe it's better to be cautious anyhow, but it is something to think about.
"We’re going to see the burden of proof turn from, prove he likely  
ColHowPepper : 10/2/2022 11:45 am : link
...has a concussion, to prove he almost certainly doesn’t. That’s a good thing for the NFL."

That just highlights the fallacy in all this and what makes it a bitch from NFL's perspective. I don't share its perspective, having a daughter who was severely concussed and had an onfield seizure. So I'm all in for extreme caution in RTP protocol; even that is not fool proof, to go to the comment..."proof".

What makes the head trauma field so hard is that clinical 'proof' is hard if not impossible to come by, there being such wide variation between immediate effects of individuals exposed to ostensibly identical trauma: immediate reaction (nausea, motor instability, dizziness, confusion, headache, ST memory loss, etc.) and longer term recovery vs durability of symptoms and signs. And this doesn't even capture the subjectivity of different practitioners, interpretation of what he/she is "seeing".

CAT scans, MRIs etc. more often than not do not capture the trauma done to cell matrix except in case of blood clots, which clearly do show up but occur in relatively small % of cases. BU head trauma and other centers believe the trauma may be reflected in micro cellular effects.
RE: ^  
Greg from LI : 10/2/2022 11:50 am : link
In comment 15840560 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:
that's (Greg's) the question that I have with MattSGS post: it doesn't take into account the heart and soul of the athlete who loves the competition


And this is true as well - many elite athletes have a drive to compete that overrides the risks they face. That's why the concussion protocol exists in the first place - remember Jeff Hostetler sniffing an ammonia capsule on the bench in XXV, after Leon Seals crushed him? In 2022, Hoss would never be allowed back into that game.
I will also note that concussions affect different people in different  
Greg from LI : 10/2/2022 11:52 am : link
ways. I have had two concussions in my life - once in high school football, once in a car wreck. I didn't have lingering effects from either one of them after a relatively short recovery time. I was lucky. Not everyone is.
RE: I will also note that concussions affect different people in different  
BrettNYG10 : 10/2/2022 12:00 pm : link
In comment 15840580 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
ways. I have had two concussions in my life - once in high school football, once in a car wreck. I didn't have lingering effects from either one of them after a relatively short recovery time. I was lucky. Not everyone is.


No lingering effects? So you were always like this?
Correct  
Greg from LI : 10/2/2022 12:04 pm : link
Can't blame the concussions for my fundamental nature
RE: I will also note that concussions affect different people in different  
Scooter185 : 10/2/2022 12:05 pm : link
In comment 15840580 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
ways. I have had two concussions in my life - once in high school football, once in a car wreck. I didn't have lingering effects from either one of them after a relatively short recovery time. I was lucky. Not everyone is.


My wife blames her concussion history for at least part of her memory/brain fog issues
I  
AcidTest : 10/2/2022 12:10 pm : link
would be surprised if he plays again this year, and wouldn't be surprised if he never does. That was a brutal hit and was preceded the week before by another hit that knocked him out of that game. Whatever happens, best wishes to him.
RE: I was wondering if this was  
RELICDOA : 10/2/2022 12:10 pm : link
In comment 15840396 section125 said:
Quote:
as much spinal as concussion.

Best wishes to him.


Mike Tyson….”Spinal”
One of my first thoughts was Tua's father  
widmerseyebrow : 10/2/2022 12:32 pm : link
He came off as a horrible controlling football parent. IIRC: Beat Tua with a belt for bad games/interceptions, forced him to throw lefty when he was right handed, and chose his school for him.

I only hope he doesn't push Tua to stay in the NFL to live out his own fantasies against doctor's wishes for his son's health.
I said in previous thread last week this is end of Tua Career  
MartyNJ1969 : 10/2/2022 12:39 pm : link
I have had alot of experience with Concussions and when Tua went Emily Rose (Fencing). It means he has neurological damage which suggest he has had a few prior concussions and now is highly susceptible to future concussions by mearly turning his head to fast can cause anogtgher concussion.

The Doctors really did him wrong here and i hope rehab helps him to live a productive and happy life going forward.
^  
ColHowPepper : 10/2/2022 12:45 pm : link
And it is fairly well established that 1/ not only does a history of head trauma pre-dispose you to further head trauma at arguably less force and 2/ in particular head trauma following soon after earlier trauma can be/is likely to be particularly damaging. Four days after is horrid.

That is exactly why RTP guidelines were developed. And they are no guarantee.
RE: As someone who has had a concussion  
outeiroj : 10/2/2022 12:47 pm : link
In comment 15840398 AnnapolisMike said:
Quote:
It shocks me how quickly guys come back. Considering the severity of the concussion, it would not surprise me at all if he is done for the season. He should be out at least a month


as someone who has had 3 concussions. Every single one of them is different and you cannot compare the recovery time of one to another.
RE: RE: As someone who has had a concussion  
Vanzetti : 10/2/2022 2:40 pm : link
In comment 15840673 outeiroj said:
Quote:
In comment 15840398 AnnapolisMike said:


Quote:


It shocks me how quickly guys come back. Considering the severity of the concussion, it would not surprise me at all if he is done for the season. He should be out at least a month



as someone who has had 3 concussions. Every single one of them is different and you cannot compare the recovery time of one to another.



I agree. I had two concussions. First one was nothing. Two days later I felt fine. Second one lingered and turned into post-concussion syndrome.

There is a big psychological element with concussions as well. Very difficult to completely separate physical and psychological. I had a brain MRI for second one.
Slaymaker!  
trueblueinpw : 10/2/2022 3:34 pm : link
With a catch!
Things will change  
Reale01 : 10/2/2022 6:13 pm : link
When I coached youth football each team had a volunteer Dr on the sideline. The Drs NEVER let a player they were asked to check return to the field. They said it was due to liability. The NFL may end up the in the same boat as a result of the impending lawsuit.
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