An earlier thread asked the question as to whether DJ should be brought back Jones next year.
Do you think management has already made that decision regardless of where we draft, what the salary demands would be or who's available via free agency?
that the more games we win this year the worse will be our selection for the top QBs in the draft. So where does that leave us? Cooper Rush? He's a fees agent. I not sure who else is a free agent, but we're not getting much better than we have now unfortunately.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
is not a good option.
If he gets an offer above his worth in free agency let him go.
But unless we are picking in the top 5 again (which means he underperformed) what are the odds of gaining a better QB?
Because his QB rating was about 27th two weeks ago and it is 19 now. Suppose it keeps improving despite the pathetic WR's and bad Offensive Line?
So in the past 3 years you've had posters use stats to show that Jones was no good, and now if his QB rating continues to climb and God Forbid the Giants make the Playoffs or in it until the last week while his QBR is pretty good
You feel they should now all of sudden DISREGARD the stats since week 2 of the season and count the past as more relevant stats????? SO DISREGARD current 15 weeks of data and use past 3 years?????
That would be stupid. Something stupid that Producer or BW might say.
that the more games we win this year the worse will be our selection for the top QBs in the draft. So where does that leave us? Cooper Rush? He's a fees agent. I not sure who else is a free agent, but we're not getting much better than we have now unfortunately.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
A rookie of similar talent is better than what we have now because he would be here on a rookie deal instead of a second deal worth more than $20M per year.
is not a good option.
If he gets an offer above his worth in free agency let him go.
But unless we are picking in the top 5 again (which means he underperformed) what are the odds of gaining a better QB?
Because his QB rating was about 27th two weeks ago and it is 19 now. Suppose it keeps improving despite the pathetic WR's and bad Offensive Line?
So in the past 3 years you've had posters use stats to show that Jones was no good, and now if his QB rating continues to climb and God Forbid the Giants make the Playoffs or in it until the last week while his QBR is pretty good
You feel they should now all of sudden DISREGARD the stats since week 2 of the season and count the past as more relevant stats????? SO DISREGARD current 15 weeks of data and use past 3 years?????
That would be stupid. Something stupid that Producer or BW might say.
Disregard? No. By all means use these stats extrapolated out. There is no way I pay over $20M to a QB with his numbers.
is not a good option.
If he gets an offer above his worth in free agency let him go.
But unless we are picking in the top 5 again (which means he underperformed) what are the odds of gaining a better QB?
Because his QB rating was about 27th two weeks ago and it is 19 now. Suppose it keeps improving despite the pathetic WR's and bad Offensive Line?
So in the past 3 years you've had posters use stats to show that Jones was no good, and now if his QB rating continues to climb and God Forbid the Giants make the Playoffs or in it until the last week while his QBR is pretty good
You feel they should now all of sudden DISREGARD the stats since week 2 of the season and count the past as more relevant stats????? SO DISREGARD current 15 weeks of data and use past 3 years?????
That would be stupid. Something stupid that Producer or BW might say.
Disregard? No. By all means use these stats extrapolated out. There is no way I pay over $20M to a QB with his numbers.
Readign comprehnasion Matt?
Tell me Matt-- I said his QBR was about 27 after the 1st two weeks and it's now 17.
What is it that you don't understand or don't want to understand?
Maybe I used too big of words that maybe you can't understand such as "IF" and "Suppose." ????
RE: RE: RE: RE: Someone explain why letting DJ go to free agency
is not a good option.
If he gets an offer above his worth in free agency let him go.
But unless we are picking in the top 5 again (which means he underperformed) what are the odds of gaining a better QB?
Because his QB rating was about 27th two weeks ago and it is 19 now. Suppose it keeps improving despite the pathetic WR's and bad Offensive Line?
So in the past 3 years you've had posters use stats to show that Jones was no good, and now if his QB rating continues to climb and God Forbid the Giants make the Playoffs or in it until the last week while his QBR is pretty good
You feel they should now all of sudden DISREGARD the stats since week 2 of the season and count the past as more relevant stats????? SO DISREGARD current 15 weeks of data and use past 3 years?????
That would be stupid. Something stupid that Producer or BW might say.
Disregard? No. By all means use these stats extrapolated out. There is no way I pay over $20M to a QB with his numbers.
Readign comprehnasion Matt?
Tell me Matt-- I said his QBR was about 27 after the 1st two weeks and it's now 17.
What is it that you don't understand or don't want to understand?
Maybe I used too big of words that maybe you can't understand such as "IF" and "Suppose." ????
This topic has been talked about enough….why don’t you just go through the archives?
But here is the short answer- Schoen and Daboll are going to let the year play out before making any decision. So, may I suggest you do as I do….chill and watch it unfold. You will know something by 1/1/23, I’m sure (that’s less than 3 months from now).
that the more games we win this year the worse will be our selection for the top QBs in the draft. So where does that leave us? Cooper Rush? He's a fees agent. I not sure who else is a free agent, but we're not getting much better than we have now unfortunately.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
A rookie of similar talent is better than what we have now because he would be here on a rookie deal instead of a second deal worth more than $20M per year.
Where do you think we're going in 2023 Matt with that 2nd year QB? So name the rookie QB this year that is better than Jones? Picket?
Cite the player you mean instead of giving a generalization.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Someone explain why letting DJ go to free agency
is not a good option.
If he gets an offer above his worth in free agency let him go.
But unless we are picking in the top 5 again (which means he underperformed) what are the odds of gaining a better QB?
Because his QB rating was about 27th two weeks ago and it is 19 now. Suppose it keeps improving despite the pathetic WR's and bad Offensive Line?
So in the past 3 years you've had posters use stats to show that Jones was no good, and now if his QB rating continues to climb and God Forbid the Giants make the Playoffs or in it until the last week while his QBR is pretty good
You feel they should now all of sudden DISREGARD the stats since week 2 of the season and count the past as more relevant stats????? SO DISREGARD current 15 weeks of data and use past 3 years?????
That would be stupid. Something stupid that Producer or BW might say.
Disregard? No. By all means use these stats extrapolated out. There is no way I pay over $20M to a QB with his numbers.
Readign comprehnasion Matt?
Tell me Matt-- I said his QBR was about 27 after the 1st two weeks and it's now 17.
What is it that you don't understand or don't want to understand?
Maybe I used too big of words that maybe you can't understand such as "IF" and "Suppose." ????
Correction 19 now -- not 17.
No problem here. What is it you don't understand? Is QBR the only stat? His numbers are somewhat pedestrian except for rushing yards. He is not producing anywhere near a $20M QB either as an individual or the offense as a whole. He is an improved player, but nowhere near enough to warrant even a decent 2nd deal here. Someone else will pay him. That's fine by me.
I've said it many times here. I think he would have to have an otherworldly good season (i.e. top 5 in the league) in order to be re-signed. Is he a top 5? He's not even top 10 and likely not top half.
This topic has been talked about enough….why don’t you just go through the archives?
But here is the short answer- Schoen and Daboll are going to let the year play out before making any decision. So, may I suggest you do as I do….chill and watch it unfold. You will know something by 1/1/23, I’m sure (that’s less than 3 months from now).
+1.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Someone explain why letting DJ go to free agency
No problem here. What is it you don't understand? Is QBR the only stat? His numbers are somewhat pedestrian except for rushing yards. He is not producing anywhere near a $20M QB either as an individual or the offense as a whole. He is an improved player, but nowhere near enough to warrant even a decent 2nd deal here. Someone else will pay him. That's fine by me.
I've said it many times here. I think he would have to have an otherworldly good season (i.e. top 5 in the league) in order to be re-signed. Is he a top 5? He's not even top 10 and likely not top half.
Again reading comprehnsion?????????
Frist off- for all the complainers they use the QBR stat when it shows Jones is failing. But now all of a sudden it's not a stat to use?
Secondly, again I used big words like "If" and "Suppose" -- why do you not understand these "big words?"
Yes his stats ARE PEDESTRIAN - ath THIS MOMENT. But the big words I used that seems to elude you are IF HIS QBR continues to climb. IE to paraphrase I said "IF IF IF they continue to climb. You understand the word "IF," right?
So IF his QBR stats continue to climb then wouldn't it stand to reason that PROBABLY other stats are also rising?
Do you really think that the number the QBR stat complies wouldn't show other data that is very favorable? Sure maybe you come up with an extreme irregularity but overall over the course of 17 games if he plays and he has a good QBR at the end playing in all 17 games--
MORE THAN LIKLEY other stats will show positive too.
===============
I agree definitely too with you and others - his availability is a huge question too.
===========
But to say he needs an "other worldly good season is ridiculous - suppose he is 12th in QBR with this bad of an OL and lousy WR's. Would you consider that other wordly?
that the more games we win this year the worse will be our selection for the top QBs in the draft. So where does that leave us? Cooper Rush? He's a fees agent. I not sure who else is a free agent, but we're not getting much better than we have now unfortunately.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
When they didn't give him a 5th year option...they basically made the decision that if DJ isn't a top 10 QB ($30 million a year) by the end of the year, he's done. Pick a rookie, pay him $5-6 million a year and see if he can develop into a NFL starter, which DJ isn't. Chasing him in free agency, and getting in a bidding war, is a silly idea.
31st in passing yards (only to Fields)
29th in passing TDs
He's gotten worse in yards an TDs every year he's been in the league? So what if he doesn't turn the ball over...19 points a game won't beat good teams!
We are a lame duck franchise as long as he is the QB
"It can be very hard to accurately evaluate a performance like this one. Listen to any quarterback talk about Jones and they will tell you it is almost impossible to play a normal version of the position in that kind of environment. If anything, I actually put this game in the “positive pile” when thinking about where his status will reside in January."
==================
I know some of you want to pretend like SY didn't say it.
No problem here. What is it you don't understand? Is QBR the only stat? His numbers are somewhat pedestrian except for rushing yards. He is not producing anywhere near a $20M QB either as an individual or the offense as a whole. He is an improved player, but nowhere near enough to warrant even a decent 2nd deal here. Someone else will pay him. That's fine by me.
I've said it many times here. I think he would have to have an otherworldly good season (i.e. top 5 in the league) in order to be re-signed. Is he a top 5? He's not even top 10 and likely not top half.
Again reading comprehnsion?????????
Frist off- for all the complainers they use the QBR stat when it shows Jones is failing. But now all of a sudden it's not a stat to use?
Secondly, again I used big words like "If" and "Suppose" -- why do you not understand these "big words?"
Yes his stats ARE PEDESTRIAN - ath THIS MOMENT. But the big words I used that seems to elude you are IF HIS QBR continues to climb. IE to paraphrase I said "IF IF IF they continue to climb. You understand the word "IF," right?
So IF his QBR stats continue to climb then wouldn't it stand to reason that PROBABLY other stats are also rising?
Do you really think that the number the QBR stat complies wouldn't show other data that is very favorable? Sure maybe you come up with an extreme irregularity but overall over the course of 17 games if he plays and he has a good QBR at the end playing in all 17 games--
MORE THAN LIKLEY other stats will show positive too.
===============
I agree definitely too with you and others - his availability is a huge question too.
===========
But to say he needs an "other worldly good season is ridiculous - suppose he is 12th in QBR with this bad of an OL and lousy WR's. Would you consider that other wordly?
Again QBR has other stats embedded within.
First off, I never used QBR to show anything about a QB, Jones or otherwise. Second, he has had moderate improvement, so that makes your "if" a huge fairy tale hypothetical. So, back to mine...he only gets a second contract in NY IF he is a top 5 QB. That's is not likely at all.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Someone explain why letting DJ go to free agency
First off, I never used QBR to show anything about a QB, Jones or otherwise. Second, he has had moderate improvement, so that makes your "if" a huge fairy tale hypothetical. So, back to mine...he only gets a second contract in NY IF he is a top 5 QB. That's is not likely at all.
But then my initial posts weren't about you/addressed to you. Other posters use them to blast Jones. Again reading comprehension. You NEED it. How many times have I said on this thread on THIS THREAD on THIS THREAD that there were posters that used QBR????????? SO again I said how odd it is that they use it and now I'm being told I can't use it.
And you know I use it.
So if you don’t want to use it- that's your prerogative but just because you didn’t; use it doesn't mean I can't.
You don’t want to use it fine. I use it partially. But when you say "moderate improvement" - how are you defining "moderate?"
A jump from 27 to 19 in two weeks is "moderate?"
And I said "IF IF IF he continues to CLIMB."
==========
IF IF IF IF he continues to CLIMB in his QBR then there will be OTHER stats. Just because you don’t' want to look at them it does not mean that they don’t exist.
And to further among other factors is that I'm listening to SY. SO I shouldn't be blasted in the manner that other poster did for this opinion.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Someone explain why letting DJ go to free agency
No problem here. What is it you don't understand? Is QBR the only stat? His numbers are somewhat pedestrian except for rushing yards. He is not producing anywhere near a $20M QB either as an individual or the offense as a whole. He is an improved player, but nowhere near enough to warrant even a decent 2nd deal here. Someone else will pay him. That's fine by me.
I've said it many times here. I think he would have to have an otherworldly good season (i.e. top 5 in the league) in order to be re-signed. Is he a top 5? He's not even top 10 and likely not top half.
Again reading comprehnsion?????????
Frist off- for all the complainers they use the QBR stat when it shows Jones is failing. But now all of a sudden it's not a stat to use?
Secondly, again I used big words like "If" and "Suppose" -- why do you not understand these "big words?"
Yes his stats ARE PEDESTRIAN - ath THIS MOMENT. But the big words I used that seems to elude you are IF HIS QBR continues to climb. IE to paraphrase I said "IF IF IF they continue to climb. You understand the word "IF," right?
So IF his QBR stats continue to climb then wouldn't it stand to reason that PROBABLY other stats are also rising?
Do you really think that the number the QBR stat complies wouldn't show other data that is very favorable? Sure maybe you come up with an extreme irregularity but overall over the course of 17 games if he plays and he has a good QBR at the end playing in all 17 games--
MORE THAN LIKLEY other stats will show positive too.
===============
I agree definitely too with you and others - his availability is a huge question too.
===========
But to say he needs an "other worldly good season is ridiculous - suppose he is 12th in QBR with this bad of an OL and lousy WR's. Would you consider that other wordly?
Again QBR has other stats embedded within.
First off, I never used QBR to show anything about a QB, Jones or otherwise. Second, he has had moderate improvement, so that makes your "if" a huge fairy tale hypothetical. So, back to mine...he only gets a second contract in NY IF he is a top 5 QB. That's is not likely at all.
But then my initial posts weren't about you/addressed to you. Other posters use them to blast Jones. Again reading comprehension. You NEED it. How many times have I said on this thread on THIS THREAD on THIS THREAD that there were posters that used QBR????????? SO again I said how odd it is that they use it and now I'm being told I can't use it.
And you know I use it.
So if you don’t want to use it- that's your prerogative but just because you didn’t; use it doesn't mean I can't.
You don’t want to use it fine. I use it partially. But when you say "moderate improvement" - how are you defining "moderate?"
A jump from 27 to 19 in two weeks is "moderate?"
And I said "IF IF IF he continues to CLIMB."
==========
IF IF IF IF he continues to CLIMB in his QBR then there will be OTHER stats. Just because you don’t' want to look at them it does not mean that they don’t exist.
And to further among other factors is that I'm listening to SY. SO I shouldn't be blasted in the manner that other poster did for this opinion.
Where are people pulling these salary numbers for Jones from? He's not going to see that kind of money. With that being said if the team is in the 8+ win range the chances of them having a chance at any of the top QB's in what's turning into a weaker class than people thought it would without trading up is pretty small. I highly doubt the Giants Brain Trust trades a bunch picks for a shot at any of them with all the holes in this roster. So that leaves brining DJ back on a short term prove it deal or looking at the available FA's to decide if the cost/benefit ratio merits signing one of them. Schoen & Daboll have 13 more games to make that decision. Based on these scenarios I wouldn't be surprised if DJ is still wearing blue next season.
Sure they haven’t. Whatever gets you to sleep at night.
It's the people who believe a decision has already been made that are just comforting themselves. Close-mindedness rooted in insecurities. God forbid they should be proven wrong after months of pontificating. It's really quite adorable.
the most positive thing you can find is "hard to evaluate". Cool. Let's commit to that.
There are 13 games left in the season, who said anything about commitment? Some fans can live with the uncertainty while... ...others? - ( New Window )
the most positive thing you can find is "hard to evaluate". Cool. Let's commit to that.
There are 13 games left in the season, who said anything about commitment? Some fans can live with the uncertainty while... ...others? - ( New Window )
Unbelievable isn't it??
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Someone explain why letting DJ go to free agency
No problem here. What is it you don't understand? Is QBR the only stat? His numbers are somewhat pedestrian except for rushing yards. He is not producing anywhere near a $20M QB either as an individual or the offense as a whole. He is an improved player, but nowhere near enough to warrant even a decent 2nd deal here. Someone else will pay him. That's fine by me.
I've said it many times here. I think he would have to have an otherworldly good season (i.e. top 5 in the league) in order to be re-signed. Is he a top 5? He's not even top 10 and likely not top half.
Again reading comprehnsion?????????
Frist off- for all the complainers they use the QBR stat when it shows Jones is failing. But now all of a sudden it's not a stat to use?
Secondly, again I used big words like "If" and "Suppose" -- why do you not understand these "big words?"
Yes his stats ARE PEDESTRIAN - ath THIS MOMENT. But the big words I used that seems to elude you are IF HIS QBR continues to climb. IE to paraphrase I said "IF IF IF they continue to climb. You understand the word "IF," right?
So IF his QBR stats continue to climb then wouldn't it stand to reason that PROBABLY other stats are also rising?
Do you really think that the number the QBR stat complies wouldn't show other data that is very favorable? Sure maybe you come up with an extreme irregularity but overall over the course of 17 games if he plays and he has a good QBR at the end playing in all 17 games--
MORE THAN LIKLEY other stats will show positive too.
===============
I agree definitely too with you and others - his availability is a huge question too.
===========
But to say he needs an "other worldly good season is ridiculous - suppose he is 12th in QBR with this bad of an OL and lousy WR's. Would you consider that other wordly?
Again QBR has other stats embedded within.
Most people on this thread use their eyes, not QBR. Im not sure why you're so up in arms, if you're trolling then i tip my cap.
Your if statements are just that.....if statements. People can only base opinions off what they see. You can tell me his QBR is going to the moon and i still don't think he should be re-signed. For some reasoning your grasping at QBR like its the bible. IF his QBR increases but he's still fairly one dimensional with the playcalling and offense built around that who the hell cares where it ranks in the NFL.
The new FO is looking at film, and yes crunching some numbers. No one is speaking about QBR in the room. I promise you that.
RE: Someone explain why letting DJ go to free agency
Most people on this thread use their eyes, not QBR. Im not sure why you're so up in arms, if you're trolling then i tip my cap.
Your if statements are just that.....if statements. People can only base opinions off what they see. You can tell me his QBR is going to the moon and i still don't think he should be re-signed. For some reasoning your grasping at QBR like its the bible. IF his QBR increases but he's still fairly one dimensional with the playcalling and offense built around that who the hell cares where it ranks in the NFL.
The new FO is looking at film, and yes crunching some numbers. No one is speaking about QBR in the room. I promise you that.
TThis is not true. First off "I'm up in arms?" I made an initial comment that DJ is not a lame duck. Then a poster made a snide comment to me then I replied in a snide way back, then got insulted. So, please stop with the exaggeration that "I'm up in arms." You're just saying that because you don’t agree with me.
Again I'm not grasping at QBR. I'll say again on this thread the complainers that have bashed Jones have used it. Now when I use it I’m getting criticized??? Where were you when BW or others use QBR to bash Jones?? Silent, right? But now when I’m using it to show a trend I can’t use it but others that bash him when it goes down they can?
And again please read my posts instead of trying to isolate my point into one issue. I referenced SY's opinion and I agree with it, didn't I? And he did NOT mention QBR. And I said I agree with what he is saying, didn't I? Read the post on this thread at 10:28 PM. You can’t og and ignore things that I said just so you want to fit your narrative.
And to use your phrase "I can promise you that he knows more about what is being said than you (and me) do."
And I'm the one agreeing with SY and you are seriously trying to argue with me other than a simple you disagree and this is why etc???? You have to be sarcastic even though I’m agreeing with the pro scout? Are you kidding? Are you kidding? Are you kidding?
This topic has been talked about enough….why don’t you just go through the archives?
But here is the short answer- Schoen and Daboll are going to let the year play out before making any decision. So, may I suggest you do as I do….chill and watch it unfold. You will know something by 1/1/23, I’m sure (that’s less than 3 months from now).
It's refreshing that you make it simple but accurate. Trust those in power to evaluate DJ. Let's see what happens this season and then make their decision to go with DJ or let him go.
he's not a lame duck. Not only does it depend on his play, but his contract demands. Let's say the Giants end up 9-8 or 8-9 or whatever middle of the pack is going to be. If you tell Jones sayonara, who are you replacing him with? Do you mortgage the future like Denver did for Wilson? That wouldn't make sense when they have so many needs in other areas. Do you draft a QB at 15th or 16th? It's possible and go with Taylor for a year, but that's just giving up on a year waiting for a QB that might not be any better than Jones.
So, if Jones has a good year and signs for a reasonable contract it leaves the team with the draft choices to build up the supporting cast.
Mara acknowledged it was unfair to judge in the offseason, and admitted the organization failed him. Was that lip service, or do you think it was a genuine appraisal? I think it's the latter and I believe Shoen and Daboll probably agreed it was also unfair to judge, see how this goes. I don't believe Hurts is better than Jones, and he's getting believers. If Jones keeps winning with no receivers, I can't see why that's purely just Saquon and good coaching, and Jones is incidental.
that the more games we win this year the worse will be our selection for the top QBs in the draft. So where does that leave us? Cooper Rush? He's a fees agent. I not sure who else is a free agent, but we're not getting much better than we have now unfortunately.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
Where were the Chiefs picking when they moved up for Mahomes? What pick did the Bills start with when they began trading up into range for Allen?
What makes you think Schoen/Daboll/Kafka will be any less aggressive if they identify the QB they want?
he's not a lame duck. Not only does it depend on his play, but his contract demands. Let's say the Giants end up 9-8 or 8-9 or whatever middle of the pack is going to be. If you tell Jones sayonara, who are you replacing him with? Do you mortgage the future like Denver did for Wilson? That wouldn't make sense when they have so many needs in other areas. Do you draft a QB at 15th or 16th? It's possible and go with Taylor for a year, but that's just giving up on a year waiting for a QB that might not be any better than Jones.
So, if Jones has a good year and signs for a reasonable contract it leaves the team with the draft choices to build up the supporting cast.
He's thrown for 3 td and yet to hit the magical 200 yard mark in 4 games and threw for 71 yards his last game. He is running more which is a good thing because he isn't a very good passer. Oh yeah, how we could we possibly find someone else to reach these heights.
Judas Priest, the continual rescue attempts for Jones are a wonder. He is a below average NFL qb, the Giants are giving him the heave ho (Mara can sugar coat it all he wants if that makes him feel better), reconcile yourselves to that and move on already.
He’s a better runner and has made strides in his passing
You sound like a reasonably intelligent fan- up until this year, what has Hurts done? Not much, right?
But notice who his top 2 receivers are to throw to this year…..Mr Smith and Mr Brown. Hmmmmm, do ya think having those two superstar toys might give him an advantage over Jones who has Golladay, Richie, and Sills to throw to?
Ya think?
Use that brain God gave you fellow.
Besides, aren’t you one of the guys who was lobbying hard for NY to pick up Russell Wilson.? How is that turning out for you?
that the more games we win this year the worse will be our selection for the top QBs in the draft. So where does that leave us? Cooper Rush? He's a fees agent. I not sure who else is a free agent, but we're not getting much better than we have now unfortunately.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
Where were the Chiefs picking when they moved up for Mahomes? What pick did the Bills start with when they began trading up into range for Allen?
What makes you think Schoen/Daboll/Kafka will be any less aggressive if they identify the QB they want?
Interesting point: Chiefs traded 2 1st rounders, a 3rd rounder to go from 27th to 10th to get Mahomes. The Bills were at 12 and traded 2 2nd rounders to get to 7.
He’s a better runner and has made strides in his passing
You sound like a reasonably intelligent fan- up until this year, what has Hurts done? Not much, right?
But notice who his top 2 receivers are to throw to this year…..Mr Smith and Mr Brown. Hmmmmm, do ya think having those two superstar toys might give him an advantage over Jones who has Golladay, Richie, and Sills to throw to?
Ya think?
Use that brain God gave you fellow.
Besides, aren’t you one of the guys who was lobbying hard for NY to pick up Russell Wilson.? How is that turning out for you?
I said I would trade for Wilson if the price was right, I wouldn’t call that lobbying for him. I wouldn’t have traded for him at the cost the Broncos gave up.
Second of all, you should probably use your brain. I didn’t say Hurts was some elite passer but he’s made strides in his decision making as a passer, that’s independent of who he is throwing to. I know some of you only have the capacity to look at box scores and win loss records.
Fans who think the Giants will be saddled with Jones because there's no better option are silly. Schoen has given no indication that's how he manages his resources.
If Jones is a Giant next years it's because 1) they've committed to him 2) they believe they need more time evaluate him.
Things we know:
1) There's very little upside to cutting Taylor, so he's likely to be the backup or bridge starter next year
2) Schoen witnessed firsthand how to move up in the draft responsibly and get a raw QB Daboll developed into a star
3) The Giants have the cap room to pay market rate for a starter if one becomes available via trade or free agency
Things we don't know yet:
1) How Jones will end up looking this year
2) Where the Giants will pick
3) Who the real college prospects are
I'm sure they see what type of QB he is and has been in the NFL
and unless there's a sudden, significant, unforeseen uptick in his performance, then yes he will be on his way out. The holes in his college tape remain unfixed.
that the more games we win this year the worse will be our selection for the top QBs in the draft. So where does that leave us? Cooper Rush? He's a fees agent. I not sure who else is a free agent, but we're not getting much better than we have now unfortunately.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
Where were the Chiefs picking when they moved up for Mahomes? What pick did the Bills start with when they began trading up into range for Allen?
What makes you think Schoen/Daboll/Kafka will be any less aggressive if they identify the QB they want?
Interesting point: Chiefs traded 2 1st rounders, a 3rd rounder to go from 27th to 10th to get Mahomes. The Bills were at 12 and traded 2 2nd rounders to get to 7.
The Bills were at 22 (with the pick they got from the Chiefs in the Mahomes trade, ironically) and used that (with other picks) to trade up to 12 first, then to 7.
he's not a lame duck. Not only does it depend on his play, but his contract demands. Let's say the Giants end up 9-8 or 8-9 or whatever middle of the pack is going to be. If you tell Jones sayonara, who are you replacing him with? Do you mortgage the future like Denver did for Wilson? That wouldn't make sense when they have so many needs in other areas. Do you draft a QB at 15th or 16th? It's possible and go with Taylor for a year, but that's just giving up on a year waiting for a QB that might not be any better than Jones.
So, if Jones has a good year and signs for a reasonable contract it leaves the team with the draft choices to build up the supporting cast.
He's thrown for 3 td and yet to hit the magical 200 yard mark in 4 games and threw for 71 yards his last game. He is running more which is a good thing because he isn't a very good passer. Oh yeah, how we could we possibly find someone else to reach these heights.
Judas Priest, the continual rescue attempts for Jones are a wonder. He is a below average NFL qb, the Giants are giving him the heave ho (Mara can sugar coat it all he wants if that makes him feel better), reconcile yourselves to that and move on already.
Have you sent your opinion to Sy in his last couple of postgame evaluation when he said he can do it etc? HE didn't see he will do it he said he can.
So why dodn'y you challenge him next time when he says anything positive about Jones next time he makes a remark such as "he can do it." ?
Fans who think the Giants will be saddled with Jones because there's no better option are silly. Schoen has given no indication that's how he manages his resources.
If Jones is a Giant next years it's because 1) they've committed to him 2) they believe they need more time evaluate him.
Things we know:
1) There's very little upside to cutting Taylor, so he's likely to be the backup or bridge starter next year
2) Schoen witnessed firsthand how to move up in the draft responsibly and get a raw QB Daboll developed into a star
3) The Giants have the cap room to pay market rate for a starter if one becomes available via trade or free agency
He’s a better runner and has made strides in his passing
You sound like a reasonably intelligent fan- up until this year, what has Hurts done? Not much, right?
But notice who his top 2 receivers are to throw to this year…..Mr Smith and Mr Brown. Hmmmmm, do ya think having those two superstar toys might give him an advantage over Jones who has Golladay, Richie, and Sills to throw to?
Ya think?
Use that brain God gave you fellow.
Besides, aren’t you one of the guys who was lobbying hard for NY to pick up Russell Wilson.? How is that turning out for you?
I said I would trade for Wilson if the price was right, I wouldn’t call that lobbying for him. I wouldn’t have traded for him at the cost the Broncos gave up.
Second of all, you should probably use your brain. I didn’t say Hurts was some elite passer but he’s made strides in his decision making as a passer, that’s independent of who he is throwing to. I know some of you only have the capacity to look at box scores and win loss records.
You forgot to quote your title….”Hurts is better than Jones”
So I assume you based this remark on the fact that his passing numbers have been better…..thus my rebuttal regarding the much better toys has to play with than Jones.
Up until this year, I don’t recall anyone here tooting Hurts horn, especially after that horrible game he played against us in NY last year. But all of a sudden, he is 3-1 and playing well and some people like you come out of the closet to tell us Hurts is better than Jones. Based on what? You know what…..Hurts has passed better because Hurts has much better toys. Is that fair?
I think the organization has doubts about whether he’s …
Things change, thus opinions change. Not sure why that concept doesn’t seem to exist on this site.
Sure adding AJ Brown has made it easier for Hurts, but that’s not the only reason Hurts looks better this year. He’s improved himself. This site has this weird complex where we’re not allowed to point out the flaws of the QB we like but every other QBs in the leagues warts get magnified.
Do you honestly think if you swapped Jones with Hurts, the Eagles would put up the same offense? No chance, and that’s not even going into passing ability - Hurts is a much better runner than Jones.
Said Hurts is a better runner and has made strides in his passing game. I didn’t even say he was a better passer than Jones, but at a minimum they’re equal as a passer.
Yea and then we are right back here in 4 years. Look for them to sign a bridge qb to hold the fort until they find a top guy in the draft. It might be Jones....it might not. But I doubt they draft a project. If they do and he doesn't work out both JS and BD will be out of a job.
that the more games we win this year the worse will be our selection for the top QBs in the draft. So where does that leave us? Cooper Rush? He's a fees agent. I not sure who else is a free agent, but we're not getting much better than we have now unfortunately.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
A rookie of similar talent is better than what we have now because he would be here on a rookie deal instead of a second deal worth more than $20M per year.
Said Hurts is a better runner and has made strides in his passing game. I didn’t even say he was a better passer than Jones, but at a minimum they’re equal as a passer.
Hurts situation and Jones's situation are so radically different that they cannot be compared. Eagles have an elite OL, a top 5 WR and a great 2 in Smith, a good tight and and a good running game. Jones has Barkley and Andrew Thomas and that is it.
Hands. The only control the Giants have is if they tag him. Otherwise, he is a free agent and can sign with the Giants (before anyone else) or any other team. Everyone will look at him in approximately the same way - as a backup/borderline starter with a chance to compete for a starting job with other backups or as a placeholder/competition for a rookie QB.
Unless Jones delivers 10+ wins, the Giants can sit back and wait to see what the market for him in that role is. Personally, no matter what happens, I think the Giants will give him the best offer because he is better than Tyrod Taylor. There may have been a point in time where Tyrod was better than Jones is now but no longer. He may not take the offer from the Giants.
Said Hurts is a better runner and has made strides in his passing game. I didn’t even say he was a better passer than Jones, but at a minimum they’re equal as a passer.
If they “are equal as passers” (your words), then how could you say “Hurts is better” (your words in title).
How is he better? If you say rushing, even that is debatable. Without looking, imwould think both are doing well with yards rushing and TDs.
Said Hurts is a better runner and has made strides in his passing game. I didn’t even say he was a better passer than Jones, but at a minimum they’re equal as a passer.
If they “are equal as passers” (your words), then how could you say “Hurts is better” (your words in title).
How is he better? If you say rushing, even that is debatable. Without looking, imwould think both are doing well with yards rushing and TDs.
It’s really not debatable that Hurts is a better runner. Jones is just a straight line runner, Hurts is a better runner in the open field and even inside the pocket
You make funny here, but many on this site were clamoring for Pickett to be picked to replace Jones. Let’s see- one game in, 3 interceptions. Nice start. But I’m not saying he can’t turn it around and become a good NFL QB.
The truth is, maybe the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t really know (guys like Pickett).
RE: RE: Jones may not take an offer from the Giants?
You make funny here, but many on this site were clamoring for Pickett to be picked to replace Jones. Let’s see- one game in, 3 interceptions. Nice start. But I’m not saying he can’t turn it around and become a good NFL QB.
The truth is, maybe the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t really know (guys like Pickett).
Said Hurts is a better runner and has made strides in his passing game. I didn’t even say he was a better passer than Jones, but at a minimum they’re equal as a passer.
If they “are equal as passers” (your words), then how could you say “Hurts is better” (your words in title).
How is he better? If you say rushing, even that is debatable. Without looking, imwould think both are doing well with yards rushing and TDs.
It’s really not debatable that Hurts is a better runner. Jones is just a straight line runner, Hurts is a better runner in the open field and even inside the pocket
You make funny here, but many on this site were clamoring for Pickett to be picked to replace Jones. Let’s see- one game in, 3 interceptions. Nice start. But I’m not saying he can’t turn it around and become a good NFL QB.
The truth is, maybe the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t really know (guys like Pickett).
I can see your post is funny too…
No, wrong post….my funny post was the AJ Klein Appreciation thread…..
RE: RE: Jones may not take an offer from the Giants?
You make funny here, but many on this site were clamoring for Pickett to be picked to replace Jones. Let’s see- one game in, 3 interceptions. Nice start. But I’m not saying he can’t turn it around and become a good NFL QB.
The truth is, maybe the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t really know (guys like Pickett).
Will the two devils have the same price tag next year? Or does the devil you know potentially cost 3x+ the amount that the devil you don't know?
And isolating your one-game-sample-size doesn't do much to support your argument. I can rattle off just as many QBs who became superstars in the past five years that were drafted later in their own draft than DJ was.
Staying with a loser because you're afraid of the alternative (to a loser) is rooted in cowardice.
People who watch other NFL games vs. People who only watch the Giants
One of my favorite interactions over the last three months was a poster asserting the Giants had the worst OL in the league. Said poster then said he doesn't really watch other teams when asked in the same thread.
RE: RE: RE: Jones may not take an offer from the Giants?
You make funny here, but many on this site were clamoring for Pickett to be picked to replace Jones. Let’s see- one game in, 3 interceptions. Nice start. But I’m not saying he can’t turn it around and become a good NFL QB.
The truth is, maybe the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t really know (guys like Pickett).
Will the two devils have the same price tag next year? Or does the devil you know potentially cost 3x+ the amount that the devil you don't know?
And isolating your one-game-sample-size doesn't do much to support your argument. I can rattle off just as many QBs who became superstars in the past five years that were drafted later in their own draft than DJ was.
Staying with a loser because you're afraid of the alternative (to a loser) is rooted in cowardice.
You make good points….I for one don’t want to spend big bucks on a guy that I don’t have utmost confidence in. I’m sure Schoen and Daboll feel the same, so I defer to their decision and me personally, I stay neutral regarding should we or shouldn’t we resign Jones.
Golladay ‘s $72 M and many in Dallas are crying over both Zeke and Dak’# big contracts…..no, I am a big believer in SPENDING WISELY. Count the costs….if you can get a qb who may be similar in talent for far less, that makes sense to me. But you still have to wisely assess both the guy leaving and the new guy you may be bringing in to replace him. Not always black and white.
Like I used to watch a lot of Rangers games, but I never watched the NHL. So if some real hockey fan said that Vladimir Whoever was better than some guy on the Rangers...I might go look up Vladimirs stats, but I wouldn't argue with him. Because I didn't know anything.
These guys obviously don't watch other teams. How do they come in so hot with arguments when they have so little knowledge?
RE: Why does it matter if nobody complimented Hurts before this year?
This site has this weird complex where we’re not allowed to point out the flaws of the QB we like but every other QBs in the leagues warts get magnified.
Do you honestly think if you swapped Jones with Hurts, the Eagles would put up the same offense? No chance, and that’s not even going into passing ability - Hurts is a much better runner than Jones.
Misrepresent issues much? Because you are doing it here. Please provide the link where anyone has suggested you can't point out flaws of Jones? No one said it but posters like you continually misrepresent /over-exaggerate to make your point about Jones.
Yes Jones is flawed but many of us rational posters realize that he could be better if for example if he had Phily's WRs and Tight End and had the Philly OLine.
It doesn't mean we think he will be as good as Hurts or even be a legit starter etc but the point is- you just want to bury your head in the sand and exclude other factors as it pertains to Jones and just proclaim in a manner of speak "he sucks."
And then you go and make exaggerated posts like you've just done here in an attempt to justify your opinion.
People who watch other NFL games vs. People who only watch the Giants
One of my favorite interactions over the last three months was a poster asserting the Giants had the worst OL in the league. Said poster then said he doesn't really watch other teams when asked in the same thread.
Well, it wasn’t me who said that, but even still, many don’t watch other games other than Giant games. (Maybe an occasional Sunday Night or Monday Night)
Nowadays, people use stats from PFF for example….there are plenty of people who rate teams and positions….so one only needs to read their research….not having to watch other teams play.
This site has this weird complex where we’re not allowed to point out the flaws of the QB we like but every other QBs in the leagues warts get magnified.
Do you honestly think if you swapped Jones with Hurts, the Eagles would put up the same offense? No chance, and that’s not even going into passing ability - Hurts is a much better runner than Jones.
Misrepresent issues much? Because you are doing it here. Please provide the link where anyone has suggested you can't point out flaws of Jones? No one said it but posters like you continually misrepresent /over-exaggerate to make your point about Jones.
Yes Jones is flawed but many of us rational posters realize that he could be better if for example if he had Phily's WRs and Tight End and had the Philly OLine.
It doesn't mean we think he will be as good as Hurts or even be a legit starter etc but the point is- you just want to bury your head in the sand and exclude other factors as it pertains to Jones and just proclaim in a manner of speak "he sucks."
And then you go and make exaggerated posts like you've just done here in an attempt to justify your opinion.
You literally can not be serious with this post. First off there’s a lot of people who get very abusive when you even have the slightest criticism of Jones. Nobody exaggerates Jones’ flaws, they’re pretty clear and it’s clear he’s not a good QB. He still wouldn’t be a good QB with AJ Brown and Smith. Tannehill didn’t turn into Aaron Rodgers or even Kirk Cousins when he had Brown, Henry and the Titans oline.
who is more fanatically obsessed with Daniel Jones than his actual parents self-identifying as a "rational poster" is pretty remarkable
Stick to the football issues being discussed….please stay away from diverting the conversation from the players to the posters…that serves no useful purpose. Email someone if you have an issue with and let’s just stick to talking football here.
RE: RE: You can just look at the stats if you want
But that doesn’t say much on the running ability at the Quarterback position.
Hurts runs are better because they are flashier. It doesn't matter that he has 22 more running plays and averages only 3.9 per play.
Yeah, I guess Hurts 3.9 impresses ajr more than Daniel’s 6.2.
I think you may be right….I think ajr isn’t impressed with Danny’s style….must look a bit too awkward…..and he likes the sleeker look (you used flashy) better.
I’m sure ajr’s car is pretty sporty looking….flashier, right? Definitely not a Cadillac. Lol
But that doesn’t say much on the running ability at the Quarterback position.
Hurts runs are better because they are flashier. It doesn't matter that he has 22 more running plays and averages only 3.9 per play.
Not what I said, but ok. I’m convinced nobody watches other teams. Jones averages more YPA than Josh Allen, is he better runner than Allen?
And by the same logic is Geno Smith averaging nearly 2 more YPA throwing mean he’s better than Jones?
I’m not playing this game with you- we are discussing Jones v Hurts. You said they are equal as passers but Hurts is a better rusher. That is what we are discussing….
If you want to compare Geno with Danny, go start a new thread.
Of using stats through 4 games to prove that Jones is a better runner than Hurts. If you can’t grasp that or just want to avoid it because exposes the flaw in your argument, there’s no point in even having this discussion.
Hurts has the better running skills. He’s faster, the better athlete, he’s shiftier. Watch the actual games.
the most positive thing you can find is "hard to evaluate". Cool. Let's commit to that.
There are 13 games left in the season, who said anything about commitment? Some fans can live with the uncertainty while... ...others? - ( New Window )
I think there's a disconnect at the premise level: the fans who "can live with the uncertainty" are the only ones who even believe there is uncertainty to be lived with at this point.
It isn't about being able to live with the uncertainty, IMO. It's about defining uncertainty vs. inevitability.
Of using stats through 4 games to prove that Jones is a better runner than Hurts. If you can’t grasp that or just want to avoid it because exposes the flaw in your argument, there’s no point in even having this discussion.
Hurts has the better running skills. He’s faster, the better athlete, he’s shiftier. Watch the actual games.
Just curious….is there a qb who has a longer run from scrimmage than our Danny boy? Too bad he tripped…imagine a 90 something yard TD run from a qb.
Of using stats through 4 games to prove that Jones is a better runner than Hurts. If you can’t grasp that or just want to avoid it because exposes the flaw in your argument, there’s no point in even having this discussion.
Hurts has the better running skills. He’s faster, the better athlete, he’s shiftier. Watch the actual games.
You said….”Hurts has the better running skills. He’s faster, the better athlete, he’s shiftier..”
If Hurts is all that, then why is Danny doing better than him? I mean come on….Hurts is faster, shiftier, better athlete…..why is he only averaging 3.9 instead of 10.9? And what about the two fumbles?
You are dense man. If we’re going just by stats then Jones is one of the worst QBs in the league right? If all you care about are the rushing stats through four games this conversation is pointless
RE: RE: RE: RE: Jones may not take an offer from the Giants?
You make funny here, but many on this site were clamoring for Pickett to be picked to replace Jones. Let’s see- one game in, 3 interceptions. Nice start. But I’m not saying he can’t turn it around and become a good NFL QB.
The truth is, maybe the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t really know (guys like Pickett).
I can see your post is funny too…
No, wrong post….my funny post was the AJ Klein Appreciation thread…..
Has the longest TD run for a QB. I guess he’s the best rushing QB of all time by your logic.
Thanks…I forgot about that 93 yard run. Well, even if Danny didn’t trip, it would have only been 88. But you mentioned Hurts is faster….Danny is pretty fast once he gets a head of steam up….I mean no one was even near him on that 80 yard run.
You are dense man. If we’re going just by stats then Jones is one of the worst QBs in the league right? If all you care about are the rushing stats through four games this conversation is pointless
I guess we are at a point where we will have to agree to disagree.
But for the record, just so we can see the numbers…
Hurts
2022….53 for 205 yards; 3.9 YPC; 4 Tds
2021…139 for 784 yards; 5.6 YPC; 10 TDs
2020….63 for 354 yards; 5.6 YPC; 3 TDs
Jones
2022….31 for 193 yards; 6.2 YPC; 2 TDs
2020…65 for 423 yards; 6.5 YPC; 1 TD (should have been 2, lol)
2019…45 for 279 yards; 6.2 YPC; 2 TDs
The only conclusions I can draw from these 3 years is this:
1. Hurts runs much more. (Not quite twice as much more; 44% more)
2. Hurts scores more TDs (not surprising)
3. Jones average per carry are better each year
I can’t say Hurts is the better runner because of these numbers….but I can say he runs much more than Jones and scores more rushing TDs.
RE: RE: RE: Why does it matter if nobody complimented Hurts before this year?
This site has this weird complex where we’re not allowed to point out the flaws of the QB we like but every other QBs in the leagues warts get magnified.
Do you honestly think if you swapped Jones with Hurts, the Eagles would put up the same offense? No chance, and that’s not even going into passing ability - Hurts is a much better runner than Jones.
Misrepresent issues much? Because you are doing it here. Please provide the link where anyone has suggested you can't point out flaws of Jones? No one said it but posters like you continually misrepresent /over-exaggerate to make your point about Jones.
Yes Jones is flawed but many of us rational posters realize that he could be better if for example if he had Phily's WRs and Tight End and had the Philly OLine.
It doesn't mean we think he will be as good as Hurts or even be a legit starter etc but the point is- you just want to bury your head in the sand and exclude other factors as it pertains to Jones and just proclaim in a manner of speak "he sucks."
And then you go and make exaggerated posts like you've just done here in an attempt to justify your opinion.
You literally can not be serious with this post. First off there’s a lot of people who get very abusive when you even have the slightest criticism of Jones. Nobody exaggerates Jones’ flaws, they’re pretty clear and it’s clear he’s not a good QB. He still wouldn’t be a good QB with AJ Brown and Smith. Tannehill didn’t turn into Aaron Rodgers or even Kirk Cousins when he had Brown, Henry and the Titans oline.
You literally can not be serious with this post.
1-- Posters attack oyu beucase hwo oyu rpesent your opinions. On this verty thread you've made psots If you just criticized Jones and left it at that but overall you set yourself up for antagonistic posts (I do too).
1a -- "Since people on this site just make up stuff to attack over"
1b--- "Not sure why that concept doesn’t seem to exist on this site."
1c-- "This site has this weird complex where we’re not allowed to point out the flaws of the QB . . ."
2--- Nobody exaggerates Jones flaws? NOBODY? I love it.
3a--- It's clear that SY thinks he could be "a good enough QB." I've provided the link to you before and apparently I must do it again because you must've forgotten (sarcasm). .
"Listen to any quarterback talk about Jones and they will tell you it is almost impossible to play a normal version of the position in that kind of environment. If anything, I actually put this game in the “positive pile” when thinking about where his status will reside in January."
3b--- But I just want to make it clear that you are saying exactly the opposite of what SY is saying about Jones if the past quote you provided me came from him which I have no reason to not believe it didn't. So thanks - so - because Philly's Offense and Defense are all top notch. So here is the link you provided and from what Sy said:
"The ceiling being a guy who absolutely needs the team around him to be top notch."
In summary - whose opinion do we think generally is it better to go with Sys's a Pr Scout? Or you = a a couch fan who loves to exaggerate?
I guess we are at a point where we will have to agree to disagree.
But for the record, just so we can see the numbers…
Hurts
2022….53 for 205 yards; 3.9 YPC; 4 Tds
2021…139 for 784 yards; 5.6 YPC; 10 TDs
2020….63 for 354 yards; 5.6 YPC; 3 TDs
Jones
2022….31 for 193 yards; 6.2 YPC; 2 TDs
2020…65 for 423 yards; 6.5 YPC; 1 TD (should have been 2, lol)
2019…45 for 279 yards; 6.2 YPC; 2 TDs
The only conclusions I can draw from these 3 years is this:
1. Hurts runs much more. (Not quite twice as much more; 44% more)
2. Hurts scores more TDs (not surprising)
3. Jones average per carry are better each year
I can’t say Hurts is the better runner because of these numbers….but I can say he runs much more than Jones and scores more rushing TDs.
You're barking up the wrong tree if you want to post logic with that poster.
Got to run.
It’s year 4 of this nonsense of posters comparing Jones
this is not even a question outside of BBI. Jones is a pretty good running QB, though it does seem every time we turn up the dial on his running - he gets hurt.
"Listen to any quarterback talk about Jones and they will tell you it is almost impossible to play a normal version of the position in that kind of environment. If anything, I actually put this game in the “positive pile” when thinking about where his status will reside in January."
I recommend proof reading and not formatting your posts so the thread turns into war and peace.
Where does that say Sy said he’s “good enough”? That’s taking quite some artistic liberty. The closest Sy has said to he’s “good enough” is that he reminds him of Tannehill. That’s not a compliment
RE: Hurts is the 2nd best running QB in the league to Lamar
this is not even a question outside of BBI. Jones is a pretty good running QB, though it does seem every time we turn up the dial on his running - he gets hurt.
Josh Allen?
RE: RE: Hurts is the 2nd best running QB in the league to Lamar
this is not even a question outside of BBI. Jones is a pretty good running QB, though it does seem every time we turn up the dial on his running - he gets hurt.
this is not even a question outside of BBI. Jones is a pretty good running QB, though it does seem every time we turn up the dial on his running - he gets hurt.
Josh Allen?
they're close. Josh Allen is amazing. Last season yardage was similar. Hurts had 10 TDs to Allen's 6 TDs
RE: RE: RE: Hurts is the 2nd best running QB in the league to Lamar
this is not even a question outside of BBI. Jones is a pretty good running QB, though it does seem every time we turn up the dial on his running - he gets hurt.
Josh Allen?
Kyler Murray?
Do you know what you are talking about Producer?
I know it’s Friday…have you started early?
Yes Hurts is a better running QB than Murray. 2021 stats:
Hurts - 784 yards 10TDs
Murray - 423 yards 5 TDs
Who sounds better than you? And thanks for slagging me even though you are completely wrong.
If Murray wanted to run (and the team wanted him to)
I think he's as good as Hurts. I like Murray for some bigger plays, Hurts better to get tough yards.
But he just doesn't want to play that way and maybe his body couldn't handle it.
In terms of what they actually do, Hurts is the 2nd best behind Lamar. Allen and Kyler both have the ability to be up there, but they don't have the usage.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Why does it matter if nobody complimented Hurts before this year?
"Listen to any quarterback talk about Jones and they will tell you it is almost impossible to play a normal version of the position in that kind of environment. If anything, I actually put this game in the “positive pile” when thinking about where his status will reside in January."
I recommend proof reading and not formatting your posts so the thread turns into war and peace.
Where does that say Sy said he’s “good enough”? That’s taking quite some artistic liberty. The closest Sy has said to he’s “good enough” is that he reminds him of Tannehill. That’s not a compliment
The prior week vs Carolina he made the comment "He can do it."
And then he's making weekly comments on Giants board specifically going over the Giants that you are too stupid to understand that when he says the below after the Dallas game - and referring to January he is talking about the Giants. How can you not understand he is talking about the Giants and Jones after the season as he speaks about “the pile?” I know you are ignorant but seriously I can't believe you are this stupid.
"Listen to any quarterback talk about Jones and they will tell you it is almost impossible to play a normal version of the position in that kind of environment. If anything, I actually put this game in the “positive pile” when thinking about where his status will reside in January."
I recommend proof reading and not formatting your posts so the thread turns into war and peace.
Where does that say Sy said he’s “good enough”? That’s taking quite some artistic liberty. The closest Sy has said to he’s “good enough” is that he reminds him of Tannehill. That’s not a compliment
The prior week vs Carolina he made the comment "He can do it."
And then he's making weekly comments on Giants board specifically going over the Giants that you are too stupid to understand that when he says the below after the Dallas game - and referring to January he is talking about the Giants. How can you not understand he is talking about the Giants and Jones after the season as he speaks about “the pile?” I know you are ignorant but seriously I can't believe you are this stupid.
this is not even a question outside of BBI. Jones is a pretty good running QB, though it does seem every time we turn up the dial on his running - he gets hurt.
Josh Allen?
Kyler Murray?
Do you know what you are talking about Producer?
I know it’s Friday…have you started early?
Yes Hurts is a better running QB than Murray. 2021 stats:
Hurts - 784 yards 10TDs
Murray - 423 yards 5 TDs
Who sounds better than you? And thanks for slagging me even though you are completely wrong.
Wow….I will be honest here….I really didn’t know how many yards Murray had last year, so I’m surprised he only had 88 carries for 423, 5 TDs and 4.8 average. Murray was injured last year, missed two games and I think was limited for other games. That may have caused the low carries (88).
The year before was his big year:
2020: 133 for 819 yards, 11 TDs and a 6.2 average……all much better than any year of Hurts.
As for Josh Allen
2021: 122 for 763 yards, 6 TDs, with a 6.3 YPC. Hurts has more TDs while Josh has a better YPC. Yards pretty similar.
So, I guess your statement saying Hurts is the 2nd best running qb does have some validity. You were not “crazy” for saying that as i accused you of being. I apologize for mocking you…that was obviously inappropriate and not supported. Me bad.
this is not even a question outside of BBI. Jones is a pretty good running QB, though it does seem every time we turn up the dial on his running - he gets hurt.
Josh Allen?
Kyler Murray?
Do you know what you are talking about Producer?
I know it’s Friday…have you started early?
Yes Hurts is a better running QB than Murray. 2021 stats:
Hurts - 784 yards 10TDs
Murray - 423 yards 5 TDs
Who sounds better than you? And thanks for slagging me even though you are completely wrong.
Wow….I will be honest here….I really didn’t know how many yards Murray had last year, so I’m surprised he only had 88 carries for 423, 5 TDs and 4.8 average. Murray was injured last year, missed two games and I think was limited for other games. That may have caused the low carries (88).
The year before was his big year:
2020: 133 for 819 yards, 11 TDs and a 6.2 average……all much better than any year of Hurts.
As for Josh Allen
2021: 122 for 763 yards, 6 TDs, with a 6.3 YPC. Hurts has more TDs while Josh has a better YPC. Yards pretty similar.
So, I guess your statement saying Hurts is the 2nd best running qb does have some validity. You were not “crazy” for saying that as i accused you of being. I apologize for mocking you…that was obviously inappropriate and not supported. Me bad.
You're a class act. Thanks for rethinking it. Yes the Murray numbers you cite from 2020 put him in the conversation but he seems to run less, perhaps his size or potential for injury? Lamar, Hurts and Allen seem to evade injury, at least for now.
Yes.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
If he gets an offer above his worth in free agency let him go.
But unless we are picking in the top 5 again (which means he underperformed) what are the odds of gaining a better QB?
Sure they haven’t. Whatever gets you to sleep at night.
If he gets an offer above his worth in free agency let him go.
But unless we are picking in the top 5 again (which means he underperformed) what are the odds of gaining a better QB?
Because his QB rating was about 27th two weeks ago and it is 19 now. Suppose it keeps improving despite the pathetic WR's and bad Offensive Line?
So in the past 3 years you've had posters use stats to show that Jones was no good, and now if his QB rating continues to climb and God Forbid the Giants make the Playoffs or in it until the last week while his QBR is pretty good
You feel they should now all of sudden DISREGARD the stats since week 2 of the season and count the past as more relevant stats????? SO DISREGARD current 15 weeks of data and use past 3 years?????
That would be stupid. Something stupid that Producer or BW might say.
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Have they made up their mind.
Sure they haven’t. Whatever gets you to sleep at night.
It doesn't keep me up at night.
Just using common sense which many on this board lack.
=================
That about the level of your intelligence.
Quack Quack.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
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In comment 15848992 giantstock said:
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Have they made up their mind.
Sure they haven’t. Whatever gets you to sleep at night.
It doesn't keep me up at night.
Just using common sense which many on this board lack.
=================
Yeah. I don’t think you really know what ‘common sense’ is or, how to use the phrase.
But again, whatever makes that slumber easier.
He has a QBRratign of 19.
SO when he's bad the QBR rating is used against him but when it comes up all of sudden it doesn't count?
Again Quack Quack is about your intelligence.
================
And if ti keep improving it's smart to dump him?
-----------------
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is not a good option.
If he gets an offer above his worth in free agency let him go.
But unless we are picking in the top 5 again (which means he underperformed) what are the odds of gaining a better QB?
Because his QB rating was about 27th two weeks ago and it is 19 now. Suppose it keeps improving despite the pathetic WR's and bad Offensive Line?
So in the past 3 years you've had posters use stats to show that Jones was no good, and now if his QB rating continues to climb and God Forbid the Giants make the Playoffs or in it until the last week while his QBR is pretty good
You feel they should now all of sudden DISREGARD the stats since week 2 of the season and count the past as more relevant stats????? SO DISREGARD current 15 weeks of data and use past 3 years?????
That would be stupid. Something stupid that Producer or BW might say.
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quack, quack.
That about the level of your intelligence.
Quack Quack.
LMFAO. Yeah, ok. Whatever you say buddy. Sleep tight in your Danny Jones onesie!
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In comment 15849009 bwitz said:
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In comment 15848992 giantstock said:
Quote:
Have they made up their mind.
Sure they haven’t. Whatever gets you to sleep at night.
It doesn't keep me up at night.
Just using common sense which many on this board lack.
=================
Yeah. I don’t think you really know what ‘common sense’ is or, how to use the phrase.
But again, whatever makes that slumber easier.
You "think?"
Do us all a favor; Stop pretending like you can do it.
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In comment 15849013 bwitz said:
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quack, quack.
That about the level of your intelligence.
Quack Quack.
LMFAO. Yeah, ok. Whatever you say buddy. Sleep tight in your Danny Jones onesie!
Yeah I've bene called "Jones hater" on other threads and morons like you characterize me as a Jones homer.
As I said - lots of dumb posters here who lack common sense such as you.
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In comment 15848968 KeoweeFan said:
Quote:
is not a good option.
If he gets an offer above his worth in free agency let him go.
But unless we are picking in the top 5 again (which means he underperformed) what are the odds of gaining a better QB?
Because his QB rating was about 27th two weeks ago and it is 19 now. Suppose it keeps improving despite the pathetic WR's and bad Offensive Line?
So in the past 3 years you've had posters use stats to show that Jones was no good, and now if his QB rating continues to climb and God Forbid the Giants make the Playoffs or in it until the last week while his QBR is pretty good
You feel they should now all of sudden DISREGARD the stats since week 2 of the season and count the past as more relevant stats????? SO DISREGARD current 15 weeks of data and use past 3 years?????
That would be stupid. Something stupid that Producer or BW might say.
Disregard? No. By all means use these stats extrapolated out. There is no way I pay over $20M to a QB with his numbers.
Readign comprehnasion Matt?
Tell me Matt-- I said his QBR was about 27 after the 1st two weeks and it's now 17.
What is it that you don't understand or don't want to understand?
Maybe I used too big of words that maybe you can't understand such as "IF" and "Suppose." ????
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In comment 15849010 giantstock said:
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In comment 15848968 KeoweeFan said:
Quote:
is not a good option.
If he gets an offer above his worth in free agency let him go.
But unless we are picking in the top 5 again (which means he underperformed) what are the odds of gaining a better QB?
Because his QB rating was about 27th two weeks ago and it is 19 now. Suppose it keeps improving despite the pathetic WR's and bad Offensive Line?
So in the past 3 years you've had posters use stats to show that Jones was no good, and now if his QB rating continues to climb and God Forbid the Giants make the Playoffs or in it until the last week while his QBR is pretty good
You feel they should now all of sudden DISREGARD the stats since week 2 of the season and count the past as more relevant stats????? SO DISREGARD current 15 weeks of data and use past 3 years?????
That would be stupid. Something stupid that Producer or BW might say.
Disregard? No. By all means use these stats extrapolated out. There is no way I pay over $20M to a QB with his numbers.
Readign comprehnasion Matt?
Tell me Matt-- I said his QBR was about 27 after the 1st two weeks and it's now 17.
What is it that you don't understand or don't want to understand?
Maybe I used too big of words that maybe you can't understand such as "IF" and "Suppose." ????
Correction 19 now -- not 17.
But here is the short answer- Schoen and Daboll are going to let the year play out before making any decision. So, may I suggest you do as I do….chill and watch it unfold. You will know something by 1/1/23, I’m sure (that’s less than 3 months from now).
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that the more games we win this year the worse will be our selection for the top QBs in the draft. So where does that leave us? Cooper Rush? He's a fees agent. I not sure who else is a free agent, but we're not getting much better than we have now unfortunately.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
A rookie of similar talent is better than what we have now because he would be here on a rookie deal instead of a second deal worth more than $20M per year.
Where do you think we're going in 2023 Matt with that 2nd year QB? So name the rookie QB this year that is better than Jones? Picket?
Cite the player you mean instead of giving a generalization.
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In comment 15849023 Matt M. said:
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In comment 15849010 giantstock said:
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In comment 15848968 KeoweeFan said:
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is not a good option.
If he gets an offer above his worth in free agency let him go.
But unless we are picking in the top 5 again (which means he underperformed) what are the odds of gaining a better QB?
Because his QB rating was about 27th two weeks ago and it is 19 now. Suppose it keeps improving despite the pathetic WR's and bad Offensive Line?
So in the past 3 years you've had posters use stats to show that Jones was no good, and now if his QB rating continues to climb and God Forbid the Giants make the Playoffs or in it until the last week while his QBR is pretty good
You feel they should now all of sudden DISREGARD the stats since week 2 of the season and count the past as more relevant stats????? SO DISREGARD current 15 weeks of data and use past 3 years?????
That would be stupid. Something stupid that Producer or BW might say.
Disregard? No. By all means use these stats extrapolated out. There is no way I pay over $20M to a QB with his numbers.
Readign comprehnasion Matt?
Tell me Matt-- I said his QBR was about 27 after the 1st two weeks and it's now 17.
What is it that you don't understand or don't want to understand?
Maybe I used too big of words that maybe you can't understand such as "IF" and "Suppose." ????
Correction 19 now -- not 17.
I've said it many times here. I think he would have to have an otherworldly good season (i.e. top 5 in the league) in order to be re-signed. Is he a top 5? He's not even top 10 and likely not top half.
But here is the short answer- Schoen and Daboll are going to let the year play out before making any decision. So, may I suggest you do as I do….chill and watch it unfold. You will know something by 1/1/23, I’m sure (that’s less than 3 months from now).
+1.
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No problem here. What is it you don't understand? Is QBR the only stat? His numbers are somewhat pedestrian except for rushing yards. He is not producing anywhere near a $20M QB either as an individual or the offense as a whole. He is an improved player, but nowhere near enough to warrant even a decent 2nd deal here. Someone else will pay him. That's fine by me.
I've said it many times here. I think he would have to have an otherworldly good season (i.e. top 5 in the league) in order to be re-signed. Is he a top 5? He's not even top 10 and likely not top half.
Again reading comprehnsion?????????
Frist off- for all the complainers they use the QBR stat when it shows Jones is failing. But now all of a sudden it's not a stat to use?
Secondly, again I used big words like "If" and "Suppose" -- why do you not understand these "big words?"
Yes his stats ARE PEDESTRIAN - ath THIS MOMENT. But the big words I used that seems to elude you are IF HIS QBR continues to climb. IE to paraphrase I said "IF IF IF they continue to climb. You understand the word "IF," right?
So IF his QBR stats continue to climb then wouldn't it stand to reason that PROBABLY other stats are also rising?
Do you really think that the number the QBR stat complies wouldn't show other data that is very favorable? Sure maybe you come up with an extreme irregularity but overall over the course of 17 games if he plays and he has a good QBR at the end playing in all 17 games--
MORE THAN LIKLEY other stats will show positive too.
===============
I agree definitely too with you and others - his availability is a huge question too.
===========
But to say he needs an "other worldly good season is ridiculous - suppose he is 12th in QBR with this bad of an OL and lousy WR's. Would you consider that other wordly?
Again QBR has other stats embedded within.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
When they didn't give him a 5th year option...they basically made the decision that if DJ isn't a top 10 QB ($30 million a year) by the end of the year, he's done. Pick a rookie, pay him $5-6 million a year and see if he can develop into a NFL starter, which DJ isn't. Chasing him in free agency, and getting in a bidding war, is a silly idea.
31st in passing yards (only to Fields)
29th in passing TDs
He's gotten worse in yards an TDs every year he's been in the league? So what if he doesn't turn the ball over...19 points a game won't beat good teams!
SY hasn't given up on him quacks like you continue to babble nonsense.
Let's repat what SY said:
https://www.bigblueinteractive.com/2022/09/28/game-review-dallas-cowboys-23-new-york-giants-16/
"It can be very hard to accurately evaluate a performance like this one. Listen to any quarterback talk about Jones and they will tell you it is almost impossible to play a normal version of the position in that kind of environment. If anything, I actually put this game in the “positive pile” when thinking about where his status will reside in January."
==================
I know some of you want to pretend like SY didn't say it.
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In comment 15849046 giantstock said:
Quote:
No problem here. What is it you don't understand? Is QBR the only stat? His numbers are somewhat pedestrian except for rushing yards. He is not producing anywhere near a $20M QB either as an individual or the offense as a whole. He is an improved player, but nowhere near enough to warrant even a decent 2nd deal here. Someone else will pay him. That's fine by me.
I've said it many times here. I think he would have to have an otherworldly good season (i.e. top 5 in the league) in order to be re-signed. Is he a top 5? He's not even top 10 and likely not top half.
Again reading comprehnsion?????????
Frist off- for all the complainers they use the QBR stat when it shows Jones is failing. But now all of a sudden it's not a stat to use?
Secondly, again I used big words like "If" and "Suppose" -- why do you not understand these "big words?"
Yes his stats ARE PEDESTRIAN - ath THIS MOMENT. But the big words I used that seems to elude you are IF HIS QBR continues to climb. IE to paraphrase I said "IF IF IF they continue to climb. You understand the word "IF," right?
So IF his QBR stats continue to climb then wouldn't it stand to reason that PROBABLY other stats are also rising?
Do you really think that the number the QBR stat complies wouldn't show other data that is very favorable? Sure maybe you come up with an extreme irregularity but overall over the course of 17 games if he plays and he has a good QBR at the end playing in all 17 games--
MORE THAN LIKLEY other stats will show positive too.
===============
I agree definitely too with you and others - his availability is a huge question too.
===========
But to say he needs an "other worldly good season is ridiculous - suppose he is 12th in QBR with this bad of an OL and lousy WR's. Would you consider that other wordly?
Again QBR has other stats embedded within.
Quote:
First off, I never used QBR to show anything about a QB, Jones or otherwise. Second, he has had moderate improvement, so that makes your "if" a huge fairy tale hypothetical. So, back to mine...he only gets a second contract in NY IF he is a top 5 QB. That's is not likely at all.
But then my initial posts weren't about you/addressed to you. Other posters use them to blast Jones. Again reading comprehension. You NEED it. How many times have I said on this thread on THIS THREAD on THIS THREAD that there were posters that used QBR????????? SO again I said how odd it is that they use it and now I'm being told I can't use it.
And you know I use it.
So if you don’t want to use it- that's your prerogative but just because you didn’t; use it doesn't mean I can't.
You don’t want to use it fine. I use it partially. But when you say "moderate improvement" - how are you defining "moderate?"
A jump from 27 to 19 in two weeks is "moderate?"
And I said "IF IF IF he continues to CLIMB."
==========
IF IF IF IF he continues to CLIMB in his QBR then there will be OTHER stats. Just because you don’t' want to look at them it does not mean that they don’t exist.
And to further among other factors is that I'm listening to SY. SO I shouldn't be blasted in the manner that other poster did for this opinion.
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In comment 15849053 Matt M. said:
Quote:
In comment 15849046 giantstock said:
Quote:
No problem here. What is it you don't understand? Is QBR the only stat? His numbers are somewhat pedestrian except for rushing yards. He is not producing anywhere near a $20M QB either as an individual or the offense as a whole. He is an improved player, but nowhere near enough to warrant even a decent 2nd deal here. Someone else will pay him. That's fine by me.
I've said it many times here. I think he would have to have an otherworldly good season (i.e. top 5 in the league) in order to be re-signed. Is he a top 5? He's not even top 10 and likely not top half.
Again reading comprehnsion?????????
Frist off- for all the complainers they use the QBR stat when it shows Jones is failing. But now all of a sudden it's not a stat to use?
Secondly, again I used big words like "If" and "Suppose" -- why do you not understand these "big words?"
Yes his stats ARE PEDESTRIAN - ath THIS MOMENT. But the big words I used that seems to elude you are IF HIS QBR continues to climb. IE to paraphrase I said "IF IF IF they continue to climb. You understand the word "IF," right?
So IF his QBR stats continue to climb then wouldn't it stand to reason that PROBABLY other stats are also rising?
Do you really think that the number the QBR stat complies wouldn't show other data that is very favorable? Sure maybe you come up with an extreme irregularity but overall over the course of 17 games if he plays and he has a good QBR at the end playing in all 17 games--
MORE THAN LIKLEY other stats will show positive too.
===============
I agree definitely too with you and others - his availability is a huge question too.
===========
But to say he needs an "other worldly good season is ridiculous - suppose he is 12th in QBR with this bad of an OL and lousy WR's. Would you consider that other wordly?
Again QBR has other stats embedded within.
First off, I never used QBR to show anything about a QB, Jones or otherwise. Second, he has had moderate improvement, so that makes your "if" a huge fairy tale hypothetical. So, back to mine...he only gets a second contract in NY IF he is a top 5 QB. That's is not likely at all.
But then my initial posts weren't about you/addressed to you. Other posters use them to blast Jones. Again reading comprehension. You NEED it. How many times have I said on this thread on THIS THREAD on THIS THREAD that there were posters that used QBR????????? SO again I said how odd it is that they use it and now I'm being told I can't use it.
And you know I use it.
So if you don’t want to use it- that's your prerogative but just because you didn’t; use it doesn't mean I can't.
You don’t want to use it fine. I use it partially. But when you say "moderate improvement" - how are you defining "moderate?"
A jump from 27 to 19 in two weeks is "moderate?"
And I said "IF IF IF he continues to CLIMB."
==========
IF IF IF IF he continues to CLIMB in his QBR then there will be OTHER stats. Just because you don’t' want to look at them it does not mean that they don’t exist.
And to further among other factors is that I'm listening to SY. SO I shouldn't be blasted in the manner that other poster did for this opinion.
Sure they haven’t. Whatever gets you to sleep at night.
...others? - ( New Window )
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the most positive thing you can find is "hard to evaluate". Cool. Let's commit to that.
There are 13 games left in the season, who said anything about commitment? Some fans can live with the uncertainty while... ...others? - ( New Window )
Unbelievable isn't it??
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In comment 15849046 giantstock said:
Quote:
No problem here. What is it you don't understand? Is QBR the only stat? His numbers are somewhat pedestrian except for rushing yards. He is not producing anywhere near a $20M QB either as an individual or the offense as a whole. He is an improved player, but nowhere near enough to warrant even a decent 2nd deal here. Someone else will pay him. That's fine by me.
I've said it many times here. I think he would have to have an otherworldly good season (i.e. top 5 in the league) in order to be re-signed. Is he a top 5? He's not even top 10 and likely not top half.
Again reading comprehnsion?????????
Frist off- for all the complainers they use the QBR stat when it shows Jones is failing. But now all of a sudden it's not a stat to use?
Secondly, again I used big words like "If" and "Suppose" -- why do you not understand these "big words?"
Yes his stats ARE PEDESTRIAN - ath THIS MOMENT. But the big words I used that seems to elude you are IF HIS QBR continues to climb. IE to paraphrase I said "IF IF IF they continue to climb. You understand the word "IF," right?
So IF his QBR stats continue to climb then wouldn't it stand to reason that PROBABLY other stats are also rising?
Do you really think that the number the QBR stat complies wouldn't show other data that is very favorable? Sure maybe you come up with an extreme irregularity but overall over the course of 17 games if he plays and he has a good QBR at the end playing in all 17 games--
MORE THAN LIKLEY other stats will show positive too.
===============
I agree definitely too with you and others - his availability is a huge question too.
===========
But to say he needs an "other worldly good season is ridiculous - suppose he is 12th in QBR with this bad of an OL and lousy WR's. Would you consider that other wordly?
Again QBR has other stats embedded within.
Most people on this thread use their eyes, not QBR. Im not sure why you're so up in arms, if you're trolling then i tip my cap.
Your if statements are just that.....if statements. People can only base opinions off what they see. You can tell me his QBR is going to the moon and i still don't think he should be re-signed. For some reasoning your grasping at QBR like its the bible. IF his QBR increases but he's still fairly one dimensional with the playcalling and offense built around that who the hell cares where it ranks in the NFL.
The new FO is looking at film, and yes crunching some numbers. No one is speaking about QBR in the room. I promise you that.
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Most people on this thread use their eyes, not QBR. Im not sure why you're so up in arms, if you're trolling then i tip my cap.
Your if statements are just that.....if statements. People can only base opinions off what they see. You can tell me his QBR is going to the moon and i still don't think he should be re-signed. For some reasoning your grasping at QBR like its the bible. IF his QBR increases but he's still fairly one dimensional with the playcalling and offense built around that who the hell cares where it ranks in the NFL.
The new FO is looking at film, and yes crunching some numbers. No one is speaking about QBR in the room. I promise you that.
TThis is not true. First off "I'm up in arms?" I made an initial comment that DJ is not a lame duck. Then a poster made a snide comment to me then I replied in a snide way back, then got insulted. So, please stop with the exaggeration that "I'm up in arms." You're just saying that because you don’t agree with me.
Again I'm not grasping at QBR. I'll say again on this thread the complainers that have bashed Jones have used it. Now when I use it I’m getting criticized??? Where were you when BW or others use QBR to bash Jones?? Silent, right? But now when I’m using it to show a trend I can’t use it but others that bash him when it goes down they can?
And again please read my posts instead of trying to isolate my point into one issue. I referenced SY's opinion and I agree with it, didn't I? And he did NOT mention QBR. And I said I agree with what he is saying, didn't I? Read the post on this thread at 10:28 PM. You can’t og and ignore things that I said just so you want to fit your narrative.
And to use your phrase "I can promise you that he knows more about what is being said than you (and me) do."
And I'm the one agreeing with SY and you are seriously trying to argue with me other than a simple you disagree and this is why etc???? You have to be sarcastic even though I’m agreeing with the pro scout? Are you kidding? Are you kidding? Are you kidding?
You just ignore the words "positive pile where he will reside in January?
You can't speculate what that means? Wan tot bury your head in the sand????????????????
C'mon. You guys are funny. hahahahha Who are you kidding?? LMAO.
But here is the short answer- Schoen and Daboll are going to let the year play out before making any decision. So, may I suggest you do as I do….chill and watch it unfold. You will know something by 1/1/23, I’m sure (that’s less than 3 months from now).
It's refreshing that you make it simple but accurate. Trust those in power to evaluate DJ. Let's see what happens this season and then make their decision to go with DJ or let him go.
Who is it ?
So, if Jones has a good year and signs for a reasonable contract it leaves the team with the draft choices to build up the supporting cast.
Are you referring to anyone in particular ????
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Question marks in posts. Type like a normal human being
Are you referring to anyone in particular ????
??????? ?????
To think otherwise is nonsensical, and assumes that the GM and coach are incompetent.
Smith and AJ Brown will definitely help a QB make strides. David Sills and Richie James?
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
Where were the Chiefs picking when they moved up for Mahomes? What pick did the Bills start with when they began trading up into range for Allen?
What makes you think Schoen/Daboll/Kafka will be any less aggressive if they identify the QB they want?
So, if Jones has a good year and signs for a reasonable contract it leaves the team with the draft choices to build up the supporting cast.
Judas Priest, the continual rescue attempts for Jones are a wonder. He is a below average NFL qb, the Giants are giving him the heave ho (Mara can sugar coat it all he wants if that makes him feel better), reconcile yourselves to that and move on already.
You sound like a reasonably intelligent fan- up until this year, what has Hurts done? Not much, right?
But notice who his top 2 receivers are to throw to this year…..Mr Smith and Mr Brown. Hmmmmm, do ya think having those two superstar toys might give him an advantage over Jones who has Golladay, Richie, and Sills to throw to?
Ya think?
Use that brain God gave you fellow.
Besides, aren’t you one of the guys who was lobbying hard for NY to pick up Russell Wilson.? How is that turning out for you?
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that the more games we win this year the worse will be our selection for the top QBs in the draft. So where does that leave us? Cooper Rush? He's a fees agent. I not sure who else is a free agent, but we're not getting much better than we have now unfortunately.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
Where were the Chiefs picking when they moved up for Mahomes? What pick did the Bills start with when they began trading up into range for Allen?
What makes you think Schoen/Daboll/Kafka will be any less aggressive if they identify the QB they want?
Interesting point: Chiefs traded 2 1st rounders, a 3rd rounder to go from 27th to 10th to get Mahomes. The Bills were at 12 and traded 2 2nd rounders to get to 7.
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He’s a better runner and has made strides in his passing
You sound like a reasonably intelligent fan- up until this year, what has Hurts done? Not much, right?
But notice who his top 2 receivers are to throw to this year…..Mr Smith and Mr Brown. Hmmmmm, do ya think having those two superstar toys might give him an advantage over Jones who has Golladay, Richie, and Sills to throw to?
Ya think?
Use that brain God gave you fellow.
Besides, aren’t you one of the guys who was lobbying hard for NY to pick up Russell Wilson.? How is that turning out for you?
I said I would trade for Wilson if the price was right, I wouldn’t call that lobbying for him. I wouldn’t have traded for him at the cost the Broncos gave up.
Second of all, you should probably use your brain. I didn’t say Hurts was some elite passer but he’s made strides in his decision making as a passer, that’s independent of who he is throwing to. I know some of you only have the capacity to look at box scores and win loss records.
If Jones is a Giant next years it's because 1) they've committed to him 2) they believe they need more time evaluate him.
Things we know:
1) There's very little upside to cutting Taylor, so he's likely to be the backup or bridge starter next year
2) Schoen witnessed firsthand how to move up in the draft responsibly and get a raw QB Daboll developed into a star
3) The Giants have the cap room to pay market rate for a starter if one becomes available via trade or free agency
Things we don't know yet:
1) How Jones will end up looking this year
2) Where the Giants will pick
3) Who the real college prospects are
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In comment 15848963 Aloha Alan said:
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that the more games we win this year the worse will be our selection for the top QBs in the draft. So where does that leave us? Cooper Rush? He's a fees agent. I not sure who else is a free agent, but we're not getting much better than we have now unfortunately.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
Where were the Chiefs picking when they moved up for Mahomes? What pick did the Bills start with when they began trading up into range for Allen?
What makes you think Schoen/Daboll/Kafka will be any less aggressive if they identify the QB they want?
Interesting point: Chiefs traded 2 1st rounders, a 3rd rounder to go from 27th to 10th to get Mahomes. The Bills were at 12 and traded 2 2nd rounders to get to 7.
The Bills were at 22 (with the pick they got from the Chiefs in the Mahomes trade, ironically) and used that (with other picks) to trade up to 12 first, then to 7.
I think it depends the price
ajr2456 : 11/23/2021 1:02 pm : link
.
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he's not a lame duck. Not only does it depend on his play, but his contract demands. Let's say the Giants end up 9-8 or 8-9 or whatever middle of the pack is going to be. If you tell Jones sayonara, who are you replacing him with? Do you mortgage the future like Denver did for Wilson? That wouldn't make sense when they have so many needs in other areas. Do you draft a QB at 15th or 16th? It's possible and go with Taylor for a year, but that's just giving up on a year waiting for a QB that might not be any better than Jones.
So, if Jones has a good year and signs for a reasonable contract it leaves the team with the draft choices to build up the supporting cast.
He's thrown for 3 td and yet to hit the magical 200 yard mark in 4 games and threw for 71 yards his last game. He is running more which is a good thing because he isn't a very good passer. Oh yeah, how we could we possibly find someone else to reach these heights.
Judas Priest, the continual rescue attempts for Jones are a wonder. He is a below average NFL qb, the Giants are giving him the heave ho (Mara can sugar coat it all he wants if that makes him feel better), reconcile yourselves to that and move on already.
Have you sent your opinion to Sy in his last couple of postgame evaluation when he said he can do it etc? HE didn't see he will do it he said he can.
So why dodn'y you challenge him next time when he says anything positive about Jones next time he makes a remark such as "he can do it." ?
If Jones is a Giant next years it's because 1) they've committed to him 2) they believe they need more time evaluate him.
Things we know:
1) There's very little upside to cutting Taylor, so he's likely to be the backup or bridge starter next year
2) Schoen witnessed firsthand how to move up in the draft responsibly and get a raw QB Daboll developed into a star
3) The Giants have the cap room to pay market rate for a starter if one becomes available via trade or free agency
Things we don't know yet:
1) How Jones will end up looking this year
2) Where the Giants will pick
3) Who the real college prospects are
+1
Quote:
In comment 15849377 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
He’s a better runner and has made strides in his passing
You sound like a reasonably intelligent fan- up until this year, what has Hurts done? Not much, right?
But notice who his top 2 receivers are to throw to this year…..Mr Smith and Mr Brown. Hmmmmm, do ya think having those two superstar toys might give him an advantage over Jones who has Golladay, Richie, and Sills to throw to?
Ya think?
Use that brain God gave you fellow.
Besides, aren’t you one of the guys who was lobbying hard for NY to pick up Russell Wilson.? How is that turning out for you?
I said I would trade for Wilson if the price was right, I wouldn’t call that lobbying for him. I wouldn’t have traded for him at the cost the Broncos gave up.
Second of all, you should probably use your brain. I didn’t say Hurts was some elite passer but he’s made strides in his decision making as a passer, that’s independent of who he is throwing to. I know some of you only have the capacity to look at box scores and win loss records.
You forgot to quote your title….”Hurts is better than Jones”
So I assume you based this remark on the fact that his passing numbers have been better…..thus my rebuttal regarding the much better toys has to play with than Jones.
Up until this year, I don’t recall anyone here tooting Hurts horn, especially after that horrible game he played against us in NY last year. But all of a sudden, he is 3-1 and playing well and some people like you come out of the closet to tell us Hurts is better than Jones. Based on what? You know what…..Hurts has passed better because Hurts has much better toys. Is that fair?
Sure adding AJ Brown has made it easier for Hurts, but that’s not the only reason Hurts looks better this year. He’s improved himself. This site has this weird complex where we’re not allowed to point out the flaws of the QB we like but every other QBs in the leagues warts get magnified.
Do you honestly think if you swapped Jones with Hurts, the Eagles would put up the same offense? No chance, and that’s not even going into passing ability - Hurts is a much better runner than Jones.
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Yea and then we are right back here in 4 years. Look for them to sign a bridge qb to hold the fort until they find a top guy in the draft. It might be Jones....it might not. But I doubt they draft a project. If they do and he doesn't work out both JS and BD will be out of a job.
that the more games we win this year the worse will be our selection for the top QBs in the draft. So where does that leave us? Cooper Rush? He's a fees agent. I not sure who else is a free agent, but we're not getting much better than we have now unfortunately.
Going to be a real tough decision with all the variables of who is a free agent: Is he better than Daniel? Is he affordable? Is there someone in the draft that where we pick, can't miss? And for that last question, how many that are drafted are "can't miss"?
I am wondering is he's be the starter next year out of necessity?
A rookie of similar talent is better than what we have now because he would be here on a rookie deal instead of a second deal worth more than $20M per year.
Hurts situation and Jones's situation are so radically different that they cannot be compared. Eagles have an elite OL, a top 5 WR and a great 2 in Smith, a good tight and and a good running game. Jones has Barkley and Andrew Thomas and that is it.
Unless Jones delivers 10+ wins, the Giants can sit back and wait to see what the market for him in that role is. Personally, no matter what happens, I think the Giants will give him the best offer because he is better than Tyrod Taylor. There may have been a point in time where Tyrod was better than Jones is now but no longer. He may not take the offer from the Giants.
If they “are equal as passers” (your words), then how could you say “Hurts is better” (your words in title).
How is he better? If you say rushing, even that is debatable. Without looking, imwould think both are doing well with yards rushing and TDs.
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Said Hurts is a better runner and has made strides in his passing game. I didn’t even say he was a better passer than Jones, but at a minimum they’re equal as a passer.
If they “are equal as passers” (your words), then how could you say “Hurts is better” (your words in title).
How is he better? If you say rushing, even that is debatable. Without looking, imwould think both are doing well with yards rushing and TDs.
It’s really not debatable that Hurts is a better runner. Jones is just a straight line runner, Hurts is a better runner in the open field and even inside the pocket
You make funny here, but many on this site were clamoring for Pickett to be picked to replace Jones. Let’s see- one game in, 3 interceptions. Nice start. But I’m not saying he can’t turn it around and become a good NFL QB.
The truth is, maybe the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t really know (guys like Pickett).
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Oh no…we’re screwed
You make funny here, but many on this site were clamoring for Pickett to be picked to replace Jones. Let’s see- one game in, 3 interceptions. Nice start. But I’m not saying he can’t turn it around and become a good NFL QB.
The truth is, maybe the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t really know (guys like Pickett).
I can see your post is funny too…
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In comment 15849891 ajr2456 said:
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Said Hurts is a better runner and has made strides in his passing game. I didn’t even say he was a better passer than Jones, but at a minimum they’re equal as a passer.
If they “are equal as passers” (your words), then how could you say “Hurts is better” (your words in title).
How is he better? If you say rushing, even that is debatable. Without looking, imwould think both are doing well with yards rushing and TDs.
It’s really not debatable that Hurts is a better runner. Jones is just a straight line runner, Hurts is a better runner in the open field and even inside the pocket
For the record, let’s compare 2022 stats.
Hurts:
53-205 yards; 3.9 yards per carry; 4 TDs, 2 fumbles
Jones:
31 - 193 yards; 6.2 yards per carry ; 2 TDs, 0 fumbles
“It’s not really debatable…..” hmmmmmmmmm, says who?
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In comment 15849978 Jimmy Googs said:
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Oh no…we’re screwed
You make funny here, but many on this site were clamoring for Pickett to be picked to replace Jones. Let’s see- one game in, 3 interceptions. Nice start. But I’m not saying he can’t turn it around and become a good NFL QB.
The truth is, maybe the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t really know (guys like Pickett).
I can see your post is funny too…
No, wrong post….my funny post was the AJ Klein Appreciation thread…..
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Oh no…we’re screwed
You make funny here, but many on this site were clamoring for Pickett to be picked to replace Jones. Let’s see- one game in, 3 interceptions. Nice start. But I’m not saying he can’t turn it around and become a good NFL QB.
The truth is, maybe the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t really know (guys like Pickett).
Will the two devils have the same price tag next year? Or does the devil you know potentially cost 3x+ the amount that the devil you don't know?
And isolating your one-game-sample-size doesn't do much to support your argument. I can rattle off just as many QBs who became superstars in the past five years that were drafted later in their own draft than DJ was.
Staying with a loser because you're afraid of the alternative (to a loser) is rooted in cowardice.
One of my favorite interactions over the last three months was a poster asserting the Giants had the worst OL in the league. Said poster then said he doesn't really watch other teams when asked in the same thread.
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In comment 15849978 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
Oh no…we’re screwed
You make funny here, but many on this site were clamoring for Pickett to be picked to replace Jones. Let’s see- one game in, 3 interceptions. Nice start. But I’m not saying he can’t turn it around and become a good NFL QB.
The truth is, maybe the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t really know (guys like Pickett).
Will the two devils have the same price tag next year? Or does the devil you know potentially cost 3x+ the amount that the devil you don't know?
And isolating your one-game-sample-size doesn't do much to support your argument. I can rattle off just as many QBs who became superstars in the past five years that were drafted later in their own draft than DJ was.
Staying with a loser because you're afraid of the alternative (to a loser) is rooted in cowardice.
You make good points….I for one don’t want to spend big bucks on a guy that I don’t have utmost confidence in. I’m sure Schoen and Daboll feel the same, so I defer to their decision and me personally, I stay neutral regarding should we or shouldn’t we resign Jones.
Golladay ‘s $72 M and many in Dallas are crying over both Zeke and Dak’# big contracts…..no, I am a big believer in SPENDING WISELY. Count the costs….if you can get a qb who may be similar in talent for far less, that makes sense to me. But you still have to wisely assess both the guy leaving and the new guy you may be bringing in to replace him. Not always black and white.
These guys obviously don't watch other teams. How do they come in so hot with arguments when they have so little knowledge?
This site has this weird complex where we’re not allowed to point out the flaws of the QB we like but every other QBs in the leagues warts get magnified.
Do you honestly think if you swapped Jones with Hurts, the Eagles would put up the same offense? No chance, and that’s not even going into passing ability - Hurts is a much better runner than Jones.
Misrepresent issues much? Because you are doing it here. Please provide the link where anyone has suggested you can't point out flaws of Jones? No one said it but posters like you continually misrepresent /over-exaggerate to make your point about Jones.
Yes Jones is flawed but many of us rational posters realize that he could be better if for example if he had Phily's WRs and Tight End and had the Philly OLine.
It doesn't mean we think he will be as good as Hurts or even be a legit starter etc but the point is- you just want to bury your head in the sand and exclude other factors as it pertains to Jones and just proclaim in a manner of speak "he sucks."
And then you go and make exaggerated posts like you've just done here in an attempt to justify your opinion.
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People who watch other NFL games vs. People who only watch the Giants
One of my favorite interactions over the last three months was a poster asserting the Giants had the worst OL in the league. Said poster then said he doesn't really watch other teams when asked in the same thread.
Well, it wasn’t me who said that, but even still, many don’t watch other games other than Giant games. (Maybe an occasional Sunday Night or Monday Night)
Nowadays, people use stats from PFF for example….there are plenty of people who rate teams and positions….so one only needs to read their research….not having to watch other teams play.
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This site has this weird complex where we’re not allowed to point out the flaws of the QB we like but every other QBs in the leagues warts get magnified.
Do you honestly think if you swapped Jones with Hurts, the Eagles would put up the same offense? No chance, and that’s not even going into passing ability - Hurts is a much better runner than Jones.
Misrepresent issues much? Because you are doing it here. Please provide the link where anyone has suggested you can't point out flaws of Jones? No one said it but posters like you continually misrepresent /over-exaggerate to make your point about Jones.
Yes Jones is flawed but many of us rational posters realize that he could be better if for example if he had Phily's WRs and Tight End and had the Philly OLine.
It doesn't mean we think he will be as good as Hurts or even be a legit starter etc but the point is- you just want to bury your head in the sand and exclude other factors as it pertains to Jones and just proclaim in a manner of speak "he sucks."
And then you go and make exaggerated posts like you've just done here in an attempt to justify your opinion.
You literally can not be serious with this post. First off there’s a lot of people who get very abusive when you even have the slightest criticism of Jones. Nobody exaggerates Jones’ flaws, they’re pretty clear and it’s clear he’s not a good QB. He still wouldn’t be a good QB with AJ Brown and Smith. Tannehill didn’t turn into Aaron Rodgers or even Kirk Cousins when he had Brown, Henry and the Titans oline.
Stick to the football issues being discussed….please stay away from diverting the conversation from the players to the posters…that serves no useful purpose. Email someone if you have an issue with and let’s just stick to talking football here.
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But that doesn’t say much on the running ability at the Quarterback position.
Hurts runs are better because they are flashier. It doesn't matter that he has 22 more running plays and averages only 3.9 per play.
Not what I said, but ok. I’m convinced nobody watches other teams. Jones averages more YPA than Josh Allen, is he better runner than Allen?
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In comment 15850004 ajr2456 said:
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But that doesn’t say much on the running ability at the Quarterback position.
Hurts runs are better because they are flashier. It doesn't matter that he has 22 more running plays and averages only 3.9 per play.
Not what I said, but ok. I’m convinced nobody watches other teams. Jones averages more YPA than Josh Allen, is he better runner than Allen?
And by the same logic is Geno Smith averaging nearly 2 more YPA throwing mean he’s better than Jones?
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But that doesn’t say much on the running ability at the Quarterback position.
Hurts runs are better because they are flashier. It doesn't matter that he has 22 more running plays and averages only 3.9 per play.
Yeah, I guess Hurts 3.9 impresses ajr more than Daniel’s 6.2.
I think you may be right….I think ajr isn’t impressed with Danny’s style….must look a bit too awkward…..and he likes the sleeker look (you used flashy) better.
I’m sure ajr’s car is pretty sporty looking….flashier, right? Definitely not a Cadillac. Lol
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In comment 15850037 fredgbrown said:
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In comment 15850004 ajr2456 said:
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But that doesn’t say much on the running ability at the Quarterback position.
Hurts runs are better because they are flashier. It doesn't matter that he has 22 more running plays and averages only 3.9 per play.
Not what I said, but ok. I’m convinced nobody watches other teams. Jones averages more YPA than Josh Allen, is he better runner than Allen?
And by the same logic is Geno Smith averaging nearly 2 more YPA throwing mean he’s better than Jones?
I’m not playing this game with you- we are discussing Jones v Hurts. You said they are equal as passers but Hurts is a better rusher. That is what we are discussing….
If you want to compare Geno with Danny, go start a new thread.
Hurts has the better running skills. He’s faster, the better athlete, he’s shiftier. Watch the actual games.
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the most positive thing you can find is "hard to evaluate". Cool. Let's commit to that.
There are 13 games left in the season, who said anything about commitment? Some fans can live with the uncertainty while... ...others? - ( New Window )
I think there's a disconnect at the premise level: the fans who "can live with the uncertainty" are the only ones who even believe there is uncertainty to be lived with at this point.
It isn't about being able to live with the uncertainty, IMO. It's about defining uncertainty vs. inevitability.
Hurts has the better running skills. He’s faster, the better athlete, he’s shiftier. Watch the actual games.
Just curious….is there a qb who has a longer run from scrimmage than our Danny boy? Too bad he tripped…imagine a 90 something yard TD run from a qb.
Hurts has the better running skills. He’s faster, the better athlete, he’s shiftier. Watch the actual games.
You said….”Hurts has the better running skills. He’s faster, the better athlete, he’s shiftier..”
If Hurts is all that, then why is Danny doing better than him? I mean come on….Hurts is faster, shiftier, better athlete…..why is he only averaging 3.9 instead of 10.9? And what about the two fumbles?
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In comment 15849988 5BowlsSoon said:
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In comment 15849978 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
Oh no…we’re screwed
You make funny here, but many on this site were clamoring for Pickett to be picked to replace Jones. Let’s see- one game in, 3 interceptions. Nice start. But I’m not saying he can’t turn it around and become a good NFL QB.
The truth is, maybe the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t really know (guys like Pickett).
I can see your post is funny too…
No, wrong post….my funny post was the AJ Klein Appreciation thread…..
I just looked at that thread.
Trust me, yours above is funnier…
Thanks…I forgot about that 93 yard run. Well, even if Danny didn’t trip, it would have only been 88. But you mentioned Hurts is faster….Danny is pretty fast once he gets a head of steam up….I mean no one was even near him on that 80 yard run.
He will plan accordingly and will have multiple avenues he can take. Jones needs to play really well to be in the discussion.
I guess we are at a point where we will have to agree to disagree.
But for the record, just so we can see the numbers…
Hurts
2022….53 for 205 yards; 3.9 YPC; 4 Tds
2021…139 for 784 yards; 5.6 YPC; 10 TDs
2020….63 for 354 yards; 5.6 YPC; 3 TDs
Jones
2022….31 for 193 yards; 6.2 YPC; 2 TDs
2020…65 for 423 yards; 6.5 YPC; 1 TD (should have been 2, lol)
2019…45 for 279 yards; 6.2 YPC; 2 TDs
The only conclusions I can draw from these 3 years is this:
1. Hurts runs much more. (Not quite twice as much more; 44% more)
2. Hurts scores more TDs (not surprising)
3. Jones average per carry are better each year
I can’t say Hurts is the better runner because of these numbers….but I can say he runs much more than Jones and scores more rushing TDs.
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In comment 15849889 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
This site has this weird complex where we’re not allowed to point out the flaws of the QB we like but every other QBs in the leagues warts get magnified.
Do you honestly think if you swapped Jones with Hurts, the Eagles would put up the same offense? No chance, and that’s not even going into passing ability - Hurts is a much better runner than Jones.
Misrepresent issues much? Because you are doing it here. Please provide the link where anyone has suggested you can't point out flaws of Jones? No one said it but posters like you continually misrepresent /over-exaggerate to make your point about Jones.
Yes Jones is flawed but many of us rational posters realize that he could be better if for example if he had Phily's WRs and Tight End and had the Philly OLine.
It doesn't mean we think he will be as good as Hurts or even be a legit starter etc but the point is- you just want to bury your head in the sand and exclude other factors as it pertains to Jones and just proclaim in a manner of speak "he sucks."
And then you go and make exaggerated posts like you've just done here in an attempt to justify your opinion.
You literally can not be serious with this post. First off there’s a lot of people who get very abusive when you even have the slightest criticism of Jones. Nobody exaggerates Jones’ flaws, they’re pretty clear and it’s clear he’s not a good QB. He still wouldn’t be a good QB with AJ Brown and Smith. Tannehill didn’t turn into Aaron Rodgers or even Kirk Cousins when he had Brown, Henry and the Titans oline.
You literally can not be serious with this post.
1-- Posters attack oyu beucase hwo oyu rpesent your opinions. On this verty thread you've made psots If you just criticized Jones and left it at that but overall you set yourself up for antagonistic posts (I do too).
1a -- "Since people on this site just make up stuff to attack over"
1b--- "Not sure why that concept doesn’t seem to exist on this site."
1c-- "This site has this weird complex where we’re not allowed to point out the flaws of the QB . . ."
2--- Nobody exaggerates Jones flaws? NOBODY? I love it.
3a--- It's clear that SY thinks he could be "a good enough QB." I've provided the link to you before and apparently I must do it again because you must've forgotten (sarcasm). .
https://www.bigblueinteractive.com/2022/09/28/game-review-dallas-cowboys-23-new-york-giants-16/
"Listen to any quarterback talk about Jones and they will tell you it is almost impossible to play a normal version of the position in that kind of environment. If anything, I actually put this game in the “positive pile” when thinking about where his status will reside in January."
3b--- But I just want to make it clear that you are saying exactly the opposite of what SY is saying about Jones if the past quote you provided me came from him which I have no reason to not believe it didn't. So thanks - so - because Philly's Offense and Defense are all top notch. So here is the link you provided and from what Sy said:
"The ceiling being a guy who absolutely needs the team around him to be top notch."
In summary - whose opinion do we think generally is it better to go with Sys's a Pr Scout? Or you = a a couch fan who loves to exaggerate?
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I guess we are at a point where we will have to agree to disagree.
But for the record, just so we can see the numbers…
Hurts
2022….53 for 205 yards; 3.9 YPC; 4 Tds
2021…139 for 784 yards; 5.6 YPC; 10 TDs
2020….63 for 354 yards; 5.6 YPC; 3 TDs
Jones
2022….31 for 193 yards; 6.2 YPC; 2 TDs
2020…65 for 423 yards; 6.5 YPC; 1 TD (should have been 2, lol)
2019…45 for 279 yards; 6.2 YPC; 2 TDs
The only conclusions I can draw from these 3 years is this:
1. Hurts runs much more. (Not quite twice as much more; 44% more)
2. Hurts scores more TDs (not surprising)
3. Jones average per carry are better each year
I can’t say Hurts is the better runner because of these numbers….but I can say he runs much more than Jones and scores more rushing TDs.
You're barking up the wrong tree if you want to post logic with that poster.
Got to run.
He just has to play at a higher level all by himself at this point otherwise it’s over…
"Listen to any quarterback talk about Jones and they will tell you it is almost impossible to play a normal version of the position in that kind of environment. If anything, I actually put this game in the “positive pile” when thinking about where his status will reside in January."
I recommend proof reading and not formatting your posts so the thread turns into war and peace.
Where does that say Sy said he’s “good enough”? That’s taking quite some artistic liberty. The closest Sy has said to he’s “good enough” is that he reminds him of Tannehill. That’s not a compliment
Josh Allen?
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this is not even a question outside of BBI. Jones is a pretty good running QB, though it does seem every time we turn up the dial on his running - he gets hurt.
Josh Allen?
Kyler Murray?
Do you know what you are talking about Producer?
I know it’s Friday…have you started early?
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this is not even a question outside of BBI. Jones is a pretty good running QB, though it does seem every time we turn up the dial on his running - he gets hurt.
Josh Allen?
they're close. Josh Allen is amazing. Last season yardage was similar. Hurts had 10 TDs to Allen's 6 TDs
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In comment 15850133 Producer said:
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this is not even a question outside of BBI. Jones is a pretty good running QB, though it does seem every time we turn up the dial on his running - he gets hurt.
Josh Allen?
Kyler Murray?
Do you know what you are talking about Producer?
I know it’s Friday…have you started early?
Yes Hurts is a better running QB than Murray. 2021 stats:
Hurts - 784 yards 10TDs
Murray - 423 yards 5 TDs
Who sounds better than you? And thanks for slagging me even though you are completely wrong.
But he just doesn't want to play that way and maybe his body couldn't handle it.
In terms of what they actually do, Hurts is the 2nd best behind Lamar. Allen and Kyler both have the ability to be up there, but they don't have the usage.
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https://www.bigblueinteractive.com/2022/09/28/game-review-dallas-cowboys-23-new-york-giants-16/
"Listen to any quarterback talk about Jones and they will tell you it is almost impossible to play a normal version of the position in that kind of environment. If anything, I actually put this game in the “positive pile” when thinking about where his status will reside in January."
I recommend proof reading and not formatting your posts so the thread turns into war and peace.
Where does that say Sy said he’s “good enough”? That’s taking quite some artistic liberty. The closest Sy has said to he’s “good enough” is that he reminds him of Tannehill. That’s not a compliment
The prior week vs Carolina he made the comment "He can do it."
And then he's making weekly comments on Giants board specifically going over the Giants that you are too stupid to understand that when he says the below after the Dallas game - and referring to January he is talking about the Giants. How can you not understand he is talking about the Giants and Jones after the season as he speaks about “the pile?” I know you are ignorant but seriously I can't believe you are this stupid.
https://www.bigblueinteractive.com/2022/09/28/game-review-dallas-cowboys-23-new-york-giants-16/
“I actually put this game in the “positive pile” when thinking about where his status will reside in January.”
You can’t be this stupid. Just being a troll?
Quote:
Do you know what you are talking about Producer?
He bullshits.
And be careful he recently told me he's a "Cosell Disciple."
hahahahaha LMAO. I kid you not. Hahahahahaha
Quote:
In comment 15850122 giantstock said:
Quote:
https://www.bigblueinteractive.com/2022/09/28/game-review-dallas-cowboys-23-new-york-giants-16/
"Listen to any quarterback talk about Jones and they will tell you it is almost impossible to play a normal version of the position in that kind of environment. If anything, I actually put this game in the “positive pile” when thinking about where his status will reside in January."
I recommend proof reading and not formatting your posts so the thread turns into war and peace.
Where does that say Sy said he’s “good enough”? That’s taking quite some artistic liberty. The closest Sy has said to he’s “good enough” is that he reminds him of Tannehill. That’s not a compliment
The prior week vs Carolina he made the comment "He can do it."
And then he's making weekly comments on Giants board specifically going over the Giants that you are too stupid to understand that when he says the below after the Dallas game - and referring to January he is talking about the Giants. How can you not understand he is talking about the Giants and Jones after the season as he speaks about “the pile?” I know you are ignorant but seriously I can't believe you are this stupid.
https://www.bigblueinteractive.com/2022/09/28/game-review-dallas-cowboys-23-new-york-giants-16/
“I actually put this game in the “positive pile” when thinking about where his status will reside in January.”
You can’t be this stupid. Just being a troll?
One game added to a very small positive pile. Woohoo!
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In comment 15850162 5BowlsSoon said:
Quote:
Do you know what you are talking about Producer?
He bullshits.
And be careful he recently told me he's a "Cosell Disciple."
hahahahaha LMAO. I kid you not. Hahahahahaha
Jeez you're a clown. Stay away from my posts unless you are willing to read them.
Quote:
In comment 15850162 5BowlsSoon said:
Quote:
In comment 15850133 Producer said:
Quote:
this is not even a question outside of BBI. Jones is a pretty good running QB, though it does seem every time we turn up the dial on his running - he gets hurt.
Josh Allen?
Kyler Murray?
Do you know what you are talking about Producer?
I know it’s Friday…have you started early?
Yes Hurts is a better running QB than Murray. 2021 stats:
Hurts - 784 yards 10TDs
Murray - 423 yards 5 TDs
Who sounds better than you? And thanks for slagging me even though you are completely wrong.
Wow….I will be honest here….I really didn’t know how many yards Murray had last year, so I’m surprised he only had 88 carries for 423, 5 TDs and 4.8 average. Murray was injured last year, missed two games and I think was limited for other games. That may have caused the low carries (88).
The year before was his big year:
2020: 133 for 819 yards, 11 TDs and a 6.2 average……all much better than any year of Hurts.
As for Josh Allen
2021: 122 for 763 yards, 6 TDs, with a 6.3 YPC. Hurts has more TDs while Josh has a better YPC. Yards pretty similar.
So, I guess your statement saying Hurts is the 2nd best running qb does have some validity. You were not “crazy” for saying that as i accused you of being. I apologize for mocking you…that was obviously inappropriate and not supported. Me bad.
He will plan accordingly and will have multiple avenues he can take. Jones needs to play really well to be in the discussion.
Quote:
In comment 15850166 5BowlsSoon said:
Quote:
In comment 15850162 5BowlsSoon said:
Quote:
In comment 15850133 Producer said:
Quote:
this is not even a question outside of BBI. Jones is a pretty good running QB, though it does seem every time we turn up the dial on his running - he gets hurt.
Josh Allen?
Kyler Murray?
Do you know what you are talking about Producer?
I know it’s Friday…have you started early?
Yes Hurts is a better running QB than Murray. 2021 stats:
Hurts - 784 yards 10TDs
Murray - 423 yards 5 TDs
Who sounds better than you? And thanks for slagging me even though you are completely wrong.
Wow….I will be honest here….I really didn’t know how many yards Murray had last year, so I’m surprised he only had 88 carries for 423, 5 TDs and 4.8 average. Murray was injured last year, missed two games and I think was limited for other games. That may have caused the low carries (88).
The year before was his big year:
2020: 133 for 819 yards, 11 TDs and a 6.2 average……all much better than any year of Hurts.
As for Josh Allen
2021: 122 for 763 yards, 6 TDs, with a 6.3 YPC. Hurts has more TDs while Josh has a better YPC. Yards pretty similar.
So, I guess your statement saying Hurts is the 2nd best running qb does have some validity. You were not “crazy” for saying that as i accused you of being. I apologize for mocking you…that was obviously inappropriate and not supported. Me bad.
You're a class act. Thanks for rethinking it. Yes the Murray numbers you cite from 2020 put him in the conversation but he seems to run less, perhaps his size or potential for injury? Lamar, Hurts and Allen seem to evade injury, at least for now.