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NFT: It's the Knicks "don't suck" Knicks thread of the day

Semipro Lineman : 11/17/2022 6:00 am
This is the thread for "real" Knicks fans and not the pretenders in the other thread who want to trade and fire anyone who even works nears MSG including the cashier at the pizza place across the street.



Damn, we got a good team this year and it's only going to get better
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RE: You don't buy it fine...  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 11:43 am : link
In comment 15910911 Jan in DC said:
Quote:
but at least you can understand a world where someone else would have a different point of view? Like, I'm on the floor, I'm going to be aggressive and get up shots.

Not everyone is going to have the MJ flu game. I'm sure the coaching staff was aware that he was sick. If they don't like the way you're playing, you should sit.

I really like djm's post. RJ's fine. I want him to be better, I want him to be more efficient, but he's fine as he is.


No he is not fine as he is, i am sorry he is not..

You cant continue to have games where you go 8 for 18 and score 19 or 20 points..
I would argue RJ  
larryflower37 : 11/17/2022 11:43 am : link
should take 80% of those shots, he was wide open from 3' all night and he had no lift but if you are out there and get clean shots you have to take them.
My problem is he shouldn't have been out there, but we beat the Thibs substitution problems to death and this is a positive thread for the real fans...so I will decline to discuss it.
Nah, I mean I don't know...  
Jan in DC : 11/17/2022 11:56 am : link
He might be an all-star one day, but at this point I doubt it. But we all know where he has to improve. Finishing, playmaking, smarter decisions when he penetrates, better shooting. By all accounts he works hard, so maybe something clicks, but at this point, I'm not holding my breath.

I am not sure how you can say he's the same player he was when he came into the league. He's a better shooter, he gets to the line more, he's better defensively.

I do think he's a bad fit with Randle, so that's something to consider.

I'm just not ready to jump out the window because he had a really bad game when we knew he was sick.
RE: I think Rj can have an all star type of season  
djm : 11/17/2022 12:01 pm : link
In comment 15910912 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
but if you are actually honest with yourself, watching Rj do you honestly see star or something that can catipult him to becoming a star?


we can do this with dozens of greats that needed 2-3-4-5 years to emerge as a true star.

Daniel Jones was never going to improve in year 4 either. Let's line up the experts who screamed that crap from the hilltops every day around here.

Jimmy Butler. There's one. Should I keep going?

I don't even want to get into it--RJB might be what he is, a tough, 2 way player who can avg 18-20 and sometimes be erratic. Ok...deal with it. Or maybe he turns into a mega star...unlikely sure, but don't tell anything with a 22 year old is a certainty. Save it.

And greg you said Reddish FUCKING SUCKED. You were wrong. Move on.
it's a great win  
djm : 11/17/2022 12:03 pm : link
WORRY WORY WORRY WORRY and WORRY some more.

Life is too fucking short.
RE: Nah, I mean I don't know...  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 12:03 pm : link
In comment 15910940 Jan in DC said:
Quote:
He might be an all-star one day, but at this point I doubt it. But we all know where he has to improve. Finishing, playmaking, smarter decisions when he penetrates, better shooting. By all accounts he works hard, so maybe something clicks, but at this point, I'm not holding my breath.

I am not sure how you can say he's the same player he was when he came into the league. He's a better shooter, he gets to the line more, he's better defensively.

I do think he's a bad fit with Randle, so that's something to consider.

I'm just not ready to jump out the window because he had a really bad game when we knew he was sick.


I am not trying to argue with you, but is he really a better shooter?

and its not just 1 game, its been like this for pretty much all year, he had a good 5 or 6 game stretch and then went right back..

and is he really much better? he averages 4 more points but takes 3 more shots, his shooting percentage is the same, 3 point is much worse, he goes to the free throw line .5 times more than his rookie year and efg% is still terrible..

i mean it sucks to do but if you really look at it, where has he improved? Rebounding the same, assists the same, turnovers the same
RE: RE: I think Rj can have an all star type of season  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 12:04 pm : link
In comment 15910950 djm said:
Quote:
In comment 15910912 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


but if you are actually honest with yourself, watching Rj do you honestly see star or something that can catipult him to becoming a star?



we can do this with dozens of greats that needed 2-3-4-5 years to emerge as a true star.

Daniel Jones was never going to improve in year 4 either. Let's line up the experts who screamed that crap from the hilltops every day around here.

Jimmy Butler. There's one. Should I keep going?

I don't even want to get into it--RJB might be what he is, a tough, 2 way player who can avg 18-20 and sometimes be erratic. Ok...deal with it. Or maybe he turns into a mega star...unlikely sure, but don't tell anything with a 22 year old is a certainty. Save it.

And greg you said Reddish FUCKING SUCKED. You were wrong. Move on.


Stop it, please name the superstar that took 4 or 5 years to develop..

Butler by year 4 was an all star.
RE: RE: RE: I think Rj can have an all star type of season  
GNewGiants : 11/17/2022 12:08 pm : link
In comment 15910959 nygiants16 said:
Quote:


Stop it, please name the superstar that took 4 or 5 years to develop..

Butler by year 4 was an all star.


Jokic was an all-star in year 4 (aage 23) but didnt become a megastar until year 6. Not saying Barrett will be a Jokic like player - but it does take players some years to develop their body to match their game.
RE: RE: RE: RE: I think Rj can have an all star type of season  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 12:12 pm : link
In comment 15910967 GNewGiants said:
Quote:
In comment 15910959 nygiants16 said:


Quote:




Stop it, please name the superstar that took 4 or 5 years to develop..

Butler by year 4 was an all star.



Jokic was an all-star in year 4 (aage 23) but didnt become a megastar until year 6. Not saying Barrett will be a Jokic like player - but it does take players some years to develop their body to match their game.


Jokic by year 2 was averaging 17, 9 and 6 on 56% shooting
You know a star when you see one pretty much right away  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 12:13 pm : link
by year 2 or 3 they are showing ok we got something here
Love you guys  
djm : 11/17/2022 12:13 pm : link
I’m feverish and quick to the trigger. Peace and love. You wanna worry be my guest. I get it.
RE: Love you guys  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 12:15 pm : link
In comment 15910976 djm said:
Quote:
I’m feverish and quick to the trigger. Peace and love. You wanna worry be my guest. I get it.


Feel better!!!
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: I think Rj can have an all star type of season  
GNewGiants : 11/17/2022 12:18 pm : link
In comment 15910971 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 15910967 GNewGiants said:


Quote:


In comment 15910959 nygiants16 said:


Quote:




Stop it, please name the superstar that took 4 or 5 years to develop..

Butler by year 4 was an all star.



Jokic was an all-star in year 4 (aage 23) but didnt become a megastar until year 6. Not saying Barrett will be a Jokic like player - but it does take players some years to develop their body to match their game.



Jokic by year 2 was averaging 17, 9 and 6 on 56% shooting


And shot under 50% in year 4. It took time for him to develop and become a dominant player in the league.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: I think Rj can have an all star type of season  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 12:21 pm : link
In comment 15910994 GNewGiants said:
Quote:
In comment 15910971 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


In comment 15910967 GNewGiants said:


Quote:


In comment 15910959 nygiants16 said:


Quote:




Stop it, please name the superstar that took 4 or 5 years to develop..

Butler by year 4 was an all star.



Jokic was an all-star in year 4 (aage 23) but didnt become a megastar until year 6. Not saying Barrett will be a Jokic like player - but it does take players some years to develop their body to match their game.



Jokic by year 2 was averaging 17, 9 and 6 on 56% shooting



And shot under 50% in year 4. It took time for him to develop and become a dominant player in the league.


my point is you saw something early, with 99% of stars in this league you see it early, it make take them a 3 or 4 years to make their mark but you see it earlier than that..

Rarely does a guy have average years 1-4 and then all of sudden becomes a star
RE: RE: Love you guys  
djm : 11/17/2022 12:22 pm : link
In comment 15910982 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 15910976 djm said:


Quote:


I’m feverish and quick to the trigger. Peace and love. You wanna worry be my guest. I get it.



Feel better!!!


I do feel better thx--less achy--i can deal with the fever. The aches last night were fucking brutal.
and it was year 3 for Jokic  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 12:22 pm : link
and he shot 49.9 %, also shot 40% from 3 and 55 efg%
RE: RE: RE: Love you guys  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 12:23 pm : link
In comment 15910998 djm said:
Quote:
In comment 15910982 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


In comment 15910976 djm said:


Quote:


I’m feverish and quick to the trigger. Peace and love. You wanna worry be my guest. I get it.



Feel better!!!



I do feel better thx--less achy--i can deal with the fever. The aches last night were fucking brutal.


yeah my fever never got to bad, but the aches suck, my wife had the headache and aches
and Greg don't go changing  
djm : 11/17/2022 12:24 pm : link
if I see one post praising a former dukeie from you I will go walk into a volcano
Barrett is going to score 25 ppg  
Vanzetti : 11/17/2022 12:25 pm : link
He just has moves around the basket that you can't teach. He is a natural scorer.

He will never be a top ten player because he lacks quickness and hops and is not a great jump shooter.

But he will be a very good player.
.  
DanMetroMan : 11/17/2022 1:40 pm : link
NBACentral
@TheNBACentral
·
12s
The New York Knicks are among the teams with an interest in Jae Crowder, per @AmicoHoops
RE: .  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 1:42 pm : link
In comment 15911133 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
NBACentral
@TheNBACentral
·
12s
The New York Knicks are among the teams with an interest in Jae Crowder, per @AmicoHoops


Just about to post this lol, According to stein he thinks a deal is getting close for Crowder, not necassarily to Knicks but in general..

Jake Fischer said he is hesring a 3 team deal is getting closer
Can't  
DanMetroMan : 11/17/2022 1:44 pm : link
wait for IQ to become Vinnie Johnson 2.0 in Phoenix
RE: Can't  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 1:45 pm : link
In comment 15911145 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
wait for IQ to become Vinnie Johnson 2.0 in Phoenix


lol, Fournier you would think would be in the deal or Rose
I can't wait!  
Jan in DC : 11/17/2022 1:50 pm : link
Acquiring another PF that Obi can sit behind!
Jae Crowder  
bceagle05 : 11/17/2022 1:54 pm : link
might be the Thibs-iest player in the entire league. If he wants playing time, he'll get it here.
RE: I can't wait!  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 1:55 pm : link
In comment 15911151 Jan in DC said:
Quote:
Acquiring another PF that Obi can sit behind!


Crowder can play the 2-3-4 good versatile wing
Rose needs to be fired if they  
larryflower37 : 11/17/2022 1:56 pm : link
Add another veteran player to this roster.
This team needs to consolidate minutes and players.
Cavs have dropped five straight.  
bceagle05 : 11/17/2022 1:58 pm : link
I guess the Garland/Mitchell backcourt has been an issue on defense, as expected.
I wanna gripe about not getting DeJountee Murray again...  
AG5686 : 11/17/2022 2:22 pm : link
But Cam is making me a bit more mollified with his D
Reddish's defense is nothing special  
Greg from LI : 11/17/2022 2:31 pm : link
I swear, it's as if none of you ever watched truly great defense.
RJ’s knee  
RAIN : 11/17/2022 2:44 pm : link
Is not right. He’s limping and laboring, and playing injured. He needs to get some time off.
That's just stupid  
Spider43 : 11/17/2022 2:56 pm : link
If he's truly injured and he's trying to tough it out. We took an abundance of caution with Mitch, and we should do the same for RJ, if he really has something serious. We have a lot of depth at the wing spots, and can tread water in the meantime. But if we're jeopardizing the rest of his career by making him play through it (or if he himself is insisting on playing through it), that isn't smart.
over the last 3  
Enzo : 11/17/2022 3:06 pm : link
games RJ 11-46 from the field and 0-16 from 3. He's also grabbed 7 total rebounds over his last 87 minutes. I don't care if he's sick, injured, or whatever - he's actively hurting the team and should have his role reduced until he improves.
If they can turn Rose and Fournier into Crowder  
adamg : 11/17/2022 3:22 pm : link
That'd be great.
RE: If they can turn Rose and Fournier into Crowder  
larryflower37 : 11/17/2022 3:49 pm : link
In comment 15911292 adamg said:
Quote:
That'd be great.

Really?
The money isn't close, Crowder is making 10 million on the last year of his deal.
Crowder is a win now player and it moves Cam/Grimes to the zero playtime again.
RE: I wanna gripe about not getting DeJountee Murray again...  
Spider43 : 11/17/2022 4:08 pm : link
In comment 15911204 AG5686 said:
Quote:
But Cam is making me a bit more mollified with his D


So, with the benefit of hindsight, which combo guard would you guys have really wanted last summer: Dejounte, SGA, or Mitchell? I think SGA is in the lead right now...
RE: RE: I wanna gripe about not getting DeJountee Murray again...  
AG5686 : 11/17/2022 4:15 pm : link
In comment 15911340 Spider43 said:
Quote:
In comment 15911204 AG5686 said:


Quote:


But Cam is making me a bit more mollified with his D



So, with the benefit of hindsight, which combo guard would you guys have really wanted last summer: Dejounte, SGA, or Mitchell? I think SGA is in the lead right now...

SGA is better offensively.. but DeJountee is a great 2 way guard...
RE: Cavs have dropped five straight.  
djm : 11/17/2022 4:29 pm : link
In comment 15911160 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
I guess the Garland/Mitchell backcourt has been an issue on defense, as expected.


That's a shame
RE: RE: If they can turn Rose and Fournier into Crowder  
adamg : 11/17/2022 4:46 pm : link
In comment 15911318 larryflower37 said:
Quote:
In comment 15911292 adamg said:


Quote:


That'd be great.


Really?
The money isn't close, Crowder is making 10 million on the last year of his deal.
Crowder is a win now player and it moves Cam/Grimes to the zero playtime again.


It'd probably be Rose for Crowder and filler. I'd rather have Crowder playing minutes than Rose, and it allows us to move Randle.
RE: RE: I wanna gripe about not getting DeJountee Murray again...  
Enzo : 11/17/2022 4:47 pm : link
In comment 15911340 Spider43 said:
Quote:
In comment 15911204 AG5686 said:


Quote:


But Cam is making me a bit more mollified with his D



So, with the benefit of hindsight, which combo guard would you guys have really wanted last summer: Dejounte, SGA, or Mitchell? I think SGA is in the lead right now...

well SGA has never been made available as far as anyone knows...right? But between Murray and Mitchell I'm taking Mitchell. Mitchell is under team control for longer and is more likely to extend his deal (due to cap rules) while still under contract. Murray is almost certainly getting to unrestricted free agency.
RE: Barrett is going to score 25 ppg  
TyreeHelmet : 11/17/2022 5:13 pm : link
In comment 15911006 Vanzetti said:
Quote:
He just has moves around the basket that you can't teach. He is a natural scorer.

He will never be a top ten player because he lacks quickness and hops and is not a great jump shooter.

But he will be a very good player.


You think Barrett will score 25PPG? In what league?

And he is about the furthest thing from a natural scorer I've ever seen.

He's clearly a good guy but he's been a disappointment overall for the Knicks. And this is not just looking at him this season- this is the totality of his nba career.
I'm tired of watching shooting nights like that for RJ  
NoGainDayne : 11/17/2022 5:26 pm : link
I disagree with the idea that if you have open looks you take them. Maybe you should be looking to do something else than post up at the 3 point line if you are shooting that badly.

And the team has a lot of depth, if he is going to be shooting that poorly he shouldn't be on the floor period. He was a -18 last night and the next worst player was Hartenstein at -6. He's 40.2% from the field and was 40.8% last year. That simply is not good enough for the amount of shots he wants to take. That makes him 31st among SGs and 59 among guards this season. You can call him a glue guy all you want, that's fine, he shouldn't be shooting as much as he does.
Barrett has a bug/flu so I'll give him a pass for these past couple  
steve in ky : 11/17/2022 5:31 pm : link
of games because it's obvious he's labored a little being asked to play through it. It's more on the coach for not spelling him a little more, but Thibbs just benched a couple guys and went to this 9 man rotation so I can also understand him not wanting to reverse that immediately.That just complicates things. The bottom line is they are playing better and winning some tough games on the road, hard to complain about that.
RE: I'm tired of watching shooting nights like that for RJ  
steve in ky : 11/17/2022 5:40 pm : link
In comment 15911402 NoGainDayne said:
Quote:
I disagree with the idea that if you have open looks you take them. Maybe you should be looking to do something else than post up at the 3 point line if you are shooting that badly.

And the team has a lot of depth, if he is going to be shooting that poorly he shouldn't be on the floor period. He was a -18 last night and the next worst player was Hartenstein at -6. He's 40.2% from the field and was 40.8% last year. That simply is not good enough for the amount of shots he wants to take. That makes him 31st among SGs and 59 among guards this season. You can call him a glue guy all you want, that's fine, he shouldn't be shooting as much as he does.


Looking at +/- for an individual player, in one individual game, is a lousy stat to draw any inference from.
I just want Rj to play smarter  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 5:48 pm : link
i dont need him to be a superstar, i dont need him to carry the team, i just need him to play smarter..

If you are hot, attack by all means go nuts, but if your off, do other things, move the ball, rebound and defend, dont force shots, you dont need to on this team..

Thats all i ask of Rj
RE: I just want Rj to play smarter  
steve in ky : 11/17/2022 5:53 pm : link
In comment 15911425 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
i dont need him to be a superstar, i dont need him to carry the team, i just need him to play smarter..

If you are hot, attack by all means go nuts, but if your off, do other things, move the ball, rebound and defend, dont force shots, you dont need to on this team..

Thats all i ask of Rj


It is frustrating to see him keep shooting three's when it's appears he is too under the weather to be effective. What we don't know, and I'm curious of, is what the coaches are telling him to do. Maybe they are telling him if you're open and the ball gets kicked out to you keep shooting.
RE: RE: I just want Rj to play smarter  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 5:57 pm : link
In comment 15911427 steve in ky said:
Quote:
In comment 15911425 nygiants16 said:


Quote:


i dont need him to be a superstar, i dont need him to carry the team, i just need him to play smarter..

If you are hot, attack by all means go nuts, but if your off, do other things, move the ball, rebound and defend, dont force shots, you dont need to on this team..

Thats all i ask of Rj



It is frustrating to see him keep shooting three's when it's appears he is too under the weather to be effective. What we don't know, and I'm curious of, is what the coaches are telling him to do. Maybe they are telling him if you're open and the ball gets kicked out to you keep shooting.


I dont mind those shots if you are wide open you got to take the shot, but i saw a few times where a guy was rotating to him and either had Randle or cam or Brunson open and all he had to do was swing it but instead took the shot..

I am not going to kill him for missing iq at the end of the 1st quarter, i dont think he saw him
The plays that bothers me the most  
nygiants16 : 11/17/2022 5:59 pm : link
is he will drive and the defender in the corner will slide in leaving the corner man wide open and instead of the easy kick he shoots off balance floater/runner..

Make the pass..Id rsther Rj be at 16 or 17 ppg at 45% shooting than 20 or 21 at 40%
I'm still giving him a pass for these games he's being asked to  
steve in ky : 11/17/2022 6:02 pm : link
play through the flu, or whatever it is. It's obvious he is sapped of energy.
RE: I'm still giving him a pass for these games he's being asked to  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 11/17/2022 6:23 pm : link
In comment 15911440 steve in ky said:
Quote:
play through the flu, or whatever it is. It's obvious he is sapped of energy.
'

'Flu is for mere mortals.'-Michael Jordan, Haha.
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