I agree a tie is better than a win but if Iran has 3 points a tie today gets us 2. A win vs Iran the last day is the only way to advance. Loss today doesn’t really change much unless I’m missing something.
A draw today would do wonders for the team's confidence and respect in the football world. Then, they need to beat Iran. They really need to move on to the knockout round to gain any respect.
A tie does nothing for us other then forces England to beat wales
for the United States. Draw would have been best but now we're win and in against Iran and won't need to worry about the Wales/England game (assuming we don't blow up our goal difference this afternoon or Wales beats England by multiple goals).
Also, a draw today doesn't do much for us as far as advancing. We'd still need to beat Iran. Presents an interesting dilemma for Berhalter. Do you set up more aggressively to try to get a win which would put us in a position to only need a draw against Iran to advance and even potentially win the group? Or do we want to sit deep and make sure, at worst, we don't concede much and hurt our goal differential heading into the last day.
Now if we beat Iran, we're in really good shape to go through. It's not a layup, not going to be easy. But that's not a terrible place to be - we control our destiny (mostly) against a team that's not that great.
Wasn’t even considering the possibility of resting players today. Not sure that’s the move but I think you have to strongly considering not starting the players on yellow. I believe that’d be Dest, Mckennie, and Ream. And maybe subbing Pulisic at some point in the second half
I'd imagine that it would be very difficult to do in real life. These guys get a very small # of WC games in their career. This game, although not that important, is extremely high profile. WC, England, holiday weekend. It's a dream game. Asking guys to sit would be very difficult
I take that back- sitting guys is. not the right move
We can win this game. Will we? Probably not. But if we do, it's great for us - both for the tournament and for the program. We have to try to win. We get 3 games. You have to try to win them.
There have been far bigger upsets than USA over England in sports. We have real players that are good. We should go out there and try to win.
And there's certainly value in allowing your best 11 to continue to build chemistry against a good team. England is not unbeatable either. Tough calls.
They didn't touch the ball in the 1st half against us and only scored on a penalty that was not a scoring chance. They did have a couple of chances in the 2nd half against us, but they mostly looked like a set piece team.
I did not watch the game this AM but losing to Iran is pretty bad.
But an abnormal number of Arab countries seem to be pulling upsets in Qatar no?
The Saudis are the only Arab team to win a game so far. Iran isn’t considered to be an Arab country, and even if you include them, their victory was mostly due to the Welsh playing a man down. Morocco and Tunisia have played well though.
But an abnormal number of Arab countries seem to be pulling upsets in Qatar no?
The Saudis are the only Arab team to win a game so far. Iran isn’t considered to be an Arab country, and even if you include them, their victory was mostly due to the Welsh playing a man down. Morocco and Tunisia have played well though.
Misworded that. Don’t watch much soccer so was just curious
The bad is that Iran is obviously better than we thought and just beat a team we tied by 2-0. Also England mopped the floor with Iran, so that doesn't bode well for today versus England
But an abnormal number of Arab countries seem to be pulling upsets in Qatar no?
The Saudis are the only Arab team to win a game so far. Iran isn’t considered to be an Arab country, and even if you include them, their victory was mostly due to the Welsh playing a man down. Morocco and Tunisia have played well though.
Misworded that. Don’t watch much soccer so was just curious
They’ve mostly played well, probably being elevated by “home” crowds
But an abnormal number of Arab countries seem to be pulling upsets in Qatar no?
The Saudis are the only Arab team to win a game so far. Iran isn’t considered to be an Arab country, and even if you include them, their victory was mostly due to the Welsh playing a man down. Morocco and Tunisia have played well though.
And Morocco and Tunisia aren't real Arab countries either. More like Berber countries who have Arabic speaker.
RE: So the good is the USA now needs to only win one
The bad is that Iran is obviously better than we thought and just beat a team we tied by 2-0. Also England mopped the floor with Iran, so that doesn't bode well for today versus England
Wales vs Iran was 0-0 until Wales’ keeper was red carded.
Considering how this is shaping up....do you just not play a lot of
The bad is that Iran is obviously better than we thought and just beat a team we tied by 2-0. Also England mopped the floor with Iran, so that doesn't bode well for today versus England
I don’t think FOX is right with that graphic.
If we somehow won today and lost vs. Iran, we would be out with an English win over Wales. Both England and Iran would have 6 points, while we would have only 4.
If we lose today and beat Iran, we almost certainly go through with 4 points unless Wales beat England by enough on GD to go over us.
Was that the first straight red of the tournament?
What prompted the ejection?
Goalie came out of the box to defend a great long ball that was going to lead to a breakaway, attacking player tapped ball past him and he demolished attacking player. It all happened fast and didn't seem intentional/late, but he caught none of the ball and he ruined the guy.
England is a star-studded team, but it's weakness is in the back. If the US sits back and plays "defense" as they did in the 2nd half of the Wales game, this will not end well. England has many finishers who are used to teams playing that way.
The risk of aggressive play is that there are several Americans on yellow cards and no matter the outcome today these kids are needed against Iran. McKennie, Dest and Ream in particular could be susceptible to another yellow through over-aggressive play. For that reason even though it would not b great, I could understand Berhalter pulling all of the front line players with yellows if the US falls behind by 2 goals.
England is a star-studded team, but it's weakness is in the back. If the US sits back and plays "defense" as they did in the 2nd half of the Wales game, this will not end well. England has many finishers who are used to teams playing that way.
The risk of aggressive play is that there are several Americans on yellow cards and no matter the outcome today these kids are needed against Iran. McKennie, Dest and Ream in particular could be susceptible to another yellow through over-aggressive play. For that reason even though it would not b great, I could understand Berhalter pulling all of the front line players with yellows if the US falls behind by 2 goals.
yeah, the "aggressive" part of their game should mean a higher-variance style of play, but they need to be very smart on their challenges.
Was that the first straight red of the tournament?
What prompted the ejection?
Goalie came out of the box to defend a great long ball that was going to lead to a breakaway, attacking player tapped ball past him and he demolished attacking player. It all happened fast and didn't seem intentional/late, but he caught none of the ball and he ruined the guy.
Looked a little scary early but we settled in. This USA team is good - they are skilled, quick, and play good soccer. I really hope we get through the group and see what they can do in the knockout.
Being small is tough though- not a threat on set pieces and we don't have much of a chance attacking high crosses.
I still think we're going to lose, but that was the 1st half I was hoping for.
Most entertaining game of the World Cup so far. US has been the better side but they need to put the ball in the net because England will when they get three chance.
What does Berhalter do now since the outcome of this game has no baering on the US chances for going through? I would find a way to get Reyna minutes, perhaps replacing Wright or Weah. Consider getting Dest out of there as his offensive potential is rivaled by his defensive lapses. Might also consider sitting McKennie who has been great but coming off an injury. Insert Aaronson. I want to play England tough but not at the rucks of being unfit for Iran.
What does Berhalter do now since the outcome of this game has no baering on the US chances for going through? I would find a way to get Reyna minutes, perhaps replacing Wright or Weah. Consider getting Dest out of there as his offensive potential is rivaled by his defensive lapses. Might also consider sitting McKennie who has been great but coming off an injury. Insert Aaronson. I want to play England tough but not at the rucks of being unfit for Iran.
There’s enormous implications. A win here means a tie is all that is needed against Iran. A loss rather than a tie means we have to care about Wales v England.
never thought I'd say this, but the referee should get more involved. That foul on Weah should have been a yellow, along with a few others in the first half.
For the US. Hard to find fault with the effort but the reality is that the US still has some serious deficiencies which will have to be corrected going forward. Primarily the right side of the US defense remains a major weakness. Whenever Zimmerman and Dest are on the ball you have to hold your breath. Stark contrast to the other side with Robinson and Ream. Solid goalie play.
was a terrible give away by Zimmerman. He also committed the foul that produced the PK against Wales.
Musah foul late, however soft, was also dumb.
Berhalter has to be WAY more aggressive with his subs because the US are basically a speed and effort group. Once that wanes in the second half, the chances start drying up.
If you can’t beat Iran, then you don’t deserve to advance. Get it done.
Not only were they convinced they would win, to them it was just a matter of how much. U.S. midfield was excellent today. I like our chances against Iran four days from now on Tuesday.
Musah, what an idiotic and unnecessary push to give ENG a dangerous FK in stoppage time, could have overturned the result.
1st half, I didn't see ENG MF outplaying USA at all; other than maybe minutes 7 - 12, I thought US midfielders had far the better of the play
And I still disagree with the notion the idea USA went into a shell in 2H vs Wales; minutes 45 - 70, thought it was much in line with 1H; they began to wear down, Wales remained patient.
What did happen in 2H vs Wales, as again today, USA creates some runs, finding seams vs back line and get it in deep, but make either blind passes back into the area right to defenders, as if passes back into the area are automatically threatening. The MFs or backs getting to the 18 are not doing a good enough job getting to space and the possession is wasted with a mis-timed, mis-aimed delivery.
For the US. Hard to find fault with the effort but the reality is that the US still has some serious deficiencies which will have to be corrected going forward. Primarily the right side of the US defense remains a major weakness. Whenever Zimmerman and Dest are on the ball you have to hold your breath. Stark contrast to the other side with Robinson and Ream. Solid goalie play.
This. Very solid game, but Dest especially makes me hold my. breath. That said, congrats to the team for a well-played game that shut up the English sports pundits who predicted a blowout for England.
But the Shaq Moore sub seemed like a poor decision, they ended up moving the ball down that wing (if thats what it is called) and I think Yedlin would have done more there.
USA looked like they belonged which is refreshing.
Iran probably advances with a draw, so I'd expect them to e sitting deep. Dest's dribbling could help break things down.
Real good game for the US. We were on even footing with one of the best teams in the world. This was not a hold on and pray for a draw - it was a true back and forth game.
Ultimately we were always going to have to get a win against Wales and/or Iran. That's still the case. Destiny is in our hands. Beat Iran.
In the first half.
Turner,Ream, Robinson,Pulisic, Adams, Dest, Musah and McKinnie really played good games.Weah didn’t have the same impact in this game
USMNT lacks a WC striker unfortunately
RE: The game turned in the Us favor when they changed tow 4-4-2 formation
In the first half.
Turner,Ream, Robinson,Pulisic, Adams, Dest, Musah and McKinnie really played good games.Weah didn’t have the same impact in this game
USMNT lacks a WC striker unfortunately
Our BIGGEST need, by far.
God this just screams when Italy played well, but couldn’t finish
and didn’t make it out of group because of not scoring and 3 draws.
Need to figure out how to finish fast. That being said I’m pretty damn encouraged by what this group can accomplish with a WC on home turf. Very poised today.
English fans threw pints in anger after the 0-0 draw. Link - ( New Window )
Haha. I'm reading the various papers in England. The London Times condemns the English team, whereas the Yorkshire Post (which covers Leeds) are all about how Tyler Adams was man of the match.
It had little to gain going balls to the wall and a lot to lose by allowing a counter and a score. It was in the cat bird's seat and didn't need to extend. Don't read this wrong: USMNT played well, gave a good account of itself, but I'm not reading into this result any sea change, yet ⁶
The real challenge for the USMNT is that Iran does not need a result in the game on Tuesday and will advance with a tie. This is a particular challenge because the US struggles to score and lacks the finisher up top to help break down a defense that is packing it in. I can see Berhalter waiting a half and then subbing in attackers. Would like to see Reyna in from the outset. May have to pull wright or sergeant. Agree with those who think that Dest could help in the attack but every time he goes forward he leaves himself vulnerable to the counter.
The real challenge for the USMNT is that Iran does not need a result in the game on Tuesday and will advance with a tie. This is a particular challenge because the US struggles to score and lacks the finisher up top to help break down a defense that is packing it in. I can see Berhalter waiting a half and then subbing in attackers. Would like to see Reyna in from the outset. May have to pull wright or sergeant. Agree with those who think that Dest could help in the attack but every time he goes forward he leaves himself vulnerable to the counter.
Yup, this is the problem - Iran only needs a tie.
But if we score first, their gameplan may go out the window.
We need a goal, and to score first.
The Saudi government gave each Saudi player a Rolls Royce
Our midfield totally outplayed England’s midfield. A big surprise.
Never got the Mason Mount love, and Southgate is not a good tactician. Another game the US could have won with a decent striker and a better RB.
English press and fans are killing Southgate over todays match. Saying he plays it too safe to get through, rather than just turn them lose and play to Englands strengths. Also pissed over his player selection, especially Mount over Foden.
I’ve always thought Sterling was a media creation - all sizzle - and Kane was invisible for much of the game due to poor midfielding.
The contrast with the talent the Brazilian, Spanish, Argentinian and French squads are fielding is a mike wide.
It was the first time I’d seen either the US or UK squads play. I’m a pretty serious soccer fan and, to my fan eyes, the US team was clearly the superior squad and actually should have won. In any case, the passing skill and speed the US team was showing was on another level compared to the clumsiness and physicality of the teams a decade ago. Our soccer culture is really making progress.
I’ve always thought Sterling was a media creation - all sizzle - and Kane was invisible for much of the game due to poor midfielding.
The contrast with the talent the Brazilian, Spanish, Argentinian and French squads are fielding is a mike wide.
It was the first time I’d seen either the US or UK squads play. I’m a pretty serious soccer fan and, to my fan eyes, the US team was clearly the superior squad and actually should have won. In any case, the passing skill and speed the US team was showing was on another level compared to the clumsiness and physicality of the teams a decade ago. Our soccer culture is really making progress.
That the matchup was fairly even. Give England Q1 and Q4 and the US squad was better during Q2 & Q3 (if broken in quarters).
Momentum at end with England though and wouldn't be surprised if they put in a goal if it went 5 minutes more. Did their subs give them more of a spark than the US substitutions?
Our conditioning was so much better yesterday than Monday.
Musah and Pulisic went the full game.
Once again Tyler Adams was the man of the match. The USMNT is challenged in finishing and scoring goals. It's a concern!!!
See what happens later. Need to at least have a draw with England and then beat Iran.
of course a win is ideal, but USA would be glad to least salvage a point vs a monster club like England
that second goal at 90+11 was a potential tiebreaker
In comment 15921620 bluefin said:
Quote:
Maybe it’s early and my brain isn’t functioning but why would we need a draw today?
of course a win is ideal, but USA would be glad to least salvage a point vs a monster club like England
We need go for it. Fuck it
Also, a draw today doesn't do much for us as far as advancing. We'd still need to beat Iran. Presents an interesting dilemma for Berhalter. Do you set up more aggressively to try to get a win which would put us in a position to only need a draw against Iran to advance and even potentially win the group? Or do we want to sit deep and make sure, at worst, we don't concede much and hurt our goal differential heading into the last day.
Today's game is kind of just a bonus.
We can't finish level with Iran no matter what. So no need to worry about their goal difference.
There have been far bigger upsets than USA over England in sports. We have real players that are good. We should go out there and try to win.
I agree - didn't Berhalter said they would not sit back, but would be aggressive. I did not see the Wales game - was on the road.
Quote:
Goal that Iran got handed by the referee late in the England game doesn’t end up being a factor.
We can't finish level with Iran no matter what. So no need to worry about their goal difference.
Lol good point I’m dumb.
I did not watch the game this AM but losing to Iran is pretty bad.
No. And Iran isn't an Arab country.
The Saudis are the only Arab team to win a game so far. Iran isn’t considered to be an Arab country, and even if you include them, their victory was mostly due to the Welsh playing a man down. Morocco and Tunisia have played well though.
Quote:
But an abnormal number of Arab countries seem to be pulling upsets in Qatar no?
The Saudis are the only Arab team to win a game so far. Iran isn’t considered to be an Arab country, and even if you include them, their victory was mostly due to the Welsh playing a man down. Morocco and Tunisia have played well though.
Misworded that. Don’t watch much soccer so was just curious
Stop the overlaps, clog midfield and you can beat England without Kane. Old-school blood and guts United States game. Let's go.
Stout would be great too, but most of the bars around there will be good
The bad is that Iran is obviously better than we thought and just beat a team we tied by 2-0. Also England mopped the floor with Iran, so that doesn't bode well for today versus England
Quote:
In comment 15921827 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
But an abnormal number of Arab countries seem to be pulling upsets in Qatar no?
The Saudis are the only Arab team to win a game so far. Iran isn’t considered to be an Arab country, and even if you include them, their victory was mostly due to the Welsh playing a man down. Morocco and Tunisia have played well though.
Misworded that. Don’t watch much soccer so was just curious
Quote:
But an abnormal number of Arab countries seem to be pulling upsets in Qatar no?
The Saudis are the only Arab team to win a game so far. Iran isn’t considered to be an Arab country, and even if you include them, their victory was mostly due to the Welsh playing a man down. Morocco and Tunisia have played well though.
And Morocco and Tunisia aren't real Arab countries either. More like Berber countries who have Arabic speaker.
The bad is that Iran is obviously better than we thought and just beat a team we tied by 2-0. Also England mopped the floor with Iran, so that doesn't bode well for today versus England
Wales vs Iran was 0-0 until Wales’ keeper was red carded.
Unless we win today, Iran is win or go home.
The bad is that Iran is obviously better than we thought and just beat a team we tied by 2-0. Also England mopped the floor with Iran, so that doesn't bode well for today versus England
I don’t think FOX is right with that graphic.
If we somehow won today and lost vs. Iran, we would be out with an English win over Wales. Both England and Iran would have 6 points, while we would have only 4.
If we lose today and beat Iran, we almost certainly go through with 4 points unless Wales beat England by enough on GD to go over us.
What prompted the ejection?
link with video
Link - ( New Window )
What prompted the ejection?
Goalie came out of the box to defend a great long ball that was going to lead to a breakaway, attacking player tapped ball past him and he demolished attacking player. It all happened fast and didn't seem intentional/late, but he caught none of the ball and he ruined the guy.
Honestly
The risk of aggressive play is that there are several Americans on yellow cards and no matter the outcome today these kids are needed against Iran. McKennie, Dest and Ream in particular could be susceptible to another yellow through over-aggressive play. For that reason even though it would not b great, I could understand Berhalter pulling all of the front line players with yellows if the US falls behind by 2 goals.
The risk of aggressive play is that there are several Americans on yellow cards and no matter the outcome today these kids are needed against Iran. McKennie, Dest and Ream in particular could be susceptible to another yellow through over-aggressive play. For that reason even though it would not b great, I could understand Berhalter pulling all of the front line players with yellows if the US falls behind by 2 goals.
yeah, the "aggressive" part of their game should mean a higher-variance style of play, but they need to be very smart on their challenges.
Quote:
was deserved. It was a late challenge outside of the box .
link with video Link - ( New Window )
Thanks for the link!
Quote:
Was that the first straight red of the tournament?
What prompted the ejection?
Goalie came out of the box to defend a great long ball that was going to lead to a breakaway, attacking player tapped ball past him and he demolished attacking player. It all happened fast and didn't seem intentional/late, but he caught none of the ball and he ruined the guy.
Honestly
Yes ugly challenge indeed.
They would be like the Giants resting their starters against the Eagles. You can expect a trashbag move like that from the Eagles, but not England.
Need to go all out against England. Their weakness is the back line.
The key will be who controls the midfield
Need to go all out against England. Their weakness is the back line.
The key will be who controls the midfield
The US has never had a world class striker. When we get one, attitudes about soccer will change in the US.
Keep the shape
Football takes a lot of them. If your big and fast in America, usually you play football.
England flipping and flopping.
Quote:
Hard to stack up with top Euro sides when we cede a big size advantage
Football takes a lot of them. If your big and fast in America, usually you play football.
True. No doubt.
match day.
It’s never a hard number. Time ends when the threat of a goal is over.
match day.
Is your concern that there is too much bad blood between them? So that collusion would be more unlikely than usual?
I like him on counters.
Being small is tough though- not a threat on set pieces and we don't have much of a chance attacking high crosses.
I still think we're going to lose, but that was the 1st half I was hoping for.
Quote:
that two British teams be in the same group, and not only are England and Wales in the same group, the play each other on the final
match day.
Is your concern that there is too much bad blood between them? So that collusion would be more unlikely than usual?
Collusion.
Quote:
If there was 1 minute of stoppage overtime, why was England allowed to take the corner kick when the clock was at 46:05?
It’s never a hard number. Time ends when the threat of a goal is over.
And sometimes they add additional time during the stoppage.
There’s enormous implications. A win here means a tie is all that is needed against Iran. A loss rather than a tie means we have to care about Wales v England.
you’re on the money
Good call.
Here he comes.
Agreed
Venezuelan Jesús Valenzuela is the ref today. - ( New Window )
Quote:
the ref against Wales
Agreed
Venezuelan Jesús Valenzuela is the ref today. - ( New Window )
He ought to moonlight with the NFL
Musah foul late, however soft, was also dumb.
Berhalter has to be WAY more aggressive with his subs because the US are basically a speed and effort group. Once that wanes in the second half, the chances start drying up.
If you can’t beat Iran, then you don’t deserve to advance. Get it done.
1st half, I didn't see ENG MF outplaying USA at all; other than maybe minutes 7 - 12, I thought US midfielders had far the better of the play
And I still disagree with the notion the idea USA went into a shell in 2H vs Wales; minutes 45 - 70, thought it was much in line with 1H; they began to wear down, Wales remained patient.
What did happen in 2H vs Wales, as again today, USA creates some runs, finding seams vs back line and get it in deep, but make either blind passes back into the area right to defenders, as if passes back into the area are automatically threatening. The MFs or backs getting to the 18 are not doing a good enough job getting to space and the possession is wasted with a mis-timed, mis-aimed delivery.
This. Very solid game, but Dest especially makes me hold my. breath. That said, congrats to the team for a well-played game that shut up the English sports pundits who predicted a blowout for England.
Great game.
USA looked like they belonged which is refreshing.
Real good game for the US. We were on even footing with one of the best teams in the world. This was not a hold on and pray for a draw - it was a true back and forth game.
Ultimately we were always going to have to get a win against Wales and/or Iran. That's still the case. Destiny is in our hands. Beat Iran.
We're ranked 16th, Iran's ranked 20th, Wales is ranked 19th (England is ranked 5th), so they're similar. Gareth Bale, of course, is the man.
FIFA Men's World Rankings - Oct. 6th (latest) - ( New Window )
Turner,Ream, Robinson,Pulisic, Adams, Dest, Musah and McKinnie really played good games.Weah didn’t have the same impact in this game
USMNT lacks a WC striker unfortunately
Turner,Ream, Robinson,Pulisic, Adams, Dest, Musah and McKinnie really played good games.Weah didn’t have the same impact in this game
USMNT lacks a WC striker unfortunately
Our BIGGEST need, by far.
Need to figure out how to finish fast. That being said I’m pretty damn encouraged by what this group can accomplish with a WC on home turf. Very poised today.
Link - ( New Window )
Haha. I'm reading the various papers in England. The London Times condemns the English team, whereas the Yorkshire Post (which covers Leeds) are all about how Tyler Adams was man of the match.
Yup, this is the problem - Iran only needs a tie.
But if we score first, their gameplan may go out the window.
We need a goal, and to score first.
Never got the Mason Mount love, and Southgate is not a good tactician. Another game the US could have won with a decent striker and a better RB.
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Our midfield totally outplayed England’s midfield. A big surprise.
Never got the Mason Mount love, and Southgate is not a good tactician. Another game the US could have won with a decent striker and a better RB.
English press and fans are killing Southgate over todays match. Saying he plays it too safe to get through, rather than just turn them lose and play to Englands strengths. Also pissed over his player selection, especially Mount over Foden.
The contrast with the talent the Brazilian, Spanish, Argentinian and French squads are fielding is a mike wide.
It was the first time I’d seen either the US or UK squads play. I’m a pretty serious soccer fan and, to my fan eyes, the US team was clearly the superior squad and actually should have won. In any case, the passing skill and speed the US team was showing was on another level compared to the clumsiness and physicality of the teams a decade ago. Our soccer culture is really making progress.
Not if Wales wins.
The contrast with the talent the Brazilian, Spanish, Argentinian and French squads are fielding is a mike wide.
It was the first time I’d seen either the US or UK squads play. I’m a pretty serious soccer fan and, to my fan eyes, the US team was clearly the superior squad and actually should have won. In any case, the passing skill and speed the US team was showing was on another level compared to the clumsiness and physicality of the teams a decade ago. Our soccer culture is really making progress.
That the matchup was fairly even. Give England Q1 and Q4 and the US squad was better during Q2 & Q3 (if broken in quarters).
Momentum at end with England though and wouldn't be surprised if they put in a goal if it went 5 minutes more. Did their subs give them more of a spark than the US substitutions?
Musah and Pulisic went the full game.
Once again Tyler Adams was the man of the match. The USMNT is challenged in finishing and scoring goals. It's a concern!!!