Dallas ended up driving down for a score when it should have been a punt. Giants likely would not be going for 4th and 1 on the next drive, which led to another 7 pts for dallas
The refs unquestionably had a very bad game. Completely inconsistent with both the holding and the PI calls. Lamb was flopping and throwing his hand up on every route he ran and if they saw that they just called something.
The most telling part of the night was the detailed explanation on the Dallas challenge where the ref told an entire story of the play instead of just making the call. He was really relishing his moment in the sun and it was clear he wanted to be part of the show.
especially considering some very egregious holdings on Thibbs that went on called (at least two). The league also needs to review the penalty on offensive linemen being too far down the field. If it doesn't impact the play then what is the value of that penalty?
Didn't Parcells say something like you have to be good enough to beat your opponent and the bad calls? We weren't yesterday. On to Washington.
...the contact did occur 5.0001 yards beyond the line of scrimmage.
I think that was the illegal contact 5.0001 yards past the line, which was dubious. I think the hold was right off the LoS and of course there was no hold...Pereira himself was mystified...
Holmes has a reputation for holding and it's well founded.
should fall down more often. That was the only time he got the holding call.
Said last night that Leo Williams got a call when he went down when be strangled, yet on the play before Thibs was held just as badly but tried to play through it and nothing was called.
I think most officiating crews are impartial until they get to Dallas
The crowd and the whole atmosphere of a game in Dallas, especially on Thanksgiving, gives the Cowboys a big advantage.
Also, being the home team for a Thursday game is a big advantage because the team gets an extra full day of practice compared to the road team. This is a bigger advantage than late in the season when two teams may each play games on a Sunday and then play each other on the following Saturday when the road team may have to give up one off-day in order to get in a full week of practice.
Its inarguable that it had an impact. Not only did Dallas score but it was an extremely long drive. Something I haven’t seen mentioned here but I originally thought when we went for it on 4th - Daboll knows his defense is gassed and stands no chance if we put them right back on the field.
It backfired big time, may not have been his thinking but my gut said it played a part
RE: Holmes has a reputation for holding and it's well founded.
Bad calls happen in every game, whining about it is for losers. They had chances on a 3rd and 12 and 3rd and 15 to force them off the field with a FG. They didn’t make plays. They also didn’t score a point after this game until garbage time. The impact of this play isn’t worthy of the complaining.
Dallas ended up driving down for a score when it should have been a punt. Giants likely would not be going for 4th and 1 on the next drive, which led to another 7 pts for dallas
I think Barkley’s drop on 4th and 1 was the bigger momentum swing.
Very play “impacts” the game to differing degrees. That call was significant no doubt, but it did not decide the game. The most crucial play of the night was the 4th and 1 where Barkely was completely uncovered and our two “star” players couldn’t execute a routine play that could have gone the distance and completely changed the game. You can’t miss those plays in crucial situations and our guys did. That’s how you lose games.
Bad calls happen in every game, whining about it is for losers. They had chances on a 3rd and 12 and 3rd and 15 to force them off the field with a FG. They didn’t make plays. They also didn’t score a point after this game until garbage time. The impact of this play isn’t worthy of the complaining.
Yes bad calls happen - this was not a bad call - it was beyond bad - appeared to be a guess...and sometimes it is not just "a" bad call, but a few(or non-calls). Yes I agree they had two other chances to stop the drive, including Thibs running right past Dak.
When you have a team that is on a thin edge with no margin for error, clearly improper calls do make a monumental difference.
There’s definitely truth to the whole “can’t blame it on the refs” mentality, but the fact of the matter is that bad officiating seems to have an impact on at least one or two games every week. Surely there’s a better way (and don’t call me Shirley).
I guess it’s just another one of those “if people keep watching and showing up to games, why spend time and money trying to improve something that doesn’t need fixing” for the NFL.
There’s definitely truth to the whole “can’t blame it on the refs” mentality, but the fact of the matter is that bad officiating seems to have an impact on at least one or two games every week. Surely there’s a better way (and don’t call me Shirley).
I guess it’s just another one of those “if people keep watching and showing up to games, why spend time and money trying to improve something that doesn’t need fixing” for the NFL.
Of course it can get fixed. Like I mentioned in the other thread, Mara is on the competition committee- if he wants it fixed he can get it fixed. The first step is making them full time employees so they can spend the time in between games and the offseason being better at their job, but that would require more money out of the owners pockets.
should fall down more often. That was the only time he got the holding call.
There is something to this. Lamb was imitating a flounder on dock all night and he got a lot of calls because of it.
If the league takes anything away from ways to improve officiating, it would be to institute (and use) a flopping penalty like hockey has. Throw flags on the histrionics and folks will stop doing it and refs will stop being confused by it.
should fall down more often. That was the only time he got the holding call.
There is something to this. Lamb was imitating a flounder on dock all night and he got a lot of calls because of it.
If the league takes anything away from ways to improve officiating, it would be to institute (and use) a flopping penalty like hockey has. Throw flags on the histrionics and folks will stop doing it and refs will stop being confused by it.
should fall down more often. That was the only time he got the holding call.
There is something to this. Lamb was imitating a flounder on dock all night and he got a lot of calls because of it.
If the league takes anything away from ways to improve officiating, it would be to institute (and use) a flopping penalty like hockey has. Throw flags on the histrionics and folks will stop doing it and refs will stop being confused by it.
I have often thought they should penalize players for asking for flags...it has gone to another level the last couple years. But perhaps a warning to that player 1st, next one is 15 yards unsportsmanlike...
Because it would mean too many star QBs getting 15 yard penalties
I would love to see it. How many QBs slide at the last minute at a defenders legs and when the guys falls on him, comes up screaming for a flag? Even a 5 yard penalty that negates the play will stop that quickly.
just digusting to have to watch that. I don't care whether they "impacted" the game or not. (Obviously they did.) It's not fair to the players, the coaches or the fans. Terrible product, unfortunately I'm addicted to watching the Giants.
just digusting to have to watch that. I don't care whether they "impacted" the game or not. (Obviously they did.) It's not fair to the players, the coaches or the fans. Terrible product, unfortunately I'm addicted to watching the Giants.
Well you can’t really expect to watch any sporting event and not see plenty of missed calls or phantom calls. That is just part of having humans be refs. They legit just don’t see some things from where they are standing, and sometimes just think they see something they didn’t (like accident witnesses).
The league should make these jobs full time and pay them really well so there is a demand for the position. That will make it easier to drum out bad refs and make the others really work at being good at it.
Because it would mean too many star QBs getting 15 yard penalties
I would love to see it. How many QBs slide at the last minute at a defenders legs and when the guys falls on him, comes up screaming for a flag? Even a 5 yard penalty that negates the play will stop that quickly.
There’s a difference between blaming the refs on a loss and hoping that you get a fairly called game where huge important moments aren’t swung in a particular direction. Which is what happened yesterday. Did the Giants lose because of the refs? No, absolutely not.
The league should make these jobs full time and pay them really well so there is a demand for the position. That will make it easier to drum out bad refs and make the others really work at being good at it.
I feel like it being part time makes it more a status thing and kind of a brag at the office.
The league should make these jobs full time and pay them really well so there is a demand for the position. That will make it easier to drum out bad refs and make the others really work at being good at it.
I feel like it being part time makes it more a status thing and kind of a brag at the office.
And you only have to avoid being the absolute worst to keep the job. Maybe you don’t get to work the Super Bowl if you are below average but you get to keep the job.
Imagine if 10 people were working their asses off behind you to take your job? It might step up your focus a little bit.
I didn’t see the game, but heard there was more then one poor penalty called. It’s been a weekly occurrence all year against the Giants. I’m sure it happens in most other games too, but obviously our focus is on this team.
the team, but almost every tight game he gets tagged with penalty. Most of the time (my opinion) there's good video. Wish he'd learn from his mistakes.
Dallas ended up driving down for a score when it should have been a punt. Giants likely would not be going for 4th and 1 on the next drive, which led to another 7 pts for dallas
I think Barkley’s drop on 4th and 1 was the bigger momentum swing.
Dallas ended up driving down for a score when it should have been a punt. Giants likely would not be going for 4th and 1 on the next drive, which led to another 7 pts for dallas
I think Barkley’s drop on 4th and 1 was the bigger momentum swing.
You mean Jones poor pass on 4th and 1 right?
No he was right, it was a brutal drop…
NFL officiating is beyond putrid and always has been.
Spot on! Officials are more prone to flag the visiting team than the cowturds. I think it has become an expected practice and teams prepare for the bad calls.
For reference, NFL referees are paid $205,000 per year.
You can certainly support a family on that and it’s a lot for a part-time position, so there’s already a financial incentive for people to seek the spots.
I’m not sure what making it a full-time job would add. Proponents of making it full time need to detail exactly how it would help.
Suspect the issue isnt financial at all but the selection and retention aspect of managing the officiating crews. The “make it full time” sounds like an illustration of Mencken’s line about simple popular solutions.
Then there’s the possibility that NFL officiating is a very difficult job and the NFL refs are actually really good at it…
Dallas ended up driving down for a score when it should have been a punt. Giants likely would not be going for 4th and 1 on the next drive, which led to another 7 pts for dallas
The most telling part of the night was the detailed explanation on the Dallas challenge where the ref told an entire story of the play instead of just making the call. He was really relishing his moment in the sun and it was clear he wanted to be part of the show.
Didn't Parcells say something like you have to be good enough to beat your opponent and the bad calls? We weren't yesterday. On to Washington.
I think that was the illegal contact 5.0001 yards past the line, which was dubious. I think the hold was right off the LoS and of course there was no hold...Pereira himself was mystified...
And not sure what Jesus Christ has to do with any of it.
2nd and 23 and Dallas rushed for 11 I knew they were gonna convert. No excuse for the defense on that.
Said last night that Leo Williams got a call when he went down when be strangled, yet on the play before Thibs was held just as badly but tried to play through it and nothing was called.
Also, being the home team for a Thursday game is a big advantage because the team gets an extra full day of practice compared to the road team. This is a bigger advantage than late in the season when two teams may each play games on a Sunday and then play each other on the following Saturday when the road team may have to give up one off-day in order to get in a full week of practice.
Its inarguable that it had an impact. Not only did Dallas score but it was an extremely long drive. Something I haven’t seen mentioned here but I originally thought when we went for it on 4th - Daboll knows his defense is gassed and stands no chance if we put them right back on the field.
It backfired big time, may not have been his thinking but my gut said it played a part
And not sure what Jesus Christ has to do with any of it.
Maybe if we can get him to be on our side we will be a better team quicker
Bad calls happen in every game, whining about it is for losers. They had chances on a 3rd and 12 and 3rd and 15 to force them off the field with a FG. They didn’t make plays. They also didn’t score a point after this game until garbage time. The impact of this play isn’t worthy of the complaining.
Dallas ended up driving down for a score when it should have been a punt. Giants likely would not be going for 4th and 1 on the next drive, which led to another 7 pts for dallas
I think Barkley’s drop on 4th and 1 was the bigger momentum swing.
Very play “impacts” the game to differing degrees. That call was significant no doubt, but it did not decide the game. The most crucial play of the night was the 4th and 1 where Barkely was completely uncovered and our two “star” players couldn’t execute a routine play that could have gone the distance and completely changed the game. You can’t miss those plays in crucial situations and our guys did. That’s how you lose games.
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But this had “no impact” on the game.
Bad calls happen in every game, whining about it is for losers. They had chances on a 3rd and 12 and 3rd and 15 to force them off the field with a FG. They didn’t make plays. They also didn’t score a point after this game until garbage time. The impact of this play isn’t worthy of the complaining.
Yes bad calls happen - this was not a bad call - it was beyond bad - appeared to be a guess...and sometimes it is not just "a" bad call, but a few(or non-calls). Yes I agree they had two other chances to stop the drive, including Thibs running right past Dak.
When you have a team that is on a thin edge with no margin for error, clearly improper calls do make a monumental difference.
I guess it’s just another one of those “if people keep watching and showing up to games, why spend time and money trying to improve something that doesn’t need fixing” for the NFL.
I guess it’s just another one of those “if people keep watching and showing up to games, why spend time and money trying to improve something that doesn’t need fixing” for the NFL.
Of course it can get fixed. Like I mentioned in the other thread, Mara is on the competition committee- if he wants it fixed he can get it fixed. The first step is making them full time employees so they can spend the time in between games and the offseason being better at their job, but that would require more money out of the owners pockets.
There is something to this. Lamb was imitating a flounder on dock all night and he got a lot of calls because of it.
If the league takes anything away from ways to improve officiating, it would be to institute (and use) a flopping penalty like hockey has. Throw flags on the histrionics and folks will stop doing it and refs will stop being confused by it.
Quote:
should fall down more often. That was the only time he got the holding call.
There is something to this. Lamb was imitating a flounder on dock all night and he got a lot of calls because of it.
If the league takes anything away from ways to improve officiating, it would be to institute (and use) a flopping penalty like hockey has. Throw flags on the histrionics and folks will stop doing it and refs will stop being confused by it.
Good idea.
Quote:
should fall down more often. That was the only time he got the holding call.
There is something to this. Lamb was imitating a flounder on dock all night and he got a lot of calls because of it.
If the league takes anything away from ways to improve officiating, it would be to institute (and use) a flopping penalty like hockey has. Throw flags on the histrionics and folks will stop doing it and refs will stop being confused by it.
I have often thought they should penalize players for asking for flags...it has gone to another level the last couple years. But perhaps a warning to that player 1st, next one is 15 yards unsportsmanlike...
I would love to see it. How many QBs slide at the last minute at a defenders legs and when the guys falls on him, comes up screaming for a flag? Even a 5 yard penalty that negates the play will stop that quickly.
I expect a fairly called game. Why is that a problem?
Well you can’t really expect to watch any sporting event and not see plenty of missed calls or phantom calls. That is just part of having humans be refs. They legit just don’t see some things from where they are standing, and sometimes just think they see something they didn’t (like accident witnesses).
The league should make these jobs full time and pay them really well so there is a demand for the position. That will make it easier to drum out bad refs and make the others really work at being good at it.
Quote:
Because it would mean too many star QBs getting 15 yard penalties
I would love to see it. How many QBs slide at the last minute at a defenders legs and when the guys falls on him, comes up screaming for a flag? Even a 5 yard penalty that negates the play will stop that quickly.
That Eli Apple play on Wentz still haunts me
The league should make these jobs full time and pay them really well so there is a demand for the position. That will make it easier to drum out bad refs and make the others really work at being good at it.
I feel like it being part time makes it more a status thing and kind of a brag at the office.
Quote:
The league should make these jobs full time and pay them really well so there is a demand for the position. That will make it easier to drum out bad refs and make the others really work at being good at it.
I feel like it being part time makes it more a status thing and kind of a brag at the office.
And you only have to avoid being the absolute worst to keep the job. Maybe you don’t get to work the Super Bowl if you are below average but you get to keep the job.
Imagine if 10 people were working their asses off behind you to take your job? It might step up your focus a little bit.
really F***ing pissed me off. Big time.
And not sure what Jesus Christ has to do with any of it.
Lighten up, Francis.
Minor correction: 5.0002 yards beyond LOS.
But other than that:🤦♂️.
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But that changed the momentum of the entire game.
Dallas ended up driving down for a score when it should have been a punt. Giants likely would not be going for 4th and 1 on the next drive, which led to another 7 pts for dallas
I think Barkley’s drop on 4th and 1 was the bigger momentum swing.
You mean Jones poor pass on 4th and 1 right?
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In comment 15921707 rsmith32 said:
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But that changed the momentum of the entire game.
Dallas ended up driving down for a score when it should have been a punt. Giants likely would not be going for 4th and 1 on the next drive, which led to another 7 pts for dallas
I think Barkley’s drop on 4th and 1 was the bigger momentum swing.
You mean Jones poor pass on 4th and 1 right?
No he was right, it was a brutal drop…
I didn't see that. I saw Lamb raise his hand because he had a step.
I don't like this call either, but did look like he pulled his jersey, could be what they saw.
I’m not sure what making it a full-time job would add. Proponents of making it full time need to detail exactly how it would help.
Suspect the issue isnt financial at all but the selection and retention aspect of managing the officiating crews. The “make it full time” sounds like an illustration of Mencken’s line about simple popular solutions.
Then there’s the possibility that NFL officiating is a very difficult job and the NFL refs are actually really good at it…