A real, legitimate #1 receiver, and then we will know. I am willing to bet that Jones would put up Jalen Hurts type numbers if he had an AJ brown on this team. But yea, the Giants should get rid of Jones, draft a green rookie QB, and go 4-13 next year. Or, go with a journeyman like Tyrod Taylor and go 6-11. Brilliant, just brilliant.
He had an excellent game?! What did you expect with no WR's, no TE's, depth at RB, and patchwork OLINE??? The offense lacks so much talent! They have pretty much nothing.. I'm even surprised they almost beat Washington and they have much more talent on offense! To make things worse the defense is also lacking talent. smh..
I don't know how we have no intermediate passing game. Every throw felt within three yards of the LOS or 20 plus yards down field. I'm sure I'm exaggerating but it's frustrating not to be able to get 8-15 yards passing.
With the idea that Jones is who he is and that might not be enough to get us over the hump but to not acknowledge the cowardly play calling at the end of each half is beyond the pale
Either you want to evaluate the QB or not.
Have you asked yourself why? Coaches who work with DJ on a daily basis and know his limitations make those calls. DJ is the reason this offense is so dumbed-down.
Ron Rivera put the game in the hands of his UDFA QB and he delivered. Kafka and Daboll wouldn’t be caught dead doing the same with Jones. That’s all you need to know. Don’t want to hear about OLs or receivers, Jones is a starter for his legs only. He’s not adequate in any other area. Take the last play. MY desperately needed 5 more yards. He knew Washington would bring pressure, yet when he took the snap he had no clue and threw the ball away in desperation. Gano’s FG would have been good from 53. Seen all I have to and I bet they have too.
Where was he suppose to throw to and was the Washington D laying down so he can make the throw?
I'm sure you're a nice guy, appreciate you being a mod and a loyal Giants fan. But, you don't anything insightful. Glad you're done with Jones. You can relax now.
Ron Rivera put the game in the hands of his UDFA QB and he delivered. Kafka and Daboll wouldn’t be caught dead doing the same with Jones. That’s all you need to know. Don’t want to hear about OLs or receivers, Jones is a starter for his legs only. He’s not adequate in any other area. Take the last play. MY desperately needed 5 more yards. He knew Washington would bring pressure, yet when he took the snap he had no clue and threw the ball away in desperation. Gano’s FG would have been good from 53. Seen all I have to and I bet they have too.
That’s all we need to know?? You didn’t tell us anything.
So, who are we going to sign this off season? Who is taking us to "the promised land"?
I want to know because there are many teams that need a QB like that. We will need to get a jump on it.
If it is not a free agent and instead, someone in the draft, then who is it? If that guy is going to go in the top 10, then we need to be sure that we are able to trade up that far.
We have to make a decision on Jones before the draft... correct?
One really bad series where Slayton dropped a ball that would have gotten him into almost FG range.
Well, in the most important game of his career, he started it out fumbling the ball and turning it over on the first drive, giving the ball to Washington in Giants territory.
When game time is on the line in the 4th Quarter -- he bumbles the play.
I don't think that's what a franchise championship QB does when the pressure is on.
Brady, Rogers, Allen, Mahomes… have all had fumbles. DJ has cleaned up the mistakes. It’s unreasonable to expect him to be completely infallible
Just put the ball in Brock Purdys hands to drive down the field for a TD before half. Yea his weapons are better, but it’s also Brock Purdy.
I saw a WR screen to Deebo in which he should’ve been tackled 4 yards behind the LOS, but he broke the tackle and turned it into a 7 yard gain. Talent matters.
As for “trust”, there have been plenty of times they’ve trusted him (third and longs, for example) and other times where they just appear to give up. Even if they “trusted” Jones, which is up for debate, would you trust anyone else on the offense not wearing #26?
I have nothing against Jones. He is who he is. Today was just further proof of that. If people are holding out hope for him to be more than you're just wasting your breath. I jumped shipped when the new regime arrived.
The good news is I think the staff feels that way. Between not picking up 5th year option and not really trusting him in big spots, I think they're doing the best they can to make sure Jones doesn't lose games for them. It's worked much of season.
But, they'll move on IMO. He's not the QB to build around.
Ron Rivera put the game in the hands of his UDFA QB and he delivered. Kafka and Daboll wouldn’t be caught dead doing the same with Jones. That’s all you need to know. Don’t want to hear about OLs or receivers, Jones is a starter for his legs only. He’s not adequate in any other area. Take the last play. MY desperately needed 5 more yards. He knew Washington would bring pressure, yet when he took the snap he had no clue and threw the ball away in desperation. Gano’s FG would have been good from 53. Seen all I have to and I bet they have too.
He didn’t just need five yards. He needed 5 yards plus getting out of bounds as we had no timeouts.
RE: RE: The Giants need to move on from Jones and Barkley
Heinicke looked better than Jones.
Robinson looked better than Barkley.
I don’t agree on Jones today. Jones stepped up big time after the fumble. And Slayton dropped yet another pass in a big spot, which likely leads to clock run off and a FG to win the game.
I don't know how we have no intermediate passing game. Every throw felt within three yards of the LOS or 20 plus yards down field. I'm sure I'm exaggerating but it's frustrating not to be able to get 8-15 yards passing.
Because those are the hardest throws. The offense is designed for extremely short throws to targets right in front of Jones and the occasional go ball, which also requires zero decion making.
When we were down 10-0 what did we do? Our bread and butter - bootleg, Jones throws 3 yards in the air to someone right in front of him.
There is no NFL offense that asks less from their QB in the passing game than the Giants.
Where would you rank Jones among Giants quarterbacks since 1980?
I would rank him after Eli and Simms and ahead of Collins. I don’t think the difference between Simms and Jones is that different.
From my username: I thought Eli was elite.
Key difference between Simms and Jones: deep passing. Both are tough and competitive. My biggest knock on Jones is that he does not take deep shots against zones as often as I would like despite demonstrating a high level of accuracy. I think this is more due to play design and game strategy to give this team the best chance to win.
Collins was good, but a fragile quarterback. When things were going right he was truly amazing (e.g. Vikings playoff game) but he caved easily when things were tough (e.g. Baltimore Super Bowl).
In the last 40+ years, Jones is in the top 2-4 quarterbacks that the Giants have had. Until you have someone with a high probability of being better, I think you try and sign or tag him.
that is based partly on blaming Jones for the James mistake is ridiculous. I really would love to know how that opinion is formed. Do you really think the play called for James and Barkley to cross directly in front of Jones and run into each other?
Because if that's the case, I have a hard time giving any analysis ever offered by you any validity. It's just that ridiculous of a conclusion.
That we are probably better off letting Jones AND Barkley walk.
What’s scary is that Jones played a smart, largely mistake free game. It was a good outing for him. And we couldn’t score points. 13 + a TD from a strip sack deep in WFT territory. Meanwhile, Jones was completing virtually every pass for much of the game. Where are the points?
For those of us knocking our WRs, Slayton made an excellent play on that long reception. And that slant to Sills in the 2nd half had the receiver reaching back to snag the ball.
Let’s not pretend the WRs weren’t helping Jones at times. They were.
I would rank him after Eli and Simms and ahead of Collins. I don’t think the difference between Simms and Jones is that different.
From my username: I thought Eli was elite.
Key difference between Simms and Jones: deep passing. Both are tough and competitive. My biggest knock on Jones is that he does not take deep shots against zones as often as I would like despite demonstrating a high level of accuracy. I think this is more due to play design and game strategy to give this team the best chance to win.
Collins was good, but a fragile quarterback. When things were going right he was truly amazing (e.g. Vikings playoff game) but he caved easily when things were tough (e.g. Baltimore Super Bowl).
In the last 40+ years, Jones is in the top 2-4 quarterbacks that the Giants have had. Until you have someone with a high probability of being better, I think you try and sign or tag him.
This place would have absolutely hated Phil Simms during his early career. And yet...
That we are probably better off letting Jones AND Barkley walk.
What’s scary is that Jones played a smart, largely mistake free game. It was a good outing for him. And we couldn’t score points. 13 + a TD from a strip sack deep in WFT territory. Meanwhile, Jones was completing virtually every pass for much of the game. Where are the points?
For those of us knocking our WRs, Slayton made an excellent play on that long reception. And that slant to Sills in the 2nd half had the receiver reaching back to snag the ball.
Let’s not pretend the WRs weren’t helping Jones at times. They were.
He didn't do much special either. It's not only about avoiding mistakes. it's about making many big plays.
That we are probably better off letting Jones AND Barkley walk.
What’s scary is that Jones played a smart, largely mistake free game. It was a good outing for him. And we couldn’t score points. 13 + a TD from a strip sack deep in WFT territory. Meanwhile, Jones was completing virtually every pass for much of the game. Where are the points?
For those of us knocking our WRs, Slayton made an excellent play on that long reception. And that slant to Sills in the 2nd half had the receiver reaching back to snag the ball.
Let’s not pretend the WRs weren’t helping Jones at times. They were.
He didn't do much special either. It's not only about avoiding mistakes. it's about making many big plays.
Kinda hard to make big plays when you’re tossing deep balls to Darius Slayton instead of Justin Jefferson, AJ Brown, or Tyreek Hill.
Jones may or may not be here next season, but the Giants need a WR corps for whoever the QB is in 2023 and beyond.
He didn't do much special either. It's not only about avoiding mistakes. it's about making many big plays.
Who’s the QB you see around the league consistently making these big plays with a receiving corps similar to the Giants? I’m genuinely interested in your answer.
So many different ways the Giants could have won this game
One of the posters made a point that Jones flaws are more of Omission than Commission.
I continue to think Jones will enjoy a lucrative career as a backup QB. Head coaches trying to get to the playoffs despite an injured starting QB will love what they get from Jones - low errors, running. Outings like today will create a lot of demand for him - as a backup.
I don’t think your comment is very wise because I think his hands were tied once we went up 20-13. So if you are upset with him at that, maybe you should consider the plays being called and who else might get some blame. Kafka for that conservative plan that didn’t allow for first down passes….maybe? Feliciano for that stupid penalty that took us out of FG range maybe? Saquon for going away in the 2nd half…maybe? For whoever was covering Samuel on that 4th down pass…maybe?
I really hate this comment, especially within the first several posts. If you disagree, debate it…. Otherwise why post a throwaway line like this? Does it make you feel cool?
I’m not sure the Giants agree with that, but let’s say they do. That means in one offseason, you’re needing a QB, RB, WR1, WR2, and probably another OL or two. I’m not even talking depth, I’m talking starters on offense.
Then, on defense, you desperately need a LB or two. Probably also need a CB opposite Adoree when he comes back.
You’re talking replacing 7-8 players out of a possible 22 starters. That seems like a lot.
can't be said enough. The "taunting" call was complete bullshit and should be reviewed as to why it was ever made. If making a spooning sign isn't taunting, you should be able to go to your OWN TEAMMATE and muscle up.
The league needs to get it priorities in order and the calls cost us a win today
But Jones played a good game today. He ran the plays that were called, was perfect (aside from a spike) well into the second half, and ran for multiple first downs.
I just don’t understand the hate for the guy. At all.
This is my take.
I get why people are fed up with him—he’s the qb and so people blame him for our anemic offense. But there’s more nuance than that. As you say, the IOL is weak and is the passcatching group is even weaker. A mid-round rookie TE is one of our better weapons. Which other starting qb would put up numbers with this talent?
His passing yards are low but critics also need to factor in his rushing yards.
Jones is not elite, but he’s also not the problem. Get Jones some decent passcatchers and let’s see what he does.
RE: RE: Where would you rank Jones among Giants quarterbacks since 1980?
In comment 15932567 Peter from NH (formerly CT) said:
Quote:
In comment 15932551 I_Believe_In_Eli said:
Quote:
I would rank him after Eli and Simms and ahead of Collins. I don’t think the difference between Simms and Jones is that different.
From my username: I thought Eli was elite.
Key difference between Simms and Jones: deep passing. Both are tough and competitive. My biggest knock on Jones is that he does not take deep shots against zones as often as I would like despite demonstrating a high level of accuracy. I think this is more due to play design and game strategy to give this team the best chance to win.
Collins was good, but a fragile quarterback. When things were going right he was truly amazing (e.g. Vikings playoff game) but he caved easily when things were tough (e.g. Baltimore Super Bowl).
In the last 40+ years, Jones is in the top 2-4 quarterbacks that the Giants have had. Until you have someone with a high probability of being better, I think you try and sign or tag him.
This place would have absolutely hated Phil Simms during his early career. And yet...
For better or worse, the reality of the cap means that you gotta be sure if you want to commit to a QB's second contract now in a way that it just didn't with Phil Simms.
Jones is OK. He's not awful but he's limited at this stage of his career.
Either you want to evaluate the QB or not.
Have you asked yourself why? Coaches who work with DJ on a daily basis and know his limitations make those calls. DJ is the reason this offense is so dumbed-down.
Where was he suppose to throw to and was the Washington D laying down so he can make the throw?
Quote:
I'm sure you're a nice guy, appreciate you being a mod and a loyal Giants fan. But, you don't anything insightful. Glad you're done with Jones. You can relax now.
Lol.
As if you’re value add.
Awful OP and you in the mix is the real LoL.
That’s all we need to know?? You didn’t tell us anything.
You can't pay them big money to not get it done.
So, who are we going to sign this off season? Who is taking us to "the promised land"?
I want to know because there are many teams that need a QB like that. We will need to get a jump on it.
If it is not a free agent and instead, someone in the draft, then who is it? If that guy is going to go in the top 10, then we need to be sure that we are able to trade up that far.
We have to make a decision on Jones before the draft... correct?
Quote:
One really bad series where Slayton dropped a ball that would have gotten him into almost FG range.
Well, in the most important game of his career, he started it out fumbling the ball and turning it over on the first drive, giving the ball to Washington in Giants territory.
When game time is on the line in the 4th Quarter -- he bumbles the play.
I don't think that's what a franchise championship QB does when the pressure is on.
Any skill guy he has is instantly the Giants best player on offense.
Aiyuk would be the Giants #1 with ease. And we see Cows win with Cooper Rush.
QB matters of course, and we see guys like Hurts who have the best OL in the league and a top WR tandem.
So 2 options take each other out and Daniel Jones is at fault? Huh?
I saw a WR screen to Deebo in which he should’ve been tackled 4 yards behind the LOS, but he broke the tackle and turned it into a 7 yard gain. Talent matters.
As for “trust”, there have been plenty of times they’ve trusted him (third and longs, for example) and other times where they just appear to give up. Even if they “trusted” Jones, which is up for debate, would you trust anyone else on the offense not wearing #26?
You can't pay them big money to not get it done.
Heinicke looked better than Jones.
Robinson looked better than Barkley.
The good news is I think the staff feels that way. Between not picking up 5th year option and not really trusting him in big spots, I think they're doing the best they can to make sure Jones doesn't lose games for them. It's worked much of season.
But, they'll move on IMO. He's not the QB to build around.
Quote:
Time to move on.
Jones had chances to win it and did not.
Your QB has to win it. That simple.
You gotta let him win it….you can’t call fucking qb draws
Nowhere did I say Purdy was good.
Quote:
In comment 15932258 Devour the Day said:
Quote:
Time to move on.
Jones had chances to win it and did not.
Your QB has to win it. That simple.
You gotta let him win it….you can’t call fucking qb draws
There wasn't a single QB draw called.
Jones might be ok here,but we'll find out
As of right now, and based on all of the data we have, that would be very unfortunate.
He didn’t just need five yards. He needed 5 yards plus getting out of bounds as we had no timeouts.
Quote:
They can't get it done.
You can't pay them big money to not get it done.
Heinicke looked better than Jones.
Robinson looked better than Barkley.
I don’t agree on Jones today. Jones stepped up big time after the fumble. And Slayton dropped yet another pass in a big spot, which likely leads to clock run off and a FG to win the game.
Because those are the hardest throws. The offense is designed for extremely short throws to targets right in front of Jones and the occasional go ball, which also requires zero decion making.
When we were down 10-0 what did we do? Our bread and butter - bootleg, Jones throws 3 yards in the air to someone right in front of him.
There is no NFL offense that asks less from their QB in the passing game than the Giants.
From my username: I thought Eli was elite.
Key difference between Simms and Jones: deep passing. Both are tough and competitive. My biggest knock on Jones is that he does not take deep shots against zones as often as I would like despite demonstrating a high level of accuracy. I think this is more due to play design and game strategy to give this team the best chance to win.
Collins was good, but a fragile quarterback. When things were going right he was truly amazing (e.g. Vikings playoff game) but he caved easily when things were tough (e.g. Baltimore Super Bowl).
In the last 40+ years, Jones is in the top 2-4 quarterbacks that the Giants have had. Until you have someone with a high probability of being better, I think you try and sign or tag him.
Because if that's the case, I have a hard time giving any analysis ever offered by you any validity. It's just that ridiculous of a conclusion.
We had live music. We ate the striped bass that we caught on Friday. Good crowd, good weather.
I said to a few folks right before heading into the stadium “I’ve been anti Daniel Jones but today he can make me a believer”
I think it’s time to move on.
What’s scary is that Jones played a smart, largely mistake free game. It was a good outing for him. And we couldn’t score points. 13 + a TD from a strip sack deep in WFT territory. Meanwhile, Jones was completing virtually every pass for much of the game. Where are the points?
For those of us knocking our WRs, Slayton made an excellent play on that long reception. And that slant to Sills in the 2nd half had the receiver reaching back to snag the ball.
Let’s not pretend the WRs weren’t helping Jones at times. They were.
We had live music. We ate the striped bass that we caught on Friday. Good crowd, good weather.
I said to a few folks right before heading into the stadium “I’ve been anti Daniel Jones but today he can make me a believer”
I think it’s time to move on.
thank you
From my username: I thought Eli was elite.
Key difference between Simms and Jones: deep passing. Both are tough and competitive. My biggest knock on Jones is that he does not take deep shots against zones as often as I would like despite demonstrating a high level of accuracy. I think this is more due to play design and game strategy to give this team the best chance to win.
Collins was good, but a fragile quarterback. When things were going right he was truly amazing (e.g. Vikings playoff game) but he caved easily when things were tough (e.g. Baltimore Super Bowl).
In the last 40+ years, Jones is in the top 2-4 quarterbacks that the Giants have had. Until you have someone with a high probability of being better, I think you try and sign or tag him.
Quote:
That we are probably better off letting Jones AND Barkley walk.
What’s scary is that Jones played a smart, largely mistake free game. It was a good outing for him. And we couldn’t score points. 13 + a TD from a strip sack deep in WFT territory. Meanwhile, Jones was completing virtually every pass for much of the game. Where are the points?
For those of us knocking our WRs, Slayton made an excellent play on that long reception. And that slant to Sills in the 2nd half had the receiver reaching back to snag the ball.
Let’s not pretend the WRs weren’t helping Jones at times. They were.
He didn't do much special either. It's not only about avoiding mistakes. it's about making many big plays.
We ate the striped bass that we caught on Friday.
I said to a few folks right before heading into the stadium “I’ve been anti Daniel Jones but today he can make me a believer”
I think it’s time to move on.
Maybe the fish was undercooked? :)
Quote:
In comment 15932541 Sean said:
Quote:
That we are probably better off letting Jones AND Barkley walk.
What’s scary is that Jones played a smart, largely mistake free game. It was a good outing for him. And we couldn’t score points. 13 + a TD from a strip sack deep in WFT territory. Meanwhile, Jones was completing virtually every pass for much of the game. Where are the points?
For those of us knocking our WRs, Slayton made an excellent play on that long reception. And that slant to Sills in the 2nd half had the receiver reaching back to snag the ball.
Let’s not pretend the WRs weren’t helping Jones at times. They were.
He didn't do much special either. It's not only about avoiding mistakes. it's about making many big plays.
Kinda hard to make big plays when you’re tossing deep balls to Darius Slayton instead of Justin Jefferson, AJ Brown, or Tyreek Hill.
Jones may or may not be here next season, but the Giants need a WR corps for whoever the QB is in 2023 and beyond.
He didn't do much special either. It's not only about avoiding mistakes. it's about making many big plays.
Who’s the QB you see around the league consistently making these big plays with a receiving corps similar to the Giants? I’m genuinely interested in your answer.
Franchise tags, extensions, second contracts...forget it.
Move with Phase 2 of the rebuild. We are getting better and let's keep that momentum with different guys that handle the ball.
I continue to think Jones will enjoy a lucrative career as a backup QB. Head coaches trying to get to the playoffs despite an injured starting QB will love what they get from Jones - low errors, running. Outings like today will create a lot of demand for him - as a backup.
I really hate this comment, especially within the first several posts. If you disagree, debate it…. Otherwise why post a throwaway line like this? Does it make you feel cool?
How is anyone comfortable with a long term deal on the hope it changes with different receivers?
Then, on defense, you desperately need a LB or two. Probably also need a CB opposite Adoree when he comes back.
You’re talking replacing 7-8 players out of a possible 22 starters. That seems like a lot.
The league needs to get it priorities in order and the calls cost us a win today
I just don’t understand the hate for the guy. At all.
This is my take.
I get why people are fed up with him—he’s the qb and so people blame him for our anemic offense. But there’s more nuance than that. As you say, the IOL is weak and is the passcatching group is even weaker. A mid-round rookie TE is one of our better weapons. Which other starting qb would put up numbers with this talent?
His passing yards are low but critics also need to factor in his rushing yards.
Jones is not elite, but he’s also not the problem. Get Jones some decent passcatchers and let’s see what he does.
Quote:
I would rank him after Eli and Simms and ahead of Collins. I don’t think the difference between Simms and Jones is that different.
From my username: I thought Eli was elite.
Key difference between Simms and Jones: deep passing. Both are tough and competitive. My biggest knock on Jones is that he does not take deep shots against zones as often as I would like despite demonstrating a high level of accuracy. I think this is more due to play design and game strategy to give this team the best chance to win.
Collins was good, but a fragile quarterback. When things were going right he was truly amazing (e.g. Vikings playoff game) but he caved easily when things were tough (e.g. Baltimore Super Bowl).
In the last 40+ years, Jones is in the top 2-4 quarterbacks that the Giants have had. Until you have someone with a high probability of being better, I think you try and sign or tag him.
This place would have absolutely hated Phil Simms during his early career. And yet...
For better or worse, the reality of the cap means that you gotta be sure if you want to commit to a QB's second contract now in a way that it just didn't with Phil Simms.
Jones is OK. He's not awful but he's limited at this stage of his career.