Saw an article on SB nation that Jones leads the league with 1 drop per 15.8 pass attempts. The talent isnt there. Losing Shep and Robinson was HUGE. The guys playing wouldn't make an NFL roster anywhere. Outside of Slayton who's a #2/3 at best, what do you do? I'd draft 3 or even 4 next year.
When has this ever happened, ever?
Did you happen to notice how good Joe Burrow is? We don't have anybody like that.
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it was a stark reminder how good T. Higgins and L. Chase are. They jumped off the screen. We don't have anybody like that.
Did you happen to notice how good Joe Burrow is? We don't have anybody like that.
Producer, here is a layup for you. Would the Giants be a markedly better team with Tee Higgins and Jamar Chase? Would they have won the game on Sunday if they had those two receivers? Would Jones stat line look a lot better with those two guys? Would Burrow be the same guy with Slayton, James and Hodgkins?
Burrow made some great throws, too.
That 3rd and 10 throw to Higgins to end the game was just brilliant.
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In comment 15934852 markky said:
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it was a stark reminder how good T. Higgins and L. Chase are. They jumped off the screen. We don't have anybody like that.
Did you happen to notice how good Joe Burrow is? We don't have anybody like that.
Producer, here is a layup for you. Would the Giants be a markedly better team with Tee Higgins and Jamar Chase? Would they have won the game on Sunday if they had those two receivers? Would Jones stat line look a lot better with those two guys? Would Burrow be the same guy with Slayton, James and Hodgkins?
Chase is great but Burrow is more important.
I take Burrow and Slayton all day over Jones and Chase. And so would every GM in the NFL.
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In comment 15934854 Producer said:
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In comment 15934852 markky said:
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it was a stark reminder how good T. Higgins and L. Chase are. They jumped off the screen. We don't have anybody like that.
Did you happen to notice how good Joe Burrow is? We don't have anybody like that.
Producer, here is a layup for you. Would the Giants be a markedly better team with Tee Higgins and Jamar Chase? Would they have won the game on Sunday if they had those two receivers? Would Jones stat line look a lot better with those two guys? Would Burrow be the same guy with Slayton, James and Hodgkins?
Chase is great but Burrow is more important.
I take Burrow and Slayton all day over Jones and Chase. And so would every GM in the NFL.
yup. Slayton wouldn't drop a ball coming out of Burrow's hand.
Regarding Jones, he still doesn’t have much to throw to and the middle of the line is only slightly better than last years version. So can you really, truly evaluate him? I still don’t think so. He will only be what he can be when those 2 position are completely shored up. I will say this about him though. He is a gamer. He gives what he has but any NFL team that needs its QB to run for 50 to 60 yards per game to be competitive is kidding itself. That’s D III stuff. This is the NFL.
I like him and he has some ability but I really don’t see him being a top10 QB in the league ever. I think he’s just outside of that with a full ensemble of talent. So the question is still what do you do?
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In comment 15934854 Producer said:
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In comment 15934852 markky said:
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it was a stark reminder how good T. Higgins and L. Chase are. They jumped off the screen. We don't have anybody like that.
Did you happen to notice how good Joe Burrow is? We don't have anybody like that.
Producer, here is a layup for you. Would the Giants be a markedly better team with Tee Higgins and Jamar Chase? Would they have won the game on Sunday if they had those two receivers? Would Jones stat line look a lot better with those two guys? Would Burrow be the same guy with Slayton, James and Hodgkins?
Chase is great but Burrow is more important.
I take Burrow and Slayton all day over Jones and Chase. And so would every GM in the NFL.
Couldn't just answer, is it that painful to go against your narrative. I think Burrow has more potential than Jones, but why is it so hard to simply answer those questions? Has Jones done something to you personally? He's the QB of the Giants, you don't have to love him, like him or want him here but this is why people get frustrated with the whole Jones debate, I know you have an agenda and are not alone, but it is maddening because it's not a debate with a lot of you guys, it's more of a vendetta and honestly who needs that. Who wants to debate against a vendetta. I'll be honest, I think they should bring him back because I don't see how and where they are getting a better option in here next year and I think he can win with some help, but if they let him go at least all this will be over and we can move on.
The drops are a real thing, but I doubt they materially affect the overall evaluation.
This is the best post in this thread. I played the game since I was 5. Coached it for several years between 20 and 35 and I know damn well I’m in no position to evaluate what is going on with the QB. Not one of us knows a route assignment on a given play. What the progressions SHOULD look like and where the ball is hopefully going. I know this place is here because we like to discuss football but more of you need to understand what you don’t know. I promise you it’s a lot more than you do know.
The one thing I do know is this receiver corp is hot garbage at the moment. That cannot be argued.
Good post BBB
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...is that the most important criterion in evaluating him, IMHO, is one that I'm completely unqualified to assess: Is he finding open receivers, when they exist, and delivering the ball to them on time/in space? Even if you gave me unlimited access to the All-22 view, I probably wouldn't know what what to look for. As a casual observation, I think he misses some shots, but it's possible that those occasions stand out because his receivers are rarely open.
The drops are a real thing, but I doubt they materially affect the overall evaluation.
This is the best post in this thread. I played the game since I was 5. Coached it for several years between 20 and 35 and I know damn well I’m in no position to evaluate what is going on with the QB. Not one of us knows a route assignment on a given play. What the progressions SHOULD look like and where the ball is hopefully going. I know this place is here because we like to discuss football but more of you need to understand what you don’t know. I promise you it’s a lot more than you do know.
The one thing I do know is this receiver corp is hot garbage at the moment. That cannot be argued.
Good post BBB
I have the same background as you. Couldn’t say it any better. A discussion is fine, a debate with some of these people is ridiculous.
3 OCs ; 2 coaches later. Winning Giants football. Losing Giants football. Golden Tate , Evan Engram it has been pretty much the same Jones throwing for low yards. Playing in a low risk , super conservative offense. Why is that?
When Manning had Nicks, Manningham, Cruz, Toomer, Barber, Burgess etc. They would turn a 8 yd slant into 60 yards.
This group makes no one miss, they get no separation and have no wiggle.
This is the worst group of WRs I have seen in a while especially for a team that is 7-4.
11 TD passes in 12 games. That does make me miserable...it should make all Giants fans miserable. Some of you want to overpay him and hope he can throw 1 TD per game next year? Is that the goal of the fanboys?
At the beginning of the year, even the fanboys said DJ should put up numbers like a REAL franchise QB. Now that he's not close (AGAIN)...it's "stats don't matter" and excuse-makers looking foolish.
3 OCs ; 2 coaches later. Winning Giants football. Losing Giants football. Golden Tate , Evan Engram it has been pretty much the same Jones throwing for low yards. Playing in a low risk , super conservative offense. Why is that?
Kadarius Toney, Evan Engram and Golden Tate, you can't be serious. Are they just all names in a box score to you? Two were kicked out of NY and one did almost more damage than good or do you forget the multiple balls tht bounced off his hands up in the air for interceptions or were you too busy screaming "F---ing Jones" to see who bounced the ball up in the air so it got picked. The players on the field matter, Jamar Chase has 19 TD's in his short career, many of them he took to the house after short gains. I don't watch all the Bengals games but I'll be generous and say maybe once the ball hit him in the hands, bounced up in the air and was picked.Evan Engram had 16 tds with the Giants and I'm going to say 8 balls bounced off his hands and were picked and I honestly think that is low
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In what world is that guy a #2/3?. At best he's a #4. He drops way too many balls to be anything more than a 4. He just looks alot better than he is because of the slop around him.
do you understand the game, bruh? If there was a #1 on the field, Slayton would be an excellent #2. He’s got nobody taking the heat off him.
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In what world is that guy a #2/3?. At best he's a #4. He drops way too many balls to be anything more than a 4. He just looks alot better than he is because of the slop around him.
do you understand the game, bruh? If there was a #1 on the field, Slayton would be an excellent #2. He’s got nobody taking the heat off him.
No team is going to start a guy who has been top 3 in drop percentage for the last 3 years if they can help it.
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Based on the talent at WR,DJ has done outstanding
Outstanding? You grade very generously.
We're 7-4-1 and he's our best offensive player.
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In comment 15934123 Giants said:
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Based on the talent at WR,DJ has done outstanding
Outstanding? You grade very generously.
We're 7-4-1 and he's our best offensive player.
I can think of two players on offense better than DJ by a WIDE margin, and then the rest of the unit isn't especially good, so being the best of the rest is hardly enough to be considered "outstanding."
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In comment 15934133 Mike from Ohio said:
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In comment 15934123 Giants said:
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Based on the talent at WR,DJ has done outstanding
Outstanding? You grade very generously.
We're 7-4-1 and he's our best offensive player.
I can think of two players on offense better than DJ by a WIDE margin, and then the rest of the unit isn't especially good, so being the best of the rest is hardly enough to be considered "outstanding."
That margin isn't as wide as you think.
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In comment 15934893 Walker Gillette said:
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In comment 15934854 Producer said:
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In comment 15934852 markky said:
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it was a stark reminder how good T. Higgins and L. Chase are. They jumped off the screen. We don't have anybody like that.
Did you happen to notice how good Joe Burrow is? We don't have anybody like that.
Producer, here is a layup for you. Would the Giants be a markedly better team with Tee Higgins and Jamar Chase? Would they have won the game on Sunday if they had those two receivers? Would Jones stat line look a lot better with those two guys? Would Burrow be the same guy with Slayton, James and Hodgkins?
Chase is great but Burrow is more important.
I take Burrow and Slayton all day over Jones and Chase. And so would every GM in the NFL.
Couldn't just answer, is it that painful to go against your narrative. I think Burrow has more potential than Jones, but why is it so hard to simply answer those questions? Has Jones done something to you personally? He's the QB of the Giants, you don't have to love him, like him or want him here but this is why people get frustrated with the whole Jones debate, I know you have an agenda and are not alone, but it is maddening because it's not a debate with a lot of you guys, it's more of a vendetta and honestly who needs that. Who wants to debate against a vendetta. I'll be honest, I think they should bring him back because I don't see how and where they are getting a better option in here next year and I think he can win with some help, but if they let him go at least all this will be over and we can move on.
There is no narrative. It's an opinion. I think Jones is a limited thrower. I would love him to prove me wrong. I'd be happy to eat tons of crow. Don't take it so personally.
I don't want us to be in QB hell with a guy we overpay to be a bottom of the middle tier QB.
Don't we trust our new GM to make him a fair offer based on his production?