For all the DJ fanclub members who don't seem to think DJ is easily replaceable, let me introduce you to Jacobe Brissett, who will be a free agent at the end of the year, and is currently playing for $4.85 million.
Jacobe Brissett stats:
PY/G = 217.2
RY/G = 19.8
TY/G = 237
Total TD/G = 1.17
Passing TD = 12
Rushing TD = 2
Air Y/A = 4.5 (15th)
Daniel Jones stats:
PY/G = 197.1
RY/G = 43.5
TY/G = 240.6
Total TD/G = 1.25
Passing TD = 11
Rushing TD = 4
Air Y/A = 3.8 (35th)
As you can tell, their stats are almost completely identical. Brissett's numbers are slightly skewed because Deshaun Watson played most of the Browns' last game, but both have played in 12 games.
DJ will be a free agent, and according to some, will command $25 (average QBs) - $45.4 (2023 franchise tag) million, and possibly need to be signed to a longterm deal. Why overpay for mediocrity when Jacoby Brissett has played for $5 million, or less, for the last 2 years (both 1 year deals)?
I think even the biggest DJ fans will agree...$5 million seems a lot smarter than $25-45 million, for an average QB, doesn't it? Discuss...
If Brisset is as good as DJ he will also get at least $25MM a year next year. The market will decide.
I would love to get a reasonably good free agent NFL starter, say in the 10 to 20 range for $5MM a year to start for us. I would also love to trade a 2nd round pick for Patrick Mahomes and then renegotiate his contract to $25MM. Also would love to draft the next Eli late in the first round next year and only pay him a rookie contract. See how this works? There is lots of stupid things you can want and propose. They are just not going to happen.
Exactly... I have yet to see a viable replacement option for Jones so far.
Jones is going to get paid because too many teams have QBs that are worse than Jones.
NOBODY has come up with anything other than "go into the season with Tyrod as the starter". If the Giants do that, they are just admitting to the fan base that they are giving up on the season. The only way Tyrod is going to be consistently successful as our QB is if we have a dominant OL and we are gaining 5+ yards on the ground.
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See how this works? There is lots of stupid things you can want and propose. They are just not going to happen.
Exactly... I have yet to see a viable replacement option for Jones so far.
Jones is going to get paid because too many teams have QBs that are worse than Jones.
NOBODY has come up with anything other than "go into the season with Tyrod as the starter". If the Giants do that, they are just admitting to the fan base that they are giving up on the season. The only way Tyrod is going to be consistently successful as our QB is if we have a dominant OL and we are gaining 5+ yards on the ground.
The fact that you overrate Jones doesn’t mean the replacements suggested aren’t viable.
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In comment 15937974 mfjmfj said:
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See how this works? There is lots of stupid things you can want and propose. They are just not going to happen.
Exactly... I have yet to see a viable replacement option for Jones so far.
Jones is going to get paid because too many teams have QBs that are worse than Jones.
NOBODY has come up with anything other than "go into the season with Tyrod as the starter". If the Giants do that, they are just admitting to the fan base that they are giving up on the season. The only way Tyrod is going to be consistently successful as our QB is if we have a dominant OL and we are gaining 5+ yards on the ground.
The fact that you overrate Jones doesn’t mean the replacements suggested aren’t viable.
I do not see where I "rated" him at all in my comment. In fact, I never once on this website said that I am in support of Jones as our long term QB. Not once..
You need to take the emotion out of these decisions and all I am doing is responding to the idea that we can easily replace him with a CHEAPER option that will be just as good. Nobody including the OP has come up with anything. If it is possible, then sign me up.
I thought this was funny and just said that to my wife... not she wont talk to me
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
Draft a QB in 2024
DG screwed the Giants by drafting a QB and rb before the rest of the roster was set. He put the cart before the horse.
Too many holes on the roster to pay Jones and Barkley what they will get as free agents.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
It will be easier to bring in playmakers with a cheaper or rookie qb than it will be after paying DJ.
Hurts and Tua are on rookie contracts, as was Allen when Diggs was brought in.
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All you need is to get Jones a stud #1 WR. Use that #1 draft pick for that, if he is out there. Or pick up as a FA.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
It will be easier to bring in playmakers with a cheaper or rookie qb than it will be after paying DJ.
Hurts and Tua are on rookie contracts, as was Allen when Diggs was brought in.
Hence, the draft.
DJ is not getting tagged with the exclusive franchise tag, under any circumstances. The highest tag level that the Giants would use for him would be the non-exclusive franchise tag, which carries an estimated value of $31.5M for 2023.
This has been explained to you repeatedly.
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All you need is to get Jones a stud #1 WR. Use that #1 draft pick for that, if he is out there. Or pick up as a FA.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
It will be easier to bring in playmakers with a cheaper or rookie qb than it will be after paying DJ.
Hurts and Tua are on rookie contracts, as was Allen when Diggs was brought in.
This isn't remotely true.
Were the Saints #1 on their list? They're the team I think he's most likely to end up on
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
Speaking of obtuse, did you know that DJ is an unrestricted free agent after this season?
How much are you paying him and for how long?
We need a QB that fires on all cylinders during the game but turns it up a notch when the game is on the line and a drive either for a TD or FG is needed.
That is what separates the top tier from the middlings.
Brisset is not that guy.
Viable replacement should DJ command too much money? Sure.
In a perfect world, I want DJ to re-sign for low-moderate dollars to have another chance to step up and/or as a stop gap til we can draft the next QB.
But, IF DJ is going to cost too much, other stop gap vets are available, if not already on the team. IMO, DJ is not worth medium-upper dollars for another round of prove it.
Going by stats alone, absolutely move on. But, the key is whether DJ is giving Daboll what he wants to see, and that's something none of us can know, so there's no point in dying on a hill for/against DJ.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
Giving a clown Academy Award winners to stage a play does not make the clown an Academy Award winning actor. You give the clown Academy Award winners to stage a play when the clown demonstrates acting ability.
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
If Mahomes or Allen was the QB, I feel very comfortable that the overwhelming majority of this board would be at the same place:
Those guys are unquestionably immensely talented - because we would be seeing incredible throws, runs and improvisation - and it makes complete sense to build around them.
It's impossible to say that about Jones unless you are experimenting with hallucinogens.
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In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
If Mahomes or Allen was the QB, I feel very comfortable that the overwhelming majority of this board would be at the same place:
Those guys are unquestionably immensely talented - because we would be seeing incredible throws, runs and improvisation - and it makes complete sense to build around them.
It's impossible to say that about Jones unless you are experimenting with hallucinogens.
It's truly astonishing how people aren't able to recognize obvious differences in raw ability.
Patrick Mahomes would not be AS productive if he was on the Giants, but his skills would still be identifiable.
Josh Allen would not be AS productive if he was on the Giants, but his arm talent and mobility would be obvious to everyone on the planet.
Perhaps more significantly, both the Chiefs and Bills would be worse if Jones was their QB.
Daniel Jones has a lower ceiling than either of those two guys, and anybody who watches other NFL games and not just the Giants can see it plainly.
You think Juju and Toney are "GREAT PLAYERS" and you have the nerve to call anyone else obtuse?
4 fourth quarter comebacks vs 0
His play has been meh, but he still has little to work with.
DJ is a free agent. He's not under contract for 2023.
How much are you paying him and for how long?
I can think of only two things Taylor and Brissett have in common. One of them is that they play QB.
The other is the reason why you think they're similar.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
I don't agree with you that Jones is one great WR away from being a franchise QB.
But I really hope that you are right about all this and I am wrong.
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In comment 15937997 5BowlsSoon said:
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In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
If Mahomes or Allen was the QB, I feel very comfortable that the overwhelming majority of this board would be at the same place:
Those guys are unquestionably immensely talented - because we would be seeing incredible throws, runs and improvisation - and it makes complete sense to build around them.
It's impossible to say that about Jones unless you are experimenting with hallucinogens.
It's truly astonishing how people aren't able to recognize obvious differences in raw ability.
Patrick Mahomes would not be AS productive if he was on the Giants, but his skills would still be identifiable.
Josh Allen would not be AS productive if he was on the Giants, but his arm talent and mobility would be obvious to everyone on the planet.
Perhaps more significantly, both the Chiefs and Bills would be worse if Jones was their QB.
Daniel Jones has a lower ceiling than either of those two guys, and anybody who watches other NFL games and not just the Giants can see it plainly.
Precisely.
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In comment 15937974 mfjmfj said:
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See how this works? There is lots of stupid things you can want and propose. They are just not going to happen.
Exactly... I have yet to see a viable replacement option for Jones so far.
Jones is going to get paid because too many teams have QBs that are worse than Jones.
NOBODY has come up with anything other than "go into the season with Tyrod as the starter". If the Giants do that, they are just admitting to the fan base that they are giving up on the season. The only way Tyrod is going to be consistently successful as our QB is if we have a dominant OL and we are gaining 5+ yards on the ground.
The fact that you overrate Jones doesn’t mean the replacements suggested aren’t viable.
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To see where Brissette ends up next year. Because it won’t be with the Giants unless he’s replacing Tyrod as DJ’s backup! If the coaches didn’t believe in DJ, Tyrod would be starting.
DJ is a free agent. He's not under contract for 2023.
How much are you paying him and for how long?
How did he do with a far superior team ?
Is he a long term solution?
This is not perfect by any means.
Yes you could potentially save money on Brisset but that is not a given. If he is as good as you believe, then his market should be equivalent to Jones. Brisset would likely be looking for a multi year contract. Do you want Brisset as the Giants starting QB for the next few years ? You could place the franchise or transition tag on Jones and get him for one year.
Brisset is not a long term solution at QB so the Giants would have to spend draft capitol on a QB who could develop into the solution.
If the Giants have Brisset you will throw away next year and perhaps the following year.
If Jones is not the QB for the Giants there needs to be a significant upgrade, someone who can be part of the long term solution.
Unfortunately I do not see that QB either as a free agent or as a draft pick.
Brisset is not the perfect to the Giants QB search.
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In comment 15938080 bw in dc said:
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In comment 15937997 5BowlsSoon said:
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In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
If Mahomes or Allen was the QB, I feel very comfortable that the overwhelming majority of this board would be at the same place:
Those guys are unquestionably immensely talented - because we would be seeing incredible throws, runs and improvisation - and it makes complete sense to build around them.
It's impossible to say that about Jones unless you are experimenting with hallucinogens.
It's truly astonishing how people aren't able to recognize obvious differences in raw ability.
Patrick Mahomes would not be AS productive if he was on the Giants, but his skills would still be identifiable.
Josh Allen would not be AS productive if he was on the Giants, but his arm talent and mobility would be obvious to everyone on the planet.
Perhaps more significantly, both the Chiefs and Bills would be worse if Jones was their QB.
Daniel Jones has a lower ceiling than either of those two guys, and anybody who watches other NFL games and not just the Giants can see it plainly.
Precisely.
What does that have to do with anything? So we jettison anyone because they're not potential first ballot HOFs? Nobody has ever claimed that DJ is Allen or Mahomes. But there are about 2 or 3 of those guys in a decade. If you're holding out for that, you'll always be disappointed. The question is whether you have a QB you can win with. That's the appropriate debate
Amari Cooper, Donovan Peoples-Jones, David Bell, David Njoku, Kareem Hunt.
Brissett 2 rushing TD, 4 Fumbles
Jones 4 rushing TD, 2 Fumbles
OL Rankings
Browns #2
Giants #31
OL Power Rankings - ( New Window )
What does that have to do with anything? So we jettison anyone because they're not potential first ballot HOFs? Nobody has ever claimed that DJ is Allen or Mahomes. But there are about 2 or 3 of those guys in a decade. If you're holding out for that, you'll always be disappointed. The question is whether you have a QB you can win with. That's the appropriate debate
Great, and my answer is no. They cannot win anything of significance with Daniel Jones at QB.
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In comment 15938103 ZoneXDOA said:
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To see where Brissette ends up next year. Because it won’t be with the Giants unless he’s replacing Tyrod as DJ’s backup! If the coaches didn’t believe in DJ, Tyrod would be starting.
DJ is a free agent. He's not under contract for 2023.
How much are you paying him and for how long?
I’m not paying him anything! LOL! That 100% up to Schoen and them. I’d be fine with whatever they decide is best for the team. If I were JS, I’d be getting that franchise tag warmed up.
Would it be fair to say that you would let Barkley walk in order to keep DJ?
That's a likely outcome if you use the tag on DJ without an extension in place for Barkley already.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
You can't be serious. The KC unit is so good they had to acquire our sloppy seconds to beef it up. And you unironically mention Toney as an example of how good their unit is.
If we had JJS on this team, there would be a contingent on BBI trying to run him out of town. He's not great.
Mahomes and Allen would be perceived as stars on any team. If you can't admit that their talent would be apparent wherever they played, you're probably so dug in on Jones that you are beyond reason. Jones is not in their zip code, talent-wise.
Jacobe instead of Jacoby.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
Fine, who? What WR? Whenever people suggest that we need to move on from DJ, people ask who exactly he could be replaced with that is better next year (which isn't even the right question to ask). But now I will ask you what stud WR? Sure, they could draft someone, but are you getting a Jefferson or Agholar. And is this rookie going to be a stud from day 1? And if not through the draft, what about the FA WRs? Is the only thing standing between Jones and elite passing stats Jakobi Meyers, or Mecole Hardman? Please name the guy that is going to come in next year, light it up, and turn Jones into the franchise QB you think he is.
If we had JJS on this team, there would be a contingent on BBI trying to run him out of town. He's not great.
The people who think JuJu is some great WR haven't watched football in 4 years, and definitely missed the year when Roethlisberger was out and the Steelers had a couple of bozos playing QB.
They would hate him by Week 3 next year for not transforming Danny into the star he's destined to become.
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All you need is to get Jones a stud #1 WR. Use that #1 draft pick for that, if he is out there. Or pick up as a FA.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
You can't be serious. The KC unit is so good they had to acquire our sloppy seconds to beef it up. And you unironically mention Toney as an example of how good their unit is.
If we had JJS on this team, there would be a contingent on BBI trying to run him out of town. He's not great.
Mahomes and Allen would be perceived as stars on any team. If you can't admit that their talent would be apparent wherever they played, you're probably so dug in on Jones that you are beyond reason. Jones is not in their zip code, talent-wise.
They key to Kansas City's offence is Andy Reid and Kelce....not the WRs.
His play has been meh, but he still has little to work with.
This is it. It’s always been this to me.
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In comment 15937997 5BowlsSoon said:
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All you need is to get Jones a stud #1 WR. Use that #1 draft pick for that, if he is out there. Or pick up as a FA.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
You can't be serious. The KC unit is so good they had to acquire our sloppy seconds to beef it up. And you unironically mention Toney as an example of how good their unit is.
If we had JJS on this team, there would be a contingent on BBI trying to run him out of town. He's not great.
Mahomes and Allen would be perceived as stars on any team. If you can't admit that their talent would be apparent wherever they played, you're probably so dug in on Jones that you are beyond reason. Jones is not in their zip code, talent-wise.
They key to Kansas City's offence is Andy Reid and Kelce....not the WRs.
Cmom. Mahomes is more critical than Kelce and as important as Reid. Don't you think?
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In comment 15937997 5BowlsSoon said:
Quote:
All you need is to get Jones a stud #1 WR. Use that #1 draft pick for that, if he is out there. Or pick up as a FA.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
You can't be serious. The KC unit is so good they had to acquire our sloppy seconds to beef it up. And you unironically mention Toney as an example of how good their unit is.
If we had JJS on this team, there would be a contingent on BBI trying to run him out of town. He's not great.
Mahomes and Allen would be perceived as stars on any team. If you can't admit that their talent would be apparent wherever they played, you're probably so dug in on Jones that you are beyond reason. Jones is not in their zip code, talent-wise.
They key to Kansas City's offence is Andy Reid and Kelce....not the WRs.
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All you need is to get Jones a stud #1 WR. Use that #1 draft pick for that, if he is out there. Or pick up as a FA.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
Fine, who? What WR? Whenever people suggest that we need to move on from DJ, people ask who exactly he could be replaced with that is better next year (which isn't even the right question to ask). But now I will ask you what stud WR? Sure, they could draft someone, but are you getting a Jefferson or Agholar. And is this rookie going to be a stud from day 1? And if not through the draft, what about the FA WRs? Is the only thing standing between Jones and elite passing stats Jakobi Meyers, or Mecole Hardman? Please name the guy that is going to come in next year, light it up, and turn Jones into the franchise QB you think he is.
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The Giants tried to do the whole bring in WRs to fix Jones thing. They brought in a very high priced WR, and first round pick. Of course these guys didn't work out, but the point is, many of you act as if finding a long term upgrade at QB is impossible, but its a guarantee that you can just go out and get a guaranteed stud WR whenever you want
Obviously it’s not EASY. It’s EASIER, though, to find better receivers than it is to find a franchise QB.
I don't think that's true. It's just easier to squeeze some sort of utility out of a WR bust than it is with a QB bust. You can use a WR situationally, but you can't really do that with a QB. So it doesn't feel like as big of a setback when a WR busts, but it happens fairly frequently.
Just look at the Giants' WR draftees from day 1-2 over the past 15 years:
2022: Wan'Dale Robinson (TBD)
2021: Kadarius Toney (bust for NYG)
2016: Sterling Shepard (good player, big injury issues, meh value)
2014: Odell Beckham, Jr. (success)
2012: Reuben Randle (mixed results, generally considered a miss)
2011: Jerrel Jernigan (bust)
2009: Hakeem Nicks (success)
2008: Mario Manningham (success)
That looks like a 38% success rate with a couple of other choices in there that provided adequate value but would absolutely not be considered WR1 caliber players. Even among the successful picks, I'd only count OBJ and Nicks as WRs who we would consider a passing-game centerpiece if that's the goal.
Take a guess...
Rushes, yards, TDs, 1st downs, long, apc, ypg, apg
47 238 2 26 22 5.1 19.8 3.9
91 522 4 42 24 5.7 43.5 7.6
Hint He evolved a long neck to eat vegetation from tree top levels in the savannahs.
Who's on board for just using the Cleveland Browns business model.
Just keep bringing them in. The draft, FA, UDFA, arena league, Europe. One of them is bound to work out. Eventually. Right????
Who's on board for just using the Cleveland Browns business model.
Just keep bringing them in. The draft, FA, UDFA, arena league, Europe. One of them is bound to work out. Eventually. Right????
Which one of those guys should the Browns have kept as I presume you're inferring the Giants should do with Jones?
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Mahomes and Josh Allen? Really? Who'da thunk?
Who's on board for just using the Cleveland Browns business model.
Just keep bringing them in. The draft, FA, UDFA, arena league, Europe. One of them is bound to work out. Eventually. Right????
Which one of those guys should the Browns have kept as I presume you're inferring the Giants should do with Jones?
Implying, not inferring.
Take a guess...
Rushes, yards, TDs, 1st downs, long, apc, ypg, apg
47 238 2 26 22 5.1 19.8 3.9
91 522 4 42 24 5.7 43.5 7.6
The word you're looking for is "innumeracy."
If the Giants were to get an Anthony Richardson, who is clearly not ready to play in the NFL, then Brisette works as a bridge.
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In comment 15938138 Producer said:
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In comment 15937997 5BowlsSoon said:
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All you need is to get Jones a stud #1 WR. Use that #1 draft pick for that, if he is out there. Or pick up as a FA.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
You can't be serious. The KC unit is so good they had to acquire our sloppy seconds to beef it up. And you unironically mention Toney as an example of how good their unit is.
If we had JJS on this team, there would be a contingent on BBI trying to run him out of town. He's not great.
Mahomes and Allen would be perceived as stars on any team. If you can't admit that their talent would be apparent wherever they played, you're probably so dug in on Jones that you are beyond reason. Jones is not in their zip code, talent-wise.
They key to Kansas City's offence is Andy Reid and Kelce....not the WRs.
Cmom. Mahomes is more critical than Kelce and as important as Reid. Don't you think?
Mahommes is a given... it was a comparison vs the WRs. Even with the WRs, Kelce and Reid... Mahommes could not get the job done when his OL was shit.
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In comment 15937978 DefenseWins said:
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In comment 15937974 mfjmfj said:
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See how this works? There is lots of stupid things you can want and propose. They are just not going to happen.
Exactly... I have yet to see a viable replacement option for Jones so far.
Jones is going to get paid because too many teams have QBs that are worse than Jones.
NOBODY has come up with anything other than "go into the season with Tyrod as the starter". If the Giants do that, they are just admitting to the fan base that they are giving up on the season. The only way Tyrod is going to be consistently successful as our QB is if we have a dominant OL and we are gaining 5+ yards on the ground.
The fact that you overrate Jones doesn’t mean the replacements suggested aren’t viable.
the point he’s making is that we will likely have to pay closer to what DJ will make if we decide to go for JB. Just because he’s making a little over 4mil now doesn’t mean that’s all he’ll cost in free agency. Just because you underrate DJ, doesn’t mean he should be replaced by a guy who won 5 games with more talent around him and potentially save very little against the cap in the process.
Nobody is going to pay Jacobe Brissett big money this offseason. He's a average QB, and has always been an average QB, just like Daniel Jones. The thread was started to show just how average DJ is and how stupid it would be to pay him anything more than a backup salary.
The Giants aren't winning games because of Daniel Jones. Since Saquon went downhill and has no longer carried the offense, the Giants are 0-3-1.
Do I want Jacobe Brissett next year? No!...but I'd damn sure take him over paying DJ 5 times what JB will command.
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All you need is to get Jones a stud #1 WR. Use that #1 draft pick for that, if he is out there. Or pick up as a FA.
Are you guys that obtuse? Don’t you see what a stud #1 WR has done for Tua and Hurts. Compare their last year with this year. Do some homework. In fact, both of those QBs #2 WRs are much better than any WR we have.
Any QB you bring in here won’t be that successful until you get them great playmates. Oh, see Josh Allen too…..Bills knew this….thus, STEFON Diggs brought in. Do you think Josh would be this great without him? Was he before Diggs came aboard? Nope.
Look at KC when they lost Hill. They went out to replace him and again they added a WR better than any we have in JSS, and interestingly, they wanted to give Mahomes more playmates, so they added a #1 pick in Toney hoping he can mature to be another stud. If Mahomes is so great, and he is, couldn’t he make even mush look good? Why get him GREAT PLAYERS? Andy Reid knows what many on our website don’t know or don’t want to know- The surrounding cast is that Important..
Who do we give for Jones to play with- Golladay, James, MJohnson, Sills, and Hodgins (although I really like him to be a solid possession receiver).
In conclusion…this is a much simpler solution as I see it, and I can assure you- if Mahomes or Allen had our WRs, they would not be stars.
You can't be serious. The KC unit is so good they had to acquire our sloppy seconds to beef it up. And you unironically mention Toney as an example of how good their unit is.
If we had JJS on this team, there would be a contingent on BBI trying to run him out of town. He's not great.
Mahomes and Allen would be perceived as stars on any team. If you can't admit that their talent would be apparent wherever they played, you're probably so dug in on Jones that you are beyond reason. Jones is not in their zip code, talent-wise.
Exactly, there's not a bigtime FA WR that is going to want to play with a QB that is limited to a dink and dunk, run heavy offense...unless the Giants severely overpay him (Golladay). Hell, with DJ, a WR is more likely to want to quit (Toney and Golladay) than even become a serviceable option in the offense.
Jacobe instead of Jacoby.
I don't want Jacoby, Jacobe, or Daniel. They're all average, at best!
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In comment 15938152 Blue The Dog said:
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The Giants tried to do the whole bring in WRs to fix Jones thing. They brought in a very high priced WR, and first round pick. Of course these guys didn't work out, but the point is, many of you act as if finding a long term upgrade at QB is impossible, but its a guarantee that you can just go out and get a guaranteed stud WR whenever you want
Obviously it’s not EASY. It’s EASIER, though, to find better receivers than it is to find a franchise QB.
I don't think that's true. It's just easier to squeeze some sort of utility out of a WR bust than it is with a QB bust. You can use a WR situationally, but you can't really do that with a QB. So it doesn't feel like as big of a setback when a WR busts, but it happens fairly frequently.
Just look at the Giants' WR draftees from day 1-2 over the past 15 years:
2022: Wan'Dale Robinson (TBD)
2021: Kadarius Toney (bust for NYG)
2016: Sterling Shepard (good player, big injury issues, meh value)
2014: Odell Beckham, Jr. (success)
2012: Reuben Randle (mixed results, generally considered a miss)
2011: Jerrel Jernigan (bust)
2009: Hakeem Nicks (success)
2008: Mario Manningham (success)
That looks like a 38% success rate with a couple of other choices in there that provided adequate value but would absolutely not be considered WR1 caliber players. Even among the successful picks, I'd only count OBJ and Nicks as WRs who we would consider a passing-game centerpiece if that's the goal.
That success rate is all Eli. The success rate with Daniel Jones is 0%. He's actually made a high priced FA and a 1st round pick want to leave NY.
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In comment 15938179 ZoneXDOA said:
Quote:
In comment 15938152 Blue The Dog said:
Quote:
The Giants tried to do the whole bring in WRs to fix Jones thing. They brought in a very high priced WR, and first round pick. Of course these guys didn't work out, but the point is, many of you act as if finding a long term upgrade at QB is impossible, but its a guarantee that you can just go out and get a guaranteed stud WR whenever you want
Obviously it’s not EASY. It’s EASIER, though, to find better receivers than it is to find a franchise QB.
I don't think that's true. It's just easier to squeeze some sort of utility out of a WR bust than it is with a QB bust. You can use a WR situationally, but you can't really do that with a QB. So it doesn't feel like as big of a setback when a WR busts, but it happens fairly frequently.
Just look at the Giants' WR draftees from day 1-2 over the past 15 years:
2022: Wan'Dale Robinson (TBD)
2021: Kadarius Toney (bust for NYG)
2016: Sterling Shepard (good player, big injury issues, meh value)
2014: Odell Beckham, Jr. (success)
2012: Reuben Randle (mixed results, generally considered a miss)
2011: Jerrel Jernigan (bust)
2009: Hakeem Nicks (success)
2008: Mario Manningham (success)
That looks like a 38% success rate with a couple of other choices in there that provided adequate value but would absolutely not be considered WR1 caliber players. Even among the successful picks, I'd only count OBJ and Nicks as WRs who we would consider a passing-game centerpiece if that's the goal.
That success rate is all Eli. The success rate with Daniel Jones is 0%. He's actually made a high priced FA and a 1st round pick want to leave NY.
Very interesting, please tell us all about this.
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In comment 15938179 ZoneXDOA said:
Quote:
In comment 15938152 Blue The Dog said:
Quote:
The Giants tried to do the whole bring in WRs to fix Jones thing. They brought in a very high priced WR, and first round pick. Of course these guys didn't work out, but the point is, many of you act as if finding a long term upgrade at QB is impossible, but its a guarantee that you can just go out and get a guaranteed stud WR whenever you want
Obviously it’s not EASY. It’s EASIER, though, to find better receivers than it is to find a franchise QB.
I don't think that's true. It's just easier to squeeze some sort of utility out of a WR bust than it is with a QB bust. You can use a WR situationally, but you can't really do that with a QB. So it doesn't feel like as big of a setback when a WR busts, but it happens fairly frequently.
Just look at the Giants' WR draftees from day 1-2 over the past 15 years:
2022: Wan'Dale Robinson (TBD)
2021: Kadarius Toney (bust for NYG)
2016: Sterling Shepard (good player, big injury issues, meh value)
2014: Odell Beckham, Jr. (success)
2012: Reuben Randle (mixed results, generally considered a miss)
2011: Jerrel Jernigan (bust)
2009: Hakeem Nicks (success)
2008: Mario Manningham (success)
That looks like a 38% success rate with a couple of other choices in there that provided adequate value but would absolutely not be considered WR1 caliber players. Even among the successful picks, I'd only count OBJ and Nicks as WRs who we would consider a passing-game centerpiece if that's the goal.
That success rate is all Eli. The success rate with Daniel Jones is 0%. He's actually made a high priced FA and a 1st round pick want to leave NY.
Seriously where would you put Slayton in this mix? One of the last of Eli's games he threw 2 TDs to Slayton in like 1 of 2 games he played that year. Mike GLennon of all things had his best game with Toney as a Giant I believe. And I don't remember Evan Engram causing a bunch of interceptions for Eli Manning and he certainly did not when Geno Smith started one game here. Jones is like the reverse Midas Touch. It would be fuinny to hear to Jones apologists if Tyreek Hill came here and looked like an aloof avg. player. "oh it's the lines fault or the play calling stinks or the coaching "
That success rate is all Eli. The success rate with Daniel Jones is 0%. He's actually made a high priced FA and a 1st round pick want to leave NY.
Seriously where would you put Slayton in this mix? One of the last of Eli's games he threw 2 TDs to Slayton in like 1 of 2 games he played that year. Mike GLennon of all things had his best game with Toney as a Giant I believe. And I don't remember Evan Engram causing a bunch of interceptions for Eli Manning and he certainly did not when Geno Smith started one game here. Jones is like the reverse Midas Touch. It would be fuinny to hear to Jones apologists if Tyreek Hill came here and looked like an aloof avg. player. "oh it's the lines fault or the play calling stinks or the coaching "
These might be the two stupidest posts I’ve ever read on BBI. Congratulations idiots.
Take a guess...
Rushes, yards, TDs, 1st downs, long, apc, ypg, apg
47 238 2 26 22 5.1 19.8 3.9
91 522 4 42 24 5.7 43.5 7.6
I get your point here. The underlying one is that one team has a OL that imposes its will creating a running game. The other needs its QB, creativity and a OL that is very hit or miss in execution to chip in. PB between the two goes from very good for one to spotty at best for the other.
Certainly all this impacts the passing stats not even factoring in the difference in skill guys.
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That success rate is all Eli. The success rate with Daniel Jones is 0%. He's actually made a high priced FA and a 1st round pick want to leave NY.
Seriously where would you put Slayton in this mix? One of the last of Eli's games he threw 2 TDs to Slayton in like 1 of 2 games he played that year. Mike GLennon of all things had his best game with Toney as a Giant I believe. And I don't remember Evan Engram causing a bunch of interceptions for Eli Manning and he certainly did not when Geno Smith started one game here. Jones is like the reverse Midas Touch. It would be fuinny to hear to Jones apologists if Tyreek Hill came here and looked like an aloof avg. player. "oh it's the lines fault or the play calling stinks or the coaching "
These might be the two stupidest posts I’ve ever read on BBI. Congratulations idiots.
Stupid is saying the Giants have a 38% success rate with new WRs, while not even mentioning Golladay, and mentioning DJ when he's had success with none of his receivers.
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In comment 15938495 Atari2600 said:
Quote:
That success rate is all Eli. The success rate with Daniel Jones is 0%. He's actually made a high priced FA and a 1st round pick want to leave NY.
Seriously where would you put Slayton in this mix? One of the last of Eli's games he threw 2 TDs to Slayton in like 1 of 2 games he played that year. Mike GLennon of all things had his best game with Toney as a Giant I believe. And I don't remember Evan Engram causing a bunch of interceptions for Eli Manning and he certainly did not when Geno Smith started one game here. Jones is like the reverse Midas Touch. It would be fuinny to hear to Jones apologists if Tyreek Hill came here and looked like an aloof avg. player. "oh it's the lines fault or the play calling stinks or the coaching "
These might be the two stupidest posts I’ve ever read on BBI. Congratulations idiots.
Stupid is saying the Giants have a 38% success rate with new WRs, while not even mentioning Golladay, and mentioning DJ when he's had success with none of his receivers.
I’m stupid for mentioning the Giants’ WR draft picks over the past 15 years?
Are you daft? Or just want to make sure that both sides of the DJ debate know that you’re a fucking idiot?
This week we broke the seal on the Sabatoge Theory. Who's going to be 1st on the 6 year evaluation period?
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In comment 15938594 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
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In comment 15938495 Atari2600 said:
Quote:
That success rate is all Eli. The success rate with Daniel Jones is 0%. He's actually made a high priced FA and a 1st round pick want to leave NY.
Seriously where would you put Slayton in this mix? One of the last of Eli's games he threw 2 TDs to Slayton in like 1 of 2 games he played that year. Mike GLennon of all things had his best game with Toney as a Giant I believe. And I don't remember Evan Engram causing a bunch of interceptions for Eli Manning and he certainly did not when Geno Smith started one game here. Jones is like the reverse Midas Touch. It would be fuinny to hear to Jones apologists if Tyreek Hill came here and looked like an aloof avg. player. "oh it's the lines fault or the play calling stinks or the coaching "
These might be the two stupidest posts I’ve ever read on BBI. Congratulations idiots.
Stupid is saying the Giants have a 38% success rate with new WRs, while not even mentioning Golladay, and mentioning DJ when he's had success with none of his receivers.
I’m stupid for mentioning the Giants’ WR draft picks over the past 15 years?
Are you daft? Or just want to make sure that both sides of the DJ debate know that you’re a fucking idiot?
Not stupid for the info but daft for the way it was presented. Better?
Trying to lump Eli's success in with DJs lack of success, was silly. Eli made receivers better, DJ doesn't...and it would've been better to mention who the QB was when a WR was successful/unsuccessful.
I'll bet that when DJ is gone, and we have a better QB, WRs will have more success as Giants. Right now, WRs get the blame for being average when it's not all them.
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In comment 15938634 GMen72 said:
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In comment 15938594 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
Quote:
In comment 15938495 Atari2600 said:
Quote:
That success rate is all Eli. The success rate with Daniel Jones is 0%. He's actually made a high priced FA and a 1st round pick want to leave NY.
Seriously where would you put Slayton in this mix? One of the last of Eli's games he threw 2 TDs to Slayton in like 1 of 2 games he played that year. Mike GLennon of all things had his best game with Toney as a Giant I believe. And I don't remember Evan Engram causing a bunch of interceptions for Eli Manning and he certainly did not when Geno Smith started one game here. Jones is like the reverse Midas Touch. It would be fuinny to hear to Jones apologists if Tyreek Hill came here and looked like an aloof avg. player. "oh it's the lines fault or the play calling stinks or the coaching "
These might be the two stupidest posts I’ve ever read on BBI. Congratulations idiots.
Stupid is saying the Giants have a 38% success rate with new WRs, while not even mentioning Golladay, and mentioning DJ when he's had success with none of his receivers.
I’m stupid for mentioning the Giants’ WR draft picks over the past 15 years?
Are you daft? Or just want to make sure that both sides of the DJ debate know that you’re a fucking idiot?
Not stupid for the info but daft for the way it was presented. Better?
Trying to lump Eli's success in with DJs lack of success, was silly. Eli made receivers better, DJ doesn't...and it would've been better to mention who the QB was when a WR was successful/unsuccessful.
I'll bet that when DJ is gone, and we have a better QB, WRs will have more success as Giants. Right now, WRs get the blame for being average when it's not all them.
It’s baffling to me that you missed the point of my post (hint: it wasn’t defending DJ).
You’re an imbecile and a troll, as evidenced by your repeated use of the exclusive franchise tag to go along with this very clear indication that you might not even know how to read.
I don't think he's worth any if the possible tag values. I don't think he's worth $20M. He is still a guy that has to prove himself. There is no telling how the roster will look next year. Do you really want to spend top half of the league money to a guy still filled with question marks and really a middle of the pack QB?
I don't. If he would sign for less than $15M, but loaded with incentives, I'd be all for it. If you perform like a #6 pick, you get paid. He'll, even throw in escalators to add more guaranteed money or more salary for future years if certain incentives are hit in the first year. I've said for months, they need to get very creative with him and he also has to be willing to listen.
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In comment 15938647 Gatorade Dunk said:
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In comment 15938634 GMen72 said:
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In comment 15938594 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
Quote:
In comment 15938495 Atari2600 said:
Quote:
That success rate is all Eli. The success rate with Daniel Jones is 0%. He's actually made a high priced FA and a 1st round pick want to leave NY.
Seriously where would you put Slayton in this mix? One of the last of Eli's games he threw 2 TDs to Slayton in like 1 of 2 games he played that year. Mike GLennon of all things had his best game with Toney as a Giant I believe. And I don't remember Evan Engram causing a bunch of interceptions for Eli Manning and he certainly did not when Geno Smith started one game here. Jones is like the reverse Midas Touch. It would be fuinny to hear to Jones apologists if Tyreek Hill came here and looked like an aloof avg. player. "oh it's the lines fault or the play calling stinks or the coaching "
These might be the two stupidest posts I’ve ever read on BBI. Congratulations idiots.
Stupid is saying the Giants have a 38% success rate with new WRs, while not even mentioning Golladay, and mentioning DJ when he's had success with none of his receivers.
I’m stupid for mentioning the Giants’ WR draft picks over the past 15 years?
Are you daft? Or just want to make sure that both sides of the DJ debate know that you’re a fucking idiot?
Not stupid for the info but daft for the way it was presented. Better?
Trying to lump Eli's success in with DJs lack of success, was silly. Eli made receivers better, DJ doesn't...and it would've been better to mention who the QB was when a WR was successful/unsuccessful.
I'll bet that when DJ is gone, and we have a better QB, WRs will have more success as Giants. Right now, WRs get the blame for being average when it's not all them.
It’s baffling to me that you missed the point of my post (hint: it wasn’t defending DJ).
You’re an imbecile and a troll, as evidenced by your repeated use of the exclusive franchise tag to go along with this very clear indication that you might not even know how to read.
Mentioning the tag was to give a range of the POSSIBLE salaries mentioned by many on this board...and to point out that Brissett is a much cheaper option. Try to follow along...it's not all about you, kiddo!
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In comment 15938634 GMen72 said:
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In comment 15938594 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
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In comment 15938495 Atari2600 said:
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That success rate is all Eli. The success rate with Daniel Jones is 0%. He's actually made a high priced FA and a 1st round pick want to leave NY.
Seriously where would you put Slayton in this mix? One of the last of Eli's games he threw 2 TDs to Slayton in like 1 of 2 games he played that year. Mike GLennon of all things had his best game with Toney as a Giant I believe. And I don't remember Evan Engram causing a bunch of interceptions for Eli Manning and he certainly did not when Geno Smith started one game here. Jones is like the reverse Midas Touch. It would be fuinny to hear to Jones apologists if Tyreek Hill came here and looked like an aloof avg. player. "oh it's the lines fault or the play calling stinks or the coaching "
These might be the two stupidest posts I’ve ever read on BBI. Congratulations idiots.
Stupid is saying the Giants have a 38% success rate with new WRs, while not even mentioning Golladay, and mentioning DJ when he's had success with none of his receivers.
I’m stupid for mentioning the Giants’ WR draft picks over the past 15 years?
Are you daft? Or just want to make sure that both sides of the DJ debate know that you’re a fucking idiot?
Not stupid for the info but daft for the way it was presented. Better?
Trying to lump Eli's success in with DJs lack of success, was silly. Eli made receivers better, DJ doesn't...and it would've been better to mention who the QB was when a WR was successful/unsuccessful.
I'll bet that when DJ is gone, and we have a better QB, WRs will have more success as Giants. Right now, WRs get the blame for being average when it's not all them.
A very good case could be made that the offensive line s inability to protect the passer makes the Giants receivers less effective.
However, even homers like Paul Dottino seem to believe the Giants receiving unit is well below NFL standards, not sure what you see to suggest they are not
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In comment 15938634 GMen72 said:
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In comment 15938594 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
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In comment 15938495 Atari2600 said:
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That success rate is all Eli. The success rate with Daniel Jones is 0%. He's actually made a high priced FA and a 1st round pick want to leave NY.
Seriously where would you put Slayton in this mix? One of the last of Eli's games he threw 2 TDs to Slayton in like 1 of 2 games he played that year. Mike GLennon of all things had his best game with Toney as a Giant I believe. And I don't remember Evan Engram causing a bunch of interceptions for Eli Manning and he certainly did not when Geno Smith started one game here. Jones is like the reverse Midas Touch. It would be fuinny to hear to Jones apologists if Tyreek Hill came here and looked like an aloof avg. player. "oh it's the lines fault or the play calling stinks or the coaching "
These might be the two stupidest posts I’ve ever read on BBI. Congratulations idiots.
Stupid is saying the Giants have a 38% success rate with new WRs, while not even mentioning Golladay, and mentioning DJ when he's had success with none of his receivers.
I’m stupid for mentioning the Giants’ WR draft picks over the past 15 years?
Are you daft? Or just want to make sure that both sides of the DJ debate know that you’re a fucking idiot?
Not stupid for the info but daft for the way it was presented. Better?
Trying to lump Eli's success in with DJs lack of success, was silly. Eli made receivers better, DJ doesn't...and it would've been better to mention who the QB was when a WR was successful/unsuccessful.
I'll bet that when DJ is gone, and we have a better QB, WRs will have more success as Giants. Right now, WRs get the blame for being average when it's not all them.
We’d love to be able to blame them for being average.
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In comment 15938108 Gatorade Dunk said:
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In comment 15938103 ZoneXDOA said:
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To see where Brissette ends up next year. Because it won’t be with the Giants unless he’s replacing Tyrod as DJ’s backup! If the coaches didn’t believe in DJ, Tyrod would be starting.
DJ is a free agent. He's not under contract for 2023.
How much are you paying him and for how long?
I’m not paying him anything! LOL! That 100% up to Schoen and them. I’d be fine with whatever they decide is best for the team. If I were JS, I’d be getting that franchise tag warmed up.
Would it be fair to say that you would let Barkley walk in order to keep DJ?
That's a likely outcome if you use the tag on DJ without an extension in place for Barkley already.
That success rate is all Eli. The success rate with Daniel Jones is 0%. He's actually made a high priced FA and a 1st round pick want to leave NY. ____________________________________
Seriously where would you put Slayton in this mix? One of the last of Eli's games he threw 2 TDs to Slayton in like 1 of 2 games he played that year. Mike GLennon of all things had his best game with Toney as a Giant I believe. And I don't remember Evan Engram causing a bunch of interceptions for Eli Manning and he certainly did not when Geno Smith started one game here. Jones is like the reverse Midas Touch. It would be fuinny to hear to Jones apologists if Tyreek Hill came here and looked like an aloof avg. player. "oh it's the lines fault or the play calling stinks or the coaching " [/quote] ————————————————————
I never thought of it this way. In 4 seasons, DJ has not made any player better so maybe the decision is “who do you want as your bridge QB and how much do you want to pay?”
We’d love to be able to blame them for being average.
Keep in mind that the person you’re responding to is the same numbskull who thinks Kenny Golladay is just being held back by Daniel Jones. Even Kenny Golladay’s parents don’t believe that ridiculousness. Kenny Golladay simply isn’t good anymore. It happens sometimes. Look at Allen Robinson… no one actually believes that Matt Stafford and Sean McVay are failing him, right? He’s been awful. As for guys like David Sills, Rickie James, and Marcus Johnson, they aren’t “average receivers”. They’re the dregs of NFL rosters.
Pat Mahomes and Joe Burrow might be the 2 best QBs in the league. Guess what their franchises don’t ask them to do? Make scrubs better. The Chiefs didn’t say, “We lost Tyreek Hill, so here’s Marcus Johnson.” They brought in proven guys with various levels of success. Look at the targets category for the Bengals. You’ve gotta go pretty far down before you find a no-name bottom of roster guy. The idea that another QB is going to elevate this group of receivers is just fucking nonsense.
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In comment 15938121 ZoneXDOA said:
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In comment 15938108 Gatorade Dunk said:
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In comment 15938103 ZoneXDOA said:
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To see where Brissette ends up next year. Because it won’t be with the Giants unless he’s replacing Tyrod as DJ’s backup! If the coaches didn’t believe in DJ, Tyrod would be starting.
DJ is a free agent. He's not under contract for 2023.
How much are you paying him and for how long?
I’m not paying him anything! LOL! That 100% up to Schoen and them. I’d be fine with whatever they decide is best for the team. If I were JS, I’d be getting that franchise tag warmed up.
Would it be fair to say that you would let Barkley walk in order to keep DJ?
That's a likely outcome if you use the tag on DJ without an extension in place for Barkley already.
it is very fair. I love Barkley. But Brightwell and Breida are capable of replacing his production. I think it’s harder to find a good QB and get him up to speed in your offense than it is to get or promote a back. Barkley is the superior talent but the smart money is on Jones. I think they find a way to keep both, though.
We agree that it's harder to find a good QB. That's why I want the Giants to get the process underway ASAP.
Difference being, I don't think anybody is going to be acting like Brissett is a longterm answer.