Is Dexter Lawrence the best Giants interior DL you've seen?

Tuck was drafted as an end but played inside a lot. He's the only one I would put in the same category. (I'm 48 years old so I don't know the guys before the 1980's)

Was pretty damn good. Had a couple double digit sack years.

Because if not, Reggie White and Aaron Donald are the best interior DL I've seen.

In terms of Giants players, I think the only guy who may have an argument, and it's an imperfect one, is Leonard Marshall. He was a DE, but a 3-4 DE, which I count as basically a DT. My basic rule is if the player would very likely play DT in a 4-3 system, but plays DE in a 3-4, I count them as an interior DL.

I was a kid when Marshall played, but I just remember thinking of him as larger than life as a player. And he was great, when you look at the career and numbers, but I don't think he had a season as dominant as Dex. But in '85 Marshall had 15.5 sacks as a DE in a 3-4. Incredible. It helps to play with the GOAT, though. He followed that up with 12 sacks in '86. He was also a tackling machine, take a look at the career numbers here:

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MarsLe00.htm

Completely different era of football, though, which the style of play then lent itself to big totals by DL. He never made All-Pro, but he also played during the time of Reggie White, Bruce Smith, and Chris Doleman.

I have to mention Snacks Harrison, because he was so dominating in 2016, but he was one-dimensional as a run-stopper, you really didn't get much in the way of pass rush from him, but he certainly did get a lot of double teams. Snacks did get first team All-Pro that year, though.

In terms of being a two-way DT, Dexter Lawrence is the best interior defensive lineman I've ever seen on the Giants for what he did this year. If he keeps this up, he'll be a gold-jacket guy and hopefully, if we can keep him for a long time, in the Giants Ring of Honor one day. This level of play, sustained for awhile, would put him alongside the great Giant defenders ever. Except for LT, of course, he's in a class by himself.

Compare him to, what he is doing is so unbelievably uncommon. To see a big long limbed 340+ man not only move like that, but just rag doll guys and seemingly never tire with this insane motor. I said it in another thread but what he was doing to Bradbury(and Nelson from Colts not long ago) is stuff Reggie White used to do to guys. The only other guy I remember doing stuff like that to guys routinely was Albert Haynesworth, and he did not have Dex’s motor/movement fluidity.

His season stacks up well with Haynesworths best season as a pro and when Haynesworth was on he was dominant. I went back through the all pro teams for 15 seasons trying to find a guy that produced like Dex and the only 2 in his ballpark were Haynesworth in 2007/2008 and Ngata back in the day…but Ngata’s best seasons didn’t touch what Dex did this year. The most QB hits Ngata ever had in a year was 14, the most Haynesworth ever had was 22 in his apex year. Dex put up 28 this year to go along with over 60 tackles which is just stunning…Haynesworth did that in his 7th year in the league, the scary part is Dex is just hitting his prime.

up with the Hammer, he was a beast in his prime. Giants have had a number of solid DTs over the years since him, but Dex is probably having the best season since Snacks in ‘16. Better coaching and playing his best position (why did two staffs not play him where he belongs!?) has unleashed his full potential.

In comment 16000220 allstarjim said:

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Because if not, Reggie White and Aaron Donald are the best interior DL I've seen. In terms of Giants players, I think the only guy who may have an argument, and it's an imperfect one, is Leonard Marshall. He was a DE, but a 3-4 DE, which I count as basically a DT. My basic rule is if the player would very likely play DT in a 4-3 system, but plays DE in a 3-4, I count them as an interior DL. I was a kid when Marshall played, but I just remember thinking of him as larger than life as a player. And he was great, when you look at the career and numbers, but I don't think he had a season as dominant as Dex. But in '85 Marshall had 15.5 sacks as a DE in a 3-4. Incredible. It helps to play with the GOAT, though. He followed that up with 12 sacks in '86. He was also a tackling machine, take a look at the career numbers here: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MarsLe00.htm Completely different era of football, though, which the style of play then lent itself to big totals by DL. He never made All-Pro, but he also played during the time of Reggie White, Bruce Smith, and Chris Doleman. I have to mention Snacks Harrison, because he was so dominating in 2016, but he was one-dimensional as a run-stopper, you really didn't get much in the way of pass rush from him, but he certainly did get a lot of double teams. Snacks did get first team All-Pro that year, though. In terms of being a two-way DT, Dexter Lawrence is the best interior defensive lineman I've ever seen on the Giants for what he did this year. If he keeps this up, he'll be a gold-jacket guy and hopefully, if we can keep him for a long time, in the Giants Ring of Honor one day. This level of play, sustained for awhile, would put him alongside the great Giant defenders ever. Except for LT, of course, he's in a class by himself.

There's been a lot of talk about signing Jones and Barkley, but Lawrence is the one I want signed the most.

Saw him play as a kid at Yankee Stadium and on TV in black and white. However big Dexy is hard to argue with as our best DT of all time. He just has to be the beast he is over multiple seasons to go down as the best DT ever for the Giants.

He is the fastest, most athletic and dominant specimen in combination that I’ve ever seen.

Helps each other....as teams must pick their poison.

His current display has not been seen.....very curious to seen how he does against the Eagles OL.

Azeez is so important.....as same goes with Thibs with picking your poison...who do you check etc....I wish he was better against the run.

Keith Hamilton was the best of those, IMO

But to answer the OPs question, yes Dexy has become the best of them all. He’s turned into Aaron Donald this season

Hammer was better in his prime but this duo with Dex and Leo is far and away the best combo we ever had. Dex, imo, is the best interior lineman this team has ever had. He’s done this back to back seasons. Should have been second team all pro last year and first team this year.

he will be the second greatest Giants defensive player of all time. Tuck, Marshall, the Hammer, were all great and fun to watch. Dex is playing at an otherworldly level.

Dex has really stepped up this year. Rex Ryan said he was a top 5 pick when the Giants got him. I thought with Wink (heavily influenced by Ryan family) maybe we could see that potential and it seems that is the case.

I liked Linval and one of the worst decisions was letting him go. Doesn't seem the same mistake will happen twice.

Mendenhall was a terrific player, but nowhere near the physical mismatch Lawrence poses, even in an era when top centers like Mike Webster and Dave Dalby weighed around 250 pounds.

We’ll never know what Troy Archer might have become.

no.

has been better

Tuck made plays when he had to and was a good 2 way DE.

.

my favorites and a really good DT(4-3). Hammer was probably the best DT they have had after Mendenall although Leonard Marshall was overall better than Hammer while playing as a DE(3-4).
Recents - Linval Joseph was better than DT, and Cornelius Griffin.
If Marshall had played NT he might be up there with Dexter.

This Season is the best NT work I have seen from a Giants NT.

IMV:
1.)Lawrence
2.)Joseph
3.)Tomlinson

He is playing with much less help than the great players in the past.

Real good question….
If we’re considering Marshall an interior lineman he’d be right there.
I go way back to the late 50s so there’s a lot to pick from
Dex is becoming the most dominant interior force I remember but it’s a short sample size.
I’ll throw out a bunch of names that were plus players inside.
Grier, Hamilton, Mendenhall, Neil, Burt, Archer, Joseph and Griffin.
Rosey was dominant and later became part of the Rams Fearsome Foursome so I’d rank him the best.
Dex has the goods to surpass everyone.

he is the best interior DL I've ever seen, and I'm 43. Only other two in the discussion IMO are Keith Hamilton and Damon Harrison. Harrison was more of a immoveable run stopper for his two great seasons with us, very little pass pressure. Hamilton was a very good and well rounded DT, but he was never the all-around force that Dexy was this season.

Troy Archer was best and future big-star in NFL before he was killed in a car crash.

In comment 16000295 SomeFan said:

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Troy Archer was best and future big-star in NFL before he was killed in a car crash.

Archer played DE too. You also have to mention John Mendenhall as in the discussion of best DL in Giants history.

Lawrence can be better than him and some of the others good players mentioned.

We have to keep in mind that this is a very different defense than any defense the Giants have played. This hybrid defense with Wink has moved Dex to the 1 Tech which has him at his natural position. In years past they had Dex playing the 3 tech with Williams at the 5 and Johnson or Tomlinson at the 1.

Dex is destroying centers and guards and double teams. He is equally devastating against the run or pass.

He is the best and the position move is a huge reason why.

quickness and smarts. He’d be too small to play today. Dex has it all and is really just getting into his prime. Lots to look forward to with the ‘other guy from North Carolina’.

However, I'd have to say I think Dex is the most dominant hands down!

No one that big should move so quickly and play so hard for a full game. He made cousins throw it on that last play. Too young to see Mendenahll. LJ was great but it seems like he played significantly better with the Vikings. DT had his moments as did Burt and Hamilton and snacks. Perhaps the best one aside from Dex would have been Troy Archer. Just a bit too far back to remember for me.

Snacks was great against the run but didn't effect the passing game like Dex. The Hammer is way up there, but I don't remember him embarrassing offensive linemen like Dex has this year.

For a single season, yeah, I'll go with Dex. He still has a way to go to catch Hammer's career.

In comment 16000227 gidiefor said:

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He is the fastest, most athletic and dominant specimen in combination that I’ve ever seen.

gifie I got to agree with you. And I go back a ways. He is 350lbs of brutal strength and speed and intensity rolled into one with a personality you can't help but love. His chatter on the field is hilarious.

... but I don't remember him being as dominant as Lawrence has been this year.

Snacks? Snacks wishes he ever had a season like this one and was really only good for us in 2016.

Back in the early 60’s the first dominant interior defensive lineman with great agility was Gene “Big Daddy” Lipscomb. He was 6’ 6” and close to 300 lbs. He played for Rams, Colts and Steelers. He was fast,agile and dominant. He lasted 10 years until his lifestyle caused his death.

In comment 16000223 BSIMatt said:

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Compare him to, what he is doing is so unbelievably uncommon. To see a big long limbed 340+ man not only move like that, but just rag doll guys and seemingly never tire with this insane motor. I said it in another thread but what he was doing to Bradbury(and Nelson from Colts not long ago) is stuff Reggie White used to do to guys. The only other guy I remember doing stuff like that to guys routinely was Albert Haynesworth, and he did not have Dex’s motor/movement fluidity. His season stacks up well with Haynesworths best season as a pro and when Haynesworth was on he was dominant. I went back through the all pro teams for 15 seasons trying to find a guy that produced like Dex and the only 2 in his ballpark were Haynesworth in 2007/2008 and Ngata back in the day…but Ngata’s best seasons didn’t touch what Dex did this year. The most QB hits Ngata ever had in a year was 14, the most Haynesworth ever had was 22 in his apex year. Dex put up 28 this year to go along with over 60 tackles which is just stunning…Haynesworth did that in his 7th year in the league, the scary part is Dex is just hitting his prime.

I think his comparison is Vince Wilfork.

In comment 16000355 Giantimistic said:

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I think his comparison is Vince Wilfork.

Probably closest. There's very little comp in history for a true Nose Tackle doing what he's doing at his size and playing an unprecedentedly high percentage of defensive plays.

allstarjam hit the nail on the head. In the Giants' old 3-4, you could argue that LT was basically a 4-3 DE and Marshall was the DT. So Leonard Marshall comes the closest.

But Leonard didn't play over the nose.

BigBlueBuff....this is a great question. You could seriously argue that Dexter is the best NT the Giants have had in memory (albeit he has to do it for more than one year to really make a name for himself).

I was too young to have fully appreciated Marshall. For me Hamilton was easily tops. He could do it all. I don't recall the stats anymore, but our run defense was over a yard per carry worse when he was out. He was so dominant in 2000 even though they tried to call holding on him all the time

the way Burt lit up Montana

I saw both Marshall, Mendenhall and prior. We can debate how the position has changed over the years and yes Mendenhall was terrific but shined on terrible teams and Burt was an overachiever. Marshall benefited from LT, etc.etc.etc. IMO as far as play after play, Dex is easily the most dominant.

interesting to see some old-timers agreeing he's the best they've seen

People yes, and Wilfork was incredibly nimble.

Wilfork couldn’t touch what Lawrence has done this season rushing the passer, not in the same stratosphere. He’s the best XXL pass rusher I’ve ever seen, Giants or otherwise.

Have the type of season that Lawrence had this year. Even the best ones just eat up double teams and give you some push up the middle in the passing game. You don't see many guys getting in QBs faces within seconds of the snap from the A gap. He's wrecking games.

Was one of the finest and most dominant performances by a Giants defensive player that I’ve ever seen(LT is in his own class as we all know).

JPP was a freak among freaks with a motor second to nobody that year, he hit quarterbacks 28 times that season. Dex hit quarterbacks 28 times this season playing with the same motor…it is hard to fathom.

But he never had a season like the one Lawrence just had. Few DTs have.

In comment 16000227 gidiefor said:

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He is the fastest, most athletic and dominant specimen in combination that I’ve ever seen.

It’s almost unholy. As a big man myself I have to say I wish I could move like him when I was skinny

His career was plagued by injuries but, when he was healthy, he was a beast.

that was for the 5th ranked defense and big man had 10 sacks that year too. That's the last season a Giants DT has had comparable to this one. It's hard to remember but I feel like Lawrence has been even better than Hamilton. At Lawrence's size, he's a 1 of 1 force in the league right now from the NT position.

JPP in 2011 is the best Giants defensive season in the last 15/20 years that I remember, atleast since Strahan's DPOY season. But I don't recall JPP being as consistently dominant as Dex. A lot of JPP's greatness that year was due to pure effort and hustle. He wasn't consistently overwhelming opposing OLs the way Dex currently is imo. What Dex has done this year has been special.

In fact, it's hard to think of many in the history of the NFL that can move like that at that size. We've all seen dominant space takers at that size, but Dex can penetrate and move down the sideline. It is something to behold.

I still feel like this guy is somehow flying under the radar. I know the players know it, I remember Aaron Rodgers making it a point to let the reporters know that the Giants had some dudes on the other side of the ball and he singled out Dex.

And at some point you have to trust what your eyes show you, and I remember a play versus the Vikings where he left his feet to dive and hit Cousins. He didn’t hop or fall down, he literally got horizontal with the ground and he might have flown right over a guard that was on the ground, it was absolutely ridiculous and for a moment it seemed like the laws of physics simply did not apply to him. Incredible play and I don’t think it was one that even counted in the stat sheet.

so yes.

the Giants. Burt, Leonard Marshall, Keith Hamilton, were all very good but not at this level.

but he never had the season that Dex is having.

I'm hard pressed to think of a guy who played this well, and I am trying because I hate "recency bias". Marshall was really good, but as stated above it was a slightly different position. Plus he played in from of LT which really helped him out. Dex is playing in front of a new guy from off the street every week

Loved Mendenhall, Hamilton, Marshall, all the guys above.

Dex plays a different game than any of them. I don't remember the Giants ever having a nose tackle who was such a threat to collapse the pocket. They have had great up-the-middle pass rush before but usually by the DT eating blockers and a linebacker or stunt come in behind them. Dex just manhandles guys, no stunt necessary.

He's kind of a unicorn in my view.

I really don't know what I would want to face less than a 350 lb NT pushing around centers like a Walmart shopping cart. And no not those old shopping carts with the sticky wheel that's hard to move and spins around in circles, I'm talking a brand new Walmart shopping cart.

In comment 16000453 Greg from LI said:

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But he never had a season like the one Lawrence just had. Few DTs have.

I'd put his 2000 season above Dex's, but that's me. As pointed out he finished 4th in DPOY. He was really unstoppable that year

In comment 16000224 darren in pdx said:

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up with the Hammer, he was a beast in his prime. Giants have had a number of solid DTs over the years since him, but Dex is probably having the best season since Snacks in ‘16. Better coaching and playing his best position (why did two staffs not play him where he belongs!?) has unleashed his full potential.

Dexy has a big fat well rounded spider chart, up there with anybody. It was kind of a too smart for your own good move to put him on the edge but makes some sort of sense I guess.

Not as much sense as lining up directly in front of a QB and 700+ lbs barelling a center straight towards the QB's lap.

It's been 22 years, perhaps I'm underselling Hamilton's 2000. Still, I remember him as more of a supporting player behind Strahan and Armstead as the headliners.

Odd - he was 4th in the AP's POY voting but only in their 2nd team All Pro.

But he's been actually better. Wilfork never could push the pocket and get sacks like Dex has. He's really the ideal nose tackle. I can't think of another who had the combination of being immovable in the run game and could also collapse the pocket with the regularity he does. You can't even compare him to Donald, who is really an elite pass rusher who can also handle playing inside every down (like imagine if the best of Justin Tuck could always stay inside and also hold up for 9 years). That's not Dex. He's playing like the absolute blueprint for the Nose Tackle. Like he was created in a laboratory to cause centers and guards nightmares.

Hamilton was the best DL in my lifetime as a fan and he's not nearly as dominant as Dex. Not really even close.

Which brings me back to Judge. Why the hell did they play him at DE lol? WTF?

Has got Dex mastering hand fighting and leverage in coordination with his tremendously powerul leg drive. It is absolutely destroying IOL right now. I don't think I have ever seen this kind of level of just obliterating the guy in front of you like this from the interior. At least not on this team.

where you start thinking you need to create a new higher league for him, like Mariano Rivera. And instead of GMs asking "Find me the next Lawrence Taylor!" they are now saying "Find me the next Dexter Lawrence!"

In comment 16000745 Spiciest Memelord said:

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where you start thinking you need to create a new higher league for him, like Mariano Rivera. And instead of GMs asking "Find me the next Lawrence Taylor!" they are now saying "Find me the next Dexter Lawrence!"

OK, now you're being silly. Relax, eat a sandwich, drink a glass of milk, do some fucking thing, but don't compare anyone to LT.

but it's still just one season, he needs to repeat it year in and out before he's in the larger convo for me. On the basis of one season he's way up there, top 3 in the 40+ years I've watched the Giants.

He was very good for a long time. He was excellent as a 22-year-old 3-4 DE, and superb as a 29-year-old 4-3 DT. And when he was 31, as injuries were rapidly finishing him, his absence was a big reason the defense fell apart in the playoff game in San Francisco.

Well done.

I had a celebrity encounter with the late, great Dennis Farina. He was enjoying brunch in the sidewalk cafe section of Nice Matin when I passed by on Amsterdam Avenue. I stopped briefly and said, "Sir, I really enjoy your work. Thank you." He gave me an indifferent little nod and a slight smirk that said, "You better move along or I'm gonna stab you through the heart with a fuckin' pencil. Do you understand me?"

I loved that guy.

Leonard Marshall was an absolute beast and perhaps gets overshadowed by all the LB talent that surrounded him.
It is possible....that if you could switch them in terms of era played and defensive scheme that you wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

was an amazingly underrated player. He was a brickwall in the middle of that defense and a massive part of our run stuffing ability. He doesn't have the skillset and high end talent that Lawrence has, but Lawrence also hasn't done it for 10 years like Hamilton did.

Fred Robbins. Not quite in the Hamilton/Lawrence echelon but an excellent player who no one really ever talks about.

which is to say very high. That's treating Marshall and Hamilton as interior DL. As a true NT, though, I'd say Lawrence is the best. Jim Burt was great but he was 6'1", 260 lbs. Lawrence is substantially bigger and more powerful than Burt was. That play against the Colts was amazing.

was a great player of that era and we've had some good, really good, and a few great ones since then -- Burt, Howard, Mendenhall, Hamilton, Marshall. But I've never seen anything like Dexter Lawrence and I've been a devoted fan since the mid 1950's.

so I don't have the perspective of some of the posters here, but in my 40+ years watching, I have NEVER seen a DT/NT DOMINATE the guy in front of him as much as Dex. He is fork-lifting, sleigh-riding 300lb+ grown men like tackling dummies. The most physically dominating NT I have ever seen.

back for a TD when he was a JR at Pitt. I was ecstatic when we drafted him in the 4th round. I knew we got a steal.

having Leo next to him really helps. He had shit around him for his first couple years.

He had 5.5 sacks his rookie year in 1981.
Tore up his knee in his second year.
He was a monster.

Leonard Marshall was really good, so was Mendenhall but Sexy Dexy is on a unbelievable roll.
He is living up to his pre draft ceiling of total domination.
Go Giants!

In comment 16000305 Rjanyg said:

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We have to keep in mind that this is a very different defense than any defense the Giants have played. This hybrid defense with Wink has moved Dex to the 1 Tech which has him at his natural position. In years past they had Dex playing the 3 tech with Williams at the 5 and Johnson or Tomlinson at the 1. Dex is destroying centers and guards and double teams. He is equally devastating against the run or pass. He is the best and the position move is a huge reason why.

It remains one of life's great mysteries that not one, but two Giants coaching staffs (with two different DCs) insisted on playing Dex somewhere other than NT.

In comment 16000668 Heisenberg said:

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Which brings me back to Judge. Why the hell did they play him at DE lol? WTF?

It's not just Judge (and Graham). Shurmur (and Bettcher) did the same thing.

It makes no sense, and it never did.

In comment 16000980 ryanmkeane said:

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having Leo next to him really helps. He had shit around him for his first couple years.

The Giants traded for Leonard Williams during Dex's rookie year.

You're just making shit up, as usual.

In comment 16000654 Greg from LI said:

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It's been 22 years, perhaps I'm underselling Hamilton's 2000. Still, I remember him as more of a supporting player behind Strahan and Armstead as the headliners. Odd - he was 4th in the AP's POY voting but only in their 2nd team All Pro.

Completely agree.

but just by virtue of size i remember that year a lot more like leonard williams career year a few years ago. probably better against the pass than dex was and solid against the run, but not as dominant as dex has been this year just completely caving in the interior OL.

he's tossed guys around all game like wilfork (and very few others) used to.

In the HOF air gotten some consideration. Really just a fucking monster.

But he really wasn’t an interior DT. If Dexter keeps this up he will wearing a gold jacket. He was the best DT In the NFL this year. Period. And there should be no reason he won’t keep it up. So year. Best ever. He wasn’t bad his first two years. Just utterly misused.

Also Erik Howard was very good ashen he replaced Burt.

You know Dex got in Cousins head on that 4th down throw. He knew his time was up and had to get rid of it.

Was much smaller but in 1977 he showed a ton of promise at age 22 from RDT. 10.5 sacks in 14 games.