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Interesting nugget RE: Hurts' shoulder

bigblue5611 : 1/19/2023 3:23 pm
Found this video on YouTube from earlier today with Orlovsky breaking down the matchup. The talk around this starts at the 1:12 mark with the tidbit on Hurts coming at 1:47. The Eagles do a ball security drill ending with the ball carrier doing a shoulder roll onto a mat. When it came time for Hurts to do it, he slowed up towards the met and instead of a shoulder roll, "gently flopped on his back". Despite everything being said, it does indeed seem his shoulder isn't going to be 100%, but who knows...
Link - ( New Window )
Hurts isn't on the injured list  
CromartiesKid21 : 1/19/2023 3:33 pm : link
He's 100%
RE: Hurts isn't on the injured list  
bceagle05 : 1/19/2023 3:35 pm : link
In comment 16002438 CromartiesKid21 said:
Quote:
He's 100%

It's gamesmanship  
Tom from LI : 1/19/2023 3:36 pm : link
Nobody is 100% this time of year.

You think the Eagles would leak that video or let it be recorded if he was not able to do the drill?
RE: Hurts isn't on the injured list; He's 100%  
Trainmaster : 1/19/2023 3:39 pm : link
I don’t think the above is necessarily true.

I believe the NFL rules only require injury reporting if a player misses or is limited in practice.

We often learn after the season about players who practiced and played through non trivial injuries that were never required to be reported because the player wasn’t listed as limited / missing practice.

I think “Hurts is still hurting” and very likely isn’t 100%.

How much his injury is still affecting his play is the $1 million question.

RE: Hurts isn't on the injured list  
bigblue5611 : 1/19/2023 3:40 pm : link
In comment 16002438 CromartiesKid21 said:
Quote:
He's 100%




I'd agree with above, there's probably some gamesmanship here, but I'll believe it's 100% when I see him do multiple designed runs over the first 2 series on offense.
we  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 1/19/2023 3:41 pm : link
simply don't know. The Eagles know but we're going to find out on Saturday.
RE: It's gamesmanship  
knowledgetimmons : 1/19/2023 3:42 pm : link
In comment 16002452 Tom from LI said:
Quote:
Nobody is 100% this time of year.

You think the Eagles would leak that video or let it be recorded if he was not able to do the drill?


Is this a poker match, or are they getting ready to play tackle football?

For some reason I don't buy the "weak is strong" argument. Guy got an AC joint injury just before Christmas. He's still in pain and not 100%. Book it.

My prediction: He can throw the ball for 4 quarters, but like our week 18 game, he'll be running away from contact at all times.
Lol at saying someone is 100% for not being in the injury list.  
robbieballs2003 : 1/19/2023 3:44 pm : link
A team is only obligated to put a player on the injury list, if I am not mistaken, if he misses any portion of practice. You can still practice, know you will you play, and not be 100%.
RE: we  
bigblue5611 : 1/19/2023 3:44 pm : link
In comment 16002472 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
simply don't know. The Eagles know but we're going to find out on Saturday.


Agreed, I simply found this interesting. Either way Wink will want to test the 100% theory...
Starting the game at 100% does not necessarily mean  
Spider56 : 1/19/2023 3:46 pm : link
finishing it that way. Keep the game close with pressure and see what happens in the 4Q.
Doesn't matter  
Beer Man : 1/19/2023 3:51 pm : link
The team should prepare as those he will be 100%
RE: Hurts isn't on the injured list  
UConn4523 : 1/19/2023 3:52 pm : link
In comment 16002438 CromartiesKid21 said:
Quote:
He's 100%


So have no idea.
RE: Hurts isn't on the injured list  
djm : 1/19/2023 3:52 pm : link
In comment 16002438 CromartiesKid21 said:
Quote:
He's 100%


He is not 100%.
Hurts is absolutely not 100%  
BSIMatt : 1/19/2023 3:56 pm : link
Not that I care at all, but the injury list is the injury list...which if you follow football that translates to the injury list is fucking meaningless.

They had a doctor from UPenn talking about Hurt's specific injury, and the fact that he was in as much pain after they played the Giants in the finale he said was "concerning". An injury like that is not healing in this short amount of time, not a chance. Now, I could care less...because in my eyes it doesn't matter..gameplan exactly as if he were 100% and go play. But yeah, there's zero chance Hurts is 100% and the early tell will be how much(and how early) they are using his designed run packages..which they took off the shelf in the finale. I don't think they'll take them off the shelf in this one, but I do think they are going to be a bit more cautious..we will see.
You will know on the first possession  
nygiants16 : 1/19/2023 3:57 pm : link
if he is healthy, if he is scrambiling around and they are calling runs for him then he is healthy, if he is protecting that shoulder and not agressive then you know he isnt
Unfortunately, at first glance, i don't see the shoulder as a problem  
Rich_Houston_1971 : 1/19/2023 3:57 pm : link
In the last game he was throwing hard down the field despite the shoulder.

However, maybe they will not do much RPO to protect Hurts. I think we will find out in the first two series what they do but if the game is close in 4th qtr, the eagles will open the playbook and run the RPO regardless of his shoulder.

The smart play for the Giants is to anticipate the RPO will be played in 4th quearter if game is close and adjust the personnel to that.
I think Wink is going to load up the box  
BSIMatt : 1/19/2023 3:59 pm : link
Make Hurts throw it 40 times, and blitz the ever living shit out of him and see if he can hold up.
RE: I think Wink is going to load up the box  
Rich_Houston_1971 : 1/19/2023 4:07 pm : link
In comment 16002528 BSIMatt said:
Quote:
Make Hurts throw it 40 times, and blitz the ever living shit out of him and see if he can hold up.


Giants have to be smart with how they execute and hit with the blitz because the refs will throw that flag knowing Hurts is hurt.
Who had a similar injury  
Spiciest Memelord : 1/19/2023 4:07 pm : link
and how long did it take to get back to 100%?
RE: Unfortunately, at first glance, i don't see the shoulder as a problem  
Dr. D : 1/19/2023 4:13 pm : link
In comment 16002525 Rich_Houston_1971 said:
Quote:
In the last game he was throwing hard down the field despite the shoulder.

However, maybe they will not do much RPO to protect Hurts. I think we will find out in the first two series what they do but if the game is close in 4th qtr, the eagles will open the playbook and run the RPO regardless of his shoulder.

The smart play for the Giants is to anticipate the RPO will be played in 4th quearter if game is close and adjust the personnel to that.

Welcome back Rich_Houston_1971

Don't get yourself killed this Sat night!
they will prepare  
Allen in CNJ : 1/19/2023 4:15 pm : link
as if he is 100% and go from there... anything else would be illogical in game planning
“Sweep the shoulder”  
gmen4ever : 1/19/2023 4:17 pm : link
Do it…sweep the shoulder!! LOL
Whether his shoulder is 100% or not, the Giants should find out  
chick310 : 1/19/2023 4:18 pm : link
by having Big Dex examine it closely on the first drive.

RE: Unfortunately, at first glance, i don't see the shoulder as a problem  
ajr2456 : 1/19/2023 4:23 pm : link
In comment 16002525 Rich_Houston_1971 said:
Quote:
In the last game he was throwing hard down the field despite the shoulder.

However, maybe they will not do much RPO to protect Hurts. I think we will find out in the first two series what they do but if the game is close in 4th qtr, the eagles will open the playbook and run the RPO regardless of his shoulder.

The smart play for the Giants is to anticipate the RPO will be played in 4th quearter if game is close and adjust the personnel to that.


If the Eagles run less or no RPO, it’s to the Giants advantage in a big way.
RE: RE: Unfortunately, at first glance, i don't see the shoulder as a problem  
BSIMatt : 1/19/2023 4:30 pm : link
In comment 16002586 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
In comment 16002525 Rich_Houston_1971 said:


Quote:


In the last game he was throwing hard down the field despite the shoulder.

However, maybe they will not do much RPO to protect Hurts. I think we will find out in the first two series what they do but if the game is close in 4th qtr, the eagles will open the playbook and run the RPO regardless of his shoulder.

The smart play for the Giants is to anticipate the RPO will be played in 4th quearter if game is close and adjust the personnel to that.



If the Eagles run less or no RPO, it’s to the Giants advantage in a big way.


It would be huge…as that is at the core of the Eagles offense…it is exactly the equivalent effect of the change to Washington’s offense when RG3 could no longer run…that is the core concept of the offense that sets the table for everything else. Without the run threat Hurts becomes a jag.
Prepare  
gfinop : 1/19/2023 4:38 pm : link
as if Hurts is going to be running hard all over the field.

Hopefully, running behind the LOS.
RE: RE: RE: Unfortunately, at first glance, i don't see the shoulder as a problem  
ajr2456 : 1/19/2023 4:40 pm : link
In comment 16002603 BSIMatt said:
Quote:


It would be huge…as that is at the core of the Eagles offense…it is exactly the equivalent effect of the change to Washington’s offense when RG3 could no longer run…that is the core concept of the offense that sets the table for everything else. Without the run threat Hurts becomes a jag.


Maybe it’s their Plaxico
Healthy or not  
SLIM_ : 1/19/2023 4:47 pm : link
hit him hard and keep hitting him hard.

Yes. Easier said then done but more importantly in my mind is Lane Johnson being limited. Hurts is a great runner but is a great passer (this year) only because he has had all day to throw. We need Dex/Leo/Thibs to dominate and we need for Wink to free up people on blitzes. If we do that, I think we see a different Hurts then what he has shown this year.
RE: Unfortunately, at first glance, i don't see the shoulder as a problem  
AcesUp : 1/19/2023 4:49 pm : link
In comment 16002525 Rich_Houston_1971 said:
Quote:
In the last game he was throwing hard down the field despite the shoulder.

However, maybe they will not do much RPO to protect Hurts. I think we will find out in the first two series what they do but if the game is close in 4th qtr, the eagles will open the playbook and run the RPO regardless of his shoulder.

The smart play for the Giants is to anticipate the RPO will be played in 4th quearter if game is close and adjust the personnel to that.


In Week 18 they weren't running any zone read and Hurts was going out of his way not to scramble. Wink seemed to know it as well and wasn't defending it. This little thing allowed us to neutralize Sanders (no threat of zone read from Hurts), helped our pass rush and provided extra bodies in the secondary. The rushing component from Hurts is HUGE. Same as Jones has the hidden value with his legs but magnified even further.

If Hurts is limited at all with his legs out of fear of aggravating the shoulder, it changes everything.
I do think Wink  
AcesUp : 1/19/2023 4:54 pm : link
will attack him early to test him and get in his head. Get him thinking about that injury. If he starts to burn us with his legs he'll adjust.
RE: RE: Unfortunately, at first glance, i don't see the shoulder as a problem  
Essex : 1/19/2023 5:12 pm : link
In comment 16002637 AcesUp said:
Quote:
In comment 16002525 Rich_Houston_1971 said:


Quote:


In the last game he was throwing hard down the field despite the shoulder.

However, maybe they will not do much RPO to protect Hurts. I think we will find out in the first two series what they do but if the game is close in 4th qtr, the eagles will open the playbook and run the RPO regardless of his shoulder.

The smart play for the Giants is to anticipate the RPO will be played in 4th quearter if game is close and adjust the personnel to that.



In Week 18 they weren't running any zone read and Hurts was going out of his way not to scramble. Wink seemed to know it as well and wasn't defending it. This little thing allowed us to neutralize Sanders (no threat of zone read from Hurts), helped our pass rush and provided extra bodies in the secondary. The rushing component from Hurts is HUGE. Same as Jones has the hidden value with his legs but magnified even further.

If Hurts is limited at all with his legs out of fear of aggravating the shoulder, it changes everything.


They are going to run Hurts this game. They are not saving him for anything anymore--this is win or go home. Plus, last time they had 16-0 lead last time which allowed them to be conservative. And, if my memory serves me correctly (which it might not in this situation), we never had the ball with a chance to take the lead, which would make their offense more risk-avers.
Essex  
AcesUp : 1/19/2023 5:15 pm : link
I agree completely on all accounts. That wasn't a component of their game because they didn't have to. I expect them to play their game on Saturday as well. I do think Wink will attack early to test him though.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Unfortunately, at first glance, i don't see the shoulder as a problem  
joeinpa : 1/19/2023 5:52 pm : link
In comment 16002619 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
In comment 16002603 BSIMatt said:


Quote:




It would be huge…as that is at the core of the Eagles offense…it is exactly the equivalent effect of the change to Washington’s offense when RG3 could no longer run…that is the core concept of the offense that sets the table for everything else. Without the run threat Hurts becomes a jag.



Maybe it’s their Plaxico


That thought has occurred to me.

Did you remember that in 08, that the Eagles beat the Vikings in the wildcard round before playing the Giants, Papa pointed that out today
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Unfortunately, at first glance, i don't see the shoulder as a problem  
ajr2456 : 1/19/2023 6:35 pm : link
In comment 16002738 joeinpa said:
Quote:


Maybe it’s their Plaxico



That thought has occurred to me.

Did you remember that in 08, that the Eagles beat the Vikings in the wildcard round before playing the Giants, Papa pointed that out today


Yup. Life is funny like that sometimes
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 1/19/2023 6:36 pm : link
The '08 Eagles also went 9-6-1, much like we went 9-7-1 this season.

Lincoln had a secretary named Kennedy. Kennedy had a secretary named Lincoln.
Question: When defending an RPO are you allowed  
HopePhil and Optimistic : 1/19/2023 6:47 pm : link
To assign a player to commit to taking out the QB as long as it's not blatantly late? If so, and if Hurts is at risk of further injury do you think their play callers would avoid the RPO?

I mean theoretically, you could have both edge rushers crashing in from each side and consistently get free hits on the QB?
RE: Question: When defending an RPO are you allowed  
ajr2456 : 1/19/2023 6:54 pm : link
In comment 16002786 HopePhil and Optimistic said:
Quote:
To assign a player to commit to taking out the QB as long as it's not blatantly late? If so, and if Hurts is at risk of further injury do you think their play callers would avoid the RPO?

I mean theoretically, you could have both edge rushers crashing in from each side and consistently get free hits on the QB?


If it’s a read option yea, you can hit him within reason. You probably wouldn’t get away with free hits on him on RPO plays
RE: RE: Question: When defending an RPO are you allowed  
Matt123 : 1/19/2023 7:12 pm : link
In comment 16002792 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
In comment 16002786 HopePhil and Optimistic said:


Quote:


To assign a player to commit to taking out the QB as long as it's not blatantly late? If so, and if Hurts is at risk of further injury do you think their play callers would avoid the RPO?

I mean theoretically, you could have both edge rushers crashing in from each side and consistently get free hits on the QB?



If it’s a read option yea, you can hit him within reason. You probably wouldn’t get away with free hits on him on RPO plays


I remember seeing that happen before, should be effective. I wonder if they'd be less likely to try that given DJ is also a running QB?

RE: ...  
Spider56 : 1/19/2023 7:35 pm : link
In comment 16002779 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
The '08 Eagles also went 9-6-1, much like we went 9-7-1 this season.

Lincoln had a secretary named Kennedy. Kennedy had a secretary named Lincoln.


And both of their VPs were named Johnson ...
And both were elected to Congress in ‘46 and President in ‘60...
And both of their alleged assassins were killed before they stood trial..
And the Giants are going to beat the Eagles (at some point).
i loved how Justin Jefferson got hit after every catch  
jmalls23 : 1/19/2023 8:17 pm : link
They will do the same thing to Hurts. make him pay for ay runs
I kept saying that to my son during Vikings game  
BSIMatt : 1/19/2023 11:32 pm : link
Even after a pass attempt kept seeing Cousins picking himself up off the ground. I kept telling my son, just keep doing that..don’t even worry about sacks. Hits are cumulative, like going to the body in boxing. Make him feel you every play. Hurts should be feeling regrets Saturday night for even lacing them up, make him regret even setting foot on that field.
Hit him legal  
PA Aggie : 1/20/2023 8:31 am : link
But hit him hard.
And often.
RE: Hit him legal  
giantBCP : 1/20/2023 8:38 am : link
In comment 16003077 PA Aggie said:
Quote:
But hit him hard.
And often.


Plaster him on any run option plays.
If he is indeed hurt...  
Doug in MA : 1/20/2023 9:51 am : link
...than I'm not surprised he's off the injury report. Why put him on there? The Giants thinking he's a real threat to run with the ball helps the Eagles right? Same thing if his shoulder was 100% but they keep him on the report to keep the Giants guessing?

...  
ryanmkeane : 1/20/2023 9:59 am : link
get a nice spear shot to that shoulder early on...
RE: RE: I think Wink is going to load up the box  
Gfan in PA : 1/20/2023 10:36 am : link
In comment 16002550 Rich_Houston_1971 said:
Quote:
In comment 16002528 BSIMatt said:


Quote:


Make Hurts throw it 40 times, and blitz the ever living shit out of him and see if he can hold up.



Giants have to be smart with how they execute and hit with the blitz because the refs will throw that flag knowing Hurts is hurt.


This....Rich is right here. I am concerned what constitutes a "legal hit" these days. They have to be very smart here with all the press about his bad shoulder I expect to see some quick flags flying. Still think you have to play the game and take the shots. One or two RTP calls may be worth it if they can knock Hurts out of the game.
RE: RE: I think Wink is going to load up the box  
Gfan in PA : 1/20/2023 10:38 am : link
In comment 16002550 Rich_Houston_1971 said:
Quote:
In comment 16002528 BSIMatt said:


Quote:


Make Hurts throw it 40 times, and blitz the ever living shit out of him and see if he can hold up.



Giants have to be smart with how they execute and hit with the blitz because the refs will throw that flag knowing Hurts is hurt.


This....Rich is right here. I am concerned what constitutes a "legal hit" these days. They have to be very smart here with all the press about his bad shoulder I expect to see some quick flags flying. Still think you have to play the game and take the shots. One or two RTP calls may be worth it if they can knock Hurts out of the game.
Sorry about the double post.....  
Gfan in PA : 1/20/2023 10:39 am : link
@#!$%!*
The shoulder joint is the most fragile joint  
Rjanyg : 1/20/2023 10:57 am : link
the space between the humurus, the clavical and the scapula is minute. Any inflammation can cause tightness and pain.

That said, you have to think Hurts is getting trainers and therapists twice a day.

It will be interesting to see how much the Eagles have designed runs for him.
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