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| Film Talk Football @FilmTalkFB · 2h · Report: #Giants DT Leonard Williams is expected to restructure his contract in order to attempt to stay with the team. His current ‘23 cap hit, $32.3 Million, Would be brought down to at least $24 Million. #TogetherBlue |
re-structuring is not a pay cut.
I mean, his current cap hit is already "at least" $24M. I weep for the English language.
I think the best approach is to find a trading partner for LW.
True, but pretty much expected?
I mean, his current cap hit is already "at least" $24M. I weep for the English language.
I took it as that’s the lowest his cap number will possibly go with this.
Is he over paid, yeah, but he's still a plus player. Little easier to bite the bullet in terms of cap hit without making the future more difficult
I'd say the Giants have bigger fish to fry when it comes to getting out of bad contracts.
He was injured a lot this season. Would it be wise to extend him when he’s reaching 30 years old. I’m not so sure.
Think longer term.
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he's in his football and earning prime. More likely they extend him and push some cap hit into the future.
He was injured a lot this season. Would it be wise to extend him when he’s reaching 30 years old. I’m not so sure.
He’ll be 29 in June..
if he gets cut the giants save 18m and he is on the open market, a lot like bradberry last year who ended up losing about 4m this year vs what he would have made as a nyg. maybe his open market value is enough to make him whole, maybe not.
but remember the giants can obviously control when they decide to put him on the market. they could wait until after the draft just like bradberry. they could tell LW and his agent they first need to try to get their UFA's extended, and that they are also trying to get lawrence extended, and unless LW is prepared to extend for their # right now they are going to need to put talks with him on hold and then either work out a new deal later in the offseason or move on from the contract. that is their leverage over LW if he wants to stay and doesn't want a few months of uncertainty.
a straight restructure in this case would be guaranteeing leonard williams net new money from that 18m that is currently at risk. it takes bullets out of their gun. and it would be doing so in an offseason where i dont see much need for immediate cap space bc the UFA market stinks. it would be a bad strategic move imo.
now maybe an unexpected player becomes available in may/june/july and they've chose to keep LW but want to clear some space to add the player (kind of like another team's bradberry) then maybe it makes sense. but that seems a pretty fringe case.
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he's in his football and earning prime. More likely they extend him and push some cap hit into the future.
He was injured a lot this season. Would it be wise to extend him when he’s reaching 30 years old. I’m not so sure.
I'm long on record here of not paying big dollars to a 3-4 DE. There's both financial cap and football architecture reasons to move on, especially when the defense has needs on the DL, ILB, and CB. NYG might need the cap space too, depending on how their various deals go to retain their own players. Perhaps it comes down to keeping Leo or SB, for example, we'll see.
The post you responded to above was me speaking just to the OP.
That's exactly what will happen if I had to bet.
I'd rather pay an equally good player at LB or edge, draft a young 3/4 DE/DT, but we are better off keeping Williams than cutting him. Unless there's a team out there that wants to trade a good player back, I doubt the trade route is feasible.
Lesser of all evils seems to be spread his money out and keep him. I guess we will see. These NFL off seasons are getting wackier by the year with trades so may be it's not so crazy. I would think his cap hit makes it tough to trade but who the hell knows.
Keep in mind, if we run the draft (kind of as I think we are going to) where we may even move down and out of RD 1 to acquire more 2nd and 3rd picks this year and maybe even ammo for next years draft (also what I expect) then we will see a number of younger cheaper guys at WR, CB, LB.. The Giants have a TON of flexibility with a number of these guys and ways to make signings be easily fit into this year with the amount of space we have going forward.
the nyg could cut him in july and he has to find a new team with very little cap room available league wide and uproot himself just a few weeks ahead of camp. coming off his first year with some injuries as he's approaching 30. or he could get a bad 2nd opinion about his neck not healing and it's all over with $0.
that is the cold reality of the nfl and it happened to bradberry just last year, who lost money this year despite it probably working out for him in the long run.
so there is incentive for both sides to extend and restructure his current deal along the lines of something like this:
this is effectively a 2 year, 29m extension, 20m gtd, that lowers his cap hit by 11m this year alone.
in the process it guarantees leo $20m new dollars where he currently has $0 guaranteed dollars remaining. he gets the $18m cash he was scheduled to get this year, likely sticks around next year and collects another 11m salary, though the nyg could move on after this year if they want and he would hit UFA just as he's scheduled to right now. the 3rd year at 15m would be unlikely unless he is still playing at a high level.
from sy's review of the minnesota game.
-Lawrence and Williams were on the field for all but six plays, an uptick from what we saw over the final month of the season. The magnitude of the game and lack of quality depth behind them dictated that. Ryder Anderson and Justin Ellis saw a few snaps and it did not go well. I know Lawrence + Williams cannot stay on the field every single snap, but it is hard to get these two off of the field and not experience a drastic decline in impact up front.
Cutting him simply accelerates bonuses that have already been paid.
The only question to answer: is Leonard Williams worth 18M in new cash next year? If the answer is no, you do what it takes to bring that number down.
Eric in Li has laid it out above well. Williams has a lot of say in it, but ultimately the Giants can just cut him.
Williams can bet on himself, and refuse to take a pay cut or team friend extension. If he's the guy many of you believe he is, he should probably do that.
However, he also loved bringing up how he is all ears on Williams taking a pay cut from his lockerroom quote. Schoen made the kind of comment you make in jest but with necessary truth behind it. He values Williams less and it’s probably not as close as some think on here.
The smart play is to shop LW sooner vs later and not restructure.
Credit to him for playing through it in 2021, but he was definitely impacted by his injury.
You work to keep provided he checks out health wise.
Let the drafts catch up. These types of players are very hard to find and they often need some time to develop.
Cutting him simply accelerates bonuses that have already been paid.
The only question to answer: is Leonard Williams worth 18M in new cash next year? If the answer is no, you do what it takes to bring that number down.
Eric in Li has laid it out above well. Williams has a lot of say in it, but ultimately the Giants can just cut him.
Williams can bet on himself, and refuse to take a pay cut or team friend extension. If he's the guy many of you believe he is, he should probably do that.
if he got cut ahead of UFA I think he'd get something like 15-20m guaranteed on a 2 or 3 year deal with an aav between 10-15m. that obviously depends on medicals and i think it's probably closer to a best case scenario.
of course the nyg have no need to cut him ahead of UFA because they have plenty of cap room to let things play out. which is where williams' leverage goes south. my guess above is probably a little high but i think it lays out the general structure of what will likely transpire (especially since the player has already publicly shown an awareness of his situational leverage as well as a desire to continue playing next to his best friend, whom he also wants to see get paid).
However, he also loved bringing up how he is all ears on Williams taking a pay cut from his lockerroom quote. Schoen made the kind of comment you make in jest but with necessary truth behind it. He values Williams less and it’s probably not as close as some think on here.
The smart play is to shop LW sooner vs later and not restructure.
100%.
Having close to 40M tied up in DTs is pretty inept.
Credit to him for playing through it in 2021, but he was definitely impacted by his injury.
i agree with that and i think my guess above is probably a little high. an extension aav around 15m while baking in the dead money they still need to account for is probably more realistic.
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Eric, the only correction I'd make to your assessment above, is Williams has been impacted by injuries the last two years.
Credit to him for playing through it in 2021, but he was definitely impacted by his injury.
i agree with that and i think my guess above is probably a little high. an extension aav around 15m while baking in the dead money they still need to account for is probably more realistic.
according to OTC an extension will save the Giants about 14Million in cap space. That's a substantial number. There is quite a bit more space we can open up if we wanted to as well.
Speaking strictly financially, it probably would be best for him to play hardball and take his chances getting cut. However, he's made out very well financially over his career and the opportunity to play in a favorable situation for the first time in his career could be a motivator. Dex freeing him up could even result in another decent pay day at ~age 31.
There are some, but not a bunch that do.
This is a total swag, but if Williams was an UFA, I think he would command 3/45 with 50% guaranteed.
Because the Giants don't need the cap room next year, I'd opt for the Eric in Li special, and make it a flat 15M per. With the acknowledgment the cap hits in year one and two would be higher because of the existing bonuses.
14.2M of that money is sunk cost and immovable. But the Giants don’t have a cap space issue in 2023, and can most certainly put together a team.
The only relevant question is whether Williams is worth 18M in new cash next year.