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What would it take to beat the Eagles in '23

CMicks3110 : 1/24/2023 7:12 pm
I don't mean generalities like build through the draft, sign good free agents. I'm asking for opinions on how we should construct the roster with the specific purpose of beating the Eagles, because, assuming they are healthy I think it's clear the road to the Super Bowl will go through them next year, as they did this year.

It is my opinion that, and I stated this yesterday on another thread, that we have to build the depth of the D-Line. I think Dex and Leo are as good as any duo to deal with the iggles interior line, especially if Leo is Healthy, but they need a quality backup. I will again mention Dalvin Tomlinson as an ideal fit. He's a known quantity in the building, which is something Schoen has said he likes, has been durable, is a good teammate, and does everything that Justin Ellis and Ryder Anderson could never dream of doing. He also won't cost a ton given his position and the fact that he's 29.

but the Edges need to improve against the run. I think Sy mentioned the Jihad Ward Role being of particular importance. I would target someone like Chris Wormley in Free Agency, there are some targets that could be available in Round 2-3 (such as Mike Morris of Michigan, Zach Harrison of OSU, and Keioin White of GT). To attack the eagles O-Line, it has to be power rushing, not speed rushing, Hurts is too good at escaping, and we need rush that can force him to throw from in the pocket.

Next position we have to focus on is corner. Sy mentioned that Adoree' looked fine on deep routes, and I'm glad to hear that since I think he's been very solid when healthy. I would like to trade for Jalen Ramsey to start opposite Adoree'. He's young enough, still an elite athlete, and a competitor and the Rams have no reason to keep him. What will he cost, not sure. If not Ramsey via trade, there are some Free Agent corners I would pursue to replace Moreau (Jamel Dean?). They wouldn't be able to shut down Devonta Smith or AJ Brown on their own like Ramsey might be able to, but gives us more flexibility to blitz.

Wide Receiver obviously stands out as a need, but I am not sure we need to spend a lot of our resources (Cash or Picks) on the top tier of available players (unless of course that player stands out on the value side). Hodgins, James and Slayton worked for this offense against a lot of defenses. Of course this thread is about beating the eagles so we would need some players that have more reliable hands than Slayton while also replicating his speed. I know folks are going to hate this suggestion, but I still think OBJ is a good fit for this offense, and then we can pepper in a few mid-round receivers to see if we can build with depth.

The offenses ineffectiveness, like many others, was due to their line play. Sure, the Eagles had 70 sacks this year, but I am going to take Sy's word on how beneficial top OL talent is. That's why I'm going OG in Free Agency AND OC in Draft. My specific targets are Issac Seumalo for LG, and John Michael Schmitz in Round 2 for OC.

That leaves me with the last of our major resources, our round 1 pick, if I'm looking to beat the Eagles, the piece tat carved us up with Miles Sanders, with the read option of Hurts, to deal with. We need a linebacker with speed and elite insticts. I would target LB Trenton Simpson at the end of round 1 (my ideal scenario would be a slight trade down to pick up an extra 3rd) I would also spend some money on a veteran linebacker to help mentor, someone like Lavonte David could work.

Anyway, that's how I would go about attacking the Eagles.

Key Additions:

CB-Jalen Ramsey (for 3rd Round, 4th and Conditional 2024 Pick)
DT-Dalvin Tomlinson Free Agency
DL-Chris Wormley - Free Agency
OG-Isaac Seumalo - Free Agency
LB-Trenton Simpson - Draft
LB-Lavonte David, Free Agency
OC-John Michael Schmitz - Draft
WR-Odell Beckham Jr. - Free Agency

Of course, I'm also dishing out contracts to DJ, SB, Julian Love, Dexter, and restructuring Leo. Cutting Golladay obviously too.














Stop their running game....force Hurts to beat you.  
George from PA : 1/24/2023 7:18 pm : link
And control clock with long drives.

Do not let them build a big lead
An offseason similar to the 2021 Eagles  
CornerStone246+17 : 1/24/2023 7:23 pm : link
Traded for a #1 WR, signed a quality 2nd boundary CB, added veteran depth at remaining weak spots.
Build the lines  
SirLoinOfBeef : 1/24/2023 7:42 pm : link
.

Starters and depth.
Eagles have 2 its round picks...  
GMen72 : 1/24/2023 7:43 pm : link
They'll have to pay Hurts, which will hurt, but they'll replenish in the draft.

Only way the Giants beat them in 23 is if Hurts gets hurt.
first things first....  
BillKo : 1/24/2023 8:02 pm : link
...the Eagles will probably digress next year. How much? The Giants appear on the upswing. How much?

Eagles have contracts, free agents, and possible retirements. It's reasonable to suggest they won't be as good next year and even articles out of Philly suggest this.

Conversely, you'd hope the Giants thru the draft and FA and experience will get better.

So right there the gap is likely to closed. I can guarantee the Eagles will not own the LOS next year like they did this year. Then there's turnovers and injuries, and just the regular ebb and flow of how NFL franchises go.

Splitting with Philly and Dallas is not some unobtainable reach.

The Eagles have the 10th pick  
Dave on the UWS : 1/24/2023 8:26 pm : link
in the draft, 2 #1s and a bunch of other high picks. Don’t think they are regressing anytime soon, unfortunately. Maybe from SB hangover.
What would it take to beat the Eagles in '23  
Jim in NH : 1/24/2023 8:35 pm : link
Divine intervention.

No one is more critical of the Maras than I have been - but fans who have NEVER recognized how bad the Giants were by 2016, and how long hiring proper management AND LETTING THEM DO THEIR WORK would take to build a champion are definitely part of the problem.

The Giants are not beating the Eagles in 2023, and probably not in 2024, either.
They need to lose players in FA and have injuries  
Payasdaddy : 1/24/2023 8:36 pm : link
And we need to sign our own, sign a few FA that work out and draft well
Plus have all our hurt guys come back strong
I think we really need two more solid drafts
Simpson probably goes in the first, but not to the Giants.  
81_Great_Dane : 1/24/2023 8:37 pm : link
Schmitz might be there when the Giants pick in the 2nd.

I think the thinking on signing free agents is mostly good but I suspect Tomlinson will be too expensive to re-sign, especially since he'd probably not be a "starter." Dex isn't moving off his position and Williams is the other starting DT. Tomlinson would probably be a rotational guy. I'd love to have him back but I think he's a starter and will want starter money.

NYG have 11 picks (assuming 2 comp picks); you're trading two of them, so we'd be back down to 9. You list 2 of them. What are you thinking for the other 7? There's a reasonable chance of getting at least one starter at a non-premium position out of them.

I'd love to see them pick a young hybrid D lineman who can function as a DT or DE, depending on the situation and scheme. At the very least, someone who can back up Leonard Williams and maybe replace him in a year or two.
It will take a better oline and players on defense that pressure  
Jack Stroud : 1/24/2023 10:26 pm : link
Hurt.
RE: The Eagles have the 10th pick  
section125 : 1/24/2023 10:35 pm : link
In comment 16012813 Dave on the UWS said:
Quote:
in the draft, 2 #1s and a bunch of other high picks. Don’t think they are regressing anytime soon, unfortunately. Maybe from SB hangover.


They only have $4.9 mill under the cap right now and they have a couple players set to make mid $20 mill next year and many over $10 mill...the cap will set them back automatically. It is true they have 2 #1s which will help. especially if the drafted players can replace the high $$ players.

By comparison the Giants are starting at $58 mill cap space with some easy cuts saving another $20 mill.

It will still take 2 years to reasonably compete with the Eagles and Cowboys.
RE: The Eagles have the 10th pick  
BillKo : 1/24/2023 10:35 pm : link
In comment 16012813 Dave on the UWS said:
Quote:
in the draft, 2 #1s and a bunch of other high picks. Don’t think they are regressing anytime soon, unfortunately. Maybe from SB hangover.


You're assuming their picks, however high, are going to replace accomplished NFL starters.

Or, their backups are going to step in and be front line starters.

Here's their picks: 1,1,2,3,7,7.

Things in the NFL change in a hurry.

Heck, just look at the Eagles in 2020.



Based on your suggestions...  
Brown_Hornet : 1/24/2023 10:42 pm : link
...you would need the cap to increase by $100m.
Of it takes 2 years to compete with pHilly  
dancing blue bear : 1/24/2023 11:20 pm : link
We have the wrong ppl in charge. We split with them the last 2 years (1 loss being the engram drop game)


They were 9-8 last year and bounced in the first round. That is not miles ahead. And miles ahead doesn’t really exist in the modern NFL anyway.

Th league is gonna go to work on how to stop the offense as it is fairly unique. Similar to how Baltimore took the league by storm the first year or 2 and then settled in to where they are now. Hurts is going to have to progress as a passer and probabl run less (or risk injury). There are quite a few expensive and older vets which will require decisions. Will they pay jalen or make him do it again?

Will either coordinator become a head coach. They had pretty good luck with health this year.

Giants need to shore up the OL and get depth on the DL. ADD in a real linebacker and we are competing with them next year.

They are a very good team, no doubt , and had a great season. I think there was some perfect storm elements to the season

Eagles fans think they are on the precipice of a dynasty (again). They have demonstrated their intelligence time and again
Well the Giants need to get better  
Breeze_94 : 1/25/2023 12:46 am : link
Young guys who are going to play bigger roles next year need to emerge as legitimate NFL starters (Ezeudu, Flott, Belton, W.Robinson)

Guys like Thibs, Neal, Jones, Ojulari, and McKinney need to stay healthy and continue to develop.

Then a solid FA haul and great draft.

The Eagles also went all in on their roster this year - tacking on void years that will limit their cap flexibility in 2023 AND 2024.

Sure, they have 2 first round picks, but only 6 picks total and 4mil cap this year (with not many easy ways to clear money)

Right now, the following starters are due to hit FA
RB Sanders
RG Seamulo
DE Graham
DT Cox
DT Hargrave
LB Edwards
LB White
CB Bradberry
S Epps
S Johnson

Many of those guys will be gone, and older vets like Kelce, Johnson, and Slay are not going to play at an all pro level forever.
The eagles  
3rdnlong : 1/25/2023 2:52 am : link
Are all in for this year. They could lose many of their key players, and they have to pay their QB. While they will still be good, the league will catch up to them. I heard the ‘85 Bears were going to be a dynasty, until everyone figured out the 46 defense. There are hundreds of examples like this. Once a team has to pay big money to the QB, they take a step back.
Can’t beat the Eagles. Never will.  
State Your Name : 1/25/2023 5:45 am : link
Just write off the two losses every year, and hopefully never see them in the playoffs. That’s the best we can do. Ever.
Rewatching that game  
bLiTz 2k : 1/25/2023 6:01 am : link
Once the eagles effectively got multiple hats on both DTs, it was over.

This was a game that totally exposed Jaylon Smith and Jarrad Davis in the inside run game.

They absolutely need to get better there. Better depth on the DL is nice, but it's not like our guys were gassed. They were taken out of the play with no support at the second level.
RE: Rewatching that game  
giantBCP : 1/25/2023 6:16 am : link
In comment 16013049 bLiTz 2k said:
Quote:
Once the eagles effectively got multiple hats on both DTs, it was over.

This was a game that totally exposed Jaylon Smith and Jarrad Davis in the inside run game.

They absolutely need to get better there. Better depth on the DL is nice, but it's not like our guys were gassed. They were taken out of the play with no support at the second level.


They gained 150 rushing yards before contact, and over 150 rushing yards over expected. They put up similar numbers in the week 14 game. Those two games were two of the six most efficient rushing performances of all teams over the course of the whole season.
Link - ( New Window )
Not to miller this thread..  
1st and 10 : 1/25/2023 7:43 am : link
but Dallas has no cap space and have some pending key people hitting FA. We should be able to overtake them next year for at least the #2 slot in the East.

Dallas will still be a thorn in our side though until we learn to beat them, plus they have a good DC and Parsons.

Washington is 4th until we know who the QB is.

Swap  
thrunthrublue : 1/25/2023 12:03 pm : link
Jerseys.
This will do it...  
BamaBlue : 1/25/2023 12:57 pm : link
I believe  
Joe Beckwith : 1/25/2023 4:35 pm : link
that our improvements will advance the Giants closer to the the rest of the division, especially Philly, Dallas than THEIR improvements.
depends  
bc4life : 1/25/2023 9:39 pm : link
if Kelce and or Cox walk away - weakened team
definitely need to upgrade interior OL  
bc4life : 1/25/2023 9:41 pm : link
and getter better ILBs
We were embarrassed against the run this season  
JoeMoney19 : 1/25/2023 10:11 pm : link
unless teams made the mistake of game planning away from it. The Eagles shone a painful light on it both in week 14 (253 rushing yards) and even more so in this divisional blowout (268 rushing yards). And last weekend their two best offensive skill players Brown and Smith didn't have to do anything. The Eagles knew that we couldn't stop their ground game so they hardly even bothered to use them.

I think before anything we have to shore up the defensive personnel to stop the run. I hope Wink is back, but he needs more guys to work with. Our ILB situation is a mess. I don't think much more needs to be said about that. Our interior line depth is terrible behind Lawrence who was great but played an unsustainably high percentage of snaps and LW who is effective when 100% but is not a guarantee to be. It's extremely noticeable when they are not on the field. Even our promising OLBs can't set the edge particularly well. KT does some things well against the run in terms of diagnosing plays and reacting, but I wouldn't say he sets the edge well (yet). Ward is ok at it but not someone you want out there for a ton of snaps given his other limitations. Ojulari even when he's healthy and flashing in other areas isn't good at it. The front seven personnel has massive issues as a run defense right now.

I think that is the biggest issue with our team right now. If we're going to beat the Eagle or any other team with a legitimate running game, meaningful improvement in this area has to be a key factor.
Everyone is focused on Jones and Barkley right now  
JoeMoney19 : 1/25/2023 10:30 pm : link
and deservedly so. I think they'll both be back for next season, whether I agree with those decisions or not. But I would guess (and hope) that our remaining offseason resources will be skewed heavily towards the defense.
RE: Not to miller this thread..  
fanatic II : 1/25/2023 11:14 pm : link
In comment 16013082 1st and 10 said:
Quote:
but Dallas has no cap space and have some pending key people hitting FA. We should be able to overtake them next year for at least the #2 slot in the East.

Dallas will still be a thorn in our side though until we learn to beat them, plus they have a good DC and Parsons.

Washington is 4th until we know who the QB is.


Dallas currently is 5 million over the cap, but by restructuring Prescott and cutting Elliott and Jordan Lewis would get Dallas up to 25 million in cap space. They also have other players they can restructure to get more space if needed.

The only players Dallas will probably resign are Pollard, Steele, and Donavan Wilson. There's a couple more but they will probably sign at a team friendly price. Cooper Rush is an example.

It always looks like Dallas will have trouble putting together a competitive team, but every year they do. Next year will be no different. Dallas will be the team that battles Philadelphia for the top spot in the NFCE.

Until NY shows they can beat Philadelphia and Dallas they will remain 3rd. If Washington were able to find a QB they might be able to escape the cellar.
rebuild...  
Bill E : 1/25/2023 11:25 pm : link
..the front seven.
Our defense could not stop them. The eagles were just running all over us.
It's easy to chalk it up to poor tackling, but it was really just a lack of talent.
I mean there were 5 or 6 guys on our defense that were just being run over.
Bottom line; we need a front seven that can stuff the run. Plain and simple.
It's a bit surprising how little play this gets on BBI.
RE: What would it take to beat the Eagles in '23  
eli4life : 1/26/2023 4:00 am : link
In comment 16012821 Jim in NH said:
Quote:
Divine intervention.

No one is more critical of the Maras than I have been - but fans who have NEVER recognized how bad the Giants were by 2016, and how long hiring proper management AND LETTING THEM DO THEIR WORK would take to build a champion are definitely part of the problem.

The Giants are not beating the Eagles in 2023, and probably not in 2024, either.


What a dumbass post. You do realize they are taking their shot this year. They have a lot of free agents and not much money. Not saying they won’t be good but not this level good. The gap will close quickly and sooner than later
Sign  
Chocco : 1/26/2023 5:20 am : link
Boston Scott
Eagles won't be able to afford him
Pick up a kick returner and you won't have to play against him.
(Only half joking)
Dominate the line of scrimmage...  
DefenseWins : 1/26/2023 5:39 am : link
...
Agree with building the lines  
joe48 : 1/26/2023 5:45 am : link
We need to get these drafts right. Willie McClay is keeping Dallas competitive by hitting in the draft despite the Jones boys meddling.
Kelce & Cox retirements  
bc4life : 1/28/2023 11:52 am : link
would be much appreciated
Putting aside injuries to their key players, there really is no  
ThomasG : 1/28/2023 1:06 pm : link
immediate path for the Giants to take beat the Eagles in 2023.

Of course the Eagles can lose a game, just like any team can beat on any given Sunday.

But the Giants are just not close enough in talent on either side of the ball, nor do anything special in any individual player/position matchup that givs them a clear advantage.

Unfortunate but rebuilding a poor roster doesn't happen overnight. And certainly won't happen by just giving the existing roster large salary raises.
Lawyers, Guns...  
BMac : 1/28/2023 8:12 pm : link
...and Money!
Well, if you don't want generalities, I'll be specific.  
Hades07 : 1/29/2023 12:49 am : link
Score more points than they do when we play them.
Significantly stronger lines on both sides  
moespree : 1/29/2023 2:19 am : link
And LBs with speed AND tackle ability.
The Eagles have some age in key spots ...  
FStubbs : 1/29/2023 8:52 am : link
... but have 3 #1s including the 10th pick overall.

Let's see what they do.

We could take a step back next year depending on the free agents we have.
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