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NGT - Derek Carr

mfjmfj : 1/26/2023 12:15 pm
I have read in a couple of threads that people expect the Raiders to trade Derek Carr. Who is trading for him? First of all it is guaranteed that he will be cut prior to 02/15 when $40MM of gurantees kick in, unless a trade deal is already worked out. Secondly, if you trade for him, you get him on a 3 year $115MM deal with $40MM guaranteed. No bargain. If you want him, wait, don't give up resources and sign him cheaper. I know there is a competition risk, but is anyone paying him 3/$115/$40MM? I would definitely see him as a replacement to DJ if we go that way, but not at that price. Am I missing something?
No you are not missing anything.  
NYG07 : 1/26/2023 12:19 pm : link
They are trying to trade him because he is vastly overpaid. Something Joe Schoen should take note of, because this is where the Giants are headed.
"where the Giants are headed...  
Brown_Hornet : 1/26/2023 12:22 pm : link
..."

You think they have interest in Carr?
He will be released  
JoeyBigBlue : 1/26/2023 12:23 pm : link
No one is trading for that contract. He will then choose where he wants to go. I think the Jets are a good fit.
"where the Giants are headed...  
CDN-Mark : 1/26/2023 12:23 pm : link
No I think he saying we should not over pay Daniel Jones or we could be in this exact situation.
I think he  
46and2Blue : 1/26/2023 12:24 pm : link
means they are about to overpay DJ for mediocre QB al la Derek Carr... I disagree. And i think the raider will miss Carr more than they think.
RE: I think he  
eric2425ny : 1/26/2023 12:27 pm : link
In comment 16014738 46and2Blue said:
Quote:
means they are about to overpay DJ for mediocre QB al la Derek Carr... I disagree. And i think the raider will miss Carr more than they think.


I saw a stat the other day that the Raiders have had a bottom 5 defense the entire time he was QB there. Carr gets a bad rap, he’s a good QB. Look at this year, they lost like 5-6 games in the fourth when they were up multiple scores. Patrick Graham basically cost that team a likely playoff berth.
RE: No you are not missing anything.  
Big Blue '56 : 1/26/2023 12:29 pm : link
In comment 16014726 NYG07 said:
Quote:
They are trying to trade him because he is vastly overpaid. Something Joe Schoen should take note of, because this is where the Giants are headed.


You don’t know WHERE the Giants are headed. I’m sure they’ve shared nothing with anyone on the outside.
i could see him ending up in washington  
Fat Wally : 1/26/2023 12:31 pm : link
that would suck for us, they have a ton talent, and the QB play has always been bad which is why they are never in contention.
3/115 is a bargain for a quality starter  
Section331 : 1/26/2023 12:34 pm : link
these days. I don’t think Carr is an elite QB, but he is good. The Jets, as one example, could do a lot worse. The question is, what are they willing to give up. Given that LV will almost certainly cut him if not traded, I wouldn’t be giving up any 1sts for him.
RE: i could see him ending up in washington  
Pepe LePugh : 1/26/2023 12:46 pm : link
In comment 16014755 Fat Wally said:
Quote:
that would suck for us, they have a ton talent, and the QB play has always been bad which is why they are never in contention.

Yeah, Raiders are screwed as far as leverage. Someone mentioned Carr has a no-trade contract, and would can pick what teams he will accept. Commie’s second round pick likely gets the deal done. Then cut Wentz, saving $27M on their cap.
Teams are lining up for him  
Sy'56 : 1/26/2023 12:51 pm : link
.
Carr  
Straw Hat : 1/26/2023 12:55 pm : link
Is not good.
who is trading for him?  
Eric on Li : 1/26/2023 12:57 pm : link
take your pick from:

robert saleh
ron rivera
arthur smith
dennis allen
whoever gets hired in carolina
maybe even whoever gets hired in indy

or those guys can just go on with crappy QBs and increase the odds they get fired next black monday to the inconvenience and detriment of their families and job opportunities they've worked really hard for and may never get again.
RE: Carr  
Producer : 1/26/2023 1:07 pm : link
In comment 16014795 Straw Hat said:
Quote:
Is not good.


If Carr isn't good, then Jones isn't good.

In fact, Carr is firmly in the QB middle class. Certainly, not elite, and not worth the money he is being paid. But overpaid doesn't mean "isn't good".
Carr is a 10-15 QB.  
Tim in Eternal Blue : 1/26/2023 1:21 pm : link

He’s a starter in this league and will have multiple offers.
RE: Teams are lining up for him  
mfjmfj : 1/26/2023 1:26 pm : link
In comment 16014787 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
.


I don't doubt that Sy, but you don't think they want wait until he is cut? It is not far in the future. Maybe someone is salivating to get his contract, but it does not seem cheap to me.
Any knock on Jones  
jestersdead : 1/26/2023 1:30 pm : link
can be the same for Carr...Multiple coaches and OCs, owner mismanagement, etc...That being said, I prefer the Giants dont make the same mistake as the Raiders and pay their QB $40m a year
And if teams do look at  
mfjmfj : 1/26/2023 1:30 pm : link
$40 per year for 3 years (although only $40MM guaranteed) as a good enough deal to give up assets for, then it is hard to see how DJ takes less than $40/year. Hard for me to imagine that Derek Carr is much more desired than DJ right now. They are both middle of the road starters with upside to the bottom end of the top 10. DJ is young enough that I could see him maybe being a 2nd tier QB after Burrow, Mahomes, Allen, & herbert. Which one I prefer if probably a system question.
Okay, Okay.....If you want to compare Danny and Carr...Consider this.  
GiantBlue : 1/26/2023 1:31 pm : link
1. Jones' offensive weapons vs. Carr's. If Danny had Devonte Adams, Waller, Josh Jacobs and their other WR's....vs our group......What would his stats have been????

Much better me-thinks.

But a good lesson as to overpaying a so-so QB.
RE: Carr  
Mike in NY : 1/26/2023 1:31 pm : link
In comment 16014795 Straw Hat said:
Quote:
Is not good.


Overpaid, I would agree with. However, I think he can take teams to playoffs. He needs to be in a more stable organization where an OC/QB coach can rebuild him. He has a lot of bad habits from when he was the only thing keeping the Raiders competitive. I am also not sure if it is from his brother, but I have seen plenty of film where he had a lane to take off running and get first downs but he just throws it away rather than risk taking a hit.
RE: RE: Teams are lining up for him  
Eric on Li : 1/26/2023 1:37 pm : link
In comment 16014870 mfjmfj said:
Quote:
In comment 16014787 Sy'56 said:


Quote:


.



I don't doubt that Sy, but you don't think they want wait until he is cut? It is not far in the future. Maybe someone is salivating to get his contract, but it does not seem cheap to me.


why would 2 different teams give up day 2 picks for carson wentz the last 2 years?
why would a team give up 2 day picks for sam darnold?
why would a team give up picks to pay a 37 year matt ryan almost 20m per year?

why is it that all of those teams paid all those prices and are still looking for qbs?

why is it that several of those teams traded for vets even after drafting rookies in the first round?
RE: Okay, Okay.....If you want to compare Danny and Carr...Consider this.  
rsjem1979 : 1/26/2023 1:40 pm : link
In comment 16014886 GiantBlue said:
Quote:
1. Jones' offensive weapons vs. Carr's. If Danny had Devonte Adams, Waller, Josh Jacobs and their other WR's....vs our group......What would his stats have been????

Much better me-thinks.


Maybe, or maybe we'd have a bunch of posters here calling those guys "busts".
Stop  
section125 : 1/26/2023 1:41 pm : link
You are being logical!
Probably have to wait for the Rodgers shoe to drop  
AcesUp : 1/26/2023 1:42 pm : link
If those rumors are true but he will definitely have a market.
Teams like the Deadskins & the Jests should be in the market for him.  
Optimus-NY : 1/26/2023 1:44 pm : link
The man can play. He can take both of those teams to the playoffs.
RE: RE: Carr  
Brown_Hornet : 1/26/2023 1:46 pm : link
In comment 16014819 Producer said:
Quote:
In comment 16014795 Straw Hat said:


Quote:


Is not good.



If Carr isn't good, then Jones isn't good.

In fact, Carr is firmly in the QB middle class. Certainly, not elite, and not worth the money he is being paid. But overpaid doesn't mean "isn't good".
Another statement of fact ...except that it's not.
RE: RE: Okay, Okay.....If you want to compare Danny and Carr...Consider this.  
Producer : 1/26/2023 1:46 pm : link
In comment 16014908 rsjem1979 said:
Quote:
In comment 16014886 GiantBlue said:


Quote:


1. Jones' offensive weapons vs. Carr's. If Danny had Devonte Adams, Waller, Josh Jacobs and their other WR's....vs our group......What would his stats have been????

Much better me-thinks.



Maybe, or maybe we'd have a bunch of posters here calling those guys "busts".


Maybe he'd get to 21 TDs
I think there's a good chance he winds up with one of the NFC South  
Strahan91 : 1/26/2023 1:48 pm : link
teams. His struggles in colder weather are well documented and depending on what Brady does, that entire division may upgrade at QB.
If Carr had the contract DJ will get  
NoPeanutz : 1/26/2023 1:49 pm : link
he would be tradeable.
He may also have a no trade clause?  
ZogZerg : 1/26/2023 1:53 pm : link
Highly doubtful he is traded.
RE: RE: Carr  
NINEster : 1/26/2023 2:40 pm : link
In comment 16014819 Producer said:
Quote:
In comment 16014795 Straw Hat said:


Quote:


Is not good.



If Carr isn't good, then Jones isn't good.

In fact, Carr is firmly in the QB middle class. Certainly, not elite, and not worth the money he is being paid. But overpaid doesn't mean "isn't good".


This.

After Carr's 2016 season that ended in injury, to me he was always a very good QB. That was easily the Raiders' best shot at any real postseason damage since the Rich Gannon years.
Carr issue  
uconngiant : 1/26/2023 4:20 pm : link
was the new coaching staff. He is talented not a top 10 but better than most on here think.

I agree with Sy as a number of teams will be after him and the Jets, Panthers, Commanders, and Colts.
RE: Teams are lining up for him  
GiantGrit : 1/26/2023 5:38 pm : link
In comment 16014787 Sy'56 said:
Quote:
.


What’re your thoughts on him? Sounds like the league likes him more than fans. I think he’s a good player, too much was asked of him. Not a guy who can overcome bad defenses and poor coaching.

Probably will get tomatoes thrown at me for saying this - if i’m Baltimore i am heavily considering cashing in on Lamar’s value and then signing Carr. I like him with a steady HC, good defense and run game.

In reality there are 3 QB’s to me who can overcome poor deficiencies elsewhere on the team and keep their squad in the contender bracket. Mahomes, Burrow and Allen. Hurts is surrounded by excellent talent, not a knock but I need to see how he performs if they take a step back. Herbert looks limited by coaching. Brady and Rodgers are too old and are eliminated.

Feels like a lot of QB’s get knocked for not being elite but the reality is almost all of them need enough surrounding talent and good coaching to win. It did a lot for Stafford. Was he never that guy or needed the right situation? And contrarily Goff looks to be a benefactor of the trade as well. Quietly put up a real nice year.

Very tough to eval QB’s with so many variables around them.
RE: Carr issue  
GiantGrit : 1/26/2023 5:40 pm : link
In comment 16015154 uconngiant said:
Quote:
was the new coaching staff. He is talented not a top 10 but better than most on here think.

I agree with Sy as a number of teams will be after him and the Jets, Panthers, Commanders, and Colts.


Agreed. He may not be “top 10” but in a stable situation be could do damage. Most guys aren’t doing anything with an average team around them anyway.
RE:  
sb from NYT Forum : 1/27/2023 1:41 am : link
In comment 16014737 CDN-Mark said:
Quote:
No I think he saying we should not over pay Daniel Jones or we could be in this exact situation.


I mean, the Raiders hired a horrible head coach (and a historic worst DC), that might have something to do with Carr's play in 2022.

So let's not assume Carr (or Jones, for that matter) will regress not improve in 2023.
RE: RE: RE: Carr  
giantBCP : 1/27/2023 5:13 am : link
In comment 16015011 NINEster said:
Quote:
In comment 16014819 Producer said:


Quote:


In comment 16014795 Straw Hat said:


Quote:


Is not good.



If Carr isn't good, then Jones isn't good.

In fact, Carr is firmly in the QB middle class. Certainly, not elite, and not worth the money he is being paid. But overpaid doesn't mean "isn't good".



This.

After Carr's 2016 season that ended in injury, to me he was always a very good QB. That was easily the Raiders' best shot at any real postseason damage since the Rich Gannon years.


And yet here we are, 9 years into his career as a full-time starter, and his playoff record sits at 0-1. The only “postseason damage” he’s accomplished appears to have been inflicted on the Raiders franchise.
Carr has no legs...  
DefenseWins : 1/27/2023 5:19 am : link
and QBs today need to be able to move the chains with their legs if needed.
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