Better Player - Tiki or Saquon?

until about 2004-the line was not great until 2004-05-06.

Fantastic at setting up blocks and great vision.

In comment 16020659 Enzo said:

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Tiki seemed to have "figured out" how to play RB to a degree that most never achieve (i.e. vision, avoiding hits, etc). It was really fun to watch. I don't know that Saquon is there quite yet.

The vision and patience he had on tosses and screens was amazing. But I would say Saqoun actually avoids big hits better than Tiki (which is why I’m not as worried about longevity as most are).

Tiki also gained lot of extra yards by ramming the crown of his helmet into defenders (often lbers). That’s not legal anymore but it was great to watch.

Either way, prime Tiki was playing at LadT-level (without the ridiculous number of tds) so Saqoun has a way to go to get there, but he is one of a select few that is capable of getting there.

In comment 16020783 k2tampa said:

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Barber, as a starter, always had a solid line in front of him (and good blocking TEs).

Again: this is not true

In comment 16020655 Section331 said:

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Now Tiki had a much better OL and skill talent around him, but he was also a better receiver and a much better pass protector.

Tiki had crap lines in 02,03,04. It wasn’t until 05 that the line improved. Tiki, in my mind, is a hall of famer. Unbelievably talented, and one of the smoothest runners to watch. Tiki on those screens was a thing of beauty

In comment 16020682 Greg from LI said:

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In comment 16020664 Johnny5 said: Quote: his ego when he played brought him down a bit. Absolute nonsense. Whatever else anyone thinks about Tiki because of his postcareer comments, he was a consummate pro on the field who worked out like a madman in the offseason.

Agreed so let me rephrase: Tiki is in the hall of fame if he did not let his ego get in the way of playing for another 2 years. Overall I believe he was the best RB the Giants have ever had. And that is saying something.

SB had one great year,probably the best RB year in Giant history. Since then he has been hurt, often mediocre, and only very occasionally great. His rookie year he had a couple of dozen plays that made you say wow! This made up for his lack of consistency (a la Barry Sanders). He had almost no plays that made you say wow! this year. A couple of plays that were critical and impressive (i.e. the two point conversion) that don't happen with a lesser back. But the vast majority of his good runs were reproducible by almost any decent running back in the league. Very rarely did he make anyone miss or run through contact. Tiki had a better OL, but also was more elusive, better after contact, had much better vision, and was a better receiver. Just not close.

I would also take the combination of Jacobs/Bradshaw. And again, not close. I actually Bradshaw on is own is possibly equal to SB.

In comment 16020815 mfjmfj said:

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I would also take the combination of Jacobs/Bradshaw. And again, not close. I actually Bradshaw on is own is possibly equal to SB.

I take back the Bradshaw on his own comment. The fact that SB never fumbles and Bradshaw fumbled at a reasonably high rate, swings the pendulum in SB's favor.

… it’s no comparison at all. Late-career Barber was insanely good at everything: fantastic vision and patience, excellent burst, flawless hands, awesome situational awareness, and he was actually a better blocker and short-yardage back than Jacobs, who outweighed him by 50+ pounds.

His first seven years, Barber was a good, versatile back with ball security issues. Those last three seasons, he was in a class with peak Faulk / Tomlinson.

Go look at the ragtag bunch that Mouse McNally had to work with in 2003. Tiki did not consistently have a great OL. And for all the Reese haters who complain about him supposedly not addressing OL (just a complete fabrication that ignores facts, but whatever), go look at Accorsi's OL acquisitions in the early aughts.

Tiki is the better player when compared to Barkley to date, and it's not especially close, IMO. That doesn't mean that Barkley can't still reach that level, but it's unlikely - very few RBs age gracefully and keep improving the way Tiki did. It's much more likely that the best remaining iteration of Saquon is what we see right now, and he'll remain at this level for a few more years before declining. That's more consistent with the typical RB career track.

In comment 16020804 Johnny5 said:

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Agreed so let me rephrase: Tiki is in the hall of fame if he did not let his ego get in the way of playing for another 2 years. Overall I believe he was the best RB the Giants have ever had. And that is saying something.

Ah, ok, I misunderstood what you were saying. I still don't really agree, but you can certainly make that argument.

I fully admit how biased I am here, but I don't think it was ego. He didn't really get along with Tom Coughlin, which sapped his desire to play. Which led to the conclusion that it would be better to get out with his health intact. He likely didn't think the Giants were going to win a championship in the few years he had left, and if we're all honest with ourselves, at the end of 2006 few of us thought that either.

And, as much as he's pilloried for butting heads with Coughlin, many people choose to forget or ignore the fact that many other veterans were less than thrilled with Coughlin, too. That is why Coughlin made changes in how he handled the team post-2006, with the "veterans council" and his efforts to be more approachable and forgiving.

Most people prefer late career Tiki.

I want to sign Barkely so we get that version of him too.

Tiki wasn't Tiki yet after his 4th season.

Barkley came in to the NFL a better athlete and player. Then hit the injury wall in year 3 which impacted 2 seasons.

Barkley (and Jones) carried this offense in 2022. It's fucking stupid how underrated he is around here but once money gets brought up some people turn into morons. Actually not only money, once a player puts on the NYG jersey people lose objectivity.

At his peak Tiki (his own words mind you) had tons of help and had finally learned how to run and weave. Barkley is a force of nature. If this OL ever improves and the WRs improve take a guess how BArkley will look. Don't hurt yourself thinking too harad.

He was a complete player. he could catch a 4 yard pass and take it 50 yards to pay dirt or 55 yard TD run. And he was durable. Saquon game is nice but he is no Tiki.

And it isn't close.

Barkley can't even hold Barber's jock strap...

In comment 16020829 Greg from LI said:

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In comment 16020804 Johnny5 said: Quote: Agreed so let me rephrase: Tiki is in the hall of fame if he did not let his ego get in the way of playing for another 2 years. Overall I believe he was the best RB the Giants have ever had. And that is saying something. Ah, ok, I misunderstood what you were saying. I still don't really agree, but you can certainly make that argument. I fully admit how biased I am here, but I don't think it was ego. He didn't really get along with Tom Coughlin, which sapped his desire to play. Which led to the conclusion that it would be better to get out with his health intact. He likely didn't think the Giants were going to win a championship in the few years he had left, and if we're all honest with ourselves, at the end of 2006 few of us thought that either. And, as much as he's pilloried for butting heads with Coughlin, many people choose to forget or ignore the fact that many other veterans were less than thrilled with Coughlin, too. That is why Coughlin made changes in how he handled the team post-2006, with the "veterans council" and his efforts to be more approachable and forgiving.

_________________________________
I never heard that Tiki didn’t get along with Coughlin until Tiki’s retirement statement, and I believe his statement about Coughlin was misinterpreted. I think he meant that Coughlin showed him how hard he needed to work and he had reached the point in his career that he didn’t want to do that anymore. It is no accident than Tiki’s career peaked with the work Tiki put in under Coughlin.
I would be happy to be corrected if someone can point to an earlier public statement from Tiki or verifiable observation from a reporter about a strained relationship.
____________________________________________

In comment 16020827 Gatorade Dunk said:

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Go look at the ragtag bunch that Mouse McNally had to work with in 2003. Tiki did not consistently have a great OL. And for all the Reese haters who complain about him supposedly not addressing OL (just a complete fabrication that ignores facts, but whatever), go look at Accorsi's OL acquisitions in the early aughts. Tiki is the better player when compared to Barkley to date, and it's not especially close, IMO. That doesn't mean that Barkley can't still reach that level, but it's unlikely - very few RBs age gracefully and keep improving the way Tiki did. It's much more likely that the best remaining iteration of Saquon is what we see right now, and he'll remain at this level for a few more years before declining. That's more consistent with the typical RB career track.

Tiki after 5 years was not the better player. I don't thin you meant to say that, but of course Tiki was better after 10 years.

By year 4 Tiki was coming off his best season which saw him catch around 65 passes and do little else on the ground. The potential was there and there were signs in 1999, but 2000, year 4, was when he finally started to peak.

2000-2003 Tiki was not better than 2018,2019 and 2022 Barkley. And you're right, Tiki didn't have the great OL early on either. But he did have better WRs and TEs.

Of course Tiki's 04-06 span was insane. Better than just about any RB to ever play the game. THAT good.

In comment 16020860 .McL. said:

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And it isn't close. Barkley can't even hold Barber's jock strap...

Yea ok. Nonsense with all due respect.

Talk to me if (when) Barkley plays the majority of games over these next 4-5 seasons. He's going to shit all over the NYG record books.

how player performance can be influenced by the other 10 guys on the field.

Also weird how some players actually reach their peak in years 4-5-6 and beyond. But sure, let's compare Tiki's peak to Barkley's beginning.

In comment 16020841 RicFlair said:

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Most people prefer late career Tiki. I want to sign Barkely so we get that version of him too.

WHOA!!! there you go using some actual thought.

But, overall, Tiki was much better for the remainder of his career than Barkley is now.

but Tiki's one weak spot (besides fumbling which he resolved) was running the ball inside the 20 - when the field became smaller.

Barkley is a more powerful back when he wants to be.

In comment 16020862 Ivan15 said:

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In comment 16020829 Greg from LI said: Quote: In comment 16020804 Johnny5 said: Quote: Agreed so let me rephrase: Tiki is in the hall of fame if he did not let his ego get in the way of playing for another 2 years. Overall I believe he was the best RB the Giants have ever had. And that is saying something. Ah, ok, I misunderstood what you were saying. I still don't really agree, but you can certainly make that argument. I fully admit how biased I am here, but I don't think it was ego. He didn't really get along with Tom Coughlin, which sapped his desire to play. Which led to the conclusion that it would be better to get out with his health intact. He likely didn't think the Giants were going to win a championship in the few years he had left, and if we're all honest with ourselves, at the end of 2006 few of us thought that either. And, as much as he's pilloried for butting heads with Coughlin, many people choose to forget or ignore the fact that many other veterans were less than thrilled with Coughlin, too. That is why Coughlin made changes in how he handled the team post-2006, with the "veterans council" and his efforts to be more approachable and forgiving. _________________________________ I never heard that Tiki didn’t get along with Coughlin until Tiki’s retirement statement, and I believe his statement about Coughlin was misinterpreted. I think he meant that Coughlin showed him how hard he needed to work and he had reached the point in his career that he didn’t want to do that anymore. It is no accident than Tiki’s career peaked with the work Tiki put in under Coughlin. I would be happy to be corrected if someone can point to an earlier public statement from Tiki or verifiable observation from a reporter about a strained relationship. ____________________________________________

Tiki was quite vocal about disliking how TC treated him, and he wasn't alone. Strahan made many of the same comments, remember how strange it was to see him and Tiki echo each other at the time. He felt he earned the respect and the opportunity to not be pushed so hard in TC's old school way. Other veterans felt the same as Tiki and it resulted in the veteran leadership committee being formed after he retired. I think it woke TC up a bit. Also, don't forget Tiki alerted the world of his plan to retire during the '06 season, which was the wrong thing to do and it really alienated him and angered many in the building. Then he goes scorched-earth leaving the Giants and picking on Eli to help his media career, and he's been persona non-grata for the most part since then.

In comment 16020868 djm said:

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Also weird how some players actually reach their peak in years 4-5-6 and beyond.

How many running backs do this? Very few.

In comment 16020829 Greg from LI said:

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In comment 16020804 Johnny5 said: Quote: Agreed so let me rephrase: Tiki is in the hall of fame if he did not let his ego get in the way of playing for another 2 years. Overall I believe he was the best RB the Giants have ever had. And that is saying something. Ah, ok, I misunderstood what you were saying. I still don't really agree, but you can certainly make that argument. I fully admit how biased I am here, but I don't think it was ego. He didn't really get along with Tom Coughlin, which sapped his desire to play. Which led to the conclusion that it would be better to get out with his health intact. He likely didn't think the Giants were going to win a championship in the few years he had left, and if we're all honest with ourselves, at the end of 2006 few of us thought that either. And, as much as he's pilloried for butting heads with Coughlin, many people choose to forget or ignore the fact that many other veterans were less than thrilled with Coughlin, too. That is why Coughlin made changes in how he handled the team post-2006, with the "veterans council" and his efforts to be more approachable and forgiving.

So, and this is just how interpreted his actions, and ultimately view the end of his Giants career.

He was undertaking monumental training regimens those last couple of years of his career, that while benefiting his body and level of play immensely (for the better) really taxing him mentally. He was furious that we went so hard after Eli because he thought Collins was an established QB they could win with, especially with better OL play. He was placated somewhat by the fact we had Warner, and was one of the players not happy when Warner was benched for Eli. He really didn't have any belief that Eli would be able do what he did in 2007, and he did not want to put his body through that when he didn't believe they could win a super bowl. This is always how I viewed the end of his career.

In comment 16020898 Greg from LI said:

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In comment 16020868 djm said: Quote: Also weird how some players actually reach their peak in years 4-5-6 and beyond. How many running backs do this? Very few.

Greg I think that's a more recent phenomenon. I don't know why.

Specifically re Tiki, the Giants treated him as more of a Meggett type specialist early on in his career. It almost seemed to me at the time that they did not want him or did not view him to be an every down player. but to his credit he worked his ass off to get stronger and better, and Dayne being disappointing opened the door and he ran through it. All that was left was to cure the fumbling which he did. He was amazing for his last 5 years.

It wasn't outstanding, by any means, for much of his career.

The way Tiki used whatever he had in front of him, his patience, burst, and smoothness catching the ball, was lightyears ahead of Barkley. Now does Barkley have more of some of those traits? Sure. But I look at Barber as a guy who had 8-9 out of 10 skills, and maximized them all the time and Barkley as a guy who had 10 out of 10 skills, but maximizes them 6 to 10 out of 10 of those times. Barber could have played longer. Barkley is the kind of guy that we already know how he'll look in a few years, we see it when he's dinged up.

In comment 16020827 Gatorade Dunk said:

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Go look at the ragtag bunch that Mouse McNally had to work with in 2003. Tiki did not consistently have a great OL. And for all the Reese haters who complain about him supposedly not addressing OL (just a complete fabrication that ignores facts, but whatever), go look at Accorsi's OL acquisitions in the early aughts. Tiki is the better player when compared to Barkley to date, and it's not especially close, IMO. That doesn't mean that Barkley can't still reach that level, but it's unlikely - very few RBs age gracefully and keep improving the way Tiki did. It's much more likely that the best remaining iteration of Saquon is what we see right now, and he'll remain at this level for a few more years before declining. That's more consistent with the typical RB career track.

And Barber average 4.4 yards a carry that year behind the worst line he had, and his longest run of the year was 27 yards, the shortest "long run" of his career, except for his second year when he only had 52 carries. His next "shortest run was 36 in 2001. His other years as starters his longest runs were 55, 68, 70, 72, 74, 78, 79, 82 and 95. Barkley's long runs (except the year he hurt his knee) were 41, 68, 68 and 78.

Barber also only reached double digits in touchdowns twice in 10 years. Barkley has done it twice in five, despite missing almost all of one season and being very limited in most of the 13 games he played in another.

And even though Barber's line wasn't good for that one year, there were still Toomer, Hilliard and Shockey to keep
defenses from just focusing on stopping Barber. He still had Brown and Dorsey Levens backing him up. And something no one else has mentioned. He virtually always had a lead fullback, where Barkley virtually never has a lead blocker. How often was Barber hit right after getting the handoff? How often is Barkley?

And while you say this is likely the version of Barkley we will have going forward, remember that he was limited by the shoulder injury for at least a third of the year if not more.

Tiki....easy at this point.

Saquon has spent too much time injured. Nice year in his rookie season and stayed healthy this past year which surprised the heck out of me. Look, Saquon is a good player but as unfair as it may be injuries count. If you’re not contributing on the field then it matters. Maybe thing will go better for Saquon in the next few years. I’m pulling for him.

this would be a much harder choice. If Barkley ups his game over the next five years, as Barber did in his last five years, that too would make it a harder choice.

The big problem with Barkley is that (as good as he is) he hasn't justified his draft position. For a RB to be drafted #2 overall in the modern NFL, he almost has to have a HoF career. Year 1, he seemed to be on his way, then he was derailed by injuries. But RBs are always subject to those injuries; that's why you don't draft them that high. They get hit a lot, get hurt a lot, and have short careers.

So our perception of Barkley is skewed because he has a faint odor of disappointment around him. Barber, on the other hand, overachieved.

walk.

Honestly the question should be Bradshaw v Barkley, who is better.

but I would have liked to have seen SB with the OL of 2005-06 and see what he could have done. Tiki's last few years he was incredible and I respect how he remade himself to fit the new coaching staff. He may have taken some shots at Eli but he was a huge asset to Eli in his early struggles. He was not fond of TC but when you're building a champion team sometimes its not so comfortable early on.

Not sure about the HOF but maybe he gets in down the road like Little did. Not being on that SB team hurts his case as does the running game not missing a beat the following year. It also took him a few years to get going. His OL's were not all that good early but the 2000 and 2002 were pretty solid imv. They had some good blocking TE's and skill guys.

Oline. Tiki more likely to take it the distance though IMO since Barkleys injury I think his top end speed isn't what it was. As far as comparison I d say pretty equal.

Jones + Tiki is better than Jones + Saquon

In comment 16020918 k2tampa said:

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Barber also only reached double digits in touchdowns twice in 10 years. Barkley has done it twice in five, despite missing almost all of one season and being very limited in most of the 13 games he played in another.

Which was largely a function of usage, because in 2005 and 2006 Brandon Jacobs got almost all the carries in short yardage and goal situations - sixteen touchdowns in just 134 carries for Jacobs in those seasons. Tiki had 9 and 5. Generally, unless he broke off a 10+ yard TD run, he wasn't getting a chance for the TD.

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And even though Barber's line wasn't good for that one year, there were still Toomer, Hilliard and Shockey to keep defenses from just focusing on stopping Barber. He still had Brown and Dorsey Levens backing him up. And something no one else has mentioned. He virtually always had a lead fullback, where Barkley virtually never has a lead blocker.

I mean, few teams use a fullback anymore. Them's the breaks. Sorry. Dorsey Levens did virtually nothing as a Giant, running for less than 200 yards at 2.9 YPC. Gary Brown didn't really back up Tiki, he was the starter most of the year while Tiki was the third down back. Tiki had almost as many receptions (42) as carries (52) in 1998.

Also, again, the line he ran behind wasn't good for more than one season. The 2001 line wasn't very good, as the aging vets brought in for the 2000 season declined rapidly. 2003 line was pretty awful, and 2004 wasn't great. 2005 was when the OL improved dramatically after Kareem McKenzie was signed.

In comment 16020865 djm said:

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In comment 16020860 .McL. said: Quote: And it isn't close. Barkley can't even hold Barber's jock strap... Yea ok. Nonsense with all due respect. Talk to me if (when) Barkley plays the majority of games over these next 4-5 seasons. He's going to shit all over the NYG record books.

At least you had the good sense to include the most likely disclaimer.

In comment 16020918 k2tampa said:

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And while you say this is likely the version of Barkley we will have going forward, remember that he was limited by the shoulder injury for at least a third of the year if not more.

Right. And I absolutely expect that Barkley will be banged up by one thing or another for some stretch of most seasons, because that's the nature of playing RB in the NFL.

Barber is the outlier here: Most RBs don't get dramatically better later in their career, Tiki did. Most RBs don't stay healthy most seasons (especially later in their career), Tiki did.

It's not meant to be an insult to Barkley when I suggest that he's unlikely to follow Tiki's trajectory, because Tiki's trajectory is fairly unique. Barkley is unlikely to follow Tiki's career trajectory because Barkley is much more likely to follow a more typical career trajectory - that's what makes it "more typical" in the first place.

Tiki also gutted through some injuries with so much toughness that you wouldn't have known that he was even hurt in the first place. Meanwhile, there is definitely a visible difference between full-strength Saquon and banged-up Saquon. Again, Saquon is the normal one here; Tiki was an outlier (and players were just tougher then, probably from having more than a dozen real practices per season).

In comment 16020841 RicFlair said:

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Most people prefer late career Tiki. I want to sign Barkely so we get that version of him too.

Tiki Barber being better later in this career than earlier in his career was a massive anomaly among RBs.

In comment 16021050 FStubbs said:

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In comment 16020841 RicFlair said: Quote: Most people prefer late career Tiki. I want to sign Barkely so we get that version of him too. Tiki Barber being better later in this career than earlier in his career was a massive anomaly among RBs.

He was also a part time player for much of the first half of his career. Barkley had a lot more wear and tear on him the first 5 seasons.

is how much better we were as a team back then. Others have also brought up how much better our skill position players were back then compared to now. Opposing defenses stack the box and focus on Barkley, Tiki never really had to deal with that.

But Saquon is still young and can get more consistent in production.
As I recall, Tiki was upset Kerry Collins was getting flushed. Stray as well, since they got close. Collins was really good but upper management didn't think he or Fassel could get the job done.
So it looked like a rebuild.
And Tiki said screw it. I don't blame him, it's not easy being a RB and having losing seasons extended

He’s poised to shatter nyg record books, if he’s re-signed.

the only one who averaged more yards every time he touched the ball was Jim Brown.

The only ones who averaged more yards per carry than Tiki among the 10K runners were Jim Brown and Barry Sanders.

In comment 16021173 JOrthman said:

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is how much better we were as a team back then. Others have also brought up how much better our skill position players were back then compared to now. Opposing defenses stack the box and focus on Barkley, Tiki never really had to deal with that.

Despite what any person would naturally assume, Barkley doesn't really deal with more stacked boxes than average (compared to other current NFL RBs), and I'd be willing to bet that there are fewer stacked boxes in general in the current NFL than there were 20 years ago. I don't think the NextGen Stats are available that far back, but I'd be willing to bet that Barkley and Barber probably face(d) relatively similar percentages of stacked box defenses.
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 16021215 djm said:

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He’s poised to shatter nyg record books, if he’s re-signed.

Can we define "shatter"?

I don't think Barkley will even break most of Barber's marks at all, but if he does, he'll squeak by. I'm curious how far above the current records you think Barkley will ultimately land, since you're pretty confident that he's going to "shatter" the record books.

In comment 16021229 Gatorade Dunk said:

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In comment 16021173 JOrthman said: Quote: is how much better we were as a team back then. Others have also brought up how much better our skill position players were back then compared to now. Opposing defenses stack the box and focus on Barkley, Tiki never really had to deal with that. Despite what any person would naturally assume, Barkley doesn't really deal with more stacked boxes than average (compared to other current NFL RBs), and I'd be willing to bet that there are fewer stacked boxes in general in the current NFL than there were 20 years ago. I don't think the NextGen Stats are available that far back, but I'd be willing to bet that Barkley and Barber probably face(d) relatively similar percentages of stacked box defenses. Link - ( New Window )

Next Gen Stats are great, but that list doesn't compare Tiki to Barkley and it's all over the place on what it shows. It's also not an apples-to-apples comparison to teams and players. For example, according to that, two WA RB's faced more 8 men in the box then Barkley. Are we really saying teams game planned to stop those to WA RB's more than Barkley?

that occurred.

I mean at the end of the day is it really that wild of a statement to say that SB was our only playmaker and teams game planned against him, daring us to pass? If you were a defensive coordinator, wouldn't you? We had no vertical threat, no depth, overall weak WR core and bad pass blocking.

Been back in the early 2000s. It was a much more violent game back then and backs had a lot more blocking assignments. Barkley struggles heavily in that area.

On the other side, imagine how good Tiki would have been in the passing game in the current game.

Now from reading above, as I recall Tiki was very vocal on Coughlin and his dislike of his methods. I believe that his dislike of Coughlin, him being under contract and under paid and not thinking that Eli was good enough to win promted his retirement.

Tikis early struggles had to do with him being viewed as small early on. Then he was asked to bulk up and lost some of his quickness and went back to his lighter playing weight.

I do believe that had Barkley been drafted in the 2nd round he would be appreciated a lot more. But when you are drafted 2nd overall and at a position that typically doesn’t have great longevity it’s an almost impossible task. At this stage he hasn’t lived up to being the 2nd overall pick after 5 years mainly because of injuries. It does seem like his mental play is greatly affected by injuries.

One of the Giants biggest current issues is that they rely too much on Barkley. I would rather they take the $12 million plus they would have to pay Barkley and use it on multiple players instead of tying it all up on Barkley. Many of the playoff teams have a multi back attack. Even when the Giants won the Superbowls we had multiple backs..

I hope Barkley goes on and becomes a HOFer because he is a great kid. I just hope he does it somewhere else because the odds are stacked against him. He was on his way to a tremendous season and the 2nd half left a lot to be desired. He needs to be consistent, the great ones always find a way.

Tikis last game of the regular season of his career for a playoff berth ran for 238 yards on 23 attempts 3 TDS and 3 catches for 24 yards. He probably saved Coughlins job that game. Eli threw for 101 yards that game. In the playoffs he ran for 137 and added 15 yards rec. Tiki has 5 200 yard rushing games, the most ever is 6.

was we were still trying to justify drafting Ron Dayne in the first round early in Tiki's career.