Evans is maybe the most accomplished offensive player in their franchise's history. Is there an emotional side to this that leads you to not trade a guy like that?
He's nicked up a lot and it just feels like he has tons of miles on him. Also not a speed guy. Want to get younger and a lot faster. I saw something on twitter yesterday that the Giants are dead last in wr speed metrics across all teams.
Giants should not be trading for 30 year old receivers with big contracts. That's not where they are on the rebuilding curve.
I don't know why so many posters think Schoen is going to trade away draft picks. He seems to value them a great deal.
Am I wrong to think there’s a good possibility if anything, they use some of their draft capital to move up a few slots in round 1 to get a WR they like?
Giants should not be trading for 30 year old receivers with big contracts. That's not where they are on the rebuilding curve.
I don't know why so many posters think Schoen is going to trade away draft picks. He seems to value them a great deal.
Am I wrong to think there’s a good possibility if anything, they use some of their draft capital to move up a few slots in round 1 to get a WR they like?
I'm pretty convinced they won't take a wr in the first round. Unless there's one there that happens to be BPA on their board. I think they are looking at the trenches, LB or CB in round 1 before they go wr
I hope they address the OL or D in the first round.
Giants should not be trading for 30 year old receivers with big contracts. That's not where they are on the rebuilding curve.
I don't know why so many posters think Schoen is going to trade away draft picks. He seems to value them a great deal.
Let’s sure hope so… the best (and cheapest) way to build and maintain a competitive team is through the draft. Dabs put on a show his first year, now Joe gets a chance to have a full year of his program running… he has to hit this draft and off-season. It’s his time to shine, and I’m excited to see how he handles the off-season. Sure feels good to be a Giants fan right now. We have adults at the wheel 💪✔️
We only have a small sample size (last year), but his "tendency" so far is to move down and acquire more picks.
I suppose it would be wide to see what his mentor in Buffalo did too.
I will say this: if you listen to Schoen, he publicly puts a very high value on draft picks. The Giants draft pick total sounds more impressive than it really is this year... most of those picks are day 3 picks.
We only have a small sample size (last year), but his "tendency" so far is to move down and acquire more picks.
I suppose it would be wide to see what his mentor in Buffalo did too.
I will say this: if you listen to Schoen, he publicly puts a very high value on draft picks. The Giants draft pick total sounds more impressive than it really is this year... most of those picks are day 3 picks.
That’s totally fair, just they do have pick 25 and I do know that teams love having that 5th year option available so not fully sure how far down they would move and really hope not out of round 1 in total. If they feel that one of these WR prospects that is gettable can be that go to WR1, the 5th year can be massive.
but I am curious to see how Tampa gets under the cap this year. They could be due for an instant bottoming out which I think is a great strategy. Fail all the way to the number 1 pick, then get your new QB.
Build through the draft
As Schoen and Daboll stated in their joint press conference:: don’t be surprised to see a 50% roster turnover on this team next year.
We are rebuilding and could take a step back next year
We have a talent gap compared to serious SB contenders
Cap space is already earmarked to re-sign their own and it will be gone quickly. This is a young team early in a rebuild, they need to stay the course and avoid pricey veterans on the backside of their NFL career.
at the schedule and the work that still needs to be done on the roster, I would not be shocked to see the Giants have problems making the playoffs next year.
at the schedule and the work that still needs to be done on the roster, I would not be shocked to see the Giants have problems making the playoffs next year.
are so intent on trading for a WR. The past several drafts have been rich on WR talent. The Diggs trade, which is used as the example for this line of thinking, was a bigger win for Minnesota, who drafted the better WR and he's cost controlled.
I'm not opposed to trading for players, but I'd prefer they be at positions that are hard to fill.
are so intent on trading for a WR. The past several drafts have been rich on WR talent. The Diggs trade, which is used as the example for this line of thinking, was a bigger win for Minnesota, who drafted the better WR and he's cost controlled.
I'm not opposed to trading for players, but I'd prefer they be at positions that are hard to fill.
I think some look at the A.J. Brown trade and how it helped the Eagles. But look at their roster, particularly the offensive and defensive lines.
AJ Brown trade was a finishing piece for a SB team
and even he carries some warts with inconsistency. Fans need to understand the Giants are not looking for finishing pieces, they're about to add 20+ new faces to a roster under construction and will be a different team in 2023. It could even take a step backwards.
Think about our aging vet firesale with Gettleman. That's the argument for it. It's a glorified Glowinski kind of move to stabilize a shaky unit with a vet that should only be on the roster for 1-2 years while you build behind him in the draft. I think it's more prudent trading a day 3 pick for Evans and spending a Day 1 or 2 pick on a WR than trading up in the 1st for a WR. Also, I'm not sure about any of the young WRs that will cost a 1 or 1+ either. Higgins, Aiyuk and Moore aren't in the same class as AJB, Hill and Diggs. You're paying upfront for potential with those guys.
Also, I think a lot of posters seem to be dialed into WR in the first when it appears to me that CB is where the value will be. WR looks like a better value in Day 2 based on how the sharper draft analysts are stacking this class atm.
Think about our aging vet firesale with Gettleman. That's the argument for it. It's a glorified Glowinski kind of move to stabilize a shaky unit with a vet that should only be on the roster for 1-2 years while you build behind him in the draft. I think it's more prudent trading a day 3 pick for Evans and spending a Day 1 or 2 pick on a WR than trading up in the 1st for a WR. Also, I'm not sure about any of the young WRs that will cost a 1 or 1+ either. Higgins, Aiyuk and Moore aren't in the same class as AJB, Hill and Diggs. You're paying upfront for potential with those guys.
Also, I think a lot of posters seem to be dialed into WR in the first when it appears to me that CB is where the value will be. WR looks like a better value in Day 2 based on how the sharper draft analysts are stacking this class atm.
Again, every draft pick matters.
But even if you don't agree with that, his base salary in 2023 is $13,000,000.
Even at his age. That's WR2 money now. Day 3 picks can be recouped, that's value in trading down.
I'm not necessarily all-in on Evans. The issue with him is more that there's only 1 year left on the deal but this idea that every single transaction has to be a factor in like 2025 is nonsense. This is a type of move that keeps you from shopping hungry early in the draft, it helps you draft better/smarter.
Even at his age. That's WR2 money now. Day 3 picks can be recouped, that's value in trading down.
I'm not necessarily all-in on Evans. The issue with him is more that there's only 1 year left on the deal but this idea that every single transaction has to be a factor in like 2025 is nonsense. This is a type of move that keeps you from shopping hungry early in the draft, it helps you draft better/smarter.
You might want to see what a 2nd-=round draft pick on his initial contract makes before saying that is typical WR2 money.
at the schedule and the work that still needs to be done on the roster, I would not be shocked to see the Giants have problems making the playoffs next year.
The NFC is extremely weak and just got weaker without Brady. The Giants can only improve as long as Jones and Barkley return.
at the schedule and the work that still needs to be done on the roster, I would not be shocked to see the Giants have problems making the playoffs next year.
The NFC is extremely weak and just got weaker without Brady. The Giants can only improve as long as Jones and Barkley return.
Also one extra team in the playoffs now..
I would be surprised if Giants miss playoffs..
(1) Never assume a team can "only improve." (You can look at multiple teams in any season and just see how wrong that assumption is).
(2) We have no idea how weak or strong the NFC will be next year. Everyone assumed the AFC was going to easily win the Super Bowl this year back in the the summer.
by another poster, but the NYG 2022 season was a bit of a mirage. The post-bye "good feeling" was mainly due to beating the Commanders, Colts, and Vikings.
at the schedule and the work that still needs to be done on the roster, I would not be shocked to see the Giants have problems making the playoffs next year.
The NFC is extremely weak and just got weaker without Brady. The Giants can only improve as long as Jones and Barkley return.
Also one extra team in the playoffs now..
I would be surprised if Giants miss playoffs..
(1) Never assume a team can "only improve." (You can look at multiple teams in any season and just see how wrong that assumption is).
(2) We have no idea how weak or strong the NFC will be next year. Everyone assumed the AFC was going to easily win the Super Bowl this year back in the the summer.
If the Giants fail to improve that would be a bad sign for Daboll and Schoen.
There will be plenty of good players to either trade for or sign when they are cut.
Also, Remember Schoen didn't have "His Scouts" for last year's draft. This is his first full year of scouting "his way". He is going to want to use most of those draft picks.
Again, i don't think you're accurately assessing the weakness of the Giants' 2022 schedule, and just how hard they had to work to win one-score games. This wasn't a strong roster.
On paper, the 2023 schedule looks much tougher (but that could change).
Jones and/or Barkley may or may not be re-signed. Even if they are, they could regress back to their previous play.
The talent gap between the Giants and Eagles and Cowboys is pretty big right now. Hell, if the Commanders get a QB, they could move past the Giants.
This is a rebuilding ball club or had a good season. That doesn't change the fact that they will only be in year #2 of the rebuilding effort in a very tough division (3 of the final four teams in the NFC this year were from the NFC East).
within the next two years. I wouldn’t overstate the importance of age with that in mind.
That sounds like Dave Gettleman.
The Bucs didn’t win a SB with a ton of veterans? The Rams didn’t do the same? The Eagles didn’t bring in several vets? Just because Gettleman failed spectacularly with some FA signings, doesn’t mean that Schoen can’t find value with older players.
a mirage, but those same people would have said with absolute certainty that the team would not make the playoffs, let alone win a playoff game on the road if they knew one starting corner would miss almost the entire season, the other would miss 8 games, 2 starting WRs miss a good portion of the season, while getting nothing out of Galloday.
In addition, losing 4 Draft picks for the season, and having the number 7 pick in the draft, Neal, struggled.
With a few decent FA signings, to go with a few good draft picks, the team should be able to compete for a championship. And by that I mean play a competitive game in the divisional round. Especially if guys like Neal take a big step in their second season, and we get a little lucky on health.
Unless the cost was minimal(it won't be), I wouldn't do it. The Bucs will expect premium picks for Evans.
As much as I want a guy like Hopkins, I don't think they fit into the Giants plans as of now. The only way the Giants take a step forward is by drafting well. We have to draft well because we are about to sign some high priced guys in the next 2 years.
I don't know why so many posters think Schoen is going to trade away draft picks. He seems to value them a great deal.
I don't know why so many posters think Schoen is going to trade away draft picks. He seems to value them a great deal.
It's insanity.
This is how you derail a rebuild ala Gettleman.
I don't know why so many posters think Schoen is going to trade away draft picks. He seems to value them a great deal.
Am I wrong to think there’s a good possibility if anything, they use some of their draft capital to move up a few slots in round 1 to get a WR they like?
I'd give them a 5th or 6th rounder or something if they're eager to get it off the books and reset, but I'm not giving up anything significant.
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Giants should not be trading for 30 year old receivers with big contracts. That's not where they are on the rebuilding curve.
I don't know why so many posters think Schoen is going to trade away draft picks. He seems to value them a great deal.
Am I wrong to think there’s a good possibility if anything, they use some of their draft capital to move up a few slots in round 1 to get a WR they like?
I'm pretty convinced they won't take a wr in the first round. Unless there's one there that happens to be BPA on their board. I think they are looking at the trenches, LB or CB in round 1 before they go wr
I don't know why so many posters think Schoen is going to trade away draft picks. He seems to value them a great deal.
Let’s sure hope so… the best (and cheapest) way to build and maintain a competitive team is through the draft. Dabs put on a show his first year, now Joe gets a chance to have a full year of his program running… he has to hit this draft and off-season. It’s his time to shine, and I’m excited to see how he handles the off-season. Sure feels good to be a Giants fan right now. We have adults at the wheel 💪✔️
We only have a small sample size (last year), but his "tendency" so far is to move down and acquire more picks.
I suppose it would be wide to see what his mentor in Buffalo did too.
I will say this: if you listen to Schoen, he publicly puts a very high value on draft picks. The Giants draft pick total sounds more impressive than it really is this year... most of those picks are day 3 picks.
I don't know why so many posters think Schoen is going to trade away draft picks. He seems to value them a great deal.
People desperately clinging to the idea that the 2022 Giants were the 2021 Eagles and are a few moves away from being a Super Bowl team.
They are not. And even if they were, Mike Evans is on the wrong side of his career.
(1) January and February are going to be fairly quiet (they didn't fire the GM and HC.).
(2) We will be picking very late in the evening in the draft.
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Giants should not be trading for 30 year old receivers with big contracts. That's not where they are on the rebuilding curve.
I don't know why so many posters think Schoen is going to trade away draft picks. He seems to value them a great deal////
It's insanity.
This is how you derail a rebuild ala Gettleman.
Tis indeed insanity. Pundits floating this are sorely out of touch and cap and balance sheet challenged
I don't know why so many posters think Schoen is going to trade away draft picks. He seems to value them a great deal.
Because so many posters here wouldn’t have a clue if it sat on their face
We only have a small sample size (last year), but his "tendency" so far is to move down and acquire more picks.
I suppose it would be wide to see what his mentor in Buffalo did too.
I will say this: if you listen to Schoen, he publicly puts a very high value on draft picks. The Giants draft pick total sounds more impressive than it really is this year... most of those picks are day 3 picks.
That’s totally fair, just they do have pick 25 and I do know that teams love having that 5th year option available so not fully sure how far down they would move and really hope not out of round 1 in total. If they feel that one of these WR prospects that is gettable can be that go to WR1, the 5th year can be massive.
As Schoen and Daboll stated in their joint press conference:: don’t be surprised to see a 50% roster turnover on this team next year.
We are rebuilding and could take a step back next year
We have a talent gap compared to serious SB contenders
Agree, I hope the fanbase has patience.
I'm not opposed to trading for players, but I'd prefer they be at positions that are hard to fill.
I'm not opposed to trading for players, but I'd prefer they be at positions that are hard to fill.
I think some look at the A.J. Brown trade and how it helped the Eagles. But look at their roster, particularly the offensive and defensive lines.
Also, I think a lot of posters seem to be dialed into WR in the first when it appears to me that CB is where the value will be. WR looks like a better value in Day 2 based on how the sharper draft analysts are stacking this class atm.
Also, I think a lot of posters seem to be dialed into WR in the first when it appears to me that CB is where the value will be. WR looks like a better value in Day 2 based on how the sharper draft analysts are stacking this class atm.
Again, every draft pick matters.
But even if you don't agree with that, his base salary in 2023 is $13,000,000.
I'm not necessarily all-in on Evans. The issue with him is more that there's only 1 year left on the deal but this idea that every single transaction has to be a factor in like 2025 is nonsense. This is a type of move that keeps you from shopping hungry early in the draft, it helps you draft better/smarter.
I'm not necessarily all-in on Evans. The issue with him is more that there's only 1 year left on the deal but this idea that every single transaction has to be a factor in like 2025 is nonsense. This is a type of move that keeps you from shopping hungry early in the draft, it helps you draft better/smarter.
You might want to see what a 2nd-=round draft pick on his initial contract makes before saying that is typical WR2 money.
The NFC is extremely weak and just got weaker without Brady. The Giants can only improve as long as Jones and Barkley return.
Also one extra team in the playoffs now..
I would be surprised if Giants miss playoffs..
MVS essentially signed for 1yr 9m last year to put this in perspective. Evans at 30 is still way ahead of MVS.
That's just not how things work. At all.
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at the schedule and the work that still needs to be done on the roster, I would not be shocked to see the Giants have problems making the playoffs next year.
The NFC is extremely weak and just got weaker without Brady. The Giants can only improve as long as Jones and Barkley return.
Also one extra team in the playoffs now..
I would be surprised if Giants miss playoffs..
(1) Never assume a team can "only improve." (You can look at multiple teams in any season and just see how wrong that assumption is).
(2) We have no idea how weak or strong the NFC will be next year. Everyone assumed the AFC was going to easily win the Super Bowl this year back in the the summer.
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In comment 16022611 Eric from BBI said:
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at the schedule and the work that still needs to be done on the roster, I would not be shocked to see the Giants have problems making the playoffs next year.
The NFC is extremely weak and just got weaker without Brady. The Giants can only improve as long as Jones and Barkley return.
Also one extra team in the playoffs now..
I would be surprised if Giants miss playoffs..
(1) Never assume a team can "only improve." (You can look at multiple teams in any season and just see how wrong that assumption is).
(2) We have no idea how weak or strong the NFC will be next year. Everyone assumed the AFC was going to easily win the Super Bowl this year back in the the summer.
If the Giants fail to improve that would be a bad sign for Daboll and Schoen.
Also, Remember Schoen didn't have "His Scouts" for last year's draft. This is his first full year of scouting "his way". He is going to want to use most of those draft picks.
Again, i don't think you're accurately assessing the weakness of the Giants' 2022 schedule, and just how hard they had to work to win one-score games. This wasn't a strong roster.
On paper, the 2023 schedule looks much tougher (but that could change).
Jones and/or Barkley may or may not be re-signed. Even if they are, they could regress back to their previous play.
The talent gap between the Giants and Eagles and Cowboys is pretty big right now. Hell, if the Commanders get a QB, they could move past the Giants.
This is a rebuilding ball club or had a good season. That doesn't change the fact that they will only be in year #2 of the rebuilding effort in a very tough division (3 of the final four teams in the NFC this year were from the NFC East).
That sounds like Dave Gettleman.
Dec 11: 48-22
Jan 21: 38-7
Live in reality.
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within the next two years. I wouldn’t overstate the importance of age with that in mind.
That sounds like Dave Gettleman.
The Bucs didn’t win a SB with a ton of veterans? The Rams didn’t do the same? The Eagles didn’t bring in several vets? Just because Gettleman failed spectacularly with some FA signings, doesn’t mean that Schoen can’t find value with older players.
In addition, losing 4 Draft picks for the season, and having the number 7 pick in the draft, Neal, struggled.
With a few decent FA signings, to go with a few good draft picks, the team should be able to compete for a championship. And by that I mean play a competitive game in the divisional round. Especially if guys like Neal take a big step in their second season, and we get a little lucky on health.
As much as I want a guy like Hopkins, I don't think they fit into the Giants plans as of now. The only way the Giants take a step forward is by drafting well. We have to draft well because we are about to sign some high priced guys in the next 2 years.