As expected, Lombardi was critical of the Jones signing. He said Jones is a good player, but the Giants overpaid. He’s made the point that NYG always falls in love with their own players and wants to keep them. He says agents know this and it leads to players getting overpaid.
He did not think NYG should have franchised Jones, rather test the market. He did not think any other team would give Jones the money NYG did.
He also said NYG will likely sign Barkley long term for the same reason.
I’m curious to what everyone thinks of this. Do you think he’s got a point?
The podcast is linked below. Jones conversation starts at 31:00.
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But I'm fine with it...that's my QB let Schoen earn his money assembling a team around him
I do think keeping the homegrown players matter.
Giants have been criticized over the last decade for not retaining their own players -- lol
You can pretty much guarantee that there would be 3-4 other teams willing to do that.
@AlbertBreer
Daniel Jones and Saquon Barkley were probably the two biggest examples of the difference Brian Daboll and Joe Schoen made in Year 1 for the Giants. Benefit of paying them: Showing other guys that buying in gets you results AND rewards.
That very much matters in program-building.
Jones would have likely gotten more guaranteed money on the open market actually.
He does clearly hate the Giants.
It's probably a case of not wanting to play moneyball with every single decision. Especially when dealing with two guys that were leaders in the locker room. Also not wanting to bottom out. It's not like they didn't protect themselves in the Jones deal and they are leveraging the tag in the Saquan negotiations.
I am more concerned about Barkley than I am about Jones. I love Saquon as a person, but don't think it makes sense to give a RB a huge contract. I think Schoen understands this.
Giants have been criticized over the last decade for not retaining their own players -- lol
His articles are not worth reading. His opinion is as important as the guy standing next to you in line at the urinal at the game.
It’s ridiculous
More shit stirring pandering to the masses who lap this shit up like gospel. It's trash.
The Giants can also get out in 2 years with only a little pain.
So as much as the parade has been thrown and bottles popped and everyone is talking about Schoen perhaps overpaying or Daniel is or isn't a franchise QB...the structure of the deal very much communicates to Daniel that he still has a lot to prove to be here longer than the next two or maybe three seasons. That's in stark contrast to the type of deal that Josh Allen got, for example.
If DJ stumbles next year, this deal won't prevent Schoen from taking a QB at any round of the 2024 draft. He might only consider QBs round 3 or later this year, but it wouldn't be the case in 2024.
Lombardi is just another out of touch windbag who thinks he knows anything despite being out of the loop.
Nah, can't be. Lombardi and posters here are smarter than Daboll. And Schoen. They would have saved money because they know better than people literally working in the business.
WTF does Schoen know? HE overpaid...
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Albert Breer
@AlbertBreer
Daniel Jones and Saquon Barkley were probably the two biggest examples of the difference Brian Daboll and Joe Schoen made in Year 1 for the Giants. Benefit of paying them: Showing other guys that buying in gets you results AND rewards.
That very much matters in program-building.
Jones contract was more than the Giants wanted to pay but I don’t think they overpaid. Totally free agent Derek Carr is a reasonable complement but we are talking about small differences in average pay.
If Lombardi was good at his former job, he would still have it instead of getting paid per appearance on sports shows and podcasts. If you asked Lombardi how much he will make next year, he has no clue. He can’t even guess.
The Giants can also get out in 2 years with only a little pain.
So as much as the parade has been thrown and bottles popped and everyone is talking about Schoen perhaps overpaying or Daniel is or isn't a franchise QB...the structure of the deal very much communicates to Daniel that he still has a lot to prove to be here longer than the next two or maybe three seasons. That's in stark contrast to the type of deal that Josh Allen got, for example.
If DJ stumbles next year, this deal won't prevent Schoen from taking a QB at any round of the 2024 draft. He might only consider QBs round 3 or later this year, but it wouldn't be the case in 2024.
The fact that they can get out of this contract after 2 years if he fails - and they have more cap space available in 2023 with both Barkley and Jones than if they had franchised Jones - seems like a major win to me.
The structure of the contract is a big deal.
If Jones was a UFA, he would 100% have received interest from other teams. Carolina, Atlanta, Jets, Houston, Raiders, Commanders... no one would have any interest in signing Jones? And at that point the Giants would have pissed off Jones and had zero control of where he went. How on earth is that smart?
Why do people value this clown's opinion?
But who really cares. It's not our money.
In the end, the question is, can you win a Super Bowl with Jones? We will know the answer to this question pretty soon. Likely, within a year or two. I say we can't.
I'm not sure, based on conflicting reports and interpretations, if this is really a 2-year deal or a 3-year deal. But by the end of year 2 if the answer is NO WE CANNOT WIN A SUPER BOWL WITH JONES, I would expect Schoen to make the transition, if for no other reason than to save his job.
If Jones was a UFA, he would 100% have received interest from other teams. Carolina, Atlanta, Jets, Houston, Raiders, Commanders... no one would have any interest in signing Jones? And at that point the Giants would have pissed off Jones and had zero control of where he went. How on earth is that smart?
Why do people value this clown's opinion?
Carr got tepid interest at best. Don't think Jones would have gotten much more. He's not viewed around the league and in the media the way the Giants and our fans view him. Does it matter? The Giants are happy for now.
His articles are not worth reading. His opinion is as important as the guy standing next to you in line at the urinal at the game.
Dude has forgotten more about football than you'll ever know.
1 team loyalty and cohesiveness
2 fewer expensive free agents
3 fewer players having to learn a new playbook
4 ability to build units that fit coordinators' philosophies
5 members of a unit knowing how team mates will react
Not letting your better players leave in free agency is PART of such a scheme (funded in part by #2 above).
Eli did the second thing twice and people still deprecate him because the Giants were lousy a lot of the time while he was QB.
Exactly!! WTF is Lomardi talking about???
Other than Davis Webb and Landon Collins returning, I think Beckham was the only player we resigned over a huge swath of time, and then we traded him the following season.
If anything, it's the opposite - the Giants haven't shown a lot of love for their own players.
Thread should have ended here. Guy is an absolute clown, haven’t clicked on one of his articles in a very long time and never will again. Loser!
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So he wanted the Giants to risk letting Jones walk for nothing? Then what? He would be the first jackass ripping the Giants for not maximizing their asset.
If Jones was a UFA, he would 100% have received interest from other teams. Carolina, Atlanta, Jets, Houston, Raiders, Commanders... no one would have any interest in signing Jones? And at that point the Giants would have pissed off Jones and had zero control of where he went. How on earth is that smart?
Why do people value this clown's opinion?
Carr got tepid interest at best. Don't think Jones would have gotten much more. He's not viewed around the league and in the media the way the Giants and our fans view him. Does it matter? The Giants are happy for now.
Carr got tepid interest because he was perceived like when the Giants went after Kurt Warner. Carr also I think frustrated a number of coaching staffs because there were plays where he acted like he was a dog approaching an electric fence when he neared the Line of Scrimmage. I forget which commentator on the NFL XM channel suggested that if he was still a head coach he would call designed runs for Carr to make him have to do that.
Tell that to Derek Carr who must have been disappointed by the deal he got. All these teams people are mentioning, not one has been linked to Jones, all refused to give Carr or anybody else a market-busting contract, they are even lukewarm to Lamar so far. The Giants gave Jones the 7th or 8th biggest NFL contract of all time. All this certainty that the market would have topped that deal, or come anywhere close, is just bluster. But what does it matter? You're happy with the deal, right?
Imagine an alternate universe where the NFL season played out exactly as it did here, but the one difference being that the Giants (by dint of good fortune) have two first round picks in this coming draft, and one of them is in the Top 5.
Now when Team Jones shows up demanding $40+ million per year, Schoen has a viable alternative, and can better afford a lower "walk-away" number. But alas, the Giants had no particularly good options other than to deal with Team Jones seriously, and hopefully land on a final number that wasn't crippling. (They succeeded, by the way).
Did Lombardi consider that? Jeez louise...
So, in his view, nothing has really changed with Schoen.
I think it would have been very interesting to allow Jones to test the open market. One of the great mysteries is how would the market value a player with such limited production over his four years.
But I've always assumed since the win over Minnesota that Jones was going to be retained.
Keeping Barkley on a long term deal with a AAV package $10M or > will be epically idiotic and give me serious concerns about Schoen's approach to building a team. That's the situation I'm very interested in...
So, in his view, nothing has really changed with Schoen.
Yawn...
However, teams tend to prefer to keep their own if they are good players. That not necessarily a "Giants thing."
And this guy is routinely incredibly wrong. The same guy that said at the end of Russell Wilson's rookie year that he was a fluke and wouldn't be a a long term NFL starter. Same guy who said Doug Pedersen was the worst nfl head coach in 30 years.
He was a terrible GM and is a complete blowhard.
Did Lombardi consider that? Jeez louise...
Exactly this. Pundits nationwide aren't actually looking at the contract details.
I agree that no one would've given us 2 firsts for him, and the franchise tag means only a few million less and continual aggravation all season while a deal is hammered out.
It's an 3 year deal, with a 4th year option and only 2 years guaranteed. It's fair.
And this guy is routinely incredibly wrong. The same guy that said at the end of Russell Wilson's rookie year that he was a fluke and wouldn't be a a long term NFL starter. Same guy who said Doug Pedersen was the worst nfl head coach in 30 years.
He was a terrible GM and is a complete blowhard.
I'm not arguing that the Giants should have passed on Jones, but there is a significant risk here. Not just for the W-L record but for the future of Schoen and Daboll. Let's not pretend there isn't significant risk.
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Look at the league. Half the teams don't have a legit QB. I'll bet at least three teams would have bid on him This contract was a market value deal. No question.
Tell that to Derek Carr who must have been disappointed by the deal he got. All these teams people are mentioning, not one has been linked to Jones, all refused to give Carr or anybody else a market-busting contract, they are even lukewarm to Lamar so far. The Giants gave Jones the 7th or 8th biggest NFL contract of all time. All this certainty that the market would have topped that deal, or come anywhere close, is just bluster. But what does it matter? You're happy with the deal, right?
Carr is a known commodity vet. Do you want him? Guys like him and Garapolo are devalued and for good reason. And Lamar is asking to be the highest paid QB in the league. Neither are comparable to Jones situation.
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So if you agree with this clown, you would he okay with letting Jones walk for nothing? Because there is no gray area there- they would have zero control.
And this guy is routinely incredibly wrong. The same guy that said at the end of Russell Wilson's rookie year that he was a fluke and wouldn't be a a long term NFL starter. Same guy who said Doug Pedersen was the worst nfl head coach in 30 years.
He was a terrible GM and is a complete blowhard.
I'm not arguing that the Giants should have passed on Jones, but there is a significant risk here. Not just for the W-L record but for the future of Schoen and Daboll. Let's not pretend there isn't significant risk.
So you would okay with an outcome where he walked for nothing? Because that's the risk you would have to take with his suggestion. And it only takes 1 team.
In fact a recent study of 7 years of draft picks (2010 to 2017) shows less than one third of 1st round picks signed a second contract with their original draft team. It get worse as the rounds get higher. 2nd round picks sign a second contract with their original draft team less than 25% of the time, and 3rd round is around just 17%.....
This study also highlights the fact fans (and some teams) overrate draft picks in general.
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In comment 16059459 BillT said:
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Look at the league. Half the teams don't have a legit QB. I'll bet at least three teams would have bid on him This contract was a market value deal. No question.
Tell that to Derek Carr who must have been disappointed by the deal he got. All these teams people are mentioning, not one has been linked to Jones, all refused to give Carr or anybody else a market-busting contract, they are even lukewarm to Lamar so far. The Giants gave Jones the 7th or 8th biggest NFL contract of all time. All this certainty that the market would have topped that deal, or come anywhere close, is just bluster. But what does it matter? You're happy with the deal, right?
Carr is a known commodity vet. Do you want him? Guys like him and Garapolo are devalued and for good reason. And Lamar is asking to be the highest paid QB in the league. Neither are comparable to Jones situation.
They are not the same situation. I agree. Carr is a known quantity. He got paid for his level of play. For Jones, the floor is lower and the ceiling is higher. Teams know that. Probably half the league wants the vet with the known track record. And then half or more of the teams people are talking about are drafting a QB this year. The Saints are out. The Texans, Indy, Carolina and the Raiders are likely all drafting a QB. They are not in the market for Jones. If you think these teams want Jones rather than to reset the clock with higher upside prospects, you are engaging in wishful thinking. The Texans don't want Jones. They want Stroud or Young.
One year alone will not change that. Start stacking winning seasons and post season success and even Lombardi will change his tune.
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In comment 16059481 TyreeHelmet said:
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So if you agree with this clown, you would he okay with letting Jones walk for nothing? Because there is no gray area there- they would have zero control.
And this guy is routinely incredibly wrong. The same guy that said at the end of Russell Wilson's rookie year that he was a fluke and wouldn't be a a long term NFL starter. Same guy who said Doug Pedersen was the worst nfl head coach in 30 years.
He was a terrible GM and is a complete blowhard.
I'm not arguing that the Giants should have passed on Jones, but there is a significant risk here. Not just for the W-L record but for the future of Schoen and Daboll. Let's not pretend there isn't significant risk.
So you would okay with an outcome where he walked for nothing? Because that's the risk you would have to take with his suggestion. And it only takes 1 team.
I was perfectly OK with letting Daniel Jones walk. As far as I am concerned, he has proven anything yet. Fingers crossed this works out.
They are not the same situation. I agree. Carr is a known quantity. He got paid for his level of play. For Jones, the floor is lower and the ceiling is higher. Teams know that. Probably half the league wants the vet with the known track record. And then half or more of the teams people are talking about are drafting a QB this year. The Saints are out. The Texans, Indy, Carolina and the Raiders are likely all drafting a QB. They are not in the market for Jones. If you think these teams want Jones rather than to reset the clock with higher upside prospects, you are engaging in wishful thinking. The Texans don't want Jones. They want Stroud or Young.
So if "half the league wants the vet with the known track record" why didn't Carr get e better contract. Teams without better choices sign guys like Carr. No one really wants him. And even if "half or more of the teams people are talking about are drafting a QB this year" There are still enough to have a a number bidding for Jones.
You mean walk and not franchise him?
Did Lombardi consider that? Jeez louise...
I still don't know if this is a 2-year commitment or a 3-year commitment. Most observers say it is two years.
Tim over at NY Giants Stright Talk/Online Big Blue Sports ent keeps insisting this is a 3 year contract. He says there is an 18M dead cap hit in year 3 if we release or trade.
Honestly, I'm a bit confused what to think about this particular issue.
One year alone will not change that. Start stacking winning seasons and post season success and even Lombardi will change his tune.
No he won't. That's his shtick.
I would love to see him try to list the players he is talking about.
the way he overhyped matt rhule as the next coming purely because he employed one of his kids put to bed any credibility anyone thought lombardi deserved.
I'll trust that over a failed GM and gambling website host, who has never met DJ, and his opinions.
They are betting on DJ's upside.
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...in only two years, with very little pain.
Did Lombardi consider that? Jeez louise...
I still don't know if this is a 2-year commitment or a 3-year commitment. Most observers say it is two years.
Tim over at NY Giants Stright Talk/Online Big Blue Sports ent keeps insisting this is a 3 year contract. He says there is an 18M dead cap hit in year 3 if we release or trade.
Honestly, I'm a bit confused what to think about this particular issue.
It's PROBABLY a three year commitment, but if he fails spectacularly, they can get out in 2 without much pain. $18M of dead money by 2025 isn't terrible, and if coupled with a draft pick, even with a bridge vet QB brought in, likely wouldn't be an exorbitant cost-allocation in terms of cap hit percentage to the position.
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...in only two years, with very little pain.
Did Lombardi consider that? Jeez louise...
I still don't know if this is a 2-year commitment or a 3-year commitment. Most observers say it is two years.
Tim over at NY Giants Stright Talk/Online Big Blue Sports ent keeps insisting this is a 3 year contract. He says there is an 18M dead cap hit in year 3 if we release or trade.
Honestly, I'm a bit confused what to think about this particular issue.
There is an $18 million dead cap hit if the team cuts or trades Jones in 2025 (pre 6/1), however they'd also save $21.5 million, so in that sense, they'd come out ahead.
If they wait another year, the dead cap hit would be only $9 million, and they'd save $47.5 million.
I'll trust that over a failed GM and gambling website host, who has never met DJ, and his opinions.
They are betting on DJ's upside.
Huh? That's a weird take, you could finish the thought completely: "...coached and observed DJ for the past year, with no ties to him, decided, given the current alternatives, he wanted DJ to be his QB."
I mean, it's not like if we held the #1 overall pick you could say Daboll would would still prefer DJ. You know, ifs and buts. The point is, this is a situation of "love the one you're with."
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NOT proven anything yet.
You mean walk and not franchise him?
If Schoen and Daboll were not convinced in the player, I was perfectly OK with them letting him walk.
Look, I'm thrilled he played better last year, but Jones had been a Cowboy and the Cowboys gave him $160 million, most of BBI would be laughing right now.
I'll trust that over a failed GM and gambling website host, who has never met DJ, and his opinions.
They are betting on DJ's upside.
We don't really know what is on Schoen and Daboll's mind. They didn't give Jones a long term mega deal. Any deal we can exit in 2 or 3 years comes with implicit caveats. It could be they didn't see an alternative within reach that moved the needle for them, so they were happy to build on what we have done so far, with a chance to exit after building up the roster a bit more. We just don't know how they view this. They will never tell us their honest feelings, if they have real questions.
Only he is kind of lying because the Giants rarely give out second contracts to their guys. Did he list examples? My guess is not based on his poor track record of being a shit analyst.
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In comment 16059504 Eric from BBI said:
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NOT proven anything yet.
You mean walk and not franchise him?
If Schoen and Daboll were not convinced in the player, I was perfectly OK with them letting him walk.
Look, I'm thrilled he played better last year, but Jones had been a Cowboy and the Cowboys gave him $160 million, most of BBI would be laughing right now.
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In comment 16059486 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 16059481 TyreeHelmet said:
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So if you agree with this clown, you would he okay with letting Jones walk for nothing? Because there is no gray area there- they would have zero control.
And this guy is routinely incredibly wrong. The same guy that said at the end of Russell Wilson's rookie year that he was a fluke and wouldn't be a a long term NFL starter. Same guy who said Doug Pedersen was the worst nfl head coach in 30 years.
He was a terrible GM and is a complete blowhard.
I'm not arguing that the Giants should have passed on Jones, but there is a significant risk here. Not just for the W-L record but for the future of Schoen and Daboll. Let's not pretend there isn't significant risk.
So you would okay with an outcome where he walked for nothing? Because that's the risk you would have to take with his suggestion. And it only takes 1 team.
I was perfectly OK with letting Daniel Jones walk. As far as I am concerned, he has proven anything yet. Fingers crossed this works out.
+1
I'm also concerned about what is going to happen with Saquon. Rookie year Saquon isn't coming back. Yes, he still may have 3 or 4 dominating performances left in the tank in 2023 but it's only going to get worse moving forward. Saquon wouldn't sign for $12M/year and even that was too much. Now we're going to invest even more in a player whose trajectory is certainly not ascending?
Schoen and Daboll's jobs are for the Giants to win as many games as possible in 2023 without mortgaging the immediate future seasons.
Based on drafting 25th in 2023 and the QB FAs combined with the QBs in the draft this year Schoen and Daboll have chosen to stay with Daniel Jones for the short term. Obviously right now they feel that Jones is their best chance to win the most games in 2023 and 24.
If they're wrong and Jones regresses and the Giants have a bad season in 2023 they will be in a better position to draft a starting QB in next years draft. The same thing goes for 2024.
I think the Giants paid Daniel Jones more than any other team would have for the next 2 seasons. I also think he's worth more to the Giants than any other team. If the Giants let him leave Daboll and Kafka would have to start over with another QB and it doesn't seem as if the Giants have the assets to acquire a better QB than Jones for the next year or two.
Right now Jones and Barkley are under the Giants control for 31M in 2023. If the Giants had used the Non Exclusive Tag on Jones he would count for 32.5 by himself. I think it was the smartest choice the GM and HC could make to play the hand they have right now.
If the Giants had only won 4/5/6 games in 2022 Daniel Jones probably wouldn't be back. But they won 10, including a playoff game and Jones was one the main reasons why. So he played the Giants out of the 2023 QB market and got well paid for it. Good for him. His contract is only a 2 or 3 year deal.
In 2022 Schoen, Daboll/Kafka seriously dated. Now they're engaged. We will see how it plays out and if two years from now they get married or break up.
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In comment 16059504 Eric from BBI said:
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NOT proven anything yet.
You mean walk and not franchise him?
If Schoen and Daboll were not convinced in the player, I was perfectly OK with them letting him walk.
Look, I'm thrilled he played better last year, but Jones had been a Cowboy and the Cowboys gave him $160 million, most of BBI would be laughing right now.
Most of BBI laughing is probably the most insignificant indicator imaginable.
I disagree.
Jones has proven that he is an NFL quarterback that is fully capable of winning in this league.
That much is crystal clear.
Is he saying that Mara forced the Jones contract, despite almost every other report saying Schoen and Daboll had free reign?
Or is he using "The Giants" as some sort of sentient machine making the same decisions every decade, regardless who the GM is, so that he can pretend the contract he disagrees with is a systemic problem?
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New England (Brady)Buffalo (Allen),and Alabama (Hurts, Tua, Mac Jones) coached and observed DJ for the past year, with no ties to him, decided he wanted DJ to be his QB.
I'll trust that over a failed GM and gambling website host, who has never met DJ, and his opinions.
They are betting on DJ's upside.
We don't really know what is on Schoen and Daboll's mind. They didn't give Jones a long term mega deal. Any deal we can exit in 2 or 3 years comes with implicit caveats. It could be they didn't see an alternative within reach that moved the needle for them, so they were happy to build on what we have done so far, with a chance to exit after building up the roster a bit more. We just don't know how they view this. They will never tell us their honest feelings, if they have real questions.
They just gave him 100 million. I think anyone that’s objective and alert can get a good sense of their honest opinion.
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In comment 16059504 Eric from BBI said:
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NOT proven anything yet.
You mean walk and not franchise him?
If Schoen and Daboll were not convinced in the player, I was perfectly OK with them letting him walk.
Look, I'm thrilled he played better last year, but Jones had been a Cowboy and the Cowboys gave him $160 million, most of BBI would be laughing right now.
But Schoen said right after the season ended that DJ would be here next year...
This deal is not too different than Franchise/Franchise back to back, but we have cap space now
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NOT proven anything yet.
I disagree.
Jones has proven that he is an NFL quarterback that is fully capable of winning in this league.
That much is crystal clear.
There are a lot of average QBs who can win in this league. Most of them don't get $160 million.
There is a significant risk here.
He's not wrong, in principle, but the Jones case has a few wrinkles.
1). It would not be unfair to say that we don't actually know whether Jones is elite or not. Take whatever elite QB you want and sub them in for Jones last season. Do any of them completely dust Jones in terms of performance?
Jones might be elite-in-waiting. If the team continues to add talent and we see commensurate improvements in Jones's performance, we will look back in a couple years and say that Jones was already an elite QB in 2022 - he just didn't have the people around him to make it obvious.
Dallas has better WRs and TE by miles, and their RBs and OL are probably better than ours. I can only imagine the train wreck Dak would with our offense last season.
As a Giants fan, I'm currently laughing at the contract Dallas gave Dak.
A lot of posters on this sight, given the injury situation in early September, swore up and down this team would be lucky to win 5-6 games. They were PROVEN wrong.
So either they are way off base, or they feel very comfortable giving the keys to Jones for the next 2-3 seasons as they continue to build this thing. There is also a risk in losing Jones and getting X at QB. Who is X? What are the other options and how does that make your team better or worse? Sure, they could have said hey let's just kind of start over at QB. Then, you either get a veteran who you still have to pay pretty good starting QB money for, maybe that player can be somewhat similar to Jones in terms of production. Or, you can go with a rookie who will likely need serious time because of where they are drafting. Or, you can go with a backup level QB and probably not be a very good team, and try to sell to the fans who just had their first taste of something good in literally forever, that you are starting from scratch at QB again and you'll just wait until the right player comes along.
Sure, Jones hasn't "proven" anything in terms of being an upper echelon QB or pro bowl QB. But because he finally has someone who can coach worth a damn, he was in the divisional playoff round this year with some pretty shitty weapons and first year system. Used his legs more. Way quicker in the pocket. Didn't get sacked a ton because he wasn't waiting forever to throw the ball. Put the team on his back in multiple games, and then looked flat out great against the Vikings in a hostile environment. Caught up to him and the team against Philly, and that sucks, but it doesn't make sense to me when someone says "Jones hasn't proven anything." Yes he has. He has proven that he is a playoff winning quarterback in a pretty shitty situation. He has proven that he can completely shake off the first 3 years of his mostly average/up and down career and start to ascend with the right coach.
So, you may think there is risk with signing Daniel Jones. But there is a lot more risk in basically doing nothing, IMO. As Schoen stated multiple times since he's been here, they have seen Jones since he was drafted, they know what type of player and person they are getting here. Taking a risk on someone else has a lot of consequences as well.
There is significant risk here. If you are going to say otherwise, then you are not being objective.
No disrespect, but you've been part of the cheerleading squad for years when every decision this team made was terrible.
I'm hopeful this decision works out well, but we're going to have to cross our fingers on this one.
Obviously I’m not saying anyone can’t be critical of Schoen\Daboll or the contact offered to DJ…but these guys inherited DJ, didn’t exercise his 5th year made him prove it and he answered with his best year and the Giants we’re winning..these guys were in the catbird seat the entire time. The owed DJ nothing. Who would be in a better position to evaluate the worth of Jones? It’s certainly not Lombardi…dude is a troll.
I hate it when you guys ruin a good story with facts.
How can you justify letting him walk for nothing? Who’s your quarterback next year then?
I simply don’t see the massive risk in this contract and it would have been an idiot football move to risk letting him walk to a contender for zero compensation.
Another guy with an anti NYG bias. I hope he chokes on 18-1 for the rest of his life.
The Ravens paid Joe Flacco for 6 seasons after he won a Super Bowl in his Free Agent walk year. The Ravens paid Flacco for past performance. Jones is getting paid for future performance. His contract is nothing like the Flacco contract. A poor at best comparison.
And he gets even more foolish by bringing an NBA player into an NFL conversation. Comparing any NFL contract besides Watson's to an NBA contract is at best disingenuous, IMO in Simmons case it's just more garbage for clicks. After his 9th NBA season the Wizards gave Beal a five year, fully guaranteed contract for $251 million at 29 years old. How many NBA get better when they're 30? Another past performance contract.
Daniel Jones will be 26 when the 2023 season starts. With good health luck he should be just entering his prime and his NFL, not NBA, contract is basically for 3 seasons max. Before the 4th season of the contract kicks in he'll either get extended or the Giants will move on. At that point he'll be younger or about the same age as Beal when he got his NBA 251M.
Did I mention F Bill Simmons?
I simply don’t see the massive risk in this contract and it would have been an idiot football move to risk letting him walk to a contender for zero compensation.
The risk is, if Jones flames out, we're stuck with him for two years. Then presumably we have to draft the next Guy and hope he proves out? That's a couple additional years of time invested even if he does. And then what if he doesn't?
The money, oddly enough, isn't the biggest issue. The deal got done ahead of the anticipated jump in cap ceiling over the next few years. The real risk is the franchise gets sucked into a competitive black hole for the next several years while we pay for the mistake in other ways.
Obviously I’m not saying anyone can’t be critical of Schoen\Daboll or the contact offered to DJ…but these guys inherited DJ, didn’t exercise his 5th year made him prove it and he answered with his best year and the Giants we’re winning..these guys were in the catbird seat the entire time. The owed DJ nothing. Who would be in a better position to evaluate the worth of Jones? It’s certainly not Lombardi…dude is a troll.
Maybe they wouldn’t give his 2 sons jobs like other teams did. The same guy who killed the giants for nepotism…
After the Pederson comments, it’s incredible this guy is employed anywhere.
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and Eric, the Giants didn't give Daniel Jones 160M. So, let's not act like that's the amount he is guaranteed.
There is significant risk here. If you are going to say otherwise, then you are not being objective.
No disrespect, but you've been part of the cheerleading squad for years when every decision this team made was terrible.
I'm hopeful this decision works out well, but we're going to have to cross our fingers on this one.
The bigger risk is scrambling to sign Rogers, Darnold or Garrafalo.
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In comment 16059565 ryanmkeane said:
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and Eric, the Giants didn't give Daniel Jones 160M. So, let's not act like that's the amount he is guaranteed.
There is significant risk here. If you are going to say otherwise, then you are not being objective.
No disrespect, but you've been part of the cheerleading squad for years when every decision this team made was terrible.
I'm hopeful this decision works out well, but we're going to have to cross our fingers on this one.
The bigger risk is scrambling to sign Rogers, Darnold or Garrafalo.
It would be really risky having a reporter as QB, that is true.
The thing that has frustrated me about this whole debate is that in the literally 6 months that is has raged not one person has put on the table a realistic, viable alternative for the Giants at QB in the immediate. You don't think there is risk in trading away as many as three first rounders and likely at least a couple of twos to have a shot at maybe the 3rd or 4th ranked QBs in this draft doesn't involve risk. Or signing a Carr or Garoppolo (who gets hurt every 5th game) for slightly less doesn't involve risk.
The fact is that yeah resigning Jones has risk, but given the other options it probably is the least riskiest going forward. You also have to remember how NFL teams think. They're trying to build something here and you do that by making bold moves. Nobody has ever won a championship simply filling holes and guarding salary cap space.
I also suspect that the Giants aren't all that unhappy about how much they paid DJ. Sure they could have probably saved a few bucks by holding firmer, but I think they think this team is close to taking off and view DJ as far and away their best option to get there. I think they also see DJ as the team leader and wanted to treat him as such to send a message to the rest of the team. Anybody ever run an office where the boss mickles and dimes every one. Doesn't usually work out that well.
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In comment 16059569 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 16059565 ryanmkeane said:
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and Eric, the Giants didn't give Daniel Jones 160M. So, let's not act like that's the amount he is guaranteed.
There is significant risk here. If you are going to say otherwise, then you are not being objective.
No disrespect, but you've been part of the cheerleading squad for years when every decision this team made was terrible.
I'm hopeful this decision works out well, but we're going to have to cross our fingers on this one.
The bigger risk is scrambling to sign Rogers, Darnold or Garrafalo.
It would be really risky having a reporter as QB, that is true.
LOL Nice!!!
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I simply don’t see the massive risk in this contract and it would have been an idiot football move to risk letting him walk to a contender for zero compensation.
The risk is, if Jones flames out, we're stuck with him for two years. Then presumably we have to draft the next Guy and hope he proves out? That's a couple additional years of time invested even if he does. And then what if he doesn't?
The money, oddly enough, isn't the biggest issue. The deal got done ahead of the anticipated jump in cap ceiling over the next few years. The real risk is the franchise gets sucked into a competitive black hole for the next several years while we pay for the mistake in other ways.
Best case you hope this becomes a median level qb contract, get run blocking linemen, build up the defense, hope to hit on a receiver or two in the draft and turn yourself in the Niners East.
I think you can say this in the FA market. But with a long track of poor drafts going back a decade plus that is what happens.
Another episode in the books
A period like the Alex Smith Chiefs or the early 10s Andy Dalton Bengals might be fine for this franchise. Learn some level of sustained competence first before you start talking Superbowls.
A deal sure, but I agree that it's unlikely they'd have offered what the Giants did. Who? What team specifically? Maybe the Jets?
Just another case of the neverending story of using the term "elite" in any way you feel like. No one will argue that Jones had been elite. But this also isn't an elite contract, and that will be made more obvious over the next year or so.
Flacco signed what was a record-breaking contract at the time. That was elite money. This isn't in the same category.
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New England (Brady)Buffalo (Allen),and Alabama (Hurts, Tua, Mac Jones) coached and observed DJ for the past year, with no ties to him, decided he wanted DJ to be his QB.
I'll trust that over a failed GM and gambling website host, who has never met DJ, and his opinions.
They are betting on DJ's upside.
Huh? That's a weird take, you could finish the thought completely: "...coached and observed DJ for the past year, with no ties to him, decided, given the current alternatives, he wanted DJ to be his QB."
I mean, it's not like if we held the #1 overall pick you could say Daboll would would still prefer DJ. You know, ifs and buts. The point is, this is a situation of "love the one you're with."
At his press confrence JS said DJ can make ALL THE THROWS, why would you want to draft another QB. Even with a better pick? That would be stupid.
This…
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In comment 16059515 Tom in NY said:
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New England (Brady)Buffalo (Allen),and Alabama (Hurts, Tua, Mac Jones) coached and observed DJ for the past year, with no ties to him, decided he wanted DJ to be his QB.
I'll trust that over a failed GM and gambling website host, who has never met DJ, and his opinions.
They are betting on DJ's upside.
Huh? That's a weird take, you could finish the thought completely: "...coached and observed DJ for the past year, with no ties to him, decided, given the current alternatives, he wanted DJ to be his QB."
I mean, it's not like if we held the #1 overall pick you could say Daboll would would still prefer DJ. You know, ifs and buts. The point is, this is a situation of "love the one you're with."
At his press confrence JS said DJ can make ALL THE THROWS, why would you want to draft another QB. Even with a better pick? That would be stupid.
So you're saying if Schoen had the #1 pick in this draft, and they let DJ walk to draft Stroud, then that would be stupid?
LMAO.
I think we are all aware of how good DJ's arm is...which is to say it's average NFL starter.
I'm not sure why that's what you answered with or the capitalization; being able to make all the throws is just one facet of being a good NFL QB.
I hope it all works out but it's no sure thing, and the point was that just because Schoen Daboll signed DJ to an extension, you have to consider that the alternatives in front of them were not good, or have shown to be similarly good to DJ but do not have the upside that DJ still does have, a function of his relative youth. Ex. Derek Carr. They don't have a high enough first to consider drafting a franchise QB, and other than Carr or DJ, what were the other options? Carson Wentz?
It's really overstating their confidence-level given this is essentially a 3-year deal they can escape from in two years.
If they were seriously convinced DJ could be a franchise QB that can put them in contention for a Super Bowl, or at least playoffs every year, why not lock him up for 6 years or more?
Psst, it's because he hasn't yet earned that level of confidence he can do that. Everyone understands he is still a maybe. Including Schoen and Daboll. They all like him...sure, there's a lot to like. I like Rob Schneider but I don't think he's ever going to win an Oscar for best male actor in a leading role.
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New England (Brady)Buffalo (Allen),and Alabama (Hurts, Tua, Mac Jones) coached and observed DJ for the past year, with no ties to him, decided he wanted DJ to be his QB.
I'll trust that over a failed GM and gambling website host, who has never met DJ, and his opinions.
They are betting on DJ's upside.
We don't really know what is on Schoen and Daboll's mind. They didn't give Jones a long term mega deal. Any deal we can exit in 2 or 3 years comes with implicit caveats. It could be they didn't see an alternative within reach that moved the needle for them, so they were happy to build on what we have done so far, with a chance to exit after building up the roster a bit more. We just don't know how they view this. They will never tell us their honest feelings, if they have real questions.
$100M given to Jones doesn't tell us how they feel about him?
Did you hear Schoen say on the press conference that they believe they can go to the Super Bowl with Jones?
Did you watch and listen to Daboll react to Jones on the field all season?
They have spoken and told you they are excited about having him as their QB and continuing to progress in the coming years.
Enjoy the ride...it's just starting.
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In comment 16059504 Eric from BBI said:
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NOT proven anything yet.
I disagree.
Jones has proven that he is an NFL quarterback that is fully capable of winning in this league.
That much is crystal clear.
There are a lot of average QBs who can win in this league. Most of them don't get $160 million.
There is a significant risk here.
Except 46 mil of that isn’t guaranteed. He’ll get it if he performs well in the next three years and by then that number will probably seem low. If he doesn’t perform, they have an out and the 160 never happens.
And for those of us that believe the Giants paid too much and we turn out to be right a couple of years from now, we are going to have to hear from posters like you that "everyone want to sign him for this contract."
And you comments about JS-- this is the same type of stuff we used to hear from posters like you defending "Resume Dave Gettleman" when he 1st started.
I hope JS is right.
Schoen and Daboll's jobs are for the Giants to win as many games as possible in 2023 without mortgaging the immediate future seasons.
Based on drafting 25th in 2023 and the QB FAs combined with the QBs in the draft this year Schoen and Daboll have chosen to stay with Daniel Jones for the short term. Obviously right now they feel that Jones is their best chance to win the most games in 2023 and 24.
If they're wrong and Jones regresses and the Giants have a bad season in 2023 they will be in a better position to draft a starting QB in next years draft. The same thing goes for 2024.
I think the Giants paid Daniel Jones more than any other team would have for the next 2 seasons. I also think he's worth more to the Giants than any other team. If the Giants let him leave Daboll and Kafka would have to start over with another QB and it doesn't seem as if the Giants have the assets to acquire a better QB than Jones for the next year or two.
Right now Jones and Barkley are under the Giants control for 31M in 2023. If the Giants had used the Non Exclusive Tag on Jones he would count for 32.5 by himself. I think it was the smartest choice the GM and HC could make to play the hand they have right now.
If the Giants had only won 4/5/6 games in 2022 Daniel Jones probably wouldn't be back. But they won 10, including a playoff game and Jones was one the main reasons why. So he played the Giants out of the 2023 QB market and got well paid for it. Good for him. His contract is only a 2 or 3 year deal.
In 2022 Schoen, Daboll/Kafka seriously dated. Now they're engaged. We will see how it plays out and if two years from now they get married or break up.
The problem is that their assessment of winning next year is most likely wrong. And they probably won't be blaming Jones for it and they may in fact be mediocre this not in a position to either believe or feel the need to get a QB..
Giants have to be bullish after last year when they and #8 outperformed expectations around the league.
Under this FO with Daniel Jones signed, Giants can be a consistent winner.
Unlike others, I think if Jones was let go for FA, he ends up with a bigger contract then he got from the Giants. Atlanta, Jets, Carolina maybe another or two would have gone after him.
I don't know what he will do, but he sure looked better last year than I ever thought he would have.
I understand the view that the Giants could have over paid and there is risk to the contract, but Jones hasn't proven anything? He lead us to the playoffs and won a game on the road. That counts for something in my opinion. We will have to agree to disagree.
Colin with a great post. Well said.
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And yes they should have let Jones test the market.
Unlike others, I think if Jones was let go for FA, he ends up with a bigger contract then he got from the Giants. Atlanta, Jets, Carolina maybe another or two would have gone after him.
I don't know what he will do, but he sure looked better last year than I ever thought he would have.
Atlanta is going to go with Desmond Ridder this year, the Jets are lined up to acquire Aaron Rodgers, and Carolina is going to get their guy at the very top of the draft. Really the only team who may have been interested in paying top dollar for an FA QB is the Raiders, and maybe the Bucs.
But don't forget Garappolo is still out there, who Josh McDaniels would likely have a preference for. And then there's guys like Baker Mayfield and Carson Wentz who some teams may roll the dice with on less costly contracts. I don't believe the market really was all that strong for Jones when you actually look at every teams' situation.
I’ve never seen a player get blasted so illogically.
Obviously he’s proven plenty to some pretty smart football guys, including the reigning CoY. These awful takes should be going away now. But now the site owner is piling on? C’mon.
In a team sport, DJ was never going to "prove" anything without a corresponding "team" which the Organization has managed never to provide.
There is no way of making a bet your life prediction, but DJ combines the non-physical characteristics combined with the upper echelon (not phenomenal, but more than enough) to eventually be recognized as a great QB.
We might well be sorry in a few years that we did not lock him up for longer. I can just imagine the hand wringing on BBI.
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In comment 16059885 giantstock said:
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And yes they should have let Jones test the market.
Unlike others, I think if Jones was let go for FA, he ends up with a bigger contract then he got from the Giants. Atlanta, Jets, Carolina maybe another or two would have gone after him.
I don't know what he will do, but he sure looked better last year than I ever thought he would have.
Atlanta is going to go with Desmond Ridder this year, the Jets are lined up to acquire Aaron Rodgers, and Carolina is going to get their guy at the very top of the draft. Really the only team who may have been interested in paying top dollar for an FA QB is the Raiders, and maybe the Bucs.
But don't forget Garappolo is still out there, who Josh McDaniels would likely have a preference for. And then there's guys like Baker Mayfield and Carson Wentz who some teams may roll the dice with on less costly contracts. I don't believe the market really was all that strong for Jones when you actually look at every teams' situation.
For a lot of teams, Daniel Jones was not part of their equation because Joe schoen made it clear that they had every intention of keeping him.
Maybe the panthers don't give up all of their draft capital to move up in the draft. The jets could have entertained the thought of going after Jones instead of Rodgers (younger). The commanders could have been interested. The falcons and bugs. We will never know, because the giants never made it a remote possibility and teams knew it.
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In comment 16059957 section125 said:
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In comment 16059885 giantstock said:
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And yes they should have let Jones test the market.
Unlike others, I think if Jones was let go for FA, he ends up with a bigger contract then he got from the Giants. Atlanta, Jets, Carolina maybe another or two would have gone after him.
I don't know what he will do, but he sure looked better last year than I ever thought he would have.
Atlanta is going to go with Desmond Ridder this year, the Jets are lined up to acquire Aaron Rodgers, and Carolina is going to get their guy at the very top of the draft. Really the only team who may have been interested in paying top dollar for an FA QB is the Raiders, and maybe the Bucs.
But don't forget Garappolo is still out there, who Josh McDaniels would likely have a preference for. And then there's guys like Baker Mayfield and Carson Wentz who some teams may roll the dice with on less costly contracts. I don't believe the market really was all that strong for Jones when you actually look at every teams' situation.
For a lot of teams, Daniel Jones was not part of their equation because Joe schoen made it clear that they had every intention of keeping him.
Maybe the panthers don't give up all of their draft capital to move up in the draft. The jets could have entertained the thought of going after Jones instead of Rodgers (younger). The commanders could have been interested. The falcons and bugs. We will never know, because the giants never made it a remote possibility and teams knew it.
This is what we mean when we talk about the Giants and fans overrate their own players. The Jets passed on Carr to get a chance at Rodgers. They weren't settling for Jones. Carolina wants the top pick in the draft to reset the clock and get Young or Stroud. They don't want Jones. Use your common sense. Young and Stroud are exciting to people outside the Giants world. Have you checked opinions of the Jones deal outside the Guants world? Hint, people aren't excited about it. It may be a great deal for us, in the opinion of Giants fans, but that's not the universal opinion.
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In comment 16059957 section125 said:
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In comment 16059885 giantstock said:
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And yes they should have let Jones test the market.
Unlike others, I think if Jones was let go for FA, he ends up with a bigger contract then he got from the Giants. Atlanta, Jets, Carolina maybe another or two would have gone after him.
I don't know what he will do, but he sure looked better last year than I ever thought he would have.
Atlanta is going to go with Desmond Ridder this year, the Jets are lined up to acquire Aaron Rodgers, and Carolina is going to get their guy at the very top of the draft. Really the only team who may have been interested in paying top dollar for an FA QB is the Raiders, and maybe the Bucs.
But don't forget Garappolo is still out there, who Josh McDaniels would likely have a preference for. And then there's guys like Baker Mayfield and Carson Wentz who some teams may roll the dice with on less costly contracts. I don't believe the market really was all that strong for Jones when you actually look at every teams' situation.
For a lot of teams, Daniel Jones was not part of their equation because Joe schoen made it clear that they had every intention of keeping him.
Maybe the panthers don't give up all of their draft capital to move up in the draft. The jets could have entertained the thought of going after Jones instead of Rodgers (younger). The commanders could have been interested. The falcons and bugs. We will never know, because the giants never made it a remote possibility and teams knew it.
Yes, there's some validity to the idea that maybe some teams decided on different options with the uncertainty of knowing whether Jones would become available (although I don't count Carolina or Atlanta among them - those teams are in full rebuild mode). But whether another team is interested in Jones is only one half the equation - the other half is would they have been willing to pay as much as the Giants did to acquire him. My guess is that the answer to that question is likely no.
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In comment 16060011 eclipz928 said:
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In comment 16059957 section125 said:
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In comment 16059885 giantstock said:
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And yes they should have let Jones test the market.
Unlike others, I think if Jones was let go for FA, he ends up with a bigger contract then he got from the Giants. Atlanta, Jets, Carolina maybe another or two would have gone after him.
I don't know what he will do, but he sure looked better last year than I ever thought he would have.
Atlanta is going to go with Desmond Ridder this year, the Jets are lined up to acquire Aaron Rodgers, and Carolina is going to get their guy at the very top of the draft. Really the only team who may have been interested in paying top dollar for an FA QB is the Raiders, and maybe the Bucs.
But don't forget Garappolo is still out there, who Josh McDaniels would likely have a preference for. And then there's guys like Baker Mayfield and Carson Wentz who some teams may roll the dice with on less costly contracts. I don't believe the market really was all that strong for Jones when you actually look at every teams' situation.
For a lot of teams, Daniel Jones was not part of their equation because Joe schoen made it clear that they had every intention of keeping him.
Maybe the panthers don't give up all of their draft capital to move up in the draft. The jets could have entertained the thought of going after Jones instead of Rodgers (younger). The commanders could have been interested. The falcons and bugs. We will never know, because the giants never made it a remote possibility and teams knew it.
This is what we mean when we talk about the Giants and fans overrate their own players. The Jets passed on Carr to get a chance at Rodgers. They weren't settling for Jones. Carolina wants the top pick in the draft to reset the clock and get Young or Stroud. They don't want Jones. Use your common sense. Young and Stroud are exciting to people outside the Giants world. Have you checked opinions of the Jones deal outside the Guants world? Hint, people aren't excited about it. It may be a great deal for us, in the opinion of Giants fans, but that's not the universal opinion.
The quarterback market is always overrated. The Jets preferred Rodgers over Carr when looking at 30 something quarterbacks. You have absolutely no idea what teams would have done if Daniel Jones was available. Nobody knows because it didn't happen.
It doesn't matter what the media says about players. It doesn't matter what you or any fan of any team thinks of Daniel Jones. Joe schoen and daboll think enough of him to sign him to the deal they did. You can't discount another team liking him no matter how you want to spin it.
Seems more like a hot-take clickbait way of getting attention.
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In comment 16060011 eclipz928 said:
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In comment 16059957 section125 said:
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In comment 16059885 giantstock said:
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And yes they should have let Jones test the market.
Unlike others, I think if Jones was let go for FA, he ends up with a bigger contract then he got from the Giants. Atlanta, Jets, Carolina maybe another or two would have gone after him.
I don't know what he will do, but he sure looked better last year than I ever thought he would have.
Atlanta is going to go with Desmond Ridder this year, the Jets are lined up to acquire Aaron Rodgers, and Carolina is going to get their guy at the very top of the draft. Really the only team who may have been interested in paying top dollar for an FA QB is the Raiders, and maybe the Bucs.
But don't forget Garappolo is still out there, who Josh McDaniels would likely have a preference for. And then there's guys like Baker Mayfield and Carson Wentz who some teams may roll the dice with on less costly contracts. I don't believe the market really was all that strong for Jones when you actually look at every teams' situation.
For a lot of teams, Daniel Jones was not part of their equation because Joe schoen made it clear that they had every intention of keeping him.
Maybe the panthers don't give up all of their draft capital to move up in the draft. The jets could have entertained the thought of going after Jones instead of Rodgers (younger). The commanders could have been interested. The falcons and bugs. We will never know, because the giants never made it a remote possibility and teams knew it.
This is what we mean when we talk about the Giants and fans overrate their own players. The Jets passed on Carr to get a chance at Rodgers. They weren't settling for Jones. Carolina wants the top pick in the draft to reset the clock and get Young or Stroud. They don't want Jones. Use your common sense. Young and Stroud are exciting to people outside the Giants world. Have you checked opinions of the Jones deal outside the Guants world? Hint, people aren't excited about it. It may be a great deal for us, in the opinion of Giants fans, but that's not the universal opinion.
First off you should consider changing your handle to LET IT BLEED
LOL
2nd how do you know who wanted DJ or who didn't?
He never hit the FA market
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In comment 16059515 Tom in NY said:
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New England (Brady)Buffalo (Allen),and Alabama (Hurts, Tua, Mac Jones) coached and observed DJ for the past year, with no ties to him, decided he wanted DJ to be his QB.
I'll trust that over a failed GM and gambling website host, who has never met DJ, and his opinions.
They are betting on DJ's upside.
We don't really know what is on Schoen and Daboll's mind. They didn't give Jones a long term mega deal. Any deal we can exit in 2 or 3 years comes with implicit caveats. It could be they didn't see an alternative within reach that moved the needle for them, so they were happy to build on what we have done so far, with a chance to exit after building up the roster a bit more. We just don't know how they view this. They will never tell us their honest feelings, if they have real questions.
$100M given to Jones doesn't tell us how they feel about him?
Did you hear Schoen say on the press conference that they believe they can go to the Super Bowl with Jones?
Did you watch and listen to Daboll react to Jones on the field all season?
They have spoken and told you they are excited about having him as their QB and continuing to progress in the coming years.
Enjoy the ride...it's just starting.
If it was unconditional love, the deal wouldn't have an out in 2 years.
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In comment 16060055 TrueBlue56 said:
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In comment 16060011 eclipz928 said:
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In comment 16059957 section125 said:
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In comment 16059885 giantstock said:
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And yes they should have let Jones test the market.
Unlike others, I think if Jones was let go for FA, he ends up with a bigger contract then he got from the Giants. Atlanta, Jets, Carolina maybe another or two would have gone after him.
I don't know what he will do, but he sure looked better last year than I ever thought he would have.
Atlanta is going to go with Desmond Ridder this year, the Jets are lined up to acquire Aaron Rodgers, and Carolina is going to get their guy at the very top of the draft. Really the only team who may have been interested in paying top dollar for an FA QB is the Raiders, and maybe the Bucs.
But don't forget Garappolo is still out there, who Josh McDaniels would likely have a preference for. And then there's guys like Baker Mayfield and Carson Wentz who some teams may roll the dice with on less costly contracts. I don't believe the market really was all that strong for Jones when you actually look at every teams' situation.
For a lot of teams, Daniel Jones was not part of their equation because Joe schoen made it clear that they had every intention of keeping him.
Maybe the panthers don't give up all of their draft capital to move up in the draft. The jets could have entertained the thought of going after Jones instead of Rodgers (younger). The commanders could have been interested. The falcons and bugs. We will never know, because the giants never made it a remote possibility and teams knew it.
This is what we mean when we talk about the Giants and fans overrate their own players. The Jets passed on Carr to get a chance at Rodgers. They weren't settling for Jones. Carolina wants the top pick in the draft to reset the clock and get Young or Stroud. They don't want Jones. Use your common sense. Young and Stroud are exciting to people outside the Giants world. Have you checked opinions of the Jones deal outside the Guants world? Hint, people aren't excited about it. It may be a great deal for us, in the opinion of Giants fans, but that's not the universal opinion.
First off you should consider changing your handle to LET IT BLEED
LOL
2nd how do you know who wanted DJ or who didn't?
He never hit the FA market
Great album. I don't know what any team would do. I'm responding to a comment that was speculating about some market where there is no evidence there was great interest. All the buzz though was the Giants overpaid. There is no buzz that it's a great deal. But even if there was a market, Carolina and NYJ don't make sense given what they have done this week. Unproven speculation seems fine to you as long as it makes Jones seem desirable to others. You're only calling me out because I'm suggesting Jones isn't very attractive to others. Do me a favor and poll Carolina fans and ask them, do they want their choice of Bryce Young/Stroud or Daniel Jones. You can do this. It's achievable. Rather than blindly calling out my comment.
And you can also poll Jets fans. Do they want Aaron Rodgers or Daniel Jones?
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In comment 16060189 BeggarsBanquet said:
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In comment 16060055 TrueBlue56 said:
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In comment 16060011 eclipz928 said:
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In comment 16059957 section125 said:
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In comment 16059885 giantstock said:
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And yes they should have let Jones test the market.
Unlike others, I think if Jones was let go for FA, he ends up with a bigger contract then he got from the Giants. Atlanta, Jets, Carolina maybe another or two would have gone after him.
I don't know what he will do, but he sure looked better last year than I ever thought he would have.
Atlanta is going to go with Desmond Ridder this year, the Jets are lined up to acquire Aaron Rodgers, and Carolina is going to get their guy at the very top of the draft. Really the only team who may have been interested in paying top dollar for an FA QB is the Raiders, and maybe the Bucs.
But don't forget Garappolo is still out there, who Josh McDaniels would likely have a preference for. And then there's guys like Baker Mayfield and Carson Wentz who some teams may roll the dice with on less costly contracts. I don't believe the market really was all that strong for Jones when you actually look at every teams' situation.
For a lot of teams, Daniel Jones was not part of their equation because Joe schoen made it clear that they had every intention of keeping him.
Maybe the panthers don't give up all of their draft capital to move up in the draft. The jets could have entertained the thought of going after Jones instead of Rodgers (younger). The commanders could have been interested. The falcons and bugs. We will never know, because the giants never made it a remote possibility and teams knew it.
This is what we mean when we talk about the Giants and fans overrate their own players. The Jets passed on Carr to get a chance at Rodgers. They weren't settling for Jones. Carolina wants the top pick in the draft to reset the clock and get Young or Stroud. They don't want Jones. Use your common sense. Young and Stroud are exciting to people outside the Giants world. Have you checked opinions of the Jones deal outside the Guants world? Hint, people aren't excited about it. It may be a great deal for us, in the opinion of Giants fans, but that's not the universal opinion.
First off you should consider changing your handle to LET IT BLEED
LOL
2nd how do you know who wanted DJ or who didn't?
He never hit the FA market
Great album. I don't know what any team would do. I'm responding to a comment that was speculating about some market where there is no evidence there was great interest. All the buzz though was the Giants overpaid. There is no buzz that it's a great deal. But even if there was a market, Carolina and NYJ don't make sense given what they have done this week. Unproven speculation seems fine to you as long as it makes Jones seem desirable to others. You're only calling me out because I'm suggesting Jones isn't very attractive to others. Do me a favor and poll Carolina fans and ask them, do they want their choice of Bryce Young/Stroud or Daniel Jones. You can do this. It's achievable. Rather than blindly calling out my comment.
And you can also poll Jets fans. Do they want Aaron Rodgers or Daniel Jones?
Hey, better yet. Let's poll Giants fans on who they wanted in 2018. Would you prefer Josh Rosen or how about Sam darnold. How about asking fans and the media about haskins or Jones. I know the answer to that one. Ask the fans?!? Really???
Nahhh, I would rather ask a current NFL general manager and a head coach. You know, the ones that actually sets the value and does the evaluations and not just a talking head.
It always should have been 2018 or 2020. Going QB in 2019 made no sense.
Nope they are still stupid and irrelevant and out of place.
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To play out his contract, take the lb Allen, and take a shot at Herbert. 2019 was a weak qb draft.
It always should have been 2018 or 2020. Going QB in 2019 made no sense.
Except it made plenty of sense to go qb in 19, evidenced by his play in 22 and the fact that the giants didn’t have to trade up for a qb that the nfl underrated, Daniel jones.
And it’s still happening as we speak. Wake me up when these writers acknowledge or own the dozens of hot takes that inevitably end up being laughably wrong. We never see those articles do we.
Reminder, most qbs drafted early in round 1 required a trade up. I guess we won’t see that article about the giants stealing Daniel jones without the trade up. Nah, doesn’t fit. Most fans don’t want to read that they like miserable shit like this.
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if the Giants have continued success, Lombardi's comments will fade away. if not, they will come back to the fore.
Nope they are still stupid and irrelevant and out of place.
Why? Because he said the Giants overpaid Jones? It happens to be a mainstream opinion. Maybe you're a little sensitive to the subject.