Although I find it difficult to envision anyone selected with that pick contributing more in the next 2 years. His age makes it doable IMO. I wonder if they'd take our 3rd and 4th for Jeudy and their 5th...
I think we're done with the splashy skill position moves
i think more likely we see a speed player added in FA like mecole hardman or paris campbell. or slayton back, but i think hardman is a much better fit after the waller move.
berrios or isaiah mckenzie are 2 other names that i think could fit.
i think more likely we see a speed player added in FA like mecole hardman or paris campbell. or slayton back, but i think hardman is a much better fit after the waller move.
berrios or isaiah mckenzie are 2 other names that i think could fit.
Agreed they need speed. Waller is a vertical threat, but they need a speed guy in the outside who can win on those crossing routes- a skill possessed by Slayton that was very underrated but important for them in this scheme.
Jeudy would be perfect, Gabe Davis an okay option. Not sure I see it with Hardman/Campbell but there’s no denying their speed which could translate…
what are the possibilities that Schoen might move up to get a WR in round 1? We may not need to trade for Jeudy.
Or lets say there is a guy who falls to day 2 they really want and the want to move up to get him.
Giving up a 2nd round pick in any draft requires a detailed what if plan.
I am sure Schoen has them mapped out but it is still early in FA.
So weird. I just said this to my Brother. Wouldn't be surprised if we moved up a bit for a WR. Just depends on which one we like.
No clue why, but I'm leaning towards Zay Flowers. Yes he's short, but he plays bigger than his height IMO. He's got the speed, route running, hands and he tracks the ball well and is very good at adjusting his body to make contested catches.
We could also try and sign Odell to an incentive laden deal
Yea, this is a pretty good conclusion. I do think though that TE was always a possibility WR aside. Daboll was a TE coach and jones has a very high completion percentage out of two TEs so I think TE was kind of always there.
One thing i will say is damn we have a good GM who was able to understand the WR market, not force anything and pivot to a position that still gives us a huge playmaker.
That being said, i think jeudy is still possible. Each day that passes his potential cost comes down. This may be something that happens on draft day if giants cannot get a wr they want at 25.
If it were me, I am still looking strongly into making an acquisition like jeudy. He is young, affordable, proven, and has the speed we need outside. I really think that would be a very strong addition and adding waller and jeudy really does change the narrative that jones has no weapons.
Yea, this is a pretty good conclusion. I do think though that TE was always a possibility WR aside. Daboll was a TE coach and jones has a very high completion percentage out of two TEs so I think TE was kind of always there.
One thing i will say is damn we have a good GM who was able to understand the WR market, not force anything and pivot to a position that still gives us a huge playmaker.
That being said, i think jeudy is still possible. Each day that passes his potential cost comes down. This may be something that happens on draft day if giants cannot get a wr they want at 25.
If it were me, I am still looking strongly into making an acquisition like jeudy. He is young, affordable, proven, and has the speed we need outside. I really think that would be a very strong addition and adding waller and jeudy really does change the narrative that jones has no weapons.
That’s assuming, with two years left on his cheap rookie contract, he’s available in the first place
Yea, this is a pretty good conclusion. I do think though that TE was always a possibility WR aside. Daboll was a TE coach and jones has a very high completion percentage out of two TEs so I think TE was kind of always there.
One thing i will say is damn we have a good GM who was able to understand the WR market, not force anything and pivot to a position that still gives us a huge playmaker.
That being said, i think jeudy is still possible. Each day that passes his potential cost comes down. This may be something that happens on draft day if giants cannot get a wr they want at 25.
If it were me, I am still looking strongly into making an acquisition like jeudy. He is young, affordable, proven, and has the speed we need outside. I really think that would be a very strong addition and adding waller and jeudy really does change the narrative that jones has no weapons.
That’s assuming, with two years left on his cheap rookie contract, he’s available in the first place
what makes you think he isnt?
the broncos are clearly taking calls(widely reported).
the giants had a deal close but broncos last minute upped the ask (widely reported)
the broncos are clearly taking calls(widely reported).
the giants had a deal close but broncos last minute upped the ask (widely reported)
I mean...where there is smoke...
he only saves them $4m. it's reported they are taking calls on WRs and sutton and patrick make a lot more sense to trade. they are older, save more money, and dont open up the hole for them trading jeudy does.
if they traded jeudy almost every team in the nfl can afford him and many would be interested - so the price would be high.
Don’t want to trade either WR for less than a 2nd.
Does that price us out?
Yes. We aren’t moving our 1st two picks for players. That’s a no go. Denver is gonna have to trade ONE. Market not significant enough for Hamler or Patrick. They’ll eventually have to settle. No one is biting for a 2nd and they MUST recoup after Wilson deal. Waiting game
my preference would be to add a solid WR in free agency and then build through the draft. I like Jeudy and during the season a 2nd made sense but we’ve already upgraded and the dynamic has changed.
Regarding Jeudy: how much does book intelligence translate to the game of football at the WR position? My thinking is, generally not much. However, in Dabs/Kafka world, it seems like “smart” is a pretty big factor.
Jeudy scored 9 on the wonderlic. That translates to borderline literate. In a really ham-fisted way, on my par,t means he’s not a fit for this offense.
My gut tells me this Jeudy chatter is a smokescreen.
If Schoen believes in the talent and Daboll believes he's a fit. A 2 and a 5 is what the Giants got for Shockey when they finally came off their first round demand. Boylhart was a fan back in January 2020 (before combine and workouts): edited for brevity...
Quote:
Jerry has the size and length and Velcro-like hands to be a potential franchise receiver for the team that selects him. He has those long legs that give him the long speed to go deep and the quick feet to make those short routes impossible to defend...smart...very good route runner...works hard on the route running techniques needed to separate...excellent run after the catch skills...good catch radius...does an excellent job adjusting to the ball in the air to make the difficult catch...will run every route on the route tree...[b]fearless going over the middle on slant routes[b].
Quote:
He is quick, fast, and smart...He has good size and can play any of the receiver positions because of his high football IQ...isn’t just “any” kind of receiver. He’s an impact receiver with the potential to be a franchise receiver...An impact receiver is the type of receiver that can make the big play at any point in the game but a franchise receiver is the receiver you go to when everyone in the stadium knows he's getting the ball and they double team him and he still catches the contested pass and moves the chains or scores the go-ahead TD.
Don’t want to trade either WR for less than a 2nd.
Does that price us out?
Yes. We aren’t moving our 1st two picks for players. That’s a no go. Denver is gonna have to trade ONE. Market not significant enough for Hamler or Patrick. They’ll eventually have to settle. No one is biting for a 2nd and they MUST recoup after Wilson deal. Waiting game
Thank you for all the info! I’ll be bummed if the Waller trade prevents us from getting Jeudy.
if you had to choose one would it really be Jeudy at his price over Waller and the non premium pick we gave up? I like Jeudy but he isn’t Higgins or Aiyuk, and if rumors are true they already balked at our offer in season for a 2nd. That’s a steep price to pay when we can draft a long term solution at 25.
This WR market stinks, the Broncos may have to drop their asking price if they are 100% moving a WR. I’m fine playing the waiting game on that as Waller removed desperation and urgency for Schoen IMO.
I know it's sort of split around here, but there's a lot to consider. First is just Waller v Jeudy. Waller for a comp pick is great in a bubble, but he'll be 31 in September coming off a hamstring injury that plagued him all year, '21 he was hampered by ankle, knee, and back injuries, so he'll be 3 years removed from the play that has us excited. If the bottom falls out, or if he has a monster year, this may end up a 1 year rental. The upside is there, but it has to be recognized that we're talking about a player who's got a decent contract number, is aging, has been injured, and plays a position that isn't particularly forgiving to the body.
Jeudy, on the other hand, is 23 and has been held back from reaching his true potential due to scheme and lack of talent. Denver was arguably the worst coached team in the league last year, and prior to that he was catching passes from Teddy Bridgewater and Drew Lock. I think with Hodgins in tow as a big body receiver, for what DJ is good at and Daboll is looking to do, Jeudy is a perfect scheme fit. He either keeps a defense honest, pulling a guy out of the box for Saquon and pulling some of the pressure looks off DJ, or he's left to find soft spots in zones and pick apart single coverage with his excellent route running. He may not be a "burner" in the normal sense, but he ran a 4.46 and comes out of his breaks on fire. That, and he's still on his rookie contract for a year w/ his 5th year option available.
Then there's the price: a 2nd rounder. There's always this overvalue of draft picks that I find curious. I don't think there's anyone on this board who wouldn't trade Wan'Dale for Jeudy straight up, but the day beforehand, when it was a nameless, faceless, indicator of hope, it's not an option. Yes, hindsight is 20/20 and all that, but I'd rather a known quantity in a position of need that can have true impact than a possibility that need can be met. Also, I love what Schoen has done thus far and where the team is headed, but the jury is certainly still out on whether or not he's a prolific talent scout/drafter.
I'll put it this way, if by some impossible stroke of bad luck, Jeudy had to be cut, start his NFL career over, and shuffled into this draft and he was sitting there at pick 50, I'd lose my mind if we passed on him. So I'd definitely cough up the 2nd rounder for him, even now.
That said, GoDeep brought up a good point about Denver lacking leverage, so I'm fine playing a waiting game, I just would be quite disappointed if it was within striking distance to have him on the roster and we lost out.
Which team ready/wanting to compete now i.e has the QB and other pieces in place badly need an established vet WR1 rather than going through the draft?
I can't really think of one besides us. Mayyyybe KC? All final 8 teams last year had pretty strong stables of receiving options.
Jerry Jeudy has been a hot name this week. The Broncos’ asking price on Jeudy has been at least a first-round pick, per sources. @TheAthletic
Absolutely no on a 1st rounder, but I’d consider a 2nd. Maybe ask DEN to throw in a late round pick with Jeudy. I think he’s been dealt a bit of a bad hand with poor QB play his first 2 years, and downright awful coaching this year. Even with that, he came on late. With proper coaching, he can be the #1 everyone imagined coming out of Bama.
that's the correct price to set - trading him for less would be dumb
It sounds like we were close at the deadline and the price changed. Denver may end up regretting that, time will tell. But our needs have changed a bit and we are no longer negotiating from a position of weakness. That isn’t to say we can’t really use Jeudy - but we’ve added a big time difference maker so the immediate pressure is off.
I’m still open to Jeudy but if I’m Schoen my offer is two 3rds knowing I may settle on a second, but fully prepared to walk away. There will be better WRs available next year, and that’s when we will hopefully be in a better position to take that next step. If we can’t get him at our price, keep the picks, fortify the lines, and try against next year.
When Sutton is the guy they actually want to move. They probably don't even anticipate getting that but are hoping something of value for Sutton to move his contract.
im not saying they should trade a 1st for jeudy (i wouldnt) but to play devil's advocate.
player A age 26 season - 15g, 93 targets, 63 recepts, 1130 yards (17 ypc), 6 tds
player B age 23 season - 15g, 100 targets, 67 recepts, 972 yards (14 ypc), 6 tds
both players had 0 pro bowls/all pros at the time of posting those seasons which were their best years to date.
For all of those who are adamant that Jeudy is not worth our second round pick, Wan'Dale Robinson was our 2nd round pick (11) ... how many here wouldn't trade Wan'Dale for Jeudy straight up, never mind for an almost end of the round 2 pick?
It sounds like we were close at the deadline and the price changed. Denver may end up regretting that, time will tell. But our needs have changed a bit and we are no longer negotiating from a position of weakness. That isn’t to say we can’t really use Jeudy - but we’ve added a big time difference maker so the immediate pressure is off.
I’m still open to Jeudy but if I’m Schoen my offer is two 3rds knowing I may settle on a second, but fully prepared to walk away. There will be better WRs available next year, and that’s when we will hopefully be in a better position to take that next step. If we can’t get him at our price, keep the picks, fortify the lines, and try against next year.
See, this is where my thoughts differ on draft picks the most. After the first round and a half to the 4th, I’d rather give up 1 pick than 2. I recognize I’m in the minority here, but it’s really such a crapshoot, I’d prefer having multiple at bats cause everyone’s evaluation process is different.
All that said, if the price is a first I recant everything I said. Not because of what I value our pick at, but I think we could get a better receiver with a first.
WR:
Jeudy
Hodgins
Robinson
Collin Johnson
Shepard
(Draft Pick)
TE:
Waller
Bellinger
Cager
Id even give a second. we would still have our 1 and 3 plus we added TWO big weapons on offense for jones.
Really would love if jeudy still happened.
This is where the cowboys and eagles beat us year after year.
berrios or isaiah mckenzie are 2 other names that i think could fit.
Or lets say there is a guy who falls to day 2 they really want and the want to move up to get him.
Giving up a 2nd round pick in any draft requires a detailed what if plan.
I am sure Schoen has them mapped out but it is still early in FA.
berrios or isaiah mckenzie are 2 other names that i think could fit.
Agreed they need speed. Waller is a vertical threat, but they need a speed guy in the outside who can win on those crossing routes- a skill possessed by Slayton that was very underrated but important for them in this scheme.
Jeudy would be perfect, Gabe Davis an okay option. Not sure I see it with Hardman/Campbell but there’s no denying their speed which could translate…
Or lets say there is a guy who falls to day 2 they really want and the want to move up to get him.
Giving up a 2nd round pick in any draft requires a detailed what if plan.
I am sure Schoen has them mapped out but it is still early in FA.
So weird. I just said this to my Brother. Wouldn't be surprised if we moved up a bit for a WR. Just depends on which one we like.
No clue why, but I'm leaning towards Zay Flowers. Yes he's short, but he plays bigger than his height IMO. He's got the speed, route running, hands and he tracks the ball well and is very good at adjusting his body to make contested catches.
We could also try and sign Odell to an incentive laden deal
Yea, this is a pretty good conclusion. I do think though that TE was always a possibility WR aside. Daboll was a TE coach and jones has a very high completion percentage out of two TEs so I think TE was kind of always there.
One thing i will say is damn we have a good GM who was able to understand the WR market, not force anything and pivot to a position that still gives us a huge playmaker.
That being said, i think jeudy is still possible. Each day that passes his potential cost comes down. This may be something that happens on draft day if giants cannot get a wr they want at 25.
If it were me, I am still looking strongly into making an acquisition like jeudy. He is young, affordable, proven, and has the speed we need outside. I really think that would be a very strong addition and adding waller and jeudy really does change the narrative that jones has no weapons.
Agree - I don't see a trade for a WR. They might sign a burner/depth receiver though.
Quote:
away from WR, we'll see.
Yea, this is a pretty good conclusion. I do think though that TE was always a possibility WR aside. Daboll was a TE coach and jones has a very high completion percentage out of two TEs so I think TE was kind of always there.
One thing i will say is damn we have a good GM who was able to understand the WR market, not force anything and pivot to a position that still gives us a huge playmaker.
That being said, i think jeudy is still possible. Each day that passes his potential cost comes down. This may be something that happens on draft day if giants cannot get a wr they want at 25.
If it were me, I am still looking strongly into making an acquisition like jeudy. He is young, affordable, proven, and has the speed we need outside. I really think that would be a very strong addition and adding waller and jeudy really does change the narrative that jones has no weapons.
That’s assuming, with two years left on his cheap rookie contract, he’s available in the first place
Undone we go nuts and added Hopkins along with a ropkie Wr? Ooof!
Quote:
away from WR, we'll see.
Undone we go nuts and added Hopkins along with a ropkie Wr? Ooof!
*imagine
Quote:
In comment 16063795 JonC said:
Quote:
away from WR, we'll see.
Yea, this is a pretty good conclusion. I do think though that TE was always a possibility WR aside. Daboll was a TE coach and jones has a very high completion percentage out of two TEs so I think TE was kind of always there.
One thing i will say is damn we have a good GM who was able to understand the WR market, not force anything and pivot to a position that still gives us a huge playmaker.
That being said, i think jeudy is still possible. Each day that passes his potential cost comes down. This may be something that happens on draft day if giants cannot get a wr they want at 25.
If it were me, I am still looking strongly into making an acquisition like jeudy. He is young, affordable, proven, and has the speed we need outside. I really think that would be a very strong addition and adding waller and jeudy really does change the narrative that jones has no weapons.
That’s assuming, with two years left on his cheap rookie contract, he’s available in the first place
what makes you think he isnt?
the broncos are clearly taking calls(widely reported).
the giants had a deal close but broncos last minute upped the ask (widely reported)
I mean...where there is smoke...
what makes you think he isnt?
the broncos are clearly taking calls(widely reported).
the giants had a deal close but broncos last minute upped the ask (widely reported)
I mean...where there is smoke...
he only saves them $4m. it's reported they are taking calls on WRs and sutton and patrick make a lot more sense to trade. they are older, save more money, and dont open up the hole for them trading jeudy does.
if they traded jeudy almost every team in the nfl can afford him and many would be interested - so the price would be high.
This is where the cowboys and eagles beat us year after year.
This. ^^^^
with sutton that's a little crazy, with jeudy it makes sense.
Does that price us out?
Quote:
Don’t want to trade either WR for less than a 2nd.
Does that price us out?
Jeudy
Hodgins
Robinson
James
Washington
Johnson
Waller
Bellinger
Jeudy scored 9 on the wonderlic. That translates to borderline literate. In a really ham-fisted way, on my par,t means he’s not a fit for this offense.
My gut tells me this Jeudy chatter is a smokescreen.
Boylhart's full profile - ( New Window )
Quote:
In comment 16063909 GoDeep13 said:
Quote:
Don’t want to trade either WR for less than a 2nd.
Does that price us out?
Yes. We aren’t moving our 1st two picks for players. That’s a no go. Denver is gonna have to trade ONE. Market not significant enough for Hamler or Patrick. They’ll eventually have to settle. No one is biting for a 2nd and they MUST recoup after Wilson deal. Waiting game
Thank you for all the info! I’ll be bummed if the Waller trade prevents us from getting Jeudy.
This WR market stinks, the Broncos may have to drop their asking price if they are 100% moving a WR. I’m fine playing the waiting game on that as Waller removed desperation and urgency for Schoen IMO.
Jeudy, on the other hand, is 23 and has been held back from reaching his true potential due to scheme and lack of talent. Denver was arguably the worst coached team in the league last year, and prior to that he was catching passes from Teddy Bridgewater and Drew Lock. I think with Hodgins in tow as a big body receiver, for what DJ is good at and Daboll is looking to do, Jeudy is a perfect scheme fit. He either keeps a defense honest, pulling a guy out of the box for Saquon and pulling some of the pressure looks off DJ, or he's left to find soft spots in zones and pick apart single coverage with his excellent route running. He may not be a "burner" in the normal sense, but he ran a 4.46 and comes out of his breaks on fire. That, and he's still on his rookie contract for a year w/ his 5th year option available.
Then there's the price: a 2nd rounder. There's always this overvalue of draft picks that I find curious. I don't think there's anyone on this board who wouldn't trade Wan'Dale for Jeudy straight up, but the day beforehand, when it was a nameless, faceless, indicator of hope, it's not an option. Yes, hindsight is 20/20 and all that, but I'd rather a known quantity in a position of need that can have true impact than a possibility that need can be met. Also, I love what Schoen has done thus far and where the team is headed, but the jury is certainly still out on whether or not he's a prolific talent scout/drafter.
I'll put it this way, if by some impossible stroke of bad luck, Jeudy had to be cut, start his NFL career over, and shuffled into this draft and he was sitting there at pick 50, I'd lose my mind if we passed on him. So I'd definitely cough up the 2nd rounder for him, even now.
That said, GoDeep brought up a good point about Denver lacking leverage, so I'm fine playing a waiting game, I just would be quite disappointed if it was within striking distance to have him on the roster and we lost out.
@jeffphowe
Jerry Jeudy has been a hot name this week. The Broncos’ asking price on Jeudy has been at least a first-round pick, per sources. @TheAthletic
Which team ready/wanting to compete now i.e has the QB and other pieces in place badly need an established vet WR1 rather than going through the draft?
I can't really think of one besides us. Mayyyybe KC? All final 8 teams last year had pretty strong stables of receiving options.
@jeffphowe
Jerry Jeudy has been a hot name this week. The Broncos’ asking price on Jeudy has been at least a first-round pick, per sources. @TheAthletic
Absolutely no on a 1st rounder, but I’d consider a 2nd. Maybe ask DEN to throw in a late round pick with Jeudy. I think he’s been dealt a bit of a bad hand with poor QB play his first 2 years, and downright awful coaching this year. Even with that, he came on late. With proper coaching, he can be the #1 everyone imagined coming out of Bama.
@jeffphowe
Jerry Jeudy has been a hot name this week. The Broncos’ asking price on Jeudy has been at least a first-round pick, per sources. @TheAthletic
No go on Jeudy. try to draft your own and have him on contract for 4-5 years.
I’m still open to Jeudy but if I’m Schoen my offer is two 3rds knowing I may settle on a second, but fully prepared to walk away. There will be better WRs available next year, and that’s when we will hopefully be in a better position to take that next step. If we can’t get him at our price, keep the picks, fortify the lines, and try against next year.
@jeffphowe
Jerry Jeudy has been a hot name this week. The Broncos’ asking price on Jeudy has been at least a first-round pick, per sources. @TheAthletic
Then Jeudy will stay with the Broncos. That ask, as far as I'm concerned, will be met with cricket from the markets.
im not saying they should trade a 1st for jeudy (i wouldnt) but to play devil's advocate.
player A age 26 season - 15g, 93 targets, 63 recepts, 1130 yards (17 ypc), 6 tds
player B age 23 season - 15g, 100 targets, 67 recepts, 972 yards (14 ypc), 6 tds
both players had 0 pro bowls/all pros at the time of posting those seasons which were their best years to date.
Quote:
Jeff Howe
@jeffphowe
Jerry Jeudy has been a hot name this week. The Broncos’ asking price on Jeudy has been at least a first-round pick, per sources. @TheAthletic
Then Jeudy will stay with the Broncos. That ask, as far as I'm concerned, will be met with cricket from the markets.
hanging on to their best receiver, who also happens to be 23 years old and affordable, doesn't seem like a bad outcome to me.
Jerry Jeudy has been a hot name this week. The Broncos’ asking price on Jeudy has been at least a first-round pick, per sources.
I’m still open to Jeudy but if I’m Schoen my offer is two 3rds knowing I may settle on a second, but fully prepared to walk away. There will be better WRs available next year, and that’s when we will hopefully be in a better position to take that next step. If we can’t get him at our price, keep the picks, fortify the lines, and try against next year.
See, this is where my thoughts differ on draft picks the most. After the first round and a half to the 4th, I’d rather give up 1 pick than 2. I recognize I’m in the minority here, but it’s really such a crapshoot, I’d prefer having multiple at bats cause everyone’s evaluation process is different.
All that said, if the price is a first I recant everything I said. Not because of what I value our pick at, but I think we could get a better receiver with a first.