Final Toney trade results (both trades)

Parsons was, and DG should've drafted him.

early to tell because we need to see how Fields and Neal play this year. Also remember that we could have taken Parsons instead of trading the pick or Darrisaw (who DG apparently wanted) instead of Toney after the trade with the Bears.

but the eagles are always aggressive and everyone knew we needed a WR. Blame DG for not trading up but he can’t control the Eagles doing what they did otherwise.

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In comment 16063881 JonC said:

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Parsons was, and DG should've drafted him.

Thought there was smoke the DG did in fact want to draft him and Judge said no?

Pretty sure DG was pretty much neutered by then so it wouldn’t shock me.

As much of a dope as Gettleman was, Judge is right up there in hindsight.

In comment 16063891 Ivan15 said:

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2 down, 2 to go for non-first round draft picks, no?

In comment 16063881 JonC said:

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Parsons was, and DG should've drafted him.

^This.

In comment 16063896 The Mike said:

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In comment 16063881 JonC said: Quote: Parsons was, and DG should've drafted him. ^This.

+2

In comment 16063881 JonC said:

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Parsons was, and DG should've drafted him.

so should have pretty much every team ahead of them with the exception of whoever took lawrence + chase.

i know some (you included) wanted him and aren't second guessing but he had opted out of the covid year and all the guys who did that fell and got under drafted. chase, parsons, sewell, slater, rousseau all included. also parsons played a different position than the one he's been a dpoy candidate at (that dallas wasnt going to play him at until lawrence got hurt) so more tape on him may have made a big difference in where he went.

it's disappointing they had the psu dl coach on their staff and werent more clued in than the rest of the league but a lot of people missed on that one and they ultimately got thibs who isnt parsons but looks like he will be a very good player in his own right. if they only had 1 pick last year they were almost definitely taking an OT > thibs. and now they also have waller, bellinger, robinson so at least they didn't flub the pick as bad as the teams that took wilson, lance, pitts over multiple all pros at premium positions.

In comment 16063881 JonC said:

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Parsons was, and DG should've drafted him.

This. I really liked Parsons and Waddle in that draft. My only draft meltdown was that night.

Said so. Stats showed it too. His win rate was the best in college, just was not asked to do it much. Took over games. Wasn't hard to see.

Been stated numerous times the the Giants would have gone OT at 5 if they only had one pick

The trade let them get KT

Anyone with half a brain, and everyone here as well, knew wanted a WR. And he was the one who was expected to be there. It was obvious.

Final results of Bears-Giants 2021 draft night trade with Toney trade factored in

If the Giants draft the 2023 version of Tom Brady (or whoever else it may be) in the 6th round, the trade will look a bit different.

In comment 16063946 The Turk said:

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Final results of Bears-Giants 2021 draft night trade with Toney trade factored in If the Giants draft the 2023 version of Tom Brady (or whoever else it may be) in the 6th round, the trade will look a bit different.

Sure. 1 in 10,000 odds

but it was tough to foresee him having this kind of impact after not playing his junior year. Not sure if anyone knew he could rush the passer like he is now.

In comment 16063921 Thegratefulhead said:

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Said so. Stats showed it too. His win rate was the best in college, just was not asked to do it much. Took over games. Wasn't hard to see.

over the 2 years he played (18-19) he got a total of 135 snaps rushing the passer. he got 8 sacks and 18 hurries. he only had 82 snaps on the line of scrimmage. he literally got more snaps hand in dirt in his first few games as a cowboy than all of his college career.

comparatively thibodeaux had 800 pass rush snaps, 1300 snaps lined up as a down lineman, 22 sacks and 73 hurries. and a lot of draft experts who criticized him said he wasnt productive enough and was raw/inexperienced as a pass rusher.

travon walker was considered raw and a guy who lined up all over the place and he had 700 pass rush snaps and 500 from a down position.

parsons had very little tape playing a true edge spot and like the other opt out guys just fell farther than he should have. it was a pretty unique circumstance though. id also question which games you think he took over? because looking back he only had 3 games at penn state with multiple hurries - indiana (3), rutgers (2), memphis (2). memphis was his only multiple sack game with 2.

parsons had 3-4-3 hurries in his first 3 games as a cowboy. he only had 3 sacks in his first 7 games as a rookie then he exploded after that for 11 in the second half, so clearly there was a learning curve that his college team just missed out on giving him (or maybe he missed out on giving himself when he opted out of 2020).

He was off their draft board due to red flags from abusing another player at Penn State.

In comment 16063952 BillHungg said:

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In comment 16063946 The Turk said: Quote: Final results of Bears-Giants 2021 draft night trade with Toney trade factored in If the Giants draft the 2023 version of Tom Brady (or whoever else it may be) in the 6th round, the trade will look a bit different. Sure. 1 in 10,000 odds

The skill level of the player that the Giants will receive is TBD. Point is, the FINAL results haven't been determined until the Giants make that 6th RD selection. FACT.

In comment 16063966 Rod in St Cloud said:

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He was off their draft board due to red flags from abusing another player at Penn State.

which was also strange given that they took a dope (toney) and had a psu coach on staff. or maybe not strange, maybe they did it because it was worse than reported. who knows.

taking toney was the mistake much more than the trade. greg rousseau or christian darrisaw plus the extra top 10 pick in 2022 would have been fine even for someone as good as parsons even with the benefit of hindsight.

In comment 16063910 Eric on Li said:

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In comment 16063881 JonC said: Quote: Parsons was, and DG should've drafted him. so should have pretty much every team ahead of them with the exception of whoever took lawrence + chase. i know some (you included) wanted him and aren't second guessing but he had opted out of the covid year and all the guys who did that fell and got under drafted. chase, parsons, sewell, slater, rousseau all included. also parsons played a different position than the one he's been a dpoy candidate at (that dallas wasnt going to play him at until lawrence got hurt) so more tape on him may have made a big difference in where he went. it's disappointing they had the psu dl coach on their staff and werent more clued in than the rest of the league but a lot of people missed on that one and they ultimately got thibs who isnt parsons but looks like he will be a very good player in his own right. if they only had 1 pick last year they were almost definitely taking an OT > thibs. and now they also have waller, bellinger, robinson so at least they didn't flub the pick as bad as the teams that took wilson, lance, pitts over multiple all pros at premium positions.

Trench players take more time to evaluate. Besides hind site is always 20/20

In comment 16063881 JonC said:

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Parsons was, and DG should've drafted him.

At the time of the draft, no one in the United States of America, including Jerry Jones had any idea that Parsons would become the star he has become. Everyone knew he was "good, but had character issues risks", which consequently took him off Giants' radar for that reason alone.

If anyone, and I mean anyone, knew what Parsons would become, he would've never fallen to where he did. Hell, the Eagles would've taken him before DeVonte Smith. But like every other person on the planet, no one believed Parsons would develop like he did.

Parsons become the best pick of the 2021 draft and about 50 players that were drafted after him were better than Toney. No one knew. But everyone is Einstein and a draft super-GM when given the miraculous gift of hindsight. We can't go back. No one can. Let it go.

I remember the Giants Insider Podcast had some dude on prior to the Draft who said Parsons would be off his board because of character concerns. I remember Googling it afterwards & found some allusions to a hazing incident, but the details were sparse. In hindsight, we should have taken Parsons, but it is what it is.

I'm still high on Neal. I think he'll be a solid pro. I liked Robinson a lot before he got injured.

IMO, is that Robinson never plays. And he's one of a handful of Giants that never play. Hope springs eternal, and I'd love to be wrong, but raise your hand if you think they are EVER going to get anything out of Robinson, Ellerson Smith, Matt Peart, or Rodarius Williams. They just never play. Even Shane Lemieux, after his early success, looks like he could be the next guy on that list.