Random encounter unexpectedly at Starbucks. Spoke to him briefly, told him I was a third generation huge Giants fan and thanked him for his contributions to the Giants. He was appreciative of the kind words and thanked me. Air Gilbride!
Gilbride said he already knew that he was doing before the 2013 season (retire or be a HC). If Coughlin used him as a 'fallguy', why would Gilbride defend him? Why would this information have not come from more sources over the years.
What you are saying makes about zero sense which is the amount of evidence you were able to drum up to prove that Coughlin made Gilbride the fallguy.
My guess is Gilbride made a pragmatic decision, that helped him save face and avoided putting Coughlin's loyalty to the test.
I believe ultimately Coughlin would have fired Gilbride (like he did many other coordinators), and that Coughlin was happy Gilbride sacrificed himself.
Coughlin was able to avoid firing a colleague he had accomplished a lot with, and he was able to avoid a actually standing up to Mara.
I don't know what Coughlin would have done if Gilbride didn't retire. Maybe Coughlin would have thrown him to the wolves. What you provided as evidence that Coughlin did indeed make him the fall guy could technically be considered evidence I suppose, (very weak evidence on it's own) but we know that not all evidence is created equal. Some 'evidence' is just someone reaching which I think is the case here.
Do you think if John Mara came out and said "We need to get better blocking and better weapons. We have an offensive coordinator who has won two championships and we have every faith in him," -- does Gilbride retire?
Do you think if John Mara came out and said "We need to get better blocking and better weapons. We have an offensive coordinator who has won two championships and we have every faith in him," -- does Gilbride retire?
It's hard to say. I do know that I have no reason to doubt Gilbride's quote about retiring if he was not given a HC job. If Gilbride went back on his word about retiring and stayed as the OC for the Giants it would not mean he was lying.
I have no reason to even speculate that Coughlin threw Gilbride under the bus. I do not recall this being a pattern with Coughlin.
I guess I did not answer your question correctly. Would Gilbride have still retired if John Mara supported him after the 2013 season?
I don't think that support alone from Mara would have changed his mind because I don't think he saw his future tied to what Mara said or felt. If Gilbride is telling the truth, then he was tired of being away from his family just to be a coordinator. It sounded like he came to the conclusion that it was only worth it if he could become a HC again.
TC was too loyal at times. Gilbride may have just returned that loyalty to TC and there were a lot of disconnects going on between the front office and coaching staff.
Christian has posted what seems like 50 pictures of Reese with the SB trophies. It is pretty clear where his loyalty stands. Just look at his posts over many years regarding the TC/Eli/Reese dynamic. Plenty of subtle and direct shots with a big denial.
GD (dumbest). Best for you to focus on you.
Gilbride was going to be fired if he didn't retire. Here is a quote
TC was too loyal at times. Gilbride may have just returned that loyalty to TC and there were a lot of disconnects going on between the front office and coaching staff.
Christian has posted what seems like 50 pictures of Reese with the SB trophies. It is pretty clear where his loyalty stands. Just look at his posts over many years regarding the TC/Eli/Reese dynamic. Plenty of subtle and direct shots with a big denial.
GD (dumbest). Best for you to focus on you.
Good find. The question is who was making Mara face such denial about the roster? Seems crystal clear to me and that would play out for a couple more years till TC was scapegoat number two.
TC was too loyal at times. Gilbride may have just returned that loyalty to TC and there were a lot of disconnects going on between the front office and coaching staff.
Christian has posted what seems like 50 pictures of Reese with the SB trophies. It is pretty clear where his loyalty stands. Just look at his posts over many years regarding the TC/Eli/Reese dynamic. Plenty of subtle and direct shots with a big denial.
GD (dumbest). Best for you to focus on you.
Good find. The question is who was making Mara face such denial about the roster? Seems crystal clear to me and that would play out for a couple more years till TC was scapegoat number two.
Are you having a conversation with yourself?
RE: Gilbride was going to be fired if he didn't retire. Here is a quote
It's amazing that Mara can literally say the quiet part out loud and fans will still cram it into their own narrative even when it doesn't fit.
Bold mine above. Has anyone ever had to say that about a retired employee that wasn't forced out?
Not sure why you are calling my post out? Thought there was enough poor representations made this thread and this article and quote I noted clears up a lot of the past on this topic.
TC was too loyal at times. Gilbride may have just returned that loyalty to TC and there were a lot of disconnects going on between the front office and coaching staff.
Christian has posted what seems like 50 pictures of Reese with the SB trophies. It is pretty clear where his loyalty stands. Just look at his posts over many years regarding the TC/Eli/Reese dynamic. Plenty of subtle and direct shots with a big denial.
GD (dumbest). Best for you to focus on you.
Good find. The question is who was making Mara face such denial about the roster? Seems crystal clear to me and that would play out for a couple more years till TC was scapegoat number two.
Are you having a conversation with yourself?
That was for nygiantfan. Thank you. Dealing with dumb caused a dumb moment myself.
I just simply possess the ability to understand why a team goes from really good to really bad is more complex than one reason or one person.
But go ahead and operate in the world where the Jerry Reese is the villain, and the Giants nearly beat the Eagles in the playoffs because they were 2 yards away from 120 yards on more than 4.5 YPC.
RE: RE: RE: Gilbride was going to be fired if he didn't retire. Here is a quote
It's amazing that Mara can literally say the quiet part out loud and fans will still cram it into their own narrative even when it doesn't fit.
Bold mine above. Has anyone ever had to say that about a retired employee that wasn't forced out?
Not sure why you are calling my post out? Thought there was enough poor representations made this thread and this article and quote I noted clears up a lot of the past on this topic.
I was using the quote from your post to emphasize the point in the post itself. There are some posters (or at least some varying handles) seemingly stuck in their belief that Gilbride voluntarily retired, despite the rather obvious evidence that Gilbride was forced out and that Coughlin did nothing to resist it. And if Gilbride hadn't retired, he'd have been fired.
My apologies for my post coming across like I was arguing against yours (and I acknowledge that my post does indeed read that way, unfortunately).
If Gilbride was going to retire anyway (his words) there was no need for anyone to intervene. Had he wanted to stay maybe Coughlin stands up for him or maybe he doesn’t, but obvious evidence showing that Coughlin didn’t do anything about the Giants wanting to fire Gilbride?
The more obvious thing to me is that Coughlin did not need or get the chance to stand up or fight for Gilbride.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Gilbride was going to be fired if he didn't retire. Here is a quote
It's amazing that Mara can literally say the quiet part out loud and fans will still cram it into their own narrative even when it doesn't fit.
Bold mine above. Has anyone ever had to say that about a retired employee that wasn't forced out?
Not sure why you are calling my post out? Thought there was enough poor representations made this thread and this article and quote I noted clears up a lot of the past on this topic.
I was using the quote from your post to emphasize the point in the post itself. There are some posters (or at least some varying handles) seemingly stuck in their belief that Gilbride voluntarily retired, despite the rather obvious evidence that Gilbride was forced out and that Coughlin did nothing to resist it. And if Gilbride hadn't retired, he'd have been fired.
My apologies for my post coming across like I was arguing against yours (and I acknowledge that my post does indeed read that way, unfortunately).
No worries, just didn’t follow.
Gilbride most certainly didn’t just voluntarily retire. The team was turning into a mess at this point and there were only so many parachutes.
Gilbride got a lot of heat on this site. Some deserved, some undeserved. But at the end of the day, he was the OC on 2 Lombardi winning teams so I appreciate his time here.
He points out correctly that the OL was the biggest thing that had to be fixed and then highlights Jernigan as a player whose talent should have been utilized quicker
The "broken offense" would be better the following year and OBJ was a big part of it.
Big problem was the D was entering its destruction for many of the same reasons.
Mess of a team might be he best point made on this thread by nygiantfan.
The New York Giants are going to present Thursday's news as the "retirement" of offensive coordinator Kevin Gilbride, but if you're buying that then I'd like to quote you a really sweet price on the George Washington Bridge.
The entire football world, including the press and the owner of the team, acknowledged retirement was a face saving story.
A nearly identical thing happened with Coughlin when he supposedly quit. Link - ( New Window )
I don't think it is unlikely the Giants FO wanted Gilbride out, but that does not disprove that Gilbride wanted to retire anyway or that Coughlin didn't defend him.
Gilbride got a lot of heat on this site. Some deserved, some undeserved. But at the end of the day, he was the OC on 2 Lombardi winning teams so I appreciate his time here.
I think Gilbride is a total whiny bitch, and I still think he got a raw deal by Coughlin and Mara.
It’s actually fairly obvious that Gilbride was forced to leave and
I don't disagree Gilbride got a raw deal. Someone had to take the fall for the 2013 season. I think Mara even was quoted as saying the offense was broken so Gilbride's 'retirement' was anything but.
The same thing happened to TC after the '15 season.
RE: It’s actually fairly obvious that Gilbride was forced to leave and
the power struggle. It's pretty simple to piece it together.
Reese was a JM hire. TC was a WM fire.
TC received the one year extensions.
With the quality of the drafts it was only a matter of time.
John acknowledged it but he just couldn't make the hard and right choices and that it why it was one by one scapegoating imv. Gilbride was just first. Then Fewell the next year after the D's collapse. Then TC.
All rooted in years of poor drafting that somehow got worse.
In hindsight, Mara should have canned both Reese & TC at the same time. Desperate to save his job, Reese spent like a sailor on shore leave that offseason heading into the '16 season. Yeah, we got a sugar high of a 11-5 season in '16, but long term...not good.
There were both reports that Coughlin would not stand up for Gilbirde and at least this report that he would have.
But, they both have about the same amount of value as evidence for either side. Would Coughlin Defend Gilbride? - ( New Window )
See above quoted comment by Mara on WFAN. It’s really all anyone should need here.
No, that indicates that there were some in the organization that wanted Gilbride out. How does that prove that Coughlin did not or would not stand up for him?
In hindsight, Mara should have canned both Reese & TC at the same time. Desperate to save his job, Reese spent like a sailor on shore leave that offseason heading into the '16 season. Yeah, we got a sugar high of a 11-5 season in '16, but long term...not good.
100%
Reese and Coughlin climbed and fell of the mountain with each other.
Mara had a rough, rough decade. Let's hope he aced it with Joe & Dabs...the early results are good.
John seems like a good dude. But-like his old man-I don't think his football acuity is as high as he thinks it is. John should just sign the checks & let the football people run the show. I still cringe when I read him opining on football matters, though I know a lot of fellow owners do that too.
There were both reports that Coughlin would not stand up for Gilbirde and at least this report that he would have.
But, they both have about the same amount of value as evidence for either side. Would Coughlin Defend Gilbride? - ( New Window )
See above quoted comment by Mara on WFAN. It’s really all anyone should need here.
No, that indicates that there were some in the organization that wanted Gilbride out. How does that prove that Coughlin did not or would not stand up for him?
There were both reports that Coughlin would not stand up for Gilbirde and at least this report that he would have.
But, they both have about the same amount of value as evidence for either side. Would Coughlin Defend Gilbride? - ( New Window )
See above quoted comment by Mara on WFAN. It’s really all anyone should need here.
No, that indicates that there were some in the organization that wanted Gilbride out. How does that prove that Coughlin did not or would not stand up for him?
Mara very understandably had a lot of sentimentality for the big contributors to the championship era. It appeared like he wanted fairy tail endings, and then when that didn't materialize he wanted a semblance of continuity.
The moment had passed after 2015. He should have rebooted the entire staff.
2003-06 produced four pro bowlers on the LOS from the draft. Reese a big part of this as he was in charge of the draft board. Another from a FA pick up.
2007-2013 produced two pro bowlers of which one was the long snapper. Linval was let go after 2013 who became a multi-time pro bowler elsewhere.
2007-17 produced one pro bowler on the lines. The other did it elsewhere. JPP and Linval.
2015 had two starters on the team from the 2007-12 drafts.
BOG didn't play out very well.
All that is clear is the very first thing TC said taking the job was the they must win the LOS.
Very hard to find success over time when your HC and GM are not aligned.
Reese won the power struggle and threw the coaches under the bus one by one.
Ross did the same to Eli after he was fired.
Reese had everything in place when he was hired. The one component he added was Ross who took his job.
Must have been a lot of fun for years before TC got the heave ho between the coaching staff and front office.
It was pretty clear what the issue was. Mara was just in denial.
Ladies and gentlemen, it's time for your weekly episode of Falling Apart starring Lines of Scrimmage.
Act 1: 1000 or more rambling characters about 2012 and Jerry Reese
Act 2: Make up things no one ever said
(hint, this where we are right now)
Act 3: Grammar will fall apart, and the anger really begins
Bonus act if it gets real good
Act 4: Awkward threats, rooted in some weird reference to how we were raised
I guess I missed the full melt down stage from you.
Appreciate that I didn't get, "Not only do I build the clock, I am the mother f'in clock" from you or a paste job from one of those books you like.
Act 3 is fair. I readily admit I make some errors from time to time. Seems petty but fair is fair.
Your other "acts" we both know that is just you venting. This is what happens to you when you lose your composure. Usually it it's the "little man" comment I have seen you call about 15 posters. The defense mechanism for that big reflection problem you have.
There were both reports that Coughlin would not stand up for Gilbirde and at least this report that he would have.
But, they both have about the same amount of value as evidence for either side. Would Coughlin Defend Gilbride? - ( New Window )
See above quoted comment by Mara on WFAN. It’s really all anyone should need here.
No, that indicates that there were some in the organization that wanted Gilbride out. How does that prove that Coughlin did not or would not stand up for him?
Proof, much like grace and forgiveness, exists in your mind. Evidence exists outside of it.
And there is most certainly plenty of evidence that Gilbride was indeed forced out and that the retirement talk was just the cover story - it's the same one Hanlon used a few years later for Coughlin himself, and then again with Gettleman a year and a half ago.
We also have evidence of Coughlin sacrificing his coordinators to save himself: he did exactly that after the 2006 season when his seat was at its hottest, and did so again a year after Gilbride's "retirement" with the dismissal of Fewell, when he needed another shakeup to save himself (because replacing Gilbride hadn't been enough).
Anyone who hasn't learned to decode the beat reports that surround and subsequently follow an event like that involving the Giants, either isn't paying attention or willingly chooses to believe the version Pat Hanlon has curated for the fanbase.
Retirement is just the story that the Giants use to announce the firings of long-tenured coaches and executives - they've used the same page in the playbook often enough to make it obvious by now if you're paying any attention at all.
What you are saying makes about zero sense which is the amount of evidence you were able to drum up to prove that Coughlin made Gilbride the fallguy.
Reese knows something about 'fallguys' though.
How are you able to use the information in your link to prove anything? You can't.
Luckily that's not what evidence is. Evidence is not proof.
Evidence is the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.
You believe Gilbride at his word he was retiring, and Mara's blame, and Coughlin's lack of support played no part.
I don't believe that. And the evidence is the source in Ranaan's reporting.
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In comment 16117745 Lines of Scrimmage said:
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thinks TC scapegoated Gilbride. Just look at Mara's quote regarding Jernigan who ended up in the CFL for one year after his contract expired.
There are morons who think all sorts of things.
Some of them repeat the same word salad about a Super Bowl clock so often that you'd think they have no other words in their vocabulary
I may have sold you short with Dumber and Dumbest is better suited in your case. Apologies.
I feel so bad for you.
Quote:
are you able to use the information in your link to prove anything? You can't.
How are you able to use the information in your link to prove anything? You can't.
Luckily that's not what evidence is. Evidence is not proof.
Evidence is the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.
You believe Gilbride at his word he was retiring, and Mara's blame, and Coughlin's lack of support played no part.
I don't believe that. And the evidence is the source in Ranaan's reporting.
You use evidence to help you prove something. I am not sure how:
"The source said it's unlikely Coughlin will put his job on the line for Gilbride."
Is evidence. It's speculation. This quote from the 'source' does not help you prove anything.
Why would Gilbride lie about what he said to protect someone who made him the 'fall guy" ?
That makes no sense.
I believe ultimately Coughlin would have fired Gilbride (like he did many other coordinators), and that Coughlin was happy Gilbride sacrificed himself.
Coughlin was able to avoid firing a colleague he had accomplished a lot with, and he was able to avoid a actually standing up to Mara.
You believe it is likely that Coughlin made Gilbride the fall guy from a source's speculation.
I believe it is likely that Gilbride already knew what he was going to do after the 2013 based on his quote.
To me, one has a helluva a lot more weight than the other.
It's hard to say. I do know that I have no reason to doubt Gilbride's quote about retiring if he was not given a HC job. If Gilbride went back on his word about retiring and stayed as the OC for the Giants it would not mean he was lying.
I have no reason to even speculate that Coughlin threw Gilbride under the bus. I do not recall this being a pattern with Coughlin.
I don't think that support alone from Mara would have changed his mind because I don't think he saw his future tied to what Mara said or felt. If Gilbride is telling the truth, then he was tired of being away from his family just to be a coordinator. It sounded like he came to the conclusion that it was only worth it if he could become a HC again.
Christian has posted what seems like 50 pictures of Reese with the SB trophies. It is pretty clear where his loyalty stands. Just look at his posts over many years regarding the TC/Eli/Reese dynamic. Plenty of subtle and direct shots with a big denial.
GD (dumbest). Best for you to focus on you.
“He retired and fortunately it didn’t come to any type of situation where he had to be forced out,’’ Mara said Thursday in an interview on WFAN.
https://nypost.com/2014/01/09/giants-wouldve-fired-gilbride-if-he-hadnt-retired-source-says/
Christian has posted what seems like 50 pictures of Reese with the SB trophies. It is pretty clear where his loyalty stands. Just look at his posts over many years regarding the TC/Eli/Reese dynamic. Plenty of subtle and direct shots with a big denial.
GD (dumbest). Best for you to focus on you.
Good find. The question is who was making Mara face such denial about the roster? Seems crystal clear to me and that would play out for a couple more years till TC was scapegoat number two.
Quote:
TC was too loyal at times. Gilbride may have just returned that loyalty to TC and there were a lot of disconnects going on between the front office and coaching staff.
Christian has posted what seems like 50 pictures of Reese with the SB trophies. It is pretty clear where his loyalty stands. Just look at his posts over many years regarding the TC/Eli/Reese dynamic. Plenty of subtle and direct shots with a big denial.
GD (dumbest). Best for you to focus on you.
Good find. The question is who was making Mara face such denial about the roster? Seems crystal clear to me and that would play out for a couple more years till TC was scapegoat number two.
Are you having a conversation with yourself?
“He retired and fortunately it didn’t come to any type of situation where he had to be forced out,’’ Mara said Thursday in an interview on WFAN.
https://nypost.com/2014/01/09/giants-wouldve-fired-gilbride-if-he-hadnt-retired-source-says/
It's amazing that Mara can literally say the quiet part out loud and fans will still cram it into their own narrative even when it doesn't fit.
Bold mine above. Has anyone ever had to say that about a retired employee that wasn't forced out?
Quote:
from Mara himself from back then.
“He retired and fortunately it didn’t come to any type of situation where he had to be forced out,’’ Mara said Thursday in an interview on WFAN.
https://nypost.com/2014/01/09/giants-wouldve-fired-gilbride-if-he-hadnt-retired-source-says/
It's amazing that Mara can literally say the quiet part out loud and fans will still cram it into their own narrative even when it doesn't fit.
Bold mine above. Has anyone ever had to say that about a retired employee that wasn't forced out?
I’m not sure if this directed towards me. If so, I was challenging the evidence that Coughlin made Gilbride the fall guy.
Quote:
from Mara himself from back then.
“He retired and fortunately it didn’t come to any type of situation where he had to be forced out,’’ Mara said Thursday in an interview on WFAN.
https://nypost.com/2014/01/09/giants-wouldve-fired-gilbride-if-he-hadnt-retired-source-says/
It's amazing that Mara can literally say the quiet part out loud and fans will still cram it into their own narrative even when it doesn't fit.
Bold mine above. Has anyone ever had to say that about a retired employee that wasn't forced out?
Not sure why you are calling my post out? Thought there was enough poor representations made this thread and this article and quote I noted clears up a lot of the past on this topic.
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In comment 16117811 Lines of Scrimmage said:
Quote:
TC was too loyal at times. Gilbride may have just returned that loyalty to TC and there were a lot of disconnects going on between the front office and coaching staff.
Christian has posted what seems like 50 pictures of Reese with the SB trophies. It is pretty clear where his loyalty stands. Just look at his posts over many years regarding the TC/Eli/Reese dynamic. Plenty of subtle and direct shots with a big denial.
GD (dumbest). Best for you to focus on you.
Good find. The question is who was making Mara face such denial about the roster? Seems crystal clear to me and that would play out for a couple more years till TC was scapegoat number two.
Are you having a conversation with yourself?
That was for nygiantfan. Thank you. Dealing with dumb caused a dumb moment myself.
I just simply possess the ability to understand why a team goes from really good to really bad is more complex than one reason or one person.
But go ahead and operate in the world where the Jerry Reese is the villain, and the Giants nearly beat the Eagles in the playoffs because they were 2 yards away from 120 yards on more than 4.5 YPC.
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In comment 16117840 nygiantfan said:
Quote:
from Mara himself from back then.
“He retired and fortunately it didn’t come to any type of situation where he had to be forced out,’’ Mara said Thursday in an interview on WFAN.
https://nypost.com/2014/01/09/giants-wouldve-fired-gilbride-if-he-hadnt-retired-source-says/
It's amazing that Mara can literally say the quiet part out loud and fans will still cram it into their own narrative even when it doesn't fit.
Bold mine above. Has anyone ever had to say that about a retired employee that wasn't forced out?
Not sure why you are calling my post out? Thought there was enough poor representations made this thread and this article and quote I noted clears up a lot of the past on this topic.
I was using the quote from your post to emphasize the point in the post itself. There are some posters (or at least some varying handles) seemingly stuck in their belief that Gilbride voluntarily retired, despite the rather obvious evidence that Gilbride was forced out and that Coughlin did nothing to resist it. And if Gilbride hadn't retired, he'd have been fired.
My apologies for my post coming across like I was arguing against yours (and I acknowledge that my post does indeed read that way, unfortunately).
The more obvious thing to me is that Coughlin did not need or get the chance to stand up or fight for Gilbride.
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In comment 16117897 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 16117840 nygiantfan said:
Quote:
from Mara himself from back then.
“He retired and fortunately it didn’t come to any type of situation where he had to be forced out,’’ Mara said Thursday in an interview on WFAN.
https://nypost.com/2014/01/09/giants-wouldve-fired-gilbride-if-he-hadnt-retired-source-says/
It's amazing that Mara can literally say the quiet part out loud and fans will still cram it into their own narrative even when it doesn't fit.
Bold mine above. Has anyone ever had to say that about a retired employee that wasn't forced out?
Not sure why you are calling my post out? Thought there was enough poor representations made this thread and this article and quote I noted clears up a lot of the past on this topic.
I was using the quote from your post to emphasize the point in the post itself. There are some posters (or at least some varying handles) seemingly stuck in their belief that Gilbride voluntarily retired, despite the rather obvious evidence that Gilbride was forced out and that Coughlin did nothing to resist it. And if Gilbride hadn't retired, he'd have been fired.
My apologies for my post coming across like I was arguing against yours (and I acknowledge that my post does indeed read that way, unfortunately).
No worries, just didn’t follow.
Gilbride most certainly didn’t just voluntarily retire. The team was turning into a mess at this point and there were only so many parachutes.
https://www.bigblueview.com/2013/12/30/5257824/john-mara-new-york-giants-press-conference-tom-coughlin-kevin-gilbride
He points out correctly that the OL was the biggest thing that had to be fixed and then highlights Jernigan as a player whose talent should have been utilized quicker
The "broken offense" would be better the following year and OBJ was a big part of it.
Big problem was the D was entering its destruction for many of the same reasons.
Mess of a team might be he best point made on this thread by nygiantfan.
The entire football world, including the press and the owner of the team, acknowledged retirement was a face saving story.
A nearly identical thing happened with Coughlin when he supposedly quit.
Link - ( New Window )
I think Gilbride is a total whiny bitch, and I still think he got a raw deal by Coughlin and Mara.
Odd thread.
The same thing happened to TC after the '15 season.
Odd thread.
How is it obvious that no one was willing to stand up for him?
But, they both have about the same amount of value as evidence for either side.
Would Coughlin Defend Gilbride? - ( New Window )
Reese was a JM hire. TC was a WM fire.
TC received the one year extensions.
With the quality of the drafts it was only a matter of time.
John acknowledged it but he just couldn't make the hard and right choices and that it why it was one by one scapegoating imv. Gilbride was just first. Then Fewell the next year after the D's collapse. Then TC.
All rooted in years of poor drafting that somehow got worse.
Whether Coughlin would have done so if necessary, who knows. But ultimately Coughlin and Mara got their fall guy in Gilbride.
That was an early turning point where it became clear Mara was holding the wheel.
We should have known -- the owner going before the press talking about who should be getting playing time. Puke.
But, they both have about the same amount of value as evidence for either side. Would Coughlin Defend Gilbride? - ( New Window )
See above quoted comment by Mara on WFAN. It’s really all anyone should need here.
Quote:
There were both reports that Coughlin would not stand up for Gilbirde and at least this report that he would have.
But, they both have about the same amount of value as evidence for either side. Would Coughlin Defend Gilbride? - ( New Window )
See above quoted comment by Mara on WFAN. It’s really all anyone should need here.
No, that indicates that there were some in the organization that wanted Gilbride out. How does that prove that Coughlin did not or would not stand up for him?
100%
Reese and Coughlin climbed and fell of the mountain with each other.
John seems like a good dude. But-like his old man-I don't think his football acuity is as high as he thinks it is. John should just sign the checks & let the football people run the show. I still cringe when I read him opining on football matters, though I know a lot of fellow owners do that too.
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In comment 16117940 ChrisRick said:
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There were both reports that Coughlin would not stand up for Gilbirde and at least this report that he would have.
But, they both have about the same amount of value as evidence for either side. Would Coughlin Defend Gilbride? - ( New Window )
See above quoted comment by Mara on WFAN. It’s really all anyone should need here.
No, that indicates that there were some in the organization that wanted Gilbride out. How does that prove that Coughlin did not or would not stand up for him?
Play it out. Who stayed and who didn’t?
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In comment 16117948 nygiantfan said:
Quote:
In comment 16117940 ChrisRick said:
Quote:
There were both reports that Coughlin would not stand up for Gilbirde and at least this report that he would have.
But, they both have about the same amount of value as evidence for either side. Would Coughlin Defend Gilbride? - ( New Window )
See above quoted comment by Mara on WFAN. It’s really all anyone should need here.
No, that indicates that there were some in the organization that wanted Gilbride out. How does that prove that Coughlin did not or would not stand up for him?
Play it out. Who stayed and who didn’t?
Answer the question please.
The moment had passed after 2015. He should have rebooted the entire staff.
2003-06 produced four pro bowlers on the LOS from the draft. Reese a big part of this as he was in charge of the draft board. Another from a FA pick up.
2007-2013 produced two pro bowlers of which one was the long snapper. Linval was let go after 2013 who became a multi-time pro bowler elsewhere.
2007-17 produced one pro bowler on the lines. The other did it elsewhere. JPP and Linval.
2015 had two starters on the team from the 2007-12 drafts.
BOG didn't play out very well.
All that is clear is the very first thing TC said taking the job was the they must win the LOS.
Very hard to find success over time when your HC and GM are not aligned.
Reese won the power struggle and threw the coaches under the bus one by one.
Ross did the same to Eli after he was fired.
Reese had everything in place when he was hired. The one component he added was Ross who took his job.
Must have been a lot of fun for years before TC got the heave ho between the coaching staff and front office.
It was pretty clear what the issue was. Mara was just in denial.
The Great Destruction: A Repetitive and (Only) Sometimes Applicable Recounting of Past Events
Makes a great stocking stuffer, anniversary keepsake, and perfect for Dads and Grads. You name the occasion and it's there.
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christian : 1:02 pm : link : reply
The Great Destruction: A Repetitive and (Only) Sometimes Applicable Recounting of Past Events
Makes a great stocking stuffer, anniversary keepsake, and perfect for Dads and Grads. You name the occasion and it's there.
Facts hurt. Plus you already had told me that you wanted both Eli/TC gone in 2012/13.
All those pictures are plenty of evidence where you stood since you deny that having said that.
Act 1: 1000 or more rambling characters about 2012 and Jerry Reese
Act 2: Make up things no one ever said
(hint, this where we are right now)
Act 3: Grammar will fall apart, and the anger really begins
Bonus act if it gets real good
Act 4: Awkward threats, rooted in some weird reference to how we were raised
Act 1: 1000 or more rambling characters about 2012 and Jerry Reese
Act 2: Make up things no one ever said
(hint, this where we are right now)
Act 3: Grammar will fall apart, and the anger really begins
Bonus act if it gets real good
Act 4: Awkward threats, rooted in some weird reference to how we were raised
I guess I missed the full melt down stage from you.
Appreciate that I didn't get, "Not only do I build the clock, I am the mother f'in clock" from you or a paste job from one of those books you like.
Act 3 is fair. I readily admit I make some errors from time to time. Seems petty but fair is fair.
Your other "acts" we both know that is just you venting. This is what happens to you when you lose your composure. Usually it it's the "little man" comment I have seen you call about 15 posters. The defense mechanism for that big reflection problem you have.
Have a good one.
Second, don't you think it's about time for an old fashion game of put up or shut up?
Here's the wager: you provide an example of me saying Coughlin or Manning should have gone after 2012 or 2013.
If you can I'll stop rubbing your face in those sweet, sweet pics of Reese and all that Super Bowl bling.
But if you can't, you promise to keep the nauseating rehashing of the made up past to two sentences or less per thread.
What do you say?
Quote:
In comment 16117940 ChrisRick said:
Quote:
There were both reports that Coughlin would not stand up for Gilbirde and at least this report that he would have.
But, they both have about the same amount of value as evidence for either side. Would Coughlin Defend Gilbride? - ( New Window )
See above quoted comment by Mara on WFAN. It’s really all anyone should need here.
No, that indicates that there were some in the organization that wanted Gilbride out. How does that prove that Coughlin did not or would not stand up for him?
Proof, much like grace and forgiveness, exists in your mind. Evidence exists outside of it.
And there is most certainly plenty of evidence that Gilbride was indeed forced out and that the retirement talk was just the cover story - it's the same one Hanlon used a few years later for Coughlin himself, and then again with Gettleman a year and a half ago.
We also have evidence of Coughlin sacrificing his coordinators to save himself: he did exactly that after the 2006 season when his seat was at its hottest, and did so again a year after Gilbride's "retirement" with the dismissal of Fewell, when he needed another shakeup to save himself (because replacing Gilbride hadn't been enough).
Anyone who hasn't learned to decode the beat reports that surround and subsequently follow an event like that involving the Giants, either isn't paying attention or willingly chooses to believe the version Pat Hanlon has curated for the fanbase.
Retirement is just the story that the Giants use to announce the firings of long-tenured coaches and executives - they've used the same page in the playbook often enough to make it obvious by now if you're paying any attention at all.
Second, don't you think it's about time for an old fashion game of put up or shut up?
Here's the wager: you provide an example of me saying Coughlin or Manning should have gone after 2012 or 2013.
If you can I'll stop rubbing your face in those sweet, sweet pics of Reese and all that Super Bowl bling.
But if you can't, you promise to keep the nauseating rehashing of the made up past to two sentences or less per thread.
What do you say?
It's in a thread from years ago. Wouldn't know which one as there are so many that you go into that full defense mode.
I don't mind the pics. A bit childish though entertaining and funny. Have at it if it makes you feel better.