DL: Projection: Solid (important) improvement.
For a position where rotations can be effective, NYG added a lot. With Robinson + Nunes Roches and even the eventual return of Davidson, this is a beefy, high caliber group led by Lawrence/Williams. Ryder Anderson should not be overlooked.
Edge: Possible improvement.
Improvement for this position heavily leans on further (likely) development of Thibideaux. Additionally, some better health with Ojulari is a must. Tomon Fox showed fairly well as an UDFA last year. I suppose we are all pessimistic w Smith and Ximines and with good reason.
LB: Much like WR, significant improvement, but still a bottom 3rd NFL group.
Okereke was the big ticket item and a wise use of $ resources. He is young, smart, durable and offers a speed component we didn’t have last year. It is hard to get excited about any other NYG LB.
CB: Probable improvement.
Moreau was a solid surprise last year but a healthy Adoree Jackson, physically gifted Tae Banks should lead this group to improved play. Add a likely improved Cordale Flott and the wildcards of Leonard Johnson and Aaron Robinson and you likely have a solid group although I don’t think highly of Holmes, Onuwariye etc.
Safety: Probable downshift.
The only thing that keeps this from declining is McKinney playing a full season and developing into a star which is certainly possible. I like Pinnock as a S2. Belton seems like a good rotational S. McCain was a sneaky pickup. Owens by all accounts is a good guy to develop with special teams duties in his immediate future.
I feel Wink has a roster of his liking.....which means....he can do what he wants. He can run his defense without limits. A Wink defense can be a top 5 in the league
I personally feel better about the defense.
Does anyone even remember who our MIKE LB was last year? We pretty much tried everyone there - having a revolving door at the leadership position is tough to overcome.
Okereke can provide some much-needed stability and skill at the all-important 3-down MIKE.
Add in a 1st round CB opposite Jackson, a healthy LW, Ojulari and A-Rob and an improved Thibs & Flott and this could be a dominant D. They only lost Love, and they replaced him with a fast, aggressive player in Pinnock.
I don't see any real weaknesses on this D, aside from depth. If the starting group stays healthy - look out.
Does anyone even remember who our MIKE LB was last year? We pretty much tried everyone there - having a revolving door at the leadership position is tough to overcome.
Okereke can provide some much-needed stability and skill at the all-important 3-down MIKE.
Add in a 1st round CB opposite Jackson, a healthy LW, Ojulari and A-Rob and an improved Thibs & Flott and this could be a dominant D. They only lost Love, and they replaced him with a fast, aggressive player in Pinnock.
I don't see any real weaknesses on this D, aside from depth. If the starting group stays healthy - look out.
At MIKE linebacker? We had Tae Crowder, Jaylon Smith, Micah McFadden, and Jarrad Davis. The former two are no longer on the team.
He was a glue kinda guy,who showed up every week.
Solid not spectaular,but important nonetheless.
He was a glue kinda guy,who showed up every week.
Solid not spectaular,but important nonetheless.
Love lost me in the first Eagle game when he whiffed on a massive hit on Smith on 4th down and took out the CB and gave up a TD. I won't miss him. A good guy and a good player on a bad team, but not a good player on a great team and not for $6million a year either.
I hope we aren't setting ourselves up for a Nate Solder-type disappointment with Bobby Okereke. He's a nice player, and a big upgrade - clearly the best feasible option at a position of glaring need. Not sure it's fair to expect a revelation though.
EDGE could get better, or it could get even worse. The floor is very low, and I'm not even sure Ojulari is a full-time player. Maybe he can be our version of Haason Reddick - which is great as long as we're not expecting him to be Carl Banks.
I hope we aren't setting ourselves up for a Nate Solder-type disappointment with Bobby Okereke. He's a nice player, and a big upgrade - clearly the best feasible option at a position of glaring need. Not sure it's fair to expect a revelation though.
EDGE could get better, or it could get even worse. The floor is very low, and I'm not even sure Ojulari is a full-time player. Maybe he can be our version of Haason Reddick - which is great as long as we're not expecting him to be Carl Banks.
I don't want to put words in his mouth, but I believe that JonC has hinted that Ojulari may be on borrowed time.
To your point about Okereke, yeah, I think many here are expecting him to be some kind of "savior," if you will, which might be unfair. Still, he's absolutely an upgrade over what we had (which certainly wasn't much), and I guess the hope is that in concert with the other improvements made on defense he'll be able to thrive. Frankly, I'll settle for solid, if not spectacular.
I hope we aren't setting ourselves up for a Nate Solder-type disappointment with Bobby Okereke. He's a nice player, and a big upgrade - clearly the best feasible option at a position of glaring need. Not sure it's fair to expect a revelation though.
EDGE could get better, or it could get even worse. The floor is very low, and I'm not even sure Ojulari is a full-time player. Maybe he can be our version of Haason Reddick - which is great as long as we're not expecting him to be Carl Banks.
Ah shoot, knew I forgot somebody.
On the other hand with EDGE, there's some on this forum who don't think we need good edge rushers because we have Wink.
Upgrading the LB and having a very athletic guy who can actually play. Just because you can run fast does not make your ability to play LB better as we saw last year.
Adding a top flight CB prospect and moving the other guys down the depth chart is always huge. The Giants have some guys who have flashed in spots but having Banks to be the No 2 improves the depth. You need a lot of corners in this league
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Martindale also tinkered with Landon Collins and Tony Jefferson in the box, if only out of sheer desperation.
I hope we aren't setting ourselves up for a Nate Solder-type disappointment with Bobby Okereke. He's a nice player, and a big upgrade - clearly the best feasible option at a position of glaring need. Not sure it's fair to expect a revelation though.
EDGE could get better, or it could get even worse. The floor is very low, and I'm not even sure Ojulari is a full-time player. Maybe he can be our version of Haason Reddick - which is great as long as we're not expecting him to be Carl Banks.
I don't want to put words in his mouth, but I believe that JonC has hinted that Ojulari may be on borrowed time.
To your point about Okereke, yeah, I think many here are expecting him to be some kind of "savior," if you will, which might be unfair. Still, he's absolutely an upgrade over what we had (which certainly wasn't much), and I guess the hope is that in concert with the other improvements made on defense he'll be able to thrive. Frankly, I'll settle for solid, if not spectacular.
I just hope that who we put out there can actually cover.
So I think any projection of floor and ceilings is at best premature. I'd like to see a season of them playing together before rating that combination poorly.
What Ojulari has shown is he's a productive pass rusher. I think what JonC is alluding to is the current staff isn't convinced he's a well rounded 3-down linebacker.
The Giants had a guy just like this in Markus Golden -- when healthy he's a lock for double digit sacks. And that's why no one over the age of 12 measures success in sacks.
I think Wink in a perfect world prefer a big edge setter starting, and I wouldn't be surprised if Ward ends up starting over Ojulari.
That is nuts.
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Martindale also tinkered with Landon Collins and Tony Jefferson in the box, if only out of sheer desperation.
I hope we aren't setting ourselves up for a Nate Solder-type disappointment with Bobby Okereke. He's a nice player, and a big upgrade - clearly the best feasible option at a position of glaring need. Not sure it's fair to expect a revelation though.
EDGE could get better, or it could get even worse. The floor is very low, and I'm not even sure Ojulari is a full-time player. Maybe he can be our version of Haason Reddick - which is great as long as we're not expecting him to be Carl Banks.
I don't want to put words in his mouth, but I believe that JonC has hinted that Ojulari may be on borrowed time.
To your point about Okereke, yeah, I think many here are expecting him to be some kind of "savior," if you will, which might be unfair. Still, he's absolutely an upgrade over what we had (which certainly wasn't much), and I guess the hope is that in concert with the other improvements made on defense he'll be able to thrive. Frankly, I'll settle for solid, if not spectacular.
Yeah, I think you misunderstood.
Ojulari has 2 years left on his rooking. He is not going anywhere for 2 years. He is "cheap" and actually plays well when healthy. It's the healthy part he needs to work on.
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In comment 16117005 Big Blue Blogger said:
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Martindale also tinkered with Landon Collins and Tony Jefferson in the box, if only out of sheer desperation.
I hope we aren't setting ourselves up for a Nate Solder-type disappointment with Bobby Okereke. He's a nice player, and a big upgrade - clearly the best feasible option at a position of glaring need. Not sure it's fair to expect a revelation though.
EDGE could get better, or it could get even worse. The floor is very low, and I'm not even sure Ojulari is a full-time player. Maybe he can be our version of Haason Reddick - which is great as long as we're not expecting him to be Carl Banks.
I don't want to put words in his mouth, but I believe that JonC has hinted that Ojulari may be on borrowed time.
To your point about Okereke, yeah, I think many here are expecting him to be some kind of "savior," if you will, which might be unfair. Still, he's absolutely an upgrade over what we had (which certainly wasn't much), and I guess the hope is that in concert with the other improvements made on defense he'll be able to thrive. Frankly, I'll settle for solid, if not spectacular.
Yeah, I think you misunderstood.
Ojulari has 2 years left on his rooking. He is not going anywhere for 2 years. He is "cheap" and actually plays well when healthy. It's the healthy part he needs to work on.
In retrospect, yeah, I think christian put it correctly.
145rypg with 189ry/game against division teams stands out. Pretty amazing they kept pts. down considering this. They made significant additions to the front and I expect AR to play with LW and DL often. Improved depth. Wink needs to stop the run to create the blitz packages. The teams in our division all need strong run games to optimally function.
I think the secondary will wind up being better with growing pains from the rookie.
Olujari is a good player but I think the team is better served with him in more of a situational role that he still gets starter reps. Big liability in run D but maybe this can improve a bit.
That would get them easily in the top 10 in sacks in the league. And of course that'll do basically nothing to change the outlook of the defense.
They need to defend the run better and create more turnovers in the secondary. Those are the needle movers.
This is what I don't 'get' in Wink's system. We used a lot of 2-DL alignments last year and, predictably, it was easy to run on. With the added depth at DL do you think we'll go more 3-DL this year?
That wouldn't diminish the importance of the edge guys but if they're linebackers, they're linebackers - not DLs.
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edge is a linebacker position. We have 3 legit talents at LB now. We could use another middle but I don't think we're bottom 3rd anymore.
This is what I don't 'get' in Wink's system. We used a lot of 2-DL alignments last year and, predictably, it was easy to run on. With the added depth at DL do you think we'll go more 3-DL this year?
That wouldn't diminish the importance of the edge guys but if they're linebackers, they're linebackers - not DLs.
I definitely think we will see more 3-DL this year on 1st down and also short situations. Last year we just didnt have the ability to do that because our backup DL were getting manhandled so I think we played more 2 DL because of that. I think we will see Ojulari and or Thibs drop into coverage a bit more too so you dont know where the pressure is coming from. Just my 2 cents.
This D is much improved on paper. Winks focus seems to be on size and speed. We brought in more speed and size at CB and Safety, at LB way more talent and on the DL more Beef that can actually move. I think our CB position looksvery strong and if Flott pans out I can see Jackson being phased out and sliding Flott in there. I think Flott will be a starter next to Jackson to start the season and Banks will be on the field a lot and when he is Flott will move to the nickel.
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edge is a linebacker position. We have 3 legit talents at LB now. We could use another middle but I don't think we're bottom 3rd anymore.
This is what I don't 'get' in Wink's system. We used a lot of 2-DL alignments last year and, predictably, it was easy to run on. With the added depth at DL do you think we'll go more 3-DL this year?
That wouldn't diminish the importance of the edge guys but if they're linebackers, they're linebackers - not DLs.
For what it's worth, Rosenthal projects a 3-3-5 defense for the Giants. Robinson and Williams at the ends flanking Dexter Lawrence, Kayvon and Ojulari at the rushbacker spots, Flott in the slot with Jackson and Banks, and a single inside linebacker in Okereke.
NFC East projected starters for 2023 NFL season: Eagles, Cowboys boast conference's top two rosters - ( New Window )
This is what I don't 'get' in Wink's system. We used a lot of 2-DL alignments last year and, predictably, it was easy to run on. With the added depth at DL do you think we'll go more 3-DL this year?
When Martindale said "they did it a little different this year" -- I suspect he meant the 2-man line.
I don't think he ever intended to use that look so much. I think it was the first Philly game where the Giants came out with Anderson as the 3rd lineman and was just getting obliterated. And they quickly subbed in a linebacker.
That really says something about Martindale's faith in the line depth last year.
Be great if another DE emerges from the roster. They have good depth behind Lawrence. Maybe Wink finds someone he can also use at the 5T at times.
Be great if another DE emerges from the roster. They have good depth behind Lawrence. Maybe Wink finds someone he can also use at the 5T at times.
We don't really have DE types, except for maybe Jihad Ward and Ryder Anderson (would like to find one in the draft next year). Both have their tradeoffs, Ward isn't much of a pass-rusher and Anderson tends to get pushed around in the run game. Wink tended to use Anderson more as a DT which doesn't help him at 276 lbs (making him lighter than Ward).
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I think that is what we see often and especially against division teams. AR took a little pressure off having to force that pick in round 1/2.
Be great if another DE emerges from the roster. They have good depth behind Lawrence. Maybe Wink finds someone he can also use at the 5T at times.
We don't really have DE types, except for maybe Jihad Ward and Ryder Anderson (would like to find one in the draft next year). Both have their tradeoffs, Ward isn't much of a pass-rusher and Anderson tends to get pushed around in the run game. Wink tended to use Anderson more as a DT which doesn't help him at 276 lbs (making him lighter than Ward).
I was in favor of drafting one in round 1/2 but things just didn't break that way or maybe they didn't feel the need right now.
I think they will address next season.