Let's chit chat here and keep everything on this thread for both games today. Here are the starting pitcher matchups for both games followed by the starting lineups for both clubs for Game #1:
as a justification to knock "the kids". Martino's value is in his access, not his opinions, but it's somewhat troubling if he is articulating a sentiment coming from within the building.
Quote:
Andy Martino @martinonyc
Huge hits lately for Lindor, Marte, Alonso. McNeil has been much better. Team was going nowhere with its veteran stars, and now those stars have started to carry them.
Andy Martino
@martinonyc
It’s up to the likes of Francisco Lindor, Starling Marte and Jeff McNeil to turn around the Mets offense. The talent is already on the roster. There are role players, not saviors, on the farm.
whether or not the young guys are "saviors" is a ridiculous strawman. they dont need to be saviors to be better than the players who are not part of the core and constantly failing to deliver run production - including in this game. the stars didn't carry baty to his 2 walks today or his 104 mph single.
also the cherry on top is that vientos/alvarez were actually literal saviors in the rays series that was 100% a lost series and possibly a sweep without them.
as a justification to knock "the kids". Martino's value is in his access, not his opinions, but it's somewhat troubling if he is articulating a sentiment coming from within the building.
Quote:
Andy Martino @martinonyc
Huge hits lately for Lindor, Marte, Alonso. McNeil has been much better. Team was going nowhere with its veteran stars, and now those stars have started to carry them.
Andy Martino
@martinonyc
It’s up to the likes of Francisco Lindor, Starling Marte and Jeff McNeil to turn around the Mets offense. The talent is already on the roster. There are role players, not saviors, on the farm.
whether or not the young guys are "saviors" is a ridiculous strawman. they dont need to be saviors to be better than the players who are not part of the core and constantly failing to deliver run production - including in this game. the stars didn't carry baty to his 2 walks today or his 104 mph single.
also the cherry on top is that vientos/alvarez were actually literal saviors in the rays series that was 100% a lost series and possibly a sweep without them.
These quotes from Martino piss me off so much. That combined with Buck’s clear dislike of young players and Eppler’s mythical boxes that need to be checked…makes me want them all gone. None of it makes any sense. Arrogant, egotistical, stubborn FO and manager. Just put the best players on the field. It really isnt that difficult.
RE: it's odd to me that writers are using the success of mets core
as a justification to knock "the kids". Martino's value is in his access, not his opinions, but it's somewhat troubling if he is articulating a sentiment coming from within the building.
Quote:
Andy Martino @martinonyc
Huge hits lately for Lindor, Marte, Alonso. McNeil has been much better. Team was going nowhere with its veteran stars, and now those stars have started to carry them.
Andy Martino
@martinonyc
It’s up to the likes of Francisco Lindor, Starling Marte and Jeff McNeil to turn around the Mets offense. The talent is already on the roster. There are role players, not saviors, on the farm.
whether or not the young guys are "saviors" is a ridiculous strawman. they dont need to be saviors to be better than the players who are not part of the core and constantly failing to deliver run production - including in this game. the stars didn't carry baty to his 2 walks today or his 104 mph single.
also the cherry on top is that vientos/alvarez were actually literal saviors in the rays series that was 100% a lost series and possibly a sweep without them.
Wow. Great post Eric. That is disturbing. Uncle Steve might need to step in here if that's really the case.
RE: RE: it's odd to me that writers are using the success of mets core
These quotes from Martino piss me off so much. That combined with Buck’s clear dislike of young players and Eppler’s mythical boxes that need to be checked…makes me want them all gone. None of it makes any sense. Arrogant, egotistical, stubborn FO and manager. Just put the best players on the field. It really isnt that difficult.
Spot on Coop. Classic case of stubbornness and egotism (and insecurity on Eppler's part IMO).
Scherzer's is now too. The second game will begin on ESPN in a little less than two and a half hours. If I'm around, I'll post the lineups for the nightcap of today's doubleheader, otherwise I'm sure someone else will.
Scherzer talked about the following when he spoke to the press:
-His thumb callous split open (it was already there from before).
-It's something to keep an eye on. He said it opened up during the DC start (his words).
-He said he'll be good to go for his next start.
-He basically is saying that he sucked it up, pitched and won.
-Was amped to see Marte's homer.
-Says everyone is jacked up now the way they're playing.
-Thought working with Sanchez was good today; he thought they worked well for neither one of them having experience working together.
-Said being creative is mixing speeds and being irrational.
they actually had a lot of hard contact against bieber so despite feeling like they stole it they earned this one.
i know marte is heating up and thats big, but id keep mcneil #3 and marte #6. teams cant pitch around baty as easily with a career .300 hitter behind him and with actual power now hitting 7/8/9 it's almost like a mid-order leadoff hitter.
oddly my biggest concern is whats been the best unit on the team the bp. with more leads there are going to be more games like the last 5 where we had to pitch a lot of the same guys every day. not sure theres a solution right now though. have to get lucky w/ someone for a month.
NL East standings
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-The Mets now hold a wild card spot (the 6th and final one)!
-They're half a game ahead of the Marlins after having started the day behind them. HUGE day today for the Mets!
oddly had a little blurb today suggesting Buck's job security might not be as strong as one would think given the 101 win season. Rosenthal generally isn't a flat out "false rumor" guy and not much to back it up but interesting.
oddly had a little blurb today suggesting Buck's job security might not be as strong as one would think given the 101 win season. Rosenthal generally isn't a flat out "false rumor" guy and not much to back it up but interesting.
i was a 100% buck guy and through 4 months last year i would have named him the team's mvp. i thought his BP usage in particular was best ive seen of any manager up until september.
but there was a game last year in august i think where they were down and with the final out he let nido hit i think instead of pinch hitting mcneil and after the game he got very snippy when questioned about it. since august of last year he has left a lot to be desired. he has made a lot of bizarre comments about the young guys, he's been a lot more defensive as he's taken criticism, and his bp usage down the stretch last year was weird against those bad teams when he let 1-2 run games get out of hand and all the best relievers were well rested going sometimes a week between getting in games.
i buy that there are probably some real internal frustrations with him because he has done some real backwards things since august. including some of the comments that came out over the last several days that seem intent on ignoring the reality that the key driver of this win streak was the kids. they've contributed like 11 runs over a winning streak of all 1 run games.
Mendick 1-5, K (he's been disappointing, 79 wRC+ on the season)
Mauricio 1-5, 2b, K
Cedrola 1-4, K
Peterson 8 innings 2 hits 0 runs 3 runs 9 k's relevant note from @jeffpaternostro "Jeffrey Paternostro
@jeffpaternostro
·
19h
Peterson threw his change less than even his curve and got big slider whiff and chase by throwing it in the zone less. It’s Triple-A but it’s also closer to an actual blueprint."
Hartwig 1 inning 1 hit 1 run 1 walk 1 k (Very rough month so far for Hartwig 5.1 innings 11 hits 8 runs 12.71 era)
AA game 1
Rudick 1-4, BB, SB, (also threw out a runner at home) really incredible start to the season for a guy who wasn't on "anybodies" radar despite an extensive history of hitting at a high level
Young 2-3, BB, SB, K
Peroza 2-4, BB, 2 k
AA game 2
Rudick 1-2, 2 BB (.307/.451/.518, 27 walks, 21 k's and is now a career 29/35 stealing bases as well)
Hamel 3 perfect 4 k's (haven't seen anything to suggest this was anything but a short outing by design) 21 k's vs. 1 walk in May.. 5.89 era, baseball is weird #Mets
BK game 1
Ramirez 0-2, 2 BB, K
Consuegra 0-4, K (cooled off considerably in May .636 OPS)
Lugo 0-4, K
Parada 1-3, K (0/3 throwing)
Beck 0.2 innings 1 K (11.2 innings 24 k's)
Stuart 6.1 innings 4 hits 0 runs 1 walk 4 k's (left with hand issue. Era down to 1.13. He's been a sleeper for me since draft time. Low mileage, huge frame. 7th best FIP in
the organization (30+ innings) since being drafted)
BK game 2
Ramirez 1-4, 2B, 2 k's
Parada 1-3, 2 k's
Scott 4 innings 1 hit 0 runs 0 walks 2 k's (has quietly been one of the organizations best performers since draft day. RP convert)
Juarez 2 perfect 3 k's (Juarez has yet to allow a run over 15.2 innings to begin his season. Big league RPer)
St. Lucie
Lara 0-3, BB, K
Jett 0-2, SB, 2 BB (Funky stat line.. hitting .207... with a .409 OBP. Some suggestion he's overly selective. Near the top of the league in key cats for his age)
out of curiosity, is there anybody on here that would support sending Alvarez down? I'm shocked how often I'm seeing this bandied about. I understand wanting to keep depth.. if the depth is GOOD! I think it would be lunacy to send down Alvarez and send a terrible message to the young players. 162 wRC+ over the last 30 days and his defense is already looking far better than people expected.
out of curiosity, is there anybody on here that would support sending Alvarez down? I'm shocked how often I'm seeing this bandied about. I understand wanting to keep depth.. if the depth is GOOD! I think it would be lunacy to send down Alvarez and send a terrible message to the young players. 162 wRC+ over the last 30 days and his defense is already looking far better than people expected.
out of curiosity, is there anybody on here that would support sending Alvarez down? I'm shocked how often I'm seeing this bandied about. I understand wanting to keep depth.. if the depth is GOOD! I think it would be lunacy to send down Alvarez and send a terrible message to the young players. 162 wRC+ over the last 30 days and his defense is already looking far better than people expected.
i was fine with it/expecting it a week ago but you can't anymore. perez is a good 3rd catcher if nido gets claimed by someone, though more ideally his vision will get a little blurry again when narvaez is healthy and he'll take a trip to the IL.
alvarez has hit more homers than nidos best year and his defense has been very good. over 20 games if alvarez wins you 1 over nido bc of a homer he hits then that's not only the right answer but the only one. his ops is closing in on .800, his rc is 114, and by fwar he's already the 13th best catcher in mlb with 50 less at bats than pretty much everyone ahead of him.
sanchez would have to go on some kind of crazy run in the next 2 weeks to get any consideration and even if he does, it has to be at the expense of narvaez or nido.
Man, Christian Scott has a funky stat line- Since 2022 70.1 innings 2.71 FIP (2nd in the organization) .376 BABIP... .376!, 11.3 K/9
I hate to buy into micro sample sizes but Dominic Hamel's first 3 starts 11.1 innings 11 walks. Dominic Hamel's 5 starts since then 22.2 innings 3 walks
but I would be furious if Alvarez is ever sent down. Alvarez with Narvaez backing up. Perez in AAA. Sanchez/Nido will have to be DFAed if all healthy. Sucks, but is what it is. Hopefully, at least one goes unclaimed
lol
Huge hits lately for Lindor, Marte, Alonso. McNeil has been much better. Team was going nowhere with its veteran stars, and now those stars have started to carry them.
Andy Martino
@martinonyc
It’s up to the likes of Francisco Lindor, Starling Marte and Jeff McNeil to turn around the Mets offense. The talent is already on the roster. There are role players, not saviors, on the farm.
whether or not the young guys are "saviors" is a ridiculous strawman. they dont need to be saviors to be better than the players who are not part of the core and constantly failing to deliver run production - including in this game. the stars didn't carry baty to his 2 walks today or his 104 mph single.
also the cherry on top is that vientos/alvarez were actually literal saviors in the rays series that was 100% a lost series and possibly a sweep without them.
Put another one in the books!
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Gameday Wrap for Game 1 of Guardians at Mets today
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Game Story from MLB.com for Game 1 of today's Doubleheader - Guardians at Mets - May 21, 2023
Quote:
Andy Martino @martinonyc
Huge hits lately for Lindor, Marte, Alonso. McNeil has been much better. Team was going nowhere with its veteran stars, and now those stars have started to carry them.
Andy Martino
@martinonyc
It’s up to the likes of Francisco Lindor, Starling Marte and Jeff McNeil to turn around the Mets offense. The talent is already on the roster. There are role players, not saviors, on the farm.
whether or not the young guys are "saviors" is a ridiculous strawman. they dont need to be saviors to be better than the players who are not part of the core and constantly failing to deliver run production - including in this game. the stars didn't carry baty to his 2 walks today or his 104 mph single.
also the cherry on top is that vientos/alvarez were actually literal saviors in the rays series that was 100% a lost series and possibly a sweep without them.
These quotes from Martino piss me off so much. That combined with Buck’s clear dislike of young players and Eppler’s mythical boxes that need to be checked…makes me want them all gone. None of it makes any sense. Arrogant, egotistical, stubborn FO and manager. Just put the best players on the field. It really isnt that difficult.
Quote:
Andy Martino @martinonyc
Huge hits lately for Lindor, Marte, Alonso. McNeil has been much better. Team was going nowhere with its veteran stars, and now those stars have started to carry them.
Andy Martino
@martinonyc
It’s up to the likes of Francisco Lindor, Starling Marte and Jeff McNeil to turn around the Mets offense. The talent is already on the roster. There are role players, not saviors, on the farm.
whether or not the young guys are "saviors" is a ridiculous strawman. they dont need to be saviors to be better than the players who are not part of the core and constantly failing to deliver run production - including in this game. the stars didn't carry baty to his 2 walks today or his 104 mph single.
also the cherry on top is that vientos/alvarez were actually literal saviors in the rays series that was 100% a lost series and possibly a sweep without them.
Wow. Great post Eric. That is disturbing. Uncle Steve might need to step in here if that's really the case.
Spot on Coop. Classic case of stubbornness and egotism (and insecurity on Eppler's part IMO).
Scherzer talked about the following when he spoke to the press:
-His thumb callous split open (it was already there from before).
-It's something to keep an eye on. He said it opened up during the DC start (his words).
-He said he'll be good to go for his next start.
-He basically is saying that he sucked it up, pitched and won.
-Was amped to see Marte's homer.
-Says everyone is jacked up now the way they're playing.
-Thought working with Sanchez was good today; he thought they worked well for neither one of them having experience working together.
-Said being creative is mixing speeds and being irrational.
@AnthonyDiComo
Mets Game 48 of 162, vs. CLE
Sunday, May 21, 7:10 p.m. (2/2)
RHP Shane Bieber (3-2, 3.20)
Nimmo CF
Lindor SS
McNeil 2B
Alonso 1B
Baty 3B
Canha RF
Vientos DH
Pham LF
Álvarez C
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Verlander RHP (1-2, 4.76)
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MLB.com Gameday Probable Starting Pitcher Matchups with opposing lineup stats against them
MLB.com - Probable Pitchers Lineups w/matchup stats against the starting pitchers - ( New Window )
@AnthonyDiComo
Mets Game 48 of 162, vs. CLE
Sunday, May 21, 7:10 p.m. (2/2)
RHP Shane Bieber (3-2, 3.20)
Nimmo CF
Lindor SS
McNeil 2B
Alonso 1B
Baty 3B
Canha RF
Vientos DH
Pham LF
Álvarez C
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Verlander RHP (1-2, 4.76)
Marte finally heating up and he sits game two. I know he's a vet, but day off tomorrow, etc.
Guess he's available to pinch hit, but he's swinging the bat so much better now.
Gotta get Canha and Pham AB's? Yeesh.
Guardians at Mets - 7:10 pom EDT start - Game 2 of Doubleheader - TV Broadcast Feed - National Game: ESPN feed (volokit2.com)
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MLB.com - Gameday Boxscore - Guardians at Mets - 7:10 pm - Game 2 of DH
-80 P (50 S)
-6 I.P.
-3 H
-1 R (1 ER)
-0 BB
-3 K
-1 HR
3.91 ERA
Other than the 1st inning, he's been superb this start. I'm assuming he'll go one more inning. Would be nice to get him a win.
We're you at Earl? :)
We're you at Earl? :)
I’m
Here. And happy Z. But long season. Have little faith in max and Justin staying healthy And bullpen is very shaky
But loving Vientos. Baty. Alvarez. And can’t wait for Mauricio
Maybe we can put hit everyone
-98 pitches (65 strikes)
-8 I.P.
-3 H
-1 R (1 ER)
-0 BB
-5 K
-1 HR
3.60 ERA
Still feel this team could be special if it all comes together.
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Gameday Wrap
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MLB.com - Game Story
i know marte is heating up and thats big, but id keep mcneil #3 and marte #6. teams cant pitch around baty as easily with a career .300 hitter behind him and with actual power now hitting 7/8/9 it's almost like a mid-order leadoff hitter.
oddly my biggest concern is whats been the best unit on the team the bp. with more leads there are going to be more games like the last 5 where we had to pitch a lot of the same guys every day. not sure theres a solution right now though. have to get lucky w/ someone for a month.
NL East standings
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.
.
-The Mets now hold a wild card spot (the 6th and final one)!
-They're half a game ahead of the Marlins after having started the day behind them. HUGE day today for the Mets!
PlayoffStatus.com - MLB - National League - Week 8 of 27 (standings are yet to be updated as of now) - ( New Window )
Anyone who doesn't see/agree with that isn't watching. He was the spark!
i was a 100% buck guy and through 4 months last year i would have named him the team's mvp. i thought his BP usage in particular was best ive seen of any manager up until september.
but there was a game last year in august i think where they were down and with the final out he let nido hit i think instead of pinch hitting mcneil and after the game he got very snippy when questioned about it. since august of last year he has left a lot to be desired. he has made a lot of bizarre comments about the young guys, he's been a lot more defensive as he's taken criticism, and his bp usage down the stretch last year was weird against those bad teams when he let 1-2 run games get out of hand and all the best relievers were well rested going sometimes a week between getting in games.
i buy that there are probably some real internal frustrations with him because he has done some real backwards things since august. including some of the comments that came out over the last several days that seem intent on ignoring the reality that the key driver of this win streak was the kids. they've contributed like 11 runs over a winning streak of all 1 run games.
Mauricio 1-5, 2b, K
Cedrola 1-4, K
Peterson 8 innings 2 hits 0 runs 3 runs 9 k's relevant note from @jeffpaternostro "Jeffrey Paternostro
@jeffpaternostro
·
19h
Peterson threw his change less than even his curve and got big slider whiff and chase by throwing it in the zone less. It’s Triple-A but it’s also closer to an actual blueprint."
Hartwig 1 inning 1 hit 1 run 1 walk 1 k (Very rough month so far for Hartwig 5.1 innings 11 hits 8 runs 12.71 era)
AA game 1
Rudick 1-4, BB, SB, (also threw out a runner at home) really incredible start to the season for a guy who wasn't on "anybodies" radar despite an extensive history of hitting at a high level
Young 2-3, BB, SB, K
Peroza 2-4, BB, 2 k
AA game 2
Rudick 1-2, 2 BB (.307/.451/.518, 27 walks, 21 k's and is now a career 29/35 stealing bases as well)
Hamel 3 perfect 4 k's (haven't seen anything to suggest this was anything but a short outing by design) 21 k's vs. 1 walk in May.. 5.89 era, baseball is weird #Mets
BK game 1
Ramirez 0-2, 2 BB, K
Consuegra 0-4, K (cooled off considerably in May .636 OPS)
Lugo 0-4, K
Parada 1-3, K (0/3 throwing)
Beck 0.2 innings 1 K (11.2 innings 24 k's)
Stuart 6.1 innings 4 hits 0 runs 1 walk 4 k's (left with hand issue. Era down to 1.13. He's been a sleeper for me since draft time. Low mileage, huge frame. 7th best FIP in
the organization (30+ innings) since being drafted)
BK game 2
Ramirez 1-4, 2B, 2 k's
Parada 1-3, 2 k's
Scott 4 innings 1 hit 0 runs 0 walks 2 k's (has quietly been one of the organizations best performers since draft day. RP convert)
Juarez 2 perfect 3 k's (Juarez has yet to allow a run over 15.2 innings to begin his season. Big league RPer)
St. Lucie
Lara 0-3, BB, K
Jett 0-2, SB, 2 BB (Funky stat line.. hitting .207... with a .409 OBP. Some suggestion he's overly selective. Near the top of the league in key cats for his age)
Christopher Soto
@SotoC803
·
2h
Adding to this....
Over the last 30 days, Alvarez has the below stat line.
.262 AVG/.896 OPS, 5 HR, 9 R, 10 RBI, +0.9 WAR
He ranks 5th among all C during this time.
He has arrived and no one's return from the IL should change that.
They simply can't do it..
It just doesn't make any sense.
i was fine with it/expecting it a week ago but you can't anymore. perez is a good 3rd catcher if nido gets claimed by someone, though more ideally his vision will get a little blurry again when narvaez is healthy and he'll take a trip to the IL.
alvarez has hit more homers than nidos best year and his defense has been very good. over 20 games if alvarez wins you 1 over nido bc of a homer he hits then that's not only the right answer but the only one. his ops is closing in on .800, his rc is 114, and by fwar he's already the 13th best catcher in mlb with 50 less at bats than pretty much everyone ahead of him.
sanchez would have to go on some kind of crazy run in the next 2 weeks to get any consideration and even if he does, it has to be at the expense of narvaez or nido.
I hate to buy into micro sample sizes but Dominic Hamel's first 3 starts 11.1 innings 11 walks. Dominic Hamel's 5 starts since then 22.2 innings 3 walks