for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

Giants-Jaguars Trade from Jaguars GM perspective

Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/26/2023 11:15 am
Dov Kleiman
@NFL_DovKleiman

Fascinating look Inside the #Jaguars Draft Room:

The Jags made the decision to trade down twice, risking missing out on picking OT Anton Harrison.

GM Trent Baalke forced the #Giants and #Bills to tell him which side of the ball they'll pick: "Offense or defense?"

Baakle got nervous when #Bills GM Brandon Beane said offense.

The Bills eventually had to tell him it's TE Dalton Kincaid. Baalke was then worried someone will trade up with the #Cowboys and take Harrison: "That means we gotta sweat out Dallas."

Beane wanted to send the 137th pick in the trade originally but Baalke convinced him to make it pick 130 due to the risk factor.
Video of war room - ( New Window )
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/26/2023 11:24 am : link
Art Stapleton
@art_stapleton
We've seen #NYGiants end of their trade up with Jaguars for Deonte Banks on Giants Life, when Joe Schoen told Trent Baalke they were going defense to secure the deal.
Now we see the flip side, and how Baalke didn't know if NYG were going CB or DL/EDGE.
I wonder if Schoen  
Spiciest Memelord : 5/26/2023 11:32 am : link
could have reneged on the "deal" once he told the Jags what side of the ball they were picking, and the Jags accept, so you know they are not picking your player (they're picking someone on offense).
RE: I wonder if Schoen  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/26/2023 11:36 am : link
In comment 16123596 Spiciest Memelord said:
Quote:
could have reneged on the "deal" once he told the Jags what side of the ball they were picking, and the Jags accept, so you know they are not picking your player (they're picking someone on offense).


Sure, all is fair in love and war.

But he would have been persona non grata with Balke after that.
RE: RE: I wonder if Schoen  
Jan in DC : 5/26/2023 11:44 am : link
In comment 16123601 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 16123596 Spiciest Memelord said:


Quote:


could have reneged on the "deal" once he told the Jags what side of the ball they were picking, and the Jags accept, so you know they are not picking your player (they're picking someone on offense).



Sure, all is fair in love and war.

But he would have been persona non grata with Balke after that.


Additionally, if they got another offer for that pick, they'd be more likely to take it to screw over the Giants, I'd think.
RE: I wonder if Schoen  
Bourne ‘86 : 5/26/2023 11:46 am : link
In comment 16123596 Spiciest Memelord said:
Quote:
could have reneged on the "deal" once he told the Jags what side of the ball they were picking, and the Jags accept, so you know they are not picking your player (they're picking someone on offense).

I think Schoen mentioned being worried about another team jumping them not so much Jacksonville's pick
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/26/2023 11:51 am : link
Art Stapleton
@art_stapleton
·
25m
Also, this from Baalke: "we had several teams calling, 3 or 4 teams calling." Confirms what Schoen believed and what I confirmed after that: had Giants not moved up to 24, someone else was talking to JAX about coming up to 24 - KC and Raiders were snooping, possibly for Banks.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/26/2023 11:52 am : link
Art Stapleton
@art_stapleton
·
16m
I know there was some angst from fans on here about the Giants giving away a 5th and a 7th to move up from 25 to 24 to guarantee they got Deonte Banks.
I think what we've seen in video proof from other teams and NYG, and what was learned via reporting, Schoen made the right move.
thanks for posting  
Rory B. Bellows : 5/26/2023 12:19 pm : link
that was SO cool to see all sides of those few picks!

because we see our side & Joe and his concerns, but its nice to hear what's on Baalke & Beane's sides too

It doesn't matter what the Giants gave up....the only thing  
George from PA : 5/26/2023 12:37 pm : link
That matters is if they got the pick right!

If Banks faulters....than it was a waste.

If he excels.....we will all rejoice.

I wonder which DL he thought the Giants might take  
RCPhoenix : 5/26/2023 12:48 pm : link
I'm guessing he thought it might have been Bresee.
What George  
arniefez : 5/26/2023 1:37 pm : link
said
This  
AcidTest : 5/26/2023 2:28 pm : link
video and the Giants Life video about the draft clearly indicate:

(1) The Giants were trying to trade up for Banks, not a WR. (Schoen said he was concerned Baltimore would take "the corner." Martindale said the same thing after the draft).

(2) Several teams were likely trying to trade up to #24. It's possible that given their fear of losing Harrison just by trading with Buffalo, the Jaguars would not have traded down with Oakland or KC. But they might have done so anyway, and in any event, Schoen had no way of knowing about that concern.

Schoen traded a third, fourth, fifth, and a seventh for Waller, Banks, and Hyatt. And we still made seven picks. As of now, that seems like a great use of draft capital to me.
RE: This  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/26/2023 2:35 pm : link
In comment 16123777 AcidTest said:
Quote:
video and the Giants Life video about the draft clearly indicate:

(1) The Giants were trying to trade up for Banks, not a WR. (Schoen said he was concerned Baltimore would take "the corner." Martindale said the same thing after the draft).

(2) Several teams were likely trying to trade up to #24. It's possible that given their fear of losing Harrison just by trading with Buffalo, the Jaguars would not have traded down with Oakland or KC. But they might have done so anyway, and in any event, Schoen had no way of knowing about that concern.

Schoen traded a third, fourth, fifth, and a seventh for Waller, Banks, and Hyatt. And we still made seven picks. As of now, that seems like a great use of draft capital to me.


The best thing is that Schoen had intel that teams were trying to trade up in front him. That's important.

RE: It doesn't matter what the Giants gave up....the only thing  
JohnG in Albany : 5/26/2023 2:42 pm : link
In comment 16123665 George from PA said:
Quote:
That matters is if they got the pick right!

If Banks faulters....than it was a waste.

If he excels.....we will all rejoice.


It always comes down to this, even without a trade. *grin*
RE: RE: I wonder if Schoen  
Joe Beckwith : 5/26/2023 2:47 pm : link
In comment 16123601 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 16123596 Spiciest Memelord said:


Quote:


could have reneged on the "deal" once he told the Jags what side of the ball they were picking, and the Jags accept, so you know they are not picking your player (they're picking someone on offense).



Sure, all is fair in love and war.

But he would have been persona non grata with Balke after that.

+1.
Why burn the bridge you may need to cross back over later?
I applaud  
Y28 : 5/26/2023 3:12 pm : link
the move Schoen made to get Banks.

However, just my opinion, but I would not have traded up for Jalin Hyatt.

I guess we will all learn more this season and beyond, but I would kept our 2 picks and done this:

Pick # 89 TE Darnell Washington, Georgia
Pick #128 WR Charlie Jones, Purdue

I don't know if this was mentioned on BBI, but DT Brodric Martin was interviewed after the draft. He said that he was "CERTAIN" he was going to the Giants @ #89. He ended up going to the Lions @ # 96. Very interesting comment and with the Giants taking Riley later, seems pretty clear the Giants weren't leaving this draft without a DT.
RE: ...  
thefan : 5/27/2023 1:01 am : link
In comment 16123621 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Art Stapleton
@art_stapleton
·
16m
I know there was some angst from fans on here about the Giants giving away a 5th and a 7th to move up from 25 to 24 to guarantee they got Deonte Banks.
I think what we've seen in video proof from other teams and NYG, and what was learned via reporting, Schoen made the right move.


People were going ape shit over the 5th and 7th. It's the guy Wink wanted, they secured him, this board likes Wink right?
RE: I applaud  
ElitoCanton : 5/27/2023 1:10 am : link
In comment 16123827 Y28 said:
Quote:
the move Schoen made to get Banks.

However, just my opinion, but I would not have traded up for Jalin Hyatt.

I guess we will all learn more this season and beyond, but I would kept our 2 picks and done this:

Pick # 89 TE Darnell Washington, Georgia
Pick #128 WR Charlie Jones, Purdue

I don't know if this was mentioned on BBI, but DT Brodric Martin was interviewed after the draft. He said that he was "CERTAIN" he was going to the Giants @ #89. He ended up going to the Lions @ # 96. Very interesting comment and with the Giants taking Riley later, seems pretty clear the Giants weren't leaving this draft without a DT.


A third TE who fell because of major injury flags and a slowish WR who won't stretch the field. No thanks.
RE: RE: RE: I wonder if Schoen  
JoeSchoens11 : 5/27/2023 8:19 am : link
In comment 16123803 Joe Beckwith said:
Quote:
In comment 16123601 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


In comment 16123596 Spiciest Memelord said:


Quote:


could have reneged on the "deal" once he told the Jags what side of the ball they were picking, and the Jags accept, so you know they are not picking your player (they're picking someone on offense).



Sure, all is fair in love and war.

But he would have been persona non grata with Balke after that.


+1.
Why burn the bridge you may need to cross back over later?
And it’s not just Balke, it would certainly get out that JS lied to get the trade through - the impact would go way beyond the Jags
RE: RE: RE: RE: I wonder if Schoen  
SomeFan : 5/27/2023 5:27 pm : link
In comment 16124009 JoeSchoens11 said:
Quote:
In comment 16123803 Joe Beckwith said:


Quote:


In comment 16123601 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


In comment 16123596 Spiciest Memelord said:


Quote:


could have reneged on the "deal" once he told the Jags what side of the ball they were picking, and the Jags accept, so you know they are not picking your player (they're picking someone on offense).



Sure, all is fair in love and war.

But he would have been persona non grata with Balke after that.


+1.
Why burn the bridge you may need to cross back over later?

And it’s not just Balke, it would certainly get out that JS lied to get the trade through - the impact would go way beyond the Jags
exactly my thoughts too.
Regardless whether Giants were going O or D  
TJ : 5/27/2023 6:20 pm : link
Surely Jags GM couldn't have though Giants were going OT? So why did he care which side of the ball they were looking at?
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 5/27/2023 6:47 pm : link
If Joe renegaded on what he told Balke, that would have spread like wildfire in the front offices across the league & that would have been a bad, bad look/impact down the road for Schoen & the Giants @ large.
Snippets  
Colin@gbn : 5/27/2023 8:34 pm : link
Eric et al: Really interesting stuff! I have a little bit of a different theory as to the jags-Giants deal for #24 (and no it has nothing to do with WRs!) Remember these guys have all been talking together for days, feeling each other and setting up possible deals depending on circumstances.

I suspect that the Jags wanted to know whether the Giants were going offence or defence not because they were afraid the Giants would take the OT, but because they already had the parameters of a better deal with the Bills who they believed were after Kincaid and they wanted to make sure the Giants were not going to take the TE. Then the Jags could move to #25 and still make the deal for the 4th with the Bills.

It also appears as if the Giants may have had something in place with both Minnesota and the Bills which I may am not sure has been heavily commented on. In the Giants video with the Vikings on the clock, Schoen says something like 'the Vikes are keeping the pick. They are going offense; I think they are going to take Addison. They pulled out!' Pulled out of what? Sounds like there was something in place there.

In a completely different video of the Bills draft room Beane says "we had that deal with the Giants and they traded ..." The Bills appear to have thought the Giants were going to take Kincaid. (And while it doesn't have anything to do with the Giants I am wondering if the Jags were putting the pressure on the Bills to tell them the position they were targeting again not so much because they were worried about the TE but to put a little pressure the Bills to sweeten the pot which they did!)

And just in passing the frustrating thing with all these videos which are cool is that they are essentially snippets and we do not really get either the context or the details.
I enjoy seeing these extracts of the draft rooms and GM discussions.  
ThomasG : 5/27/2023 10:10 pm : link
You can really see them all work their strategies just like the ones we watched on Schoen who was obviously going after and trying to set himself up in a position to grab his #1 target in CB Banks. And then successfully achieving that goal makes it all the better.

Back to the Corner