Why can’t Jalin Hyatt be a number 1?

blazing speed, but you cannot just dismiss concerns on his route running out of hand. I haven't a clue as to if he can read defenders and turn them inside out just after the snap.
If he can be a competent route runner, then yes he can be a #1. I think the belief is he is, at worst, Darius Slayton with better speed and much better hands.
As of now, I expect Waller will be their #1.

It’s that he hasn’t yet shown all the requisite skills to be one. If he has them then sure he could be a #1. He has the unteachable skills. The speed, hands tracking ability. We will see.

so at this point, we cannot say that he can't be a #1.

The real question here is whether he will be OUR #1 WR

But most of area quickness tests were very average.....but I like his potential.

Waller looks like our #1 receiving talent this year.....as long as he stays healthy.

receiving option. My question was more about #1 WIDE RECEIVER..

.

In comment 16124533 gidiefor said:

Quote:

.

Of course, but do you feel he has the tools to be one?

the biggest concern is not really the route running. That wasn't on him. The biggest concern is why did he only have one year of legit production in college and why was it due to an injury to Tillman? That is my biggest concern. There is a real lack of experience there that will take time to really leadn the nuances of the position against top quality players. Yes, he put up crazy numbers in the SEC this year but consistency is what makes good players great. Can they repeat that success against different teams, defensive coordinators, different coverages, different players, etc. over an extended period of time?

Does he have potential to develop? Absolutely.

top wide receivers must have “agility, body control, strength, quickness, soft hands, physical stamina, concentration, focus, toughness, pride, eye-hand coordination, vision, intelligence, and the ability to conceptualize concepts.”

A serious deficiency in any of those attributes would knock a player down a peg or two. That’s why there are so few true number ones. Let’s hope Jalin has the natural ability and work ethic to approach that.

As long as the offense can come up with schemes that can attack defenses, and the players can execute them properly IMO the whole #1WR argument could be moot.

KC doesnt have a #1WR. They have a #1 Target in their TE in Kelce. Most of the years Brady played he didnt have a #1WR. He had a #1 target in Gronk at TE.

Its VERY possible that the #1 target for the Giants would be Waller.

In comment 16124536 Giant John said:

Quote:

Does he have potential to develop? Absolutely.

We know that, but many have stated BEFORE he’s played an NFL down, that he’s “not a true number 1,” as if they do not believe he will or can be. I just want to know why?

In comment 16124541 blueblood said:

Quote:

As long as the offense can come up with schemes that can attack defenses, and the players can execute them properly IMO the whole #1WR argument could be moot. KC doesnt have a #1WR. They have a #1 Target in their TE in Kelce. Most of the years Brady played he didnt have a #1WR. He had a #1 target in Gronk at TE. Its VERY possible that the #1 target for the Giants would be Waller.

He most likely will be, but that’s a target. I want to know about JH’s ability to be number 1 at WR

In comment 16124549 Big Blue '56 said:

Quote:

In comment 16124536 Giant John said: Quote: Does he have potential to develop? Absolutely. We know that, but many have stated BEFORE he’s played an NFL down, that he’s “not a true number 1,” as if they do not believe he will or can be. I just want to know why?

If that is what you are concerned about then the answer is simple, he's never done it in college so why would people say the opposite as a pro. Go earn it.

In comment 16124530 George from PA said:

Quote:

But most of area quickness tests were very average.....but I like his potential. Waller looks like our #1 receiving talent this year.....as long as he stays healthy.

Nonsense. How much quickness did Chris Carter have?

In comment 16124534 Big Blue '56 said:

Quote:

In comment 16124533 gidiefor said: Quote: . Of course, but do you feel he has the tools to be one?

Great hands and faster than any receiver in the league???? So yeah, I feel he does have the tools.

In comment 16124551 robbieballs2003 said:

Quote:

In comment 16124549 Big Blue '56 said: Quote: In comment 16124536 Giant John said: Quote: Does he have potential to develop? Absolutely. We know that, but many have stated BEFORE he’s played an NFL down, that he’s “not a true number 1,” as if they do not believe he will or can be. I just want to know why? If that is what you are concerned about then the answer is simple, he's never done it in college so why would people say the opposite as a pro. Go earn it.

That’s fair, but why was he projected as a possible first rounder? Unless you’re a standout slot receiver who might be taken in round one (usually not), why was he projected by some/a bunch, to be first round material?

How many true # 1WRS did Brady have over the years in NE. And the utter fallacy you can't fine a #1 type after round 1 persists despite dozens of stud WRs drafted in in rounds 2,3 and even later every year just amazes me.

Poor KC didn't a #1 this year. They had to settle for Kelce. Hyatt is a TBD but if the Gms knew who would develop each year there would be so much turnover would there lol. It's why I utterly don't get the Slayton hate. The guy gets more shit than Golloday it seemed at times.

If Hyatt is a starter or gets significant snaps over his career its a successful pick. He becomes a number 1 Schoen deserves a huge raise

In comment 16124556 Big Blue '56 said:

Quote:

In comment 16124551 robbieballs2003 said: Quote: In comment 16124549 Big Blue '56 said: Quote: In comment 16124536 Giant John said: Quote: Does he have potential to develop? Absolutely. We know that, but many have stated BEFORE he’s played an NFL down, that he’s “not a true number 1,” as if they do not believe he will or can be. I just want to know why? If that is what you are concerned about then the answer is simple, he's never done it in college so why would people say the opposite as a pro. Go earn it. That’s fair, but why was he projected as a possible first rounder? Unless you’re a standout slot receiver who might be taken in round one (usually not), why was he projected by some/a bunch, to be first round material?

Speed and production in the SEC and not a great WR class at the top of the draft. I think your threqd title and what uou just said are two different things. One, your thread title says he can't as in never will. Your last comment says not as in right now. He isn't a number 1 so that is what people are saying.

In addition, you need to first define what a number 1 WR is. Not all teams have one. Imo, a number 1 needs to basically do one of these two things consistently game after game, seas9n after season. One, get peppered with targets that reults in a majority of wins against all types 9f players and coverages. Think of a Devante Adams. Two, you get a ton of attention from the defense, so much so that it opens up the running game and one on one matchups for your teammates in the passing game. Long story short, he is always affecting the game in a positive way for his teammates. Being fast and having good hands isn't enough.

They said the same thing about Amani Toomer.

unlikely. He was 73rd pick and the 10th WR selected in the draft so the NFL experts in assessing this aren’t exactly expecting it. Becoming a reliable 3rd down target and developing a good on the field rapport with Jones would increase those chances.

These guys are exceedingly rare. If you watched Bama with Smith or LSU with Chase you see players who are clearly better than the competition. If you watch Tennessee games I doubt you come away thinking of Hyatt that way.

Remember that JS didn’t even have Hyatt on his radar when he saw the breakout Bama game.

Can he pull a Kupp or Hill? That would be amazing but the odds are very, very low. Hyatt just doesn’t have that level of movement skills to get open quickly, and that’s a big deal for an undersized wr.

We could just wait and find out?

In comment 16124561 robbieballs2003 said:

Quote:

In comment 16124556 Big Blue '56 said: Quote: In comment 16124551 robbieballs2003 said: Quote: In comment 16124549 Big Blue '56 said: Quote: In comment 16124536 Giant John said: Quote: Does he have potential to develop? Absolutely. We know that, but many have stated BEFORE he’s played an NFL down, that he’s “not a true number 1,” as if they do not believe he will or can be. I just want to know why? If that is what you are concerned about then the answer is simple, he's never done it in college so why would people say the opposite as a pro. Go earn it. That’s fair, but why was he projected as a possible first rounder? Unless you’re a standout slot receiver who might be taken in round one (usually not), why was he projected by some/a bunch, to be first round material? Speed and production in the SEC and not a great WR class at the top of the draft. I think your threqd title and what uou just said are two different things. One, your thread title says he can't as in never will. Your last comment says not as in right now. He isn't a number 1 so that is what people are saying. In addition, you need to first define what a number 1 WR is. Not all teams have one. Imo, a number 1 needs to basically do one of these two things consistently game after game, seas9n after season. One, get peppered with targets that reults in a majority of wins against all types 9f players and coverages. Think of a Devante Adams. Two, you get a ton of attention from the defense, so much so that it opens up the running game and one on one matchups for your teammates in the passing game. Long story short, he is always affecting the game in a positive way for his teammates. Being fast and having good hands isn't enough.

Ok, I see where my thread title can be interpreted that way. It’s in reponsetothose who say he can’t or won’t be a number 1 and I was asking, why can’t he be? That was my honest intent with the thread title

Depends on what you mean by number one. I imagine that means something like: despite getting the most defensive attention, he gets the most targets and produces at a high rate.

You can't ignore the poor track record of receivers who have come from that Art Briles system in the NFL. Those guys aren't learning to beat the jam against press coverage and they aren't learning how to do a lot schematically down field.

It's a genuine deficit when you come into the NFL. Transitioning to the NFL is hard enough. But these guys are jumping a level of competition and also have to learn some basics. It's chewed up talented guys.

The big, big reason to be optimistic about Hyatt is Kafka ran a bunch of the stack concepts from the Briles system last year.

I think he can be a day one contributor and will get his looks. The one knock I think is really worth watching is his limited moves with the ball in his hands. He's obviously crazy fast, but so are NFL defenders. He won't be able just to blow by everyone. He needs to showcase more wiggle.

Besides the speed and hands, what little I saw was the ability to loase a defender at the LOS. It remains to be seen if he can do that at the pro level, but the skill seems to be there. Obviously route running and reading defenses and defenders are huge at the pro level. But, this staff has gotten nearly every player on the roster to improve, so why not him, as well?

In comment 16124562 joeinpa said:

Quote:

They said the same thing about Amani Toomer.

Love Toomer, but remember we had to get a better no.1 wr to win the super bowl.

In comment 16124541 blueblood said:

Quote:

As long as the offense can come up with schemes that can attack defenses, and the players can execute them properly IMO the whole #1WR argument could be moot. KC doesnt have a #1WR. They have a #1 Target in their TE in Kelce. Most of the years Brady played he didnt have a #1WR. He had a #1 target in Gronk at TE. Its VERY possible that the #1 target for the Giants would be Waller.

I think it's very likely that Waller will be the main target. Regarding Hyatt, there are two things he needs to answer on the field - route running and being able to deal with press coverage. If he does well in both areas, we got a steal in round 3.

I really don't see a problem with having 5+ receivers with 50+ receptions at 12+ ypc. Only a problem if DJ decision process is tied to a perception of a security blanket.

Also, I believe he was not considered an obvious #1 by the scouting services because he was not on the pre 2022 wr lists because Tillman was on them. Changing pre-conceived notions is not a strong male trait.

In comment 16124618 Bob in Newburgh said:

Quote:

I really don't see a problem with having 5+ receivers with 50+ receptions at 12+ ypc. Only a problem if DJ decision process is tied to a perception of a security blanket. Also, I believe he was not considered an obvious #1 by the scouting services because he was not on the pre 2022 wr lists because Tillman was on them. Changing pre-conceived notions is not a strong male trait.

Yes, agree with your first sentence

.

Just on observing his highlights the thing that I noticed is that its not uncommon for Hyatt to not catch the ball cleanly - the ball does bounce off his hands a bit before he secures it. Not a big deal if he's receiving the ball wide open but I would expect that to lead to some drops on contested passes.

...the poor guy's ceiling may only be Randy Moss.

He has the skills to be whatever Dabes wants him to be.

So I don't see him as ever being a traditional #1 WR. My interpretation of a true #1 is obviously the guy that commands the most targets but also somebody that wins consistently at all 3 levels. I think Hyatt eats off short hitters and that vertical stem (not just go balls but what he can leverage off that threat as he matures). I think he's got a relatively high likelihood of being one of the league's most dangerous deep threats and the upside of a complimentary player that completely elevates an offense because of how valuable his skillset is. It's not a knock to say he won't be a WR1, I agree with the sentiment on this thread that fans are a little too obsessed with that idea. There's only about 10-15 of them in the league, they don't grow on trees. And on the low end of that bucket, I would argue that they aren't even as valuable to an offense as the dangerous complementary types (like Fuller was and like Metcalf is now) that Hyatt can grow into.

In comment 16124688 AcesUp said:

Quote:

So I don't see him as ever being a traditional #1 WR. My interpretation of a true #1 is obviously the guy that commands the most targets but also somebody that wins consistently at all 3 levels. I think Hyatt eats off short hitters and that vertical stem (not just go balls but what he can leverage off that threat as he matures). I think he's got a relatively high likelihood of being one of the league's most dangerous deep threats and the upside of a complimentary player that completely elevates an offense because of how valuable his skillset is. It's not a knock to say he won't be a WR1, I agree with the sentiment on this thread that fans are a little too obsessed with that idea. There's only about 10-15 of them in the league, they don't grow on trees. And on the low end of that bucket, I would argue that they aren't even as valuable to an offense as the dangerous complementary types (like Fuller was and like Metcalf is now) that Hyatt can grow into.

Many solid posts on here, but sorry, this is the “winner.” 😂

Tough to predict how the college systems and players translate to the NFL. Much harder to find the matchup advantages in the NFL but hopefully he has enough raw talent to win enough of them especially downfield in year 1. Grow in time.

I just saw him against Bama and Tenn. had WR's running open all over the field.

More connects down the field will help the offense and at least he has speed.

Not sure why that can’t be discussed.

We don’t know if he can run the whole route tree effectively because he didn’t do it in college. We also don’t know if he can beat press coverage off the line because he never had to do it in college. There is a reason the guy was available in the 3rd round.

Nobody knows what the guys true capability is, but he is coming into the league with a lot more question marks than most guys who go on to become top receivers.

In comment 16124698 Mike from Ohio said:

Quote:

Not sure why that can’t be discussed. We don’t know if he can run the whole route tree effectively because he didn’t do it in college. We also don’t know if he can beat press coverage off the line because he never had to do it in college. There is a reason the guy was available in the 3rd round. Nobody knows what the guys true capability is, but he is coming into the league with a lot more question marks than most guys who go on to become top receivers.

It has been discussed a lot and perhaps people think it's overblown. On the other hand it depends on whether or not cornerbacks line up in press coverage against him and whether or not he knows how to beat it; the Giants for instance line up corners at least 5 yards off.

In comment 16124698 Mike from Ohio said:

Quote:

Not sure why that can’t be discussed. We don’t know if he can run the whole route tree effectively because he didn’t do it in college. We also don’t know if he can beat press coverage off the line because he never had to do it in college. There is a reason the guy was available in the 3rd round. Nobody knows what the guys true capability is, but he is coming into the league with a lot more question marks than most guys who go on to become top receivers.

It’s a valid concern if, as I mentioned in the OP, people actually saw him play and deduced that he wasn’t a good “route-treer.” But my sense is that a bunch of the media just parrots what they’ve heard and didn’t actually watch him play or even noticed the “route tree.” If that is true, I learn nothing from them and that’s WHY I alluded to it in my OP..

I want to learn why he supposedly has a problem with it and not that he does without substance to the assertion.

In comment 16124709 Big Blue '56 said:

Quote:

In comment 16124698 Mike from Ohio said: Quote: Not sure why that can’t be discussed. We don’t know if he can run the whole route tree effectively because he didn’t do it in college. We also don’t know if he can beat press coverage off the line because he never had to do it in college. There is a reason the guy was available in the 3rd round. Nobody knows what the guys true capability is, but he is coming into the league with a lot more question marks than most guys who go on to become top receivers. It’s a valid concern if, as I mentioned in the OP, people actually saw him play and deduced that he wasn’t a good “route-treer.” But my sense is that a bunch of the media just parrots what they’ve heard and didn’t actually watch him play or even noticed the “route tree.” If that is true, I learn nothing from them and that’s WHY I alluded to it in my OP.. I want to learn why he supposedly has a problem with it and not that he does without substance to the assertion.

Did you watch him play and deduce that he CAN in fact run the whole route tree?

.

In comment 16124541 blueblood said:

Quote:

As long as the offense can come up with schemes that can attack defenses, and the players can execute them properly IMO the whole #1WR argument could be moot. KC doesnt have a #1WR. They have a #1 Target in their TE in Kelce. Most of the years Brady played he didnt have a #1WR. He had a #1 target in Gronk at TE. Its VERY possible that the #1 target for the Giants would be Waller.

You're kinda glossing right over a pretty important fact. You just gave 2 examples of teams that don't have a #1 WR, but they have 2 of the best QB's in history. #1 WR is real. Look at all the good teams and all the good offenses and they all have bonafide #1 WR's.

In comment 16124698 Mike from Ohio said:

Quote:

Not sure why that can’t be discussed. We don’t know if he can run the whole route tree effectively because he didn’t do it in college. We also don’t know if he can beat press coverage off the line because he never had to do it in college. There is a reason the guy was available in the 3rd round. Nobody knows what the guys true capability is, but he is coming into the league with a lot more question marks than most guys who go on to become top receivers.

Exactly. Heupel is running one of the most innovative approaches to tempo and targeting in all of college football. Hyatt succeeded like many other WRs have in the Briles-based system. And virtually all of those WRs have fizzled in the NFL.

In comment 16124711 RicFlair said:

Quote:

In comment 16124709 Big Blue '56 said: Quote: In comment 16124698 Mike from Ohio said: Quote: Not sure why that can’t be discussed. We don’t know if he can run the whole route tree effectively because he didn’t do it in college. We also don’t know if he can beat press coverage off the line because he never had to do it in college. There is a reason the guy was available in the 3rd round. Nobody knows what the guys true capability is, but he is coming into the league with a lot more question marks than most guys who go on to become top receivers. It’s a valid concern if, as I mentioned in the OP, people actually saw him play and deduced that he wasn’t a good “route-treer.” But my sense is that a bunch of the media just parrots what they’ve heard and didn’t actually watch him play or even noticed the “route tree.” If that is true, I learn nothing from them and that’s WHY I alluded to it in my OP.. I want to learn why he supposedly has a problem with it and not that he does without substance to the assertion. Did you watch him play and deduce that he CAN in fact run the whole route tree?

Reading is fundamental. I said I never saw him play. I said unless someone actually saw him run or didn’t run a route tree, I don’t want to read it from those who are parroting what they read or heard. I want actual observations on this subject. That’s how I learn.

So he is 84.

Seriously, perhaps at some point, not this year.

In comment 16124698 Mike from Ohio said:

Quote:

Not sure why that can’t be discussed. We don’t know if he can run the whole route tree effectively because he didn’t do it in college. We also don’t know if he can beat press coverage off the line because he never had to do it in college. There is a reason the guy was available in the 3rd round....

Oh it can be discussed. Now do you(or I) know what "running the entire route tree" means? That is an important question.

And he did have press coverage in college and he did beat it. It was not often, but he faced it.

And believe it or not, there are ways to defeat press coverage - motion, stacked formations, etc., besides muscling through it. And then that brings in the point that if he beats press off the LoS, he is likely going to have a huge gain with his speed. Very few CBs will be able to run with him. Once he gets a step, good bye.

.

required.

Daboll/Kafka now have weapons to spread out and attack defenses.
Hyatt has elite straight line speed that creates issues for defenses.

What it means in Hyatt's case is that he cannot cut sharply and use body control to get the DB going one way while he goes another. That's usually the key to getting open on all routes other than deep balls.

It's also easy to see on tape.

That's why he fell to third round.

Hyatt will be a threat in his first year, just by running down the sideline as fast as he can. What we need right now is what Hyatt can do right now.

I'll give Hyatt two or three years to become a "number 1" receiver, or whatever you want to call it, but right now, that is not really relevant.