article, which I just read, the writer argues that, rather than Andrew Thomas, the Giants should have drafted John.Jefferson. Now, Jefferson is obviously s great player and God knows, the Giants need a Number 1 wide receiver, but passing up Thomas, who may turnout to be the best left tackle in the NFL, what do we all think?
SI.com - ( New Window )
I do want a upper tier/elite WR but where the Giants were as a team AT was the right pick imv.
As far as Justin Jefferson goes as great as he is unless Thomas has injury issues going forward I'll take Thomas for the Giants. But I understand if people disagree.
He's literally the most productive receiver ever over his first 3 years in the NFL. His 4825 yards in 50 games is over 600 more yards than Randy Moss over 48 games.
Jefferson is on pace with the all time greats.
Thomas is a very good player, but this isn't even a conversation.
SFG; It was the '14 draft and I agree with you about Martin over OBJ. Dallas went in round one with Smith '11, Frederick '13 and Martin in '14. Might be 20 Pro Bowls between them. It's staggering the amount of PB's both Dallas and Philly have had from 2012 forward on the OL.
Last Giants PB OL? I believe it was Snee in '12.
Reese never drafted a upper tier OL or PB one in 11 drafts. What did you expect lol.
If the Giants draft the All Pro WR in 2020, they have the opportunity to draft the All Pro left tackle Rashawn Slater in 2021. And then draft Thibs in 2022.
Now of course the fruit of the 2021 trade produces Neal, Bellinger, Waller etc.
But an outcome of Jefferson, Slater, and Thibs is a superior outcome.
He would still have good numbers but I doubt he makes the same impact especially late in the season.
Jefferson against NFCE competition
Eagles 6-48
WFT 1-10
Dallas 3-33
Giants 12-133 We still had the secondary issues for this one with Jax and X.
Against Green Bay late in the year in Green Bay 1-15.
At a per game average of 6 catches, 78 yards, .6 TDs.
For context on a 6 game average that's 36 catches, 468 yards, 4TDs.
On a 17 game schedule, pro-rated to 102 catches, 1326 yards, 10TDs.
Not really sure what your point is. I said his numbers would be good. 7 other WR's have those numbers you posted and one TE and that's with the 1/5 games that was a outlier.
I'll take AT and saying it is not even a conversation sounds like someone from the BOG community. No thanks to that community. I saw what that group did the Giants and it wasn't pretty.
He's literally the most productive receiver ever over his first 3 years in the NFL. His 4825 yards in 50 games is over 600 more yards than Randy Moss over 48 games.
Jefferson is on pace with the all time greats.
Thomas is a very good player, but this isn't even a conversation.
Agree.
At a per game average of 6 catches, 78 yards, .6 TDs.
For context on a 6 game average that's 36 catches, 468 yards, 4TDs.
On a 17 game schedule, pro-rated to 102 catches, 1326 yards, 10TDs.
If you go to Pro Football Reference and look at his split for his career you will see that Jefferson does the worst against the NFCE over every other division. His average numbers are still very good. But if he played in the NFCE they wouldn't be all time numbers.
Have to really look closely when evaluating Dome teams especially at the QB and WR position.
Have to really look closely when evaluating Dome teams especially at the QB and WR position.
Jefferson has played 17 games, equivalent of a full year outdoors -- he went for 92 catches and 1294 yards.
I missed a game when I posted above - he's played 6 games against the NFCE and went 33 for 436 (17 game prorated 94 and 1235).
If Jefferson played all his games on the road outdoors, or if he played all his games against the NFCE, he'd just be great, not historically great.
Of course, if he were a Giant he wouldn't play all his games outdoors on the road or against the NFCE, so he'd be back to historically great.
Jefferson has been elite and consistent from the moment he stepped on the field. Every GM in the NFL would take him over Thomas.
Saying that all 32 GM's would go with Jefferson over Thomas seems like a awfully big assumption and I can't see any argument one can make to justify to make such a claim.
- A very good left tackle, with 1 very good season under his belt, but with a history of ankle and foot issues that have hampered 2/3 seasons
- A WR who has literally had the most productive start to his career in the history of the league, including offensive player of the year in year 3
Remember, the point of the exercise is "knowing what you know now, who would you have drafted."
It's fair to project the Giants would had the opportunity to pick an All Pro LT the next year.
Hypothetically the question is what group of players would you rather have.
Scenario A: Thomas, Thibs, Neal, Robinson, Bellinger, Waller
Scenario B: Slater, Thibs, Jefferson
Saying that all 32 GM's would go with Jefferson over Thomas seems like a awfully big assumption and I can't see any argument one can make to justify to make such a claim.
The question asked in the article isn't would any team prioritize offensive lineman vs. skill players.
It's a pointed hypothetical about what each team (in this case) the Giants would, given the benefit of hindsight.
Given the Giants situation, and the way things played out the next 2 years, no one would pick Thomas over Jefferson.
Where in the article does it discuss the "projections" you talk about?
My initial post was based on Jefferson versus Thomas and I stated my reason for it. That's it.
- A very good left tackle, with 1 very good season under his belt, but with a history of ankle and foot issues that have hampered 2/3 seasons
- A WR who has literally had the most productive start to his career in the history of the league, including offensive player of the year in year 3
Remember, the point of the exercise is "knowing what you know now, who would you have drafted."
It's fair to project the Giants would had the opportunity to pick an All Pro LT the next year.
Hypothetically the question is what group of players would you rather have.
Scenario A: Thomas, Thibs, Neal, Robinson, Bellinger, Waller
Scenario B: Slater, Thibs, Jefferson
I don’t really consider Robinson a part of the equation (we may have been able to draft him without the trade-up, or we would have gotten a comparable player if we stayed put). I guess 12% of ARob is appropriate for this exercise.
Slater’s been more injured than AT and Jefferson has been banged up as well. So injuries have benefitted staying with our players more than changing picks.
Salary also comes in to play as we payed for 2 useless seasons of KT + dead money (and coaching headaches while dealing with him). Waller is maligning significantly more than a rookie scale player. Neal/Bellinger contacts should hopefully make up for that.
Scenario 2 may also be Slater, Ickey/Neal, and Jefferson. We took Thibs 1st knowing that one of the elite T prospects would be available for our 2nd pick.
Either way, both teams did well and Philly ended up with Reagor so no complaints here!