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Dalvin Cook to the Giants?

jeffusedtobeonwebtv : 6/10/2023 7:31 am
One of the suggested landing places in this article is the Giants. It says you can rescind the franchise tag on Barkley and get Cook at a cheaper price. I do not think that is happening, but thought I would post this to see how others felt.
Where will Dalvin Cook land - ( New Window )
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Team Chemistry is important for this squad.....imo  
George from PA : 6/10/2023 9:28 am : link
.
I'm sure rescinding the tag  
AcesUp : 6/10/2023 9:30 am : link
of a hardworking and respected veteran in June, when the market has completely dried for him, would go over swimmingly for the locker room.

Juice wouldn't be worth the squeeze to net ~5m to replace him with Dalvin, who is an inferior player at this point with much bigger injury concerns than Barkley.

Some of the drama around this negotiation is so stupid. We've been heading towards the conclusion of him signing his tag right before the July deadline since we signed Jones.
It CAN work, but i doubt it  
Reale01 : 6/10/2023 9:36 am : link
You CAN let Team Barkley work out a deal with a team and then get him to sign the tag knowing he will be traded to a that team. I am not sure what you would get, at least a 3rd as that would be what you would likely get as a comp pick.

Happy Cook, plus 3rd round pick, plus more ?? cap space might be better than 1 pissed off Barkley.

The key is what would it take to sign Cook and have him be "happy"?

Also, what kind of person is Cook? Is he and healthy? Has he lost a step?

I would rather have Barkley as a known quantity.
Don't like the disloyalty of that  
Wildcardgiants : 6/10/2023 9:46 am : link
Saving a few bucks to diss one of our own is a Commander's move.
I don’t want cook  
UConn4523 : 6/10/2023 9:48 am : link
good player but Barkley is better by a pretty decent margin and the cost savings between the two is likely negligible.
Aces +1  
JonC : 6/10/2023 9:54 am : link
We'd be looking at a #3 pick and maybe more for SB, most likely.
RE: RE: RE: It's not about whether  
TrevorC : 6/10/2023 9:59 am : link
In comment 16130916 jvm52106 said:
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In comment 16130902 robbieballs2003 said:


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In comment 16130901 mittenedman said:


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its "stupid" or not. It's about whether the relationship between Barkely representation and the Giants has been fractured. Schoen seems pretty irritated about it and has definitely shown a "move on" mentality if things aren't done on the needed time schedule.



Then you trade him. You don't just release him for nothing.



You can't trade him without a deal in place and nobody is going to do that knowing the Giants and Barkley are at an impasse. We have no leverage here trading wise . Barkley's demands might be more than we want to pay and the cap savings would be huge. Not saying do it but too many here put fandom in front of smart business. Barkley should have taken his deal last fall- now he isn't getting more for sure and the Giants probably should have traded him at the deadline for max value. But, we are here and either he gets a Giants friendly deal or plays on the cap or he gets released. There are zero other options .


Exactly, the Giants made two offers to Barclay, both of which were significantly higher than any other running back. Got this off season and he said no to both. How is he going to agree to a trade when the other team would have to beat those offers? And if they wouldn't have to be those offers, why wouldn't you just resign Barkley who I still think is a better player than dalvin Cook?
If someone wanted to pay the Giants what SB was worth,  
Kmed6000 : 6/10/2023 9:59 am : link
than I think it would be done already. I think everyone knows where this is going(a breakup after this season), but we don't know how SB is going to handle this when camp starts.

SB is an asset to the Giants. He has value on the field and in the trade market(a bit less than CMC was traded for). You don't just rid yourself of assets, its poor management. Now, if someone were to want SB and we traded him, then I can see Cook as a possibility, depending on his contract demands.
RE: I'm sure rescinding the tag  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/10/2023 10:04 am : link
In comment 16130935 AcesUp said:
Quote:
of a hardworking and respected veteran in June, when the market has completely dried for him, would go over swimmingly for the locker room.

Juice wouldn't be worth the squeeze to net ~5m to replace him with Dalvin, who is an inferior player at this point with much bigger injury concerns than Barkley.

Some of the drama around this negotiation is so stupid. We've been heading towards the conclusion of him signing his tag right before the July deadline since we signed Jones.


I learned a long time ago back in the 1980s when holdouts were quite common that fans lose any sense of rationality during holdouts.

And it happened over and over again.
RE: RE: I'm sure rescinding the tag  
Dr. D : 6/10/2023 10:12 am : link
In comment 16130950 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 16130935 AcesUp said:


Quote:


of a hardworking and respected veteran in June, when the market has completely dried for him, would go over swimmingly for the locker room.

Juice wouldn't be worth the squeeze to net ~5m to replace him with Dalvin, who is an inferior player at this point with much bigger injury concerns than Barkley.

Some of the drama around this negotiation is so stupid. We've been heading towards the conclusion of him signing his tag right before the July deadline since we signed Jones.



I learned a long time ago back in the 1980s when holdouts were quite common that fans lose any sense of rationality during holdouts.

And it happened over and over again.

I think there's a lack of rationality on a lot of subjects.
RE: RE: Nobody is giving up a 1st for Barkley.  
mfjmfj : 6/10/2023 10:25 am : link
In comment 16130911 joeinpa said:
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In comment 16130907 robbieballs2003 said:


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If that was going to happen, it would have happened already. I doubt anybody would give up a 2nd. Read the market. Teams aren't paying these guys so why would they give up premium picks too?



I think you might be right. But considering what the Niners gave up for McCafferty, a 2,3, and 4 at age 26, what do you believe the Giants could garner in a trade for Saquon?


In my opinion nothing close to that. First CMC is just better. And their health issues are roughly the same. More importantly, SF got CM for 2 years at $5.5 per year. Then one more year at $11.8MM (he will be cut or take a pay cut). I would trade something for SB if I had him locked in at a below market contract. Not so much if I have to figure out his contract and he wants $15MMish. His trade value is about the same as DeAndre Hopkins. Or Dalvin Cook.
Saquon's situation  
AROCK1000 : 6/10/2023 10:27 am : link
Is one where I am not sure what to think.....
so many moving parts involved,but my gut tells me there is too much bad blood now and he is not going to be a long term solution here in NY.
Dalvin Cook is as good a solution as possible,iff Schoen can make it happen.
Otherwise,he should/will let things play out....
I personally have lost all of my loyalty towards Saquon.
He can stay or go,I am neutral on the subject....
RE: RE: Nobody is giving up a 1st for Barkley.  
uther99 : 6/10/2023 10:27 am : link
In comment 16130911 joeinpa said:
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In comment 16130907 robbieballs2003 said:


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If that was going to happen, it would have happened already. I doubt anybody would give up a 2nd. Read the market. Teams aren't paying these guys so why would they give up premium picks too?



I think you might be right. But considering what the Niners gave up for McCafferty, a 2,3, and 4 at age 26, what do you believe the Giants could garner in a trade for Saquon?


No one is making deal anywhere close to the CMC deal. I would guess a third for Barkley
RE: RE: RE: Nobody is giving up a 1st for Barkley.  
Kmed6000 : 6/10/2023 10:40 am : link
In comment 16130953 mfjmfj said:
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In comment 16130911 joeinpa said:


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In comment 16130907 robbieballs2003 said:


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If that was going to happen, it would have happened already. I doubt anybody would give up a 2nd. Read the market. Teams aren't paying these guys so why would they give up premium picks too?



I think you might be right. But considering what the Niners gave up for McCafferty, a 2,3, and 4 at age 26, what do you believe the Giants could garner in a trade for Saquon?



In my opinion nothing close to that. First CMC is just better. And their health issues are roughly the same. More importantly, SF got CM for 2 years at $5.5 per year. Then one more year at $11.8MM (he will be cut or take a pay cut). I would trade something for SB if I had him locked in at a below market contract. Not so much if I have to figure out his contract and he wants $15MMish. His trade value is about the same as DeAndre Hopkins. Or Dalvin Cook.


Their health issues are not really the same. McCaffrey missed a large portion of 2 seasons before he was traded. He played 3 games and 7 games in the 2 seasons before he was traded. I think CMC is better, but I don't think it's by much and I agree about the contract situations. The Panthers ate some of that money(Signing bonus) which made it easier and less risky for the 9ers to stomach it.

At best, I think the Giants can get a 3 and 5 or something like that.
What would that do  
JoeyBigBlue : 6/10/2023 11:38 am : link
For team morale? Barkley is respected and loved by his teammates.
so replace a player that was mostly productive for us  
gidiefor : Mod : 6/10/2023 11:49 am : link
last year -- with a player with major injury concerns -- just because you don't like the way that negotiations are going; in a negotiation where the Giants really hold all the cards, and have an asset that they like and appreciate.

Great management move.
It’s a dumb dumb article  
JoeyBigBlue : 6/10/2023 11:53 am : link
Not even worth clicking. This is a Madden Franchise move, that has no effect on team morale or chemistry. In real life, chemistry and morale is just as important as talent.
RE: What would that do  
TrevorC : 6/10/2023 11:53 am : link
In comment 16130965 JoeyBigBlue said:
Quote:
For team morale? Barkley is respected and loved by his teammates.


His teammates understand it's a business and Im sure are aware with whats happening with backs around the league as far as contracts. They also have seen the contracts they have handed out to DJ and Dex. I doubt its a morale thing. In fact, they might look at Barkley a little bit differently because he is turning up his nose at 10 mill for the year when no other back got that this offseason.

They offered him 13 million per year. While we don't know the guarantees, those that hypothesize that maybe the Giants offered him 3/36 with 8 gtd are stretching. There is no way they would make that offer if they were serious about keeping Barkley who has 3 1k rushing seasons in 5 years (1 cut short to injury). More than likely they made a fair offer with at least half gtd and incentives that could make him top hos value and he was convinced he could get more.

Im sure the lockerroom is just fine with whats going on.
RE: so replace a player that was mostly productive for us  
TrevorC : 6/10/2023 11:54 am : link
In comment 16130967 gidiefor said:
Quote:
last year -- with a player with major injury concerns -- just because you don't like the way that negotiations are going; in a negotiation where the Giants really hold all the cards, and have an asset that they like and appreciate.

Great management move.


Exactly, it makes zero sense unless Cook is willing to take 4/5 million per and 10 gtd.
RE: RE: It's not about whether  
Red Right Hand : 6/10/2023 12:00 pm : link
In comment 16130902 robbieballs2003 said:
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In comment 16130901 mittenedman said:


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its "stupid" or not. It's about whether the relationship between Barkely representation and the Giants has been fractured. Schoen seems pretty irritated about it and has definitely shown a "move on" mentality if things aren't done on the needed time schedule.



Then you trade him. You don't just release him for nothing.
How exactly do you do an on dermand trade when you want for a player who isn't under contract and not compliant with your plans? I don't see how they trade him before he signs, if he signs.
RE: So stupid and not worth clicking on  
Spiciest Memelord : 6/10/2023 12:02 pm : link
In comment 16130898 robbieballs2003 said:
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I think it's slow news season so might as well make something up.
Zero chance that happens  
ZogZerg : 6/10/2023 12:05 pm : link
For so many reasons.
RE: RE: RE: It's not about whether  
Section331 : 6/10/2023 12:13 pm : link
In comment 16130905 mittenedman said:
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In comment 16130902 robbieballs2003 said:


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In comment 16130901 mittenedman said:


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its "stupid" or not. It's about whether the relationship between Barkely representation and the Giants has been fractured. Schoen seems pretty irritated about it and has definitely shown a "move on" mentality if things aren't done on the needed time schedule.



Then you trade him. You don't just release him for nothing.



So........can't they do that and then sign Cook? You'd get a 1st/2nd rounder for Barkley, then sign Cook for less money. I'd rather keep Barkley, too, but I'm open to discussing different scenarios.


You’re not getting a 1st rounder for SB. If Schoen could have, he would have.

I don’t think the Giants sign Cook, but it’s not the craziest idea. I think SB rejecting the latest Giants offer (which was reportedly well above market value), then at some point, you have to move on.

Cook is a hell of a player, and is more dependable than SB. He’s not the game breaker SB is, but he gets the tough, “hidden” yards that SB often does not (although he was far better this past season at that). You also can’t overlook how SB tailed off late. To be fair, he suffered from the same roster shortcomings DJ did, but it has to be considered.
 
christian : 6/10/2023 12:25 pm : link
Quote:
Jason_OTC
@Jason_OTC
Dalvin Cook completed two years of a five year, $63m contract. One day teams will just stop the extensions at the position.


This is a spot on observation. There's just too much evidence 5-6 years is the shelf life of a back.
Running Back market continuing to display it hasn’t bottomed out  
nygiantfan : 6/10/2023 12:41 pm : link
.
RE: RE: RE: It's not about whether  
robbieballs2003 : 6/10/2023 12:55 pm : link
In comment 16130913 k2tampa said:
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In comment 16130902 robbieballs2003 said:


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In comment 16130901 mittenedman said:


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its "stupid" or not. It's about whether the relationship between Barkely representation and the Giants has been fractured. Schoen seems pretty irritated about it and has definitely shown a "move on" mentality if things aren't done on the needed time schedule.



Then you trade him. You don't just release him for nothing.



You can't trade him if he is not under contract.


I know how the tag works. You tell Barkleg to seek out another deal with another team. They fine an amount that they are happy with and then the teams work on compensation. Do people not understand this? I am pretty sure the Giants tagged Barkley with the non-exclusive FT meaning he can already ne talking to other teams if he wants.

The point is simple, we aren't dropping the tag on Barkley for nothing.
And people are coming at me saying you can't just trade him.  
robbieballs2003 : 6/10/2023 1:08 pm : link
Context matters. Did anybody read what I was replying to? I guess not. The post was about Barkley being frustrated and the relationship between his representation and the Giants being fractured. Step one for the Giants is getting a long term deal done. If that doesn't materialize then step 2 is to keep him on the tag. If that is still an issue then step 3 is to tell him to seek a trade. Again, not rocket science. The Giants aren't just releasing him. That's bad business at this point.
RE: RE: so replace a player that was mostly productive for us  
mfjmfj : 6/10/2023 1:16 pm : link
In comment 16130971 TrevorC said:
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In comment 16130967 gidiefor said:


Quote:


last year -- with a player with major injury concerns -- just because you don't like the way that negotiations are going; in a negotiation where the Giants really hold all the cards, and have an asset that they like and appreciate.

Great management move.



Exactly, it makes zero sense unless Cook is willing to take 4/5 million per and 10 gtd.


We will see, but I think that is about what Cook will get. Maybe a little better, but not much.
RE: RE: What would that do  
JoeyBigBlue : 6/10/2023 1:17 pm : link
In comment 16130970 TrevorC said:
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In comment 16130965 JoeyBigBlue said:


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For team morale? Barkley is respected and loved by his teammates.



His teammates understand it's a business and Im sure are aware with whats happening with backs around the league as far as contracts. They also have seen the contracts they have handed out to DJ and Dex. I doubt its a morale thing. In fact, they might look at Barkley a little bit differently because he is turning up his nose at 10 mill for the year when no other back got that this offseason.

They offered him 13 million per year. While we don't know the guarantees, those that hypothesize that maybe the Giants offered him 3/36 with 8 gtd are stretching. There is no way they would make that offer if they were serious about keeping Barkley who has 3 1k rushing seasons in 5 years (1 cut short to injury). More than likely they made a fair offer with at least half gtd and incentives that could make him top hos value and he was convinced he could get more.

Im sure the lockerroom is just fine with whats going on.



So his teammates are looking down on him because Barkley is using the only leverage he has to get a long term contract????? Lol the shit I read on BBI.
And Barkley's camp is taking a HUGE risk right now.  
robbieballs2003 : 6/10/2023 1:19 pm : link
The deadline to sign a long term deal is July 17th. That is fast approaching. If not, it is either play on the tag or holdout and get tagged again next year. If he plays on the tag then he runs the risk of screwing up his long term earnings with his injury history. Tick tock.
RE: And Barkley's camp is taking a HUGE risk right now.  
JoeyBigBlue : 6/10/2023 1:26 pm : link
In comment 16131000 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
The deadline to sign a long term deal is July 17th. That is fast approaching. If not, it is either play on the tag or holdout and get tagged again next year. If he plays on the tag then he runs the risk of screwing up his long term earnings with his injury history. Tick tock.



We don’t know what the Giants offered Barkley in terms of guarantees. On the tag he’s due 10 mill this year and 12 mill next year. That’s 22 million guaranteed. If the Giants offered less than 22 mill guaranteed he has no incentive to sign here. He’ll just play on his 10 mill this year, and take the 12 next year or go to free agency.
I'd be absolutely shocked if this happened  
dpinzow : 6/10/2023 1:40 pm : link
...
RE: RE: RE: RE: Nobody is giving up a 1st for Barkley.  
k2tampa : 6/10/2023 1:55 pm : link
In comment 16130958 Kmed6000 said:
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In comment 16130953 mfjmfj said:


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In comment 16130911 joeinpa said:


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In comment 16130907 robbieballs2003 said:


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If that was going to happen, it would have happened already. I doubt anybody would give up a 2nd. Read the market. Teams aren't paying these guys so why would they give up premium picks too?



I think you might be right. But considering what the Niners gave up for McCafferty, a 2,3, and 4 at age 26, what do you believe the Giants could garner in a trade for Saquon?



In my opinion nothing close to that. First CMC is just better. And their health issues are roughly the same. More importantly, SF got CM for 2 years at $5.5 per year. Then one more year at $11.8MM (he will be cut or take a pay cut). I would trade something for SB if I had him locked in at a below market contract. Not so much if I have to figure out his contract and he wants $15MMish. His trade value is about the same as DeAndre Hopkins. Or Dalvin Cook.



Their health issues are not really the same. McCaffrey missed a large portion of 2 seasons before he was traded. He played 3 games and 7 games in the 2 seasons before he was traded. I think CMC is better, but I don't think it's by much and I agree about the contract situations. The Panthers ate some of that money(Signing bonus) which made it easier and less risky for the 9ers to stomach it.

At best, I think the Giants can get a 3 and 5 or something like that.


No one is giving up anything for Barkley because he can't be traded. He is not under contract.
RE: RE: RE: What would that do  
TrevorC : 6/10/2023 1:59 pm : link
In comment 16130999 JoeyBigBlue said:
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In comment 16130970 TrevorC said:


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In comment 16130965 JoeyBigBlue said:


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For team morale? Barkley is respected and loved by his teammates.



His teammates understand it's a business and Im sure are aware with whats happening with backs around the league as far as contracts. They also have seen the contracts they have handed out to DJ and Dex. I doubt its a morale thing. In fact, they might look at Barkley a little bit differently because he is turning up his nose at 10 mill for the year when no other back got that this offseason.

They offered him 13 million per year. While we don't know the guarantees, those that hypothesize that maybe the Giants offered him 3/36 with 8 gtd are stretching. There is no way they would make that offer if they were serious about keeping Barkley who has 3 1k rushing seasons in 5 years (1 cut short to injury). More than likely they made a fair offer with at least half gtd and incentives that could make him top hos value and he was convinced he could get more.

Im sure the lockerroom is just fine with whats going on.




So his teammates are looking down on him because Barkley is using the only leverage he has to get a long term contract????? Lol the shit I read on BBI.


That isnt close to what I said. Whoa, the way people read on BBI.

I was saying that his teammates are probably saying the same thing all of us are....basically when they talk about what they read about what he turned down, that he is silly for turning that down given what has happened to the market.

Good try tho.
RE: RE: And Barkley's camp is taking a HUGE risk right now.  
TrevorC : 6/10/2023 2:01 pm : link
In comment 16131001 JoeyBigBlue said:
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In comment 16131000 robbieballs2003 said:


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The deadline to sign a long term deal is July 17th. That is fast approaching. If not, it is either play on the tag or holdout and get tagged again next year. If he plays on the tag then he runs the risk of screwing up his long term earnings with his injury history. Tick tock.




We don’t know what the Giants offered Barkley in terms of guarantees. On the tag he’s due 10 mill this year and 12 mill next year. That’s 22 million guaranteed. If the Giants offered less than 22 mill guaranteed he has no incentive to sign here. He’ll just play on his 10 mill this year, and take the 12 next year or go to free agency.


We are not tagging him 2 years in a row. If he signs the tag he gets 0 this year, after that, buena suerte and draft another next year.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Nobody is giving up a 1st for Barkley.  
Kmed6000 : 6/10/2023 2:18 pm : link
In comment 16131009 k2tampa said:
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In comment 16130958 Kmed6000 said:


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In comment 16130953 mfjmfj said:


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In comment 16130911 joeinpa said:


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In comment 16130907 robbieballs2003 said:


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If that was going to happen, it would have happened already. I doubt anybody would give up a 2nd. Read the market. Teams aren't paying these guys so why would they give up premium picks too?



I think you might be right. But considering what the Niners gave up for McCafferty, a 2,3, and 4 at age 26, what do you believe the Giants could garner in a trade for Saquon?



In my opinion nothing close to that. First CMC is just better. And their health issues are roughly the same. More importantly, SF got CM for 2 years at $5.5 per year. Then one more year at $11.8MM (he will be cut or take a pay cut). I would trade something for SB if I had him locked in at a below market contract. Not so much if I have to figure out his contract and he wants $15MMish. His trade value is about the same as DeAndre Hopkins. Or Dalvin Cook.



Their health issues are not really the same. McCaffrey missed a large portion of 2 seasons before he was traded. He played 3 games and 7 games in the 2 seasons before he was traded. I think CMC is better, but I don't think it's by much and I agree about the contract situations. The Panthers ate some of that money(Signing bonus) which made it easier and less risky for the 9ers to stomach it.

At best, I think the Giants can get a 3 and 5 or something like that.



No one is giving up anything for Barkley because he can't be traded. He is not under contract.


Semantics. He'd have to sign the FT and agree to a new deal.
RE: RE: RE: And Barkley's camp is taking a HUGE risk right now.  
JoeyBigBlue : 6/10/2023 2:33 pm : link
In comment 16131014 TrevorC said:
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In comment 16131001 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 16131000 robbieballs2003 said:


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The deadline to sign a long term deal is July 17th. That is fast approaching. If not, it is either play on the tag or holdout and get tagged again next year. If he plays on the tag then he runs the risk of screwing up his long term earnings with his injury history. Tick tock.




We don’t know what the Giants offered Barkley in terms of guarantees. On the tag he’s due 10 mill this year and 12 mill next year. That’s 22 million guaranteed. If the Giants offered less than 22 mill guaranteed he has no incentive to sign here. He’ll just play on his 10 mill this year, and take the 12 next year or go to free agency.



We are not tagging him 2 years in a row. If he signs the tag he gets 0 this year, after that, buena suerte and draft another next year.



You don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about. If he signs the tag he gets 10 mill this year. If he’s not franchised next offseason, he becomes a free agent and he will get more than 12 mill guaranteed (assuming he stays healthy like he did in 2022).

Also why can’t the Giants tag him two years in a row. It’s the perfect strategy if you don’t want to sign him long term and guarantee him more than 22 mill he’s owed the next two years on the franchise tag.
RE: RE: RE: RE: And Barkley's camp is taking a HUGE risk right now.  
TrevorC : 6/10/2023 2:44 pm : link
In comment 16131025 JoeyBigBlue said:
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In comment 16131014 TrevorC said:


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In comment 16131001 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 16131000 robbieballs2003 said:


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The deadline to sign a long term deal is July 17th. That is fast approaching. If not, it is either play on the tag or holdout and get tagged again next year. If he plays on the tag then he runs the risk of screwing up his long term earnings with his injury history. Tick tock.




We don’t know what the Giants offered Barkley in terms of guarantees. On the tag he’s due 10 mill this year and 12 mill next year. That’s 22 million guaranteed. If the Giants offered less than 22 mill guaranteed he has no incentive to sign here. He’ll just play on his 10 mill this year, and take the 12 next year or go to free agency.



We are not tagging him 2 years in a row. If he signs the tag he gets 0 this year, after that, buena suerte and draft another next year.




You don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about. If he signs the tag he gets 10 mill this year. If he’s not franchised next offseason, he becomes a free agent and he will get more than 12 mill guaranteed (assuming he stays healthy like he did in 2022).

Also why can’t the Giants tag him two years in a row. It’s the perfect strategy if you don’t want to sign him long term and guarantee him more than 22 mill he’s owed the next two years on the franchise tag.


I dont think you are understanding me and I dont know why you are cursing at me. The idea that we would franchise SB TWICE is absurd. Guaranteeing him almost 25 miloion dollars for 2 seasons of work is not very smart fiscally. Hell we could just offer that in a contract with the money spread out and not have to deal with the tag beef altogether.

I truly don't get the aggression in your post. But we dont have any options better than SB returning as our starting RB this year, and thats why he hasnt had the tag yanked yet.
The benefit of the FT and using it twice  
Kmed6000 : 6/10/2023 2:46 pm : link
would be that there is no commitment should he get hurt or fall off. Its a series of 1 year deals, so no dead money, no extensions and no restructures necessary. There is a value to that, specifically at the RB position.
RE: …  
Section331 : 6/10/2023 3:17 pm : link
In comment 16130983 christian said:
Quote:


Quote:


Jason_OTC
@Jason_OTC
Dalvin Cook completed two years of a five year, $63m contract. One day teams will just stop the extensions at the position.



This is a spot on observation. There's just too much evidence 5-6 years is the shelf life of a back.


It’s not going to happen, it already has. This is why the market for RB’s has plummeted, nobody is giving them that kind of money any more.
RE: RE: RE: RE: And Barkley's camp is taking a HUGE risk right now.  
Section331 : 6/10/2023 3:21 pm : link
In comment 16131025 JoeyBigBlue said:
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In comment 16131014 TrevorC said:


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In comment 16131001 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 16131000 robbieballs2003 said:


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The deadline to sign a long term deal is July 17th. That is fast approaching. If not, it is either play on the tag or holdout and get tagged again next year. If he plays on the tag then he runs the risk of screwing up his long term earnings with his injury history. Tick tock.




We don’t know what the Giants offered Barkley in terms of guarantees. On the tag he’s due 10 mill this year and 12 mill next year. That’s 22 million guaranteed. If the Giants offered less than 22 mill guaranteed he has no incentive to sign here. He’ll just play on his 10 mill this year, and take the 12 next year or go to free agency.



We are not tagging him 2 years in a row. If he signs the tag he gets 0 this year, after that, buena suerte and draft another next year.




You don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about. If he signs the tag he gets 10 mill this year. If he’s not franchised next offseason, he becomes a free agent and he will get more than 12 mill guaranteed (assuming he stays healthy like he did in 2022).

Also why can’t the Giants tag him two years in a row. It’s the perfect strategy if you don’t want to sign him long term and guarantee him more than 22 mill he’s owed the next two years on the franchise tag.


What evidence do you see that ANY RB will get that kind of money on the open market? Every bit of evidence suggests he won’t, so I’m not sure you should be accusing anyone of not knowing what they’re talking about.

SB’s agents totally misread the market, and now they are compounding it by turning down a better offer than any other RB is getting.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: And Barkley's camp is taking a HUGE risk right now.  
JoeyBigBlue : 6/10/2023 4:03 pm : link
In comment 16131049 Section331 said:
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In comment 16131025 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 16131014 TrevorC said:


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In comment 16131001 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 16131000 robbieballs2003 said:


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The deadline to sign a long term deal is July 17th. That is fast approaching. If not, it is either play on the tag or holdout and get tagged again next year. If he plays on the tag then he runs the risk of screwing up his long term earnings with his injury history. Tick tock.




We don’t know what the Giants offered Barkley in terms of guarantees. On the tag he’s due 10 mill this year and 12 mill next year. That’s 22 million guaranteed. If the Giants offered less than 22 mill guaranteed he has no incentive to sign here. He’ll just play on his 10 mill this year, and take the 12 next year or go to free agency.



We are not tagging him 2 years in a row. If he signs the tag he gets 0 this year, after that, buena suerte and draft another next year.




You don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about. If he signs the tag he gets 10 mill this year. If he’s not franchised next offseason, he becomes a free agent and he will get more than 12 mill guaranteed (assuming he stays healthy like he did in 2022).

Also why can’t the Giants tag him two years in a row. It’s the perfect strategy if you don’t want to sign him long term and guarantee him more than 22 mill he’s owed the next two years on the franchise tag.



What evidence do you see that ANY RB will get that kind of money on the open market? Every bit of evidence suggests he won’t, so I’m not sure you should be accusing anyone of not knowing what they’re talking about.

SB’s agents totally misread the market, and now they are compounding it by turning down a better offer than any other RB is getting.



Miles Sanders got a 4 year 25 million dollar contract with 13 million guaranteed. Saquon is a superior player in every aspect of football to Miles Sanders. If you don’t think he’d get more than 13 million guaranteed, than you are out of your mind.

Not gonna happen, sadly.  
Dave in Hoboken : 6/10/2023 4:10 pm : link
But it certainly would solve the Barkley contract issue. Too bad. Cook would be a suitable replacement.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: And Barkley's camp is taking a HUGE risk right now.  
Section331 : 6/10/2023 5:02 pm : link
In comment 16131063 JoeyBigBlue said:
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In comment 16131049 Section331 said:


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In comment 16131025 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 16131014 TrevorC said:


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In comment 16131001 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 16131000 robbieballs2003 said:


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The deadline to sign a long term deal is July 17th. That is fast approaching. If not, it is either play on the tag or holdout and get tagged again next year. If he plays on the tag then he runs the risk of screwing up his long term earnings with his injury history. Tick tock.




We don’t know what the Giants offered Barkley in terms of guarantees. On the tag he’s due 10 mill this year and 12 mill next year. That’s 22 million guaranteed. If the Giants offered less than 22 mill guaranteed he has no incentive to sign here. He’ll just play on his 10 mill this year, and take the 12 next year or go to free agency.



We are not tagging him 2 years in a row. If he signs the tag he gets 0 this year, after that, buena suerte and draft another next year.




You don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about. If he signs the tag he gets 10 mill this year. If he’s not franchised next offseason, he becomes a free agent and he will get more than 12 mill guaranteed (assuming he stays healthy like he did in 2022).

Also why can’t the Giants tag him two years in a row. It’s the perfect strategy if you don’t want to sign him long term and guarantee him more than 22 mill he’s owed the next two years on the franchise tag.



What evidence do you see that ANY RB will get that kind of money on the open market? Every bit of evidence suggests he won’t, so I’m not sure you should be accusing anyone of not knowing what they’re talking about.

SB’s agents totally misread the market, and now they are compounding it by turning down a better offer than any other RB is getting.




Miles Sanders got a 4 year 25 million dollar contract with 13 million guaranteed. Saquon is a superior player in every aspect of football to Miles Sanders. If you don’t think he’d get more than 13 million guaranteed, than you are out of your mind.


An AAV of $6M is not equal to $12M, which was what was quoted in the post I responded to. Yes, SB is better than Sanders, and will get paid more, but it won’t be a $12M per deal.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: And Barkley's camp is taking a HUGE risk right now.  
JoeyBigBlue : 6/10/2023 5:13 pm : link
In comment 16131077 Section331 said:
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In comment 16131063 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 16131049 Section331 said:


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In comment 16131025 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 16131014 TrevorC said:


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In comment 16131001 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 16131000 robbieballs2003 said:


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The deadline to sign a long term deal is July 17th. That is fast approaching. If not, it is either play on the tag or holdout and get tagged again next year. If he plays on the tag then he runs the risk of screwing up his long term earnings with his injury history. Tick tock.




We don’t know what the Giants offered Barkley in terms of guarantees. On the tag he’s due 10 mill this year and 12 mill next year. That’s 22 million guaranteed. If the Giants offered less than 22 mill guaranteed he has no incentive to sign here. He’ll just play on his 10 mill this year, and take the 12 next year or go to free agency.



We are not tagging him 2 years in a row. If he signs the tag he gets 0 this year, after that, buena suerte and draft another next year.




You don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about. If he signs the tag he gets 10 mill this year. If he’s not franchised next offseason, he becomes a free agent and he will get more than 12 mill guaranteed (assuming he stays healthy like he did in 2022).

Also why can’t the Giants tag him two years in a row. It’s the perfect strategy if you don’t want to sign him long term and guarantee him more than 22 mill he’s owed the next two years on the franchise tag.



What evidence do you see that ANY RB will get that kind of money on the open market? Every bit of evidence suggests he won’t, so I’m not sure you should be accusing anyone of not knowing what they’re talking about.

SB’s agents totally misread the market, and now they are compounding it by turning down a better offer than any other RB is getting.




Miles Sanders got a 4 year 25 million dollar contract with 13 million guaranteed. Saquon is a superior player in every aspect of football to Miles Sanders. If you don’t think he’d get more than 13 million guaranteed, than you are out of your mind.




An AAV of $6M is not equal to $12M, which was what was quoted in the post I responded to. Yes, SB is better than Sanders, and will get paid more, but it won’t be a $12M per deal.


AAV doesn’t matter here, what’s important is the guarantees. We don’t know what the Giants offered in guaranteed money. If it was less than 22 million, then I don’t blame Barkley for not signing.
RE: RE: RE: Nobody is giving up a 1st for Barkley.  
joeinpa : 6/10/2023 7:54 pm : link
In comment 16130953 mfjmfj said:
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In comment 16130911 joeinpa said:


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In comment 16130907 robbieballs2003 said:


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If that was going to happen, it would have happened already. I doubt anybody would give up a 2nd. Read the market. Teams aren't paying these guys so why would they give up premium picks too?



I think you might be right. But considering what the Niners gave up for McCafferty, a 2,3, and 4 at age 26, what do you believe the Giants could garner in a trade for Saquon?



In my opinion nothing close to that. First CMC is just better. And their health issues are roughly the same. More importantly, SF got CM for 2 years at $5.5 per year. Then one more year at $11.8MM (he will be cut or take a pay cut). I would trade something for SB if I had him locked in at a below market contract. Not so much if I have to figure out his contract and he wants $15MMish. His trade value is about the same as DeAndre Hopkins. Or Dalvin Cook.


That s really a good answer, thanks
Barkley is far more important to our offense than any other RBs being  
PatersonPlank : 6/10/2023 10:36 pm : link
mentioned in this thread. They all have a much better WR corp than the Giants.

Barkley was a huge part of the offense. Not just his 1650 yds and 11 TDs, but also his decoys which opened up runs for Jones and got JAGS like James open for slants. What the guy did with every defense basically keyed up to just stop him is impressive. Its not like Cook where he is a change of pace to throwing to their WRs.
Barkley most liley won't be here in 2024,  
Dave in Hoboken : 6/10/2023 10:51 pm : link
so the Giants should probably think about who their next RB is going to be after that.
RE: Barkley most liley won't be here in 2024,  
ThomasG : 6/11/2023 8:54 am : link
In comment 16131193 Dave in Hoboken said:
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so the Giants should probably think about who their next RB is going to be after that.


Numerous options and paths. Higher priorities elsewhere.
RE: RE: RE: RE: And Barkley's camp is taking a HUGE risk right now.  
mfjmfj : 6/11/2023 8:46 pm : link
In comment 16131025 JoeyBigBlue said:
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In comment 16131014 TrevorC said:


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In comment 16131001 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 16131000 robbieballs2003 said:


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The deadline to sign a long term deal is July 17th. That is fast approaching. If not, it is either play on the tag or holdout and get tagged again next year. If he plays on the tag then he runs the risk of screwing up his long term earnings with his injury history. Tick tock.




We don’t know what the Giants offered Barkley in terms of guarantees. On the tag he’s due 10 mill this year and 12 mill next year. That’s 22 million guaranteed. If the Giants offered less than 22 mill guaranteed he has no incentive to sign here. He’ll just play on his 10 mill this year, and take the 12 next year or go to free agency.



We are not tagging him 2 years in a row. If he signs the tag he gets 0 this year, after that, buena suerte and draft another next year.




You don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about. If he signs the tag he gets 10 mill this year. If he’s not franchised next offseason, he becomes a free agent and he will get more than 12 mill guaranteed (assuming he stays healthy like he did in 2022).

Also why can’t the Giants tag him two years in a row. It’s the perfect strategy if you don’t want to sign him long term and guarantee him more than 22 mill he’s owed the next two years on the franchise tag.


I think it is possible but unlikely he gets a second tag. First he has to stay healthy and play as well as he did for the first half of last year for the whole year. I am hopeful for the first, but think the second is unlikely. Even then, in the current market, I am not convinced he is worth the FT. All pro level and healthy sure. But he hasn't managed that since 2018. And I don't think he gets $12MM guaranteed on the open market if he is not FT. Dalvin Cook won't, in my opinion. And SB is not that much better than Dalvin Cook. We will see. I hope he has a monster season and we give him a great contract next year.
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