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NFT: Mets vs Pirates: Game 1 - Carrasco vs Priester - 7:10 pm EDT

Optimus-NY : 8/14/2023 6:15 pm

Starting Lineups for both clubs tonight
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Probable Starting Pitcher Matchups for tonight in Flushing against the Pirates.
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#LFGM!
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Notes:
-The Mets and Pirates start off the day 8.5 games behind the Marlins for the last Wildcard spot in the NL (click HERE to see the Playoff Status of teams in the NL).
-The Mets have a record of 53-65, which ties them with the Tigers and Pirates for the 7th/8th/9th worst record in MLB (click HERE to keep track on Tankathon).

-Only 1 game separates the five teams with the 5th through 9th worst records in MLB: Cards, Nats, Pirates, Tigers, 7 Mets.
-The way the lineup looks tonight with Arauz, Ortega, and Vogelbach, combined with Cookie the Crumbler on the mound, losing is the most likely end result.

-The weather looks decent, but there's a chance for showers later on in the night. Click HERE to check on the Hourly AccuWeather Report at Citi Field tonight.
-All three games of this series at home against the kindred bottom-feeding Pirates will be on SNY.
-Yesterday, the Mets transferred RHP Elieser Hernández from the 15-day injured list to the 60-day injured list. They also sent RHP Reed Garrett back down to Syracuse yesterday after he served as the 27th man for both games of Saturday's Doubleheader massacre.

-They also optioned RHP Edwin Uceta to Syracuse.
-Click HERE to the Mets' List of Transactions.
-The Mets' 4-man bench for this game will consist of Narvaez, Mendick, Locastro, & Stewart.
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Russo says not to pay attention to Licata, lol  
Optimus-NY : 8/14/2023 6:33 pm : link



Tweet - Funhouse @BackAftaThis - 5:51 PM · Aug 14, 2023 · 33.5K Views - ( New Window )
Here are links to tonight's game:  
Optimus-NY : 8/14/2023 7:04 pm : link
*Courtesy of jm.freestreams-live1.tv & sportsurge.net*

Mets vs. Pirates | 7:10 pm EDT start - August 14, 2023 - TV Broadcast: Mets' feed - SNY: Gary & Keith (strfi5h.blogspot.com)

Mets vs. Pirates | 7:10 pm EDT start - August 14, 2023 - TV Broadcast: Pirates' feed - ATT SportsNet-PIT (strfi5h.blogspot.com)

MLB.com - Gameday: Pitch by Pitch - Mets vs. Pirates - August 14, 2023 - 7:10 pm EDT start


Note: Ron isn't doing the game tonight.


Enjoy tonight's farce...I mean game! ;-)



Here are the moves the Mets made today:  
Optimus-NY : 8/14/2023 7:47 pm : link
-John Curtiss' season is over.
-Coonrod is with the big club tonight.
-Click HERE to see the Mets' updated 26-man active roster.




Tweet - Mike Mayer @mikemayer22 - 6:25 PM · Aug 14, 2023 · 14.5K Views - ( New Window )
Thank you  
spike : 8/14/2023 8:32 pm : link
for keeping up with the game threads, Optimus
RE: Thank you  
Optimus-NY : 8/14/2023 8:41 pm : link
In comment 16173025 spike said:
Quote:
for keeping up with the game threads, Optimus


No prob. Thank you to you guys about suggestions for them as well. If I can make 'em, then I will.

I think I'll shorten the Notes section more as we go forward (not much of note to really note anymore anyway) since this season is #tanked to high hell. I'm not gonna make a thread on Thursday. One of you guys can go ahead and start one then. Takin' a lady friend of mine out that night, haha.
Apparently, Sal Licata didn't say Alonso was a clubhouse problem.  
81_Great_Dane : 8/14/2023 8:58 pm : link
He said there's a problem in the clubhouse, the core needs to be broken up, and the only core guy who's tradeable is Alonso.

I keep hearing the clubhouse is toxic; I don't know who should stay and who should go, I know that if you trade Alonso you better bring back something effin' great. It's not quite like trading Seaver but damn.

Disappointed in the Baby Mets right now. Mauricio never made it up; Baty's back down; Vientos looks overmatched in the field and at the plate. Alvarez is doing great for a 21-year-old rookie but I hope he makes more consistent contact as he grows up.

But I'm WAY more disappointed in the vets.
Sounds like  
spike : 8/14/2023 9:01 pm : link
Mcneil is the problem
...  
Optimus-NY : 8/14/2023 9:03 pm : link
...  
Optimus-NY : 8/14/2023 9:16 pm : link
DP and Megill  
spike : 8/14/2023 9:26 pm : link
have been equally disappointing. No one wants a permanent job in the rotation.
RE: DP and Megill  
Optimus-NY : 8/15/2023 8:17 am : link
In comment 16173066 spike said:
Quote:
have been equally disappointing. No one wants a permanent job in the rotation.


This is their chance to earn one for next season as the 5th starter. Mets will most likely sign two starting pitchers in FA. Senga and Quintana will have the other two spots in the rotation. Megill and Peterson are basically fighting it out now for that 5th spot. The Mets have have Blade Tidwell and Mike Vasil on the come---more likely for 2025 though. By 2025 Quintana will have been gone from the teams since his contract expires after the 2024 season. They're not gonna spend willy nilly.

They'll target at least one youngster. Yamamoto is about to turn 25 in a couple of days and Urias is 26 now. If they can get both that would be even better. We all know about Ohtani. He trumps all of course and is 29 now. Get two guys---one of whom is in his mid 20s and avoid any guys in their mid to late 30s in FA. Hopefully Christian Scott and Brandon Sproat after him can add to that staff or bullpen as well.

METS MINORS RECAP: RYAN CLIFFORD STAYS HOT, CHRISTIAN SCOTT PITCHES A GEM | Posted by Ricky Keeler | Aug 13, 2023

Mets Pitching Prospect Scott Makes Huge Jump in Top 30 Rankings: Christian Scott is pitching at Double-A Binghamton and moved nearly 20 spots in the New York Mets' Top 30 prospect rankings. | MATTHEW POSTINSAUG 13, 2023 9:00 AM EDT

Mets sign top draft picks Colin Houck and Brandon Sproat: The Mets have signed their first two picks from the amateur draft. - By Chris McShane@chrismcshane | Jul 14, 2023 - 5:44pm EDT
RE: Sounds like  
Gruber : 8/15/2023 9:19 am : link
In comment 16173052 spike said:
Quote:
Mcneil is the problem


Please explain.
RE: Sounds like  
Section331 : 8/15/2023 9:35 am : link
In comment 16173052 spike said:
Quote:
Mcneil is the problem


That wouldn’t surprise me, he was a major issue 2 years ago when he refused to position himself where coaches wanted him to. So yeah, McNeil’s the problem, but trade Alonso.

I guess if Sal Licata was a doctor, he’d say, “well, you have lung cancer, so let’s remove your leg”.
RE: RE: Sounds like  
Optimus-NY : 8/15/2023 10:27 am : link
In comment 16173251 Section331 said:
Quote:
In comment 16173052 spike said:


Quote:


Mcneil is the problem



That wouldn’t surprise me, he was a major issue 2 years ago when he refused to position himself where coaches wanted him to. So yeah, McNeil’s the problem, but trade Alonso.

I guess if Sal Licata was a doctor, he’d say, “well, you have lung cancer, so let’s remove your leg”.


Here's an old article with a video clip...

Francisco Lindor grabbed Jeff McNeil by throat during Mets’ ‘rat-raccoon’ altercation | By Mike Puma | November 3, 2021 | 5:44pm | NYPost.com
this may be nothing or it may be something but lindor promised mcneil  
Eric on Li : 8/15/2023 10:36 am : link
a car if he won the batting title and as of July he hadnt paid that off.

mcneil just signed a $50m extension so it's not quite the same as veterans in training camp stiffing a rookie with a big check, but lindor is set to earn almost 3x this year ($27m) what mcneil has made his entire career so far (11m career earnings including this season).

im not saying it has but neither side should have let something like this become a distraction even on the level of the article linked below being written.

alonso also shouldnt have let his contract discussions drag the way they have. cohen has proven he's willing to pay people, i have a hard time believing he's drawing some unreasonable line with alonso.

when you have an owner throwing around record sums of money to individual players, it is absolutely a risk that some guys in the clubhouse are going to want to get theirs too, and feel slighted.
Francisco Lindor Still Hasn't Fulfilled Promise to Jeff McNeil - ( New Window )
Who  
DanMetroMan : 8/15/2023 10:47 am : link
knows how true it is, but the "rumor" is Alonso is looking for at least 30 million per season which may be in line with "top" 1b, but not if he's also looking for 10+ seasons. Freeman (the superior player) got 6 for 162 at 32, Goldschmidt (also the superior player) 5 for 130, Votto 10 for 225, Olson 8 for 168. The "problem" in regard to Alonso is he's likely coming into this comparing himself to non-1b, but the market does not appear to agree that a 1b has the same value as other positions. I'm pretty confident Cohen would give Alonso 5-6 seasons at 30 per TODAY, but I do not believe the Mets are going to give Pete Alonso 30 per for 9-10 seasons.
As  
DanMetroMan : 8/15/2023 10:48 am : link
for McNeil, he may well be annoyed about the car (no clue) but he's going to make 10.2, 15.8, 15.8 2024-2026 + either a buyout for 2 or 15.8 more, so if he's letting a car impact his play... that's scary.
They  
DanMetroMan : 8/15/2023 11:18 am : link
may shut down Marte at some point soon per Showalter it's been discussed.
RE: As  
Eric on Li : 8/15/2023 11:21 am : link
In comment 16173326 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
for McNeil, he may well be annoyed about the car (no clue) but he's going to make 10.2, 15.8, 15.8 2024-2026 + either a buyout for 2 or 15.8 more, so if he's letting a car impact his play... that's scary.


everyone has been pissed with a co-worker, and even if there's zero impact on whatever your work is it's not positive.

again zero idea if this is real or nothing, but something has been off in the clubhouse since may.

shecky noted marte has been a different guy this year and marte gave a weird interview right around that same time, maybe he turned into a negative when his game diminished rapidly? who knows.

last year was all positive vibes this was just a year where everything went entirely the opposite way.
I'm  
DanMetroMan : 8/15/2023 11:36 am : link
not even "defending" Lindor and the car stuff but if Jeff McNeil is letting that get to him to the point it's impacting his play because Francisco Lindor is making X and he's "only" guaranteed 50 million from 2023-2027, then he wouldn't really be the person/player I thought he was. This isn't a guy making the minimum. This is a guy who will have made 11.3 million through this season with at MINIMUM 42 million coming his way. He's very much set.
RE: I'm  
Eric on Li : 8/15/2023 11:54 am : link
In comment 16173378 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
not even "defending" Lindor and the car stuff but if Jeff McNeil is letting that get to him to the point it's impacting his play because Francisco Lindor is making X and he's "only" guaranteed 50 million from 2023-2027, then he wouldn't really be the person/player I thought he was. This isn't a guy making the minimum. This is a guy who will have made 11.3 million through this season with at MINIMUM 42 million coming his way. He's very much set.


we are talking about 2 guys that fought in the dugout 2 years ago over field positioning.

yes it would be great if everyone had 0 emotions and just did their job but thats not how things go at any workplace but especially pro sports. geno smith got his jaw broken for not paying a guy back $600.

i have no idea if lindor or mcneil were problems this year and im not making an excuse for anyone on the team if they allowed anything to be a distraction whether this, or alonso and his contract, or marte and his injuries, or whoever. but it appeared something was a distraction to have so many players underperform at once.
Not  
DanMetroMan : 8/15/2023 12:11 pm : link
interested in a big back and forth on a theory but I'm guessing McNeil's teammates would be pretty upset with him vs, blaming Lindor if they felt his harboring of ill will against Lindor was the catalyst for his 89 OPS+ and career worst in almost every possible batted ball category.
I would try and do with McNeil and Marte what was done with  
Optimus-NY : 8/15/2023 12:29 pm : link
Scherzer and Verlander this past trade deadline. Deal those two away at peak value next trade deadline regardless of how the team is doing and recoup more top shelf prospects by paying teams of to take those two guys away. It'll clear the deck in more ways than one. Deal Quintana next trade deadline too for that matter, but for a different reason (he seems like a team guy FWIW, unlike McNeil and Marte).
the odds marte has any value ever again are small, no less peak  
Eric on Li : 8/15/2023 12:34 pm : link
he's about to turn 35 and seems to be rapidly deteriorating. they may need to pay someone to just take him away like mccann.

mcneil is now hitting .280 with a 107 rc in the 2nd half, he's not that expensive and plays a bunch of positions so he's movable but when they just extended him you would think it's because they want to keep him. he wasn't a free agent he was a known quantity they didnt need to extend.

id be surprised if the lindor/mcneil thing is the problem. i think it's one of many strange things in the clubhouse this year that just wasnt handled well. some by players some by org.
McNeil  
DanMetroMan : 8/15/2023 12:36 pm : link
probably bounces back in 2024 and the fact he can play 3 positions at a high level (at a relatively low price) makes him an appealing piece for the Mets. Marte unfortunately could in fact be done. You would hope not but he's a former PED guy at an age where MANY players break down.
Peak value was thw wrong word to use for Marte, lol.  
Optimus-NY : 8/15/2023 12:43 pm : link
IF he can at least stay healthy and play well, they would be wise to get what they can for him. Contenders tend to over pay. With Cohen's money, they'd do what they did a couple of weeks ago and pay off as much of the contract as they could to draw a decent return back. Eric's spot on: Starling will never be the dynamic player he once was.

DMM is right about Jeff's versatility and relatively low salary. I'm just concerned about these rumors with him being difficult. None of these vets should be sacred cows though at this point. I think these remaining players all saw that, especially Pete.
its impossible to tell what rumors are real and which arent off field  
Eric on Li : 8/15/2023 12:54 pm : link
at least right now. i think we can probably guess that alonso has had big, possibly unreasonable demands for the extension - but he's delivered this year as usually does. as has lindor, who has said all the right things post-deadline and all year.

we can obviously see that marte has had a very strange year both with injuries and performance.

the way scherzer is pitching now maybe we can say that there was an adjustment period to the pitch clock impacting him earlier in the year. in his last 6 starts he's 4-1 with a 2.25 era. he's 12-4 with a 3.67 era on the season and he's 1 start away from making the same number he made last year. so that demise was overrated (not saying the trade was mistake).

other stuff like mcneil's fall off and like those pop ups nimmo has dropped all year is hard to explain, and may just be the types of things that happen when players press because things are going bad.
McNeil just seems like a malcontent to me.  
CooperDash : 8/15/2023 1:51 pm : link
He’s slap, singles hitter and a damn good one. However, he wants the prestige and pay of being a HR hitter like his buddy Alonso. This was confirmed in 2021 when he admittedly tried to be a HR hitter that year and his stats greatly suffered. Then went back to his roots in 2022 and was the batting champion. He’s clearly trying to hit for more power this year and that’s probably a big reason why his stats are suffering again. Not sure if that’s a McNeil thing or a new hitting thing. But he’s already proven to be a selfish hitter.

He’s the only teammate to have an issue with Lindor - reportedly because of a power struggle between the star shortstop and the second baseman.

I’ll never forget McNeil holding the wrestling championship belt that they give to the player of the game - in a game that the new rookie Brett Baty clearly won for the team single handed.

And I’ve never see a player have more tantrums after striking out or grounding out. This guy throws more bats and helmets because he just can’t get it done.

It’s exhausting and a shitty tone to set for the clubhouse and the younger players. I’ve said it for a while - McNeil is likely problem #1 in the Mets clubhouse. Either have him shape up or ship him out.
if that's the case they didnt need to extend him  
Eric on Li : 8/15/2023 2:11 pm : link
8 months ago he was a model of what they were looking for.

Quote:
Similarly, Eppler wanted explore retaining who he considered to be the model “Dirtbag.” There are club officials remaining with the Mets who, like Eppler, have long admired how McNeil seems to always make contact, how he obsesses over winning, and how he plays so hard. Drew Toussaint, the former amateur scout who recommended McNeil in 2013, earned a recent promotion as the Mets’ amateur scouting director. He was in attendance at McNeil’s news conference.


i think this was just (another) really disappointing year because as an organization they are trying to move faster then they are capable of and there's no 1 single person responsible for why it went the way it did. though i do think a manager with a reputation of running a good clubhouse and fundamental soundness deserves some time under the microscope.
How Jeff McNeil’s path to an extension with the Mets began with a simple dinner - ( New Window )
RE: if that's the case they didnt need to extend him  
CooperDash : 8/15/2023 2:30 pm : link
In comment 16173602 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
8 months ago he was a model of what they were looking for.



Quote:


Similarly, Eppler wanted explore retaining who he considered to be the model “Dirtbag.” There are club officials remaining with the Mets who, like Eppler, have long admired how McNeil seems to always make contact, how he obsesses over winning, and how he plays so hard. Drew Toussaint, the former amateur scout who recommended McNeil in 2013, earned a recent promotion as the Mets’ amateur scouting director. He was in attendance at McNeil’s news conference.



i think this was just (another) really disappointing year because as an organization they are trying to move faster then they are capable of and there's no 1 single person responsible for why it went the way it did. though i do think a manager with a reputation of running a good clubhouse and fundamental soundness deserves some time under the microscope. How Jeff McNeil’s path to an extension with the Mets began with a simple dinner - ( New Window )


So, just another in a long line of horrible Eppler moves or philosophies?

Either way, you can obssess over winning/play hard without acting like a petulant child all the time when it doesn’t work out. Most players are able to do it.
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