Outside Linebacker Kayvon Thibodeaux
Q: What's been your take on what's been going on defensively?
A: I mean, it's still early. But when you talk about—we've given up a little bit too much. We obviously want greatness, and we strive for the best. I don't think as a defense as a whole we've been playing to the standard we seek for ourselves.
Q: Can you walk off the field from that game at least feeling like, 'Hey, the defense we think we can be showed up for at least the last quarter?' Were the situations also more manageable because it's a close game at that point?
A: You mean after the game?
Q: Yes.
A: I think you're always happy as a defense when you can contribute to a win, obviously. We were able to get three kills at the end of that game, or three stops at the end of the game. We call it a kill. But once we did that, it did breed a little more confidence in us that we can execute at a high level.
Q: You didn't have a tackle in that game. What do you make of that?
A: Did you guys watch the game?
Q: Yeah…
A: So, if you watch the game, they—it's all scheme. Once (outside linebacker) Azeez (Ojulari) kind of got hurt, you understand that you're kind of left in a situation of being on the back side. So, I was on the backside a lot of those plays. Granted, they were getting the ball out quick and once you kind of go down in a football game, they don't really run plays. They're not trying to win the game with the plays that they're running, right? So, it's a lot of just short runs. A lot of other guys were making plays, so for me, it's really not about the stat line, especially in the game of football. I think football is probably the only sport where you can contribute to a game without having any stats. So, when you go back and watch that tape, a lot of the balls were ran to the other side. Even with them doing that, towards the end of the game, when they did start to run my way, it was about setting the edge. It was about kind of doing my part. I know teammates before previously have talked about just being able to handle your job. My main job is to set the edge and to make the runs go back inside so that my linebackers and other players can fill gaps. So, just being able to contribute to a win felt pretty good.
Q: How would you assess your pass-rush productivity in the first two weeks?
A: The first two weeks, again, when you start to really break down football, when you go down, I think in the first game, teammates talk about situations, in the first game, we didn't get on the field until it was about 14-0 or 16-0. So, looking at that, teams aren't looking to drive the ball down the field. They're looking to run the ball. And when you don't stop the run, you don't really have any room to pass rush. So, I think when you look at us as a team, we haven't been able to get those numbers because we haven't really buckled down on what we need to do as far as handling situations and stopping the run.
Q: You're asked to drop in coverage more in this defense than edge rushers are in other defenses, and everyone judges you by sacks. How have you accepted that? How do you feel about that?
A: I mean, there are a lot of social media GMs. There are a lot of people who want the game and want to coach, and they want to create narratives. But as long as I stick to the game plan, and my coaches and my team are happy with what I'm able to do, whether it be drop back, whether it be hold the edge, whatever it may be – I'm just happy to contribute.
Q: There was a video posted of you sitting alone on the bench, while a lot of the rest of the team was celebrating. I'm not insinuating anything, I'm just giving you a chance to respond.
A: What part of the game was that?
Q: I think it was at the end after the field goal. It looks like it in the video.
A: After the field goal, so that was the last play…I think when you play this game, you start to realize, and I'm only answering it like this because I know that there's videos and there's always narratives put out, but when you're in a situation where the fate of the game lands on one drive or one situation, and you're kind of those people, right? The defense are the guys who are looked to to answer that. The only person I look to is God, right? So, I'm sitting in that moment, and I'm praying, and I'm kind of, I guess you would say meditating and visualizing what we're going to do as a team to go out there. For me, it's kind of like there are too many people that wake up and want to put negativity out there. For us to come back and win a game, it's nothing but positive. For a defense, everybody just wants to be able to make that play when the time does come. I think it's more of a visualization and a meditation thing that, hopefully I don't ever have to answer something like that in the future.
Q: (Defensive lineman) Leo(nard Williams) said that as a group, you have to stop worrying about these numbers, the sacks, the takeaways, and just do your job, because that's something people are asking about. How important is it to not listen to that?
A: The thing is, every fan just wants to be a part of a winning team, right? So even early in that game, our own fans are booing us. They're giving up on us. And then as soon as we start to win, now, everybody's cheering and everybody's excited. Everybody wants to get a jersey signed and this and that. It's a tough situation, but when you start to realize that the only people that matter are the people in the room and the only people who are really here for us, is us. As long as we continue to focus on that and continue to control the narrative and keep pushing forward, we'll be alright.
Q: Is a fast start vital for this game given the opposition, especially if you let them get out to a big lead?
A: Definitely. I mean, football, it's all about complimentary football. As a team, we've been trying to work on that, and starting fast is everything, whether it's defense going out there getting a three-and-out or it's offense going out there and putting some points up. We definitely just want to do our 1-11 and go out there and execute.
Q: Has your confidence waned at all individually?
A: No. I'm excited. We've got a big matchup this weekend. Every game is a big game. So, being that this is the next one, I feel like the team is primed. We've been consistently making gains and I feel like it's going to be definitely a good matchup.
Q: What do you see in (49ers quarterback Brock) Purdy?
A: He's a great quarterback. I actually played him way back when when he was in college in a bowl game. He's the same guy. He's obviously gotten better, but when you talk about his poise, when you talk about him just being able to deliver the ball and he doesn't really get off balance. He likes to really focus in, and he knows where to get the ball.
Q: And he had that back then?
A: Yeah. It was hard for us to get him. He was able to deliver it and put it on the money.
Some folks have talked themselves into thinking Evan Neal can be a stud RT just given the time.
Do the players need to be better? Absolutely. But I have a feeling the major problem is Wink.
Leo could be playing like a man who's out the door in a few months, A'Shawn hasn't gotten it going yet and could well be a stopgap signing. Need more on the DL, ILB opposite Okereke, and they need a stud at Edge.
No Ints
No Fumbles recovered
6th worst defense in yards/play
13th worst defense in pressure %
Leo could be playing like a man who's out the door in a few months, A'Shawn hasn't gotten it going yet and could well be a stopgap signing. Need more on the DL, ILB opposite Okereke, and they need a stud at Edge.
I suppose I had higher hopes for this current defense. Sounds like we're about 6 players away from realizing our true potential.
But, other than Leo (who's going to be a hole to backfill) and A'Shawn the DL are journeyman, there's a big hole next to Okereke, and AO is probably not a core piece for NYG.
Significant holes, and then you have to try and plan for players who might not fit the plan, or leave via UFA, etc.
But I also see on some plays either indecisiveness or lack of "crazed dog" effort. I forget exactly what part of the game, but there was a play where KT ended up directly in front of Dobbs, only about 2 yds from him, with absolutely no one between them. KT stopped for about a second, which was enough for Dobbs to get rid of the ball.
I don't know for sure, but it seems a "crazed dog" wouldn't have hesitated with such an open path to the QB.
Maybe KT is still thinking too much, IDK. I'm going to be patient, but hope something changes soon.
LEt shit play the fuck out before we condemn a player. If they didn't hold up in the 4th quarter i'd be killing the D as much as anyone, even if it would be premature only 2 weeks in. But they did hold up. Doesn't mean the D holds up all season long. Doesn't mean Thibs will be fine. But fucking come on already. It's 2 games. 1-1. Got it done late in week 2 but people NEED to get their knives out. GET A FUCKING GRIP.
But, other than Leo (who's going to be a hole to backfill) and A'Shawn the DL are journeyman, there's a big hole next to Okereke, and AO is probably not a core piece for NYG.
Significant holes, and then you have to try and plan for players who might not fit the plan, or leave via UFA, etc.
Everyone calm the hell down.
Everyone calm the hell down.
It is the media world we live in now. Last week we had several posts questioning if Daboll and Schoen were over their heads, with comparisons to McAdoo, Judge, etc. Now I see posters praising Daboll for (supposedly) taking over play calling. Over the offseason people were worried about Kafka getting an HC gig. Now some are saying they don't trust Kafka to scheme appropriately.
This week it is Kayvon's turn.
The entire defense has had a rough start to the year. The offense ineptitude didn't help, especially for edge rushers to accumulate stats against QB dropbacks.
We should save our worries for/if the game scripts are favorable for QB pressure and he is still putting up duds.
Emphasis added by me.
I have no problem with flipping out during and right after a game. Where the fuck if the clarity and logic? It's Wednesday. Who the hell puts a player on blast two weeks into a season? Especially when the D did its job down the stretch of week 2?
No one can tell me otherwise. Some of you like to be mad. You need to complain about a player.
But I also see on some plays either indecisiveness or lack of "crazed dog" effort. I forget exactly what part of the game, but there was a play where KT ended up directly in front of Dobbs, only about 2 yds from him, with absolutely no one between them. KT stopped for about a second, which was enough for Dobbs to get rid of the ball.
I don't know for sure, but it seems a "crazed dog" wouldn't have hesitated with such an open path to the QB.
Maybe KT is still thinking too much, IDK. I'm going to be patient, but hope something changes soon.
There is the possibility that the staff looks at KT and sees a much more limited player than they imagined. So, his responsibilities have been reduced.
Posters can keep complaining that other posters don't know anything about football to criticize KT, but they can't run away from these words from Sy:
BTW, how many penalties did the Cardinals have on their last couple of drives? At least three, right?
No one can tell me otherwise. Some of you like to be mad. You need to complain about a player.
I don't buy this. I think it's perfectly reasonable to wonder why the 5th pick in the draft looks like a JAG so far.
Personally, I'd like to think if KT was this great pass rusher that Wink would adjust his D to optimize that.
BTW, how many penalties did the Cardinals have on their last couple of drives? At least three, right?
I believe an illegal block by WR Brown near end of 3rd Q and 3 false starts in the 4th Q.
The D has very little to brag about. Without 4 drive killing penalties by the cards, we might be 0-2.
It's possible this D will also jell and turn into a great D at some point, but it's not crazy to be a little concerned right now (imo).
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In comment 16213332 Thunderstruck27 said:
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He mentions fans booing in the first half...did you think they would cheer after going down 20 points to the Arizona Cardinals and Josh Dobbs?
I'm done waiting for this guy.
Detroit didn't have to wait 1 game for Hutchinson to show up, let alone 1 season.
The Giants made the playoffs last year because of KT's game against the Commanders.
So that’s the contribution? We look to that game over an entire rookie contract and say thanks?
Please tell me you expect more.
There is nothing wrong with debating WHY the defense, including KT, is not playing well.
But there are now regular posts on BBI and on social media making slanderous statements about desire.
Nothing we know about KT since he's been here raises any sort of red flag about desire. In fact, the opposite has been true. All the coaches and teammates have praised him in that department. He actually does extra work in camp that others don't do.
Yet here we are. It's makes our fanbase look stupid.
No Ints
No Fumbles recovered
6th worst defense in yards/play
13th worst defense in pressure %
Who gives a shit? The team won and turned things around in the second half. Stats mean nothing if we’re losing and even less if we’re winning. Nobody loses 40 - 0 and says “Oh but at least Kayvon got 12 pressures and 4 hits”
Also…. It’s two games. Way too much football left to be looking at stats as a gauge.
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No Sacks
No Ints
No Fumbles recovered
6th worst defense in yards/play
13th worst defense in pressure %
Who gives a shit? The team won and turned things around in the second half. Stats mean nothing if we’re losing and even less if we’re winning. Nobody loses 40 - 0 and says “Oh but at least Kayvon got 12 pressures and 4 hits”
Also…. It’s two games. Way too much football left to be looking at stats as a gauge.
Maybe if Kayvon got 12 pressures and 4 hits then the Giants wouldn't have lost 40-0.
Yes it's 2 games. Should we only read and discuss things on the BBI site after 8 games?...17 games? Let us know what makes sense but please think before commenting as well.
But I also see on some plays either indecisiveness or lack of "crazed dog" effort. I forget exactly what part of the game, but there was a play where KT ended up directly in front of Dobbs, only about 2 yds from him, with absolutely no one between them. KT stopped for about a second, which was enough for Dobbs to get rid of the ball.
I don't know for sure, but it seems a "crazed dog" wouldn't have hesitated with such an open path to the QB.
Maybe KT is still thinking too much, IDK. I'm going to be patient, but hope something changes soon.
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In comment 16213482 ThomasG said:
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No Sacks
No Ints
No Fumbles recovered
6th worst defense in yards/play
13th worst defense in pressure %
Who gives a shit? The team won and turned things around in the second half. Stats mean nothing if we’re losing and even less if we’re winning. Nobody loses 40 - 0 and says “Oh but at least Kayvon got 12 pressures and 4 hits”
Also…. It’s two games. Way too much football left to be looking at stats as a gauge.
Maybe if Kayvon got 12 pressures and 4 hits then the Giants wouldn't have lost 40-0.
Yes it's 2 games. Should we only read and discuss things on the BBI site after 8 games?...17 games? Let us know what makes sense but please think before commenting as well.
Let me make sure I understand this. If KT gets three sacks tomorrow, can we assume you won't be here applauding the three sacks?
You don't find it at all curious that a linebacker/edge plays an entire game with no tackles?
And I assure you, the coaches are very concerned about those stats and will try to do things to turn them around. They are very meaningful.
There is nothing wrong with debating WHY the defense, including KT, is not playing well.
But there are now regular posts on BBI and on social media making slanderous statements about desire.
Nothing we know about KT since he's been here raises any sort of red flag about desire. In fact, the opposite has been true. All the coaches and teammates have praised him in that department. He actually does extra work in camp that others don't do.
Yet here we are. It's makes our fanbase look stupid.
Yep
Same thing with Thibodeax now.
Also, he was a beast at Minnesota too and was being held on nearly every drive.
Also, he was a beast at Minnesota too and was being held on nearly every drive.
So what's holding him back now?
They had barely stepped on the field against Dallas before it was 20-0. Cowboys pretty much went conservative the rest of the way.
The first 20 snaps against Arizona, he wasn't involved in a pass rush. He held contain, and in the second half and especially 4th Q when they tried to run his way, most of the time he shut it down.
It sucks that he's not filling up the stat sheet with pressures and sacks through a whole 2 games of a season. But he really hasn't had the opportunities yet. Not trying to drum up some empty excuses here.
The guy had 40 pressures in 14 games as a rookie. It's not like he all of a sudden forgot how to rush.
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The point is that he is doing what he is being asked to do and stats don’t mean a damn thing in the end.
Let me make sure I understand this. If KT gets three sacks tomorrow, can we assume you won't be here applauding the three sacks?
You don't find it at all curious that a linebacker/edge plays an entire game with no tackles?
BTW, how many penalties did the Cardinals have on their last couple of drives? At least three, right?
The hot takes are beyond the pale though, grasping at the weirdest things.
I don't see the rationale of making the fans the villain when you are invisible for 2 games.
Let's not act like he isn't missing plays either. He is tentative and hesitant when coming around the edge. If you watched Baldy's breakdown he highlights one such play where Connor runs right past KT.
Sure...he had a couple good games last year. But this year he is scaring nobody. Teams should be scheming against him, not ignoring him.
Fair enough. To each their own. But I think your view is a bit naive.
I find stats to be a great way to get insight about the outcome of a game and season - from players to the team. Should a team just pay players based on wins or loses? Or should stats be applied to determine value versus cost?
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to answer your first question, if we lost, I wouldn’t care about the sack total. Stats are fun and interesting to me but only in the moment. Once the game is over, all I care about is the W or the L. I also care about stats when it comes to fantasy football. Because stats literally contribute to a W or and L in Fantasy. If a player goes bonkers and has an incredible game, am I gonna celebrate it? Sure! But I don’t see it as that effort being what won the game. Very few players… generational players… can take over a game completely. LT is the pinnacle. Question 2: If a player has a bad game, am I going to wonder what happened? You betcha. But I’m also going to take game flow into account. I’m not just gonna sit on my couch and snipe the guy I was celebrating just a year ago. What y’all are lacking in nuance. It’s like a player is elite or he’s shit and it doesn’t matter if he was elite last week if he was shit this week. It’s a weak way of looking at things.
Fair enough. To each their own. But I think your view is a bit naive.
I find stats to be a great way to get insight about the outcome of a game and season - from players to the team. Should a team just pay players based on wins or loses? Or should stats be applied to determine value versus cost?
I don't see the rationale of making the fans the villain when you are invisible for 2 games.
Let's not act like he isn't missing plays either. He is tentative and hesitant when coming around the edge. If you watched Baldy's breakdown he highlights one such play where Connor runs right past KT.
Sure...he had a couple good games last year. But this year he is scaring nobody. Teams should be scheming against him, not ignoring him.
What is the purpose of making things up about a player? Offenses certainly do not ignore Thibodeaux. Think about how you feel when fans make up something about Jones in an attempt to criticize him.
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They were in Arizona for Christs sake.
I don't see the rationale of making the fans the villain when you are invisible for 2 games.
Let's not act like he isn't missing plays either. He is tentative and hesitant when coming around the edge. If you watched Baldy's breakdown he highlights one such play where Connor runs right past KT.
Sure...he had a couple good games last year. But this year he is scaring nobody. Teams should be scheming against him, not ignoring him.
What is the purpose of making things up about a player? Offenses certainly do not ignore Thibodeaux. Think about how you feel when fans make up something about Jones in an attempt to criticize him.
Nah. They ignore him. Only reason he got a sack tonight. It was the one play where they didn't toss them aside like a toddler.