Cornerback play... is it time to reconsider the experiment?

CB is one of the hardest positions to get a fast start on for a rookie. I expect both Banks and Hawkins to improve consistently throughout the season.

Second guessing whether we should be called the Giants.

I think they made this decision based on the next few years. Adoree may not be in the long term plans. Let the rookies play.

In comment 16217339 BillT said:

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Second guessing whether we should be called the Giants.

Bill, honestly, I don't know what's next. Are we ok with the status quo? Dabs and staff have not hesitated to make changes in the past when things weren't going well.

Hawkins had played 47 coverage snaps, targeted 3 times, allowed 1 reception for 19 yards and had one pass break up.

I am not sure about the exact details from last night, but it seems like you are expecting Revis in his prime when he is a 6th rounder and day 1 starter playing his third professional game against a Super Bowl contender.

Seen much bad coverage out of the rookies. Adoree doesn't look any better out there. The tackling on the other hand has been horrendous.

Our highly paid and highly drafted DL gets run on like cake all game. LBs routinely give him double digit gains on 3rd and long to obvious screen calls (secondary does share some blame here too to be fair).

In comment 16217360 Mike in ramapo college said:

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Hawkins had played 47 coverage snaps, targeted 3 times, allowed 1 reception for 19 yards and had one pass break up. I am not sure about the exact details from last night, but it seems like you are expecting Revis in his prime when he is a 6th rounder and day 1 starter playing his third professional game against a Super Bowl contender.

Per Pro Football Reference, Hawkins has a passer rating against of 145.1 through three games.

Is not got in the slot. His tackling is a huge liability out there. Holmes is grabby, but his tackling is solid. I think you Jackson, Banks, and Holmes as the nickel should be the starters. I think you bring in Hawkins to spell Banks and Jackson on occasions.

In comment 16217339 BillT said:

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Second guessing whether we should be called the Giants.

Thats' an easy one.

I think they have played pretty well in coverage. Where they have erred is in run support which they both looked poor. From the coverage standpoing, I feel much better going up against Dolphins and Seahawks than I would've last year.

Aaron Robinson hopefully comes back by midseason and if we are healthy, that would pose an interesting question (put him as a nickle, keep Jackson on the outside) if one is struggling. For now, I'd much rather see those guys make a mistake than Holmes just grab people.

must have whiffed 3 or 4 times last night

In comment 16217374 JoeyBigBlue said:

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Is not got in the slot. His tackling is a huge liability out there. Holmes is grabby, but his tackling is solid. I think you Jackson, Banks, and Holmes as the nickel should be the starters. I think you bring in Hawkins to spell Banks and Jackson on occasions.

Agree. Holmes has his problems, but he was definitely a physical presence last night.

everyone knew that was going to be the case. I actually think the future is bright at corner for the Giants, after watching those guys.

In comment 16217369 KingBlue said:

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In comment 16217360 Mike in ramapo college said: Quote: Hawkins had played 47 coverage snaps, targeted 3 times, allowed 1 reception for 19 yards and had one pass break up. I am not sure about the exact details from last night, but it seems like you are expecting Revis in his prime when he is a 6th rounder and day 1 starter playing his third professional game against a Super Bowl contender. Per Pro Football Reference, Hawkins has a passer rating against of 145.1 through three games.

ok, so last night he allowed 3 catches on 3 targets for 38 yds and a TD, while playing 56 snaps (not sure how many coverage snaps)....you think that it is time to pull the plug?

Adoree has left a lot to be desired. Especially as the vet.

he also seems to making a lot of business decisions out there

In comment 16217411 Mike in ramapo college said:

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In comment 16217369 KingBlue said: Quote: In comment 16217360 Mike in ramapo college said: Quote: Hawkins had played 47 coverage snaps, targeted 3 times, allowed 1 reception for 19 yards and had one pass break up. I am not sure about the exact details from last night, but it seems like you are expecting Revis in his prime when he is a 6th rounder and day 1 starter playing his third professional game against a Super Bowl contender. Per Pro Football Reference, Hawkins has a passer rating against of 145.1 through three games. ok, so last night he allowed 3 catches on 3 targets for 38 yds and a TD, while playing 56 snaps (not sure how many coverage snaps)....you think that it is time to pull the plug?

No Mike. I'm just bringing it up for discussion. As others have stated, our defense has disappointed. We know that Adoree has had success on the outside, we know that Holmes has played reasonably well in the nickel.

is WRAP up and tackle.

I saw McKinney continue to wave at the football rather than try to wrap up, Banks and Hawkins throw weak shoulders that deflected off the SF ballcarriers, KT-5 and others blowing off contact and not rallying to the football. Awful finishers, no alpha present. Looks to be alot of freelancing out there from Simmons and Pinnock, and the former still has weak instincts.

Adoree and Leo both know what's up, they're elsewhere in '24.

Should be benched for his tackling alone. He completely whiffed on multiple plays that resulted in +10 yard gains. I mean head down, eating turf, and not even touching the runner. I’m just not impressed as some others.

I completely agree on Jackson making business decisions. Last year he seemed bigger and was actually impressed with his physicality earlier in the year. This year he’s almost trying to avoid contact. Frustrating.

The defense as a whole unit just doesn’t have that streak you look for for physical play. Not to this point anyways. Maybe a switch will flip, but right now it’s too much laughing, and not enough physicality.

In comment 16217447 JonC said:

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is WRAP up and tackle. I saw McKinney continue to wave at the football rather than try to wrap up, Banks and Hawkins throw weak shoulders that deflected off the SF ballcarriers, KT-5 and others blowing off contact and not rallying to the football. Awful finishers, no alpha present. Looks to be alot of freelancing out there from Simmons and Pinnock, and the former still has weak instincts. Adoree and Leo both know what's up, they're elsewhere in '24.

One of the better analysits (not on this game) mentioned that college players no longer wrap up but go for the shoulder hit, and have to be coached up to tackle at this level.

Good that we have 2 weeks for a secondary tackling clinic. Not sure what X's deal is....

That man had perfect tackling form.

Giants are not going to the Super Bowl.

Why would you want to delay the development of the young players?

Play them now.

In comment 16217513 Eric from BBI said:

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Giants are not going to the Super Bowl. Why would you want to delay the development of the young players? Play them now.

Eric... Please stop

Cornerback play has been the least of our problems this year.

But NFL cornerbacks are created by fire.

It is an investment in the future.

We have corners with speed and length.

Patience.

Before the season but when they happen they are surprised by it.
This is a very tough early schedule and it's trial by fire right now hopefully it makes them better long term ..
I know this is crazy though but let's see how the season finishes up before we start cutting everyone.

In comment 16217616 larryflower37 said:

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Before the season but when they happen they are surprised by it. This is a very tough early schedule and it's trial by fire right now hopefully it makes them better long term .. I know this is crazy though but let's see how the season finishes up before we start cutting everyone.

It is what it is. This is sports and these are fans. 10% are logical, the other 90% want to fire everyone, bench every player, question every single player move and draft selection, EVERYTHING...after EVERY SINGLE LOSS. Player development...no time for that. Win now or else! If fans ran sports teams there wouldnt be a job on the face of the earth with less job security.

In comment 16217339 BillT said:

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Second guessing whether we should be called the Giants.

How about the “Tacklers”

In comment 16217616 larryflower37 said:

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Before the season but when they happen they are surprised by it. This is a very tough early schedule and it's trial by fire right now hopefully it makes them better long term .. I know this is crazy though but let's see how the season finishes up before we start cutting everyone.

Growing pains were and are expected. Showing up for 3 weeks and not even having the basics of football we’re not. They are unorganized and under prepared to this point.

I think we will see dramatic improvement as the year goes on, with more playing time, and more tape available for our coaches to analyze. But to this point they have been coached poorly.

In comment 16217471 HBart said:

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In comment 16217447 JonC said: Quote: is WRAP up and tackle. I saw McKinney continue to wave at the football rather than try to wrap up, Banks and Hawkins throw weak shoulders that deflected off the SF ballcarriers, KT-5 and others blowing off contact and not rallying to the football. Awful finishers, no alpha present. Looks to be alot of freelancing out there from Simmons and Pinnock, and the former still has weak instincts. Adoree and Leo both know what's up, they're elsewhere in '24. One of the better analysits (not on this game) mentioned that college players no longer wrap up but go for the shoulder hit, and have to be coached up to tackle at this level. Good that we have 2 weeks for a secondary tackling clinic. Not sure what X's deal is....

I think his hand is one issue.

He has never shown special abilities but he's talked about like an All Pro player.

He's been OK here, nothing great. I'm talking the entire body of work.

But the defense is better with him in there.

In comment 16217712 mittenedman said:

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He has never shown special abilities but he's talked about like an All Pro player. He's been OK here, nothing great. I'm talking the entire body of work.

McKinney had a very good rookie season and the sky appeared to be the limit. It appears to me like the injury last year has taken some of his ability away. Maybe more mental right now?!

Looked flat-footed, slow and timid last night. McKinney has not played like a guy that has any interest in being re-signed to a large contract. The spotlight has been on him numerous times already and, outside of one or two plays, he has failed to rise to the occasion. He got trucked by Josh Dobbs, and too often goes for half-hearted forced fumble attempts. He's starting to seem more and more like a solid-to-good-but-not-great longterm player.

And a bargain compared to what Adoree is being paid.

Banks and Adoree’ on the outside and Holmes back in the slot. Hawkins simply is not ready for prime time because of horrid tackling and penalties.

In comment 16220082 GoBigBlue16to56 said:

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Banks and Adoree’ on the outside and Holmes back in the slot. Hawkins simply is not ready for prime time because of horrid tackling and penalties.

I agree with this from my couch but I don’t get paid to make these decisions or claim to know better than this coaching staff. Not that you do, just saying for me I’ll defer to the guys who get paid to see and know more than me.

From what I’ve seen in games I like this alignment the best. I prefer to have guys in their best positions to succeed and I think Adoree is best on the outside. Holmes gets a lot of hate but he always seems to be around the ball and not afraid to make some tackles.

In comment 16217577 Larry in Pencilvania said:

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In comment 16217513 Eric from BBI said: Quote: Giants are not going to the Super Bowl. Why would you want to delay the development of the young players? Play them now. Eric... Please stop

Eric, please continue