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| Quote: |
| But they are a long way away from any final decision, and the source acknowledged it might be premature for them to completely give up on Jones after watching him in just six starts this season — including three without running back Saquon Barkley, four without left tackle Andrew Thomas, and behind a disastrous offensive line that got him sacked a ridiculous 30 times. |
Back so soon after your comment on Ray's thread this morning?
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Coming out.
On one hand it's a relief that it's not real if the fans don't want it to be. On the other hand, John Mara believes this is a completely normal way to run your NFL franchise.
It's cool that fans basically get to dictate what the Giants do because Mara lives in fear of an uprising.
But then I'm reminded of how fucking dense most football fans are, and the only way to succeed is probably to dare that uprising to occur when necessary.
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In comment 16287848 robbieballs2003 said:
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One thing I will give this regime, they use the media to their advantage. Look at the information our beats get. It's straight bullshit. Remember after we traded William and the narrative was there was a l9t of interest in the Giants roster? What happened? Nothing. Same with this situation. We all know they are going all in on this QB class. Now they are trying to downplay all the visits they have to colleges by saying they are still in on Jones. This is an attempt to try to deflect what is really happening as to not kill us with something like a trade up to get said QB. It is also to keep Jones' value from plummeting if we decide to trade him.
I think you're giving them too much credit. The last time we saw trial balloons there was no strategic need to mask their intentions. They just didn't know what they wanted to do.
What trial balloon are you referring to? Any GM who feels the need to pole the fans before making a decision doesn't belong in the seat to begin with.
The GM isn't conducting the poll. His boss is.
If Schoen and Daboll want to hook their horse to Jones, good luck with that. And we'll see you on the unemployment line.
If Jones plays amazing, Dre Brees him to another team. If Jones stinks, cut him or demote him to QB2 by mid season or following season.
For me its actually the best QB plan they have had in a decade. Especially since they boggle the Eli Manning replacement plan so poorly.
The Giants aren’t sitting a player they took top 2 on the hope that Jones does something he hasn’t done in 5 years
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In comment 16287855 widmerseyebrow said:
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In comment 16287848 robbieballs2003 said:
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One thing I will give this regime, they use the media to their advantage. Look at the information our beats get. It's straight bullshit. Remember after we traded William and the narrative was there was a l9t of interest in the Giants roster? What happened? Nothing. Same with this situation. We all know they are going all in on this QB class. Now they are trying to downplay all the visits they have to colleges by saying they are still in on Jones. This is an attempt to try to deflect what is really happening as to not kill us with something like a trade up to get said QB. It is also to keep Jones' value from plummeting if we decide to trade him.
I think you're giving them too much credit. The last time we saw trial balloons there was no strategic need to mask their intentions. They just didn't know what they wanted to do.
What trial balloon are you referring to? Any GM who feels the need to pole the fans before making a decision doesn't belong in the seat to begin with.
The GM isn't conducting the poll. His boss is.
1. The QB room now has a #2 overall pick and Daniel Jones at a $47M cap hit
2. Brian Daboll is probably coaching for his job. In such a scenario he might be more comfortable going with the Blue) devil he knows than the one he doesn't.
3. Cutting Jones after the '24 season results in a $22M cap hit in '25
4. They've only gotten 5 games out of Jones in a $160M contract.
This is not an ideal scenario into which to draft a quarterback. Should they do it? Absolutely.
But how easy is it to see them do the calculus and tell themselves they should use this draft to help Daniel and draft his replacement next year if necessary?
I can't stress enough how bad the decision was to pay Jones.
It is what is at that this point. It was a bad decision, but they shouldn’t add to a bad decision. The front office has to draft a QB in a strong QB class. If not everyone in the front office needs to be fired.
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i'll get my popcorn
Back so soon after your comment on Ray's thread this morning?
as usual you are way out of your depth. I was complimenting Ray for being a savant in what he does in playoff and (unfortunately) draft scenarios . *savant means really good at
the reference is to a movie called rain man. the guys name is ray. check it out. good movie
ha ha- you will be happy if true- you can hate and blame and make statements of what should be.. God forbid they draft a guy you actually say and then he doesn't pan out- of course it will be because of management, ownership etc... Malik Willis ring a bell-first round QB right...
If Schoen and Daboll want to hook their horse to Jones, good luck with that. And we'll see you on the unemployment line.
It bears repeating. Thanks, Eric.
Jones was not the prospect Eli was. Not even close. And I think what Eli did is guiding Mara's thinking. Could Jones run Gilbride's complex offense making anticipation throws? Does anyone think that.
This franchise needs hope. It needs a big time prospect at QB. Jones is not the prospect Williams or Maye are.
Most realistic scenario is they simply take the best QB on their board with their first pick.
Jones was not the prospect Eli was. Not even close. And I think what Eli did is guiding Mara's thinking. Could Jones run Gilbride's complex offense making anticipation throws? Does anyone think that.
This franchise needs hope. It needs a big time prospect at QB. Jones is not the prospect Williams or Maye are.
Yup... and there are so many issues here... the injuries... the fact that Jones is at his best on the run and coming off those injuries... the amount of pressure on Jones to perform... his history of not delivering the goods... his history of not being able to stay healthy.
It's time. It didn't work. Move on.
Most realistic scenario is they simply take the best QB on their board with their first pick.
I think that is far from ideal, Eric. The ideal scenario is the Giants have their pick of these QBs, because it is unlikely more than one of them will become elite. More than one may be good or decent, but how often is there more than one elite guy, and if you have the choice, that's the ideal scenario. QB is not a fungible position.
Most realistic scenario is they simply take the best QB on their board with their first pick.
I would say the ideal scenario is taking the QB of their choosing. The guy who is #1 on their board.
Most realistic scenario is they simply take the best QB on their board with their first pick.
Most realistic scenario is they simply take the best QB on their board with their first pick.
The ideal scenario is drafting a QB with their top 2 pick and grabbing WR in the top of the second round. Similar to the Bengals in 2020 with Burrow and Tee Higgins. I love Harrison Jr, but we can’t expect for a good QB to fall into the end of the 1st round.
It doesn't make sense.
What if Daniels is the best QB in this draft? Do you trade back?
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In comment 16287815 dancing blue bear said:
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i'll get my popcorn
Back so soon after your comment on Ray's thread this morning?
as usual you are way out of your depth. I was complimenting Ray for being a savant in what he does in playoff and (unfortunately) draft scenarios . *savant means really good at
the reference is to a movie called rain man. the guys name is ray. check it out. good movie
Oh I got every element of the reference.
But where I come from it's never considered a sincere compliment to compare someone to a movie character portraying a person with Autism.
There are some places where I'm out of my depth. BBI has yet to be one of those places.
LOL!
Well done sir.
That's exactly what I was thinking. Of course they're gonna say they still believe in him.
It doesn't make sense.
What if Daniels is the best QB in this draft? Do you trade back?
Yeah, of course. I mean Mahomes was taken after Trubisky. But the point is you expect the guy you take #1/#2 overall to be a better player than someone you take afterwards. Personally speaking, I think Drake Maye and Caleb Williams are in a class of their own. Daniels is a tier below.
Now, if they think Jayden Daniels is QB1, then trade down a bit (but not too far) and get some more assets. But that's obviously risky as you don't want to lose out on a franchise QB.
Additionally, I expect reports to come out that Jones's latest neck injury is fully healed, and he will not have further risk. His previous neck injury looks better than ever. And he ACL recovery is way ahead of schedule.
So, I brace myself for this announcement on Thursday, April 25, 2024 at 8:15pm:
With the 1st pick in the 2024 NFL draft, the New York Football Giants select...
Marvin Harrison, WR, Ohio State.
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In comment 16287870 UberAlias said:
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In comment 16287855 widmerseyebrow said:
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In comment 16287848 robbieballs2003 said:
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One thing I will give this regime, they use the media to their advantage. Look at the information our beats get. It's straight bullshit. Remember after we traded William and the narrative was there was a l9t of interest in the Giants roster? What happened? Nothing. Same with this situation. We all know they are going all in on this QB class. Now they are trying to downplay all the visits they have to colleges by saying they are still in on Jones. This is an attempt to try to deflect what is really happening as to not kill us with something like a trade up to get said QB. It is also to keep Jones' value from plummeting if we decide to trade him.
I think you're giving them too much credit. The last time we saw trial balloons there was no strategic need to mask their intentions. They just didn't know what they wanted to do.
What trial balloon are you referring to? Any GM who feels the need to pole the fans before making a decision doesn't belong in the seat to begin with.
The GM isn't conducting the poll. His boss is.
And we have this info, how?
The Vacchiano tweet itself is the exact same formula this franchise has relied upon for trial balloons under several GMs, HCs, etc. The only people involved who haven't changed during that time are the owners and Pat Hanlon. And the latter would only conduct the trial at the behest of the former.
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Coming out.
Yessir, like clockwork.
As you know, there are a few levels of Giants trial balloons, each representing how serious the organization is about whatever the topic of discussion may be:
- The friendly reporter (historically this has been Gary Myers, but increasingly Ralph has been in this category too, since leaving the beat and NYDN). Lowest level, a notch above mere speculation.
- The in-house shill, almost always Dottino, especially when it involves a "favorite" Giant.
- Carl Banks. He has free reign to publicly criticize the team through official channels, and usually does so in thoughful, justified manner, which adds to his credibility. But make no mistake, he is often echoing the sentiment of the very top of the organization, and at times, I understand, at express direction to do so.
If this climbs up the trial balloon tree, each successive voice will lend more credence to the notion... so, for our sake I hope it ends here.
But if the Giants think they need to float trial balloons at this point, that's a bit alarming in itself.
I'm just speculating on what ifs ... if they have different views on the QB pecking order.
The one thing I know is this... the NFL graveyard is littered with "sure thing" quarterbacks.
It doesn't make sense.
What if Daniels is the best QB in this draft? Do you trade back?
You can only go by your scouting an analysis. Every selection is a lottery ticket, and none of them are 100% guaranteed. But if you have a deep conviction that Daniels is the #1 guy, you have to take him. You don't get cute, and trade back, because if you think he is #1, there is a strong chance somebody else does too, and you are giving them the opportunity to jump you.
Having worked with several athletes that have torn ACLs, and assuming that Jones does proper rehab the issue isn't going to be his legs. He should be as strong as ever. What people should focus on is his neck--that is the career threatening condition. Its not something that can be easily protected and given the complete ineptitude of the organization in fielding a competent OL, the risk that the Giants could lose Jones to another injury to the neck is great.
I don’t understand what rolling with Jones means at this point. Pure gambling. It may take him 12-15 months to recover.
But if the Giants think they need to float trial balloons at this point, that's a bit alarming in itself.
If it truly is a trial balloon, which is likely is, we are gonna need your daughter to dust off the clown pic and attach the nose and wig to Jones and send it out. If it takes the fans from trying to save this franchise from itself again then so be it.
Could see this coming!! Always floating this crap out there
That's right. They have no reason to diminish the asset. They are unlikely to ever tell us what they really feel if the answer is they are done with him. even when he is off the team, they are unlikely to ever admit how they feel. It isn't in the team's interest or individual members of the front office/ coaching staff.
1. The QB room now has a #2 overall pick and Daniel Jones at a $47M cap hit
2. Brian Daboll is probably coaching for his job. In such a scenario he might be more comfortable going with the Blue) devil he knows than the one he doesn't.
3. Cutting Jones after the '24 season results in a $22M cap hit in '25
4. They've only gotten 5 games out of Jones in a $160M contract.
This is not an ideal scenario into which to draft a quarterback. Should they do it? Absolutely.
But how easy is it to see them do the calculus and tell themselves they should use this draft to help Daniel and draft his replacement next year if necessary?
I can't stress enough how bad the decision was to pay Jones.
I’m a Schoen supporter but you are correct. Massive mistake and a failure to balance the pain of extending Barkley v Jones. But the point is to fail fast and move on.
I want them to trade Jones, even if it means giving away a draft pick. I dont want any more of our cap devoted to this failed project.