Really insightful interview with ESPN Giants beat writer Jordan Raanan. Jordan confirms there is tension between Daboll and Martindale and if he had to bet, he thinks Martindale is gone after the season. He stated that there is a strong difference in coaching style between the two. Daboll is a fiery coach who will yell behind close doors at players but never in the media. Wink is more calm and collected and will not yell at players. Daboll was not happy about Wink’s handling of the McKinney situation, where Wink basically embarrassed McKinney to the media. Ranaan also mentioned that Daboll has put a ton of pressure on Wink, but hasn’t on the other coordinators when it can be argued that Wink has done the best job out of the three.
If true, Good God. Mara’s infatuation with Jones…what is he, a teenage girl circa ‘65 with Paul McCartney?
He stated that he has not heard much grumblings between Daboll and Kafka and Daboll and McGauhey.
If true, Good God. Mara’s infatuation with Jones…what is he, a teenage girl circa ‘65 with Paul McCartney?
Raanan said Mara would not need to be convinced at all if they had a top 2 pick. If they are picking QB at 6, isn't that Jones all over again? Assuming Williams/Maye/Daniels is off the board.
I find it curious - as other have alluded to - that now these guys seem "informed" of what is going on.
Either they didn't know what was going on or they were cowards in not reporting it for fearing negative reaction from the team.
against Dallas
625 yards later and 40 pts with no adjustments Dabol wants to know why, I would too.
Basically, don't draft a "jones" to replace Jones... If we are in that boat, then we run with a low cost Vet for a year and look elsewhere while building the talent up across the board.
There is more than one way to get you where you want to go.
I find it curious - as other have alluded to - that now these guys seem "informed" of what is going on.
Either they didn't know what was going on or they were cowards in not reporting it for fearing negative reaction from the team.
Keep in mind, Glazer has Strahan and Strahan has ears in the locekroom. I suspect this "development" of tension became more out there from something said to Glazer. Doesn't mean it is 100% correct (like there is big fire behind closed doors) but certainly seems accurate that they have different styles.
Overall, Wink fizzled out in Baltimore and quite frankly his side of the ball has been far more healthy than the offensive side and still hasn't performed great.
People here have knocked the Giants winning games against bad teams but the congratulate Wink for his defense against the very same bad teams.
The Giants defense let Seattle score a VERY easy late first half TD that really killed any momentum we had. They let a VERY easy TD be scored by the Jets that really gave the Jets their only hope of staying in game and then let them off the hook at the end of the game. The Giants defense has been scorched by Dallas, Arizona for a half, Dallas again, the Raiders moved on them, Miami moved on them and one lucky long INT TD really covered up what was a horrible defensive game there and even Washington moved on us a ton in the first game but couldn't score...
I find it curious - as other have alluded to - that now these guys seem "informed" of what is going on.
Either they didn't know what was going on or they were cowards in not reporting it for fearing negative reaction from the team.
This also makes me suspicious of Raanan downplaying Jones' performance this season as a factor in looking to replace the QB and instead emphasizing the injury part. Raanan basically dismissed Jones' struggles and blamed it on the missing Barkley, JMS and Thomas, but we have already had tidbits leaked that many in the Giants building were befuddled by Jones' performance even factoring in the oline.
I would be willing to bet a more comprehensive story will come out on this and the beats *again* will come out and admit they information all alonge.
These guys want to make money and NOT being involved would be straight up negligent in the eyes of business strategy.
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‘convince Mara to move off Jones.’
If true, Good God. Mara’s infatuation with Jones…what is he, a teenage girl circa ‘65 with Paul McCartney?
Raanan said Mara would not need to be convinced at all if they had a top 2 pick. If they are picking QB at 6, isn't that Jones all over again? Assuming Williams/Maye/Daniels is off the board.
school girl reference aside, I agree that you can't fall into the same trap you did before. If your top two or three guys aren't there, move on and grab the BPA.
For the record, X has played the best games of the season (possibly past 2 seasons) after Wink ‘embarrassed’ him.
If our D holds up over the next 5 games, I’d hope there would be better reasons for dismissal than that.
If true, Good God. Mara’s infatuation with Jones…what is he, a teenage girl circa ‘65 with Paul McCartney?
I find it curious - as other have alluded to - that now these guys seem "informed" of what is going on.
Either they didn't know what was going on or they were cowards in not reporting it for fearing negative reaction from the team.
Based on how we’ve seen the media operate in the past, I’d wager they were told not to say anything
against Dallas
625 yards later and 40 pts with no adjustments Dabol wants to know why, I would too.
Your suggestion here is do something outside of your established defense?
What's the adjustment for "they have 3 legit WR and a pro bowl QB, we have rookies starting at CB and two players who can rush the passer"?
Generally speaking, the reporters could have heard the same things as Glazer, but not trusted it or not had it confirmed enough to run with it.
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‘convince Mara to move off Jones.’
If true, Good God. Mara’s infatuation with Jones…what is he, a teenage girl circa ‘65 with Paul McCartney?
Raanan said Mara would not need to be convinced at all if they had a top 2 pick. If they are picking QB at 6, isn't that Jones all over again? Assuming Williams/Maye/Daniels is off the board.
Justin Herbert is a #6 pick.
Daniel Jones was overdrafted, or whatever the expression is.
He hasn't justified going that high.
Actually it's not sad, he owns the damn team and has the right to do whatever he wants with it.
Yep. This isn't monopoly money. Schoen could have just as easily brought both Jones & Barkley back by giving Barkley a contract and franchising Jones. If I'm Mara, I want to know why Schoen chose the path he did.
Schoen knew his boss preferred to bring back both, but as senior vice president/GM of the Giants, he should have done it in a way which was more cost effective.
Schoen now has to go to ownership and sell the idea of another QB not even 5 and a half games into the $81M guaranteed contract that Jones just got.
Easy to just blame Mara, but it is his money.
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‘convince Mara to move off Jones.’
If true, Good God. Mara’s infatuation with Jones…what is he, a teenage girl circa ‘65 with Paul McCartney?
He is writing 80 million worth of checks for Jones. "Convince" might equal "explain wtf you were thinking telling me that is what we should do, and I should write the checks."
They have to spend to the cap, so it all gets spent anyway.
LOL. Of course they are taking a QB if one of the guys they like is there. We all know this.
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And your GM spent 40 mil on a QB and then keep to you wanting to draft one, would you want to be convinced one first? Not that you wouldn’t go along but wouldn’t you want a full explanation and details. That is just business.
Yep. This isn't monopoly money. Schoen could have just as easily brought both Jones & Barkley back by giving Barkley a contract and franchising Jones. If I'm Mara, I want to know why Schoen chose the path he did.
Schoen knew his boss preferred to bring back both, but as senior vice president/GM of the Giants, he should have done it in a way which was more cost effective.
Schoen now has to go to ownership and sell the idea of another QB not even 5 and a half games into the $81M guaranteed contract that Jones just got.
Easy to just blame Mara, but it is his money.
This isn’t hard. It’s a two year deal. He should ask Schoen what the QB plan is now, and going forward. He got injured, twice this year. I think Schoen overpaid by about 20m on the guarantees but the pay scale is what it is and Giants did not have bird in hand or lot of QB options for 2023 and 2024. Garoppolo would have cost a sizable deal even if cheaper (he also is constantly hurt). Carrs contract is even worse.
Dynamics change on a dime. Mara should be thankful it’s not a dumb Watson or Murray like contract.
He’s not going to tell Schoen he’s stuck with Jones or 3 more years. Thats ridiculous. He’s going to say, what is the plan, what do you do if so and so happens or Jones does this. What are the off-ramps in either direction?
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reporter I can recall mentioning any possible tension before the Glazer report was Dan Duggan.
I find it curious - as other have alluded to - that now these guys seem "informed" of what is going on.
Either they didn't know what was going on or they were cowards in not reporting it for fearing negative reaction from the team.
Keep in mind, Glazer has Strahan and Strahan has ears in the locekroom. I suspect this "development" of tension became more out there from something said to Glazer. Doesn't mean it is 100% correct (like there is big fire behind closed doors) but certainly seems accurate that they have different styles.
Overall, Wink fizzled out in Baltimore and quite frankly his side of the ball has been far more healthy than the offensive side and still hasn't performed great.
People here have knocked the Giants winning games against bad teams but the congratulate Wink for his defense against the very same bad teams.
The Giants defense let Seattle score a VERY easy late first half TD that really killed any momentum we had. They let a VERY easy TD be scored by the Jets that really gave the Jets their only hope of staying in game and then let them off the hook at the end of the game. The Giants defense has been scorched by Dallas, Arizona for a half, Dallas again, the Raiders moved on them, Miami moved on them and one lucky long INT TD really covered up what was a horrible defensive game there and even Washington moved on us a ton in the first game but couldn't score...
I 100% agree with this post. Not only has the defense been largely healthy all season, but Martindale had the benefit of a 1st Rd. pick AND every major UFA signing… and the defense was terrible, particularly when playing non-shit QBs. I understand that SF and Dallas have good offenses, but Martindale was non-competitive against them.
Saying he’s “done the best job out of the three” other coordinators is faint freakin praise, considering the incompetence of the special teams, and the injuries on offense.
Not last year. They had Thibodeaux out a number of games. They had to start Ximines and Fox a few if I remember correctly. Then Azeez missed time and both Adoree and Aaron Robinson were missed tons of time. Xavier missed half the season due to the accident.
But John is watching the same games we are and from a very good seat every Sunday. The contract was structured with an "easy" out after 2 years so clearly was written (and signed off on) with an idea of still a "prove it period". DJ then went on to be worse then ever before then succumb to yet another neck injury before tearing his ACL (the ACL mind you of a QB whose main skill to this point has been running).
John may have inherited the Giants but is not an idiot. Any investor would see the "asset" of DJ as holding less value today than was perceived 6 months ago. And sometimes, the right decision is "sell low"....
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‘convince Mara to move off Jones.’
If true, Good God. Mara’s infatuation with Jones…what is he, a teenage girl circa ‘65 with Paul McCartney?
Raanan said Mara would not need to be convinced at all if they had a top 2 pick. If they are picking QB at 6, isn't that Jones all over again? Assuming Williams/Maye/Daniels is off the board.
Yes, even reasonable takes by the owner now become filtered through the lens of Maranoia
It would appear that there are two QBs who are head and shoulders better than the others and would be no brainer selections.
Mara would love one of those players.
If that is the case and then I would not be surprised to see the Giants trade up for either Caleb Williams or Drake Maye.
Despite the rise of other QBs including Daniels, Williams and Maye have been touted and put under the microscope for three years. Their unique skills are transcendent.
Their are still questions about the others and Schoen would have to sell them to ownership despite some past foibles and deficiencies.
if I am Schoen I would not want to put my career on line unless I was totally convinced in the QB.
If true, Good God. Mara’s infatuation with Jones…what is he, a teenage girl circa ‘65 with Paul McCartney?
haha...
It's getting weird.
Now that Giants have virtually no chance of a top two pick, we hear, "Oh well, he would agree if they had a top two."
Funny.
Let Mara speak for himself, from just before his GM had to negotiate with team Jones:
“To me, it was the poise,” Mara said. “That building is as loud as can be, and you look at him, and he’s in complete control of the offense.”
I asked Mara when it became a finality to him that Daniel Jones would be his Quarterback of the Future.
“It was a while ago I think … he just keeps getting better and better every week,” Mara said.
Mara laughed when it was suggested that he got the succession plan for Eli right (yes, with former GM Dave Gettleman’s help) and said: “Hey I can’t screw up everything, I gotta get something right.”
I got it right. Hard to have a clearer statement of personal investment.
nyp - ( New Window )
It's time to get serious about running a billion dollar business and football team. If you want to hand out scholarships, become a booster for a college program.
Draft a QB high, and end this stupidity already.
against Dallas
625 yards later and 40 pts with no adjustments Dabol wants to know why, I would too.
Wink has said that is how he calls the game ... hence the canning in Balt ... Joe S and DaBoll KNEW this .... he lives and dies by the sword
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Wink continued to play his defense, putting his guys in precarious situations
against Dallas
625 yards later and 40 pts with no adjustments Dabol wants to know why, I would too.
Wink has said that is how he calls the game ... hence the canning in Balt ... Joe S and DaBoll KNEW this .... he lives and dies by the sword
It would not be so bad in the offense was not putrid. Complimentary football. ST is its on issue....
So yeah if you got beef with Wink then the whole staff should be getting his ire. Medical guys as well f' it injuries are an issue too.
It's time to get serious about running a billion dollar business and football team. If you want to hand out scholarships, become a booster for a college program.
Draft a QB high, and end this stupidity already.
I don’t think Mara is worried about petitions from fans. A QB on a 2 year prove it deal got hurt and the coach did not have the team ready. Schoen did not fix the OL. Giants will look to draft QB this year. This team is light years behind Cowboys and Eagles. Fix OL and DL and starting drafting better.
Now that Giants have virtually no chance of a top two pick, we hear, "Oh well, he would agree if they had a top two."
Funny.
Let Mara speak for himself, from just before his GM had to negotiate with team Jones:
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John Mara was stopped in the middle of this joyous Giants locker room and marveled at the way his franchise quarterback performed.
“To me, it was the poise,” Mara said. “That building is as loud as can be, and you look at him, and he’s in complete control of the offense.”
I asked Mara when it became a finality to him that Daniel Jones would be his Quarterback of the Future.
“It was a while ago I think … he just keeps getting better and better every week,” Mara said.
Mara laughed when it was suggested that he got the succession plan for Eli right (yes, with former GM Dave Gettleman’s help) and said: “Hey I can’t screw up everything, I gotta get something right.”
I got it right. Hard to have a clearer statement of personal investment.
nyp - ( New Window )
This is my first time seeing this. Yikes. Not sure I can really blame Schoen anymore. Good grief when your boss says that, what are you supposed to do?
Now I'm back to being appreciative that he can be moved off of after next year for $19M in cap savings. The owner said this with a pending free agent. Geez, Jones' agents must have been salivating at those quotes.
First of all he’s the owner so you expect him to have influence in things like stadiums, secondary beyond speculation on BBI there isn’t any evidence he’s interfered with Schoen doing his job
Ehh “he believes”, so it’s all speculation. I read so many more quotes from other owners injecting themselves directly into the team’s situations than I do from Mara. He’s the owner he’s allowed an opinion about his team and a GM can discuss his plans and vision with the owners without it being interference
I get it, it’s an easy thing for fans to complain about in down seasons, it’s human nature for many to lock onto that, we see it with almost every team.
At least it isn't Tepper who came across as a complete buffoon.
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Look at those quotes above. That is evidence right there. What is Schoen supposed to do when his boss is giving those opinions?
Ehh “he believes”, so it’s all speculation. I read so many more quotes from other owners injecting themselves directly into the team’s situations than I do from Mara. He’s the owner he’s allowed an opinion about his team and a GM can discuss his plans and vision with the owners without it being interference
I get it, it’s an easy thing for fans to complain about in down seasons, it’s human nature for many to lock onto that, we see it with almost every team.
Mara is on record and it's an absolute certainty that he has input on franchise-altering decisions like moving on from a QB who he adores and just won a playoff game.
There was ZERO chance Jones was leaving even if Schoen wanted him to let him go.
However, this season, I mentioned more than once that there are teams with lousy offensive lines that score more than 11 points per game. What I thought was Jones turning the corner was just a little hot streak, but let's face it his contract almost assures that he will be with the team next year. Maybe he starts while they groom his replacement. Who knows? We'll find out in April.
For the record, X has played the best games of the season (possibly past 2 seasons) after Wink ‘embarrassed’ him.
If our D holds up over the next 5 games, I’d hope there would be better reasons for dismissal than that.
Additionally, Ranaan likened training camp to a ‘Country Club’
As an aside, Ranaan sounded like he may of had a few drinks prior to the interview.
Another guys theory is Schoen planted the info to smoke out a mole.
Another guy said Wink won't stand for Daboll railing on him like he does some other coaches, but Mara will mediate to work it out cause nobody wants him to leave.
Another guy said Wink is taking offense to Dabs poking his nose in his gameplans and shading his D when his offense is so putrid.
Some other theories tossed in too.
It's like the JFK assassination.
Cutthroat would be telling Team Barkley he wishes them luck out on the open market.