on this board truly believe that we can actually win a SB with Jones at this point?
Yes, I do. It would require some good fortune that eludes Jones. I don’t think he can stay healthy. I want a Maye,Williams, Daniel’s or a later prospect.
We need a QB
ALSO
Jones will be given a chance to rehab and start.
I don’t get the venom I receive for that.
When you say "good fortune that has eluded Jones" are you referring to health? Or....
We just disagree. I think the injured player will be given a chance to come back.
That's materially different than being cleared to practice at the extreme low end of the recovery timeline and likely beating out a blue chip draft pick.
Let's move up the miracle and say Jones is cleared mid-July. Jayden Daniels would blow the doors off a rusty Daniel Jones in practice.
Athletically for sure, he would do that to anyone. I have watched most highly drafted QB that are drafted for said fail at the NFL. Jones could very likely outperform a rookie. You are blinded by a desire to eject Jones. I get it.
to ask what does your QB need to win a SB and measure how attainable that is. The history of the SB winning teams have had quite the range of QB ability. For some multiple winning SB QB's they were much better the second time than on the rookie deal. Plenty of history with the QB on a rookie deal.
I find the interesting situation is if the Giants pick a QB in the top 5 or somewhere close to that and he looks terrible and what direction they go. Jones health is a big factor but that could get interesting.
It is being HELL BENT on being correct. People are more concerned with shouting their POV over and over, rather than a discussion. They use insulting language unnecessarily repeatedly and the fire is returned and all we do is shout.
That's rich. You mean like when you went around pretending to be FMIC calling anyone who said it was a mistake to pay DJ a moron?
Is afraid of Jones being given a chance to start in 2024.
You are afraid that he will do well.
If you knew he would fail, you would not show so much emotion in this debate.
It’s OK
They been wrong for so long, might as well drive off the cliff.
Funny thing is, the true best case scenario is jones playing well enough for someone to take his contract. but even that delicious cap space and a golden ticket couldn't disengage them from their obsessions.
It is being HELL BENT on being correct. People are more concerned with shouting their POV over and over, rather than a discussion. They use insulting language unnecessarily repeatedly and the fire is returned and all we do is shout.
That's rich. You mean like when you went around pretending to be FMIC calling anyone who said it was a mistake to pay DJ a moron?
inaccurate. I am not a punk, I will return fire but the people on this board that are polite have never read me direct an unkind word to them. It was a reasonable deal based on the context and still think so.
Hindsight changes that but we didn’t know all the players we would lose and the difficulty of the early schedule. I see a bunch of people taking victory laps because their opinion on Jones appears more accurate.
Rooting for new QB
We have different reasons, do we need to be enemies.
It seems as though this board is filled with sides.
If Jones is healthy and all his teammates witness his journey, if he outperforms the rookie in camp(likely), there is no way Jones does not start.
This is silly. Do you think they'll set it to a musical montage?
Men are moved by effort in my experience. When they see a teammate put in the work, they notice. You might be person who is indifferent about the locker room and the personalities that make it up, we likely will not agree here. Team chemistry matters IMV
I imagine the offensive linemen would be moved by Jones learning how to read a fucking blitz.
'Witness Jones's journey'... you've got to be fucking kidding me. Sounds like something out of True Detective.
half the team. It's all silly fluff fluff discussion to think which of the current FA will remain with the team. I believe Schoen is going to clean house just like what happened after 1983 season.
Is afraid of Jones being given a chance to start in 2024.
You are afraid that he will do well.
If you knew he would fail, you would not show so much emotion in this debate.
It’s OK
The anit-Jones crowd is terrified of a fragile QB coming off a bad injury getting injured again and adding another $22M to the cap in 2025 when he isn't even here.
If the Giants draft a QB I would not have Jones on the roster out of necessity but I would never activate him in 2024. They can't afford to have him injured. He needs to leave after 2024 in perfect health.
Let's move up the miracle and say Jones is cleared mid-July. Jayden Daniels would blow the doors off a rusty Daniel Jones in practice.
Athletically for sure, he would do that to anyone. I have watched most highly drafted QB that are drafted for said fail at the NFL. Jones could very likely outperform a rookie. You are blinded by a desire to eject Jones. I get it.
ryan, we really haven’t won shit since 2011. A WC win doesn’t move the needle for me, especially when we got shredded the following week by our divisional rival.
ryan. You keep talking about the ‘22 season. How much winning did Jones do THIS season?
The only reason I keep bringing up 2022, is because you guys continue to say that the Giants haven't won anything in 10 years.
It is baffling to me that everyone has conveniently forgotten what happened less than a year ago.
I don't think anyone forgot about 2022.
Some just don't see it as anything but a good season by Jones. Not some great break out performance that shook the NFL.
I would argue 2022 was more a testament to Dabka's game planning and coaching. And identifying a system that would work in the short term for Jones and the team...
SFG - so let me get this straight just so I'm clear:
Before the 2022 season, you and the majority of BBI thought the Giants were going to absolutely suck, probably go 3-14 or 4-13 or something so that effect. They'd move on from Jones, the roster was awful, etc, etc.
The team won 10 games, including a road playoff win.
And now you are saying that it "doesn't do it for you" even though before all that happened - you likely predicted that the team was going to be awful?
Basically - you're saying well actually that doesn't matter because hey we got killed by the Eagles anyway so....eh....I'm over that season, moving on.
I have been refraining for a while, but enough with how great last year was.
"Daniel Jones you and your team just got embarrassed by a division rival. What are you going to do next?"
"I'm going to Disney World!"
The standards are pathetic.
You predicted that we'd be the worst team in football, that Tyrod Taylor would be starting by week 4, and we'd be an embarrassment. Did you not say this over and over again?
And now you are somehow moving the goal posts so far and away beyond anything reasonable - that you are actually criticizing the Giants for losing by 30 to the Eagles in the divisional round of the playoffs - a spot that you predicted they would not come even remotely close to achieving?
GTFO with that. Come on man. I know you hate Jones but at least be consistent with your critiques.
I have been refraining for a while, but enough with how great last year was.
"Daniel Jones you and your team just got embarrassed by a division rival. What are you going to do next?"
"I'm going to Disney World!"
The standards are pathetic.
You predicted that we'd be the worst team in football, that Tyrod Taylor would be starting by week 4, and we'd be an embarrassment. Did you not say this over and over again?
And now you are somehow moving the goal posts so far and away beyond anything reasonable - that you are actually criticizing the Giants for losing by 30 to the Eagles in the divisional round of the playoffs - a spot that you predicted they would not come even remotely close to achieving?
GTFO with that. Come on man. I know you hate Jones but at least be consistent with your critiques.
I'll admit I was surprised the Giants got as far as they did; it's difficult to do that with a quarterback that sucks. Daboll earned every bit of that Coach of the Year award.
ryan. You don’t seem to get it. Yes, I thought we were going to suck last year. Guilty as charged. And I am obviously glad we didn’t. But I think it is clear AF that that season was a mirage based on Dabs and Kafka having Jones on training wheels. And yes, I have higher standards than beating a pretty awful Vikes defense on the road.
And again, last season. How did Jones look this season? How about a rookie cornerback saying that the entire team knows he stares down his first option? How about the offense looking more functional with his backups running the show?
The only way Jones could possibly continue starting is if we win.
I am not afraid of winning, no matter who starts at QB.
I agree with you. He will be cleared by the doctors and start so the team is not stuck with the injury guarantee. I am also confident he will be the same middling to bad qb he has been for the last 5 years and will be eased out by week 8 or 9 for whatever rookie Schoen takes in the upcoming draft and that he will not be on the team in 2025.
SFG, DeVito has played the Jets, Raiders, Washington, Dallas, and New England.
He had a really nice game against Commanders, no doubt about it.
We lost to the Jets in embarrassing fashion. We got killed by Vegas. We got killed by Dallas. We scored 10 points against New England. DeVito was really good against Washington.
By my estimation - that is 1 good performance out of 5 games. What am I missing?
ryan. You don’t seem to get it. Yes, I thought we were going to suck last year. Guilty as charged. And I am obviously glad we didn’t. But I think it is clear AF that that season was a mirage based on Dabs and Kafka having Jones on training wheels. And yes, I have higher standards than beating a pretty awful Vikes defense on the road.
And again, last season. How did Jones look this season? How about a rookie cornerback saying that the entire team knows he stares down his first option? How about the offense looking more functional with his backups running the show?
Again - watch Jones against Dallas in 2022. Played well. Watch the OL against Dallas, SF, Seattle, and Miami early on this season.
Unmitigated disaster. Actually - the OL was amazingly bad as well against Dallas in the MNF game last year, and Jones nearly pulled it off.
I think he can be a serviceable backup and give you a very solid 3-4 games a year. I think there is value there but he is WAY overpaid.
I also think he cannot play that role here, there is too much history and sentimentality with this player here. And it's probably like any business. I doubt it's just Mara. I'm sure Daboll loves the guy, Schoen, ownership and from all accounts his teammates love him too. All of this plays a role and it's why keeping him around is complicated. I think a fresh start for both parties is best.
I have been refraining for a while, but enough with how great last year was.
"Daniel Jones you and your team just got embarrassed by a division rival. What are you going to do next?"
"I'm going to Disney World!"
The standards are pathetic.
I was (mostly) joking. You add too much here to be on time out.
No worries. I get it...for me that was a nauseating moment in this team's history. It mystifies me that so many are just glossing over that and pointing to the Minnesota game like it was a massive moment that validates the Jones experience. It was a fun few days, but that good feeling vanished about 5 minutes after kickoff in Philadelphia.
For me the Minnesota game was rendered irrelevant by how the following game went. It's one thing if the Giants went to Philly and lost a well contested game. But what we learned was that the team was a complete pretender that had benefited by circumstance just to be there.
I think very few fans that participate actively in this forum gloss over the Eagle game to promote the Vikings. There certainly aren't many that I can think.
Quote:
on this board truly believe that we can actually win a SB with Jones at this point?
Yes, I do. It would require some good fortune that eludes Jones. I don’t think he can stay healthy. I want a Maye,Williams, Daniel’s or a later prospect.
We need a QB
ALSO
Jones will be given a chance to rehab and start.
I don’t get the venom I receive for that.
When you say "good fortune that has eluded Jones" are you referring to health? Or....
That's materially different than being cleared to practice at the extreme low end of the recovery timeline and likely beating out a blue chip draft pick.
Better chance of me bedding Margot Robbie.
You are afraid that he will do well.
If you knew he would fail, you would not show so much emotion in this debate.
It’s OK
The only way Jones could possibly continue starting is if we win.
I am not afraid of winning, no matter who starts at QB.
You are afraid that he will do well.
If you knew he would fail, you would not show so much emotion in this debate.
It’s OK
I'm terrified of Jones starting in 2024. Because I'm terrified of them starting off 1-5 again, not because I think he'll do well.
I find the interesting situation is if the Giants pick a QB in the top 5 or somewhere close to that and he looks terrible and what direction they go. Jones health is a big factor but that could get interesting.
Quote:
what's the mistake(s) and who's admitting it?
It is being HELL BENT on being correct. People are more concerned with shouting their POV over and over, rather than a discussion. They use insulting language unnecessarily repeatedly and the fire is returned and all we do is shout.
That's rich. You mean like when you went around pretending to be FMIC calling anyone who said it was a mistake to pay DJ a moron?
You are afraid that he will do well.
If you knew he would fail, you would not show so much emotion in this debate.
It’s OK
They been wrong for so long, might as well drive off the cliff.
Funny thing is, the true best case scenario is jones playing well enough for someone to take his contract. but even that delicious cap space and a golden ticket couldn't disengage them from their obsessions.
Quote:
In comment 16309865 Dnew15 said:
Quote:
what's the mistake(s) and who's admitting it?
It is being HELL BENT on being correct. People are more concerned with shouting their POV over and over, rather than a discussion. They use insulting language unnecessarily repeatedly and the fire is returned and all we do is shout.
That's rich. You mean like when you went around pretending to be FMIC calling anyone who said it was a mistake to pay DJ a moron?
Hindsight changes that but we didn’t know all the players we would lose and the difficulty of the early schedule. I see a bunch of people taking victory laps because their opinion on Jones appears more accurate.
Rooting for new QB
We have different reasons, do we need to be enemies.
It seems as though this board is filled with sides.
I don’t want to be on a side.
Go Giants!
Again, the Giants won a road playoff game in 2022, the first time they had done that in 10 years.
Does this novel concept of winning somehow not include the most recent season where they did?
Quote:
In comment 16309866 Thegratefulhead said:
Quote:
If Jones is healthy and all his teammates witness his journey, if he outperforms the rookie in camp(likely), there is no way Jones does not start.
This is silly. Do you think they'll set it to a musical montage?
Men are moved by effort in my experience. When they see a teammate put in the work, they notice. You might be person who is indifferent about the locker room and the personalities that make it up, we likely will not agree here. Team chemistry matters IMV
I imagine the offensive linemen would be moved by Jones learning how to read a fucking blitz.
'Witness Jones's journey'... you've got to be fucking kidding me. Sounds like something out of True Detective.
You are afraid that he will do well.
If you knew he would fail, you would not show so much emotion in this debate.
It’s OK
The anit-Jones crowd is terrified of a fragile QB coming off a bad injury getting injured again and adding another $22M to the cap in 2025 when he isn't even here.
If the Giants draft a QB I would not have Jones on the roster out of necessity but I would never activate him in 2024. They can't afford to have him injured. He needs to leave after 2024 in perfect health.
The only reason I keep bringing up 2022, is because you guys continue to say that the Giants haven't won anything in 10 years.
It is baffling to me that everyone has conveniently forgotten what happened less than a year ago.
Athletically for sure, he would do that to anyone. I have watched most highly drafted QB that are drafted for said fail at the NFL. Jones could very likely outperform a rookie. You are blinded by a desire to eject Jones. I get it.
You're getting more strange by the day.
Quote:
Perhaps non members of the DJFC want to, ya know, win? Novel concept I know.
Again, the Giants won a road playoff game in 2022, the first time they had done that in 10 years.
Does this novel concept of winning somehow not include the most recent season where they did?
It's like this never happened.
Quote:
In comment 16309970 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
Perhaps non members of the DJFC want to, ya know, win? Novel concept I know.
Again, the Giants won a road playoff game in 2022, the first time they had done that in 10 years.
Does this novel concept of winning somehow not include the most recent season where they did?
It's like this never happened.
I agree with your point about the selective memories, but you should be put in a timeout for posting that gif.
Quote:
ryan. You keep talking about the ‘22 season. How much winning did Jones do THIS season?
The only reason I keep bringing up 2022, is because you guys continue to say that the Giants haven't won anything in 10 years.
It is baffling to me that everyone has conveniently forgotten what happened less than a year ago.
I don't think anyone forgot about 2022.
Some just don't see it as anything but a good season by Jones. Not some great break out performance that shook the NFL.
I would argue 2022 was more a testament to Dabka's game planning and coaching. And identifying a system that would work in the short term for Jones and the team...
"Daniel Jones you and your team just got embarrassed by a division rival. What are you going to do next?"
"I'm going to Disney World!"
The standards are pathetic.
Before the 2022 season, you and the majority of BBI thought the Giants were going to absolutely suck, probably go 3-14 or 4-13 or something so that effect. They'd move on from Jones, the roster was awful, etc, etc.
The team won 10 games, including a road playoff win.
And now you are saying that it "doesn't do it for you" even though before all that happened - you likely predicted that the team was going to be awful?
Basically - you're saying well actually that doesn't matter because hey we got killed by the Eagles anyway so....eh....I'm over that season, moving on.
Do I have that right?
"Daniel Jones you and your team just got embarrassed by a division rival. What are you going to do next?"
"I'm going to Disney World!"
The standards are pathetic.
You predicted that we'd be the worst team in football, that Tyrod Taylor would be starting by week 4, and we'd be an embarrassment. Did you not say this over and over again?
And now you are somehow moving the goal posts so far and away beyond anything reasonable - that you are actually criticizing the Giants for losing by 30 to the Eagles in the divisional round of the playoffs - a spot that you predicted they would not come even remotely close to achieving?
GTFO with that. Come on man. I know you hate Jones but at least be consistent with your critiques.
Link - ( New Window )
Flash forward 5 months.
"They won a road playoff game and then lost to a superior team? Who fucking cares, that means nothing."
Quote:
I have been refraining for a while, but enough with how great last year was.
"Daniel Jones you and your team just got embarrassed by a division rival. What are you going to do next?"
"I'm going to Disney World!"
The standards are pathetic.
You predicted that we'd be the worst team in football, that Tyrod Taylor would be starting by week 4, and we'd be an embarrassment. Did you not say this over and over again?
And now you are somehow moving the goal posts so far and away beyond anything reasonable - that you are actually criticizing the Giants for losing by 30 to the Eagles in the divisional round of the playoffs - a spot that you predicted they would not come even remotely close to achieving?
GTFO with that. Come on man. I know you hate Jones but at least be consistent with your critiques.
I'll admit I was surprised the Giants got as far as they did; it's difficult to do that with a quarterback that sucks. Daboll earned every bit of that Coach of the Year award.
And again, last season. How did Jones look this season? How about a rookie cornerback saying that the entire team knows he stares down his first option? How about the offense looking more functional with his backups running the show?
I think that applies.
To be fair, which I'm sure you will agree with, everything that could possibly go wrong with this offense did. From players to staff.
What was saw through that collapse was that Jones didn't have the skills - physical and mental - to stop many of the leaks.
The only way Jones could possibly continue starting is if we win.
I am not afraid of winning, no matter who starts at QB.
He had a really nice game against Commanders, no doubt about it.
We lost to the Jets in embarrassing fashion. We got killed by Vegas. We got killed by Dallas. We scored 10 points against New England. DeVito was really good against Washington.
By my estimation - that is 1 good performance out of 5 games. What am I missing?
And when you’re paying someone $40 million, maybe we can expect him to stop the bleeding? Call me crazy.
"Daniel Jones you and your team just got embarrassed by a division rival. What are you going to do next?"
"I'm going to Disney World!"
The standards are pathetic.
I was (mostly) joking. You add too much here to be on time out.
And again, last season. How did Jones look this season? How about a rookie cornerback saying that the entire team knows he stares down his first option? How about the offense looking more functional with his backups running the show?
Again - watch Jones against Dallas in 2022. Played well. Watch the OL against Dallas, SF, Seattle, and Miami early on this season.
Unmitigated disaster. Actually - the OL was amazingly bad as well against Dallas in the MNF game last year, and Jones nearly pulled it off.
I also think he cannot play that role here, there is too much history and sentimentality with this player here. And it's probably like any business. I doubt it's just Mara. I'm sure Daboll loves the guy, Schoen, ownership and from all accounts his teammates love him too. All of this plays a role and it's why keeping him around is complicated. I think a fresh start for both parties is best.
Giants win = Jones put the team on his back and carried them to victory.
Giants loss - Jones put the team on his back, but could only carry them so far.
I see why the word "heroic" gets thrown around the way it does.
Yeah, Jones was bad for that quarter. He made bad throws, including the deep balls to Hyatt.
But he’s never going to be an elite QB. And he’s about to enter his sixth season. I think it’s fair to assume he is who he is at this point.
Wish the kid luck. But ready to move on and go find an elite QB.
Is anyone willing to take the position of the former?
Quote:
I have been refraining for a while, but enough with how great last year was.
"Daniel Jones you and your team just got embarrassed by a division rival. What are you going to do next?"
"I'm going to Disney World!"
The standards are pathetic.
I was (mostly) joking. You add too much here to be on time out.
No worries. I get it...for me that was a nauseating moment in this team's history. It mystifies me that so many are just glossing over that and pointing to the Minnesota game like it was a massive moment that validates the Jones experience. It was a fun few days, but that good feeling vanished about 5 minutes after kickoff in Philadelphia.
For me the Minnesota game was rendered irrelevant by how the following game went. It's one thing if the Giants went to Philly and lost a well contested game. But what we learned was that the team was a complete pretender that had benefited by circumstance just to be there.