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NFT: Mets Thread - Happy Winter Meetings To All!!!

Shecky : 12/4/2023 10:28 am
- Luis Severino has joined the Mets in free agency after a mixed history with the Yankees. His career with the Yankees was marked by both success and extensive injuries. Severino signed a one-year, $13 million deal with the Mets.
Mets' Catching Depth:
- The Mets' catching depth is a concern, regarding Omar Narváez's performance and health. Cooper Hmel is considered a potential replacement for Narváez. They also picked up Tyler Heineman.
- Joey Wendle was picked up to replace LG as the utility man.
- Kyle Crick, a new Mets relief pitcher, has joined on a minor league deal with hopes of strengthening the bullpen.
The Mets have signed Austin Adams, Joseph Yabbour, Andre Scrubb and Cole Sulser to aid bullpen depth.

Mets Winter Meetings Focus:
- The Mets are expected to be active at the Winter Meetings, with a focus on acquiring an outfielder, starting pitching, and relief pitching. They are also interested in improving run prevention and outfield defense.
- The team may engage in trade talks, expect to hear the usual prospect names such as Kevin Parada, Brett Baty, Mark Vientos, and Ronny Mauricio.

Yoshinobu Yamamoto and Player Meetings:
- The New York Mets are planning to meet with Japanese pitcher Yoshinobu Yamamoto in the next week and he is expected to continue to draw significant interest from MLB teams.
- Shohei Ohtani is also expected to make a decision on his next team soon, with bids for his services surpassing $500 million.
- The Mets are also considering Korean outfielder Jung Hoo Lee.

Summary from pre Winter Meeting thread:

Hall of Fame Ballot Newbies: Inclusion of players like Big Sexy, Wright, and Reyes in the Hall of Fame ballot.
- Several iconic Yankees and Mets greats were in contention for Hall of Fame induction, but they fell short of the required votes.
Management and Coaching Updates: Significant changes in the Mets' management and coaching staff, including a new contract for manager Mendoza. Bench coach vacancy and role shifts for Eric Chavez and Jeremy Barnes as hitting coaches. Introduction of Kris Gross and Andy Green in player development and amateur scouting.

Pitching Strategy and Market Moves: Focus on fortifying the rotation, implications of the Cardinals' signings, and the pursuit of high-caliber pitchers.

Bullpen and Player Performance: Signing of BP arms to minor league deals and review of the players.
Previous Mets thread: - ( New Window )
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RE: The word literally is so overused  
CooperDash : 12/7/2023 8:59 am : link
In comment 16315491 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
it's about as meaningful as genocide or violence or racism (not to get political).

the owner can't "literally" buy any player he wants, in fact he's finding out right now he may not even necessarily be able to buy the players available in free agency.

is there a better fit for the Mets than Yamamoto? 25 year old top of the rotation starter, only costs money. Isn't that the prototypical player Cohen should be able to "buy" - if he doesn't wind up in Queens, what does that tell you? Maybe the highest bidder doesn't always win or that he wasn't the highest bidder - you can interpret them two different ways.

Montgomery, not even a TOR starter really with a lengthy track record, wants to "go home" which last time I heard was when Roger Clemens left Boston to to go Toronto (he's from Texas).

those are just a couple examples.

Even Ohtani who prototypes as a perfect bat in the middle of the Mets lineup as just a hitter not even considering if/when he starts pitching again, sure he costs draft pick comp since he has a QO but he's a guy you break that rule for - doesn't even get a sniff from the Mets (reportedly).

money is not the only answer. Players sometimes want more - they want a legacy of winning, culture, belonging, teammates, structure, know their role, know you have a plan, things you can't just wave a wallet at. It's a two-way street.

if this off-season Cohen comes up empty and it remains to be seen - I'm not prejudging the off-season on 12/6 but I wouldn't be shocked if he has an exit plan. the fucking Texas Rangers won a WS and Cohen's Mets aren't a playoff team today with the leagues highest payroll. I feel like it is harder than he thought it would be.


So sorry the word “literally” is such a trigger for you 🙄

I mean, we essentially said the same thing but it was like a bat signal for you to make some weird snarky response. Hope you feel better.

But the he point remains…Cohen’s wealth puts him at the front of the line of signing premier FAs, and that’s good enough. We won’t always get them (again…as I mentioned in my post), but we have a chance where we typically did not. And that’s a good place to me. And while I would love to get Yamamoto, I also don’t know if a 10 year contract for him is wise (it probably isn’t). But then again, Yankee fans think they are going to sign him for $25 million per year (which I think is really low). We’ll see soon what Yamamoto wants more - the biggest contract or to be a Yankee.
RE: Padres  
Sammo85 : 12/7/2023 9:11 am : link
In comment 16315541 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Believed to be the favorites for Lee


I think its a great pivot for them. The ankle he had last year worries me a little, and some acclimation to the pitching/parks here, but I think the hit tool with him is legit and translates.
RE: The Cohen era is only just getting started  
Sammo85 : 12/7/2023 9:15 am : link
In comment 16315554 Chris684 said:
Quote:
He wanted his Prez of BB Ops and now he has him.

The sale of the team and the transition period was during the height of Covid and there were a bunch of unforeseen circumstances at the GM level. I don't think anyone ever thought that money alone buys you any player you want, and even if it did, buying every player wouldn't necessarily mean you would win.

He's thrown some of his financial weight around already in the form of Lindor and the pitching, and most importantly he's proven he will spend even more money if it means he can quickly reverse some decisions that didn't pan out. Last year's deadline was proof of this.

He finally has the guy he wanted (Stearns) in place to run the baseball decisions. Meanwhile he's done everything Mets fans could have ever dreamed of in terms of fan relations that the Wilpons pissed on for years.

As a long suffering Mets fan, I have no doubt that if Yamamoto does not come here, it will NOT be because the money wasn't there. That's all I can ask as a fan.



Eventually, its simply about winning and doing it consistently. That hasn't been Mets MO in over 3 decades (and even the 80s run, was short over a few seasons and ended in quick disappointment after 88). If Cohen changes that finally, after some serious initial misfires/missteps, all the better.
RE: RE: The Cohen era is only just getting started  
Chris684 : 12/7/2023 9:25 am : link
In comment 16315579 Sammo85 said:
Quote:
In comment 16315554 Chris684 said:


Quote:


He wanted his Prez of BB Ops and now he has him.

The sale of the team and the transition period was during the height of Covid and there were a bunch of unforeseen circumstances at the GM level. I don't think anyone ever thought that money alone buys you any player you want, and even if it did, buying every player wouldn't necessarily mean you would win.

He's thrown some of his financial weight around already in the form of Lindor and the pitching, and most importantly he's proven he will spend even more money if it means he can quickly reverse some decisions that didn't pan out. Last year's deadline was proof of this.

He finally has the guy he wanted (Stearns) in place to run the baseball decisions. Meanwhile he's done everything Mets fans could have ever dreamed of in terms of fan relations that the Wilpons pissed on for years.

As a long suffering Mets fan, I have no doubt that if Yamamoto does not come here, it will NOT be because the money wasn't there. That's all I can ask as a fan.




Eventually, its simply about winning and doing it consistently. That hasn't been Mets MO in over 3 decades (and even the 80s run, was short over a few seasons and ended in quick disappointment after 88). If Cohen changes that finally, after some serious initial misfires/missteps, all the better.


"Serious missteps/misfires" LOL

Inherited garbage, first season shortened by Covid. a 101 win season and a couple of disappointing ones (although the latest disappointing season served as a massive boost to the farm system given the way Cohen handled it), all while still trying to get his baseball ops in place.

RE: RE: RE: The Cohen era is only just getting started  
Sammo85 : 12/7/2023 9:43 am : link
In comment 16315587 Chris684 said:
Quote:
In comment 16315579 Sammo85 said:


Quote:


In comment 16315554 Chris684 said:


Quote:


He wanted his Prez of BB Ops and now he has him.

The sale of the team and the transition period was during the height of Covid and there were a bunch of unforeseen circumstances at the GM level. I don't think anyone ever thought that money alone buys you any player you want, and even if it did, buying every player wouldn't necessarily mean you would win.

He's thrown some of his financial weight around already in the form of Lindor and the pitching, and most importantly he's proven he will spend even more money if it means he can quickly reverse some decisions that didn't pan out. Last year's deadline was proof of this.

He finally has the guy he wanted (Stearns) in place to run the baseball decisions. Meanwhile he's done everything Mets fans could have ever dreamed of in terms of fan relations that the Wilpons pissed on for years.

As a long suffering Mets fan, I have no doubt that if Yamamoto does not come here, it will NOT be because the money wasn't there. That's all I can ask as a fan.




Eventually, its simply about winning and doing it consistently. That hasn't been Mets MO in over 3 decades (and even the 80s run, was short over a few seasons and ended in quick disappointment after 88). If Cohen changes that finally, after some serious initial misfires/missteps, all the better.



"Serious missteps/misfires" LOL

Inherited garbage, first season shortened by Covid. a 101 win season and a couple of disappointing ones (although the latest disappointing season served as a massive boost to the farm system given the way Cohen handled it), all while still trying to get his baseball ops in place.


What are you laughing about? Cohen himself has admitted the first three years have brought some learning experiences and things that were missed (including by Sandy) with manager, general manager situations and front office strategies on player development.

RE: RE: The word literally is so overused  
pjcas18 : 12/7/2023 9:58 am : link
In comment 16315567 CooperDash said:
Quote:
In comment 16315491 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


it's about as meaningful as genocide or violence or racism (not to get political).

the owner can't "literally" buy any player he wants, in fact he's finding out right now he may not even necessarily be able to buy the players available in free agency.

is there a better fit for the Mets than Yamamoto? 25 year old top of the rotation starter, only costs money. Isn't that the prototypical player Cohen should be able to "buy" - if he doesn't wind up in Queens, what does that tell you? Maybe the highest bidder doesn't always win or that he wasn't the highest bidder - you can interpret them two different ways.

Montgomery, not even a TOR starter really with a lengthy track record, wants to "go home" which last time I heard was when Roger Clemens left Boston to to go Toronto (he's from Texas).

those are just a couple examples.

Even Ohtani who prototypes as a perfect bat in the middle of the Mets lineup as just a hitter not even considering if/when he starts pitching again, sure he costs draft pick comp since he has a QO but he's a guy you break that rule for - doesn't even get a sniff from the Mets (reportedly).

money is not the only answer. Players sometimes want more - they want a legacy of winning, culture, belonging, teammates, structure, know their role, know you have a plan, things you can't just wave a wallet at. It's a two-way street.

if this off-season Cohen comes up empty and it remains to be seen - I'm not prejudging the off-season on 12/6 but I wouldn't be shocked if he has an exit plan. the fucking Texas Rangers won a WS and Cohen's Mets aren't a playoff team today with the leagues highest payroll. I feel like it is harder than he thought it would be.



So sorry the word “literally” is such a trigger for you 🙄

I mean, we essentially said the same thing but it was like a bat signal for you to make some weird snarky response. Hope you feel better.

But the he point remains…Cohen’s wealth puts him at the front of the line of signing premier FAs, and that’s good enough. We won’t always get them (again…as I mentioned in my post), but we have a chance where we typically did not. And that’s a good place to me. And while I would love to get Yamamoto, I also don’t know if a 10 year contract for him is wise (it probably isn’t). But then again, Yankee fans think they are going to sign him for $25 million per year (which I think is really low). We’ll see soon what Yamamoto wants more - the biggest contract or to be a Yankee.


Not triggered by it, but I have three teenagers and the word literally has replaced "like" or they're used in concert - so whatever maybe I am triggered by it. Sorry for the snark.

anyway, I think you need to separate the pre-and post Madoff Wilpons.

the Mets made Bonilla the highest paid player in the league, Piazza too at one point, signed Beltran, traded for and extended Johan - and routinely had a high payroll.

And still never won.

You really need to get to a few years post-Madoff fall out until the Mets payroll was not always in the top 10, most of the time top 5. Then they began operating like the NY Twins or Pirates.

The biggest complaint I had about the pre-Madoff Wilpons is they would almost never go the "extra mile". Yes they'd have high payrolls but they made silly decisions like Bay vs Holliday when the Holliday bidding reached those levels.

With Cohen presumptively we don't have that, but can he "sell"? Can he get the Yamamoto's or Montgomerys or whoever bought in on his vision and can Stearns put the pieces together.

remains to be seen, but I reiterate, I think he thought it would be easier.
Feinsand  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 10:22 am : link
“This is going to come down to the Mets and Yankees,” one source said. “They both think they need him badly -- and they do. Get your popcorn ready. This could be fun.”
RE: TTH  
Eric on Li : 12/7/2023 10:26 am : link
In comment 16315513 Sean said:
Quote:
How would you explain Correa then? Cohen had dinner with Boras and agreed to a 12 year, $315 million contact. Correa would be 40 at the end of that deal if the health checked out. Compare that to a year later.


what exactly are you pointing to Correa as an example of? healthy he was one of the best players in MLB and an MVP candidate (was 5th in 2021), and he was a prime aged FA at 28 last year.

cohen was trying to make a 101 win team better with an actual prime aged star who only cost money (wouldnt have hurt farm).

when it was clear he wasnt healthy, they bailed, took some criticism for it, but in the end like SFG look correct.
RE: RE: RE: The word literally is so overused  
CooperDash : 12/7/2023 10:33 am : link
In comment 16315616 pjcas18 said:
Quote:

Not triggered by it, but I have three teenagers and the word literally has replaced "like" or they're used in concert - so whatever maybe I am triggered by it. Sorry for the snark.

anyway, I think you need to separate the pre-and post Madoff Wilpons.

the Mets made Bonilla the highest paid player in the league, Piazza too at one point, signed Beltran, traded for and extended Johan - and routinely had a high payroll.

And still never won.

You really need to get to a few years post-Madoff fall out until the Mets payroll was not always in the top 10, most of the time top 5. Then they began operating like the NY Twins or Pirates.

The biggest complaint I had about the pre-Madoff Wilpons is they would almost never go the "extra mile". Yes they'd have high payrolls but they made silly decisions like Bay vs Holliday when the Holliday bidding reached those levels.

With Cohen presumptively we don't have that, but can he "sell"? Can he get the Yamamoto's or Montgomerys or whoever bought in on his vision and can Stearns put the pieces together.

remains to be seen, but I reiterate, I think he thought it would be easier.


Fair enough - sorry for my snark as well, lol.

I agree with everything you said.
I mentioned this earlier but  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 10:33 am : link
Interestingly @BaseballAmerica
is significantly less high on Imanaga than other sources I've read. They also view Go as more of a low-leverage reliever with upside to develop further (only 25 years old)

Probably also worth mentioning that the teams willing to bid 100+ million are probably higher on Imanaga than BA
RE: RE: RE: The word literally is so overused  
Eric on Li : 12/7/2023 10:46 am : link
In comment 16315539 pjcas18 said:
Quote:

I'm not sure what Texas did is directly repeatable. Just like I think in football drafting your QB in the 6th round with a comp pick as a strategy isn't really repeatable.

But anyway, my point was Cohen opening his wallet and players jumping on to the roster doesn't seem to be happening like he (or some fans on here) thought would happen.

For many reasons, players may want to play somewhere else for the same money or in some cases maybe less.


maybe i didnt say it clear enough but i think what's repeatable is pursuing great players paying off - if you pick the right players. at the $300m+ level that shouldnt be so hard. they obviously got it right with lindor (even though that was a trade not a fa). it's why i give cohen a lot of credit for trying for correa last year and being 100% right when he said after "we needed 1 more bat". they did and they do.

"paying off" doesnt necessarily mean championship. LAD have done everything right for a decade and they only (barely) have 1 WS win. to carry on your 6th rd comp pick qb analogy, it's a different level of investment and the outcomes but if i were running an nfl team id probably draft a qb on day 3 every year because day 3 picks are disposable and you miss 100% of the shots you dont take. even getting tommy devito level backup qb is a major value from a day 3 pick. most will be more like andre woodson or kyle lauletta who never do anything. hitting on dak or purdy is franchise altering in the same way adding corey seager was franchise altering for texas.

in terms of players not jumping to come here there's a lot more evidence against that than for it, at least until their top targets choose to go elsewhere.

cohen offseason 1 brought a lindor extension, highest paid SS and NYM ever before cohen's first regular season game. that move was every bit as big as the soto trade for yankees. lindor was 27.

cohen offseason 2 brought a h2h win vs LAD for scherzer off CY runner up, plus all the black friday guys.

cohen offseason 3 brought not just verlander off CY/WS but senga at a bargain contract, and he had one of the biggest markets last year.

ohtani is the 1 big target they werent able to get in the mix for, but martino has said they were willing to spend the money if there was interest on ohtani's side in NY. apparently there wasnt (for either ny team).

i suspect at an absolute minimum cohen offseason #4 is going to bring the biggest SP contract in franchise history to somebody. previous high was JDG's 5x$137m (which he opted out of after year 4).
If Mets miss on Yamamoto  
Sammo85 : 12/7/2023 10:56 am : link
who is the other SP to go crazy on? Montgomery or Snell? Both have risks (sample size/age, innings). Sounds like Montgomery may want to stay with TEX and Snell might prefer to stay on West Coast - saw somewhere though where Cubs/Braves had checked in.

Mets were willing to go deep on JDG for 3 yrs, and got lucky there as it turned out.

Mets may have to divest some farm capital to add a starter just to be marginally staffed.

I haven't looked at next offseasons pitching market, but Mets may have to look to spend big again there. Severino is a one year gamble - I'd be stunned if he makes more than 15 starts. Quintana also will have some limits and his contract is up.

I believe Senga has an out after Year 3?
RE: If Mets miss on Yamamoto  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 10:58 am : link
In comment 16315666 Sammo85 said:
Quote:
who is the other SP to go crazy on? Montgomery or Snell? Both have risks (sample size/age, innings). Sounds like Montgomery may want to stay with TEX and Snell might prefer to stay on West Coast - saw somewhere though where Cubs/Braves had checked in.

Mets were willing to go deep on JDG for 3 yrs, and got lucky there as it turned out.

Mets may have to divest some farm capital to add a starter just to be marginally staffed.

I haven't looked at next offseasons pitching market, but Mets may have to look to spend big again there. Severino is a one year gamble - I'd be stunned if he makes more than 15 starts. Quintana also will have some limits and his contract is up.

I believe Senga has an out after Year 3?


Correct. The Mets have 3 SP with guaranteed contracts following 2025. Megill/Peterson/Lucchesi
Will  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 11:00 am : link
Sammon reiterated to me, the Mets are not in on Glasnow and Mets sources tell him they aren't interested in trading for Burnes given his contract situation/Boras/prospect cost.
Jonathan India  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 11:05 am : link
97 OPS+ over the past 2 seasons hitting .246/.333/.394 in the best hitters park in baseball, -21 DRS at 2b, -16 OAA. I'm perplexed as to why people mention him as a target for the Mets so often.
RE: Will  
Sammo85 : 12/7/2023 11:07 am : link
In comment 16315669 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Sammon reiterated to me, the Mets are not in on Glasnow and Mets sources tell him they aren't interested in trading for Burnes given his contract situation/Boras/prospect cost.


Burnes, Bieber headling the pitching FA class from brief look at 2024-2025 offseason. The rest is "woof" - lot of older guys, including Wheeler. Buehler and Glasnow are in there also, but with those injury histories, no way long-term on those guys.
.  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 11:13 am : link
Can't say I can recall seeing this before... new @mets
minor league P Alan Perdomo pitched in the DSL for 4 seasons.... strange
swear im not ghost marino  
Eric on Li : 12/7/2023 11:26 am : link
Quote:
Michael Marino
@MarinoMLB
·
30m
Left out Shoto Imanaga, who I’ve heard Mets and several other teams are interested in. My best educated guess is Mets have these arms ranked accordingly on their board:
1. Yamamoto
2. Montgomery
3. Snell (bumped down bc QO)
4. Imanaga


here is the thing with snell. everyone talks about next year's FA crop, but other than burnes, how many guys are better/younger?

if we were stack ranking the best SP for 2025 Opening Day out of this year's FA crop and next year's, Snell is still very high on this list, possibly #3 behind Yamamoto and Burnes assuming cole doesnt opt out if we are excluding anyone older than 32.

Yamamoto
Burnes
wheeler (entering age 35 season)
Snell
fried (entering age 31)
bieber (entering age 30)
woodruff (off injury)

i think they need 1 of Yamamoto/Snell this year,
then probably 1 of those other guys next year too (burnes, fried, maybe bieber if he bounces back).

it's possible they like montgomery on that level, but if that were the case i think they'd have already been more aggressive on him.

the thing they cant do is just wait for 25 year old yamamoto's because they will be waiting forever. he's described as a unicorn for a reason.
RE: RE: Will  
Eric on Li : 12/7/2023 11:27 am : link
In comment 16315680 Sammo85 said:
Quote:
In comment 16315669 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


Sammon reiterated to me, the Mets are not in on Glasnow and Mets sources tell him they aren't interested in trading for Burnes given his contract situation/Boras/prospect cost.



Burnes, Bieber headling the pitching FA class from brief look at 2024-2025 offseason. The rest is "woof" - lot of older guys, including Wheeler. Buehler and Glasnow are in there also, but with those injury histories, no way long-term on those guys.


hey we agree on something!
Cole  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 11:31 am : link
can't be a FA next season
RE: I mentioned this earlier but  
Eric on Li : 12/7/2023 11:31 am : link
In comment 16315644 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Interestingly @BaseballAmerica
is significantly less high on Imanaga than other sources I've read. They also view Go as more of a low-leverage reliever with upside to develop further (only 25 years old)

Probably also worth mentioning that the teams willing to bid 100+ million are probably higher on Imanaga than BA


Dan do you remember where they were on senga last year? I remember there was at least 1 service that thought there was significant reliever risk for him. "just a 2 pitch pitcher" etc.

that doesn't necessarily foretell success for imanaga but i think last year exposed some limitations in the international scouting capabilities of the public data. suzuki and yoshida probably have places in that argument as well.
RE: Cole  
Eric on Li : 12/7/2023 11:33 am : link
In comment 16315705 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
can't be a FA next season


mlb.com has him listed as an opt out? im pretty sure the yankees can guarantee something to cancel it out though (and i doubt he's leaving even if he hit the market).

Starting pitcher: Gerrit Cole (opt-out), Justin Verlander (vesting option), Max Scherzer, Corbin Burnes, Zack Wheeler, Brandon Woodruff, Max Fried, Shane Bieber, Walker Buehler, Nathan Eovaldi (vesting option), Chris Sale (vesting option), Tyler Glasnow, Robbie Ray (opt-out), Alex Cobb, Kyle Hendricks, Charlie Morton, Freddy Peralta (club option), Merrill Kelly (club option), Wade Miley (mutual option), Lance Lynn (club option), Kyle Gibson (club option), Luis Severino, Yusei Kikuchi, Patrick Corbin, Anthony DeSclafani, Nick Pivetta, Domingo Germán, Marco Gonzales (club option), Andrew Heaney, Eric Lauer, John Means, José Quintana, Michael Soroka, Ross Stripling, Spencer Turnbull
https://www.mlb.com/news/baseball-s-next-free-agent-classes - ( New Window )
RE: RE: I mentioned this earlier but  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 11:35 am : link
In comment 16315706 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 16315644 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


Interestingly @BaseballAmerica
is significantly less high on Imanaga than other sources I've read. They also view Go as more of a low-leverage reliever with upside to develop further (only 25 years old)

Probably also worth mentioning that the teams willing to bid 100+ million are probably higher on Imanaga than BA



Dan do you remember where they were on senga last year? I remember there was at least 1 service that thought there was significant reliever risk for him. "just a 2 pitch pitcher" etc.

that doesn't necessarily foretell success for imanaga but i think last year exposed some limitations in the international scouting capabilities of the public data. suzuki and yoshida probably have places in that argument as well.



They were higher on Senga. They projected Senga as a #3 if he threw strikes. Obviously he was better than that this season (absolutely no knock on Senga, but when it comes to "new" pitchers Japanese or not, you like to see a 2+ sample size before really stating what they are. Will the ghost fork remain as dominant when players have seen it? I mean Nomo year 1 was a phenom, again this isn't anything against Senga) . BA called Seng'a floor a #4. They called Imanaga a 4-5 with the floor of a bulk innings RPer.
RE: RE: Cole  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 11:37 am : link
In comment 16315709 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 16315705 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


can't be a FA next season



mlb.com has him listed as an opt out? im pretty sure the yankees can guarantee something to cancel it out though (and i doubt he's leaving even if he hit the market).

Starting pitcher: Gerrit Cole (opt-out), Justin Verlander (vesting option), Max Scherzer, Corbin Burnes, Zack Wheeler, Brandon Woodruff, Max Fried, Shane Bieber, Walker Buehler, Nathan Eovaldi (vesting option), Chris Sale (vesting option), Tyler Glasnow, Robbie Ray (opt-out), Alex Cobb, Kyle Hendricks, Charlie Morton, Freddy Peralta (club option), Merrill Kelly (club option), Wade Miley (mutual option), Lance Lynn (club option), Kyle Gibson (club option), Luis Severino, Yusei Kikuchi, Patrick Corbin, Anthony DeSclafani, Nick Pivetta, Domingo Germán, Marco Gonzales (club option), Andrew Heaney, Eric Lauer, John Means, José Quintana, Michael Soroka, Ross Stripling, Spencer Turnbull https://www.mlb.com/news/baseball-s-next-free-agent-classes - ( New Window )


His opt out triggers an additional optional year added by the Yankees. He has no avenue to become a FA outside of the Yankees letting him walk.
So  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 11:40 am : link
yeah, if the Yankees bizarrely don't want Gerrit Cole after 2024 he can become a FA, otherwise he can't. Major injury and he won't opt out, so barring him pulling a John Rocker...
RE: Jonathan India  
Shecky : 12/7/2023 11:41 am : link
In comment 16315677 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
97 OPS+ over the past 2 seasons hitting .246/.333/.394 in the best hitters park in baseball, -21 DRS at 2b, -16 OAA. I'm perplexed as to why people mention him as a target for the Mets so often.

He had cool hair and his dad I believe was a HUGE Mets fan. Might even be on here 👋
RE: So  
Eric on Li : 12/7/2023 11:43 am : link
In comment 16315725 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
yeah, if the Yankees bizarrely don't want Gerrit Cole after 2024 he can become a FA, otherwise he can't. Major injury and he won't opt out, so barring him pulling a John Rocker...


some might suggest that meets the definition of assumption.

In comment 16315702 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
assuming cole doesnt opt out if we are excluding anyone older than 32.
Eric...  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 11:46 am : link
he CAN'T become a FA after the season UNLESS the Yankees decided they didn't want him back. You honestly count that as him being a FA? It's like saying "the Phillies can let Harper leave if they want after 2024 and they do that he'll be a FA".
I'm  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 11:54 am : link
completely confused as to what my "assumption" is?

-He has an opt out after 2024. The opt-out allows the Yankees to tack on an additional year to his current contract which would VOID the opt-out

In what scenario would the Yankees not want Cole back? And what scenario would they not want him back but the Mets and other teams WOULD want him? I truly can't come up with one.
RE: RE: Jonathan India  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 11:57 am : link
In comment 16315726 Shecky said:
Quote:
In comment 16315677 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


97 OPS+ over the past 2 seasons hitting .246/.333/.394 in the best hitters park in baseball, -21 DRS at 2b, -16 OAA. I'm perplexed as to why people mention him as a target for the Mets so often.


He had cool hair and his dad I believe was a HUGE Mets fan. Might even be on here 👋


Hard pass (Sorry if you're on here Jonathan!)
Mike  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:01 pm : link
Mayer must have had bad intel. Martino and Heyman both reported the Mets were never "involved" on Eduardo Rodriguez. Heyman notes the Dodgers also weren't (they tried trading for him last season).
BA on Imanaga  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:02 pm : link
Scouting Report: Imanaga is a crafty lefthander with a good feel for pitching. His fastball sits 89-93 mph with solid riding life as a starter and touches 94-95 in short bursts. His main secondary pitch is an above-average, 82-85 mph splitter with late cut that induces ground balls. Imanaga’s success in MLB will hinge largely on the development of his slider. It’s currently a fringy offering at 80-83 mph that stays on one plane and gets barreled in the strike zone. He’s flashed the ability to throw it firmer and get chase swings, but it needs improvement to become an average pitch. He also has a below-average, 71-74 mph curveball he’ll throw as a change-of-pace offering. Imanaga mostly throws to his glove-side and can get one-sided in his repertoire, but he mixes and matches well to keep opponents off-balance. He has above-average control and keeps everything around the plate.

The Future: Imanaga’s feel for pitching gives him a chance to be a No. 4 or 5 starter. He may fit best as a swingman or bulk reliever on a contending team.

BA Grade: 50/Medium

Scouting Grades

Fastball: 50. Curveball: 40. Slider: 45. Splitter: 55. Control: 55
Writer gave me some of his predictions-  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:09 pm : link
Yamamoto- Yankees
Montgomery-Texas
Ohtani-LAD
Bellinger- Cubs
Lee- Padres
Snell- "He wants Seattle, very quiet on him so far but Braves?"
Chapman- Toronto
Hader- Phillies
Stroman- Angels or Dodgers
Imanaga- Mets
Hoskins- Cubs
Teoscar Hernandez- Mets
Lugo-Braves
JD Martinez- Arizona
FG  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:12 pm : link
Quote:
Less than an hour after his Rule 5 selection by the Mets, Slaten was dealt to the Red Sox, where he’ll join Boston’s big league bullpen as a single-inning relief option. To call his command iffy in 2022 would be an understatement; he posted a walk rate just shy of 20% in his 50.2 innings of work at Double-A that season. But 2023 was a bounce-back season for the 26 year old. He spent most of the season at Double-A, where he maintained a 7.9% walk rate while striking out 37.4% of opponents. When he was promoted to Triple-A, the walks crept up a bit, though nowhere near that 2022 mark, while his strikeouts dipped, though they stayed above 30%. Across the two levels, he fanned 86 over just under 60 innings, which equates to a K/9 just under 13, and a 1.07 WHIP, both ranking third in the Rangers system for pitchers with at least 50 innings of work. His fastball sits in the mid-90s and touches 98 mph, and he mostly pairs it with a sweeping slider that has a bat-missing track record. His cutter also garnered more than its fare share of swing-and-miss in 2023, with his two-plane, low-80s curveball and rarely-thrown mid-80s changeup rounding out his arsenal.

Relief prospect Ryan Ammons, Boston’s 2023 10th round pick out of Clemson, never pitched more 27 innings in a single college season in part because he was injured for two months of his draft spring. The drop-and-drive style lefty only throws 88-89 mph but his fastball punches way, way above its weight thanks to its extreme uphill angle, which was impossible for college hitters to get on top of. You can project on him throwing harder because of how athletic and powerful Ammons’ delivery looks, but he’ll still need to find a better secondary pitch in pro ball. His changeup looked better than his breaking ball in college and we think that pitch has the better chance to emerge as a real weapon.
RE: I'm  
Eric on Li : 12/7/2023 12:12 pm : link
In comment 16315735 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
completely confused as to what my "assumption" is?

-He has an opt out after 2024. The opt-out allows the Yankees to tack on an additional year to his current contract which would VOID the opt-out

In what scenario would the Yankees not want Cole back? And what scenario would they not want him back but the Mets and other teams WOULD want him? I truly can't come up with one.


dan take a breathe - you are arguing something nobody argued.

my initial post assumed that cole wouldnt be available. nobody suggested he would be available - the only reason he was mentioned is because he was listed on a FA list driectly from mlb.com that was posted 3 days ago.
RE: RE: I'm  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:14 pm : link
In comment 16315751 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 16315735 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


completely confused as to what my "assumption" is?

-He has an opt out after 2024. The opt-out allows the Yankees to tack on an additional year to his current contract which would VOID the opt-out

In what scenario would the Yankees not want Cole back? And what scenario would they not want him back but the Mets and other teams WOULD want him? I truly can't come up with one.



dan take a breathe - you are arguing something nobody argued.

my initial post assumed that cole wouldnt be available. nobody suggested he would be available - the only reason he was mentioned is because he was listed on a FA list driectly from mlb.com that was posted 3 days ago.


Eric,
I'm just saying he's not even one of those "long shot" options. He's essentially a Yankee for life.
RE: RE: RE: I'm  
Eric on Li : 12/7/2023 12:18 pm : link
In comment 16315752 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 16315751 Eric on Li said:


Quote:


In comment 16315735 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


completely confused as to what my "assumption" is?

-He has an opt out after 2024. The opt-out allows the Yankees to tack on an additional year to his current contract which would VOID the opt-out

In what scenario would the Yankees not want Cole back? And what scenario would they not want him back but the Mets and other teams WOULD want him? I truly can't come up with one.



dan take a breathe - you are arguing something nobody argued.

my initial post assumed that cole wouldnt be available. nobody suggested he would be available - the only reason he was mentioned is because he was listed on a FA list driectly from mlb.com that was posted 3 days ago.



Eric,
I'm just saying he's not even one of those "long shot" options. He's essentially a Yankee for life.


right we agree, which is why i didnt list him in those options even though mlb.com listed him as an opt out. that's all i was pointing out w/ the post about "assumption", we both made the same one.
If India  
pjcas18 : 12/7/2023 12:19 pm : link
was included in a trade to unite the Diaz brothers in Queens I'd support it.

More to get Alexis.
Michael  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:20 pm : link
Taylor is "fine" but again I'd sooner take a shot on O'Neill. Still some upside there vs. a 33 year old Taylor. I've convinced myself Lee is probably the way to go OF wise but sounds like SD are suddenly heavy favorites for him. I think Mets fans would become very frustrated watching a guy like Teoscar Hernandez. 211 k's. 211!, clearly had major trouble hitting at home in Seattle (.830 OPS away) but was also the epitome of streaky 4 months sub .700 OPS, 2 months over .900
RE: If India  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:21 pm : link
In comment 16315754 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
was included in a trade to unite the Diaz brothers in Queens I'd support it.

More to get Alexis.


I'd say there is nearly a 0% chance they would deal Diaz. The Reds were in on E-Rod just added a new 3b, they are trying to win. They have been one of the most aggressive teams this off-season.
Looks like  
bronxboy : 12/7/2023 12:24 pm : link
the Cohen bank account will not change much this off season.
Reds  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:26 pm : link
have committed 26 million to Nick Martinez, 45 million to Candelario and 16 million to Pagan already this off-season and were "in" on E-Rod (originally reported as finalists, later that was disputed). Good for them.
RE: Michael  
Sammo85 : 12/7/2023 12:27 pm : link
In comment 16315756 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Taylor is "fine" but again I'd sooner take a shot on O'Neill. Still some upside there vs. a 33 year old Taylor. I've convinced myself Lee is probably the way to go OF wise but sounds like SD are suddenly heavy favorites for him. I think Mets fans would become very frustrated watching a guy like Teoscar Hernandez. 211 k's. 211!, clearly had major trouble hitting at home in Seattle (.830 OPS away) but was also the epitome of streaky 4 months sub .700 OPS, 2 months over .900


Agreed - Hernandez and Imanaga would be a somewhat low-expectation risky offseason, kind of just holding or taping the plumbing line type of moves. It would reinforce despite what Stearns/Cohen said publicly, the private chatter, Mets know deck is stacked instead to retool into 2025 and 2026.
.  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:30 pm : link
Gallen, Kelly, E-Rod, Pfaadt + Henry... not too shabby. Arizona is cooking.
I read  
pjcas18 : 12/7/2023 12:31 pm : link
in one of these threads that CLE has made Clase available.

Maybe the Reds flip Diaz - who did not have a great year (comparatively spoeaking0 to the Mets and get Clase. Diaz probably/possibly cool being a set up guy for his big brother.

Or if that's even true I'd like to see the Mets pursue Clase if he'd be comfortable as a set up guy.

I have no idea why CLE would be interested in moving Clase other than maybe they don't expect to contend and don't feel a closer is a huge need.

if that's true and CLE is sellers - go big and get Clase (who was also not lights out in 2023 compared to 2022) and add in Jose Ramirez.

Cleveland  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:37 pm : link
is reportedly looking for a young power bat they can insert into their lineup if they move Clase. Mets don't appear to be a fit there.

Diaz with 4 years left on his contract. I find it hard to believe either one will be Mets in 2024.
RE: I read  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:38 pm : link
In comment 16315769 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
in one of these threads that CLE has made Clase available.

Maybe the Reds flip Diaz - who did not have a great year (comparatively spoeaking0 to the Mets and get Clase. Diaz probably/possibly cool being a set up guy for his big brother.

Or if that's even true I'd like to see the Mets pursue Clase if he'd be comfortable as a set up guy.

I have no idea why CLE would be interested in moving Clase other than maybe they don't expect to contend and don't feel a closer is a huge need.

if that's true and CLE is sellers - go big and get Clase (who was also not lights out in 2023 compared to 2022) and add in Jose Ramirez.


Jose Ramirez has a full no trade and said he intends to spend the rest of his career in Cleveland (he took far less than market value). No indication they are sellers anyway.
.  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:39 pm : link
Andrew Flax
@ajflax
Mark reports the Nats plan to play Senzel primarily at third... not exactly an inspiring acquisition. More in the Dom Smith vein (bad player who's shown flashes) than the Jeimer Candelario one (good player who had a down year).
Re: Ramirez  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:42 pm : link
"They told him that they can't afford what he's worth, and he told them that he didn't care," Nieves said. "He wanted to stay there, and they made it work. He knows that he left money on the table, but he says, '$150 million or $200 million, my life is gonna be the same. I'm happier with $150 million in Cleveland than $200 million somewhere else.'"

"I tried to talk him out of it," Nieves said. "Everyone tried to talk him out of it."

Ramirez, however, longed for stability.

"That was my motivation," Ramirez said in Spanish, "to stay here."
.  
DanMetroMan : 12/7/2023 12:44 pm : link
Jon Morosi
@jonmorosi
The Giants and Padres are active on center fielders, including free agent Harrison Bader.

Jung-Hoo Lee is of interest to both clubs. Credit to @JonHeyman
for his reporting on Lee's robust market.

@MLBNetwork
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