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| Quote: |
| 39. Giants: Michael Penix Jr., Washington Perhaps the Giants ultimately try to trade into the back end of Round 1 to secure the fifth-year option on a quarterback, but they get their pick of the next tier near the top of Round 2. I went with Penix over Michigan's J.J. McCarthy in this scenario because of his big arm and ability to get the ball downfield. That makes him an ideal fit for Brian Daboll's offense. This is of course contingent on Penix's physical going well, given his extensive injury history (two shoulder injuries, two knee injuries). The pick gives New York options should Daniel Jones not rebound in 2024 after coming back from his torn ACL. -- Jordan Raanan, Giants reporter |
i think it happened in 2021 but it's pretty rare that 4 qbs would go top 10.
Don't think so.
obviously it all depends on how their grades go but if there end up being 6 with first round grades, it's likely 1 of them falls to the back half of round 1.
if there's a QB they like more than the others i expect they will be aggressive and possibly even trade up from 6, but if the top 3 are gone and they like 2 of the 3 others similarly, that's where i could see them being a little patient knowing they could almost certainly move up by packaging #39 and the 2025 first.
obviously it all depends on how their grades go but if there end up being 6 with first round grades, it's likely 1 of them falls to the back half of round 1.
if there's a QB they like more than the others i expect they will be aggressive and possibly even trade up from 6, but if the top 3 are gone and they like 2 of the 3 others similarly, that's where i could see them being a little patient knowing they could almost certainly move up by packaging #39 and the 2025 first.
2018
It probably makes more sense to gamble on Penix's injury future than to pray that Nix or McCarthy can start to progress through multiple receivers and deliver balls in tight windows in the NFL. No one wants the next Daniel Jones.
The Giants are allergic to drafting QBs. You are suggesting spending ANOTHER draft to not draft a QB? The most important position in football and the Giants to neglect it and say, "oh well, Jones sucks but nothing we can do." The top teams don't operate this way. It's been since 2019 for NYG to draft a QB. Hell, the Lions drafted a QB last year.
But this is also coming from Raanan, and I doubt Drew Wilkins knows anything about the Giants draft targets, so I'm guessing Raanan doesn't know shit with his main source on the unemployment line.
I'd rather take Spencer Rattler in the third.
Penix isn't like Jones; he will pull the trigger and throw with anticipation. That would help the OL a ton.
I was all in on Sam Darnold. I still think if he went to the right team and coach he could have been an above average NFL QB but that's a different discussion.
In the limited times I watch college QBs on TV, I ignore anything that happens with clean pockets. There's such a talent imbalance in most of the games that throwing against glorified 7 on 7 drills seems meaningless to me.
I think the best predictor of whether a QB (with the necessary physical traits) can translate to the NFL is how they perform under pressure. I don't think Pennix can play at a high level in the NFL based off watching the Michigan game. I know. It's one game. I saw him put up big numbers in other games. But when he wasn't playing on a vastly superior team he didn't have a way to play effectively*.
I know this will be unpopular but given the choice I'd rather the Giants draft the Michigan QB. I think he has more NFL potential and instincts.
This will probably be even more unpopular. But I would be happy if the Giants traded one of their 2nd picks for Fields if the Bears take a QB at #1. I think Fields would be a big upgrade over Daniel Jones with Brian Daboll as his coach. I think his cap hit for 2024 is 6M. No rookie learning curve with Fields and if he isn't better than Jones the Giants won't be stuck with him.
Penix isn't like Jones; he will pull the trigger and throw with anticipation. That would help the OL a ton.
And he will be sacked a ton and be borderline a statue but sure..
Daboll's offense depends on downfield passing.
Instead of drafting all injury-free college players only to see them injured in the NFL, we should draft injury-type players from college to have the opposite effect. Also, they would have experience with injury treatment and rehabilitation.
As such, Penix is our guy!!!!!
LOL
Penix isn't shitty. He's better than anyone we have now. He is a pure downfield passer. Getting an upgrade at QB in the 2nd round is a lot better than spending a 2nd round pick on a maybe at another position that is of marginal use, Ojulari, JMS, WanDale.. ok players but not good enough to pass on an upgrade at QB.
Is BBI just a place where you come to complain?
Not sure Penix lasts to 39 but Giants should be willing to get back into the 20s if they like him.
Makes perfect sense.
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For this team, this offense and especially this Oline.. Daboll's offense relies on QB mobility and that doesn't have anything to do with hand size..
Daboll's offense depends on downfield passing.
Then why did he approve giving Jones a long term contract? There is zero chance that schoen would offer that deal to Jones without Daboll's buy in, right?
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not going to last that long. He may go in the top 10.
If he does, I hope it's not us.
I think he is the wrong fit for the Giants...completely. We don't have the OL to protect him anywhere near the level he got in college. Plus, he is a lefty and our only plus OL is at LT. I know he has been available the last 2 seasons, but his injury history is scary and we already are trying to replace another QB that can't stay healthy.
Bold prediction!
I’m looking forward to all the ups and downs on prospects. I can’t recall as volatile a set of opinions on QBs are there are this year.
Schoen has some decisions to make.
He would also beat out Jones head to head.
But honestly even if he's a high level backup, I still think he's good pick in the 2nd.
I don't understand this concern. Did we not have protection issues with our right handed QBs? Was Neal not an issue?
If Neal is a problem, he's a problem for everyone. If they don't think he'll get better they should find a replacement. The draft pick used on him is gone. Don't waste time justifying it.
Definitely underrated if we aspire to be a home team in the playoffs.
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and quickly glancing hasnt happened since 2010 either.
obviously it all depends on how their grades go but if there end up being 6 with first round grades, it's likely 1 of them falls to the back half of round 1.
if there's a QB they like more than the others i expect they will be aggressive and possibly even trade up from 6, but if the top 3 are gone and they like 2 of the 3 others similarly, that's where i could see them being a little patient knowing they could almost certainly move up by packaging #39 and the 2025 first.
2018
there you go, for some reason thought rosen fell father than 10th.
bottom line though it's pretty rare and this year there are 6 qbs in the first round discussion. the top ones will of course push up as usual but the middle or bottom ones may push down.
I don't get it either. Everyone pines for the next Lamar instead of the next CJ Stroud I guess.
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None of these other guys are any good. I get it. Jones sucks. I want him gone as much as anyone. But wasting a premium pick on a shitty qb because you need a qb is just an awful strategy
The Giants are allergic to drafting QBs. You are suggesting spending ANOTHER draft to not draft a QB? The most important position in football and the Giants to neglect it and say, "oh well, Jones sucks but nothing we can do." The top teams don't operate this way. It's been since 2019 for NYG to draft a QB. Hell, the Lions drafted a QB last year.
I’m very much in favor of drafting a good qb. I don’t think that penix will be good. I think it’s a 3 qb draft. If the giants want to trade up and get one or if one those guys falls to them, I’d be thrilled. I do not want to draft players I think stink just because they are a certain position. By forcing a qb pick on a bad qb you set yourself up to be in the same position next year as you are this year except now you wasted a premium pick in the prior year
Penix stunk against Michigan. He has awful pocket mobility. He has a huge injury history. And that Washington offense was a little gimmicky for me. I just don’t think he’s going to be a good pro. If I thought highly of him I’d absolutely be in favor of drafting him so I think that is where we disagree.
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No, he's not a running QB, but he's not immobile either. He can move around decently when he has to.
I don't get it either. Everyone pines for the next Lamar instead of the next CJ Stroud I guess.
Penix has athletic ability but when he’s in the pocket he’s very stiff and not very agile. He has good straight like speed and isn’t bad as a runner. These two things are different
Makes perfect sense.
That is ironic for sure. If Penix gets in play, I really hope that don't waste a lottery pick for him. That would not be a good risk-reward play.
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On the blindside.
I don't understand this concern. Did we not have protection issues with our right handed QBs? Was Neal not an issue?
If Neal is a problem, he's a problem for everyone. If they don't think he'll get better they should find a replacement. The draft pick used on him is gone. Don't waste time justifying it.
There's a reason LTs make the big money.
We saw that happen this year.
I'm not saying stay away because of that, but there would need to be a change.
Makes perfect sense.
Looks better with the new turf already.
I don't see them getting a guy at 6 and it takes two to tango if you want them to trade up. Not as easy as it sounds.
I can live with a QB in round 2 or in the second half of round 1.
I don't see them getting a guy at 6 and it takes two to tango if you want them to trade up. Not as easy as it sounds.
I can live with a QB in round 2 or in the second half of round 1.
I agree with the caveat that I think Schoen will aggressively try to move up.
1000%
Some of these folks have it twisted. You don't draft a QB to fit your line. You draft a QB:
1) based on talent, far and away the number one criteria. Does he have the talent to thrive in the NFL.
2) coach and scheme fit, far behind talent.
3) a set of steak knives, there is no #3
so unless 1 of the other qbs rises up, i think more likely nyg have a really high player on their board available (odunze, nabers, arnold?) and then consider aggressively move up from #39 with next year's first (or maybe just both seconds) if there's a guy they think is a legitimate first round worthy prospect they can develop.
that's what baltimore did with lamar (though there is obviously a good argument that drafting hayden hurst ahead of him was not a risk worth taking).
🤣
After the combine, I’m betting he’s QB1.
There’s a report that NE “might” have Nix as QB2.
If Chicago still believes in Fields ( even if they want a QB reset), they WILLhace a price.
Does JS want to pay it?
Tons of variables yet.
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In comment 16384597 jvm52106 said:
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For this team, this offense and especially this Oline.. Daboll's offense relies on QB mobility and that doesn't have anything to do with hand size..
Daboll's offense depends on downfield passing.
Then why did he approve giving Jones a long term contract? There is zero chance that schoen would offer that deal to Jones without Daboll's buy in, right?
None of us knows what was said between Mara, Schoen and Daboll and we don't know what they were thinking. Do I think Daboll settled on Jones because he got something out of him in 2022, and maybe didn't think he would fail so badly with vertical schemes? Given that the owner loves Jones, yes I think Daboll compromised. But I don't know it for certain. If he had a do-over I'm sure he would not agree to offer Jones a big contract.
After the combine, I’m betting he’s QB1.
There’s a report that NE “might” have Nix as QB2.
If Chicago still believes in Fields ( even if they want a QB reset), they WILLhace a price.
Does JS want to pay it?
Tons of variables yet.
You'll lose that bet. Daniels might jump Maye (though I doubt it) but he won't jump Williams, who has monster arm talent and creativity. Daniels, though a supreme athlete and runner, just doesn't have the arm talent to jump Williams and his frame will become an issue. He is slight with a narrow waist and at least one site is reporting, smallish hands at 9-1/4 inch.
I also believe they prefer mobility at the position, more then Pennix has. I could see them drafting a Joe Milton maybe who can chuck it, but I'd see this like rd 3.
Shocking…
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why is everyone so sure Daniels is QB3?
After the combine, I’m betting he’s QB1.
There’s a report that NE “might” have Nix as QB2.
If Chicago still believes in Fields ( even if they want a QB reset), they WILLhace a price.
Does JS want to pay it?
Tons of variables yet.
You'll lose that bet. Daniels might jump Maye (though I doubt it) but he won't jump Williams, who has monster arm talent and creativity. Daniels, though a supreme athlete and runner, just doesn't have the arm talent to jump Williams and his frame will become an issue. He is slight with a narrow waist and at least one site is reporting, smallish hands at 9-1/4 inch.
It is like he is shrinking every week reading your posts.
And there are those that think this would be a good match?
I think Penix is a superior player to Nix
I want nothing to do with Nix. Was not good in the SEC. Suddenly good at Oregon because of better. Talent and no defense played in Pack 12
That's 100 percent wrong. He has an extremely quick release and very quick processing. The only thing he is subpar at is running.
And there are those that think this would be a good match?
You don't avoid a QB because of the current state of the OL. The expectation obviously is that the OL improves. Without that, very few QBs will succeed, mobile or otherwise.
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leg injuries in college and may be the least mobile of all the big name prospects. And the Giants have an OL that absolutely requires plus mobility skills of whatever QB that lines up under Center.
And there are those that think this would be a good match?
You don't avoid a QB because of the current state of the OL. The expectation obviously is that the OL improves. Without that, very few QBs will succeed, mobile or otherwise.
We should most definitely avoid QBs where mobility isn't a plus. And that should be the case whether you think the OL will improve or not in the short term.
Unless, of course, Penix is the second coming of Dan Marino. Is he?