WBG84
@WBG84
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@PLeonardNYDN
thinks Michigan's JJ McCarthy is the type of quarterback he can see the Giants taking a liking to and selecting high in the draft. #NYGiants #NFLDraft
Nobody in that organization of any real capabilities is speaking with him, specifically Daboll and Schoen. With Wink and Wilkins gone, who would be his sources? I have no trust in his ability to determine what the Giants would like or not like.
McCarthy might be of interest, might not.
That last sentence has the same weight as PL's tweet.
but the offense he was in made him a tough read. I, unlike many, do not delide myself into being able to say with certainty whether he is good at pre snap reads, progressions and what not.
What I see is a young, very athletic, very strong-armed and highly accurate passer who did nothing but win at Michigan. I would LOVE hom or Daniels as our next QB.
and have for same time. He has all the traits. He'll be better soon than Jones ever was. He's massively more talented than Jones in every way and he can actually read defenses.
"Do I think McCarthy is a dramatic improvement over Daniel Jones...no...but he would be on a rookie contract..."
JFC, that sounds really daft. You can't invest in a QB largely because of resetting the contract. You need to draft a more talented player.
I don't like McCarthy at all in round one. But like nearly every QB in this 2024 class, he's more talented than Jones...
Really good take. I won't read Leonard articles but if he is hinting that drafting a QB with a top ten pick only for a slight improvement on Jones but mostly because ue will be cheaper going forward... If thats his take, then his editor should fire him on the spot.
I think it’s the intangibles that set him apart from Jones…..
more than anything IMO. He’s got all the requisite traits to be a successful QB in the NFL, but the intangibles will cause him to rise in the draft. I think he’s still QB#4 , but who knows.
Winning pedigree, ability to throw on the move, and the outspoken leader vibe coaches like in a QB.
His off-platform stuff, from highlight video's, is really intriguing.
You mean Maye's size right? JD and JJ are the same size and JJ had more room to grow than JD due to body type and age. I like JJ's mind and movement in the pocket a lot myself, whereas I see that as a weakness for Maye. I also love his ability to throw on the run and off platform, I like JJ more than Maye. I still like JD more than JJ, but I would be happy with either of them. I'd be ok with Maye but a bit disappointed if JD and JJ went top 3.
but the offense he was in made him a tough read. I, unlike many, do not delide myself into being able to say with certainty whether he is good at pre snap reads, progressions and what not.
What I see is a young, very athletic, very strong-armed and highly accurate passer who did nothing but win at Michigan. I would LOVE hom or Daniels as our next QB.
Agreed, and when I say I like his mind in the pocket it's obviously an educated guess vs an assumption that he is definitively amazing with reading defenses and making quick decisions.
reasonable representation of Giants fans talking, prepare yourself for a lot of media linking JJM to the Giants. It may be completely baseless, but BBI has shown JJM to be a hot topic and touchy subject. Makes for good click bait material.
Which will there be more threads on over the next two months - DJ sucks, or JJM? Probably DJ, because nearly every thread gets turned into a DJ sucks thread. Topic: We need a new punter. Reply: DJ sucks. punt him out the door. NFT: The sun rises in the east. Reply: and it's setting on DJ, coz he sucks.
because nothing is possible for this franchise until they replace a crappy QB with one who actually may develop into something really good. You can't consistently win in the NFL with a shit QB
lets revisit the "don't touch him with a 10 ft pole in rd 1"
AFTER the combine.
My gut tells me he's going to light it up throwing the ball, and any doubts about him going HIGH in rd 1 will be gone.
I think Leonard is a douche, personally, but I think he's on point here. Schoen and Daboll have given some insight into what "kind" of QB they like during the time they've been here, and I keep coming back to Maye and McCarthy.
lets revisit the "don't touch him with a 10 ft pole in rd 1"
AFTER the combine.
My gut tells me he's going to light it up throwing the ball, and any doubts about him going HIGH in rd 1 will be gone.
I think Leonard is a douche, personally, but I think he's on point here. Schoen and Daboll have given some insight into what "kind" of QB they like during the time they've been here, and I keep coming back to Maye and McCarthy.
I love your presence and posts here, but I really hope you're wrong about us not taking a rd1 qb. I'd be very happy with JD or JJ and I'd be good with Maye. Odds are we got a shot at one of those 3 at the least. Schoen also attended all of their games personally I believe.
lets revisit the "don't touch him with a 10 ft pole in rd 1"
AFTER the combine.
My gut tells me he's going to light it up throwing the ball, and any doubts about him going HIGH in rd 1 will be gone.
I think Leonard is a douche, personally, but I think he's on point here. Schoen and Daboll have given some insight into what "kind" of QB they like during the time they've been here, and I keep coming back to Maye and McCarthy.
What kind do they say they like?
Mobile, smart, athletic, tough, ability to make plays out of the pocket with eyes downfield, threat to run
lets revisit the "don't touch him with a 10 ft pole in rd 1"
AFTER the combine.
My gut tells me he's going to light it up throwing the ball, and any doubts about him going HIGH in rd 1 will be gone.
I think Leonard is a douche, personally, but I think he's on point here. Schoen and Daboll have given some insight into what "kind" of QB they like during the time they've been here, and I keep coming back to Maye and McCarthy.
What kind do they say they like?
Mobile, smart, athletic, tough, ability to make plays out of the pocket with eyes downfield, threat to run
So the non-mobile, dumb, unathletic, soft, poor pocket throwing, check down QB-types are all out of the question?
He's got everything the Giants look for in a QB, except the prototypical size. If he was 6'5" I'd put it in the bank already. We'll see if they deviate from that, but the rest is all there, and it's pretty easy to see him operating Daboll's offense.
I don't think Caleb or Daniels fit the Giants MO, so it's really down to Maye vs. McCarthy IMO. Herbert or Burrow?
What's not to like in reading through the 62 threads on him this past week.
The threads on McCarthy are a lot more readable than the same posters who post the same regurgitated criticisms or excises for Daniel Jones. By a longshot.
Only a matter of time before this McCarthy thread gets one of the usual suspects posting a con about Jones and then that idiot Stroud chimes in along with the rest of the pro-Jones army.
I don't think Caleb or Daniels fit the Giants MO, so it's really down to Maye vs. McCarthy IMO. Herbert or Burrow?
I agree that Maye and McCarthy have the prototypical characteristics that scream NYG. If they are the two, I'll cheer if Maye is there, and Schoen ends the Jones era buy selecting him.
Maye definitely has a game that mirrors a lot of what Herbert and Burrow have. McCarthy? Not so much...
McCarthy reminds me of a bigger version of Bryce Young. But I think Young is a more talented thrower.
Do you think this would be Jones all over again or do you at least think McCarthy has more upside?
McCarthy is obviously polarizing, but I think he is more talented than Jones. And he has pedigree being a 4-star recruit, winning programs (IMG, Michigan), playing for Harbaugh, NCG, etc.
I'm just not convinced he's a lottery talent.
But if we select him, I expect him to quickly out-play Jones and secure the starter's role. And then it's up to Dabka to hopefully have enough to develop him.
I don't think Caleb or Daniels fit the Giants MO, so it's really down to Maye vs. McCarthy IMO. Herbert or Burrow?
I agree that Maye and McCarthy have the prototypical characteristics that scream NYG. If they are the two, I'll cheer if Maye is there, and Schoen ends the Jones era buy selecting him.
Maye definitely has a game that mirrors a lot of what Herbert and Burrow have. McCarthy? Not so much...
McCarthy reminds me of a bigger version of Bryce Young. But I think Young is a more talented thrower.
Well, McCarthy is a lot more athletically gifted and physically gifted than Bryce Young for starters. McCarthy will eventually play at 6'3 220-225 imo, Bryce Young is what 5'10 with a slender frame and didn't even put up any athletic testing cuz he is at best average in that department. I think that comparison doesn't make a lot of sense tbh, I also think McCarthy has a stronger arm and many other aspects that I think project better than Bryce Young's. I still can't believe the Panthers took him over CJ stroud. All you had to do was watch the Georgia Ohio St tape to see Stroud over Young was an obvious choice smfh
I’ll add to the reply to your question, a pocket passer with outstanding mobility.
Not a scrambler.
If you watch Allen and Mahomes, other than the designed runs, they try to win from the pocket first and only run if they have to, frequently to buy time.
Someone like Lamar Jackson can’t wait to take off.
CW is an interesting prospect in he moves around so much I’m not sure how disciplined in the pocket he is. Daniels has incredible skills both as a passer AND runner. Maye and McCarthy fit the way Daboll wants the QB to play.
"Someone like Lamar Jackson can’t wait to take off."
To be fair I feel like this was fairly accurate in his first 2 years, but he has evolved a lot. I still don't think he has that clutch mechanism where he elevates his game in the big moments.
a 2nd RD talent and contrary to many of the posts on this thread, he doesn't think JJ throws well on the move.
I didn't like JJ before I heard Pauline's comments. JJ is listed as 6' 3", but he looks shorter and his arm is good, but not great.
And all this talk about "intangibles" just seems like a different version of "hard worker/great guy"... and we've already got one of those.
Why not draft a QB with "tangibles"... great arm, good size, accurate, etc.?
If the Giants take JJ, I hope I'm wrong. I'd rather take Nabors in the first and gamble on Rattler in RD-2. (Don't think Rattler is going to make it to RD-3 any more.)
a 2nd RD talent and contrary to many of the posts on this thread, he doesn't think JJ throws well on the move.
I didn't like JJ before I heard Pauline's comments. JJ is listed as 6' 3", but he looks shorter and his arm is good, but not great.
And all this talk about "intangibles" just seems like a different version of "hard worker/great guy"... and we've already got one of those.
Why not draft a QB with "tangibles"... great arm, good size, accurate, etc.?
If the Giants take JJ, I hope I'm wrong. I'd rather take Nabors in the first and gamble on Rattler in RD-2. (Don't think Rattler is going to make it to RD-3 any more.)
Well I respect that opinion, but I think throwing on the move is one of his obvious strengths really.
Thank you for putting up the fight here..
It is getting ridiculous what I am hearing about JJ
3rd rounder at best
Not really fighting here. I'm just not seeing McCarthy as a premium talent versus the big three.
Outside the big three, I don't think there are any other first round prospects. But I'm in the minority on this because it appears at least five are going day one.
a 2nd RD talent and contrary to many of the posts on this thread, he doesn't think JJ throws well on the move.
I didn't like JJ before I heard Pauline's comments. JJ is listed as 6' 3", but he looks shorter and his arm is good, but not great.
And all this talk about "intangibles" just seems like a different version of "hard worker/great guy"... and we've already got one of those.
Why not draft a QB with "tangibles"... great arm, good size, accurate, etc.?
If the Giants take JJ, I hope I'm wrong. I'd rather take Nabors in the first and gamble on Rattler in RD-2. (Don't think Rattler is going to make it to RD-3 any more.)
Well I respect that opinion, but I think throwing on the move is one of his obvious strengths really.
BB46... Here's a link to the Draft Season video where Tony chose JJ as his most overrated QB.
I like JJ but it’s too early to grade the top 6 accurately.
I’m looking forward to the combine more than usual. The drills will help sort out the .Qb’s potential.
I have a feeling JJ will run a 4.5 or better and excel in the athletic and agility drills.
If he throws as well as the top 3 he could be rated in the top 6 by draft time.
Nobody in that organization of any real capabilities is speaking with him, specifically Daboll and Schoen. With Wink and Wilkins gone, who would be his sources? I have no trust in his ability to determine what the Giants would like or not like.
McCarthy might be of interest, might not.
That last sentence has the same weight as PL's tweet.
Some QB almost always does.....
or
were you talking about Pat Leonard!
"Do I think McCarthy is a dramatic improvement over Daniel Jones...no...but he would be on a rookie contract..."
JFC, that sounds really daft. You can't invest in a QB largely because of resetting the contract. You need to draft a more talented player.
I don't like McCarthy at all in round one. But like nearly every QB in this 2024 class, he's more talented than Jones...
What I see is a young, very athletic, very strong-armed and highly accurate passer who did nothing but win at Michigan. I would LOVE hom or Daniels as our next QB.
"Do I think McCarthy is a dramatic improvement over Daniel Jones...no...but he would be on a rookie contract..."
JFC, that sounds really daft. You can't invest in a QB largely because of resetting the contract. You need to draft a more talented player.
I don't like McCarthy at all in round one. But like nearly every QB in this 2024 class, he's more talented than Jones...
Really good take. I won't read Leonard articles but if he is hinting that drafting a QB with a top ten pick only for a slight improvement on Jones but mostly because ue will be cheaper going forward... If thats his take, then his editor should fire him on the spot.
Winning pedigree, ability to throw on the move, and the outspoken leader vibe coaches like in a QB.
His off-platform stuff, from highlight video's, is really intriguing.
Winning pedigree, ability to throw on the move, and the outspoken leader vibe coaches like in a QB.
His off-platform stuff, from highlight video's, is really intriguing.
You mean Maye's size right? JD and JJ are the same size and JJ had more room to grow than JD due to body type and age. I like JJ's mind and movement in the pocket a lot myself, whereas I see that as a weakness for Maye. I also love his ability to throw on the run and off platform, I like JJ more than Maye. I still like JD more than JJ, but I would be happy with either of them. I'd be ok with Maye but a bit disappointed if JD and JJ went top 3.
What I see is a young, very athletic, very strong-armed and highly accurate passer who did nothing but win at Michigan. I would LOVE hom or Daniels as our next QB.
Agreed, and when I say I like his mind in the pocket it's obviously an educated guess vs an assumption that he is definitively amazing with reading defenses and making quick decisions.
Which will there be more threads on over the next two months - DJ sucks, or JJM? Probably DJ, because nearly every thread gets turned into a DJ sucks thread. Topic: We need a new punter. Reply: DJ sucks. punt him out the door. NFT: The sun rises in the east. Reply: and it's setting on DJ, coz he sucks.
But, can he play QB ?
AFTER the combine.
My gut tells me he's going to light it up throwing the ball, and any doubts about him going HIGH in rd 1 will be gone.
I think Leonard is a douche, personally, but I think he's on point here. Schoen and Daboll have given some insight into what "kind" of QB they like during the time they've been here, and I keep coming back to Maye and McCarthy.
AFTER the combine.
My gut tells me he's going to light it up throwing the ball, and any doubts about him going HIGH in rd 1 will be gone.
I think Leonard is a douche, personally, but I think he's on point here. Schoen and Daboll have given some insight into what "kind" of QB they like during the time they've been here, and I keep coming back to Maye and McCarthy.
What kind do they say they like?
I love your presence and posts here, but I really hope you're wrong about us not taking a rd1 qb. I'd be very happy with JD or JJ and I'd be good with Maye. Odds are we got a shot at one of those 3 at the least. Schoen also attended all of their games personally I believe.
Quote:
lets revisit the "don't touch him with a 10 ft pole in rd 1"
AFTER the combine.
My gut tells me he's going to light it up throwing the ball, and any doubts about him going HIGH in rd 1 will be gone.
I think Leonard is a douche, personally, but I think he's on point here. Schoen and Daboll have given some insight into what "kind" of QB they like during the time they've been here, and I keep coming back to Maye and McCarthy.
What kind do they say they like?
Mobile, smart, athletic, tough, ability to make plays out of the pocket with eyes downfield, threat to run
Quote:
In comment 16402794 Dave on the UWS said:
Quote:
lets revisit the "don't touch him with a 10 ft pole in rd 1"
AFTER the combine.
My gut tells me he's going to light it up throwing the ball, and any doubts about him going HIGH in rd 1 will be gone.
I think Leonard is a douche, personally, but I think he's on point here. Schoen and Daboll have given some insight into what "kind" of QB they like during the time they've been here, and I keep coming back to Maye and McCarthy.
What kind do they say they like?
Mobile, smart, athletic, tough, ability to make plays out of the pocket with eyes downfield, threat to run
So the non-mobile, dumb, unathletic, soft, poor pocket throwing, check down QB-types are all out of the question?
I don't think Caleb or Daniels fit the Giants MO, so it's really down to Maye vs. McCarthy IMO. Herbert or Burrow?
The threads on McCarthy are a lot more readable than the same posters who post the same regurgitated criticisms or excises for Daniel Jones. By a longshot.
Only a matter of time before this McCarthy thread gets one of the usual suspects posting a con about Jones and then that idiot Stroud chimes in along with the rest of the pro-Jones army.
That is pathetic. A columnist who exists only to troll a message board... Because he sure as shit isn't a good writer.
Gives me more reason to completely ignore him.
I don't think Caleb or Daniels fit the Giants MO, so it's really down to Maye vs. McCarthy IMO. Herbert or Burrow?
I agree that Maye and McCarthy have the prototypical characteristics that scream NYG. If they are the two, I'll cheer if Maye is there, and Schoen ends the Jones era buy selecting him.
Maye definitely has a game that mirrors a lot of what Herbert and Burrow have. McCarthy? Not so much...
McCarthy reminds me of a bigger version of Bryce Young. But I think Young is a more talented thrower.
McCarthy is obviously polarizing, but I think he is more talented than Jones. And he has pedigree being a 4-star recruit, winning programs (IMG, Michigan), playing for Harbaugh, NCG, etc.
I'm just not convinced he's a lottery talent.
But if we select him, I expect him to quickly out-play Jones and secure the starter's role. And then it's up to Dabka to hopefully have enough to develop him.
"Do I think McCarthy is a dramatic improvement over Daniel Jones...no...but he would be on a rookie contract..."
JFC, that sounds really daft. You can't invest in a QB largely because of resetting the contract. You need to draft a more talented player.
I don't like McCarthy at all in round one. But like nearly every QB in this 2024 class, he's more talented than Jones...
Thank you for putting up the fight here..
It is getting ridiculous what I am hearing about JJ
3rd rounder at best
Quote:
I don't think Caleb or Daniels fit the Giants MO, so it's really down to Maye vs. McCarthy IMO. Herbert or Burrow?
I agree that Maye and McCarthy have the prototypical characteristics that scream NYG. If they are the two, I'll cheer if Maye is there, and Schoen ends the Jones era buy selecting him.
Maye definitely has a game that mirrors a lot of what Herbert and Burrow have. McCarthy? Not so much...
McCarthy reminds me of a bigger version of Bryce Young. But I think Young is a more talented thrower.
Well, McCarthy is a lot more athletically gifted and physically gifted than Bryce Young for starters. McCarthy will eventually play at 6'3 220-225 imo, Bryce Young is what 5'10 with a slender frame and didn't even put up any athletic testing cuz he is at best average in that department. I think that comparison doesn't make a lot of sense tbh, I also think McCarthy has a stronger arm and many other aspects that I think project better than Bryce Young's. I still can't believe the Panthers took him over CJ stroud. All you had to do was watch the Georgia Ohio St tape to see Stroud over Young was an obvious choice smfh
Quote:
and I'm paraphrasing:
"Do I think McCarthy is a dramatic improvement over Daniel Jones...no...but he would be on a rookie contract..."
JFC, that sounds really daft. You can't invest in a QB largely because of resetting the contract. You need to draft a more talented player.
I don't like McCarthy at all in round one. But like nearly every QB in this 2024 class, he's more talented than Jones...
Thank you for putting up the fight here..
It is getting ridiculous what I am hearing about JJ
3rd rounder at best
Would be nice if we took him at 6 and he ended up being the answer wouldn't it? :)
Not a scrambler.
If you watch Allen and Mahomes, other than the designed runs, they try to win from the pocket first and only run if they have to, frequently to buy time.
Someone like Lamar Jackson can’t wait to take off.
CW is an interesting prospect in he moves around so much I’m not sure how disciplined in the pocket he is. Daniels has incredible skills both as a passer AND runner. Maye and McCarthy fit the way Daboll wants the QB to play.
To be fair I feel like this was fairly accurate in his first 2 years, but he has evolved a lot. I still don't think he has that clutch mechanism where he elevates his game in the big moments.
I didn't like JJ before I heard Pauline's comments. JJ is listed as 6' 3", but he looks shorter and his arm is good, but not great.
And all this talk about "intangibles" just seems like a different version of "hard worker/great guy"... and we've already got one of those.
Why not draft a QB with "tangibles"... great arm, good size, accurate, etc.?
If the Giants take JJ, I hope I'm wrong. I'd rather take Nabors in the first and gamble on Rattler in RD-2. (Don't think Rattler is going to make it to RD-3 any more.)
I didn't like JJ before I heard Pauline's comments. JJ is listed as 6' 3", but he looks shorter and his arm is good, but not great.
And all this talk about "intangibles" just seems like a different version of "hard worker/great guy"... and we've already got one of those.
Why not draft a QB with "tangibles"... great arm, good size, accurate, etc.?
If the Giants take JJ, I hope I'm wrong. I'd rather take Nabors in the first and gamble on Rattler in RD-2. (Don't think Rattler is going to make it to RD-3 any more.)
Well I respect that opinion, but I think throwing on the move is one of his obvious strengths really.
Quote:
and I'm paraphrasing:
"Do I think McCarthy is a dramatic improvement over Daniel Jones...no...but he would be on a rookie contract..."
JFC, that sounds really daft. You can't invest in a QB largely because of resetting the contract. You need to draft a more talented player.
I don't like McCarthy at all in round one. But like nearly every QB in this 2024 class, he's more talented than Jones...
Thank you for putting up the fight here..
It is getting ridiculous what I am hearing about JJ
3rd rounder at best
Colin Cowherd's BBI handle?
He's a top 12 pick easy.
Thank you for putting up the fight here..
It is getting ridiculous what I am hearing about JJ
3rd rounder at best
Not really fighting here. I'm just not seeing McCarthy as a premium talent versus the big three.
Outside the big three, I don't think there are any other first round prospects. But I'm in the minority on this because it appears at least five are going day one.
Quote:
a 2nd RD talent and contrary to many of the posts on this thread, he doesn't think JJ throws well on the move.
I didn't like JJ before I heard Pauline's comments. JJ is listed as 6' 3", but he looks shorter and his arm is good, but not great.
And all this talk about "intangibles" just seems like a different version of "hard worker/great guy"... and we've already got one of those.
Why not draft a QB with "tangibles"... great arm, good size, accurate, etc.?
If the Giants take JJ, I hope I'm wrong. I'd rather take Nabors in the first and gamble on Rattler in RD-2. (Don't think Rattler is going to make it to RD-3 any more.)
Well I respect that opinion, but I think throwing on the move is one of his obvious strengths really.
BB46... Here's a link to the Draft Season video where Tony chose JJ as his most overrated QB.
His JJ eval starts at 2:44.
Pauline on JJ - ( New Window )
Blue horseshoe likes Anacott steel...
I’m looking forward to the combine more than usual. The drills will help sort out the .Qb’s potential.
I have a feeling JJ will run a 4.5 or better and excel in the athletic and agility drills.
If he throws as well as the top 3 he could be rated in the top 6 by draft time.