for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

Giants considering using rare tactic with Xavier McKinney

GFAN52 : 2/21/2024 2:56 pm
negotiations.

"They will negotiate with McKinney’s representatives and if a deal cannot get done — there is no reason to believe an agreement will be reached — they have until March 5 to apply the lesser-used transition tag on him. That is a possibility, the Post has learned.

It would cost the Giants $13.9 million, a nice savings from the franchise tag. The transition tag allows the player to negotiate with any other team and come up with a deal, with the Giants having the ability to match that offer sheet and retain the player.

In effect, if the Giants put the transition tag on McKinney — their 2020 second-round pick — another team will determine what the market is willing to pay him and the Giants can then decide if that contract fits with their valuation of the player. If the Giants do not match the offer, McKinney is gone and the Giants do not receive any compensation in return."
Link - ( New Window )
Does he factor in the comp pick formula?  
robbieballs2003 : 2/21/2024 3:04 pm : link
If not, they won't do that.
...  
christian : 2/21/2024 3:08 pm : link
Transition tag negates comp eligibility, but the Giants activity in UFA probably will as well.
bw..  
IchabodGiant : 2/21/2024 4:14 pm : link
is going to love it!
RE: bw..  
bw in dc : 2/21/2024 4:36 pm : link
In comment 16404636 IchabodGiant said:
Quote:
is going to love it!

 
Leave it to the Giants to possibly use some type of tag in back-to-back years on the two most fungible positions in the NFL.

But I do think it's a smart, under-used tool. And it would have been very useful last year for the Jones situation. I will go to my grave believing Jones would not have received an offer >$25M AAV from the open market.

I don't think they should use any tag on McKinney but  
ThomasG : 2/21/2024 4:42 pm : link
if you had to use one it had better be the TT versus the FT.

Agree  
mpinmaine : 2/21/2024 5:51 pm : link
They should use TT
RE: RE: bw..  
djm : 2/21/2024 6:05 pm : link
In comment 16404665 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 16404636 IchabodGiant said:


Quote:


is going to love it!


 
Leave it to the Giants to possibly use some type of tag in back-to-back years on the two most fungible positions in the NFL.

But I do think it's a smart, under-used tool. And it would have been very useful last year for the Jones situation. I will go to my grave believing Jones would not have received an offer >$25M AAV from the open market.


Since when is a playmaking safety who can cover and support the run a fungible position? Wtf did I miss??? Oh and he calls all the plays.

Passing league. Good safeties are important.
RE: RE: RE: bw..  
bluefin : 2/21/2024 6:09 pm : link
In comment 16404731 djm said:
Quote:
In comment 16404665 bw in dc said:


Quote:


In comment 16404636 IchabodGiant said:


Quote:


is going to love it!


 
Leave it to the Giants to possibly use some type of tag in back-to-back years on the two most fungible positions in the NFL.

But I do think it's a smart, under-used tool. And it would have been very useful last year for the Jones situation. I will go to my grave believing Jones would not have received an offer >$25M AAV from the open market.




Since when is a playmaking safety who can cover and support the run a fungible position? Wtf did I miss??? Oh and he calls all the plays.

Passing league. Good safeties are important.

+1
before I click  
fkap : 2/21/2024 6:21 pm : link
is it click bait saying it's an option for the Giants,

or did they present evidence the Giants are considering it?
...  
dancing blue bear : 2/21/2024 6:30 pm : link
In comment 16404737 bluefin said:
Quote:
In comment 16404731 djm said:


Quote:




Since when is a playmaking safety who can cover and support the run a fungible position? Wtf did I miss??? Oh and he calls all the plays.

Passing league. Good safeties are important.


+1

I'm with you. good, versitile safties are a tremendous asset.
the group think has run amok.
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 2/21/2024 6:42 pm : link
Not a bad tactic. I like X & would like him back, but I don't wanna break the bank.
He would get a multi year deal  
Essex : 2/21/2024 7:09 pm : link
From a bunch of teams I think. If they did this, we would lose him, which I think the giants have to know
I  
AcidTest : 2/21/2024 7:37 pm : link
wouldn't do this.

It's frankly their job to know what the market is for their players, especially a high-value FA like McKinney. And as someone said, using the TT means he doesn't go into the comp formula.

I'd try and resign him, but think someone will offer him a lot more than what the Giants are willing to or should pay.
RE: RE: RE: bw..  
bw in dc : 2/21/2024 7:45 pm : link
In comment 16404731 djm said:
Quote:


Since when is a playmaking safety who can cover and support the run a fungible position? Wtf did I miss??? Oh and he calls all the plays.

Passing league. Good safeties are important.


Safety is the cheapest position on defense in the NFL per the projected FT $s. Like RB is the cheapest position on offense.

This isn't new information.

So, the average of the five top safeties is $16M+. Do you really think that's a wise use of cap dollars at this point? Unless we have a safety that conjures images of Ed Reed or Ronnie Lott, there is no need to overspend.

And this looks like a good free agent market with safeties. So, if we lose X to another team willing to overpay, there are other solutions...

Safeties...LOL.
Just get...  
2ndroundKO : 2/21/2024 7:54 pm : link
a deal done and let's sign a draft pick to a second contract for once. And I'm not just saying we should do that just to do it. McKinney is deserving. Folks act like he's Jerrel Jernigan and showed up at the end of the season or something. McKinney is proven -- five interceptions during a standout 2021 and PFF rated him the fourth-best safety this year, for what it's worse. At 24, he's an ascending talent.

I don't know what the cost will be and I'm sure there is a number where we may have to bow out but I hope the Giants make a serious effort to retain him and I believe they will.
I predicted this 9 days ago  
JoeyBigBlue : 2/21/2024 7:59 pm : link
He’s still a solid player, going into the prime of his career. They should negotiate with him in good faith to try to get a deal done. The transition tag gives us a chance to at least match an offer, if we see fit.


Giants Free Agent Class - ( New Window )
RE: RE: RE: bw..  
FStubbs : 2/21/2024 8:12 pm : link
In comment 16404731 djm said:
Quote:
In comment 16404665 bw in dc said:


Quote:


In comment 16404636 IchabodGiant said:


Quote:


is going to love it!


 
Leave it to the Giants to possibly use some type of tag in back-to-back years on the two most fungible positions in the NFL.

But I do think it's a smart, under-used tool. And it would have been very useful last year for the Jones situation. I will go to my grave believing Jones would not have received an offer >$25M AAV from the open market.




Since when is a playmaking safety who can cover and support the run a fungible position? Wtf did I miss??? Oh and he calls all the plays.

Passing league. Good safeties are important.


Yeah. While safeties are one of the more "fungible" positions, there's a gulf of difference between safety and RB because safeties aren't used up at the end of their contract.

So the correct position is to pay him as long as he doesn't break the bank. That being said, some team out there will probably offer him the stupid money.
Keep X  
AROCK1000 : 2/21/2024 8:15 pm : link
.
I mentioned the transition tag for X a month ago  
BigBlue7 : 2/21/2024 8:30 pm : link
Seems like a no brainer
RE: I mentioned the transition tag for X a month ago  
Angel Eyes : 2/21/2024 9:31 pm : link
In comment 16404870 BigBlue7 said:
Quote:
Seems like a no brainer

So did I in an offseason plan.
RE: RE: bw..  
sb from NYT Forum : 2/21/2024 10:32 pm : link
In comment 16404665 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 16404636 IchabodGiant said:


Quote:


is going to love it!


 
Leave it to the Giants to possibly use some type of tag in back-to-back years on the two most fungible positions in the NFL.

But I do think it's a smart, under-used tool. And it would have been very useful last year for the Jones situation. I will go to my grave believing Jones would not have received an offer >$25M AAV from the open market.


John Mara is not the only NFL owner that thinks the best qualities of an NFL QB are a strong jawline and firm handshake.
Why is the TT so rare?  
cpgiants : 2/21/2024 11:15 pm : link
Because a GM might find it strange to admit that he does not know the value of a player on the open market.....cuz that's kinda precisely his job to figure that out....

Here, I think it is a good fit.

Why? You have a young player who was in quick ascent to the top of the league at his position. Then he had a serious injury, and came back very good, but not quite the same....

Let's see what the rest of the league thinks and then make a decision.
I don’t think they should use it  
Rudy5757 : 2/22/2024 12:42 am : link
Offer him a fair deal, if he wants to be a Giant he will sign it. If he doesn’t so be it. We have to stop paying top $$$ to every player and bring in players who want to be here. In hindsight we overpaid Jones, we offered Barkley more than the market value and got lucky he rejected. The Okereke deal seemed high but he played great. Glowinski was an overpay.

I do like the idea of keeping our guys. I think X is a very good player but not a great one. He’s young and still on the rise. The transition tag is not looked upon well by the players so I think a lot of GMs try to avoid that look. You are in essence letting another team negotiate for you. Having players on the tag sucks up too much cap space. You can’t manipulate the money and it would lock us up in FA like the Barkley deal did but we could still lose the player and miss out on others. Hard pass on the TT.
I just think the transition tag is a waste of time  
Essex : 2/22/2024 5:47 am : link
because if a team wants to sign him and I have to think there will be a team or two with cap room to do it, they are going to structure it friendly to their situation and not our own. If we want to resign him, just do it. If not, let him go
RE: I just think the transition tag is a waste of time  
DonQuixote : 2/22/2024 6:57 am : link
In comment 16404986 Essex said:
Quote:
because if a team wants to sign him and I have to think there will be a team or two with cap room to do it, they are going to structure it friendly to their situation and not our own. If we want to resign him, just do it. If not, let him go


+1. I actually think both tags are kind of unnecessary and antagonistic toward the player.
There's playing football and there's playing tag  
Marty in Albany : 2/22/2024 8:31 am : link
Money makes everything complicated.
To save what?  
jeff57 : 2/22/2024 8:41 am : link
2 or 3 million? Not worth it. Just franchise him in that event.
In my opinion even though I am not fond  
mpinmaine : 2/22/2024 9:03 am : link
About his recent statement or tweet (whatever)...
..I think if they sign him for even 15 per it wouldn't be something that they would regret 3 or 4 years down the line (if it was indeed say a 4 year deal)

The FT # will be up by then as well as the cap #.
Giants are bad. Giants lack cap space. Giants draft a good player.  
81_Great_Dane : 2/22/2024 9:10 am : link
Giants remain bad. Giants still lack cap space.

Good player leaves in free agency. Giants remain bad as they try to replace departed player, and still lack cap space.

Bored with this cycle.
TT makes sense for Barkley not X  
rnargi : 2/22/2024 9:38 am : link
As mentioned, if we lose X on the TT, no chance of supplemental draft pick. And I don't think we'll be able to match a contract offered to X if they can't come to a deal before the tag becomes necessary. X is going to get better offers than what the Giants can afford. So the question is, will X stay for less? Reading the tea leaves, the answer seems like a no.

As for Barkley, tagging him at 12+M for 1 year makes little sense in both the long and short term. Either do a handshake deal and let him walk with the option to match whatever he can get on the open market or TT him. That ensures either a long term deal that is palatable to both parties or the Giants are at least in play for a supplemental pick if he does go elsewhere.
The point of using TT for McKinney  
UberAlias : 2/22/2024 9:50 am : link
Is because he has an exaggerated perception for what his market is. Using the TT allows you to retain his rights while giving him a chance to recalibrate his expectation based on market feedback. It makes sense. Worst case is he finds a buyer out of our price range and he moves on. But his intention is to move on anyway. If NYG has a price tag on him between 13M and 16M and they believe the market may seem the same, it is 100% the way to go if XM has his eyes set on 16M or more.
RE: The point of using TT for McKinney  
rnargi : 2/22/2024 10:13 am : link
In comment 16405109 UberAlias said:
Quote:
Is because he has an exaggerated perception for what his market is. Using the TT allows you to retain his rights while giving him a chance to recalibrate his expectation based on market feedback. It makes sense. Worst case is he finds a buyer out of our price range and he moves on. But his intention is to move on anyway. If NYG has a price tag on him between 13M and 16M and they believe the market may seem the same, it is 100% the way to go if XM has his eyes set on 16M or more.


I get it, but I think X is going to get his money. I think it will be more than what the Giants are willing to pay. Just my opinion, gut feeling...and that and almost 10 bucks will get you a cup of joe at Starbucks
It sounds like he wants to get paid  
JonC : 2/22/2024 10:39 am : link
$16M figures to be the target baseline for his camp. He gone.
Safety QBs the secondary  
bc4life : 2/22/2024 10:39 am : link
In a passing league, that's not nothing.

RE: The point of using TT for McKinney  
Essex : 2/22/2024 11:11 am : link
In comment 16405109 UberAlias said:
Quote:
Is because he has an exaggerated perception for what his market is. Using the TT allows you to retain his rights while giving him a chance to recalibrate his expectation based on market feedback. It makes sense. Worst case is he finds a buyer out of our price range and he moves on. But his intention is to move on anyway. If NYG has a price tag on him between 13M and 16M and they believe the market may seem the same, it is 100% the way to go if XM has his eyes set on 16M or more.

Teams don’t like wasting their time, if they sign him to an offer sheet they will do it creatively knowing their cap situation and have a good idea of what the Giants cap is so that the offer sheet is really a poison pill for the Giants and that is why it is not used that often.
RE: TT makes sense for Barkley not X  
Mayo2JZ : 2/22/2024 1:30 pm : link
In comment 16405089 rnargi said:
Quote:
As mentioned, if we lose X on the TT, no chance of supplemental draft pick. And I don't think we'll be able to match a contract offered to X if they can't come to a deal before the tag becomes necessary. X is going to get better offers than what the Giants can afford. So the question is, will X stay for less? Reading the tea leaves, the answer seems like a no.

As for Barkley, tagging him at 12+M for 1 year makes little sense in both the long and short term. Either do a handshake deal and let him walk with the option to match whatever he can get on the open market or TT him. That ensures either a long term deal that is palatable to both parties or the Giants are at least in play for a supplemental pick if he does go elsewhere.


After what the Giants did for him when he injured himself why shouldn’t he take less? They could have curtailed his salary but they didn’t and even though we made the playoffs he was out for some key games. Why is it ALWAYS about the welfare of the player? IMHO he should be grateful to the Giants and show it during negotiations
I would like the Giants to sign him to a second contract  
arniefez : 2/22/2024 4:17 pm : link
I think he is an ascending player who will be more impactful with the new DC than the old one.

The Giants are year late discussing using the TT. If only.
I hate blurbs like this where you can't tell if there's real substance  
Milton : 2/22/2024 7:17 pm : link
Or if it's just someone in the organization stating the obvious, because everything is possible at this point in the process. Is someone gonna say "no" when the Post asks if the transition tag is a possibility?
Back to the Corner