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| Quote: |
| "Once you get paid that amount of money as a Quarterback you cant blame things on everybody else...You're the guy and you have to find a way to deliver" |
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And never add full context.
He bitched slapped you. Glad you were able to recover and take this one you’re getting now since you literally made up shit I said because I countered with common sense that you never include.
First off you implied I said Jones didn't have a worse oline which was never said. Secondly, if you don't want things implied, then simply answer the questions - Do you have similar expectations of Jones and Devito?
When did I imply you said anything about the OL and Joes didn’t have a worse one? I literally asked you :-4 questions about it thst you totally ignored.
Stay on task.
Injuries fucking matter especially to your best players.
Should the eagles move on from him since he didn’t get it done at the end of the year? Of course not. But to discount them as major reasons why a QB can struggle is just being obtuse.
Oline - ( New Window )
Goal posts are a shifting with still NO context from last year lol
So we aren't allowed to count 2023? That's new one for the Jones cult. Nobody said when we signed him to an historic contract that we might have to give him a mulligan. Franchise QBs don't get mulligans.
actually I asked you questions that you ignored. Pretty prevalent ones too.
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To compare jones play to devito’s?
Goal posts are a shifting with still NO context from last year lol
So we aren't allowed to count 2023? That's new one for the Jones cult. Nobody said when we signed him to an historic contract that we might have to give him a mulligan. Franchise QBs don't get mulligans.
This makes zero sense. I am not a jones cult. I’ve wanted a new QB back in October you foolish troll. I think you were banned under Producer then and posted as NorCalGiant fan back then.
Tough to keep up.
But let's revisit the concept of good quarterback that we broached last week. If Jones was among that dozen or so good quarterbacks in the league, how *should* he even out the scale?
Ezeudu, Breida, Jones vs.
Thomas, Barkley, DeVito
I'd argue the quarterback is such an outsized contributor, a good quarterback would offset a bad lineman and running back. Is that fair?
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. Oline - ( New Window )
actually I asked you questions that you ignored. Pretty prevalent ones too.
How is saying the offensive line was putrid for Jones and Devito avoiding the question?
I even gave the pressure stats. Jones got 2 more pressures in the same amount of games. TWO!
The offensive line was putrid for both players, it doesn't matter what the combinations were. Maybe guys like Ezedu and Neal were better than Devito playing with Phillips and Pugh.
So now that it's settled the offensive line was bad for both players, do you have the same set of expectations for Devito and Jones?
But let's revisit the concept of good quarterback that we broached last week. If Jones was among that dozen or so good quarterbacks in the league, how *should* he even out the scale?
Ezeudu, Breida, Jones vs.
Thomas, Barkley, DeVito
I'd argue the quarterback is such an outsized contributor, a good quarterback would offset a bad lineman and running back. Is that fair?
Over a course of a season - I would agree with you. A handful of games is different. Would you argue that most QBs would perform worse without their best players?
Look at Dobbs with Minny and Browning from Cincy - they had some initial success early on - then struggled even with some really good players once film got out on them.
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In comment 16408090 ajr2456 said:
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. Oline - ( New Window )
actually I asked you questions that you ignored. Pretty prevalent ones too.
How is saying the offensive line was putrid for Jones and Devito avoiding the question?
I even gave the pressure stats. Jones got 2 more pressures in the same amount of games. TWO!
The offensive line was putrid for both players, it doesn't matter what the combinations were. Maybe guys like Ezedu and Neal were better than Devito playing with Phillips and Pugh.
So now that it's settled the offensive line was bad for both players, do you have the same set of expectations for Devito and Jones?
Because jones OL could be argued was a lot worse. And I tried showing it by using your stat.
And what if Ezeudu and the other schleps were worse??? You don’t know.
I am going to make a very bold claim. And you can argue this if you want. Andrew Thomas is a much better LT than Josh Ezeudu. Therefore - jones probably would have seen less pressure from his blind side and probably would have played at least a little better.
Now if Ezeudu played for Devito - I would argue he gets pressured more and therefore may have been sacked or played worse.
I know those are bold claims. Very bold. But I am gonna stick with them.
You just assume. Not a good philosophy.
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In comment 16408079 JT039 said:
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To compare jones play to devito’s?
Goal posts are a shifting with still NO context from last year lol
So we aren't allowed to count 2023? That's new one for the Jones cult. Nobody said when we signed him to an historic contract that we might have to give him a mulligan. Franchise QBs don't get mulligans.
This makes zero sense. I am not a jones cult. I’ve wanted a new QB back in October you foolish troll. I think you were banned under Producer then and posted as NorCalGiant fan back then.
Tough to keep up.
It doesn't make sense to have high expectations for your $100M QB? You want to get rid of Jones? Then what are you arguing about? This is troll behavior. You are just arguing for the sake of it. Seems you agree with ajr, then. What's your actual opinion?
The pressure stats are what they are. Even if you want to say Jones has marginally worse offensive line he performed significantly worse than an UDFA rookie. At a minimum he should have performed at the same level of DeVito.
Which is Osi’s point.
The offensive line was bad all year. So were the quarterbacks, but one quarterback was significantly worse than the other two.
Don’t add that type of context, Greg. Data doesn’t matter.
You know it was in garbage time right moron?
He led us ro a whopping 3 points is context?
lol.
But the data!!!
Nobody is allowed to assume but you. Daniel Jones would have had a good season if Thomas didn’t get hurt. And Ezeudu/Neal is confirmed worse than having a guy off the couch and Phillips at RT.
Except Pugh was rated one of the Giants worst Olineman. Both lines were bad. Jones still should have outperformed DeVito, even if slightly. Not sure how that’s even debatable. DeVito is going to be running a sandwich shop in 3 years.
Nobody is allowed to assume but you. Daniel Jones would have had a good season if Thomas didn’t get hurt. And Ezeudu/Neal is confirmed worse than having a guy off the couch and Phillips at RT.
Except Pugh was rated one of the Giants worst Olineman. Both lines were bad. Jones still should have outperformed DeVito, even if slightly. Not sure how that’s even debatable. DeVito is going to be running a sandwich shop in 3 years.
Here you go making up shit again. Did I ever once say jones was good or would have been good? No. I said jones should perform better than Devito. But they didn’t have the same players. They didn’t play against the same teams. Variables matter. I said he would have performed better with his two best offensive players? What a fucking shock right? Well maybe for you…
This isnt the first time you made up shit in this thread so clearly your flustered that you were proven wrong again. Grow the fuck up already.
And data does matter - just next time - use it with same variables. Missing the teams two best offensive players makes a massive difference. Despite your continuous omitting of it.
And anyone comparing him to Herbert is either blind or truly delusional. They are in different stratospheres.
But let's revisit the concept of good quarterback that we broached last week. If Jones was among that dozen or so good quarterbacks in the league, how *should* he even out the scale?
Ezeudu, Breida, Jones vs.
Thomas, Barkley, DeVito
I'd argue the quarterback is such an outsized contributor, a good quarterback would offset a bad lineman and running back. Is that fair?
Over a course of a season - I would agree with you. A handful of games is different. Would you argue that most QBs would perform worse without their best players?
Look at Dobbs with Minny and Browning from Cincy - they had some initial success early on - then struggled even with some really good players once film got out on them.
I think that's true and it's why the Giants went back to Taylor.
To me the real analogue is Taylor. I think all things equal, the sobering conclusion from last season is Jones is in the class of QB as Taylor.
And anyone comparing him to Herbert is either blind or truly delusional. They are in different stratospheres.
The comparison to Herbert was poking some fun at Osi's comment that Jones has to deliver, no excuses. (Basically - DO IT ANYWAYZ!) We know we've handed you a historically bad OL and bottom-tier skill players - but DELIVER!
I'm assuming "deliver" = deep postseason run.
No QB is going to deliver jack shit behind an OL as bad as the Giants had last year, paired with bottom-tier skill players. Look at Herbert. Some good stats and wow throws, but he hasn't delivered. Even though he has 2 #1-type WRs + Josh Palmer as his #3, who would probably be the #1 here.
That's why Herbert was brought into the conversation. He isn't doing it anywayz, either.
I got 4 hours of chemo now. I’ll make you feel better and say you “win”. Maybe you will shut the fuck ip for the rest of the day so people can actually post relevant stuff.
If you want to talk about arguing things that weren't said.
Dep - ( New Window )
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Miami too. And against Dallas, San Fran and Seattle. Where were his garbage time stats?
I got 4 hours of chemo now. I’ll make you feel better and say you “win”. Maybe you will shut the fuck ip for the rest of the day so people can actually post relevant stuff.
You're going to start posting relevant stuff?
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I think Thomas and Barkley had a marked impact on the offense. They are far and away the two best offensive players on the team.
But let's revisit the concept of good quarterback that we broached last week. If Jones was among that dozen or so good quarterbacks in the league, how *should* he even out the scale?
Ezeudu, Breida, Jones vs.
Thomas, Barkley, DeVito
I'd argue the quarterback is such an outsized contributor, a good quarterback would offset a bad lineman and running back. Is that fair?
Over a course of a season - I would agree with you. A handful of games is different. Would you argue that most QBs would perform worse without their best players?
Look at Dobbs with Minny and Browning from Cincy - they had some initial success early on - then struggled even with some really good players once film got out on them.
I think that's true and it's why the Giants went back to Taylor.
To me the real analogue is Taylor. I think all things equal, the sobering conclusion from last season is Jones is in the class of QB as Taylor.
For once - you and I are in agreement. Jones future looks to be of a pretty good backup. Now that there’s anything wrong with that. But he’s here one more year and hopefully gone.
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Did people watch him play this year? It wasn't like he was up and down. He played to the level of probably the worst quarterback in the league. How can you not be alarmed by that?
And anyone comparing him to Herbert is either blind or truly delusional. They are in different stratospheres.
The comparison to Herbert was poking some fun at Osi's comment that Jones has to deliver, no excuses. (Basically - DO IT ANYWAYZ!) We know we've handed you a historically bad OL and bottom-tier skill players - but DELIVER!
I'm assuming "deliver" = deep postseason run.
No QB is going to deliver jack shit behind an OL as bad as the Giants had last year, paired with bottom-tier skill players. Look at Herbert. Some good stats and wow throws, but he hasn't delivered. Even though he has 2 #1-type WRs + Josh Palmer as his #3, who would probably be the #1 here.
That's why Herbert was brought into the conversation. He isn't doing it anywayz, either.
Josh Palmer is a number 1 WR??
Herbert hasn't delivered? He has shown that he can play at the highest level, there is no doubting that. Jones has never proven that and has had an extra season to do it. That's the difference.
His injured shortened 2023 season would still be the best year in Jones career.
Finally something we agree on!
He may not have been referring to Jones placing blame, but rather everyone us (the "you all" meaning of "you").
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. Oline - ( New Window )
actually I asked you questions that you ignored. Pretty prevalent ones too.
Prevalent? Are you sure you know what that word means?
Did you mean "relevant"?
That's why I'm unconvinced by the "he didn't have Thomas or Barkley or Wan'Dale" argument. This kind of falls into the "tough shit" cateogry for me. He wanted that big $40 million number to parade around after 1 good season, so Schoen structured it like the Geno and Carr contracts that essentially function as 2-year windows. He forfeited the luxury of time and flexibility. For all intents and purposes, Schoen DID make efforts to build around him by bringing back Barkley, trading for Waller, signing Campbell, and drafting JMS in addition the Olineman he drafted in 2022.
You can say these acquisitions were bad, but we already have assistant coaches and players wondering why Taylor performed (according to Dunleavy). But the bottom line is that his contract doesn't provide a window for the Giants to provide a perfect environment for him before they have to commit more money and years to his contract.
Beat me to it.
True statement.
Very simple .
I thought I also heard him say DJ has all the ability and no way he can't turn it around.
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when did he ever blame anyone else?
Beat me to it.
Another victim of Jones Above Success Syndrome (JONES A.S.S.).
That logic doesn't compute on this board.
The thing is, time may eventually wind up on their side. It IS possible he learns to perform at his best consistently and puts his bad traits behind him. I just certainly wouldn't count on it whatsoever and feel like it's massively risky to do so.
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I can’t help but laugh that people still defend Jones. Buy then again, it’s a cult so I shouldn’t be surprised.
The thing is, time may eventually wind up on their side. It IS possible he learns to perform at his best consistently and puts his bad traits behind him. I just certainly wouldn't count on it whatsoever and feel like it's massively risky to do so.
I can totally believe him having a revival with another team, similar to how Jake Plummer had a couple of good years with Mike Shannahan. Given today's NFL and overall QB play and health, he'll be back on the field in no time.
It's basically over with the Giants though. That's just how it is sometimes.
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and he is correct. You have to make plays for 40M. And he does not .
Very simple .
I thought I also heard him say DJ has all the ability and no way he can't turn it around.
Oh, there are plenty of ways he can't turn it around.
Starting with he never had "it".
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In comment 16408500 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
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I can’t help but laugh that people still defend Jones. Buy then again, it’s a cult so I shouldn’t be surprised.
The thing is, time may eventually wind up on their side. It IS possible he learns to perform at his best consistently and puts his bad traits behind him. I just certainly wouldn't count on it whatsoever and feel like it's massively risky to do so.
I can totally believe him having a revival with another team, similar to how Jake Plummer had a couple of good years with Mike Shannahan. Given today's NFL and overall QB play and health, he'll be back on the field in no time.
It's basically over with the Giants though. That's just how it is sometimes.
There isn't one other NFL team that would go into next season choosing Jones to be their starter, even if we was available.
There isn't one other NFL team that would go into next season choosing Jones to be their starter, even if we was available.
He definitely won't go into 2025 as a starter, but say the Panthers sign him and Bryce continues to look like shit? Not hard to imagine him back on the field again.
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You one throw passes over 10 yards when you have 1.5 seconds to throw. Maybe that stat forgot to include that part of the equation for Jones in the majority of his starts in 2023
That logic doesn't compute on this board.
It's because it's not actually true.
The unfortunate victims of JONES A.S.S. seem to lack basic logic and reasoning skills.
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There isn't one other NFL team that would go into next season choosing Jones to be their starter, even if we was available.
He definitely won't go into 2025 as a starter, but say the Panthers sign him and Bryce continues to look like shit? Not hard to imagine him back on the field again.
I think he'll start in 2025, but be a backup and on his third team by 2026