he cherry picks some Valid points to make his comments.
IF Jones played at the Minn. playoff game EVERY game, then JS would be "technically correct" in his evaluation.
Now, he absolutely can NOT speak to Jones' injuries as the major reason they would have to move on. That would destroy any bargaining position they may need.
At this time of year, ANY smart GM "loves" ALL his players (Barkley, Jones, X), until its time to put up or shut up.
If they take, say McCarthy at 6, look for Schoen to say something along the lines of:
"DJ is still our starter, but the value was just too good to pass up". They will NEVER say, "we picked him to replace Jones right away". You don't conduct business this way.
RE: RE: The problem with drafting Penix or Nix in round 2...
They're both far more talented players than Jones. They'd be nearly as much a threat to Jones as one of the top 3 guys. I don't know that they'd want to introduce that.
By the way the scenario I laid out is optimistic; it's just as possible Jones is not released and he plays out his whole deal. Or perhaps he's restructured.
The Giants think he's good.
So not only won't they draft a first round QB, they won't even bring in viable competition? So, essentially a *downgrade* from last years QB room? Because, DeVito would move up to QB2 and a day 3 QB would be drafted.
I very much hope you are wrong. If nothing else, the injuries should at least provide a greater emphasis on QB regardless of their belief in Jones.
I'd expect a vet FA brought in as 2024 insurance for Jones's knee injury. Tannehill, Trubisky, Brissett, Mariota...we all know the names. And maybe DeVito gets replaced by a draft pick (Pratt, Rattler, etc.).
A quick Q&A with the General Manager so Giants.com can get some internet activity had no vibe. It was nondescript.
Credit to the one caller who asked Schoen basically what the hell he sees in Daniel Jones anyway. But Schoen took the high road as any Sen Mngt-type should. He also pointed to the Minn game to probably defend himself more than anything.
I don't know if Schoen will pick or QB or not, and if he does will it be early in the draft or not. But he's committing professional suicide if they pass on upgrading the position in such a deep QB draft.
They're both far more talented players than Jones. They'd be nearly as much a threat to Jones as one of the top 3 guys. I don't know that they'd want to introduce that.
By the way the scenario I laid out is optimistic; it's just as possible Jones is not released and he plays out his whole deal. Or perhaps he's restructured.
The Giants think he's good.
__________________
You have to give Schoen a little more credit for managing a team. Even if he thinks Jones is good enough and Jones is ready to start the season, he has to have a better backup than TT in case Jones gets injured again. The question is how high he will pick one. And that QB will sit on the bench for 4, 8, or 12 games until Jones gets hurt or plays down to expectations and the fan base is chanting in unison for a backup. So the QB room will have Jones, TT or a vet, and the rookie. DeVito will end up on the practice squad if he continues to look capable and has worked on his flaws during the offseason.
Remember that time the Broncos didn't try to upgrade the QB position for years because Tebow threw for 316 yards in a playoff win and spent the next few years only talking about that game whenever anyone questioned them about it?
Oh wait..
Nope can't say that I remember that at all. And neither do you. The Broncos drafted Osweiller in the 2nd round a mere 3-4 months after Tebow won that playoff game.
Teams don't think the way you do.
A) I thought my sarcasm was pretty obvious
B) You missed the much more impactful move of signing Peyton Manning.
After Tebow won a playoff game, the broncos signed one of the greatest QBs ever, and drafted a QB in the second
Are shying away from the idea of investing in a QB. They scouted them, they have talked publicly about the need to bring someone in, and they have not run from the concerns about DJs injuries. We can’t predict how the draft will play out and we don’t know what grades they have on these guys. But the idea that they’re afraid to bring in someone to push Jones is a made up notion.
At this point I wish LIKE HELL Schoen would just cut Jones outright ASAP just so all of the whiny babies on this site can STFU about him already. Then we can move on to the next QB everyone can whine incessantly about after a brief hiatus.
he cherry picks some Valid points to make his comments.
IF Jones played at the Minn. playoff game EVERY game, then JS would be "technically correct" in his evaluation.
Now, he absolutely can NOT speak to Jones' injuries as the major reason they would have to move on. That would destroy any bargaining position they may need.
At this time of year, ANY smart GM "loves" ALL his players (Barkley, Jones, X), until its time to put up or shut up.
If they take, say McCarthy at 6, look for Schoen to say something along the lines of:
"DJ is still our starter, but the value was just too good to pass up". They will NEVER say, "we picked him to replace Jones right away". You don't conduct business this way.
I'm taking solace in the fact that AZ publicly backed Rosen up until they drafted Kyler, and we've seen this movie before when the Giants paid Eli only to draft Jones and have him start the third game of the year. I'm hoping for a sequel and one that is better than the original
GiantsWFAN
@giantswfan
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4m
#NYGiants #Schoen tells #Giants.com - learned from parcells not to be scheme-specific, it is best to just get "good" players....team has versatile players....new DC bowen prefers to stop the run on the way to the passer
Run defense has been horrible for what seems like a long, long time. And it's a killer for time of possession.
Are shying away from the idea of investing in a QB. They scouted them, they have talked publicly about the need to bring someone in, and they have not run from the concerns about DJs injuries. We can’t predict how the draft will play out and we don’t know what grades they have on these guys. But the idea that they’re afraid to bring in someone to push Jones is a made up notion.
Why hasn’t there been real completion for 5 years?
Are shying away from the idea of investing in a QB. They scouted them, they have talked publicly about the need to bring someone in, and they have not run from the concerns about DJs injuries. We can’t predict how the draft will play out and we don’t know what grades they have on these guys. But the idea that they’re afraid to bring in someone to push Jones is a made up notion.
Why hasn’t there been real completion for 5 years?
5 years is not relevant. When this group came in, they declined to take DJs 5th year option. So you are talking about one year. Last year. Now what they do this year remains to be seen.
Last year NYG had the 5th highest priced backup QB in the league
1. If you believe Jones isn't a good player, giving him $82M guaranteed doesn't make sense. The Giants have him $82M guaranteed. They must think he's a good player.
2. If you think Jones is a good player, drafting a QB in 2024 to replace him doesn't make sense. He's got one of the biggest cap hits in the NFL. You're going to look stupid keeping that cap hit on the bench, having gotten only 6 games out of that $82M guaranteed.
I think it plays out like this:
1. 2024 QB depth chart is Jones/FA vet/DeVito or Day 3 pick
2. Giants win 4-7 games in 2024, Daboll is fired
3. Giants release Jones and carry the dead $23M or whatever in 2025
4. Giants draft a QB early in the weaker 2025 class
This scenario is history repeating itself with the Giants lacking the foresight to draft from the right QB class, as they failed to do in 2018 and 2020.
This is very possible.
Daniel Jones at best is a mediocre QB who gets injured a lot.
Schoen has to get a new young QB and that is indisputable. What we don't know is how do Schoen/Daboll feel about the top three or four QBs. I guess if they don't take one in round one or two they must believe that DJ is their best option. I feel this can't be true. Any QB taken in rounds three and beyond reeks of career backup QB. If Schoen's judgement is way off in this regard I hope he has alternate career goals.
RE: Last year NYG had the 5th highest priced backup QB in the league
So not like Jones sitting there as the only QB in the room.
That wasn’t a real competition. Tyrod had no chance to win the job.
If you recall, it was reported throughout camp that Taylor was outperforming Jones and it got laughed at on here. Then the season showed the same exact thing.
Do you believe if Jones had stayed healthy and continued his poor play that they would have put Tyrod in?
If the answers no, then there was no real competition at QB.
Be careful reading into that. The expectation was that Toney wouldn't be traded. The expectation was that Wink would be back. The expectation is that Daniel will be the starter.
It's wasted energy to try and interpret this stuff.
The handwringing is like Groundhog day on here.
We are a bad team right now. But bad teams can turn around quickly in the NFL. This is the regime's third season and it has been a bit of an uneven ride so far.
There's a chance to correct it starting in April...let's see what happens FIRST.
I realize it's a discussion board, but as much as there's the DJFC, there's an equal amount with DJDS.
They'll draft a QB relatively high IMO. You don't gamble on Jones' injury, susceptibility to injury, and geneal overall play without bringing in competition.
Breaking BBI news … Penix and Nix guaranteed to be far
So not like Jones sitting there as the only QB in the room.
That wasn’t a real competition. Tyrod had no chance to win the job.
If you recall, it was reported throughout camp that Taylor was outperforming Jones and it got laughed at on here. Then the season showed the same exact thing.
Do you believe if Jones had stayed healthy and continued his poor play that they would have put Tyrod in?
If the answers no, then there was no real competition at QB.
No, it wasn't a competition. But why would there be? They had just extended Jones. But at the same time, the year before that they declined Jones' 5th year option and brought in Taylor. Ask that same question a year earlier and my answer is yes, they would have turned to Taylor.
Are shying away from the idea of investing in a QB. They scouted them, they have talked publicly about the need to bring someone in, and they have not run from the concerns about DJs injuries. We can’t predict how the draft will play out and we don’t know what grades they have on these guys. But the idea that they’re afraid to bring in someone to push Jones is a made up notion.
Why hasn’t there been real completion for 5 years?
JS has only been here…now going on 3rd off season so the 5 year thing doesn’t reality have validity as JS can’t answer for the previous 2
Should have have brought in competition after just signing him to an extension?
1. If you believe Jones isn't a good player, giving him $82M guaranteed doesn't make sense. The Giants have him $82M guaranteed. They must think he's a good player.
2. If you think Jones is a good player, drafting a QB in 2024 to replace him doesn't make sense. He's got one of the biggest cap hits in the NFL. You're going to look stupid keeping that cap hit on the bench, having gotten only 6 games out of that $82M guaranteed.
I think it plays out like this:
1. 2024 QB depth chart is Jones/FA vet/DeVito or Day 3 pick
2. Giants win 4-7 games in 2024, Daboll is fired
3. Giants release Jones and carry the dead $23M or whatever in 2025
4. Giants draft a QB early in the weaker 2025 class
This scenario is history repeating itself with the Giants lacking the foresight to draft from the right QB class, as they failed to do in 2018 and 2020.
AS usual you twist shit to fit your own take.
The contract given to Jones was around average for an NFL starting QB. Whgen you factor in DJ's age and that he was coming off his best year and that he was a UFA, it's fair to say the contract was on the lower end for a QB. If Jones was better he gets paid more money than what he got.
The Niners paid Jimmy G similar money. Maybe a little more, or less who the fuck cares, adjusted for inflation. 2 years later they went after Lance.
They want insurance in the form of younger with more upside than Cutlets.
If it ends up true, they deserve the results.
Right. Because if anyone disagrees with you, FUCK THEM and anyone who roots for them, am I right?
Seems fair and balanced.
What are you yelling about now?
How is saying “if they go that route and it fails, if they get fired they deserve it” saying “ if anyone disagrees with you, FUCK THEM and anyone who roots for them, am I right?”?
Are shying away from the idea of investing in a QB. They scouted them, they have talked publicly about the need to bring someone in, and they have not run from the concerns about DJs injuries. We can’t predict how the draft will play out and we don’t know what grades they have on these guys. But the idea that they’re afraid to bring in someone to push Jones is a made up notion.
Why hasn’t there been real completion for 5 years?
Are you really this fucking needy? You can't think of anything without trolling for chum?
2019 he had a promising rookie year and the team loved the tackles in the 2020 draft, thus picking Thomas in round 1. IN 2021 they were picking pretty low, to be fair DJ did struggle but they couldn't draft anyone where they sat, they should have taken Parsons but I digress, they trade down for more picks. in 2022 once again no QBs are available. They OBVIOUSLY DIDN'T LOVE JONES AT THIS POINT. RIGHT? THey didn't extend him. They didn't kick in year 5 of the deal. They picked BPA. In 23 they were picking too low.
You're fucking smarter than this. Christ how many threads...
at the drop of a hat. Right or wrong. You can be the GM that does that. Drafting some skinny dork in round 5 from east illinois state isn't going to fix a fucking thing.
Most QBs need to be picked in rounds 1-2. The Giants haven't exactly been passing on QB after QB the last 2-3 years other than the exalted one who hasn't one jack shit, Justin Herbert. The same QB who BBI loves to grant leniency to.
The Giants know DJ can be upgraded. They aren't dumb. Mara isn't forcing anything. Stop already. This place is full fucking conspiracy deep thoughts horse shit and it's getting worse.
The competition didn’t have to be a 1st round pick. They could have added a pick in the later rounds. They’ve done nothing to invest in young QBs since drafting Jones.
You can yell that Tyrod was on the team, but if Jones started off 2022 like he did 2023 there’s zero chance they would have switched to Tyrod. There has never been a real competition for Jones’ job since he got here.
at the drop of a hat. Right or wrong. You can be the GM that does that. Drafting some skinny dork in round 5 from east illinois state isn't going to fix a fucking thing.
Most QBs need to be picked in rounds 1-2. The Giants haven't exactly been passing on QB after QB the last 2-3 years other than the exalted one who hasn't one jack shit, Justin Herbert. The same QB who BBI loves to grant leniency to.
The Giants know DJ can be upgraded. They aren't dumb. Mara isn't forcing anything. Stop already. This place is full fucking conspiracy deep thoughts horse shit and it's getting worse.
That skinny dork could be better than Jake From, Mike Glennon and Tommy DeVito, which is the point.
at the drop of a hat. Right or wrong. You can be the GM that does that. Drafting some skinny dork in round 5 from east illinois state isn't going to fix a fucking thing.
Most QBs need to be picked in rounds 1-2. The Giants haven't exactly been passing on QB after QB the last 2-3 years other than the exalted one who hasn't one jack shit, Justin Herbert. The same QB who BBI loves to grant leniency to.
The Giants know DJ can be upgraded. They aren't dumb. Mara isn't forcing anything. Stop already. This place is full fucking conspiracy deep thoughts horse shit and it's getting worse.
That skinny dork could be better than Jake From, Mike Glennon and Tommy DeVito, which is the point.
They did bring in Taylor who is one of the better backups.
Look dude I get it, we all want wins. We all want greatness. I just can't listen to fans when they insist that 2022 never happened. That Jones NEVER played well here. He did play well here and he did so in the first year of this current regime. THAT matters. A lot. You can call that season fool's gold or a mirage and no one would mock you for it. It's a fair take. But to deny it? You're literally ignoring what happened. You're ignoring the facts. You're also ignoring a promising rookie year along with many others here. Why? Daniel Jones hasn't sucked game after game year after year here. Granted he's probably had more bad than good, even if you allow for circumstances, again, totally fair, but he has had good moments that lasted longer than one game or even one month. That matters. Context. Were we all fooled? We shall see.
Also, the fucking contract. Can we maybe calm down here too? The Giants have plenty of cap room. Likely won't lose anyone they don't want to lose (hello McKinney and BArkley) and DJ's deal is more manageable one year form now. ONE. Not ten. The guy was a UFA and under aged 30 coming off a playoff winning season. That's life in the NFL. You pay and you pray. You manage the cap as best you can and pivot as needed. Think of it this way, the DJ cap money the Giants need to navigate around saves them from doing something stupid. Sleep well at night. They want to build this the long slow way, it's obvious at this point. Slow and steady.
You could simply not click on the threads if it’s going to anger you so much.
Secondly, nobody denies 2022 happened or that Jones wasn’t average. But that was one year out of five. Acting like that should have greater weight than the rest of the body of work is nonsense. We’re also closer to the end of the 2024 season than we are to the end of the 2022 season. 2022 is far away in football terms.
Sure he’s not getting paid top QB dollars, the Giants have cap room, they can get out of it, etc but it’s still a bad contract that hurts the Giants ability to build a better team. When you a player has a cap hit of $47 million and the best you’ve seen if $20 million production, that’s a problem. It would be very beneficial for the Giants to have an extra $27 million to spend wouldn’t it?
He references the Niners aggressively moving up for QB and now he's playing with Dallas. Link - ( New Window )
We’ll see how it plays out he said, in terms of his plan. If he’s relying on Jones next year he’s delusional. Dabs and Schoen’s wagons are now attached to Jones. I sure hope he can build a team that Jones can lead.
When can we expect Jones to throw more then 15 TDs in a season or play a whole season.
The hoops and hurdles people go to prop up Jones…good Lord. Look at the entire body of work.
GTFO with that shit. Who is propping him up here? Do you deny that our roster has sucked balls for basically 12 years? That our OL was literally worst in the NFL last year (especially games 1-6?) Aside from who was taking snaps from center?
Geezus. Cut the fucking guy already. I am so ass tired of wading through post after post thread after thread of this.
The hoops and hurdles people go to prop up Jones…good Lord. Look at the entire body of work.
GTFO with that shit. Who is propping him up here? Do you deny that our roster has sucked balls for basically 12 years? That our OL was literally worst in the NFL last year (especially games 1-6?) Aside from who was taking snaps from center?
Geezus. Cut the fucking guy already. I am so ass tired of wading through post after post thread after thread of this.
No one is forcing you to come to BBI, much less click on the thread.
None of what Schoen said it the vibe from what he said points to anything about how he will go about his draft. Good GMs don't give off vibes about their future decisions, they keep things close to their vest and allow for any possibilities. Maybe everyone got too used to Gettleman and even Reese whom both didn't understand this poker playing aspect of being a GM (especially Gettleman). There are no moles or leaks anymore with Schoen and co here, their thought process is contained to their inner circle as it should be. If anything the comments about WR and Daniel Jones give off a vibe of doing the opposite of what is felt in response to his words, that's how a good gm operates. Thus, I take this as the opposite of most here. He scouted all the top 4 QBs thoroughly and personally attended games of each of them. He is very interested in taking a QB, ideally standing pat at 6 or trading up to 3-5 if needed. He isn't as worried about receiver. That's how I read between the lines here. Schoen is a very smart young gm, he knows how to play this game.
Also, yeah DJ had a promising rookie year and a solid 2022 thx to the playoff win (without that win I'd consider his season mediocre). That was then and this is now. His deficiencies reading and reacting to defenses in the game are clear. Schoen and Co know this.
with Schoen is when he said whether he thinks Jones can be the QB to lead the team to a Super Bowl.
"We have full faith in Daniel...it's not one position. You need to have a good team...You have to have surrounding parts...You have to continue to build the team around the QB..."
To me, that screams DJ is QB1 and they will continue to do whatever needs to be done to give Jones the best chance to succeed...
with Schoen is when he said whether he thinks Jones can be the QB to lead the team to a Super Bowl.
"We have full faith in Daniel...it's not one position. You need to have a good team...You have to have surrounding parts...You have to continue to build the team around the QB..."
To me, that screams DJ is QB1 and they will continue to do whatever needs to be done to give Jones the best chance to succeed...
What do you expect him to say?
He sucks and we made a mistake by giving him an extension
Taking these press conferences literally is an exercise in stupidity
with Schoen is when he said whether he thinks Jones can be the QB to lead the team to a Super Bowl.
"We have full faith in Daniel...it's not one position. You need to have a good team...You have to have surrounding parts...You have to continue to build the team around the QB..."
To me, that screams DJ is QB1 and they will continue to do whatever needs to be done to give Jones the best chance to succeed...
Again, if he is a good gm he would say all those things to give an impression he isn't interested in qb at all only to take a qb high in the draft 2 months later. That's how good gms operate: they have no tells like a good poker player. You want the opposition to think youre going to do the opposite of what you end up doing. It's quite simple. I don't understand why everyone thinks they can analyze what he says here and assume he is telling everyone what he's going to do rather than putting out smoke to make it unclear what he is going to do. What do you think is the better approach out of these two courses of action? To me its clear and I think Schoen is a smart young gm unlike our former GM who seemed to get sniped and jumped for his targets left and right while being completely oblivious about what other teams were doing. Schoen already proved the opposite of that, having a feel for other teams and communicating with GMs in front of him to avoid being sniped for Deonte Banks.
I tend to agree with mbavaro. I don't think Joe is going to tip his hand or come out & declare, 'Jones sucks! We need a new QB!'
But we do.
I don't understand how this isn't blatantly obvious that he would want the opposition to have no idea or better yet think they are going to do something different than what they ultimately do.
I tend to agree with mbavaro. I don't think Joe is going to tip his hand or come out & declare, 'Jones sucks! We need a new QB!'
But we do.
I don't understand how this isn't blatantly obvious that he would want the opposition to have no idea or better yet think they are going to do something different than what they ultimately do.
Who cares really. If everybody just assumes its lying-season, the truth gets lost in the shuffle anyway. I guess it makes it think you mastered the art of deception, but whatever.
Spend more time evaluating players than sending mixed smoke-signals or trial balloons. It creates a better and impactful roster.
IF Jones played at the Minn. playoff game EVERY game, then JS would be "technically correct" in his evaluation.
Now, he absolutely can NOT speak to Jones' injuries as the major reason they would have to move on. That would destroy any bargaining position they may need.
At this time of year, ANY smart GM "loves" ALL his players (Barkley, Jones, X), until its time to put up or shut up.
If they take, say McCarthy at 6, look for Schoen to say something along the lines of:
"DJ is still our starter, but the value was just too good to pass up". They will NEVER say, "we picked him to replace Jones right away". You don't conduct business this way.
Quote:
They're both far more talented players than Jones. They'd be nearly as much a threat to Jones as one of the top 3 guys. I don't know that they'd want to introduce that.
By the way the scenario I laid out is optimistic; it's just as possible Jones is not released and he plays out his whole deal. Or perhaps he's restructured.
The Giants think he's good.
So not only won't they draft a first round QB, they won't even bring in viable competition? So, essentially a *downgrade* from last years QB room? Because, DeVito would move up to QB2 and a day 3 QB would be drafted.
I very much hope you are wrong. If nothing else, the injuries should at least provide a greater emphasis on QB regardless of their belief in Jones.
I'd expect a vet FA brought in as 2024 insurance for Jones's knee injury. Tannehill, Trubisky, Brissett, Mariota...we all know the names. And maybe DeVito gets replaced by a draft pick (Pratt, Rattler, etc.).
Credit to the one caller who asked Schoen basically what the hell he sees in Daniel Jones anyway. But Schoen took the high road as any Sen Mngt-type should. He also pointed to the Minn game to probably defend himself more than anything.
I don't know if Schoen will pick or QB or not, and if he does will it be early in the draft or not. But he's committing professional suicide if they pass on upgrading the position in such a deep QB draft.
By the way the scenario I laid out is optimistic; it's just as possible Jones is not released and he plays out his whole deal. Or perhaps he's restructured.
The Giants think he's good.
You have to give Schoen a little more credit for managing a team. Even if he thinks Jones is good enough and Jones is ready to start the season, he has to have a better backup than TT in case Jones gets injured again. The question is how high he will pick one. And that QB will sit on the bench for 4, 8, or 12 games until Jones gets hurt or plays down to expectations and the fan base is chanting in unison for a backup. So the QB room will have Jones, TT or a vet, and the rookie. DeVito will end up on the practice squad if he continues to look capable and has worked on his flaws during the offseason.
I do know they push the NFL as sports entertainment and this shit isn't entertaining.
The Maras can pull the cost of the Jones contract out of one of Wellington's old sport coats.
Admit the mistake and fix the team, Jones is mentally broken, when the whistle blows he doesn't see what is in front of him.
In Davoli's own words, Cutlets saw the field the way they saw it on tape.
I personally don't care what round he comes from, but a new NFL QB is required to make this debacle entertainment.
Quote:
Remember that time the Broncos didn't try to upgrade the QB position for years because Tebow threw for 316 yards in a playoff win and spent the next few years only talking about that game whenever anyone questioned them about it?
Oh wait..
Nope can't say that I remember that at all. And neither do you. The Broncos drafted Osweiller in the 2nd round a mere 3-4 months after Tebow won that playoff game.
Teams don't think the way you do.
A) I thought my sarcasm was pretty obvious
B) You missed the much more impactful move of signing Peyton Manning.
After Tebow won a playoff game, the broncos signed one of the greatest QBs ever, and drafted a QB in the second
IF Jones played at the Minn. playoff game EVERY game, then JS would be "technically correct" in his evaluation.
Now, he absolutely can NOT speak to Jones' injuries as the major reason they would have to move on. That would destroy any bargaining position they may need.
At this time of year, ANY smart GM "loves" ALL his players (Barkley, Jones, X), until its time to put up or shut up.
If they take, say McCarthy at 6, look for Schoen to say something along the lines of:
"DJ is still our starter, but the value was just too good to pass up". They will NEVER say, "we picked him to replace Jones right away". You don't conduct business this way.
I'm taking solace in the fact that AZ publicly backed Rosen up until they drafted Kyler, and we've seen this movie before when the Giants paid Eli only to draft Jones and have him start the third game of the year. I'm hoping for a sequel and one that is better than the original
@giantswfan
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4m
#NYGiants #Schoen tells #Giants.com - learned from parcells not to be scheme-specific, it is best to just get "good" players....team has versatile players....new DC bowen prefers to stop the run on the way to the passer
Run defense has been horrible for what seems like a long, long time. And it's a killer for time of possession.
Why hasn’t there been real completion for 5 years?
Quote:
Are shying away from the idea of investing in a QB. They scouted them, they have talked publicly about the need to bring someone in, and they have not run from the concerns about DJs injuries. We can’t predict how the draft will play out and we don’t know what grades they have on these guys. But the idea that they’re afraid to bring in someone to push Jones is a made up notion.
Why hasn’t there been real completion for 5 years?
2. If you think Jones is a good player, drafting a QB in 2024 to replace him doesn't make sense. He's got one of the biggest cap hits in the NFL. You're going to look stupid keeping that cap hit on the bench, having gotten only 6 games out of that $82M guaranteed.
I think it plays out like this:
1. 2024 QB depth chart is Jones/FA vet/DeVito or Day 3 pick
2. Giants win 4-7 games in 2024, Daboll is fired
3. Giants release Jones and carry the dead $23M or whatever in 2025
4. Giants draft a QB early in the weaker 2025 class
This scenario is history repeating itself with the Giants lacking the foresight to draft from the right QB class, as they failed to do in 2018 and 2020.
This is very possible.
That wasn’t a real competition. Tyrod had no chance to win the job.
If you recall, it was reported throughout camp that Taylor was outperforming Jones and it got laughed at on here. Then the season showed the same exact thing.
Do you believe if Jones had stayed healthy and continued his poor play that they would have put Tyrod in?
If the answers no, then there was no real competition at QB.
It's wasted energy to try and interpret this stuff.
The handwringing is like Groundhog day on here.
We are a bad team right now. But bad teams can turn around quickly in the NFL. This is the regime's third season and it has been a bit of an uneven ride so far.
There's a chance to correct it starting in April...let's see what happens FIRST.
I realize it's a discussion board, but as much as there's the DJFC, there's an equal amount with DJDS.
They'll draft a QB relatively high IMO. You don't gamble on Jones' injury, susceptibility to injury, and geneal overall play without bringing in competition.
Quote:
So not like Jones sitting there as the only QB in the room.
That wasn’t a real competition. Tyrod had no chance to win the job.
If you recall, it was reported throughout camp that Taylor was outperforming Jones and it got laughed at on here. Then the season showed the same exact thing.
Do you believe if Jones had stayed healthy and continued his poor play that they would have put Tyrod in?
If the answers no, then there was no real competition at QB.
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Are shying away from the idea of investing in a QB. They scouted them, they have talked publicly about the need to bring someone in, and they have not run from the concerns about DJs injuries. We can’t predict how the draft will play out and we don’t know what grades they have on these guys. But the idea that they’re afraid to bring in someone to push Jones is a made up notion.
Why hasn’t there been real completion for 5 years?
JS has only been here…now going on 3rd off season so the 5 year thing doesn’t reality have validity as JS can’t answer for the previous 2
Should have have brought in competition after just signing him to an extension?
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They don't want real competition for Jones.
They want insurance in the form of younger with more upside than Cutlets.
If it ends up true, they deserve the results.
Right. Because if anyone disagrees with you, FUCK THEM and anyone who roots for them, am I right?
Seems fair and balanced.
2. If you think Jones is a good player, drafting a QB in 2024 to replace him doesn't make sense. He's got one of the biggest cap hits in the NFL. You're going to look stupid keeping that cap hit on the bench, having gotten only 6 games out of that $82M guaranteed.
I think it plays out like this:
1. 2024 QB depth chart is Jones/FA vet/DeVito or Day 3 pick
2. Giants win 4-7 games in 2024, Daboll is fired
3. Giants release Jones and carry the dead $23M or whatever in 2025
4. Giants draft a QB early in the weaker 2025 class
This scenario is history repeating itself with the Giants lacking the foresight to draft from the right QB class, as they failed to do in 2018 and 2020.
AS usual you twist shit to fit your own take.
The contract given to Jones was around average for an NFL starting QB. Whgen you factor in DJ's age and that he was coming off his best year and that he was a UFA, it's fair to say the contract was on the lower end for a QB. If Jones was better he gets paid more money than what he got.
The Niners paid Jimmy G similar money. Maybe a little more, or less who the fuck cares, adjusted for inflation. 2 years later they went after Lance.
TEAMS DO THAT ALL THE TIME.
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In comment 16409272 bw in dc said:
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They don't want real competition for Jones.
They want insurance in the form of younger with more upside than Cutlets.
If it ends up true, they deserve the results.
Right. Because if anyone disagrees with you, FUCK THEM and anyone who roots for them, am I right?
Seems fair and balanced.
What are you yelling about now?
How is saying “if they go that route and it fails, if they get fired they deserve it” saying “ if anyone disagrees with you, FUCK THEM and anyone who roots for them, am I right?”?
You’re on a roll today.
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Are shying away from the idea of investing in a QB. They scouted them, they have talked publicly about the need to bring someone in, and they have not run from the concerns about DJs injuries. We can’t predict how the draft will play out and we don’t know what grades they have on these guys. But the idea that they’re afraid to bring in someone to push Jones is a made up notion.
Why hasn’t there been real completion for 5 years?
Are you really this fucking needy? You can't think of anything without trolling for chum?
2019 he had a promising rookie year and the team loved the tackles in the 2020 draft, thus picking Thomas in round 1. IN 2021 they were picking pretty low, to be fair DJ did struggle but they couldn't draft anyone where they sat, they should have taken Parsons but I digress, they trade down for more picks. in 2022 once again no QBs are available. They OBVIOUSLY DIDN'T LOVE JONES AT THIS POINT. RIGHT? THey didn't extend him. They didn't kick in year 5 of the deal. They picked BPA. In 23 they were picking too low.
You're fucking smarter than this. Christ how many threads...
Most QBs need to be picked in rounds 1-2. The Giants haven't exactly been passing on QB after QB the last 2-3 years other than the exalted one who hasn't one jack shit, Justin Herbert. The same QB who BBI loves to grant leniency to.
The Giants know DJ can be upgraded. They aren't dumb. Mara isn't forcing anything. Stop already. This place is full fucking conspiracy deep thoughts horse shit and it's getting worse.
You can yell that Tyrod was on the team, but if Jones started off 2022 like he did 2023 there’s zero chance they would have switched to Tyrod. There has never been a real competition for Jones’ job since he got here.
Most QBs need to be picked in rounds 1-2. The Giants haven't exactly been passing on QB after QB the last 2-3 years other than the exalted one who hasn't one jack shit, Justin Herbert. The same QB who BBI loves to grant leniency to.
The Giants know DJ can be upgraded. They aren't dumb. Mara isn't forcing anything. Stop already. This place is full fucking conspiracy deep thoughts horse shit and it's getting worse.
That skinny dork could be better than Jake From, Mike Glennon and Tommy DeVito, which is the point.
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at the drop of a hat. Right or wrong. You can be the GM that does that. Drafting some skinny dork in round 5 from east illinois state isn't going to fix a fucking thing.
Most QBs need to be picked in rounds 1-2. The Giants haven't exactly been passing on QB after QB the last 2-3 years other than the exalted one who hasn't one jack shit, Justin Herbert. The same QB who BBI loves to grant leniency to.
The Giants know DJ can be upgraded. They aren't dumb. Mara isn't forcing anything. Stop already. This place is full fucking conspiracy deep thoughts horse shit and it's getting worse.
That skinny dork could be better than Jake From, Mike Glennon and Tommy DeVito, which is the point.
They did bring in Taylor who is one of the better backups.
Look dude I get it, we all want wins. We all want greatness. I just can't listen to fans when they insist that 2022 never happened. That Jones NEVER played well here. He did play well here and he did so in the first year of this current regime. THAT matters. A lot. You can call that season fool's gold or a mirage and no one would mock you for it. It's a fair take. But to deny it? You're literally ignoring what happened. You're ignoring the facts. You're also ignoring a promising rookie year along with many others here. Why? Daniel Jones hasn't sucked game after game year after year here. Granted he's probably had more bad than good, even if you allow for circumstances, again, totally fair, but he has had good moments that lasted longer than one game or even one month. That matters. Context. Were we all fooled? We shall see.
Also, the fucking contract. Can we maybe calm down here too? The Giants have plenty of cap room. Likely won't lose anyone they don't want to lose (hello McKinney and BArkley) and DJ's deal is more manageable one year form now. ONE. Not ten. The guy was a UFA and under aged 30 coming off a playoff winning season. That's life in the NFL. You pay and you pray. You manage the cap as best you can and pivot as needed. Think of it this way, the DJ cap money the Giants need to navigate around saves them from doing something stupid. Sleep well at night. They want to build this the long slow way, it's obvious at this point. Slow and steady.
I get the frustration. We all want to win.
Secondly, nobody denies 2022 happened or that Jones wasn’t average. But that was one year out of five. Acting like that should have greater weight than the rest of the body of work is nonsense. We’re also closer to the end of the 2024 season than we are to the end of the 2022 season. 2022 is far away in football terms.
Sure he’s not getting paid top QB dollars, the Giants have cap room, they can get out of it, etc but it’s still a bad contract that hurts the Giants ability to build a better team. When you a player has a cap hit of $47 million and the best you’ve seen if $20 million production, that’s a problem. It would be very beneficial for the Giants to have an extra $27 million to spend wouldn’t it?
We’ll see how it plays out he said, in terms of his plan. If he’s relying on Jones next year he’s delusional. Dabs and Schoen’s wagons are now attached to Jones. I sure hope he can build a team that Jones can lead.
When can we expect Jones to throw more then 15 TDs in a season or play a whole season.
What exactly has been made up? Besides you saying being denying 2022 was a thing.
GTFO with that shit. Who is propping him up here? Do you deny that our roster has sucked balls for basically 12 years? That our OL was literally worst in the NFL last year (especially games 1-6?) Aside from who was taking snaps from center?
Geezus. Cut the fucking guy already. I am so ass tired of wading through post after post thread after thread of this.
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The hoops and hurdles people go to prop up Jones…good Lord. Look at the entire body of work.
GTFO with that shit. Who is propping him up here? Do you deny that our roster has sucked balls for basically 12 years? That our OL was literally worst in the NFL last year (especially games 1-6?) Aside from who was taking snaps from center?
Geezus. Cut the fucking guy already. I am so ass tired of wading through post after post thread after thread of this.
No one is forcing you to come to BBI, much less click on the thread.
Also, yeah DJ had a promising rookie year and a solid 2022 thx to the playoff win (without that win I'd consider his season mediocre). That was then and this is now. His deficiencies reading and reacting to defenses in the game are clear. Schoen and Co know this.
"We have full faith in Daniel...it's not one position. You need to have a good team...You have to have surrounding parts...You have to continue to build the team around the QB..."
To me, that screams DJ is QB1 and they will continue to do whatever needs to be done to give Jones the best chance to succeed...
"We have full faith in Daniel...it's not one position. You need to have a good team...You have to have surrounding parts...You have to continue to build the team around the QB..."
To me, that screams DJ is QB1 and they will continue to do whatever needs to be done to give Jones the best chance to succeed...
What do you expect him to say?
He sucks and we made a mistake by giving him an extension
Taking these press conferences literally is an exercise in stupidity
"We have full faith in Daniel...it's not one position. You need to have a good team...You have to have surrounding parts...You have to continue to build the team around the QB..."
To me, that screams DJ is QB1 and they will continue to do whatever needs to be done to give Jones the best chance to succeed...
Again, if he is a good gm he would say all those things to give an impression he isn't interested in qb at all only to take a qb high in the draft 2 months later. That's how good gms operate: they have no tells like a good poker player. You want the opposition to think youre going to do the opposite of what you end up doing. It's quite simple. I don't understand why everyone thinks they can analyze what he says here and assume he is telling everyone what he's going to do rather than putting out smoke to make it unclear what he is going to do. What do you think is the better approach out of these two courses of action? To me its clear and I think Schoen is a smart young gm unlike our former GM who seemed to get sniped and jumped for his targets left and right while being completely oblivious about what other teams were doing. Schoen already proved the opposite of that, having a feel for other teams and communicating with GMs in front of him to avoid being sniped for Deonte Banks.
But we do.
He sucks and we made a mistake by giving him an extension
Yes, it's time for Schoen to repent for his sins.
;)
But we do.
I don't understand how this isn't blatantly obvious that he would want the opposition to have no idea or better yet think they are going to do something different than what they ultimately do.
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I tend to agree with mbavaro. I don't think Joe is going to tip his hand or come out & declare, 'Jones sucks! We need a new QB!'
But we do.
I don't understand how this isn't blatantly obvious that he would want the opposition to have no idea or better yet think they are going to do something different than what they ultimately do.
Who cares really. If everybody just assumes its lying-season, the truth gets lost in the shuffle anyway. I guess it makes it think you mastered the art of deception, but whatever.
Spend more time evaluating players than sending mixed smoke-signals or trial balloons. It creates a better and impactful roster.
And Jones will continue to be a disaster but likely will be gone after next year as well, due to injury then anything else.
Given the Giants have been awful at building any sort of functional offense, maybe pivoting to a defensive head coach will help out.