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| The Giants are exploring the cost of trading up, although it’s not believed the Chicago Bears or Washington Commanders will make the first or second picks available. The swing team is the New England Patriots, who have the No. 3 pick. |
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| It would be costly for the Giants to jump from the sixth pick to No. 3 — it cost the Jets three second-round picks in an identical trade up for quarterback Sam Darnold in 2018 — but league sources believe Schoen would pull the trigger on such a bold move. The sense around the league is that this regime feels urgency to add a quarterback entering a pivotal third season. |
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| If Schoen can’t swing a trade for one of the top three quarterbacks, the focus would shift to McCarthy. There’s debate about his worthiness for the sixth pick, but the expectation is that a quarterback who had a 27-1 record as a starter at Michigan will win over teams during the pre-draft process. |
Really? I wouldn't be shocked at all.
Grit,
Would you be shocked if they took Nix at 6?
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Absolutely shocked if the Giants picked McCarthy at 6.
Really? I wouldn't be shocked at all.
Me neither.
If it's Jones PTSD, that's an easy fix. Don't get lazy with the QB position like you did after 2019, look to bring in good competition each year in the mid to later rounds.
Not over 6'3", he measured 6'2 4/8" and 219 lbs to be exact.
Story is certainly getting more widespread.
They may not be able to pull off what they want to do but there is little denying what they want to do.
I agree. Get your QB at 6, trade back into the 1st to get WR.
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over 6-3 and 219 pounds. Not much smaller than Maye. He's going top 8 for sure. NOT a reach at 6. Is he the right "fit" is the big question.
Not over 6'3", he measured 6'2 4/8" and 219 lbs to be exact.
So 6’ 2.5 “
Generally agree with a lot of these points.
Except I just can't get beyond the fact that Daniel Jones isn't any good.
It's either old times again at the meadowlands with loose lips OR it is intentional smoke.
Based on this regime being pretty tight on info so far I'd say most likely smoke.
I wouldn’t be shocked. They picked Jones there.
Because he’s not a top 10 pick.
There is something to this. Picking Jones in the 1st round absolutely set the franchise back 5 years. Hopefully it won’t take this crew 5 years to realize if whoever they pick can’t play the position.
It's either old times again at the meadowlands with loose lips OR it is intentional smoke.
Based on this regime being pretty tight on info so far I'd say most likely smoke.
Not sure how the Giants making other teams think they want a QB helps them. The non-QBs will be there.
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Who keep saying it's desperate but don't explain why.
Because he’s not a top 10 pick.
Why? If Daboll covets him, why not?
Why, because you feel that way?
How nice that would be for us.
des·per·ate
/ˈdesp(ə)rət/
adjective
feeling, showing, or involving a hopeless sense that a situation is so bad as to be impossible to deal with.
Because when you are desperate you cling to any hope no matter how small and you are afraid of losing what you have even when you have nothing.
Believing Jones will stay healthy and become something he has never been; not in HS, not in college and not in his 5 year NFL career is desperate.
And being afraid to do something new and different because you are too afraid to is desperate. Ie “we have so many holes we can’t draft a QB.” ‘There’s no sure thing at QB. Let’s just stick with Jones.
Why is it ok to “settle’ for any position. Like say taking the 3rd WR out of 3?
Fix the OLine or the QBs will get IRed one after another
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Reach for a QB at your peril.
Why, because you feel that way?
That’s my opinion.
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In comment 16414094 Dave on the UWS said:
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over 6-3 and 219 pounds. Not much smaller than Maye. He's going top 8 for sure. NOT a reach at 6. Is he the right "fit" is the big question.
Not over 6'3", he measured 6'2 4/8" and 219 lbs to be exact.
So 6’ 2.5 “
Looks like he has about the same body type as Aaron Rodgers and Matthew Stafford. 6'2.5" is a solid height for a QB. Give him some time in the NFL while DJ holds it down and he will be playing at 225-230lbs 6'2.5", hands are a bit smaller like Joe Burrows but he has played with cold weather in the Midwest his whole football career growing up in Illinois and playing at Michigan. If we can't get Jayden Daniels then I want JJM without trading much more than future picks (future 3rd or 4th and 5th should get it done for the Chargers).
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but if they're aggressively trying to trade up (as has been reported) and fail to do so, taking McCarthy at six would seem like settling. I think that's the issue people would have with it, and it's a legit concern.
Why is it ok to “settle’ for any position. Like say taking the 3rd WR out of 3?
If the NFL thinks there are 4 top qb prospects and many think JJM is a better prospect than Drake Maye, then it isn't a desperate reach. JJM I'm is a vastly superior prospect compared to DJ out of Duke. I would be disappointed but still excited if JJM was taken before Maye and we ended up with Maye. The only QB I would trade up to 3 for is Jayden Daniels.
Maye probably won’t be available at 6 so if he is the guy, they will have to trade up.. McCarthy might be there but they probably need to trade up to 3 to be sure. Nix probably will be there and no move up is needed.
Well that's the thing, if the Chargers don't want to miss out on their guy then they take a future 3rd or 4th and 5th. The Eagles traded a future 4th to move up from 10 to 9 so I figure we could get it with at most a future 3rd and 5th.
You really think the Cardinals will pass on MHJ and trade down? I just don't see that myself, but if Schoen thought they were going to do it then we would have to pull the trigger.
In comment 16414211 BleedBlue46 said:
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I've been saying so for months. I like him more than Daniels. Kid's arm talent is special. I think the Giants will trade up to 4 to secure McCarthy.
You really think the Cardinals will pass on MHJ and trade down? I just don't see that myself, but if Schoen thought they were going to do it then we would have to pull the trigger.
Hahaha. I've been feeling McCarthy to the Giants for a while. That's what led me to do a deep dive of research on him and my perspective on him completely changed. I used to think like many here think about him: average nothing special college football game manager. After watching all 22 and researching him thoroughly, I see what a lot of the pros see. There is a lot more to JJM than you see when casually watching the stats and live games.
In comment 16414211 BleedBlue46 said:
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In comment 16414200 ElitoCanton said:
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I've been saying so for months. I like him more than Daniels. Kid's arm talent is special. I think the Giants will trade up to 4 to secure McCarthy.
You really think the Cardinals will pass on MHJ and trade down? I just don't see that myself, but if Schoen thought they were going to do it then we would have to pull the trigger.
Yeah of they have Nabers or Odunze graded closely enough then it makes sense. I just see MHJ as the clear cut most surefire and generational talent in this draft. I wouldn't pass up on him for Nabers or Odunze +picks.
If the QB is good, no one will care.
I didn't think the Giants would be willing to move on this soon after signing Jones. I'm very happy that it appears I'm wrong on that.
Eric from BBI : Admin : 12:59 pm : link : reply
yet another report saying the Giants are done with Jones.
Take it with salt. Whether you agree or not, Duggan bangs the drum to get rid of Jones every day. Suggesting that the Giants COULD move up in the draft isn't "feeling the urgency," it's a DUH.
We really won't know until the draft is over.
Because with 2 neck injuries and an injury guarantee, Jones is virtually unplayable this year.
I didn't think the Giants would be willing to move on this soon after signing Jones. I'm very happy that it appears I'm wrong on that.
Well it's feeling likely that CW and JD go 1-2, then Maye or McCarthy which will leave us trading up to 4 or 5 for Maye or McCarthy. I'm guessing you would prefer Maye? I would trade as much as it took if Jayden Daniels was available at 3, but if it's Maye I'm not biting.
DJ will never again be 100% healthy, that is the point.
Exactly, they should be exploring all options, including moving up and moving down.
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Who keep saying it's desperate but don't explain why.
Because with 2 neck injuries and an injury guarantee, Jones is virtually unplayable this year.
That can be picking a quarterback in general then, not simply name dropping JJ and saying it's desperate. Why picking him is desperate but picking others is not, for example.
I'm skeptical on all the players, tbh. But if Daboll eyes JJ and they get him, he wanted him because he has a plan for him and his fit in BD's real offense.
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In comment 16414126 GFAN52 said:
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In comment 16414094 Dave on the UWS said:
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over 6-3 and 219 pounds. Not much smaller than Maye. He's going top 8 for sure. NOT a reach at 6. Is he the right "fit" is the big question.
Not over 6'3", he measured 6'2 4/8" and 219 lbs to be exact.
So 6’ 2.5 “
Looks like he has about the same body type as Aaron Rodgers and Matthew Stafford. 6'2.5" is a solid height for a QB. Give him some time in the NFL while DJ holds it down and he will be playing at 225-230lbs 6'2.5", hands are a bit smaller like Joe Burrows but he has played with cold weather in the Midwest his whole football career growing up in Illinois and playing at Michigan. If we can't get Jayden Daniels then I want JJM without trading much more than future picks (future 3rd or 4th and 5th should get it done for the Chargers).
He may be the pick at 6. Based on what Sy says and the general thoughts in NFL reports, he might be worth the 6th pick.
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this "smoke" from many beat writers probably means that Giants are in fact strongly trying to move up to #3. That would be a huge mistake IMO, especially since it would cost a lot more than the three second round picks the Jets gave up to move from #6 to #3. I would prefer not to take McCarthy at #6, but could live with doing so.
If the QB is good, no one will care.
The operative word you used is "if." Massive move ups for QBs rarely work. And after giving Jones that ridiculous contract, Schoen frankly hasn't earned the right to spend the amount of draft capital that would be required to trade with NE. He's also made a lot of other poor evaluations both in the draft and FA, including Ezeudu, McKethan, Glowinski, Waller, Campbell, and maybe Neal, who doesn't look even close to being worth the #7 pick. Schmitz and Gray were also underwhelming.
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In comment 16414196 AcidTest said:
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this "smoke" from many beat writers probably means that Giants are in fact strongly trying to move up to #3. That would be a huge mistake IMO, especially since it would cost a lot more than the three second round picks the Jets gave up to move from #6 to #3. I would prefer not to take McCarthy at #6, but could live with doing so.
If the QB is good, no one will care.
The operative word you used is "if." Massive move ups for QBs rarely work. And after giving Jones that ridiculous contract, Schoen frankly hasn't earned the right to spend the amount of draft capital that would be required to trade with NE. He's also made a lot of other poor evaluations both in the draft and FA, including Ezeudu, McKethan, Glowinski, Waller, Campbell, and maybe Neal, who doesn't look even close to being worth the #7 pick. Schmitz and Gray were also underwhelming.
I agree, trading up to 3 is not worth it unless it's for Jayden Daniels and I feel like that's a low likelihood at this point.
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Absolutely shocked if the Giants picked McCarthy at 6.
Grit,
Would you be shocked if they took Nix at 6?
As of today, yes. Giants like both of them but I don't know if they would pull the trigger on either that high. the immediate counterpoint, which is valid, would be neither guy is going to be around in the 2nd round with McCarthy seemingly going top 15 now and Nix maybe lasting till 20-30.
I'm mystified as to what the strategy will be.
I mean even if they wanted to believe in his talent and I think he had the making to be a really solid QB that could help a team win. How can they trust the health? The neck the knee...I don't think even if you believed in his talent you cant be all in with the injuries especially long term.
So is the entire fanbase.
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In comment 16414091 GiantGrit said:
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Absolutely shocked if the Giants picked McCarthy at 6.
Grit,
Would you be shocked if they took Nix at 6?
As of today, yes. Giants like both of them but I don't know if they would pull the trigger on either that high. the immediate counterpoint, which is valid, would be neither guy is going to be around in the 2nd round with McCarthy seemingly going top 15 now and Nix maybe lasting till 20-30.
I'm mystified as to what the strategy will be.
If the Giants trade down the won't get McCarthy, but as you note they could very likely still get Nix. And even in a WR-rich draft, somebody might want to trade up to #6 for Nabers or Odunze. If not, then just take whichever one is left, or the one you prefer if they are both still available.
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In comment 16414098 Rjanyg said:
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In comment 16414091 GiantGrit said:
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Absolutely shocked if the Giants picked McCarthy at 6.
Grit,
Would you be shocked if they took Nix at 6?
As of today, yes. Giants like both of them but I don't know if they would pull the trigger on either that high. the immediate counterpoint, which is valid, would be neither guy is going to be around in the 2nd round with McCarthy seemingly going top 15 now and Nix maybe lasting till 20-30.
I'm mystified as to what the strategy will be.
If the Giants trade down the won't get McCarthy, but as you note they could very likely still get Nix. And even in a WR-rich draft, somebody might want to trade up to #6 for Nabers or Odunze. If not, then just take whichever one is left, or the one you prefer if they are both still available.
Trading down for Nix would be awful imo he isn't anywhere close to the level of the top 4 and I'd prefer Pennix to him myself.
Eric from BBI : Admin : 2:06 pm : link : reply
he said the Giants ARE exploring the cost of moving up, not maybe.
Of course they are. Why wouldn't they? Isn't that just due diligence? Schoen said he'd be talking to the other GMs at the combine (about whether they'd be receptive). If he says it publicly in his presser, it's not some big, inside scoop from a biased (in this area) beat writer.
Look, maybe they trade up, or maybe they feel price is too high for them. I don't know. But to me, it seems quite a leap from exploring the possibility to being done with Jones.
My take is this: IF they go all in and trade up, that's a clear indicator Jones is out after next season. Same is true in the unlikely event one of the top 3 QBs falls to them at 6 and they take him. If they don't trade up, Jones is their QB until they find another one.
What they do in the draft will be the ONLY PUBLIC indication of how they really feel about Jones.
Anything before that is speculation, and wishful thinking.
ALSO, everyone's just assuming that the Giants LOVE all 3 QBs. What if they don't? We've ALL watched drafts were a fan-consensus guy was sitting there and they took someone else.
What if one of the top 3 QBs falls in their lap at 6 and the Giants take a WR? Sure, BBI will shit its cage, but what does THAT say? About Jones or anything else?
I don't claim to know how they feel or what they want to do at 6. I don't think anyone does. But right now, much of the media is writing DUH type articles under the assumption that the Giants absolutely MUST trade up and get a new QB. I don't believe the Giants are operating under that premise. It's just one option.
Ned, it sounds great on paper and if they knew Nix/McCarthy would be there back end of round 1 I'm sure they would sign up for this. But how realistic is that?
Hard to swallow pill for everyone, including the Giants, is if they are really that fixated on taking a top 5 QB it will need to be at 6.
They have enough holes that you're strategy also makes sense but they absolutely cannot rely solely on Jones at QB.
The Giants, and really this regime in particular are in a very disadvantageous position imo
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In comment 16414081 jeff57 said:
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Reach for a QB at your peril.
Why, because you feel that way?
That’s my opinion.
Interesting since your opinion implies you have QB rankings that are different (ie McCarthy ) isn't worth a top 6 pick..
If the Giants like McCarthy then go for it! They have scouted ALL of the top touted QB prospects thos year..
Its just going to be a tough sell on the franchise...we really want a QB but we probably are getting the 4th QB out of the top 6 picks. I mean maybe this is a generational QB class...but if its not this regime will be out of here really quick. Especially when there are big time non-qb prospects that will just fall into our lap at 6.
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In comment 16414172 jvm52106 said:
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In comment 16414081 jeff57 said:
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Reach for a QB at your peril.
Why, because you feel that way?
That’s my opinion.
Interesting since your opinion implies you have QB rankings that are different (ie McCarthy ) isn't worth a top 6 pick..
If the Giants like McCarthy then go for it! They have scouted ALL of the top touted QB prospects thos year..
they can't just like him they have to love him...otherwise that does kind reek of a little desperation...you want a QB that bad and like the kid so you basically are left with the 4th QB selected in the draft within the top 6.
They better think the kid is a franchise changing QB...not a good system game managing QB.
Its just going to be a tough sell on the franchise...we really want a QB but we probably are getting the 4th QB out of the top 6 picks. I mean maybe this is a generational QB class...but if its not this regime will be out of here really quick. Especially when there are big time non-qb prospects that will just fall into our lap at 6.
There are plenty of examples Of quarterbacks taken after the top three being Great NFL quarterbacks. Just in recent years Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson and Jalen Hurts come to mind.
I can see Arizona moving from 4 to 6 IF they feel Nabors (or Odunze) are pretty close to MHJ. They could get a blue chip WR and a nice package from NY. They would definitely consider it.
There will ABSOLUTELY be a price that will get them to move.
Its "will JS pay it".
This is a watershed moment for the franchise. Even if the guy they pick busts, they break the sequence of Eli and Eli 2.0. that they've been stuck in since around 2016.
No one knows which of these guys is THE guy. You can make a case for any of these QBs. Identify YOUR guy and go and get him.
6 QBs are going in rd 1. If you want a QB, THIS is the draft to get one!
Falcons at 8, Vikings at 11, Broncos at 12, Raiders at 13. All of those teams would draft him and all of them are probably trying to figure out how to get in front of each other to draft him.
2- Jones now has an injury history in his neck and knee which are two important spots for a running QB. This has led to 2 season ending injuries in 2 out of last 3 years.
3- Schoen has openly acknowledged Giants need to add a QB, will look to draft for a QBand that has mentioned both Jones injuries and the possibility of trading up in virtually every single public interview/presser.
4- the Giants reporters including the ones most closely connected with team directives (Paul Schwartz) have all written articles on Giants looking to not only draft a QB but potentially trading up.
5- national reporters at the Combine are discussing how they are hearing at the Combine and reporting that the Giants are mentioned in every conversation about trading up.
6- we have asshat rumors on top of that coming out that the Giants are in fact looking to draft QB and maybe trade up.
The Giants may not draft QB at 6 but you really need your head in the sand to not be taking this very seriously that Giants think they need a QB and considering even trading up for one.
All of the above smells of a team preparing its fan base for drafting a QB and moving on from the incumbent QB.
I can see Arizona moving from 4 to 6 IF they feel Nabors (or Odunze) are pretty close to MHJ. They could get a blue chip WR and a nice package from NY. They would definitely consider it.
There will ABSOLUTELY be a price that will get them to move.
Its "will JS pay it".
This is a watershed moment for the franchise. Even if the guy they pick busts, they break the sequence of Eli and Eli 2.0. that they've been stuck in since around 2016.
No one knows which of these guys is THE guy. You can make a case for any of these QBs. Identify YOUR guy and go and get him.
Maye to me seems like Eli 3.0
(if JJ is the target)
(if JJ is the target)
I think Jayden Daniels go 1-2 then Maye could be had with trade up to 3 and JJ could be had from 4-6.
"Sometimes qb3/4/etc is the best one in the draft!"
As long as it's a QB BD feels comfortable with take him
2- Jones now has an injury history in his neck and knee which are two important spots for a running QB. This has led to 2 season ending injuries in 2 out of last 3 years.
3- Schoen has openly acknowledged Giants need to add a QB, will look to draft for a QBand that has mentioned both Jones injuries and the possibility of trading up in virtually every single public interview/presser.
4- the Giants reporters including the ones most closely connected with team directives (Paul Schwartz) have all written articles on Giants looking to not only draft a QB but potentially trading up.
5- national reporters at the Combine are discussing how they are hearing at the Combine and reporting that the Giants are mentioned in every conversation about trading up.
6- we have asshat rumors on top of that coming out that the Giants are in fact looking to draft QB and maybe trade up.
The Giants may not draft QB at 6 but you really need your head in the sand to not be taking this very seriously that Giants think they need a QB and considering even trading up for one.
All of the above smells of a team preparing its fan base for drafting a QB and moving on from the incumbent QB.
I’m not arguing with that. But it has to be the right QB.
The roster still has many holes. Trading up from sixth overall will consume even more 2024 and 2025 picks. leaving more holes to be addressed. My guess is the highest they consider moving up is to NE at third overall (cost the Jets three second rounders in 2018 I believe). Arizona and San Diego are potential trade up partners as well.
With no reasonable trade up offers and assuming the top 3 or even top 4 picks are gone, the choices are: 1) Stay put and pick the next QB off the board (likely overdrafting the 5th best or even 4th best QB), 2) taking the BPA non-QB and maybe trading back into the bottom of the first round for a QB or 3) trading back from sixth overall and taking a QB with their first rounder or waiting until the second round.
The roster still has many holes. Trading up from sixth overall will consume even more 2024 and 2025 picks. leaving more holes to be addressed. My guess is the highest they consider moving up is to NE at third overall (cost the Jets three second rounders in 2018 I believe). Arizona and San Diego are potential trade up partners as well.
With no reasonable trade up offers and assuming the top 3 or even top 4 picks are gone, the choices are: 1) Stay put and pick the next QB off the board (likely overdrafting the 5th best or even 4th best QB), 2) taking the BPA non-QB and maybe trading back into the bottom of the first round for a QB or 3) trading back from sixth overall and taking a QB with their first rounder or waiting until the second round.
If they like DM or JJM then we won't lose the bidding war to trade up to 6. No one but us can guarantee AZ or LA a blue chipper while trading down. We won't let someone jump us for one of the top 4 if we want him.
Link - ( New Window )
Wrong.
If one didn’t know better, you could say that looks like full bloom…ah, nevermind.
1. Maye is available and NE takes him. AZ takes MHJ. Charger willing to move back and Giants trade the 3rd round pick for McCarthy.
2. Maybe the Pats like McCarthy so they trade pick 39 and 2025 1st round pick to NYG. Giants take Maye. Or Pats take McCarthy and Giants trade to 5 and get Maye.
3. One of Maye or McCarthy falls to NYG and we keep all our draft picks.
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1- Jones has a 5 year of putting it charitably not getting the desired results. We are a bottom 3 team in NFL for his career here and we have not made it out of October for 4 out of 5 seasons
2- Jones now has an injury history in his neck and knee which are two important spots for a running QB. This has led to 2 season ending injuries in 2 out of last 3 years.
3- Schoen has openly acknowledged Giants need to add a QB, will look to draft for a QBand that has mentioned both Jones injuries and the possibility of trading up in virtually every single public interview/presser.
4- the Giants reporters including the ones most closely connected with team directives (Paul Schwartz) have all written articles on Giants looking to not only draft a QB but potentially trading up.
5- national reporters at the Combine are discussing how they are hearing at the Combine and reporting that the Giants are mentioned in every conversation about trading up.
6- we have asshat rumors on top of that coming out that the Giants are in fact looking to draft QB and maybe trade up.
The Giants may not draft QB at 6 but you really need your head in the sand to not be taking this very seriously that Giants think they need a QB and considering even trading up for one.
All of the above smells of a team preparing its fan base for drafting a QB and moving on from the incumbent QB.
I’m not arguing with that. But it has to be the right QB.
Sure. But shouldn’t it be true for any position? Is it good to draft the wrong WR?
There seems to be a presumption that all these WRs will hit but only QBs can bust
Its simply not true. Did it help us that Neal or Flowers or Apple were not QBs?
The idea that a QB is 5 years and is outdated only if you let it. SF just made a SB within 5 years of a bust QB. The Eagles drafted Wentz, won a SB with Foles and then made a SB with Hurts all within 7 years. The Rams drafted Goff and made a SB and then traded him and made a SB with Stafford within 6 years. The Bucs drafted Winston and won a SB with Brady within 6 years.
QB is only 5 years if you make excuses and deny all results and stubbornly stick to mistakes to prove you are right
1. Maye is available and NE takes him. AZ takes MHJ. Charger willing to move back and Giants trade the 3rd round pick for McCarthy.
2. Maybe the Pats like McCarthy so they trade pick 39 and 2025 1st round pick to NYG. Giants take Maye. Or Pats take McCarthy and Giants trade to 5 and get Maye.
3. One of Maye or McCarthy falls to NYG and we keep all our draft picks.
Very likely, wildcard being if AZ has MHJ and Nabers/Odunze graded very closely and we trade up to 4 for JJM or Maye. Either way you cut it, we are primed to get one of the top 4 QBs if we want to which all signs seem to point toward us wanting to based on insider info and reports.
Its a total crap shoot and you need a back up.
How about JJM and Pratt.
Its a total crap shoot and you need a back up.
How about JJM and Pratt.
NO!
+10000
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May be the most dialed in of the beats.
It's either old times again at the meadowlands with loose lips OR it is intentional smoke.
Based on this regime being pretty tight on info so far I'd say most likely smoke.
Not sure how the Giants making other teams think they want a QB helps them. The non-QBs will be there.
Something just feels off. This isn't smoke it's a raging inferno. Every single beat it on it and even non-locals are on it. I can't imagine the Giants brass being that obvious about it.
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In comment 16414145 BJacobs The Tiptoe Bandit said:
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May be the most dialed in of the beats.
It's either old times again at the meadowlands with loose lips OR it is intentional smoke.
Based on this regime being pretty tight on info so far I'd say most likely smoke.
Not sure how the Giants making other teams think they want a QB helps them. The non-QBs will be there.
Something just feels off. This isn't smoke it's a raging inferno. Every single beat it on it and even non-locals are on it. I can't imagine the Giants brass being that obvious about it.
It's harder to keep your intentions secret when you are actively trying to move up. If you are trying to move up, by definition you have to be talking to other teams, so it opens up the amount of people who know your plans. If the giants have put in calls to all of the top 5 about what it would take to move up, there are now 5 front offices who know the Giants overall plan and have no incentive to keep it a secret
I didn't think the Giants would be willing to move on this soon after signing Jones. I'm very happy that it appears I'm wrong on that.
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In comment 16414159 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 16414145 BJacobs The Tiptoe Bandit said:
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May be the most dialed in of the beats.
It's either old times again at the meadowlands with loose lips OR it is intentional smoke.
Based on this regime being pretty tight on info so far I'd say most likely smoke.
Not sure how the Giants making other teams think they want a QB helps them. The non-QBs will be there.
Something just feels off. This isn't smoke it's a raging inferno. Every single beat it on it and even non-locals are on it. I can't imagine the Giants brass being that obvious about it.
It's harder to keep your intentions secret when you are actively trying to move up. If you are trying to move up, by definition you have to be talking to other teams, so it opens up the amount of people who know your plans. If the giants have put in calls to all of the top 5 about what it would take to move up, there are now 5 front offices who know the Giants overall plan and have no incentive to keep it a secret
Plus, Schoen knows we hold all the cards for a trade up. No other team can offer a trade package that would include getting a blue chip player in the draft. So if Schoen really wants one of the top 4 QBs then he doesn't care if reports leak about them wanting to tradeup. No team behind us can Make an offer like we can.
Thank goodness!
Stay at 6 and get the BPA. Take Rattler in the 2nd. He’s going to be a star
And how do you know that this isn’t their plan all along? Just a few days ago everyone was hoping to get JJ but now it’s viewed as a desperation pick? Please
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he said the Giants ARE exploring the cost of moving up, not maybe.
Stay at 6 and get the BPA. Take Rattler in the 2nd. He’s going to be a star
Link - ( New Window )
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Eric from BBI : Admin : 2:06 pm : link : reply
he said the Giants ARE exploring the cost of moving up, not maybe.
Of course they are. Why wouldn't they? Isn't that just due diligence? Schoen said he'd be talking to the other GMs at the combine (about whether they'd be receptive). If he says it publicly in his presser, it's not some big, inside scoop from a biased (in this area) beat writer.
Look, maybe they trade up, or maybe they feel price is too high for them. I don't know. But to me, it seems quite a leap from exploring the possibility to being done with Jones.
My take is this: IF they go all in and trade up, that's a clear indicator Jones is out after next season. Same is true in the unlikely event one of the top 3 QBs falls to them at 6 and they take him. If they don't trade up, Jones is their QB until they find another one.
What they do in the draft will be the ONLY PUBLIC indication of how they really feel about Jones.
Anything before that is speculation, and wishful thinking.
ALSO, everyone's just assuming that the Giants LOVE all 3 QBs. What if they don't? We've ALL watched drafts were a fan-consensus guy was sitting there and they took someone else.
What if one of the top 3 QBs falls in their lap at 6 and the Giants take a WR? Sure, BBI will shit its cage, but what does THAT say? About Jones or anything else?
I don't claim to know how they feel or what they want to do at 6. I don't think anyone does. But right now, much of the media is writing DUH type articles under the assumption that the Giants absolutely MUST trade up and get a new QB. I don't believe the Giants are operating under that premise. It's just one option.
THIS!!!
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but if they're aggressively trying to trade up (as has been reported) and fail to do so, taking McCarthy at six would seem like settling. I think that's the issue people would have with it, and it's a legit concern.
And how do you know that this isn’t their plan all along? Just a few days ago everyone was hoping to get JJ but now it’s viewed as a desperation pick? Please
I literally said desperate isn’t the right word.
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In comment 16414159 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 16414145 BJacobs The Tiptoe Bandit said:
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May be the most dialed in of the beats.
It's either old times again at the meadowlands with loose lips OR it is intentional smoke.
Based on this regime being pretty tight on info so far I'd say most likely smoke.
Not sure how the Giants making other teams think they want a QB helps them. The non-QBs will be there.
Something just feels off. This isn't smoke it's a raging inferno. Every single beat it on it and even non-locals are on it. I can't imagine the Giants brass being that obvious about it.
It's harder to keep your intentions secret when you are actively trying to move up. If you are trying to move up, by definition you have to be talking to other teams, so it opens up the amount of people who know your plans. If the giants have put in calls to all of the top 5 about what it would take to move up, there are now 5 front offices who know the Giants overall plan and have no incentive to keep it a secret
Good Point.
I suppose our best case scenario is that our brass is doing their due diligence on all scenarios and setting up all options depending on how things move in the next few weeks.
We all have PTSD from when the Giants seemed to get caught flat footed a a few times (Eli Apple year, Devonta Smith jump, barkley not answering calls, etc.)
To his credit Shoen does seem to be very prepared for all scenarios. It's amazing that we as giants fans need to applaud that but here we are.
The roster still has many holes. Trading up from sixth overall will consume even more 2024 and 2025 picks. leaving more holes to be addressed. My guess is the highest they consider moving up is to NE at third overall (cost the Jets three second rounders in 2018 I believe). Arizona and San Diego are potential trade up partners as well.
With no reasonable trade up offers and assuming the top 3 or even top 4 picks are gone, the choices are: 1) Stay put and pick the next QB off the board (likely overdrafting the 5th best or even 4th best QB), 2) taking the BPA non-QB and maybe trading back into the bottom of the first round for a QB or 3) trading back from sixth overall and taking a QB with their first rounder or waiting until the second round.
Are we still celebrating that Eagles win? That certainly did a lot for the franchise, huh?
Its a total crap shoot and you need a back up.
How about JJM and Pratt.
Gotta love Rattler
I didn't think the Giants would be willing to move on this soon after signing Jones. I'm very happy that it appears I'm wrong on that.
Terps, don't mortgage the farm, yet. I'll believe it when I see it...
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Two quarterbacks.
Its a total crap shoot and you need a back up.
How about JJM and Pratt.
Gotta love Rattler
Why? What has he done to deserve this love?
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At a minimum, Schoen's and Daball's jobs (particularly Daboll's) are potentially on the line for the 2024. IMHO, they absolutely cannot rely on Daniel Jones to be the starter for the full year, given his multiple serious injuries.
The roster still has many holes. Trading up from sixth overall will consume even more 2024 and 2025 picks. leaving more holes to be addressed. My guess is the highest they consider moving up is to NE at third overall (cost the Jets three second rounders in 2018 I believe). Arizona and San Diego are potential trade up partners as well.
With no reasonable trade up offers and assuming the top 3 or even top 4 picks are gone, the choices are: 1) Stay put and pick the next QB off the board (likely overdrafting the 5th best or even 4th best QB), 2) taking the BPA non-QB and maybe trading back into the bottom of the first round for a QB or 3) trading back from sixth overall and taking a QB with their first rounder or waiting until the second round.
Are we still celebrating that Eagles win? That certainly did a lot for the franchise, huh?
I personally loved that win and thought it was worth dropping from 5 to 6 to kick the Eagles ass as they headed into the playoffs.
Why are you sitting on the edges of your seats and taking every bit of content as legit news? It's okay to be skeptical.
Why are you sitting on the edges of your seats and taking every bit of content as legit news? It's okay to be skeptical.
Now we want to move up in the draft, lose draft capital and plug a new QB into a poor situation. It’s a plan that fails around the league over and over.
Look at the successful QBs around the league. The majority were plugged in to good situations where they had talent around them and were able to achieve success. Rodgers sat for a few years and became a HOFer, Mahomes sat for a year is well on his way, Purdy looks good in SF on a great team, Dak as a 4th rounder, has been behind the best OL and looks like a good enough QB, Romo before him as an undrafted FA QB, Joe Burrow in Cin was also put into a great situation and even Stroud was put into a good situation.
Then you have Young down in Carolina, Wilson in NY and the countless failures at QB when a team has no talent to support them.
Drafting a QB into the Giants situation and thinking they are going to be successful is just repeating history. We are middle of the road in cap space with very little skill talent and almost no skill talent available in FA. The worst OL in the league. If we trade up, we give away prime draft capital and set up the new QB for failure yet again. Maybe they can fix the OL in FA but they still have no RB, no reliable TE and terrible WRs. It only makes sense to get a QB if the guy falls to them. If not let the QB guru work on a guy they draft in the later rounds. Half the leagues starting QBs are not 1st rounders, so why can’t the Giants groom one?
His next neck injury (the two make it HIGHLY likely), "might" leave him paralyzed. He has a 23 million injury guarantee.
Come on, its time to move on.
What a terrible fucking quote. Ken Dorsey was 38-2 with a Natty too. I’m sure he interviewed incredibly well. Doesn’t make him a top 6 pick.
I stopped reading after this part. If you think that's true then you have no idea what you're talking about. Both were far worse situations than the Giants are in now.
If they don't sign Baker, then yeah.
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QB and Harrison. Cardinals and Chargers could work.
If they don't sign Baker, then yeah.
NE has been rumored to sign Baker AND still draft a QB of the future. Baker would be mentoring their pick is the plan that was rumored.
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In comment 16414206 UConn4523 said:
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QB and Harrison. Cardinals and Chargers could work.
If they don't sign Baker, then yeah.
NE has been rumored to sign Baker AND still draft a QB of the future. Baker would be mentoring their pick is the plan that was rumored.
I doubt Baker would sign up to be a lame duck QB with what seems to be a pretty good market for him
It would have been nice if he could actually make the talent assessment instead of his normal decision making process of going with his personal feelings until there are enough pitchforks outside the meadowlands. At least he is consistent!
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Joe Burrow in Cin was also put into a great situation and even Stroud was put into a good situation.
I stopped reading after this part. If you think that's true then you have no idea what you're talking about. Both were far worse situations than the Giants are in now.
So Cincy getting the 1st overall QB without having to trade away anything and Tee Higgins in the 2nd with Mixon on the team and then getting the best WR in the 1st the following year in Chase is a worse situation than the Giants?
We most likely have to trade up to get the 3rd or 4th best QB in the draft and at what price? Maybe our 1st next year.
The biggest issue with trading up to take a QB is where are you going to get players to improve the team? We are middle of the road in cap space with a ton of needs and no real playmakers. No RB, No TE and No WRs. FA money dries up quick the way the Giants operate. Tag Barkley and $12 Mil is gone. Sit tight and get a QB if one that you like falls to 6. Dont get desperate and trade away a boatload of resources, just take a WR. There are QBs worth taking later on that Daboll can work with especially since the QB drafted ealry may not even start year 1 anyway. Complete mistake trading up.