Before traveling to Pittsburgh today, Russell Wilson stopped in New Jersey for what one source described as “an exploratory meeting” with the Giants, per league sources.
Wilson is in Pittsburgh today to meet with the Steelers, per sources
Before traveling to Pittsburgh today, Russell Wilson stopped in New Jersey for what one source described as “an exploratory meeting” with the Giants, per league sources.
Wilson is in Pittsburgh today to meet with the Steelers, per sources
I’m not. Taylor as a solid backup that can’t stay healthy. Wilson actually had a good 2023. Obviously huge difference in price between the two but if Wilson is cheap, and we draft Nabers/Odinze, we immediately have a real NFL capable offense.
You'll get him for the vet minimum. Draft a QB like JJ McCarthy to sit and learn. If Russ plays well you try to trade him or he walks in FA and you get a nice comp pick.
It made cap sense to let DJ go I would take Rus in a heartbeat as a bridge to a young 1st round QB. Even with all the sh** in Denver last year he produced . Would be best QB since Eli
I see the Giants' beats are on top of this, as usual
I’m not. Taylor as a solid backup that can’t stay healthy. Wilson actually had a good 2023. Obviously huge difference in price between the two but if Wilson is cheap, and we draft Nabers/Odinze, we immediately have a real NFL capable offense.
Wilson should be cheaper than Tyrod. He's getting paid by Denver this year.
You'll get him for the vet minimum. Draft a QB like JJ McCarthy to sit and learn. If Russ plays well you try to trade him or he walks in FA and you get a nice comp pick.
I have no illusions that he's the player he was in his prime, but I think he's still a decent option to at least play competently if the price is right.
Adam Schefter reposted
Brad Spielberger, Esq.
@PFF_Brad
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1m
Giants passing game coordinator/QB coach Shea Tierney was at NC State as a student when Russell Wilson played there, became a grad assistant the year he transferred
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Adam Schefter
@AdamSchefter
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9m
Before traveling to Pittsburgh today, Russell Wilson stopped in New Jersey for what one source described as “an exploratory meeting” with the Giants, per league sources.
Rumors are that Russ might play for close to vet minimum
I’m not. Taylor as a solid backup that can’t stay healthy. Wilson actually had a good 2023. Obviously huge difference in price between the two but if Wilson is cheap, and we draft Nabers/Odinze, we immediately have a real NFL capable offense.
Denver has a lot of pieces on offense, at least 3 really talented receivers, and a good offensive line, why did they let him go?
You'll get him for the vet minimum. Draft a QB like JJ McCarthy to sit and learn. If Russ plays well you try to trade him or he walks in FA and you get a nice comp pick.
Sign him to compete with Jones. No QB at 6.
Sure let's rely on a 35 year old that is regressing and a 27 year old that's never been good and can't stay healthy. No thanks
You'll get him for the vet minimum. Draft a QB like JJ McCarthy to sit and learn. If Russ plays well you try to trade him or he walks in FA and you get a nice comp pick.
Sign him to compete with Jones. No QB at 6.
LOL. Signing Russ would not mean we rule out a QB. It would mean that we wouldn't have to risk playing DJ and DJ getting hurt again and screwing up our financial situation do to his injury guarantees
also preferring tyrod over russell wilson is beyond laughable
i doubt rw comes to nyg but that would be the absolute last reason why.
in his last 7 seasons combined tyrod has 18 total tds and 14 ints. that is over 34 games played (15 starts).
in the 2 worst years of his career as a bronco russ had 48 touchdowns and 19 ints. 30 games, 30 starts.
tyrod hasnt gone 1 month staying healthy in any of those 7 seasons. russ has only missed 4 games in 12 years due to injury.
again very little reason he'd choose nyg but on top of being a galactically better and more durable player than tyrod, he'd also probably be cheaper bc of the denver offset.
I’m not. Taylor as a solid backup that can’t stay healthy. Wilson actually had a good 2023. Obviously huge difference in price between the two but if Wilson is cheap, and we draft Nabers/Odinze, we immediately have a real NFL capable offense.
Denver has a lot of pieces on offense, at least 3 really talented receivers, and a good offensive line, why did they let him go?
Because he’s expensive and Payton wants to run a different offense.
I’m not saying we have to do this but we should be open minded. I’m happy Schoen is exploring it.
They're gonna pay Barkley & X around 2 million combined? I mean if they'll both sign for a million each then sure you gotta get that done. Unfortunately I don't think they will.
Jordan Raanan
@JordanRaanan
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1m
The #Giants are going to sign a quarterback in free agency. This would be a cheap option and contingency for Daniel Jones + draft. It kind of makes some sense if Wilson can’t get a guaranteed starting spot.
Pat Leonard
@PLeonardNYDN
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3m
Joe Schoen promised to be in the veteran QB market with Daniel Jones tracking to be the Week 1 starter. But signing Wilson would replace Jones, not support him. A reinforcement here of just how much work the Giants recognize they need to do at QB — including in the short term
Says no dead money added to this year's salary cap if we designate DJ a post June 1st cut. Can anybody confirm that to be true?
correct - it would be same as cutting him next year except it would take them off the hook for his injury guarantee (as long as they cut him after he's healthy and can pass a physical).
But is there anyone out there still believing they are in on Jones? They have no choice but to keep him this year, and yet they don't trust him even for that.
Are going to draft a QB. Preferably early. It buys Daboll and Schoen time for the development. Wilson would be a one year rental and I can't see him putting his ego aside and be comfortable being replaced by the kid later in the season.
problem with playing Jones in 2024 as the bridge QB is if he gets hurt again. Bad situation.
Funny, but I wonder if Wilson's situation in Denver is kind of opening eyes to other teams on don't hold a QB if you are not on board fully..
FYI- Pittsburgh, New England, Chicago, Washington, Atlanta all moving on (or appear to be) from QB's they were behind last year but now see the need to find a new one.
But is there anyone out there still believing they are in on Jones? They have no choice but to keep him this year, and yet they don't trust him even for that.
You highly doubt it? Why? They brought him in for a meeting. That alone says a lot.
pittsburgh makes a lot more sense so i think it's a lot more likely
but there is some sense with nyg if they are done with jones. wilson is durable and will be a cheap replacement (likely minimum year 1).
he could be a 2-3 year bridge QB (obviously would be a 1 year prove it deal to start).
doesnt stop them from drafting someone. and if RW is on the minimum and he plays well trading him could bring back a return. or just letting him expire and getting a 3rd rd comp pick if he rehabs his value to 20m+ or beyond (if he's a starter level player again he'd get more than that).
if they are done with jones RW makes sense.
but like i said pitt likely makes more sense. they have no QB and they were a playoff team last year. strong defense and established coach. good wide receivers. better OL. id bet on that for rw.
You'll get him for the vet minimum. Draft a QB like JJ McCarthy to sit and learn. If Russ plays well you try to trade him or he walks in FA and you get a nice comp pick.
This is the key!
Not only do you get a vet QB for the absolute minimum vet salary (likely at least 2 million less than even the worst vet QBs) BUT it also means that the Giants are serious about moving on from Jones.
and Eric mentioned it yesterday I believe, Jones has a number of injury pieces now (two neck injuries and a major knee injury) where thinking he can play a full season (which he has not done yet) is wishful thinking at best. Add that to his performance and his contract and the real worry is that he gets injured making us even more on the hook $ wise well past this season..
Are going to draft a QB. Preferably early. It buys Daboll and Schoen time for the development. Wilson would be a one year rental and I can't see him putting his ego aside and be comfortable being replaced by the kid later in the season.
I actually think Russ would be the opposite of that. He’s a little weird but I’ve never gotten ego getting in the way. It’s the only scenario I’d be ok with the rookie sitting most of the year. They can actually learn something from Russ.
I have no illusions that he's the player he was in his prime, but I think he's still a decent option to at least play competently if the price is right.
I’m not. Taylor as a solid backup that can’t stay healthy. Wilson actually had a good 2023. Obviously huge difference in price between the two but if Wilson is cheap, and we draft Nabers/Odinze, we immediately have a real NFL capable offense.
Denver has a lot of pieces on offense, at least 3 really talented receivers, and a good offensive line, why did they let him go?
Because he’s expensive and Payton wants to run a different offense.
I’m not saying we have to do this but we should be open minded. I’m happy Schoen is exploring it.
There is also plenty of smoke that he was terrible in the locker room and despised by teammates in both Denver and Seattle
But is there anyone out there still believing they are in on Jones? They have no choice but to keep him this year, and yet they don't trust him even for that.
You highly doubt it? Why? They brought him in for a meeting. That alone says a lot.
They brought him in for an exploratory meeting, yes. But I don't see Wilson wanting to go to a spot where there is another veteran QB plus potentially a high round rookie. And who knows what money he's looking for.
1 they're not cutting DJ < 2025
2 RW would come at the MIN salary
3 RW comes with several Pros/Cons
Pros:
-Still a good QB
-MIN salary doesn't hurt financial flexibility in pursuing FAs
-Allows NYG to concentrate on a non-QB e.g. Odunze to give us an outside weapon
Add up all of the above: QB = RW, RB = TBD, OL (left to right) = Thomas, Bredeson, JMS, Onwenu, Neal/Eluemunur, TE = Noah Fant (just an idea), WRs Odunze/Hyatt/Wandale/Slayton feels like an actual NFL offense.
Cons:
-Wilson's age (35)
-His leadership/intangibles (inflated ego)
-Its a short term perhaps short sighted solution to the QB position (how often do you get the chance to choose a QB this high in a QB heavy draft?)
And Kurt Warner hated how the situation ended even though he was replaced because he was playing poorly.
As others have mentioned, this is all because of the injury guarantee in Jones contract. The Giants drafting a quarterback can’t be surprising news at this point.
I wonder if Wilson's wife is pushing NY - she is a model right?
I'm fine with getting Wilson on the cheap, cutting Jones, as long as we can draft the QB of the future to sit behind Wilson this year. I was never a big Wilson fan, but I think he's better than Jones.
RE: RE: RE: I highly doubt they will go this route
But is there anyone out there still believing they are in on Jones? They have no choice but to keep him this year, and yet they don't trust him even for that.
You highly doubt it? Why? They brought him in for a meeting. That alone says a lot.
They brought him in for an exploratory meeting, yes. But I don't see Wilson wanting to go to a spot where there is another veteran QB plus potentially a high round rookie. And who knows what money he's looking for.
Denver is paying his entire salary. Whatever his new team pays him does not add on to that. It simply gets Denver off the hook for whatever he signs for. Wilson has no motivation to help Denver out so I’d assume it’s going to be a minimum contract he signs
so its understandable he wants to show what he can do with anyone who is better than a one read quarterback in his offense.
As far as Wilson is concerned, I think Schoen is just doing his due diligence with the reality that AT BEST there are 4 QBs worth taking at the top of the draft and we're picking 6th.
of drafting a QB, it'll be an enormous mistake. Wilson is only good enough to win you 7-8 games anymore, and then we'd be drafting out of range to get a top QB next year despite still needing one.
If it's done in addition to drafting a QB then fine.
idea of shelving Jones for the year on another thread.
Not sure how exactly Schoen deals with it but he is not going to keep a healthy player on the roster with no intent of playing him under any circumstances. Schoen has been saying he expects him cleared by camp.
Does say they're looking into all avenues for a bridge QB because they're terrified of that injury guarantee kicking in. Raiders did it with Carr and obviously the Broncos with Wilson.
Wilson's 2023 season didn't prove anything other than he's declining and has no business being paid as a top level QB. Or even a second tier QB.
He had fewer air yards in 2023 than what Jones did in 2022 and the Giants were forced to play significant snaps to Marcus Johnson, David Sills, and Richie James. He could very well be signed vet minimum and I feel that's the only way Schoen is looking at this.
of drafting a QB, it'll be an enormous mistake. Wilson is only good enough to win you 7-8 games anymore, and then we'd be drafting out of range to get a top QB next year despite still needing one.
If it's done in addition to drafting a QB then fine.
If he wants his own people having their own office then that is hard no for me. I disagree with others that he is playoff caliber starting QB anymore, but on the right terms as a bridge so we don't have to start a rookie that is not ready absolutely.
of drafting a QB, it'll be an enormous mistake. Wilson is only good enough to win you 7-8 games anymore, and then we'd be drafting out of range to get a top QB next year despite still needing one.
If it's done in addition to drafting a QB then fine.
He's 35. This would be a bridge type situation.
Bridge to the QB we draft this year or to some QB we hypothetically draft in future years?
to Mara and Tisch's checkbook. They are going to pay Jones 91 million bucks for six games. We may have done everything in our power to "screw him up," but we also did everything in our power to make sure he lives an extremely opulent life for that screw up.
idea of shelving Jones for the year on another thread.
Not sure how exactly Schoen deals with it but he is not going to keep a healthy player on the roster with no intent of playing him under any circumstances. Schoen has been saying he expects him cleared by camp.
idea of shelving Jones for the year on another thread.
Not sure how exactly Schoen deals with it but he is not going to keep a healthy player on the roster with no intent of playing him under any circumstances. Schoen has been saying he expects him cleared by camp.
Schoen also said he’s our starting QB. Do you believe him?
Sign Russell, draft Maye and retain DJ as the backup.
Giants had Simms vs Hoss QB battle part II. But they drafted Kent Graham in the 8th round and later took Dave Brown in 1st round supplemental.
The plan was basically, let the better QB win the starting spot between Simms & Hoss, and the rookie QBs would redshirt and sit on the bench to learn. Of course, it all fell apart, because Simms got hurt early in the season & was lost for the year. Hoss came in and then he got hurt and Brown and Graham had to play on Thanksgiving in a massacre at Dallas.
Still, from Schoen & Daboll's standpoint, they are in a tough spot that they have to win to keep their jobs and simultaneously find the QB of the future. A trade up is unlikely, so that QB who they take needs to be talented enough with a big upside, but you sit them to let them learn. Meanwhile, you can't trust Jones to stay healthy enough to win, so you need real competition at QB. But for the Giants, I think the goal is to get to the playoffs, even as the 7th seed. That will buy the front office and coach additional time.
Tyrod is a really nice backup...but he gets hurt whenever he plays. Backup QBs who get hurt are, as the old saying goes "like T*** on a bull". Wilson isn't what he once was, but can a combination of Jones and Wilson eek out 8 or 9 wins to clinch a playoff spot while the rookie QB develops?
Regardless, there are plenty of shots across the bow at Jones that his time here is done after 2024.
to Mara and Tisch's checkbook. They are going to pay Jones 91 million bucks for six games. We may have done everything in our power to "screw him up," but we also did everything in our power to make sure he lives an extremely opulent life for that screw up.
so its understandable he wants to show what he can do with anyone who is better than a one read quarterback in his offense.
As far as Wilson is concerned, I think Schoen is just doing his due diligence with the reality that AT BEST there are 4 QBs worth taking at the top of the draft and we're picking 6th.
I really don't think Daboll is coaching for his life. If he was they'd have done more to sign Saquon & McKinney. It seems like Schoen & Daboll have been given the go ahead to tear it down and rebuild like they were planning to do in 2023 (Unfortunately we won a lot more games in 2022 than anybody thought so they really couldn't do it last year)
Ryan Dunleavy
@rydunleavy
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18m
A QB room of Russell Wilson, Daniel Jones, J.J. McCarthy and Tommy DeVito sure would make #Giants interesting.
I think the best QB in 2024 -- not necessarily the right choice to start -- would be ... Wilson. Ultimately, I don't think he signs in NY but fun to think about today
so its understandable he wants to show what he can do with anyone who is better than a one read quarterback in his offense.
As far as Wilson is concerned, I think Schoen is just doing his due diligence with the reality that AT BEST there are 4 QBs worth taking at the top of the draft and we're picking 6th.
I really don't think Daboll is coaching for his life. If he was they'd have done more to sign Saquon & McKinney. It seems like Schoen & Daboll have been given the go ahead to tear it down and rebuild like they were planning to do in 2023 (Unfortunately we won a lot more games in 2022 than anybody thought so they really couldn't do it last year)
Or Saquon and McKinney simply aren't as good in their minds and there are better/cheaper options. I remember years ago when Armstead was let go and everyone thought it was a cap casualty, but we later found out the Giants just thought he wasn't worth it. I think the Giants need to at least be in the playoff race entering January, and there is no reason they shouldn't.
They are clearly scouting the shit out of THIS quarterback class.
But things don't always go according to plan too.
I get that, the problem is if they bring in Wilson to start, they probably won't be picking this high again next year (and maybe not the year after either), so it really puts them in nowhere land.
Giants won't have 4 QBs on the roster no? If Wilson does sign here-which I think is remote, but still-Russ, Jones, & rookie QB. DeVito would be a goner no?
so its understandable he wants to show what he can do with anyone who is better than a one read quarterback in his offense.
As far as Wilson is concerned, I think Schoen is just doing his due diligence with the reality that AT BEST there are 4 QBs worth taking at the top of the draft and we're picking 6th.
I really don't think Daboll is coaching for his life. If he was they'd have done more to sign Saquon & McKinney. It seems like Schoen & Daboll have been given the go ahead to tear it down and rebuild like they were planning to do in 2023 (Unfortunately we won a lot more games in 2022 than anybody thought so they really couldn't do it last year)
Or Saquon and McKinney simply aren't as good in their minds and there are better/cheaper options. I remember years ago when Armstead was let go and everyone thought it was a cap casualty, but we later found out the Giants just thought he wasn't worth it. I think the Giants need to at least be in the playoff race entering January, and there is no reason they shouldn't.
Giants won't have 4 QBs on the roster no? If Wilson does sign here-which I think is remote, but still-Russ, Jones, & rookie QB. DeVito would be a goner no?
They are clearly scouting the shit out of THIS quarterback class.
But things don't always go according to plan too.
Scouted the shit out of this QB class and have been discussing trade ups for close to 2 months now. They are doing everything they can to draft a QB this year.
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
As in Schoen is not hearing any interest in those three trading down. That leaves McCarthy or Maye and a gaggle of folks trying to move into the 4 spot.
He left Seattle on what seemed to be bad terms, they improved when Geno Smith took over. When he went to Denver he brought all kinds of drama, then Peyton, a QB guru took over and it seems determined he didn’t want him as his QB.
For a team like the Giants who are trying to build a winning culture and one of a team atmosphere, I think his presence would be detrimental, especially in a city like NY where football can take a back seat to other interests.
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
I mean, Pittsburgh isn’t really all that close to Jersey, lol
will play for the veteran minimum? Has this been reported somewhere?
As I said in an earlier post, Denver is on the hook for his entire salary. A new deal he signs with a team doesn’t not add on to that. It simply gets taken off what Denver has to pay. Wilson isn’t going to do Aden er any favors by lessening what they pay him. The less he takes in a new contract, the more Denver has to pay
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
I mean, Pittsburgh isn’t really all that close to Jersey, lol
Yeah, that makes no sense. You can "feel each other out" over the phone. The Giants are interested enough to host him, and Wilson is interested enough to physically go there.
RE: Gotta wonder if this indicates how 1-3 think about the QBs
As in Schoen is not hearing any interest in those three trading down. That leaves McCarthy or Maye and a gaggle of folks trying to move into the 4 spot.
Probably 3rd spot. Arizona has a lot of draft capital right now and need high end talent.
Currently they have two 1st round picks, one 2nd, and three 3rds.
We have DJ.
We're adding a vet/retaining TT.
We hope to draft the future.
DJ's on the team next year. He can be the (very expensive) vet back up.
If a vet (better than DJ) can be landed to take over starting, would that upset anyone? According to the vocal majority of BBI, better than DJ should be easy. Pricing is the issue.
Is NY big enough for both Aaron and Russell to coexist?
@ least the Giants are FINALLY coming to the realization that Jones isn't the answer. Thank God. It took them long enough.
Something to consider - If Mara has not been as influential as many fans think then Schoen and Daboll decided they needed to see more of Jones up close to make a firm decision on whether they could win with him. IF that is the case, it does not make sense or seem likely that fans could come to an educated conclusion before them. I think it is obvious there is more than meets the eye when it comes to evaluating players.
& Russ' wife is in the entertainment business too right? That'd make NYC a helluva lot more appealing to him & her than Pittsburgh. After all, happy wife...happy life. Haha.
Think about it: how would you feel if you went through years of Mac Jones and Bailey Zappe, you get a brand new head coach, and they pass on Maye/McCarthy in favor of Baker Mayfield? This place would melt down.
If Tampa doesn't see Mayfield as the franchise guy going forward, why would Jerod Mayo stake his job on him? It's hard to get in striking distance of a franchise QB in the draft. I don't see NE squandering the opportunity.
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
I mean, Pittsburgh isn’t really all that close to Jersey, lol
Yeah, that makes no sense. You can "feel each other out" over the phone. The Giants are interested enough to host him, and Wilson is interested enough to physically go there.
What's been reported literally says "exploratory meeting". But hey, let's just jump to a conclusion without considering what we actually know.
and admitting they screwed up would honestly give me a great feeling on where this team is heading and the people in charge making decisions.
Cut Jones. Take our medicine. Cut Jones this season and according to overthecap, we don't have any more added dead money next season. We'd have 136M in cap space as opposed to 114M with cutting Jones next year.
Russ would be an amazing bridge QB. Let the draft come to us at 6.
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
I mean, Pittsburgh isn’t really all that close to Jersey, lol
Whatever --none of us know. Adam Schefter's tweet sort of gave that impression it was a transitory thing, which is why I mentioned. But of course you know better, right?
Assume signing Russ means they also draft a QB at 6. I actually think it means the opposite.
I feel like drafting a kid will help Daboll and his time left in NY. The team signing Wilson isn't getting many wins (with Pittsburgh is different as they have more overall talent) or bringing long term stability.
They are clearly scouting the shit out of THIS quarterback class.
But things don't always go according to plan too.
I get that, the problem is if they bring in Wilson to start, they probably won't be picking this high again next year (and maybe not the year after either), so it really puts them in nowhere land.
But that doesn't impact this draft.
You seem to be wanting to complain about something for the sake of complaining.
we can put to rest the idea that they are OK with Jones being the QB.
Agree with this. Whether or not they sign Wilson or not is less important than the fact they seem to realize going into 2024 starting Jones is no longer a viable plan to win games.
Here are the facts: $23 million of Jones' $30 million salary for 2025 was guaranteed for injury at signing. Separately, $12 million of Jones' $30 million salary becomes fully guaranteed if he's on the roster on the fifth day of the 2025 league year. So sometime in mid-March of 2025 will become a crucial deadline if the Giants want to move on from Jones since they'd want to cut him before that $12 million becomes guaranteed.
The injury guarantee will come into play if the Giants want to move on and Jones can't pass a physical. It would have to be a major injury, like the torn ACL he's currently rehabbing, to prevent him from passing a physical in March, thus triggering the injury guarantee. His $35.5 million salary for 2024 was fully guaranteed at signing, which is why there's no chance the team will dump him this offseason and why the injury guarantee won't enter the equation until 2025.
The 2025 injury guarantee shouldn't be a major consideration next season unless the team has already decided it's done with Jones. That seems unlikely, and if Jones is deemed the best option, he'll be the starting quarterback next season despite the financial risk. The injury guarantee could become an issue later in the season if the Giants are out of contention and they plan to move on from Jones. At that point, they could bench him to protect themselves from potentially getting stuck with the $23 million charge from the injury guarantee.
That's what the Raiders did with quarterback Derek Carr at the end of last season
Also, it’s SMART to sign and play a vet and ensure Jones does not see the field in 2024 to not screw up the 2025 cap. There is a high likelihood of him getting injured.
The best thing for the player is honesty to cut him but the Giants need a replacement in house.
They are clearly scouting the shit out of THIS quarterback class.
But things don't always go according to plan too.
I get that, the problem is if they bring in Wilson to start, they probably won't be picking this high again next year (and maybe not the year after either), so it really puts them in nowhere land.
But that doesn't impact this draft.
You seem to be wanting to complain about something for the sake of complaining. [/quote]
Lol, now you sound like my wife! I'm bitter and can't stomach more stopgap moves. I want a chance at our own top QB, not a backup paid like a starter (Jones) or a former superstar at the tail end of his career (Wilson).
problem with playing Jones in 2024 as the bridge QB is if he gets hurt again. Bad situation.
This x1000
If the team is done with Jones it is complete idiocy to play him even 1 snap next year due to 2025 cap ramifications incase of injury. They should cut him after signing a vet or two and drafting the franchise QB.
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
I mean, Pittsburgh isn’t really all that close to Jersey, lol
Whatever --none of us know. Adam Schefter's tweet sort of gave that impression it was a transitory thing, which is why I mentioned. But of course you know better, right?
Simmer down. I didn’t realize I even said anything to get your panties all in a bunch. Your sensitivity means nothing to me. All I said was Pittsburgh wasn’t really all that close to Jersey when you said he was “on his way to Pittsburgh anyway”. New Jersey is not exactly just on the way to Pittsburgh. That’s all. Now pull your shit together and stop being so sensitive
and admitting they screwed up would honestly give me a great feeling on where this team is heading and the people in charge making decisions.
Cut Jones. Take our medicine. Cut Jones this season and according to overthecap, we don't have any more added dead money next season. We'd have 136M in cap space as opposed to 114M with cutting Jones next year.
Russ would be an amazing bridge QB. Let the draft come to us at 6.
They can't cut Jones until he can pass a physical. He won't be able to pass a physical until after June 1st. There isn't going to be a way around carrying dead DJ money into 2025. The only thing the Giants could theoretically do would be to earmark the 2024 cap room that corresponds to the 2025 dead money and then roll that over to next year as unspent space, but that potentially means restructuring other contracts to leave the phantom cap space untouched, and that's a ridiculous way to manage the cap.
The better approach would be for fans to stop pretending like there's a realistic way for the Giants to absorb the entirety of DJ's remaining albatross this year.
You can't rely on a rookie to start. Mahomes didn't start as a rookie.
They are scouting the QBs. Why would they be meeting with all the quarterbacks, including having Maye come to NJ if they weren't strongly considering drafting one?
Guarantee Russ the job for 2024. It’s fine to move on.
Thank you.
Take the medicine now and turn the page strongly.
You can’t have Daniel Jones in that QB room, field, or locker room if a rookie is coming and Jones has no future here. It needs to be fresh all the way around.
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
I mean, Pittsburgh isn’t really all that close to Jersey, lol
Whatever --none of us know. Adam Schefter's tweet sort of gave that impression it was a transitory thing, which is why I mentioned. But of course you know better, right?
Simmer down. I didn’t realize I even said anything to get your panties all in a bunch. Your sensitivity means nothing to me. All I said was Pittsburgh wasn’t really all that close to Jersey when you said he was “on his way to Pittsburgh anyway”. New Jersey is not exactly just on the way to Pittsburgh. That’s all. Now pull your shit together and stop being so sensitive
Could be a layover in Newark, who knows. It might explain why beats weren't out in front was the suggestion.
to try to manufacture leverage before meeting with Pittsburgh. If vet minimum is on the table, there might not be much of a market for the Russell Wilson circus and his agent is getting creative. Who leaked it to Schefter and why?
the market value/demand for Justin Fields has not materialized - too many vets out there, and draft options.
Supposedly, Chicago couldn't even get a conditional 2nd/3rd contemplation taken seriously at Combine.
It goes to show how quickly QB value can tank in todays NFL - boom or bust market both for teams and players.
This is not a surprise. People claiming Bears could get a first round pick for Fields were smoking something. Fields has not shown to be a good QB. If you trade for him, you only have one year to see how he does. So, teams don't want to give up a lot for a year trial. Unless of course, a coach has connections with him or is confident that he can be the guy.
to sign high priced players should want this. We need a Vet backup AND a rookie. If you sign Russ for Vet min that will be 4-5 mil less than anyone else we sign. We would be dumb not to sign him, but I can't imagine he would sign with us.
RE: Uninformed opinion, but this seems like an agent leak
to try to manufacture leverage before meeting with Pittsburgh. If vet minimum is on the table, there might not be much of a market for the Russell Wilson circus and his agent is getting creative. Who leaked it to Schefter and why?
to try to manufacture leverage before meeting with Pittsburgh. If vet minimum is on the table, there might not be much of a market for the Russell Wilson circus and his agent is getting creative. Who leaked it to Schefter and why?
Idk about this. Russ is getting his 39 million no matter what from the Broncos. So him taking a big salary for his new team would be extremely stupid as it hurts them building around him. I'd assume he wants as much money as possible on the Broncos books and not his new team.
second time how were you able to post within two minutes? I believe is a small post freeze time, but nothing like 900 seconds... Unless you are talking New Threads and not just posts.
second time how were you able to post within two minutes? I believe is a small post freeze time, but nothing like 900 seconds... Unless you are talking New Threads and not just posts.
New thread yes, that is the time limit one.
RE: RE: Uninformed opinion, but this seems like an agent leak
to try to manufacture leverage before meeting with Pittsburgh. If vet minimum is on the table, there might not be much of a market for the Russell Wilson circus and his agent is getting creative. Who leaked it to Schefter and why?
Idk about this. Russ is getting his 39 million no matter what from the Broncos. So him taking a big salary for his new team would be extremely stupid as it hurts them building around him. I'd assume he wants as much money as possible on the Broncos books and not his new team.
You may be right there, didn't realize there was offset language in his contract. Looks like whatever he gets paid by a new team would reduce what the Broncos owe.
can find a way to cut Jones now, they should. It's bad for both sides to have him on the roster.
at this point I am 100% on board with this. The Giants need to turn the page.
There is no benefit to cut Jones unless you want to kill all our Cap space this year to save on next year. You post June 1st cut him doesn't save us money pretty sure this year or next.
second time how were you able to post within two minutes? I believe is a small post freeze time, but nothing like 900 seconds... Unless you are talking New Threads and not just posts.
New thread yes, that is the time limit one.
Ok thank you... I don't post new threads very often.
can find a way to cut Jones now, they should. It's bad for both sides to have him on the roster.
at this point I am 100% on board with this. The Giants need to turn the page.
There is no benefit to cut Jones unless you want to kill all our Cap space this year to save on next year. You post June 1st cut him doesn't save us money pretty sure this year or next.
There are two big benefits:
(1) You are not wasting a roster spot.
(2) More importantly, you are not creating an awkward situation where your $160 million QB is inactive for 17 games. Possibly a Union issue too?
can find a way to cut Jones now, they should. It's bad for both sides to have him on the roster.
at this point I am 100% on board with this. The Giants need to turn the page.
There is no benefit to cut Jones unless you want to kill all our Cap space this year to save on next year. You post June 1st cut him doesn't save us money pretty sure this year or next.
There are two big benefits:
(1) You are not wasting a roster spot.
(2) More importantly, you are not creating an awkward situation where your $160 million QB is inactive for 17 games. Possibly a Union issue too?
I hear you but now you need to go sign another QB. We need two Vets. The only way it makes sense is if you Cut DJ pre-June 1st. Take the 22 mil hit this year meaning we would only have about 8-10 mil in cap, HOWEVER he would be zero next year.
can find a way to cut Jones now, they should. It's bad for both sides to have him on the roster.
at this point I am 100% on board with this. The Giants need to turn the page.
There is no benefit to cut Jones unless you want to kill all our Cap space this year to save on next year. You post June 1st cut him doesn't save us money pretty sure this year or next.
There are two big benefits:
(1) You are not wasting a roster spot.
(2) More importantly, you are not creating an awkward situation where your $160 million QB is inactive for 17 games. Possibly a Union issue too?
What is the rush to move on from Jones?
It's only Year 6. Give him a chance to prove himself.
Hmmm... I guess I just assumed that was where we were going. I don't think they want DeVito starting again as he isn't good.
Nobody has a 3rd QB on their roster who is "good." DeVito is probably as good as it gets when your backup goes down.
I mean that is a good point. Just they have been saying they are going to bring in a Vet and it appears they want to draft a rookie. I assume that means they want to keep two Vets and a Rookie. Maybe I am reading it wrong.
If Russell wants to be here (and his wife)......I can't think of a
better scenario to bridge to our rookie QB in 2025.
Russell gets to start and play the whole season pretty much without any pressure........
He can work with the rookie we draft and Davito.
He would be cheap....
And he can resurrect his own value for 2025 unless he likes it here and wants to be the back-up/#2.
I think this is a win-win and if I am Joe.....Don't let him leave the building.
Also, I don't think the Giants want to paint this year as a complete throwaway. Selling contrarian fans and ownership on cutting Jones with a bridge QB in the Tyrod- Tannehill tier is a tough sell especially in year 3 of this thing.
to stick it to Denver which is on the hook for his full 2024 salary, minus whatever he gets from another team, according to Riesen. So, I think an opportunity to start will be his primary motivation. I just don't see how Giants can realistically cut Jones this year, be active in free agency, while absorbing the cap hit. He would be a lot cheaper than a competent backup but I don't see it happening unless Schoen can figure out the cap stuff.
They could also be using the threat of bringing in a veteran
As leverage to Jones and his agent to agree to remove the injury clause from his contract. You were injured last year twice, we can't be on the hook for your health. If you want to step on the field, remove the clause or park your seat on the bench.
and admitting they screwed up would honestly give me a great feeling on where this team is heading and the people in charge making decisions.
Cut Jones. Take our medicine. Cut Jones this season and according to overthecap, we don't have any more added dead money next season. We'd have 136M in cap space as opposed to 114M with cutting Jones next year.
Russ would be an amazing bridge QB. Let the draft come to us at 6.
They can't cut Jones until he can pass a physical. He won't be able to pass a physical until after June 1st. There isn't going to be a way around carrying dead DJ money into 2025. The only thing the Giants could theoretically do would be to earmark the 2024 cap room that corresponds to the 2025 dead money and then roll that over to next year as unspent space, but that potentially means restructuring other contracts to leave the phantom cap space untouched, and that's a ridiculous way to manage the cap.
The better approach would be for fans to stop pretending like there's a realistic way for the Giants to absorb the entirety of DJ's remaining albatross this year.
Good call on Jones not passing a physical until after June 1st, GD. I'm in favor of paying Jones to sit home. It's time for everyone to move on. Management, players and fans.
I will lose faith in Schoen & Daboll if they sign him.
He will probably be the cheapest Vet we can sign and we want to sign a Vet. It would be dumb not to unless we don't sign a Vet at all and just go with DJ and a Rookie.
agree that he will likely sign elsewhere, but I'd definitely be in favor of signing Wilson as a "bridge" QB for a year or two, especially given the very low cost.
I probably would, but I don't see the Giants cutting Jones this year. Overthecap says the cap hit for doing so would be $47M. But I could see the Giants wanting to play him as little as possible to minimize the risk of triggering his injury guarantee. Wilson would allow them to do so and still be competitive.
there is no possible reason that keep him on this team in 2024.
The injury risk alone to the 2025 cap is going to force the Giants to not play him. If he won't be played, just do the player a favor and cut him and save the locker room drama.
Do we think Team Wilson proactively asked for a meeting with Schoen? Or did Schoen reach out to Team Wilson?
I would 100% think the former. I don't think Wilson fits into the current situation at all.
If I was to guess, I would bet we are drafting a QB somewhere in the 1st 2 rounds and keeping Taylor to start (unless said drafted QB wins the job) if Jones isn't ready for the season.
Who knows though? Interesting offseason this year, that's for sure.
and admitting they screwed up would honestly give me a great feeling on where this team is heading and the people in charge making decisions.
Cut Jones. Take our medicine. Cut Jones this season and according to overthecap, we don't have any more added dead money next season. We'd have 136M in cap space as opposed to 114M with cutting Jones next year.
Russ would be an amazing bridge QB. Let the draft come to us at 6.
They can't cut Jones until he can pass a physical. He won't be able to pass a physical until after June 1st. There isn't going to be a way around carrying dead DJ money into 2025. The only thing the Giants could theoretically do would be to earmark the 2024 cap room that corresponds to the 2025 dead money and then roll that over to next year as unspent space, but that potentially means restructuring other contracts to leave the phantom cap space untouched, and that's a ridiculous way to manage the cap.
The better approach would be for fans to stop pretending like there's a realistic way for the Giants to absorb the entirety of DJ's remaining albatross this year.
Good call on Jones not passing a physical until after June 1st, GD. I'm in favor of paying Jones to sit home. It's time for everyone to move on. Management, players and fans.
Have to take a look at him. No harm but think like others have said - he will wind up elsewhere.
Best case scenario - the QB they want falls into their lap without having to give up anything. OLine improves and Jones plays better. Would make Jones appealing as a trade option.
whether its pre or post June 1, Bring in a vet and draft a rookie while improving the team.
You cant fix everything this offseason with the resources we have and you can fix even less if you cut Jones because you have to pay another QB at least a few million. Look around the league, look at how much the Bills had to cut just to get under the cap because they are paying their QB. The whole benefit of a rookie QB is you have cap money to sign your own good players and bring in new FA.
The Giants situation is what it is, I believe if they are brining in a vet, it is to either compete with Jones because Jones wont be ready. If they draft a QB the best bet would be to keep Jones and Davito and let them battle it out in camp.
Cutting Jones now without the June 1 Designation adds $22 Mil at least (Dont forget the injury settlement), post June 1 keeps the number the same but you have a replacement cost of a vet. Not many are going to come here to start for the league mimimum unless its a multiyear deal again kicking more money into next season eating into the rookie QB savings again.
So how does a team get better when you are terrible and operating with low cap money and possibly less drafts picks because of a trade up to get a QB? This is not a smart way to build a successful franchise and just about every team that has tried like this has failed.
whether its pre or post June 1, Bring in a vet and draft a rookie while improving the team.
You cant fix everything this offseason with the resources we have and you can fix even less if you cut Jones because you have to pay another QB at least a few million. Look around the league, look at how much the Bills had to cut just to get under the cap because they are paying their QB. The whole benefit of a rookie QB is you have cap money to sign your own good players and bring in new FA.
The Giants situation is what it is, I believe if they are brining in a vet, it is to either compete with Jones because Jones wont be ready. If they draft a QB the best bet would be to keep Jones and Davito and let them battle it out in camp.
Cutting Jones now without the June 1 Designation adds $22 Mil at least (Dont forget the injury settlement), post June 1 keeps the number the same but you have a replacement cost of a vet. Not many are going to come here to start for the league mimimum unless its a multiyear deal again kicking more money into next season eating into the rookie QB savings again.
So how does a team get better when you are terrible and operating with low cap money and possibly less drafts picks because of a trade up to get a QB? This is not a smart way to build a successful franchise and just about every team that has tried like this has failed.
Probably not, but if there is anyway to do it now, even at the expense of the 2024 season, do it.
Having Jones on the roster as the third QB is not going to be a good situation.
on the field, but they are not a better situation in life. You're talking about a celebrity couple now. They want the bright lights. There's been smoke around Wilson wanting to play in NY for years now.
You can't rely on a rookie to start. Mahomes didn't start as a rookie.
They are scouting the QBs. Why would they be meeting with all the quarterbacks, including having Maye come to NJ if they weren't strongly considering drafting one?
Stroud says "hold my beer."
Mahomes didn't start because they had Alex Smith who threw for 4000+ yards and 26 td's that season. We are not in that situation.
You can't rely on a rookie to start. Mahomes didn't start as a rookie.
They are scouting the QBs. Why would they be meeting with all the quarterbacks, including having Maye come to NJ if they weren't strongly considering drafting one?
Stroud says "hold my beer."
Mahomes didn't start because they had Alex Smith who threw for 4000+ yards and 26 td's that season. We are not in that situation.
Him to look at NY. Russell is probably looking at Strahan and Brady's post football careers in broadcasting. He would be in demand, and NY would be a great launching point for that.
Without the medical clause and playing for less....he can try and salvage his career somewhat before we ultimately put in the QB we draft in late 2024 or 2025.
i doubt rw comes to nyg but that would be the absolute last reason why.
in his last 7 seasons combined tyrod has 18 total tds and 14 ints. that is over 34 games played (15 starts).
in the 2 worst years of his career as a bronco russ had 48 touchdowns and 19 ints. 30 games, 30 starts.
tyrod hasnt gone 1 month staying healthy in any of those 7 seasons. russ has only missed 4 games in 12 years due to injury.
again very little reason he'd choose nyg but on top of being a galactically better and more durable player than tyrod, he'd also probably be cheaper bc of the denver offset.
This man is correct
RE: RE: RE: This Board is going to look pretty stupid
I interpret the Giants taking that meeting as meaning there is potential interest in Wilson to be a vet to start the season while Jones is rehabbing and Jones returning to start.
Says no dead money added to this year's salary cap if we designate DJ a post June 1st cut. Can anybody confirm that to be true?
They are paying DJ virtually nothing to play this year. Why would they cut him.
If $36M qualifies as "virtually nothing" in your world, I can only imagine you share a zip code with Jeff Bezos and/or Elon Musk.
The Giants are handcuffed to DJ's 2024 guaranteed cap obligation, so they have no cash or cap benefit by cutting him, but they're paying him thirty-six million brand spankin' new American dollars this year alone. Where did you arrive at such a ridiculous notion that they're paying him "virtually nothing to play this year"?
I interpret the Giants taking that meeting as meaning there is potential interest in Wilson to be a vet to start the season while Jones is rehabbing and Jones returning to start.
Wilson isn’t going to the bench for jones. Wilson at his worst is better than jones.
If the Giants acquire a replacement for Jones, the very best outcome for them is to find a trade partner.
One potential destination for Jones is actually Buffalo, where Mike Shula is an advisor. Shula is the only former coach or coordinator Jones has played under still employed in the NFL.
RE: the timeline and dollars, it's not complex. Jones cannot be cut or traded until he can pass a physical which will certainly be after June 1. At which point the 22M in unaccounted for bonus money for 2025/26 will hit the 2025 cap.
The Giants should not just cut Jones. They should exhaust every option to find a trade partner, even if that means holding out from playing while he's healthy.
If the Giants pick up all but the minimum of his salary, a healthy Jones can net the Giants a modest return.
DJ is dumb... He won't happen he is going to start the season as QB1 for this team next year. Can we cut him yes... will we cut him no.
When I see posts like this, all I can think of is the Baghdad Bob meme.
How can you ignore all the smoke from the last week? Put the pieces together and it’s clear the Giants are moving on from Jones.
Several of you guys are going to go through a serious Daniel Jones withdrawal when he’s officially not part of the future anymore. Going to be really hard for some of you to get off that drug.
DJ is dumb... He won't happen he is going to start the season as QB1 for this team next year. Can we cut him yes... will we cut him no.
When I see posts like this, all I can think of is the Baghdad Bob meme.
How can you ignore all the smoke from the last week? Put the pieces together and it’s clear the Giants are moving on from Jones.
Several of you guys are going to go through a serious Daniel Jones withdrawal when he’s officially not part of the future anymore. Going to be really hard for some of you to get off that drug.
What are you talking about... Most people want to move on from DJ. Some think he sucks and some think he is good, but you can't trust him to stay healthy. Just because you want to cut him doesn't mean he will. He won't be cut at all because sadly he will be starting next year unless the rookie we draft shows to be insanely good and ready. My guess we draft a rookie and he is starting by game 6. Either way they aren't cutting DJ.
idea of shelving Jones for the year on another thread.
Not sure how exactly Schoen deals with it but he is not going to keep a healthy player on the roster with no intent of playing him under any circumstances. Schoen has been saying he expects him cleared by camp.
The jumping to conclusions on this board is interesting. There's a report of a meeting with the Giants, that's not been confirmed. If it did happen, that would be proper due diligence by the team, that should not start this avalanche response of cut DJ and Russell is the bridge blah, blah, blah. Second, JS has stated, a number of times, that if healthy, DJ is the starting QB. Some will say that's GM talk, maybe yes, maybe no, but for now I'm willing to take him at his word. They're not dumping DJ. C'mon, if Russell is signed, and that's a big if, he would not be the opening day QB but a backup insurance policy. It appears to me the organization is committed to DJ and will give him every opportunity to succeed. Strickley my opinion.
idea of shelving Jones for the year on another thread.
Not sure how exactly Schoen deals with it but he is not going to keep a healthy player on the roster with no intent of playing him under any circumstances. Schoen has been saying he expects him cleared by camp.
The jumping to conclusions on this board is interesting. There's a report of a meeting with the Giants, that's not been confirmed. If it did happen, that would be proper due diligence by the team, that should not start this avalanche response of cut DJ and Russell is the bridge blah, blah, blah. Second, JS has stated, a number of times, that if healthy, DJ is the starting QB. Some will say that's GM talk, maybe yes, maybe no, but for now I'm willing to take him at his word. They're not dumping DJ. C'mon, if Russell is signed, and that's a big if, he would not be the opening day QB but a backup insurance policy. It appears to me the organization is committed to DJ and will give him every opportunity to succeed. Strickley my opinion.
Do we think Team Wilson proactively asked for a meeting with Schoen? Or did Schoen reach out to Team Wilson?
I would 100% think the former. I don't think Wilson fits into the current situation at all.
If I was to guess, I would bet we are drafting a QB somewhere in the 1st 2 rounds and keeping Taylor to start (unless said drafted QB wins the job) if Jones isn't ready for the season.
Who knows though? Interesting offseason this year, that's for sure.
That's what I was thinking, but I just don't know for sure.
This news could be leaked by Team Wilson to show the market they are in big demand early in this process. So, if you want us, you'd better act now and make an appointment.
If it was actually Schoen, it would be a direct hit the groin of Team Jones. I'm just not sure if Schoen is that cold blooded...
on a vet min deal is myopic. There should be a free agent signing to add to the QB room. Russ would be preferable to anyone else on the FA market because of cost.
He may get a better deal elsewhere, though.
But this would do nothing in terms of draft plans. You still are targeting a franchise QB for the future in this draft. But then you can go:
Russell Wilson to start the season, potentially completely redshirting your rookie.
Rookie as the backup.
Daniel Jones as the third string.
Tommy DeVito on the PS.
That's a much more preferable scenario to any of the other possible scenarios I can see right now.
It would also give Schoen better positioning at 6. You could then more or less let the draft come to you unless the move up cost is approachable. You can try and see if Maye or McCarthy makes it to 6.
on a vet min deal is myopic. There should be a free agent signing to add to the QB room. Russ would be preferable to anyone else on the FA market because of cost.
He may get a better deal elsewhere, though.
But this would do nothing in terms of draft plans. You still are targeting a franchise QB for the future in this draft. But then you can go:
Russell Wilson to start the season, potentially completely redshirting your rookie.
Rookie as the backup.
Daniel Jones as the third string.
Tommy DeVito on the PS.
That's a much more preferable scenario to any of the other possible scenarios I can see right now.
It would also give Schoen better positioning at 6. You could then more or less let the draft come to you unless the move up cost is approachable. You can try and see if Maye or McCarthy makes it to 6.
Agreed
I'd love to see Russell Wilson under center for the Giants
Even if it's for a short amount of time, he scored 26 TD's with Denver last season, as opposed to how many for Jones? Russell Wilson helped Denver score more TD's than all 3 QB's combined on the Giants last season. Russell Wilson still has juice, so why not tap into it?
The Giants could draft one of the top WR's in the first round, then draft one of the QB's in the second round. Jones could go to the PS.
We all get caught up in this amazing Pollyanna concept of dynasty building and sustained excellence. Yes we get a Pats and a Chiefs occasionally but they are exceptions and not the norm.
The new NFL is making the playoffs and getting hot. Heck we did it in 2022. We had no business in the Divisional Round but we got a little hot. Packers went to the NFLCC and went toe to toe with the 49ers this year a month after our Tommy Devito led team beat them up on national TV.
Before we start worrying about consistent excellence how about we worry about not getting our asses kicked up and down the field on Sundays and putting out a watchable offensive product?
Nobody is saying that Russ is a top end QB anymore but you are delusional if you think he isn't better for 2024 than either an injury riddled Dan Jones. Even if you draft the rookie you can't make the Jets mistake and throw him in. Guys have to sit now for at least a few weeks. For every CJ Stroud there are 10 Tannehills, Jameis', and Mariotas.
He is cheap and competent. Not a long term answer but as a bridge guy he is literally perfect.
If the Giants sign Wilson or some other vet QB and draft a QB, can they put Jones on the practice squad so he doesn’t take up a roster spot? I assume no one would claim him at his salary
If the Giants sign Wilson or some other vet QB and draft a QB, can they put Jones on the practice squad so he doesn’t take up a roster spot? I assume no one would claim him at his salary
You cut players before you sign them to the practice squad.
I interpret the Giants taking that meeting as meaning there is potential interest in Wilson to be a vet to start the season while Jones is rehabbing and Jones returning to start.
Wilson isn’t going to the bench for jones. Wilson at his worst is better than jones.
I agree with that. I am worried the Giants don't see it that way.
while we draft our future in April?
Would Russ rather go to a team where he could be a three or four year starter as he winds down his career?
Thus the exploratory meeting. What's in it for both sides. What do both sides think.
I'd rather play Bubble Boy Anakim at QB than Wilson.
For $1M+, we'd be getting HoF QB for one-year at the league minimum after he just threw 26 TDs/8 INTs at 66% completion%, 7+ AY/A, top ten in TD passes, tied for 1st in 4qtr comebacks and tied for 2nd in game wining drives. And he missed the last two games because Payton benched him.
If he plays the last two games, he might have 30 TD passes to finish in the top five.
Before traveling to Pittsburgh today, Russell Wilson stopped in New Jersey for what one source described as “an exploratory meeting” with the Giants, per league sources.
Wilson is in Pittsburgh today to meet with the Steelers, per sources
This is the point. It makes no sense to ever play DJ again. As soon as he passes a physical you cut him. This allows a guy like Maye to sit for a year under Russ. Very smart to strongly consider this.
I'd rather play Bubble Boy Anakim at QB than Wilson.
For $1M+, we'd be getting HoF QB for one-year at the league minimum after he just threw 26 TDs/8 INTs at 66% completion%, 7+ AY/A, top ten in TD passes, tied for 1st in 4qtr comebacks and tied for 2nd in game wining drives. And he missed the last two games because Payton benched him.
If he plays the last two games, he might have 30 TD passes to finish in the top five.
For league minimum...
It really is a no brainer, but no way he comes here.
I'd rather play Bubble Boy Anakim at QB than Wilson.
No one is obligated to like Wilson the person, but if you could get 3k yards, 26 TD and 8 INT on anything around league min. salary for a year, you're an idiot not to take it.
We had many posters here say if we took a QB at 6 - we should play him immediately because we need to start the rebuild - and now we are backtracking for an aging veteran who was hated by his last team so much - they took a massive hit?
Come on people. Let’s get the QB and play him and see what we got.
I'd rather play Bubble Boy Anakim at QB than Wilson.
For $1M+, we'd be getting HoF QB for one-year at the league minimum after he just threw 26 TDs/8 INTs at 66% completion%, 7+ AY/A, top ten in TD passes, tied for 1st in 4qtr comebacks and tied for 2nd in game wining drives. And he missed the last two games because Payton benched him.
If he plays the last two games, he might have 30 TD passes to finish in the top five.
For league minimum...
It makes perfect sense for the Giants. And at first I would think RW would have no interest in coming here. But the New York market is a huge advantage for him and is wife and he is likely looking at a one year window to play for his next contract. Certainly a much better market than Pittsburgh or Minneapolis, that's for sure. So this may be more of a possibility than I originally thought...
We had many posters here say if we took a QB at 6 - we should play him immediately because we need to start the rebuild - and now we are backtracking for an aging veteran who was hated by his last team so much - they took a massive hit?
Come on people. Let’s get the QB and play him and see what we got.
Sometimes it is not the right move to throw a rookie to the wolves immediately. Eli started halfway through his rookie season, and even had a rough go of it.
We had many posters here say if we took a QB at 6 - we should play him immediately because we need to start the rebuild - and now we are backtracking for an aging veteran who was hated by his last team so much - they took a massive hit?
Come on people. Let’s get the QB and play him and see what we got.
Sometimes it is not the right move to throw a rookie to the wolves immediately. Eli started halfway through his rookie season, and even had a rough go of it.
This is exactly right. And irrespective of RW's persona, the guy is a likely future HoFer. A Drake Maye and the Giants franchise would be very well served for him to hold a clip board under RW for a year.
There were whispers before he went to Denver that fame had gone way to his head. Now whispers he wasn't liked in Denver by his teammates.
I really haven't followed that aspect of him.
No question he is a prima donna and not well liked by his teammates. But this would be a one year rental which would allow the Giants to cut DJ as soon as he clears his physical. No brainer.
We had many posters here say if we took a QB at 6 - we should play him immediately because we need to start the rebuild - and now we are backtracking for an aging veteran who was hated by his last team so much - they took a massive hit?
Come on people. Let’s get the QB and play him and see what we got.
Sitting a rookie behind Russel Wilson and behind Daniel Jones are two vastly different things
We had many posters here say if we took a QB at 6 - we should play him immediately because we need to start the rebuild - and now we are backtracking for an aging veteran who was hated by his last team so much - they took a massive hit?
Come on people. Let’s get the QB and play him and see what we got.
Sitting a rookie behind Russel Wilson and behind Daniel Jones are two vastly different things
We aren’t going anywhere Russell Wilson. It’s time to be realistic. Yes Wilson is much better than Jones. But it’s gonna prolong what we need to do starting him a full year.
If Eric situation arose like Eli - fine - but if we draft a rookie - he needs to play a lot this year. Sitting him a full year is just pissing in the wind.
The Wilson personality thing always interested me. I remember a lot of Seahawks-Sherman in particular-didn’t like Wilson and thought that Carroll favored him, which is why they called that play that ended up in the INT that cost them that Super Bowl to the Pats because they wanted Russ to get the glory. Then the team-in an attempt to bridge the divide-took a trip to Hawaii. It was always odd.
As for Denver, I remember he got like an office. And Payton obviously wasn’t a huge fan, telling him to be more a QB than politician.
There were whispers before he went to Denver that fame had gone way to his head. Now whispers he wasn't liked in Denver by his teammates.
I really haven't followed that aspect of him.
He is considered a phony. The situation in Denver was his own fault because he negotiated an office with the executives. So, when practice would end, he would shoot up the elevator, and act like he was with the football intelligentsia...
If the Giants sign Wilson or some other vet QB and draft a QB, can they put Jones on the practice squad so he doesn’t take up a roster spot? I assume no one would claim him at his salary
You cut players before you sign them to the practice squad.
...he'd probably be an upgrade (he's now another year older) but I could clearly see the arm strength was no longer there.
As a placeholder for a rookie - sure why not if the price/length is extremely Giant friendly - but I doubt it would be. Then again, what other options does he have?
...he'd probably be an upgrade (he's now another year older) but I could clearly see the arm strength was no longer there.
As a placeholder for a rookie - sure why not if the price/length is extremely Giant friendly - but I doubt it would be. Then again, what other options does he have?
If he signs a 1-year deal, it will be for the League minimum because of his the offsets in his previous contract. He gets $39 million from the Broncos and can't make more than that total.
It could not make more sense to sit a rookie under a future HoF quarterback for one year.
The chiefs were a playoff team the year before and good when he sat.
I think we are too far off to be comparable
But the rule continues to be to have a high potential rookie sit for at least a year. But only IF you have a quarterback ahead of him that is effective. So clearly, if DJ is the guy, then I agree with you and you have to start the rookie asap. But if Russ is the guy, like Kurt Warner with Eli, you start the vet and allow the rookie to ease into the role.
Four of the greatest quarterbacks in our lifetime - Mahomes, Brady, Montana and Rodgers all sat for at least a year. Yes, Marino and Peyton are the exceptions. And now perhaps Burrow, Herbert, Allen and Stroud as well. But none of these recent guys have won anything yet, so it is still not clear that starting right away was all that relevant in the grand scheme of things. Time will tell.
The more I think about it, the more this intrigues me. He'd be getting the league minimum & he's an immediate-IMMEDIATE-upgrade at the QB position. We all know he's not the long term answer, but a bridge to the next QB.
I'm warming to this. &-if @ a minimum-this means I never have to see Daniel Fucking Jones ever again behind center as a Giants QB....that in itself is a win for me.
I actually think this makes a lot of sense for Wilson
In comment 16421766 BJacobs The Tiptoe Bandit said:
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What's the real downside?
We all get caught up in this amazing Pollyanna concept of dynasty building and sustained excellence. Yes we get a Pats and a Chiefs occasionally but they are exceptions and not the norm.
The new NFL is making the playoffs and getting hot. Heck we did it in 2022. We had no business in the Divisional Round but we got a little hot. Packers went to the NFLCC and went toe to toe with the 49ers this year a month after our Tommy Devito led team beat them up on national TV.
Before we start worrying about consistent excellence how about we worry about not getting our asses kicked up and down the field on Sundays and putting out a watchable offensive product?
Nobody is saying that Russ is a top end QB anymore but you are delusional if you think he isn't better for 2024 than either an injury riddled Dan Jones. Even if you draft the rookie you can't make the Jets mistake and throw him in. Guys have to sit now for at least a few weeks. For every CJ Stroud there are 10 Tannehills, Jameis', and Mariotas.
He is cheap and competent. Not a long term answer but as a bridge guy he is literally perfect.
We had many posters here say if we took a QB at 6 - we should play him immediately because we need to start the rebuild - and now we are backtracking for an aging veteran who was hated by his last team so much - they took a massive hit?
Come on people. Let’s get the QB and play him and see what we got.
Sitting a rookie behind Russel Wilson and behind Daniel Jones are two vastly different things
Absolutely and I have said this before. Are we really going to let DJ mentor the new QB?
are intent on drafting Maye or McCarthy, the KC model is in play. Neither of these guys are ready to play more than a couple games end of year. Best case is red shirt on both. They’re young and raw from being able to run Dabolls passing offense. One on mental side of it (Maye) and other with more physical and vertical passing game(McCarthy).
Wilson is no longer relevant and he is an awful QB. Denver tried to rehabilitate him. Payton the QB guru could not extract anything from him.
It is reported that he alienates his teammates by his attitude. He is about his brand and not about football. If he wanted to win why would he select the Giants when there are many better teams who are QB needy.
He would be an unwanted distraction.
If he had anything left he would still be playing for Seattle and Denver.
Wilson is no longer relevant and he is an awful QB. Denver tried to rehabilitate him. Payton the QB guru could not extract anything from him.
It is reported that he alienates his teammates by his attitude. He is about his brand and not about football. If he wanted to win why would he select the Giants when there are many better teams who are QB needy.
He would be an unwanted distraction.
If he had anything left he would still be playing for Seattle and Denver.
Perhaps RW is aware of this and NYG is the perfect destination to resurrect his image/career
Sit the rookie or start the rookie? Either way, if your decision is already made before you even get an up-close and personal look at the player, then you have increased the risk of making the wrong decision. Agreeing with a philosophy is much different than have that philosophy hard-coded in how things are done regardless of new insights.
Is a Kurt Warner situation and we’re drafting a QB I want no part of it. It’s bad enough we’re stuck with Jones for another year, now all we need is a past his prime QB on our roster.
but assuming he's looking for an end-of-career situation, NY might be appealing. His wife would love the limelight, RW would make the media rounds for a Strahan-like exit after a season or two, and expectations for this season would be rock bottom. After every win he'd be the toast of the town.
Wilson is no longer relevant and he is an awful QB. Denver tried to rehabilitate him. Payton the QB guru could not extract anything from him.
If Daniel Jones put up 26 touchdowns and 8 INT over 15 healthy starts with 3000 passing yards, and 4 4th quarter comebacks, half this board would never shut up about it. That is not 'awful'. That is the QB play that everyone who is a Jones fan thinks he is in their fantasy land.
If playing from day one is going to break him, then we drafted the wrong guy. Get him out there and start getting game experience under his belt.
Every time you say something stupid, I think that is the worst we may hear from you. However, you continue to break your own records with some of these posts.
His EPA and QBR were not kind and exactly why Payton wants to move on. And his 2023 season, he had fewer air yards than Daniel Jones and his 2022 season. The season with Richie James, David Sills and Marcus Johnson getting significant snaps season.
"Russell Wilson EPA by season - 2023: -62.7 - 2022: -68.5 - 2021: -13.2 - 2020: 69.4 - 2019: 46.2 - 2018: 61.3 - 2017: 32.7 - 2016: 25.2
QBs Russ had a better EPA than in 2023 (min 200 att): Bryce Young, Howell, Zach Wilson, Bailey Zappe, Mac Jones, Dobbs, Pickett"
His EPA and QBR were not kind and exactly why Payton wants to move on. And his 2023 season, he had fewer air yards than Daniel Jones and his 2022 season. The season with Richie James, David Sills and Marcus Johnson getting significant snaps season.
"Russell Wilson EPA by season - 2023: -62.7 - 2022: -68.5 - 2021: -13.2 - 2020: 69.4 - 2019: 46.2 - 2018: 61.3 - 2017: 32.7 - 2016: 25.2
QBs Russ had a better EPA than in 2023 (min 200 att): Bryce Young, Howell, Zach Wilson, Bailey Zappe, Mac Jones, Dobbs, Pickett"
https://twitter.com/MichaelFFlorio/status/1764777879278096413 - ( New Window )
All of this can be reality, and the context is still, for one year, what can he give you.
@MichaelFFlorio
Russ still takes a ton of sacks. But one thing he has going for him is he still has the deep ball. On passes of 20+ air yards this season Russ ranked 11th in EPA ahead of Love, Lamar, Hurts, Herbert, Burrow, etc
Did you watch him play last year ?
Put him behind Giants OL and he will make Jons look like Brady.
Wilson holds the ball and takes sacks even when he has time.
He was at his best when he was behind a good ol, had a running game and deep passing options.
Did you watch him play last year ?
Put him behind Giants OL and he will make Jons look like Brady.
Wilson holds the ball and takes sacks even when he has time.
He was at his best when he was behind a good ol, had a running game and deep passing options.
Sounds just like the Giants.
I don't have access to a lot of Broncos games.
45 sacks last year. The difference compared to what we've dealt with here is while doing so he was still *productive*.
Again, all of this is in the context of a player who isn't long term, and wouldn't be making a lot of money.
Did you watch him play last year ?
Put him behind Giants OL and he will make Jons look like Brady.
Wilson holds the ball and takes sacks even when he has time.
He was at his best when he was behind a good ol, had a running game and deep passing options.
Sounds just like the Giants.
Russell Wilson would make Jones look like Brady? FFS man. How do some of you have the bandwidth to put your socks on in the morning? Socks with the number 8 on them, no doubt…
First off, you can’t get a decent backup QB for league min, so even if he sucks, it’s worth it
Gives the team so much more control, flexibility and options re Jones and drafting a Q/
And best case scenario, Wilson looks halfway decent. Leaves as. a FA and we get a comp pick. With a QB, would be at least a 5 or 6…. Best case that’s unlikely is a 3 or 4 if he shows his old self. Literally, nothing to lose.
Come on. Mahomes, Joe Cool, TB12 all but sat on the bench their rookie seasons. Hell, Eli didn't even start until that Falcons game in late November.
We've been around long enough that we can name examples to support either approach. Wilson, Peyton, Stroud, Roethlisberger, Josh Allen, Stafford - these guys all started right away and they worked out.
Regarding the QBs in this draft, I don't know which of them would be fine starting right away or which may benefit from sitting at first. What I do know is that in the current CBA the single biggest roster building advantage you can have, by far, is a productive QB on a rookie contract.
Now it's true the Giants won't have that advantage in year 1 because of the Jones cap hit. So maybe this is a different situation and sitting that first year makes more sense. On the other hand maybe it'd be better to enter those advantageous years with a year of playing experience under the draft pick's belt.
the last bunch of years, but he’s not stupid. He knows his next chance is his last good chance to show that he can still start, he will be on his best behavior. If not, you cut him, his impact on the cap would be near zero.
When the talk surfaced about the Giants trading for Russ a couple of years ago, I was dead set against it. He would have cost draft assets, would have needed an enormous new contract, and his age didn’t align with a rebuilding team. That’s not the case now. He’d be a one year bridge for a rookie QB on a super cheap contract. The Giants would be foolish to at least not explore it.
There were whispers before he went to Denver that fame had gone way to his head. Now whispers he wasn't liked in Denver by his teammates.
I really haven't followed that aspect of him.
I think too many on this site are making too much of his personality. There are MANY bad teammates around the league (some Ben played or play for the Giants)- but if you perform, that’s all that matters.
Something lost on many here is that now that he is one the street for the first time, he now actually has to play for his next contract. There’s little more motivating than having to earn your next deal in the NFL.
Now, yes he is still getting paid for this coming season, but while the Broncos are taking a cap hit, there’s nothing more being paid to him after the guaranteed money for 2024. So, if he wants to be a well compensated QB in the league, he will have to go somewhere and perform well.
I suspect that NY is only an option because he would get a ton of media attention- and if he performs, it gives him a platform for his next deal
One more thing- people are making the mistake of thinking the Giants are going to throw a rookie out there to start the season. Didn’t so it with Eli- won’t do it here. Not their way.
is go the the Giants today and tell them he wants to waive the injury provision in his contract. This way the Giants can play him (if and when he's healthy) and see if he's able to rebound from last year. Otherwise looks like he's likely to sit all year and that only be considered a backup QB after that.
2024 might be his last shot to compete as a starting QB, he should do everything in his power to salvage his career and that means waiving the injury clause. Otherwise I think he sits the entire year at this point.
a possible reason would be moving on somewhere he could get playing time vs. being pinned to the bench.
if they were done with him he'd probably want to find a place he can get on the field as much as possible in 2024 to rebuild whatever value he can for next offseason.
if they signed wilson that could apply, though i think it's unlikely rw signs here. dont think there's any other veteran qb out there who would create that dynamic other than rw.
Because it's becoming apparent that he's never going to collect on that injury guarantee because the Giants won't risk playing him because of it. Just like Russell Wilson at the end of last year.
So not only will he never collect that money, it's likely going to prevent him from playing this season, which is going to 1) suck for him personally has he's gonna want to play, and 2) damage his career by preventing him any chance at redemption this year.
The smart thing to do would be to go the Giants NOW and say no need to get a vet filler to replace me because you're worried about the injury guarantee, let's take that out of the equation and give me a chance to play this season.
Because it's becoming apparent that he's never going to collect on that injury guarantee because the Giants won't risk playing him because of it. Just like Russell Wilson at the end of last year.
So not only will he never collect that money, it's likely going to prevent him from playing this season, which is going to 1) suck for him personally has he's gonna want to play, and 2) damage his career by preventing him any chance at redemption this year.
The smart thing to do would be to go the Giants NOW and say no need to get a vet filler to replace me because you're worried about the injury guarantee, let's take that out of the equation and give me a chance to play this season.
That would require an extension or restructure- neither of which benefit the Giants. Won’t happen
There were whispers before he went to Denver that fame had gone way to his head. Now whispers he wasn't liked in Denver by his teammates.
I really haven't followed that aspect of him.
I think too many on this site are making too much of his personality. There are MANY bad teammates around the league (some Ben played or play for the Giants)- but if you perform, that’s all that matters.
Something lost on many here is that now that he is one the street for the first time, he now actually has to play for his next contract. There’s little more motivating than having to earn your next deal in the NFL.
Now, yes he is still getting paid for this coming season, but while the Broncos are taking a cap hit, there’s nothing more being paid to him after the guaranteed money for 2024. So, if he wants to be a well compensated QB in the league, he will have to go somewhere and perform well.
I suspect that NY is only an option because he would get a ton of media attention- and if he performs, it gives him a platform for his next deal
One more thing- people are making the mistake of thinking the Giants are going to throw a rookie out there to start the season. Didn’t so it with Eli- won’t do it here. Not their way.
If no one's giving him a starters job, the Giants are probably a good landing spot for him.
Good post all around but I’d be pretty disappointed if the Giants hand Jones the starting job over Wilson without a legit competition. I’d also be disappointed if we flat out told Russ the other day that only the backup job is open. A declining Wilson is still better than Jones.
Wilson is in Pittsburgh today to meet with the Steelers, per sources
Although, they would have to sell the job to him.
if this happens
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Before traveling to Pittsburgh today, Russell Wilson stopped in New Jersey for what one source described as “an exploratory meeting” with the Giants, per league sources.
Wilson is in Pittsburgh today to meet with the Steelers, per sources
Intersting 😈
I’m not. Taylor as a solid backup that can’t stay healthy. Wilson actually had a good 2023. Obviously huge difference in price between the two but if Wilson is cheap, and we draft Nabers/Odinze, we immediately have a real NFL capable offense.
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Much happier with Tyron Taylor.
I’m not. Taylor as a solid backup that can’t stay healthy. Wilson actually had a good 2023. Obviously huge difference in price between the two but if Wilson is cheap, and we draft Nabers/Odinze, we immediately have a real NFL capable offense.
Wilson should be cheaper than Tyrod. He's getting paid by Denver this year.
Sign him to compete with Jones. No QB at 6.
Adam Schefter reposted
Brad Spielberger, Esq.
@PFF_Brad
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Giants passing game coordinator/QB coach Shea Tierney was at NC State as a student when Russell Wilson played there, became a grad assistant the year he transferred
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Adam Schefter
@AdamSchefter
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Before traveling to Pittsburgh today, Russell Wilson stopped in New Jersey for what one source described as “an exploratory meeting” with the Giants, per league sources.
$47 milliion
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Much happier with Tyron Taylor.
I’m not. Taylor as a solid backup that can’t stay healthy. Wilson actually had a good 2023. Obviously huge difference in price between the two but if Wilson is cheap, and we draft Nabers/Odinze, we immediately have a real NFL capable offense.
Denver has a lot of pieces on offense, at least 3 really talented receivers, and a good offensive line, why did they let him go?
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You'll get him for the vet minimum. Draft a QB like JJ McCarthy to sit and learn. If Russ plays well you try to trade him or he walks in FA and you get a nice comp pick.
Sign him to compete with Jones. No QB at 6.
Sure let's rely on a 35 year old that is regressing and a 27 year old that's never been good and can't stay healthy. No thanks
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You'll get him for the vet minimum. Draft a QB like JJ McCarthy to sit and learn. If Russ plays well you try to trade him or he walks in FA and you get a nice comp pick.
Sign him to compete with Jones. No QB at 6.
LOL. Signing Russ would not mean we rule out a QB. It would mean that we wouldn't have to risk playing DJ and DJ getting hurt again and screwing up our financial situation do to his injury guarantees
in his last 7 seasons combined tyrod has 18 total tds and 14 ints. that is over 34 games played (15 starts).
in the 2 worst years of his career as a bronco russ had 48 touchdowns and 19 ints. 30 games, 30 starts.
tyrod hasnt gone 1 month staying healthy in any of those 7 seasons. russ has only missed 4 games in 12 years due to injury.
again very little reason he'd choose nyg but on top of being a galactically better and more durable player than tyrod, he'd also probably be cheaper bc of the denver offset.
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In comment 16421097 barens said:
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Much happier with Tyron Taylor.
I’m not. Taylor as a solid backup that can’t stay healthy. Wilson actually had a good 2023. Obviously huge difference in price between the two but if Wilson is cheap, and we draft Nabers/Odinze, we immediately have a real NFL capable offense.
Denver has a lot of pieces on offense, at least 3 really talented receivers, and a good offensive line, why did they let him go?
Because he’s expensive and Payton wants to run a different offense.
I’m not saying we have to do this but we should be open minded. I’m happy Schoen is exploring it.
They're gonna pay Barkley & X around 2 million combined? I mean if they'll both sign for a million each then sure you gotta get that done. Unfortunately I don't think they will.
@JordanRaanan
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The #Giants are going to sign a quarterback in free agency. This would be a cheap option and contingency for Daniel Jones + draft. It kind of makes some sense if Wilson can’t get a guaranteed starting spot.
@PLeonardNYDN
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Joe Schoen promised to be in the veteran QB market with Daniel Jones tracking to be the Week 1 starter. But signing Wilson would replace Jones, not support him. A reinforcement here of just how much work the Giants recognize they need to do at QB — including in the short term
@DDuggan21
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This is an interesting development…
Collins- Warner- Manning situation?
Jones- Wilson- Maye??
I see the same thing.
Just 47 million in dead cap this year.
🤮
correct - it would be same as cutting him next year except it would take them off the hook for his injury guarantee (as long as they cut him after he's healthy and can pass a physical).
Funny, but I wonder if Wilson's situation in Denver is kind of opening eyes to other teams on don't hold a QB if you are not on board fully..
FYI- Pittsburgh, New England, Chicago, Washington, Atlanta all moving on (or appear to be) from QB's they were behind last year but now see the need to find a new one.
You highly doubt it? Why? They brought him in for a meeting. That alone says a lot.
he could be a 2-3 year bridge QB (obviously would be a 1 year prove it deal to start).
doesnt stop them from drafting someone. and if RW is on the minimum and he plays well trading him could bring back a return. or just letting him expire and getting a 3rd rd comp pick if he rehabs his value to 20m+ or beyond (if he's a starter level player again he'd get more than that).
if they are done with jones RW makes sense.
but like i said pitt likely makes more sense. they have no QB and they were a playoff team last year. strong defense and established coach. good wide receivers. better OL. id bet on that for rw.
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Says no dead money added to this year's salary cap if we designate DJ a post June 1st cut. Can anybody confirm that to be true?
I see the same thing.
Just 47 million in dead cap this year.
Yup. Which is identical to his cap hit if he was on the team. Hmmm 🤔
This is the key!
Not only do you get a vet QB for the absolute minimum vet salary (likely at least 2 million less than even the worst vet QBs) BUT it also means that the Giants are serious about moving on from Jones.
I actually think Russ would be the opposite of that. He’s a little weird but I’ve never gotten ego getting in the way. It’s the only scenario I’d be ok with the rookie sitting most of the year. They can actually learn something from Russ.
This is where I am.
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In comment 16421105 UConn4523 said:
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In comment 16421097 barens said:
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Much happier with Tyron Taylor.
I’m not. Taylor as a solid backup that can’t stay healthy. Wilson actually had a good 2023. Obviously huge difference in price between the two but if Wilson is cheap, and we draft Nabers/Odinze, we immediately have a real NFL capable offense.
Denver has a lot of pieces on offense, at least 3 really talented receivers, and a good offensive line, why did they let him go?
Because he’s expensive and Payton wants to run a different offense.
I’m not saying we have to do this but we should be open minded. I’m happy Schoen is exploring it.
There is also plenty of smoke that he was terrible in the locker room and despised by teammates in both Denver and Seattle
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But is there anyone out there still believing they are in on Jones? They have no choice but to keep him this year, and yet they don't trust him even for that.
You highly doubt it? Why? They brought him in for a meeting. That alone says a lot.
That's what has been reported. In my mind that makes him almost unplayable with his neck issues and his propensity to get hurt somehow every year.
2 RW would come at the MIN salary
3 RW comes with several Pros/Cons
Pros:
-Still a good QB
-MIN salary doesn't hurt financial flexibility in pursuing FAs
-Allows NYG to concentrate on a non-QB e.g. Odunze to give us an outside weapon
Add up all of the above: QB = RW, RB = TBD, OL (left to right) = Thomas, Bredeson, JMS, Onwenu, Neal/Eluemunur, TE = Noah Fant (just an idea), WRs Odunze/Hyatt/Wandale/Slayton feels like an actual NFL offense.
Cons:
-Wilson's age (35)
-His leadership/intangibles (inflated ego)
-Its a short term perhaps short sighted solution to the QB position (how often do you get the chance to choose a QB this high in a QB heavy draft?)
And Kurt Warner hated how the situation ended even though he was replaced because he was playing poorly.
As others have mentioned, this is all because of the injury guarantee in Jones contract. The Giants drafting a quarterback can’t be surprising news at this point.
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In comment 16421156 UberAlias said:
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But is there anyone out there still believing they are in on Jones? They have no choice but to keep him this year, and yet they don't trust him even for that.
You highly doubt it? Why? They brought him in for a meeting. That alone says a lot.
They brought him in for an exploratory meeting, yes. But I don't see Wilson wanting to go to a spot where there is another veteran QB plus potentially a high round rookie. And who knows what money he's looking for.
Denver is paying his entire salary. Whatever his new team pays him does not add on to that. It simply gets Denver off the hook for whatever he signs for. Wilson has no motivation to help Denver out so I’d assume it’s going to be a minimum contract he signs
As far as Wilson is concerned, I think Schoen is just doing his due diligence with the reality that AT BEST there are 4 QBs worth taking at the top of the draft and we're picking 6th.
I don’t think anyone with a brain thought that. Besides, the contract was a “We like you, we don’t love you” deal. They were never fully bought in.
Somewhere Jack Stroud & eightshamerocks are weeping into their pillows.
If it's done in addition to drafting a QB then fine.
Pittsburgh makes way more sense for him.
Pittsburgh and Minnestoa/Atlanta (depending on what Cousins does) make considerably more sense.
Not sure how exactly Schoen deals with it but he is not going to keep a healthy player on the roster with no intent of playing him under any circumstances. Schoen has been saying he expects him cleared by camp.
Wilson's 2023 season didn't prove anything other than he's declining and has no business being paid as a top level QB. Or even a second tier QB.
He had fewer air yards in 2023 than what Jones did in 2022 and the Giants were forced to play significant snaps to Marcus Johnson, David Sills, and Richie James. He could very well be signed vet minimum and I feel that's the only way Schoen is looking at this.
If it's done in addition to drafting a QB then fine.
He's 35. This would be a bridge type situation.
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of drafting a QB, it'll be an enormous mistake. Wilson is only good enough to win you 7-8 games anymore, and then we'd be drafting out of range to get a top QB next year despite still needing one.
If it's done in addition to drafting a QB then fine.
He's 35. This would be a bridge type situation.
Bridge to the QB we draft this year or to some QB we hypothetically draft in future years?
Not sure how exactly Schoen deals with it but he is not going to keep a healthy player on the roster with no intent of playing him under any circumstances. Schoen has been saying he expects him cleared by camp.
Teams have done it before.
Not sure how exactly Schoen deals with it but he is not going to keep a healthy player on the roster with no intent of playing him under any circumstances. Schoen has been saying he expects him cleared by camp.
Schoen also said he’s our starting QB. Do you believe him?
Then trade them all to the Panthers for Bryce Young.
The plan was basically, let the better QB win the starting spot between Simms & Hoss, and the rookie QBs would redshirt and sit on the bench to learn. Of course, it all fell apart, because Simms got hurt early in the season & was lost for the year. Hoss came in and then he got hurt and Brown and Graham had to play on Thanksgiving in a massacre at Dallas.
Still, from Schoen & Daboll's standpoint, they are in a tough spot that they have to win to keep their jobs and simultaneously find the QB of the future. A trade up is unlikely, so that QB who they take needs to be talented enough with a big upside, but you sit them to let them learn. Meanwhile, you can't trust Jones to stay healthy enough to win, so you need real competition at QB. But for the Giants, I think the goal is to get to the playoffs, even as the 7th seed. That will buy the front office and coach additional time.
Tyrod is a really nice backup...but he gets hurt whenever he plays. Backup QBs who get hurt are, as the old saying goes "like T*** on a bull". Wilson isn't what he once was, but can a combination of Jones and Wilson eek out 8 or 9 wins to clinch a playoff spot while the rookie QB develops?
Regardless, there are plenty of shots across the bow at Jones that his time here is done after 2024.
But things don't always go according to plan too.
Maye/McCarthy
Jones
Sounds like they aren't planning to play Jones.
As I said, no one with a brain.
Not literally. Figuratively.
As far as Wilson is concerned, I think Schoen is just doing his due diligence with the reality that AT BEST there are 4 QBs worth taking at the top of the draft and we're picking 6th.
I really don't think Daboll is coaching for his life. If he was they'd have done more to sign Saquon & McKinney. It seems like Schoen & Daboll have been given the go ahead to tear it down and rebuild like they were planning to do in 2023 (Unfortunately we won a lot more games in 2022 than anybody thought so they really couldn't do it last year)
@rydunleavy
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18m
A QB room of Russell Wilson, Daniel Jones, J.J. McCarthy and Tommy DeVito sure would make #Giants interesting.
I think the best QB in 2024 -- not necessarily the right choice to start -- would be ... Wilson. Ultimately, I don't think he signs in NY but fun to think about today
Pittsburgh and Minnestoa/Atlanta (depending on what Cousins does) make considerably more sense.
I suppose more than NYG, but when I think of SB contenders, Minny/ATL/Pitt don't jump out at me.
Thought the same thing.
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so its understandable he wants to show what he can do with anyone who is better than a one read quarterback in his offense.
As far as Wilson is concerned, I think Schoen is just doing his due diligence with the reality that AT BEST there are 4 QBs worth taking at the top of the draft and we're picking 6th.
I really don't think Daboll is coaching for his life. If he was they'd have done more to sign Saquon & McKinney. It seems like Schoen & Daboll have been given the go ahead to tear it down and rebuild like they were planning to do in 2023 (Unfortunately we won a lot more games in 2022 than anybody thought so they really couldn't do it last year)
Or Saquon and McKinney simply aren't as good in their minds and there are better/cheaper options. I remember years ago when Armstead was let go and everyone thought it was a cap casualty, but we later found out the Giants just thought he wasn't worth it. I think the Giants need to at least be in the playoff race entering January, and there is no reason they shouldn't.
But things don't always go according to plan too.
I get that, the problem is if they bring in Wilson to start, they probably won't be picking this high again next year (and maybe not the year after either), so it really puts them in nowhere land.
I'm sure Russell believes he'll beat out Daniel Jones for the starting spot regardless.
Would you rather live in PIT or the NYC area if you were Wilson?
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so its understandable he wants to show what he can do with anyone who is better than a one read quarterback in his offense.
As far as Wilson is concerned, I think Schoen is just doing his due diligence with the reality that AT BEST there are 4 QBs worth taking at the top of the draft and we're picking 6th.
I really don't think Daboll is coaching for his life. If he was they'd have done more to sign Saquon & McKinney. It seems like Schoen & Daboll have been given the go ahead to tear it down and rebuild like they were planning to do in 2023 (Unfortunately we won a lot more games in 2022 than anybody thought so they really couldn't do it last year)
Or Saquon and McKinney simply aren't as good in their minds and there are better/cheaper options. I remember years ago when Armstead was let go and everyone thought it was a cap casualty, but we later found out the Giants just thought he wasn't worth it. I think the Giants need to at least be in the playoff race entering January, and there is no reason they shouldn't.
They all get together and wash Saquon’s car on Thursdays.
DeVito goes to practice squad. Or he's gone.
The Giants beat aren't that good.
But things don't always go according to plan too.
Scouted the shit out of this QB class and have been discussing trade ups for close to 2 months now. They are doing everything they can to draft a QB this year.
They were too busy trying to get more dirt from Wink and his minions
For a team like the Giants who are trying to build a winning culture and one of a team atmosphere, I think his presence would be detrimental, especially in a city like NY where football can take a back seat to other interests.
Hard no for me, even as a bridge guy.
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Miss this yesterday
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
I mean, Pittsburgh isn’t really all that close to Jersey, lol
Not even pretending anymore. Seems doubtful he’s even on the roster next year.
Would be interesting to hear what they told Russ about the Jones situation.
As I said in an earlier post, Denver is on the hook for his entire salary. A new deal he signs with a team doesn’t not add on to that. It simply gets taken off what Denver has to pay. Wilson isn’t going to do Aden er any favors by lessening what they pay him. The less he takes in a new contract, the more Denver has to pay
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In comment 16421222 ajr2456 said:
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Miss this yesterday
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
I mean, Pittsburgh isn’t really all that close to Jersey, lol
Yeah, that makes no sense. You can "feel each other out" over the phone. The Giants are interested enough to host him, and Wilson is interested enough to physically go there.
Probably 3rd spot. Arizona has a lot of draft capital right now and need high end talent.
Currently they have two 1st round picks, one 2nd, and three 3rds.
We're adding a vet/retaining TT.
We hope to draft the future.
DJ's on the team next year. He can be the (very expensive) vet back up.
If a vet (better than DJ) can be landed to take over starting, would that upset anyone? According to the vocal majority of BBI, better than DJ should be easy. Pricing is the issue.
Something to consider - If Mara has not been as influential as many fans think then Schoen and Daboll decided they needed to see more of Jones up close to make a firm decision on whether they could win with him. IF that is the case, it does not make sense or seem likely that fans could come to an educated conclusion before them. I think it is obvious there is more than meets the eye when it comes to evaluating players.
If Tampa doesn't see Mayfield as the franchise guy going forward, why would Jerod Mayo stake his job on him? It's hard to get in striking distance of a franchise QB in the draft. I don't see NE squandering the opportunity.
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In comment 16421235 UberAlias said:
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In comment 16421222 ajr2456 said:
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Miss this yesterday
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
I mean, Pittsburgh isn’t really all that close to Jersey, lol
Yeah, that makes no sense. You can "feel each other out" over the phone. The Giants are interested enough to host him, and Wilson is interested enough to physically go there.
Veteran, Jones, 1st round draft pick.
and admitting they screwed up would honestly give me a great feeling on where this team is heading and the people in charge making decisions.
Cut Jones. Take our medicine. Cut Jones this season and according to overthecap, we don't have any more added dead money next season. We'd have 136M in cap space as opposed to 114M with cutting Jones next year.
Russ would be an amazing bridge QB. Let the draft come to us at 6.
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In comment 16421222 ajr2456 said:
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Miss this yesterday
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
I mean, Pittsburgh isn’t really all that close to Jersey, lol
Veteran, Jones, 1st round draft pick.
This has been clear for months.
Wishful thinking with a new coach and absolutely nothing at QB1.
I feel like drafting a kid will help Daboll and his time left in NY. The team signing Wilson isn't getting many wins (with Pittsburgh is different as they have more overall talent) or bringing long term stability.
This is my fear.
When Cousins goes to Atlanta, Minnesota jumps to the front of the line.
I'm sure Russell believes he'll beat out Daniel Jones for the starting spot regardless.
Would you rather live in PIT or the NYC area if you were Wilson?
Because Pittsburgh is a better situation.
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They are clearly scouting the shit out of THIS quarterback class.
But things don't always go according to plan too.
I get that, the problem is if they bring in Wilson to start, they probably won't be picking this high again next year (and maybe not the year after either), so it really puts them in nowhere land.
But that doesn't impact this draft.
You seem to be wanting to complain about something for the sake of complaining.
Agree with this. Whether or not they sign Wilson or not is less important than the fact they seem to realize going into 2024 starting Jones is no longer a viable plan to win games.
Here are the facts: $23 million of Jones' $30 million salary for 2025 was guaranteed for injury at signing. Separately, $12 million of Jones' $30 million salary becomes fully guaranteed if he's on the roster on the fifth day of the 2025 league year. So sometime in mid-March of 2025 will become a crucial deadline if the Giants want to move on from Jones since they'd want to cut him before that $12 million becomes guaranteed.
The injury guarantee will come into play if the Giants want to move on and Jones can't pass a physical. It would have to be a major injury, like the torn ACL he's currently rehabbing, to prevent him from passing a physical in March, thus triggering the injury guarantee. His $35.5 million salary for 2024 was fully guaranteed at signing, which is why there's no chance the team will dump him this offseason and why the injury guarantee won't enter the equation until 2025.
The 2025 injury guarantee shouldn't be a major consideration next season unless the team has already decided it's done with Jones. That seems unlikely, and if Jones is deemed the best option, he'll be the starting quarterback next season despite the financial risk. The injury guarantee could become an issue later in the season if the Giants are out of contention and they plan to move on from Jones. At that point, they could bench him to protect themselves from potentially getting stuck with the $23 million charge from the injury guarantee.
That's what the Raiders did with quarterback Derek Carr at the end of last season
Supposedly, Chicago couldn't even get a conditional 2nd/3rd contemplation taken seriously at Combine.
It goes to show how quickly QB value can tank in todays NFL - boom or bust market both for teams and players.
Yup.
Also, it’s SMART to sign and play a vet and ensure Jones does not see the field in 2024 to not screw up the 2025 cap. There is a high likelihood of him getting injured.
The best thing for the player is honesty to cut him but the Giants need a replacement in house.
They are clearly scouting the shit out of THIS quarterback class.
But things don't always go according to plan too.
I get that, the problem is if they bring in Wilson to start, they probably won't be picking this high again next year (and maybe not the year after either), so it really puts them in nowhere land.
But that doesn't impact this draft.
You seem to be wanting to complain about something for the sake of complaining. [/quote]
Lol, now you sound like my wife! I'm bitter and can't stomach more stopgap moves. I want a chance at our own top QB, not a backup paid like a starter (Jones) or a former superstar at the tail end of his career (Wilson).
This x1000
If the team is done with Jones it is complete idiocy to play him even 1 snap next year due to 2025 cap ramifications incase of injury. They should cut him after signing a vet or two and drafting the franchise QB.
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In comment 16421235 UberAlias said:
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In comment 16421222 ajr2456 said:
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Miss this yesterday
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
I mean, Pittsburgh isn’t really all that close to Jersey, lol
Whatever --none of us know. Adam Schefter's tweet sort of gave that impression it was a transitory thing, which is why I mentioned. But of course you know better, right?
Simmer down. I didn’t realize I even said anything to get your panties all in a bunch. Your sensitivity means nothing to me. All I said was Pittsburgh wasn’t really all that close to Jersey when you said he was “on his way to Pittsburgh anyway”. New Jersey is not exactly just on the way to Pittsburgh. That’s all. Now pull your shit together and stop being so sensitive
GoTerps would wet himself.
and admitting they screwed up would honestly give me a great feeling on where this team is heading and the people in charge making decisions.
Cut Jones. Take our medicine. Cut Jones this season and according to overthecap, we don't have any more added dead money next season. We'd have 136M in cap space as opposed to 114M with cutting Jones next year.
Russ would be an amazing bridge QB. Let the draft come to us at 6.
They can't cut Jones until he can pass a physical. He won't be able to pass a physical until after June 1st. There isn't going to be a way around carrying dead DJ money into 2025. The only thing the Giants could theoretically do would be to earmark the 2024 cap room that corresponds to the 2025 dead money and then roll that over to next year as unspent space, but that potentially means restructuring other contracts to leave the phantom cap space untouched, and that's a ridiculous way to manage the cap.
The better approach would be for fans to stop pretending like there's a realistic way for the Giants to absorb the entirety of DJ's remaining albatross this year.
They are scouting the QBs. Why would they be meeting with all the quarterbacks, including having Maye come to NJ if they weren't strongly considering drafting one?
Thank you.
Take the medicine now and turn the page strongly.
You can’t have Daniel Jones in that QB room, field, or locker room if a rookie is coming and Jones has no future here. It needs to be fresh all the way around.
Cut him.
Pittsburgh and Minnestoa/Atlanta (depending on what Cousins does) make considerably more sense.
I think Wilson would be more motivated by rehabbing his image in the media and setting himself up for a career after football.
He has a much better chance of doing that in NY than in Pittsburgh if things go well here.
+1
Can't risk jones getting hurt, even in practice. bite the bullet and cut him asap imo
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In comment 16421241 BigBlueShock said:
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In comment 16421235 UberAlias said:
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In comment 16421222 ajr2456 said:
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Miss this yesterday
Just a guess --but it probably wasn't an arranged thing. Could be his agent reached out since he was making his way to Pittsburgh anyway, so more circumstantial to feel each other out.
I mean, Pittsburgh isn’t really all that close to Jersey, lol
Whatever --none of us know. Adam Schefter's tweet sort of gave that impression it was a transitory thing, which is why I mentioned. But of course you know better, right?
Simmer down. I didn’t realize I even said anything to get your panties all in a bunch. Your sensitivity means nothing to me. All I said was Pittsburgh wasn’t really all that close to Jersey when you said he was “on his way to Pittsburgh anyway”. New Jersey is not exactly just on the way to Pittsburgh. That’s all. Now pull your shit together and stop being so sensitive
That was my first thought.
Bw and Terps - take note.
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The Wilsons have wanted to be in NY for a while now.
I'm sure Russell believes he'll beat out Daniel Jones for the starting spot regardless.
Would you rather live in PIT or the NYC area if you were Wilson?
Because Pittsburgh is a better situation.
Hey Eric is there any chance we can lower the wait on posting new threads? I just had to wait like 20 minutes to post a new thread. Thanks
Agreed.
Too many fans are not understanding this and the F’ed up dynamics that will be in the QB room and locker room if he is still on the team.
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They’re done with Jones
That was my first thought.
Bw and Terps - take note.
Yeah I'm coming around that they're actually done with him. What a relief. 2024 will be the most excited I've been for a Giants season in years.
Supposedly, Chicago couldn't even get a conditional 2nd/3rd contemplation taken seriously at Combine.
It goes to show how quickly QB value can tank in todays NFL - boom or bust market both for teams and players.
This is not a surprise. People claiming Bears could get a first round pick for Fields were smoking something. Fields has not shown to be a good QB. If you trade for him, you only have one year to see how he does. So, teams don't want to give up a lot for a year trial. Unless of course, a coach has connections with him or is confident that he can be the guy.
This could be exactly what is happening too.
Hmm that's very odd. It wouldn't let me post for like 900 seconds. One second. I'm gonna try it again.
I'm going to email you. I just tried a test and it told me the same thing.
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There is no waiting time to post a thread.
I'm going to email you. I just tried a test and it told me the same thing.
Unless Gary installed something that I don't know about (or forgot about). I've seen other posters make multiple threads in a row too.
Yeah, makes sense.
Idk about this. Russ is getting his 39 million no matter what from the Broncos. So him taking a big salary for his new team would be extremely stupid as it hurts them building around him. I'd assume he wants as much money as possible on the Broncos books and not his new team.
at this point I am 100% on board with this. The Giants need to turn the page.
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In comment 16421350 Eric from BBI said:
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There is no waiting time to post a thread.
I'm going to email you. I just tried a test and it told me the same thing.
Unless Gary installed something that I don't know about (or forgot about). I've seen other posters make multiple threads in a row too.
There absolutely is a waiting time.
New thread yes, that is the time limit one.
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to try to manufacture leverage before meeting with Pittsburgh. If vet minimum is on the table, there might not be much of a market for the Russell Wilson circus and his agent is getting creative. Who leaked it to Schefter and why?
Idk about this. Russ is getting his 39 million no matter what from the Broncos. So him taking a big salary for his new team would be extremely stupid as it hurts them building around him. I'd assume he wants as much money as possible on the Broncos books and not his new team.
You may be right there, didn't realize there was offset language in his contract. Looks like whatever he gets paid by a new team would reduce what the Broncos owe.
Link - ( New Window )
Does it affect just new threads, or new posts too?
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can find a way to cut Jones now, they should. It's bad for both sides to have him on the roster.
at this point I am 100% on board with this. The Giants need to turn the page.
There is no benefit to cut Jones unless you want to kill all our Cap space this year to save on next year. You post June 1st cut him doesn't save us money pretty sure this year or next.
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In comment 16421360 Big Rick in FL said:
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In comment 16421350 Eric from BBI said:
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There is no waiting time to post a thread.
I'm going to email you. I just tried a test and it told me the same thing.
Unless Gary installed something that I don't know about (or forgot about). I've seen other posters make multiple threads in a row too.
There absolutely is a waiting time.
Yes it is small though.
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second time how were you able to post within two minutes? I believe is a small post freeze time, but nothing like 900 seconds... Unless you are talking New Threads and not just posts.
New thread yes, that is the time limit one.
Ok thank you... I don't post new threads very often.
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In comment 16421309 Eric from BBI said:
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can find a way to cut Jones now, they should. It's bad for both sides to have him on the roster.
at this point I am 100% on board with this. The Giants need to turn the page.
There is no benefit to cut Jones unless you want to kill all our Cap space this year to save on next year. You post June 1st cut him doesn't save us money pretty sure this year or next.
There are two big benefits:
(1) You are not wasting a roster spot.
(2) More importantly, you are not creating an awkward situation where your $160 million QB is inactive for 17 games. Possibly a Union issue too?
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In comment 16421371 jvm52106 said:
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In comment 16421309 Eric from BBI said:
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can find a way to cut Jones now, they should. It's bad for both sides to have him on the roster.
at this point I am 100% on board with this. The Giants need to turn the page.
There is no benefit to cut Jones unless you want to kill all our Cap space this year to save on next year. You post June 1st cut him doesn't save us money pretty sure this year or next.
There are two big benefits:
(1) You are not wasting a roster spot.
(2) More importantly, you are not creating an awkward situation where your $160 million QB is inactive for 17 games. Possibly a Union issue too?
I hear you but now you need to go sign another QB. We need two Vets. The only way it makes sense is if you Cut DJ pre-June 1st. Take the 22 mil hit this year meaning we would only have about 8-10 mil in cap, HOWEVER he would be zero next year.
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coming to NYG makes little to no sense.
Pittsburgh and Minnestoa/Atlanta (depending on what Cousins does) make considerably more sense.
I think Wilson would be more motivated by rehabbing his image in the media and setting himself up for a career after football.
He has a much better chance of doing that in NY than in Pittsburgh if things go well here.
I'm fine with Russell Wilson being a cheap Kurt Warner-type bridge option to our next QB.
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In comment 16421371 jvm52106 said:
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In comment 16421309 Eric from BBI said:
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can find a way to cut Jones now, they should. It's bad for both sides to have him on the roster.
at this point I am 100% on board with this. The Giants need to turn the page.
There is no benefit to cut Jones unless you want to kill all our Cap space this year to save on next year. You post June 1st cut him doesn't save us money pretty sure this year or next.
There are two big benefits:
(1) You are not wasting a roster spot.
(2) More importantly, you are not creating an awkward situation where your $160 million QB is inactive for 17 games. Possibly a Union issue too?
What is the rush to move on from Jones?
It's only Year 6. Give him a chance to prove himself.
Wilson, draft pick, and DeVito (on or off PS).
Wilson, draft pick, and DeVito (on or off PS).
Hmmm... I guess I just assumed that was where we were going. I don't think they want DeVito starting again as he isn't good.
or
Jones + another veteran with starter experience such as Wilson + a WR at 6 + a QB taken later who they can develop (Nix/Penix/Rattler/Pratt/Milton)
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why do we need two vets?
Wilson, draft pick, and DeVito (on or off PS).
Hmmm... I guess I just assumed that was where we were going. I don't think they want DeVito starting again as he isn't good.
Nobody has a 3rd QB on their roster who is "good." DeVito is probably as good as it gets when your backup goes down.
1. First round pick
2. Vet FA (wouldn't surprise me if they bring back Taylor)
3. Day 3 pick
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In comment 16421403 Eric from BBI said:
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why do we need two vets?
Wilson, draft pick, and DeVito (on or off PS).
Hmmm... I guess I just assumed that was where we were going. I don't think they want DeVito starting again as he isn't good.
Nobody has a 3rd QB on their roster who is "good." DeVito is probably as good as it gets when your backup goes down.
I mean that is a good point. Just they have been saying they are going to bring in a Vet and it appears they want to draft a rookie. I assume that means they want to keep two Vets and a Rookie. Maybe I am reading it wrong.
Russell gets to start and play the whole season pretty much without any pressure........
He can work with the rookie we draft and Davito.
He would be cheap....
And he can resurrect his own value for 2025 unless he likes it here and wants to be the back-up/#2.
I think this is a win-win and if I am Joe.....Don't let him leave the building.
They are paying DJ virtually nothing to play this year. Why would they cut him.
Why would it look stupid. We all want whoever is starting to succeed, but you can't trust DJ staying healthy.
Russell gets to start and play the whole season pretty much without any pressure........
He can work with the rookie we draft and Davito.
He would be cheap....
And he can resurrect his own value for 2025 unless he likes it here and wants to be the back-up/#2.
I think this is a win-win and if I am Joe.....Don't let him leave the building.
Also, I don't think the Giants want to paint this year as a complete throwaway. Selling contrarian fans and ownership on cutting Jones with a bridge QB in the Tyrod- Tannehill tier is a tough sell especially in year 3 of this thing.
That was my first thought.
Bw and Terps - take note.
I couldn't be happier to eat crow than for Schoen to end the Jones Era this offseason.
Just remind me if this actually does happen... ;)
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and admitting they screwed up would honestly give me a great feeling on where this team is heading and the people in charge making decisions.
Cut Jones. Take our medicine. Cut Jones this season and according to overthecap, we don't have any more added dead money next season. We'd have 136M in cap space as opposed to 114M with cutting Jones next year.
Russ would be an amazing bridge QB. Let the draft come to us at 6.
They can't cut Jones until he can pass a physical. He won't be able to pass a physical until after June 1st. There isn't going to be a way around carrying dead DJ money into 2025. The only thing the Giants could theoretically do would be to earmark the 2024 cap room that corresponds to the 2025 dead money and then roll that over to next year as unspent space, but that potentially means restructuring other contracts to leave the phantom cap space untouched, and that's a ridiculous way to manage the cap.
The better approach would be for fans to stop pretending like there's a realistic way for the Giants to absorb the entirety of DJ's remaining albatross this year.
Good call on Jones not passing a physical until after June 1st, GD. I'm in favor of paying Jones to sit home. It's time for everyone to move on. Management, players and fans.
1. First round pick
2. Vet FA (wouldn't surprise me if they bring back Taylor)
3. Day 3 pick
Dear god the sky is falling, I agree with you a second time..
He will probably be the cheapest Vet we can sign and we want to sign a Vet. It would be dumb not to unless we don't sign a Vet at all and just go with DJ and a Rookie.
I probably would, but I don't see the Giants cutting Jones this year. Overthecap says the cap hit for doing so would be $47M. But I could see the Giants wanting to play him as little as possible to minimize the risk of triggering his injury guarantee. Wilson would allow them to do so and still be competitive.
The injury risk alone to the 2025 cap is going to force the Giants to not play him. If he won't be played, just do the player a favor and cut him and save the locker room drama.
I would 100% think the former. I don't think Wilson fits into the current situation at all.
If I was to guess, I would bet we are drafting a QB somewhere in the 1st 2 rounds and keeping Taylor to start (unless said drafted QB wins the job) if Jones isn't ready for the season.
Who knows though? Interesting offseason this year, that's for sure.
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In comment 16421271 Tim in Eternal Blue said:
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and admitting they screwed up would honestly give me a great feeling on where this team is heading and the people in charge making decisions.
Cut Jones. Take our medicine. Cut Jones this season and according to overthecap, we don't have any more added dead money next season. We'd have 136M in cap space as opposed to 114M with cutting Jones next year.
Russ would be an amazing bridge QB. Let the draft come to us at 6.
They can't cut Jones until he can pass a physical. He won't be able to pass a physical until after June 1st. There isn't going to be a way around carrying dead DJ money into 2025. The only thing the Giants could theoretically do would be to earmark the 2024 cap room that corresponds to the 2025 dead money and then roll that over to next year as unspent space, but that potentially means restructuring other contracts to leave the phantom cap space untouched, and that's a ridiculous way to manage the cap.
The better approach would be for fans to stop pretending like there's a realistic way for the Giants to absorb the entirety of DJ's remaining albatross this year.
Good call on Jones not passing a physical until after June 1st, GD. I'm in favor of paying Jones to sit home. It's time for everyone to move on. Management, players and fans.
+2.
Wilson makes a lot of sense here. But I still imagine he would prefer the Steelers.
Best case scenario - the QB they want falls into their lap without having to give up anything. OLine improves and Jones plays better. Would make Jones appealing as a trade option.
Got to love those still clinging to the rails of the Titanic.
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when Jones takes us to the playoffs next year. Just like it did in 2022.
Got to love those still clinging to the rails of the Titanic.
Dear god people, the Giants made the playoffs with Jones in 2022, not because of Jones..
You cant fix everything this offseason with the resources we have and you can fix even less if you cut Jones because you have to pay another QB at least a few million. Look around the league, look at how much the Bills had to cut just to get under the cap because they are paying their QB. The whole benefit of a rookie QB is you have cap money to sign your own good players and bring in new FA.
The Giants situation is what it is, I believe if they are brining in a vet, it is to either compete with Jones because Jones wont be ready. If they draft a QB the best bet would be to keep Jones and Davito and let them battle it out in camp.
Cutting Jones now without the June 1 Designation adds $22 Mil at least (Dont forget the injury settlement), post June 1 keeps the number the same but you have a replacement cost of a vet. Not many are going to come here to start for the league mimimum unless its a multiyear deal again kicking more money into next season eating into the rookie QB savings again.
So how does a team get better when you are terrible and operating with low cap money and possibly less drafts picks because of a trade up to get a QB? This is not a smart way to build a successful franchise and just about every team that has tried like this has failed.
You cant fix everything this offseason with the resources we have and you can fix even less if you cut Jones because you have to pay another QB at least a few million. Look around the league, look at how much the Bills had to cut just to get under the cap because they are paying their QB. The whole benefit of a rookie QB is you have cap money to sign your own good players and bring in new FA.
The Giants situation is what it is, I believe if they are brining in a vet, it is to either compete with Jones because Jones wont be ready. If they draft a QB the best bet would be to keep Jones and Davito and let them battle it out in camp.
Cutting Jones now without the June 1 Designation adds $22 Mil at least (Dont forget the injury settlement), post June 1 keeps the number the same but you have a replacement cost of a vet. Not many are going to come here to start for the league mimimum unless its a multiyear deal again kicking more money into next season eating into the rookie QB savings again.
So how does a team get better when you are terrible and operating with low cap money and possibly less drafts picks because of a trade up to get a QB? This is not a smart way to build a successful franchise and just about every team that has tried like this has failed.
Probably not, but if there is anyway to do it now, even at the expense of the 2024 season, do it.
Having Jones on the roster as the third QB is not going to be a good situation.
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when Jones takes us to the playoffs next year. Just like it did in 2022.
Got to love those still clinging to the rails of the Titanic.
That’s an insult to the titanic. Much of it is still intact.
They are scouting the QBs. Why would they be meeting with all the quarterbacks, including having Maye come to NJ if they weren't strongly considering drafting one?
Mahomes didn't start because they had Alex Smith who threw for 4000+ yards and 26 td's that season. We are not in that situation.
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when Jones takes us to the playoffs next year. Just like it did in 2022.
Got to love those still clinging to the rails of the Titanic.
God, even Rose eventually let go of Jack.
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You can't rely on a rookie to start. Mahomes didn't start as a rookie.
They are scouting the QBs. Why would they be meeting with all the quarterbacks, including having Maye come to NJ if they weren't strongly considering drafting one?
Stroud says "hold my beer."
Mahomes didn't start because they had Alex Smith who threw for 4000+ yards and 26 td's that season. We are not in that situation.
And if Wilson is here...
Same with Warner in 2004.
That's the point.
Without the medical clause and playing for less....he can try and salvage his career somewhat before we ultimately put in the QB we draft in late 2024 or 2025.
Jones is sunk cost and the risk for the injury guarantee removing future flexibility is too much.
It will be painful (cap wise) but could be more damaging longer term if they don’t.
I’m glad they recognized their mistake and possibly fixing it.
in his last 7 seasons combined tyrod has 18 total tds and 14 ints. that is over 34 games played (15 starts).
in the 2 worst years of his career as a bronco russ had 48 touchdowns and 19 ints. 30 games, 30 starts.
tyrod hasnt gone 1 month staying healthy in any of those 7 seasons. russ has only missed 4 games in 12 years due to injury.
again very little reason he'd choose nyg but on top of being a galactically better and more durable player than tyrod, he'd also probably be cheaper bc of the denver offset.
This man is correct
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In comment 16421427 WillieYoung said:
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when Jones takes us to the playoffs next year. Just like it did in 2022.
Got to love those still clinging to the rails of the Titanic.
God, even Rose eventually let go of Jack.
OK, that line wins the internets today.
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In comment 16421427 WillieYoung said:
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when Jones takes us to the playoffs next year. Just like it did in 2022.
Got to love those still clinging to the rails of the Titanic.
God, even Rose eventually let go of Jack.
There was plenty of room on that board. That evil bitch!
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Says no dead money added to this year's salary cap if we designate DJ a post June 1st cut. Can anybody confirm that to be true?
They are paying DJ virtually nothing to play this year. Why would they cut him.
If $36M qualifies as "virtually nothing" in your world, I can only imagine you share a zip code with Jeff Bezos and/or Elon Musk.
The Giants are handcuffed to DJ's 2024 guaranteed cap obligation, so they have no cash or cap benefit by cutting him, but they're paying him thirty-six million brand spankin' new American dollars this year alone. Where did you arrive at such a ridiculous notion that they're paying him "virtually nothing to play this year"?
One potential destination for Jones is actually Buffalo, where Mike Shula is an advisor. Shula is the only former coach or coordinator Jones has played under still employed in the NFL.
RE: the timeline and dollars, it's not complex. Jones cannot be cut or traded until he can pass a physical which will certainly be after June 1. At which point the 22M in unaccounted for bonus money for 2025/26 will hit the 2025 cap.
The Giants should not just cut Jones. They should exhaust every option to find a trade partner, even if that means holding out from playing while he's healthy.
If the Giants pick up all but the minimum of his salary, a healthy Jones can net the Giants a modest return.
When I see posts like this, all I can think of is the Baghdad Bob meme.
How can you ignore all the smoke from the last week? Put the pieces together and it’s clear the Giants are moving on from Jones.
Several of you guys are going to go through a serious Daniel Jones withdrawal when he’s officially not part of the future anymore. Going to be really hard for some of you to get off that drug.
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DJ is dumb... He won't happen he is going to start the season as QB1 for this team next year. Can we cut him yes... will we cut him no.
When I see posts like this, all I can think of is the Baghdad Bob meme.
How can you ignore all the smoke from the last week? Put the pieces together and it’s clear the Giants are moving on from Jones.
Several of you guys are going to go through a serious Daniel Jones withdrawal when he’s officially not part of the future anymore. Going to be really hard for some of you to get off that drug.
What are you talking about... Most people want to move on from DJ. Some think he sucks and some think he is good, but you can't trust him to stay healthy. Just because you want to cut him doesn't mean he will. He won't be cut at all because sadly he will be starting next year unless the rookie we draft shows to be insanely good and ready. My guess we draft a rookie and he is starting by game 6. Either way they aren't cutting DJ.
Not sure how exactly Schoen deals with it but he is not going to keep a healthy player on the roster with no intent of playing him under any circumstances. Schoen has been saying he expects him cleared by camp.
The jumping to conclusions on this board is interesting. There's a report of a meeting with the Giants, that's not been confirmed. If it did happen, that would be proper due diligence by the team, that should not start this avalanche response of cut DJ and Russell is the bridge blah, blah, blah. Second, JS has stated, a number of times, that if healthy, DJ is the starting QB. Some will say that's GM talk, maybe yes, maybe no, but for now I'm willing to take him at his word. They're not dumping DJ. C'mon, if Russell is signed, and that's a big if, he would not be the opening day QB but a backup insurance policy. It appears to me the organization is committed to DJ and will give him every opportunity to succeed. Strickley my opinion.
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idea of shelving Jones for the year on another thread.
Not sure how exactly Schoen deals with it but he is not going to keep a healthy player on the roster with no intent of playing him under any circumstances. Schoen has been saying he expects him cleared by camp.
The jumping to conclusions on this board is interesting. There's a report of a meeting with the Giants, that's not been confirmed. If it did happen, that would be proper due diligence by the team, that should not start this avalanche response of cut DJ and Russell is the bridge blah, blah, blah. Second, JS has stated, a number of times, that if healthy, DJ is the starting QB. Some will say that's GM talk, maybe yes, maybe no, but for now I'm willing to take him at his word. They're not dumping DJ. C'mon, if Russell is signed, and that's a big if, he would not be the opening day QB but a backup insurance policy. It appears to me the organization is committed to DJ and will give him every opportunity to succeed. Strickley my opinion.
lol.
100%
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Do we think Team Wilson proactively asked for a meeting with Schoen? Or did Schoen reach out to Team Wilson?
I would 100% think the former. I don't think Wilson fits into the current situation at all.
If I was to guess, I would bet we are drafting a QB somewhere in the 1st 2 rounds and keeping Taylor to start (unless said drafted QB wins the job) if Jones isn't ready for the season.
Who knows though? Interesting offseason this year, that's for sure.
That's what I was thinking, but I just don't know for sure.
This news could be leaked by Team Wilson to show the market they are in big demand early in this process. So, if you want us, you'd better act now and make an appointment.
If it was actually Schoen, it would be a direct hit the groin of Team Jones. I'm just not sure if Schoen is that cold blooded...
He may get a better deal elsewhere, though.
But this would do nothing in terms of draft plans. You still are targeting a franchise QB for the future in this draft. But then you can go:
Russell Wilson to start the season, potentially completely redshirting your rookie.
Rookie as the backup.
Daniel Jones as the third string.
Tommy DeVito on the PS.
That's a much more preferable scenario to any of the other possible scenarios I can see right now.
It would also give Schoen better positioning at 6. You could then more or less let the draft come to you unless the move up cost is approachable. You can try and see if Maye or McCarthy makes it to 6.
He may get a better deal elsewhere, though.
But this would do nothing in terms of draft plans. You still are targeting a franchise QB for the future in this draft. But then you can go:
Russell Wilson to start the season, potentially completely redshirting your rookie.
Rookie as the backup.
Daniel Jones as the third string.
Tommy DeVito on the PS.
That's a much more preferable scenario to any of the other possible scenarios I can see right now.
It would also give Schoen better positioning at 6. You could then more or less let the draft come to you unless the move up cost is approachable. You can try and see if Maye or McCarthy makes it to 6.
Agreed
The Giants could draft one of the top WR's in the first round, then draft one of the QB's in the second round. Jones could go to the PS.
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In comment 16421427 WillieYoung said:
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when Jones takes us to the playoffs next year. Just like it did in 2022.
Got to love those still clinging to the rails of the Titanic.
God, even Rose eventually let go of Jack.
HAHA.
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In comment 16421506 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 16421427 WillieYoung said:
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when Jones takes us to the playoffs next year. Just like it did in 2022.
Got to love those still clinging to the rails of the Titanic.
God, even Rose eventually let go of Jack.
HAHA.
Good one! If Russ watched any NYG football last year, why would he want to come here?
Quit your day job, cause you're hilarious!
We all get caught up in this amazing Pollyanna concept of dynasty building and sustained excellence. Yes we get a Pats and a Chiefs occasionally but they are exceptions and not the norm.
The new NFL is making the playoffs and getting hot. Heck we did it in 2022. We had no business in the Divisional Round but we got a little hot. Packers went to the NFLCC and went toe to toe with the 49ers this year a month after our Tommy Devito led team beat them up on national TV.
Before we start worrying about consistent excellence how about we worry about not getting our asses kicked up and down the field on Sundays and putting out a watchable offensive product?
Nobody is saying that Russ is a top end QB anymore but you are delusional if you think he isn't better for 2024 than either an injury riddled Dan Jones. Even if you draft the rookie you can't make the Jets mistake and throw him in. Guys have to sit now for at least a few weeks. For every CJ Stroud there are 10 Tannehills, Jameis', and Mariotas.
He is cheap and competent. Not a long term answer but as a bridge guy he is literally perfect.
He is healthy enough to play and remains relatively healthy.
The OLine is fixed, and I mean really fixed.
The rest of the team plays at a playoff level. Including new DC and ST coaches having the right system and getting players to function in it.
But that would not make the Board look stupid. There's a lot on the scale (see above) that weigh against him taking the Giants there.
I'm hoping he plays well and think he can. He has to stay healthy and be consistent. And everyone else has to do their part.
accusing him being fake/phony and more interested in sponsorships then winning.
Hard pass on Wilson as a NYG.
You cut players before you sign them to the practice squad.
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I interpret the Giants taking that meeting as meaning there is potential interest in Wilson to be a vet to start the season while Jones is rehabbing and Jones returning to start.
Wilson isn’t going to the bench for jones. Wilson at his worst is better than jones.
Would Russ rather go to a team where he could be a three or four year starter as he winds down his career?
Thus the exploratory meeting. What's in it for both sides. What do both sides think.
For $1M+, we'd be getting HoF QB for one-year at the league minimum after he just threw 26 TDs/8 INTs at 66% completion%, 7+ AY/A, top ten in TD passes, tied for 1st in 4qtr comebacks and tied for 2nd in game wining drives. And he missed the last two games because Payton benched him.
If he plays the last two games, he might have 30 TD passes to finish in the top five.
For league minimum...
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Before traveling to Pittsburgh today, Russell Wilson stopped in New Jersey for what one source described as “an exploratory meeting” with the Giants, per league sources.
Wilson is in Pittsburgh today to meet with the Steelers, per sources
Intersting 😈
You called it Festina!
Maye/McCarthy
Jones
Sounds like they aren't planning to play Jones.
This is the point. It makes no sense to ever play DJ again. As soon as he passes a physical you cut him. This allows a guy like Maye to sit for a year under Russ. Very smart to strongly consider this.
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I'd rather play Bubble Boy Anakim at QB than Wilson.
For $1M+, we'd be getting HoF QB for one-year at the league minimum after he just threw 26 TDs/8 INTs at 66% completion%, 7+ AY/A, top ten in TD passes, tied for 1st in 4qtr comebacks and tied for 2nd in game wining drives. And he missed the last two games because Payton benched him.
If he plays the last two games, he might have 30 TD passes to finish in the top five.
For league minimum...
It really is a no brainer, but no way he comes here.
No one is obligated to like Wilson the person, but if you could get 3k yards, 26 TD and 8 INT on anything around league min. salary for a year, you're an idiot not to take it.
Late career Wilson is vastly better than Jones.
Come on people. Let’s get the QB and play him and see what we got.
There were whispers before he went to Denver that fame had gone way to his head. Now whispers he wasn't liked in Denver by his teammates.
I really haven't followed that aspect of him.
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I'd rather play Bubble Boy Anakim at QB than Wilson.
For $1M+, we'd be getting HoF QB for one-year at the league minimum after he just threw 26 TDs/8 INTs at 66% completion%, 7+ AY/A, top ten in TD passes, tied for 1st in 4qtr comebacks and tied for 2nd in game wining drives. And he missed the last two games because Payton benched him.
If he plays the last two games, he might have 30 TD passes to finish in the top five.
For league minimum...
It makes perfect sense for the Giants. And at first I would think RW would have no interest in coming here. But the New York market is a huge advantage for him and is wife and he is likely looking at a one year window to play for his next contract. Certainly a much better market than Pittsburgh or Minneapolis, that's for sure. So this may be more of a possibility than I originally thought...
Come on people. Let’s get the QB and play him and see what we got.
Sometimes it is not the right move to throw a rookie to the wolves immediately. Eli started halfway through his rookie season, and even had a rough go of it.
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We had many posters here say if we took a QB at 6 - we should play him immediately because we need to start the rebuild - and now we are backtracking for an aging veteran who was hated by his last team so much - they took a massive hit?
Come on people. Let’s get the QB and play him and see what we got.
Sometimes it is not the right move to throw a rookie to the wolves immediately. Eli started halfway through his rookie season, and even had a rough go of it.
This is exactly right. And irrespective of RW's persona, the guy is a likely future HoFer. A Drake Maye and the Giants franchise would be very well served for him to hold a clip board under RW for a year.
Cant be worse than Denver for Wilson...right?
There were whispers before he went to Denver that fame had gone way to his head. Now whispers he wasn't liked in Denver by his teammates.
I really haven't followed that aspect of him.
No question he is a prima donna and not well liked by his teammates. But this would be a one year rental which would allow the Giants to cut DJ as soon as he clears his physical. No brainer.
Come on people. Let’s get the QB and play him and see what we got.
Sitting a rookie behind Russel Wilson and behind Daniel Jones are two vastly different things
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We had many posters here say if we took a QB at 6 - we should play him immediately because we need to start the rebuild - and now we are backtracking for an aging veteran who was hated by his last team so much - they took a massive hit?
Come on people. Let’s get the QB and play him and see what we got.
Sitting a rookie behind Russel Wilson and behind Daniel Jones are two vastly different things
We aren’t going anywhere Russell Wilson. It’s time to be realistic. Yes Wilson is much better than Jones. But it’s gonna prolong what we need to do starting him a full year.
If Eric situation arose like Eli - fine - but if we draft a rookie - he needs to play a lot this year. Sitting him a full year is just pissing in the wind.
As for Denver, I remember he got like an office. And Payton obviously wasn’t a huge fan, telling him to be more a QB than politician.
There were whispers before he went to Denver that fame had gone way to his head. Now whispers he wasn't liked in Denver by his teammates.
I really haven't followed that aspect of him.
He is considered a phony. The situation in Denver was his own fault because he negotiated an office with the executives. So, when practice would end, he would shoot up the elevator, and act like he was with the football intelligentsia...
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If the Giants sign Wilson or some other vet QB and draft a QB, can they put Jones on the practice squad so he doesn’t take up a roster spot? I assume no one would claim him at his salary
You cut players before you sign them to the practice squad.
Ahhh. Thank you. Figured there had to be a catch
As a placeholder for a rookie - sure why not if the price/length is extremely Giant friendly - but I doubt it would be. Then again, what other options does he have?
There were whispers before he went to Denver that fame had gone way to his head. Now whispers he wasn't liked in Denver by his teammates.
I really haven't followed that aspect of him.
Didn't he have his own office or something in Denver and SP put an end to it..........??
The chiefs were a playoff team the year before and good when he sat.
I think we are too far off to be comparable
As a placeholder for a rookie - sure why not if the price/length is extremely Giant friendly - but I doubt it would be. Then again, what other options does he have?
If he signs a 1-year deal, it will be for the League minimum because of his the offsets in his previous contract. He gets $39 million from the Broncos and can't make more than that total.
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It could not make more sense to sit a rookie under a future HoF quarterback for one year.
The chiefs were a playoff team the year before and good when he sat.
I think we are too far off to be comparable
But the rule continues to be to have a high potential rookie sit for at least a year. But only IF you have a quarterback ahead of him that is effective. So clearly, if DJ is the guy, then I agree with you and you have to start the rookie asap. But if Russ is the guy, like Kurt Warner with Eli, you start the vet and allow the rookie to ease into the role.
Four of the greatest quarterbacks in our lifetime - Mahomes, Brady, Montana and Rodgers all sat for at least a year. Yes, Marino and Peyton are the exceptions. And now perhaps Burrow, Herbert, Allen and Stroud as well. But none of these recent guys have won anything yet, so it is still not clear that starting right away was all that relevant in the grand scheme of things. Time will tell.
Calls him a bad teammate.
Link - ( New Window )
I'm warming to this. &-if @ a minimum-this means I never have to see Daniel Fucking Jones ever again behind center as a Giants QB....that in itself is a win for me.
Wilson - week 1 starter
Maye/McCarthy
Jones/day 3 draft pick
Everything is easier without Jones on the roster. I think it would be best for both sides.
If playing from day one is going to break him, then we drafted the wrong guy. Get him out there and start getting game experience under his belt.
If playing from day one is going to break him, then we drafted the wrong guy. Get him out there and start getting game experience under his belt.
I know where you are coming from, but you know you can ruin a QB too if he's not ready. The NFL is filled with such stories.
The best case is the rookie is ready and he plays. But you have to have a back-up plan.
We all get caught up in this amazing Pollyanna concept of dynasty building and sustained excellence. Yes we get a Pats and a Chiefs occasionally but they are exceptions and not the norm.
The new NFL is making the playoffs and getting hot. Heck we did it in 2022. We had no business in the Divisional Round but we got a little hot. Packers went to the NFLCC and went toe to toe with the 49ers this year a month after our Tommy Devito led team beat them up on national TV.
Before we start worrying about consistent excellence how about we worry about not getting our asses kicked up and down the field on Sundays and putting out a watchable offensive product?
Nobody is saying that Russ is a top end QB anymore but you are delusional if you think he isn't better for 2024 than either an injury riddled Dan Jones. Even if you draft the rookie you can't make the Jets mistake and throw him in. Guys have to sit now for at least a few weeks. For every CJ Stroud there are 10 Tannehills, Jameis', and Mariotas.
He is cheap and competent. Not a long term answer but as a bridge guy he is literally perfect.
Outstanding post brother!
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We had many posters here say if we took a QB at 6 - we should play him immediately because we need to start the rebuild - and now we are backtracking for an aging veteran who was hated by his last team so much - they took a massive hit?
Come on people. Let’s get the QB and play him and see what we got.
Sitting a rookie behind Russel Wilson and behind Daniel Jones are two vastly different things
Absolutely and I have said this before. Are we really going to let DJ mentor the new QB?
It is reported that he alienates his teammates by his attitude. He is about his brand and not about football. If he wanted to win why would he select the Giants when there are many better teams who are QB needy.
He would be an unwanted distraction.
If he had anything left he would still be playing for Seattle and Denver.
It is reported that he alienates his teammates by his attitude. He is about his brand and not about football. If he wanted to win why would he select the Giants when there are many better teams who are QB needy.
He would be an unwanted distraction.
If he had anything left he would still be playing for Seattle and Denver.
Perhaps RW is aware of this and NYG is the perfect destination to resurrect his image/career
He is not coming here when Pittsburgh will offer him 3 years and the starting job....
This is something the Jets would do.
Draft your next QB.
Do not have a Russell Wilson competing for playing time.
He is not a mentor. I would much rather have Taylor back.
Wilson will not improve the team.
His roots are on the East Coast, in Richmond VA.
If Daniel Jones put up 26 touchdowns and 8 INT over 15 healthy starts with 3000 passing yards, and 4 4th quarter comebacks, half this board would never shut up about it. That is not 'awful'. That is the QB play that everyone who is a Jones fan thinks he is in their fantasy land.
There were whispers before he went to Denver that fame had gone way to his head. Now whispers he wasn't liked in Denver by his teammates.
I really haven't followed that aspect of him.
Beastmode talked about it. He said nobody had Rus's phone number. If you wanted to contact him, you had to go through a handler.
If playing from day one is going to break him, then we drafted the wrong guy. Get him out there and start getting game experience under his belt.
Every time you say something stupid, I think that is the worst we may hear from you. However, you continue to break your own records with some of these posts.
His EPA and QBR were not kind and exactly why Payton wants to move on. And his 2023 season, he had fewer air yards than Daniel Jones and his 2022 season. The season with Richie James, David Sills and Marcus Johnson getting significant snaps season.
"Russell Wilson EPA by season - 2023: -62.7 - 2022: -68.5 - 2021: -13.2 - 2020: 69.4 - 2019: 46.2 - 2018: 61.3 - 2017: 32.7 - 2016: 25.2
QBs Russ had a better EPA than in 2023 (min 200 att): Bryce Young, Howell, Zach Wilson, Bailey Zappe, Mac Jones, Dobbs, Pickett"
https://twitter.com/MichaelFFlorio/status/1764777879278096413 - ( New Window )
His EPA and QBR were not kind and exactly why Payton wants to move on. And his 2023 season, he had fewer air yards than Daniel Jones and his 2022 season. The season with Richie James, David Sills and Marcus Johnson getting significant snaps season.
"Russell Wilson EPA by season - 2023: -62.7 - 2022: -68.5 - 2021: -13.2 - 2020: 69.4 - 2019: 46.2 - 2018: 61.3 - 2017: 32.7 - 2016: 25.2
QBs Russ had a better EPA than in 2023 (min 200 att): Bryce Young, Howell, Zach Wilson, Bailey Zappe, Mac Jones, Dobbs, Pickett"
https://twitter.com/MichaelFFlorio/status/1764777879278096413 - ( New Window )
All of this can be reality, and the context is still, for one year, what can he give you.
@MichaelFFlorio
Russ still takes a ton of sacks. But one thing he has going for him is he still has the deep ball. On passes of 20+ air yards this season Russ ranked 11th in EPA ahead of Love, Lamar, Hurts, Herbert, Burrow, etc
Put him behind Giants OL and he will make Jons look like Brady.
Wilson holds the ball and takes sacks even when he has time.
He was at his best when he was behind a good ol, had a running game and deep passing options.
Sounds just like the Giants.
Put him behind Giants OL and he will make Jons look like Brady.
Wilson holds the ball and takes sacks even when he has time.
He was at his best when he was behind a good ol, had a running game and deep passing options.
Sounds just like the Giants.
I don't have access to a lot of Broncos games.
45 sacks last year. The difference compared to what we've dealt with here is while doing so he was still *productive*.
Again, all of this is in the context of a player who isn't long term, and wouldn't be making a lot of money.
Put him behind Giants OL and he will make Jons look like Brady.
Wilson holds the ball and takes sacks even when he has time.
He was at his best when he was behind a good ol, had a running game and deep passing options.
Sounds just like the Giants.
Russell Wilson would make Jones look like Brady? FFS man. How do some of you have the bandwidth to put your socks on in the morning? Socks with the number 8 on them, no doubt…
Gives the team so much more control, flexibility and options re Jones and drafting a Q/
And best case scenario, Wilson looks halfway decent. Leaves as. a FA and we get a comp pick. With a QB, would be at least a 5 or 6…. Best case that’s unlikely is a 3 or 4 if he shows his old self. Literally, nothing to lose.
We've been around long enough that we can name examples to support either approach. Wilson, Peyton, Stroud, Roethlisberger, Josh Allen, Stafford - these guys all started right away and they worked out.
Regarding the QBs in this draft, I don't know which of them would be fine starting right away or which may benefit from sitting at first. What I do know is that in the current CBA the single biggest roster building advantage you can have, by far, is a productive QB on a rookie contract.
Now it's true the Giants won't have that advantage in year 1 because of the Jones cap hit. So maybe this is a different situation and sitting that first year makes more sense. On the other hand maybe it'd be better to enter those advantageous years with a year of playing experience under the draft pick's belt.
When the talk surfaced about the Giants trading for Russ a couple of years ago, I was dead set against it. He would have cost draft assets, would have needed an enormous new contract, and his age didn’t align with a rebuilding team. That’s not the case now. He’d be a one year bridge for a rookie QB on a super cheap contract. The Giants would be foolish to at least not explore it.
There were whispers before he went to Denver that fame had gone way to his head. Now whispers he wasn't liked in Denver by his teammates.
I really haven't followed that aspect of him.
I think too many on this site are making too much of his personality. There are MANY bad teammates around the league (some Ben played or play for the Giants)- but if you perform, that’s all that matters.
Something lost on many here is that now that he is one the street for the first time, he now actually has to play for his next contract. There’s little more motivating than having to earn your next deal in the NFL.
Now, yes he is still getting paid for this coming season, but while the Broncos are taking a cap hit, there’s nothing more being paid to him after the guaranteed money for 2024. So, if he wants to be a well compensated QB in the league, he will have to go somewhere and perform well.
I suspect that NY is only an option because he would get a ton of media attention- and if he performs, it gives him a platform for his next deal
One more thing- people are making the mistake of thinking the Giants are going to throw a rookie out there to start the season. Didn’t so it with Eli- won’t do it here. Not their way.
2024 might be his last shot to compete as a starting QB, he should do everything in his power to salvage his career and that means waiving the injury clause. Otherwise I think he sits the entire year at this point.
Starting Wilson would make it about a 2.5
Stop messing around with the rebuild. Please draft a WB and start him as quickly as possible.
Yeah, that makes no sense on Jones’ end.
a possible reason would be moving on somewhere he could get playing time vs. being pinned to the bench.
if they were done with him he'd probably want to find a place he can get on the field as much as possible in 2024 to rebuild whatever value he can for next offseason.
if they signed wilson that could apply, though i think it's unlikely rw signs here. dont think there's any other veteran qb out there who would create that dynamic other than rw.
Starting Wilson would make it about a 2.5
Stop messing around with the rebuild. Please draft a WB and start him as quickly as possible.
Flip that around for me. I’ll have almost no excitement if we are trotting Jones right back out there. Been there, done that.
Wilson wouldn’t be much better but at least there’s the element of the unknown, which is something I guess, lol
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If Jones starts is around a .5
Starting Wilson would make it about a 2.5
Stop messing around with the rebuild. Please draft a WB and start him as quickly as possible.
Flip that around for me. I’ll have almost no excitement if we are trotting Jones right back out there. Been there, done that.
Wilson wouldn’t be much better but at least there’s the element of the unknown, which is something I guess, lol
Nevermind. I see you had .5 for Jones. I read it as a 5 initially
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In comment 16422372 JT039 said:
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If Jones starts is around a .5
Starting Wilson would make it about a 2.5
Stop messing around with the rebuild. Please draft a WB and start him as quickly as possible.
Flip that around for me. I’ll have almost no excitement if we are trotting Jones right back out there. Been there, done that.
Wilson wouldn’t be much better but at least there’s the element of the unknown, which is something I guess, lol
Nevermind. I see you had .5 for Jones. I read it as a 5 initially
Yeah the .5 is only for when daboll yells at him for something lol
Because it's becoming apparent that he's never going to collect on that injury guarantee because the Giants won't risk playing him because of it. Just like Russell Wilson at the end of last year.
So not only will he never collect that money, it's likely going to prevent him from playing this season, which is going to 1) suck for him personally has he's gonna want to play, and 2) damage his career by preventing him any chance at redemption this year.
The smart thing to do would be to go the Giants NOW and say no need to get a vet filler to replace me because you're worried about the injury guarantee, let's take that out of the equation and give me a chance to play this season.
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it’s a massive security blanket for him
Because it's becoming apparent that he's never going to collect on that injury guarantee because the Giants won't risk playing him because of it. Just like Russell Wilson at the end of last year.
So not only will he never collect that money, it's likely going to prevent him from playing this season, which is going to 1) suck for him personally has he's gonna want to play, and 2) damage his career by preventing him any chance at redemption this year.
The smart thing to do would be to go the Giants NOW and say no need to get a vet filler to replace me because you're worried about the injury guarantee, let's take that out of the equation and give me a chance to play this season.
That would require an extension or restructure- neither of which benefit the Giants. Won’t happen
Quote:
have the scoop on Wilson's personality?
There were whispers before he went to Denver that fame had gone way to his head. Now whispers he wasn't liked in Denver by his teammates.
I really haven't followed that aspect of him.
I think too many on this site are making too much of his personality. There are MANY bad teammates around the league (some Ben played or play for the Giants)- but if you perform, that’s all that matters.
Something lost on many here is that now that he is one the street for the first time, he now actually has to play for his next contract. There’s little more motivating than having to earn your next deal in the NFL.
Now, yes he is still getting paid for this coming season, but while the Broncos are taking a cap hit, there’s nothing more being paid to him after the guaranteed money for 2024. So, if he wants to be a well compensated QB in the league, he will have to go somewhere and perform well.
I suspect that NY is only an option because he would get a ton of media attention- and if he performs, it gives him a platform for his next deal
One more thing- people are making the mistake of thinking the Giants are going to throw a rookie out there to start the season. Didn’t so it with Eli- won’t do it here. Not their way.
Good post.
We've all taken the "cut Jones" ball and run with it, but Schoen's been pretty open about all this. He's said:
*DJ's the starter when he's healthy
*They'll look to sign a vet backup
The meeting was probably "exploratory" because they wanted to see his appetite for being a backup to DJ this year.
With PIT thinking the same thing, Wilson may not be seen as a starting QB anymore. So the Giants may actually be his best landing spot.
A - he'll get to live/play in the NY metro area which he and his wife have wanted for years
B - he might actually get some playing time because DJ is rehabbing an ACL and tends to get hurt during the year
If no one's giving him a starters job, the Giants are probably a good landing spot for him.
Good post all around but I’d be pretty disappointed if the Giants hand Jones the starting job over Wilson without a legit competition. I’d also be disappointed if we flat out told Russ the other day that only the backup job is open. A declining Wilson is still better than Jones.