I've read a number of posts virtually guaranteeing Daboll and Schoen survive this year. I think it's likely, except in one scenario.
If the Giants run it back with Jones as the starter, don't pick a legitimate alternative (for instance Rattler in the third), and falter.
I'd bet my house if a Daniel Jones led team loses 10 games in 2024, the level of ugliness from the media and fans will lap what we saw in 2021.
Anyone willing to be they'd survive that?
This year could very well be their only chance to draft a QB. And given the fact that GMs rarely get second GM jobs, this could be the only opportunity that Schoen ever has to pick a QB. The Jones contract could be a big reason for the death of his GM career, just one of the many pelts on Jones's wall full of OCs, HCs, and GMs
I think this is *the* reason they will make an aggressive move to draft a quarterback. Self preservation.
Hitching their wagon to Jones wastes potentially two more prime years of Thomas, Lawrence, Burns, and Thibs/Banks on their rookie contracts. Would be a disaster.
What if Daboll doesn't lose the team, and the Giants are competitive but lose 11 games?
What if he doesn't?
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I do expect jones, behind and actually improved line, and talent around him to do well.
What if he doesn't?
And what does improved even mean? If he gets to 1 passing TD/game that's an improvement over his last 4 years, but that's still pretty awful
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I do expect jones, behind and actually improved line, and talent around him to do well.
What if he doesn't?
And what makes you think he can stay healthy?
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I do expect jones, behind and actually improved line, and talent around him to do well.
What if he doesn't?
Then our record won’t be great either go for a stop gap vet the next offseason or then take your QB. In the meantime do not draft one at 6 this season. Take an impact player like Rome, Bowers, Nabers etc. build the roster so when the qb eventually comes we have talent. This way we won’t waste a rookie QB contract. My idea has and will be to get Rattler whatever it takes. If we have to trade up in round 3 do it. He has all the potential that the top guys have. Hes being slept on tremendously by the media and fans. The scouts definitely see what he has. I can’t go through his resume again but it’s impressive and he checks all the boxes imo. Only issues is height not size. Hes built very thick from top to bottom. He’s also 6-1 he’s not a smurf and he has great feet within the pocket. Sneaky athlete
They are getting a young QB in this drsft whether its in the top 6 ir a trade back jnto the late first to get Nix or Penix..
There is no chance they let Jones torpedo them this year
Schoen took a calculated risk with the Jones-Barkley contracts. It would have been better to tag Jones and negotiate with Barkley, but a lot of GMs would have done it the same way. The mistake was believing Jones had improved and would continue to improve and that his injury history was behind him. What we don’t know is how supportive ownership was to the strategy that was implemented.
Schoen’s job depends on how he gets the Giants out of QB hell. That has to play out.
Mara will not fire Schoen for a continued belief in Daniel Jones. If Jones plays terribly this year, you can bet Mara will simply conclude that Daboll wasn’t able to get Jones to play at the level he is capable of playing, and will want another coach to try.
I don’t think there is any possibility Schoen gets fired in the next two years. None.
Mara will not fire Schoen for a continued belief in Daniel Jones. If Jones plays terribly this year, you can bet Mara will simply conclude that Daboll wasn’t able to get Jones to play at the level he is capable of playing, and will want another coach to try.
I don’t think there is any possibility Schoen gets fired in the next two years. None.
We are well beyond that imo. It's over for Jones. I'd be shocked if this is all set up for another go with Daniel.
Mara will not fire Schoen for a continued belief in Daniel Jones. If Jones plays terribly this year, you can bet Mara will simply conclude that Daboll wasn’t able to get Jones to play at the level he is capable of playing, and will want another coach to try.
Yikes, I can almost see it.
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The question is Daboll.
Mara will not fire Schoen for a continued belief in Daniel Jones. If Jones plays terribly this year, you can bet Mara will simply conclude that Daboll wasn’t able to get Jones to play at the level he is capable of playing, and will want another coach to try.
I don’t think there is any possibility Schoen gets fired in the next two years. None.
We are well beyond that imo. It's over for Jones. I'd be shocked if this is all set up for another go with Daniel.
We would not be making the decision - John Mara would. Our view on Daniel Jones is irrelevant to the decision. Only John Mara’s view is relevant on who gets fired. If Schoen tells him they can’t land a top prospect so the best course it to stay with Jones for one more year and try again on QB in 2025, do you think Schoen starts screaming at him or nods and says “yeah ok?” If the latter, Schoen is not getting fired.
I’ll believe Mara is ok giving up on Daniel Jones when Daniel Jones is no longer publicly penciled in as the starter.
If Barkley has a strong season and Philly makes a deep playoff run, while Jones flops, that might be enough for Mara to make a move at GM.
If Barkley has a strong season and Philly makes a deep playoff run, while Jones flops, that might be enough for Mara to make a move at GM.
Which is more reason Jones is done imo. Schoen is making his mark, Barkley is in Philly, he's not going to half ass it and roll with Jones. That makes no sense. I'm very confident Schoen knows this is the time to get QB. I'll be surprised if NYG owns their 2025 first round pick.
schoen is judged differently over a longer horizon. i think he's batted around league average in draft/fa so i dont think he'll get canned for his personnel track record. daboll won a COY so his hiring of him is already in his favor even if it doesnt work out. but his big responsibility is in running the wider org with a lot of people in a lot of different departments so the biggest factor in his continued employment is how well he is as a manager. is that environment positive, running effectively, and attracting talented people or is it sour/sniping like gettleman days? it seems a lot better but its hard to know from the outside.
the only other way i could see schoen get canned (or sidelined to some extent) if is they can daboll and decide to move on to an established veteran coach who demands autonomy. if they hired belichek i dont think we'd see schoen in the lockerroom huddles postgame any more even if he stuck around.
[quote] The question is Daboll.
Mara will not fire Schoen for a continued belief in Daniel Jones. If Jones plays terribly this year, you can bet Mara will simply conclude that Daboll wasn’t able to get Jones to play at the level he is capable of playing, and will want another coach to try.
I don’t think there is any possibility Schoen gets fired in the next two years. None. [/quote
My god that's terrifying.
Right now I'd take Daboll over Schoen in a heartbeat.
Do you think the lense of competitive changes if the QB is Jones vs. Taylor/DeVito?
I think the general zeitgeist changes. 6-11 with several close games smells very different if Jones is playing.
He gets one more Drafted QB.....imo.
If the Giants have poor season in 2024, do you think it's more likely the root cause is Daboll did a poor job coaching, or that the talent wasn't sufficient?
He gets one more Drafted QB.....imo.
How do you think the public and media would react?
“Overdraft” a QB is something that you’ve created in your head as part of your fierce Daniel Jones defense.
So they get fired if Williams sucks but not for paying with and sticking with a QB for year 6 that also sucks?
The math doesn’t math.
And if Jones and the Giants play poorly, I think the reaction will be ugly and give no benefit of the doubt.
I think the coverage and criticism would be merciless and non-stop.
So sticking with a bad QB for 6 years and paying him a fortune won’t get them fired, but a rookie having ONE bad season would? Haha, Now THATS some logic right there. If only you (and in this scenario, Mara) were as impatient with the current QB…
You gotta @ least give the fan base some hope. A Jones-Lock-DeVito trio is the equivalent of giving the middle finger to the fans in an absurd attempt to somehow prop Jones up & make him something he isn't: a good QB.
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Schoen has more rope than Dabes.
If the Giants have poor season in 2024, do you think it's more likely the root cause is Daboll did a poor job coaching, or that the talent wasn't sufficient?
It could easily be both, but from my point of view, Schoen is the more secure. He keeps his mouth shut, and only talks when needed. He mostly toes the company line. And from what I've observed, he's mostly doing his 'master's' bidding (26 aside). Meanwhile Dabes is somewhat of a loose cannon (he says way too much ["We're NOT trading 26," uh, shut up and let your GM handle it]). He's had episodes with several coaches and players. His sideline antics are very unbecoming of a Giant. And if we have a poor record again this coming season, it could be spun easier as a HC-shortcoming, rather than on the GM (given the moves, so far)... though we'd have to let the season play out first, obviously.
- Daniel Jones contract was an unforced error. Schoen bid against himself.
- Mara may not be happy to lose the face of his franchise in Barkely. I think Barkley needed to move on.
- If the 2024 season is disaster and Jones gets another year on the contract due to injury, I could see Schoen being fired.
They were brought into to fix an organization that has been broken for 12-14 years. You are NOT fixing that in 2-3 years. The worst thing that happened to them was winning year one. It created unrealistic expectation by both the management and the fanbase.
I said it before.. if last year was this year and this year was last year the perspective would be TOTALLY different.
Yet we criticize the team for winning meaningless games. We can’t have it both ways.
They were brought into to fix an organization that has been broken for 12-14 years. You are NOT fixing that in 2-3 years. The worst thing that happened to them was winning year one. It created unrealistic expectation by both the management and the fanbase.
I said it before.. if last year was this year and this year was last year the perspective would be TOTALLY different.
The Texans and Bengals disagree.
Wait we don't know what Mara thinks? Better shut down the site.
They MAYE end up trading up for a QB. If not, they go WR at 6 and get a much needed impact player on offense.
This team wins more games than people expect them to in 2024 - just like they did in 2022.
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and a compleat revolt by the locker room.
They were brought into to fix an organization that has been broken for 12-14 years. You are NOT fixing that in 2-3 years. The worst thing that happened to them was winning year one. It created unrealistic expectation by both the management and the fanbase.
I said it before.. if last year was this year and this year was last year the perspective would be TOTALLY different.
The Texans and Bengals disagree.
tell me how long that turn around took..
It wasnt as fast as people think..
Neither was Detroit..
These guys had to dig out of cap hell. Completely revamp the scouting department.. get rid of the dead weight in the front office..
Hell they were still using MAGNETS to move players around on the draft board..
We arent just talking a losing team.. we are talking a completely broken organization.. from top to bottom...
They MAYE end up trading up for a QB. If not, they go WR at 6 and get a much needed impact player on offense.
This team wins more games than people expect them to in 2024 - just like they did in 2022.
His guy*
tell me how long that turn around took..
It wasnt as fast as people think..
Neither was Detroit..
The Texans drafted Watson in 2013 and made the playoffs 4 of the next 6 years and were over .500 in 5 of 6. If Watson didn’t become a sex criminal they don’t blow up the roster the next two years. They were 3-13-1 two years ago, drafted a QB, won 10 games and are on the trajectory to be a contender.
The Bengals drafted Burrow and were in the Super Bowl two years later and the AFC title game the following year. The Bengals rebuild took so long because their refusal to not half ass the QB position had them in QB hell from 2017-2020.
They were brought into to fix an organization that has been broken for 12-14 years. You are NOT fixing that in 2-3 years. The worst thing that happened to them was winning year one. It created unrealistic expectation by both the management and the fanbase.
I said it before.. if last year was this year and this year was last year the perspective would be TOTALLY different.
This is such a ridiculous take. Are you seriously suggesting that how a team is currently trending doesn’t matter? Flip the seasons? wtf? I’m sure there are a ton of successful regimes in the league that were fired when things went south that would have loved the “yeah but, if you flipped the seasons and this past year we won the Super Bowl instead of having a top 5 pick we wouldn’t be getting fired!”.
Flipping seasons and pretending they happened in reverse is some special coins of reasoning, lol
- Daniel Jones contract was an unforced error. Schoen bid against himself.
- Mara may not be happy to lose the face of his franchise in Barkely. I think Barkley needed to move on.
- If the 2024 season is disaster and Jones gets another year on the contract due to injury, I could see Schoen being fired.
Totally agree. And Daboll made the playoffs in 2022 not with any great additions from Schoen, but largely with Gettleman's team. At least he's distinguished himself.
Schoen has done nothing thus far to distinguish himself. NOTHING. It's easy to get sucked into liking him because he's not the daft prick Gettleman was. But when you break it down, there is little to no separation right now between Schoen and Gettleman.
To the question posed, if the season goes sideways, both will survive because of the built-in excuses that point to another year needed. And they are:
-- Jones is coming off major injuries
-- Barkley was missing
-- The OL needs more time to gel
-- lots of new faces on O
-- New DC needs more time to get the D in-sync
-- Etc
It's a pretty easy script to write.
The NEW YORK FOOTBALL EXCUSES
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the scenario that gets daboll fired is regression from last year. it's not an exact win number, but if the team is non-competitive in year 3, it will be someone else making the next top 5 pick. he had the team competitive with tommy cutlets, so it seems that would be an unlikely scenario. a similar season would be 50/50 sort of like saleh (who got the 4th year having never won more than 7 games).
Do you think the lense of competitive changes if the QB is Jones vs. Taylor/DeVito?
I think the general zeitgeist changes. 6-11 with several close games smells very different if Jones is playing.
in this case they were competitive with 3 different qbs last year. this year they have 3 under contract again and will probably draft a 4th. everyone has known since before bye week jones is an unknown for this year and they needed to have alternatives to remain competitive.
i think the lens changes depending on things out of anyones control like injuries. if saleh had the same year but rodgers didnt get hurt he'd have been fired in-season. im not sure the giants have any single player who could get injured and impact the teams competitiveness to that extent though.
Just after Dabol and Schoen was hired. Here is a direct quote.
"I think he's shown enough when we had the right pieces around him and when we've been relatively healthy, he's shown enough talent to make us believe that we can win with him, I've been quoted over and over again about all the problems that we've caused for him by the lack of continuity and the lack of stability. We've got to help him become a good player, become a better player and hopefully, we'll do that this year. The head coach and the general manager have both been very impressed with him so far. He's got everything that you want. We just have to, number one, keep him healthy and, number two, put the right pieces around him."
Now, I imagine when DJ lead the Giants to the playoffs that year, Mara was felling pretty chuffed with himself. I imagine a scenario where in his meetings with schoen he pushes for the big contract that DJ got. Mara’s a good guy. He runs this team like a small family business. If he likes you, he will take care of you.
I don’t think Dabols even been truly sold on DJ. I think he works with him as a professional, but I have seen him chew DJ out way to many times to think that Dabol has faith that DJ’s “the guy”
I think Schoen didn’t have the clout with Mara to say “look, I know DJ lead us to the playoffs, but he’s not the guy” or maybe Schoen thought DJ was the “man” He is hard to read.
Whatever happens this season, both the coach and the GM are here long term. They both deserve to draft a QB of their choosing, and figure they get a season and a half minimum after that.
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- Neal has not produced yet. I have not given up but Neal needs to play well in 2024.
- Daniel Jones contract was an unforced error. Schoen bid against himself.
- Mara may not be happy to lose the face of his franchise in Barkely. I think Barkley needed to move on.
- If the 2024 season is disaster and Jones gets another year on the contract due to injury, I could see Schoen being fired.
Totally agree. And Daboll made the playoffs in 2022 not with any great additions from Schoen, but largely with Gettleman's team. At least he's distinguished himself.
Schoen has done nothing thus far to distinguish himself. NOTHING. It's easy to get sucked into liking him because he's not the daft prick Gettleman was. But when you break it down, there is little to no separation right now between Schoen and Gettleman.
To the question posed, if the season goes sideways, both will survive because of the built-in excuses that point to another year needed. And they are:
-- Jones is coming off major injuries
-- Barkley was missing
-- The OL needs more time to gel
-- lots of new faces on O
-- New DC needs more time to get the D in-sync
-- Etc
It's a pretty easy script to write.
The NEW YORK FOOTBALL EXCUSES
Your bizarre hatred of Schoen in such short order is fucking embarrassing. Pull your shit together. I know your schtick is to ALWAYS be whiny, bitching, moaning and complaining about the Giants and constantly wanting everyone immediately fired but this shit is pathetic even for you. Can’t wait until they start winning again and you take another decade away from the site because you’re pissed they are winning.
It’s also precious that you haven’t given Schoen an ounce of credit for playing hard ball with Barkley and McKinney and letting them leave and turn his focus to the trenches, including landing an elite edge rusher. Nope. No credit from you, despite you incessantly bitching about Barkley since the day he was drafted.
Spare us all your slings and arrows. We all know you’re act and don’t give one single shit about your fake ass “outrage” at Schoen. Everyone on the planet knew cleaning up the mess left by Gettleman was going to take several years. It’s not our problem that your patience has run out before year 3 even begins. That’s your massive flaw. You deal with it and stop involving us in your bullshit misery
That's the scenario in which I think all of their jobs are in danger.
That's the scenario in which I think all of their jobs are in danger.
I agree. In that scenario I think we see a reset because it would be that ugly.
It’s also precious that you haven’t given Schoen an ounce of credit for playing hard ball with Barkley and McKinney and letting them leave and turn his focus to the trenches, including landing an elite edge rusher. Nope. No credit from you, despite you incessantly bitching about Barkley since the day he was drafted.
There is no hatred for Schoen. I just don't think he's done a good job yet. And I know you are unable to follow along, but I think it's unfair for anyone to say Daboll is more at risk than Schoen when these hypotheticals are raised.
The decision to let Barkley leave was over a year late. And he should have been traded at the deadline. And not overpaying for a safety not named Ed Reed is modern GM 101 stuff.
Until we see the OL play, I would recommend keeping your foot on the brake. It's not like we signed high level quality. That is a big TBD.
Burns is a good player, but I would have saved the draft picks and made a push for Hunter. Nevertheless, Burns is young and hopefully will actually blossom into an elite player, which he isn't yet.
BTW, I saw the non-sense you wrote the other day calling Burns excellent at playing the run. That was very funny. Another gem from your keyboard.
If they proactively choose Jones to start as their choice and he stinks it up, then they should be banished forever.
If Barkley has a strong season and Philly makes a deep playoff run, while Jones flops, that might be enough for Mara to make a move at GM.
Barkley will have a strong season because Philly has a great offensive line. I could gain 1000 yards behind that line.
Regardless of sticking with Jones in 2024 or cutting him and paying a King's Ransom for one of the top 3 QBs, I think it is highly unless Daboll and Schoen (and especially Schoen) are fired after the 2024 given.
Given the premise of "Plausible Scenario ..." (I don't think there really is one), going against the owner's wishes (based on all his public statements) is the way to get fired, not sticking with the owner's dream / fantasy of Jones being the QB for the future.
I'm willing to bet that fan agitation on a message board isn't getting anybody fired.
I'm willing to bet that fan agitation on a message board isn't getting anybody fired.
You must have missed the last time the coach was fired.
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It’s also precious that you haven’t given Schoen an ounce of credit for playing hard ball with Barkley and McKinney and letting them leave and turn his focus to the trenches, including landing an elite edge rusher. Nope. No credit from you, despite you incessantly bitching about Barkley since the day he was drafted.
There is no hatred for Schoen. I just don't think he's done a good job yet. And I know you are unable to follow along, but I think it's unfair for anyone to say Daboll is more at risk than Schoen when these hypotheticals are raised.
The decision to let Barkley leave was over a year late. And he should have been traded at the deadline. And not overpaying for a safety not named Ed Reed is modern GM 101 stuff.
Until we see the OL play, I would recommend keeping your foot on the brake. It's not like we signed high level quality. That is a big TBD.
Burns is a good player, but I would have saved the draft picks and made a push for Hunter. Nevertheless, Burns is young and hopefully will actually blossom into an elite player, which he isn't yet.
BTW, I saw the non-sense you wrote the other day calling Burns excellent at playing the run. That was very funny. Another gem from your keyboard.
What the fuck are you talking about man, pushed for Hunter? He’s almost 30 and signed a 2 year deal. By the time the Giants are ready to compete he would’ve been gone. How is that the better move?
Overall Schoen has been very solid and the moves that haven’t worked out were backed by sound logic. Funny he gets no credit for fixing the cap or the dumpster diving moves that worked out in ‘22 that led to a playoff push.
Your takes are literally the worst on the site. The Giants should actually hire you as a consultant and do the exact opposite of what you suggest. They’d hit on every move.
If Jones is playing, it is because Mara ordered it. And that is not getting them fired.
What the fuck are you talking about man, pushed for Hunter? He’s almost 30 and signed a 2 year deal. By the time the Giants are ready to compete he would’ve been gone. How is that the better move?
Overall Schoen has been very solid and the moves that haven’t worked out were backed by sound logic. Funny he gets no credit for fixing the cap or the dumpster diving moves that worked out in ‘22 that led to a playoff push.
Your takes are literally the worst on the site. The Giants should actually hire you as a consultant and do the exact opposite of what you suggest. They’d hit on every move.
Hunter is 30, but he's all salary for two years and no draft compensation was involved. Thus, we'd still have two second day picks in April. To me, I think that just might be a better deal for the better player.
Talk to me when Schoen solves for the massive QB hole. Until then, he's been average at best. I do agree he has improved the cap position.
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What the fuck are you talking about man, pushed for Hunter? He’s almost 30 and signed a 2 year deal. By the time the Giants are ready to compete he would’ve been gone. How is that the better move?
Overall Schoen has been very solid and the moves that haven’t worked out were backed by sound logic. Funny he gets no credit for fixing the cap or the dumpster diving moves that worked out in ‘22 that led to a playoff push.
Your takes are literally the worst on the site. The Giants should actually hire you as a consultant and do the exact opposite of what you suggest. They’d hit on every move.
Hunter is 30, but he's all salary for two years and no draft compensation was involved. Thus, we'd still have two second day picks in April. To me, I think that just might be a better deal for the better player.
Talk to me when Schoen solves for the massive QB hole. Until then, he's been average at best. I do agree he has improved the cap position.
What does a 29 year old Hunter solve for this team now and moving forward? And on a 2 year deal? And please explain to me how that’s better than a 25 year old locked up for 5 years whose talent isn’t maxed out yet.
This is assuming Hunter would’ve even come to the Giants which just shows how dumb this MMQB of the move is.
Schoen's drafts have been mediocre at best, his signings other than Okereke have been downright terrible and his trades, other than Burns, have been atrocious. And the DJ contract is the worst GM decision in Giants history. So if he screws up this draft and doesn't come away with a high ceiling elite starting quarterback on a five year rookie contract, he SHOULD be fired by the end of the year. But of course, he WON'T because of the Mara friends and family program.
As far as Daboll, I am probably in the minority who think we have found the right guy to lead this team. I firmly believe that if Schoen can get the next Josh Allen, Daboll can be a winning coach. I think he has the right demeanor, experience and firm control of the locker room that is needed to coach an NFL team in New York. But Daboll WILL be fired if the team is terrible in 2024 because of the scapegoating policy that has plagued this franchise for more than a decade now since the brilliant decision to blame Kevin Gilbride for the decline in team performance and hire an idiot like McAdoo as the solution.
Schoen's drafts have been mediocre at best, his signings other than Okereke have been downright terrible and his trades, other than Burns, have been atrocious. And the DJ contract is the worst GM decision in Giants history. So if he screws up this draft and doesn't come away with a high ceiling elite starting quarterback on a five year rookie contract, he SHOULD be fired by the end of the year. But of course, he WON'T because of the Mara friends and family program.
As far as Daboll, I am probably in the minority who think we have found the right guy to lead this team. I firmly believe that if Schoen can get the next Josh Allen, Daboll can be a winning coach. I think he has the right demeanor, experience and firm control of the locker room that is needed to coach an NFL team in New York. But Daboll WILL be fired if the team is terrible in 2024 because of the scapegoating policy that has plagued this franchise for more than a decade now since the brilliant decision to blame Kevin Gilbride for the decline in team performance and hire an idiot like McAdoo as the solution.
His trades other than Burns have been 'atrocious'?
You were upset with getting a second round pick for Leonard Williams?
A flyer on Isaiah Simmons upset you?
Schoen's drafts have been mediocre at best, his signings other than Okereke have been downright terrible and his trades, other than Burns, have been atrocious. And the DJ contract is the worst GM decision in Giants history. So if he screws up this draft and doesn't come away with a high ceiling elite starting quarterback on a five year rookie contract, he SHOULD be fired by the end of the year. But of course, he WON'T because of the Mara friends and family program.
As far as Daboll, I am probably in the minority who think we have found the right guy to lead this team. I firmly believe that if Schoen can get the next Josh Allen, Daboll can be a winning coach. I think he has the right demeanor, experience and firm control of the locker room that is needed to coach an NFL team in New York. But Daboll WILL be fired if the team is terrible in 2024 because of the scapegoating policy that has plagued this franchise for more than a decade now since the brilliant decision to blame Kevin Gilbride for the decline in team performance and hire an idiot like McAdoo as the solution.
Schoen has had two drafts. 1 of which he drafted an edge rusher who turns out is better than the player the Jags took first overall, and the other he took the best rookie corner we’ve had on the team since Jason Sehorn with the 24th overall pick. He’s taken some really nice weapons at receiver in Hyatt and Robinson who have basically only played 1 season each. He drafted McFadden in round 5 who is a good starter. OL - yes he has struggled with the talent there. The rest is pretty good. To say his drafts have been mediocre at best is a massive stretch. He’s drafted two of the better young and exciting defenders in the league in Thibodeaux and Banks.
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Schoen has been downright terrible so far. People giving him credit for not giving contracts to Barkley and Mckinney are conveniently forgetting that he should have traded both of them at the deadline last October. Had he done so, he'd have several more day two picks in the upcoming draft and the Giants would be picking second overall and being assured of getting either Daniels or Maye.
Schoen's drafts have been mediocre at best, his signings other than Okereke have been downright terrible and his trades, other than Burns, have been atrocious. And the DJ contract is the worst GM decision in Giants history. So if he screws up this draft and doesn't come away with a high ceiling elite starting quarterback on a five year rookie contract, he SHOULD be fired by the end of the year. But of course, he WON'T because of the Mara friends and family program.
As far as Daboll, I am probably in the minority who think we have found the right guy to lead this team. I firmly believe that if Schoen can get the next Josh Allen, Daboll can be a winning coach. I think he has the right demeanor, experience and firm control of the locker room that is needed to coach an NFL team in New York. But Daboll WILL be fired if the team is terrible in 2024 because of the scapegoating policy that has plagued this franchise for more than a decade now since the brilliant decision to blame Kevin Gilbride for the decline in team performance and hire an idiot like McAdoo as the solution.
His trades other than Burns have been 'atrocious'?
You were upset with getting a second round pick for Leonard Williams?
A flyer on Isaiah Simmons upset you?
Everything about this team's front office has upset me for more than a decade now. I know you hate fans who get emotional about the team. But it's what we do - fan being short for fanatic and all...
I will give you LW. That was indeed a very good trade by Schoen. I was really referring to Waller, Basham and Simmons. Simmons may have been sensible in intent, but the outcome was not good. He is a great athlete who is just not a very good instinctive football player.
I'm fine with criticizing Schoen where it's deserved and he's deserved some. It's still an Incomplete grade. We're halfway through a a 4 year run and there's a lot missing.
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Schoen has been downright terrible so far. People giving him credit for not giving contracts to Barkley and Mckinney are conveniently forgetting that he should have traded both of them at the deadline last October. Had he done so, he'd have several more day two picks in the upcoming draft and the Giants would be picking second overall and being assured of getting either Daniels or Maye.
Schoen's drafts have been mediocre at best, his signings other than Okereke have been downright terrible and his trades, other than Burns, have been atrocious. And the DJ contract is the worst GM decision in Giants history. So if he screws up this draft and doesn't come away with a high ceiling elite starting quarterback on a five year rookie contract, he SHOULD be fired by the end of the year. But of course, he WON'T because of the Mara friends and family program.
As far as Daboll, I am probably in the minority who think we have found the right guy to lead this team. I firmly believe that if Schoen can get the next Josh Allen, Daboll can be a winning coach. I think he has the right demeanor, experience and firm control of the locker room that is needed to coach an NFL team in New York. But Daboll WILL be fired if the team is terrible in 2024 because of the scapegoating policy that has plagued this franchise for more than a decade now since the brilliant decision to blame Kevin Gilbride for the decline in team performance and hire an idiot like McAdoo as the solution.
Schoen has had two drafts. 1 of which he drafted an edge rusher who turns out is better than the player the Jags took first overall, and the other he took the best rookie corner we’ve had on the team since Jason Sehorn with the 24th overall pick. He’s taken some really nice weapons at receiver in Hyatt and Robinson who have basically only played 1 season each. He drafted McFadden in round 5 who is a good starter. OL - yes he has struggled with the talent there. The rest is pretty good. To say his drafts have been mediocre at best is a massive stretch. He’s drafted two of the better young and exciting defenders in the league in Thibodeaux and Banks.
2022 was below average and 2023 was above average. Mediocre. Would average be a better descriptor?
In 2022, Thibs has been good, but not pro bowl good. And he was more than offset by Neal busting. Selecting Wandale over Pickens made no sense. Selecting Ezeudu third and Mckethan fifth were clearly misfires and very likely not part of the solution going forward. I did originally think that Bellinger and Beavers were strong picks, but both have regressed. To the point where I'm not sure either one even makes the team in 2024. And McFadden, Flott, Davidson and Belton are basically JAGs.
In 2023, the first three picks were indeed very good. But not pro bowl good. So you can't call it a great draft - at least not yet. After that, Gray feels like a miss. And Hawkins and Riley appear to be solid late picks, but are probably best considered JAGs at this point notwithstanding the good day three value.
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In comment 16435493 WillVAB said:
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What the fuck are you talking about man, pushed for Hunter? He’s almost 30 and signed a 2 year deal. By the time the Giants are ready to compete he would’ve been gone. How is that the better move?
Overall Schoen has been very solid and the moves that haven’t worked out were backed by sound logic. Funny he gets no credit for fixing the cap or the dumpster diving moves that worked out in ‘22 that led to a playoff push.
Your takes are literally the worst on the site. The Giants should actually hire you as a consultant and do the exact opposite of what you suggest. They’d hit on every move.
Hunter is 30, but he's all salary for two years and no draft compensation was involved. Thus, we'd still have two second day picks in April. To me, I think that just might be a better deal for the better player.
Talk to me when Schoen solves for the massive QB hole. Until then, he's been average at best. I do agree he has improved the cap position.
What does a 29 year old Hunter solve for this team now and moving forward? And on a 2 year deal? And please explain to me how that’s better than a 25 year old locked up for 5 years whose talent isn’t maxed out yet.
This is assuming Hunter would’ve even come to the Giants which just shows how dumb this MMQB of the move is.
If the Giants had signed Hunter and another team, say the Eagles traded for Burns and locked him up for 5 seasons bw in dc would have destroyed Schoen for that. The dude just HAS to have an enemy to destroy in the organization. It’s been that way since he’s been posting on here. Whether it’s, Eli, Gettleman, Barkley, Schoen, etc. he’s always got his target to constantly complain about. The dude is an absolute clown show and I’m not sure how anyone on this site could possibly take his opinions seriously
Agree not to force a QB pick, that would be dumb and have a ripple effect.