I've been watching a ton of pundits lately to get a feel for who will go where in the upcoming draft, and to hear their takes on the respective teams, including the Giants.
The general consensus nationally is that the Giants' roster stinks. Some even saying it is one of the very worst in the NFL.
The Giants currently approach the draft with only six picks, one of the lowest totals in the entire league.
That is not good.
Are we looking at this the wrong way? Yes, the Giants need a QB. They need a #1 WR. But they need a lot of things in a draft that is going to be very strong in the 1-4 round range.
Perhaps the Giants should trade down. And then trade down again... and maybe again.
Trade down if a top QB doesn’t fall into our laps.
1. franchise LT in Andrew Thomas
2. 2 good young WRs in Robinson and Hyatt
3. an all-pro type DT in Dexter Lawrence
4. 2 good edge players in Burns and Thibs
5. a should be #1 CB in Banks
6. a good MLB in Okereke
Giants need to keep getting more impact players, not trading down and decreasing the chances of doing so
In addition to being out of reach for the QBs that matter - they have a ton of roster space that needs to be filled - they lost of a ton of guys that played a ton of snaps for them last year.
They don’t even have JAGS as depth on this roster right now.
The NyG need cheap, young players - the best place to get em is the draft.
Free agency allows you to add depth and solid starters.
Getting a young QB and a talented WR will help with salary cap costs on their rookie deals.
If NYG like Penix or Nix and can move back, aquire additional first round and mid round pick or an early pick next year ( think MN ) then it might be worth moving back.
Robinson, Slayton, and Hyatt are good WRs. Yes, they are lacking a #1
And then there’s Neal and Jones contract.
1. franchise LT in Andrew Thomas
2. 2 good young WRs in Robinson and Hyatt
3. an all-pro type DT in Dexter Lawrence
4. 2 good edge players in Burns and Thibs
5. a should be #1 CB in Banks
6. a good MLB in Okereke
Giants need to keep getting more impact players, not trading down and decreasing the chances of doing so
This overrates Robinson and Hyatt. Look what other young receivers do early in their careers, and then look at these guys' production.
Give me a Slater or Parsons over Toney/Neal scraps
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Giants have the following 8 players I would consider impact players:
1. franchise LT in Andrew Thomas
2. 2 good young WRs in Robinson and Hyatt
3. an all-pro type DT in Dexter Lawrence
4. 2 good edge players in Burns and Thibs
5. a should be #1 CB in Banks
6. a good MLB in Okereke
Giants need to keep getting more impact players, not trading down and decreasing the chances of doing so
This overrates Robinson and Hyatt. Look what other young receivers do early in their careers, and then look at these guys' production.
They are 2/3 receivers. I agree the Giants need a #1 and said so above.
At #6, you are assured of either getting a QB you like or a likely #1 WR. Both are situations where the need meets the value.
But there is one huge thing remaining. If they draft a QB and move on from Jones it will be the best offseason they've had in a decade at least. It will be like waking up from a coma.
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In comment 16454838 KDavies said:
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Giants have the following 8 players I would consider impact players:
1. franchise LT in Andrew Thomas
2. 2 good young WRs in Robinson and Hyatt
3. an all-pro type DT in Dexter Lawrence
4. 2 good edge players in Burns and Thibs
5. a should be #1 CB in Banks
6. a good MLB in Okereke
Giants need to keep getting more impact players, not trading down and decreasing the chances of doing so
This overrates Robinson and Hyatt. Look what other young receivers do early in their careers, and then look at these guys' production.
They are 2/3 receivers. I agree the Giants need a #1 and said so above.
I get your point. Perhaps if there were a real number 1 they would perform better, and I do think they have the *talent* to *become* 2/3 quality WRs. But the (lack of) production itself grates on me. They're simply not producing whereas plenty of other young receivers are.
They can't afford to miss on any picks.
This overrates Robinson and Hyatt. Look what other young receivers do early in their careers, and then look at these guys' production.
Do those other young WRs have sucko Daniel Jones throwing to them?
There are a lot of areas where the team is young. Schoen has two draft classes of players and I think we need to see how the develop. Those guys are coming into year 2 and year 3. Time to start seeing what we have, not writing them off as bad because aren't plus starters at the get go.
I would much rather address one of those needs (QB or WR) with a massive upgrade than dabble here and there trying to patch holes for 2024.
The defense wasn't terrible last year and we've added a major piece in Burns. We have to hope the Oline is coming together towards respectability in what was done in FA. So on offense, an upgraded Oline plus our QB or blue chip WR will have a big impact on the offense.
Even SB rosters have weaknesses, but they have the QB and they have game changes up and down the roster. Lets add to one of those elements while we have a premium pick to do so.
the rest of the leagues rosters are all basically the same.
teams seasons turn mostly on a handful of players they acquire/develop well from 1 year to the next (or dont) and injury luck.
the rest of the leagues rosters are all basically the same.
teams seasons turn mostly on a handful of players they acquire/develop well from 1 year to the next (or dont) and injury luck.
This is a valid point.
Get the QB!
the rest of the leagues rosters are all basically the same.
teams seasons turn mostly on a handful of players they acquire/develop well from 1 year to the next (or dont) and injury luck.
Absolutely correct.
the rest of the leagues rosters are all basically the same.
teams seasons turn mostly on a handful of players they acquire/develop well from 1 year to the next (or dont) and injury luck.
also what this means as it relates to the draft is that the approach should almost always be the same.
if there is a standout player on the clock you take that player. if there isnt, and you have an overwhelming trade offer, you consider it.
the "giants suck" approach to 2021 was probably either take a QB (fields/mac?) or take the trade down, but in reality we now know the obvious right approach was Parsons (or Slater).
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This overrates Robinson and Hyatt. Look what other young receivers do early in their careers, and then look at these guys' production.
Do those other young WRs have sucko Daniel Jones throwing to them?
They don't, but some of them have mediocre Qbs. We can't keep playing this game where when we point out that one position (QB, WR, OL, etc.) stinks, we blame it on other positions. They all stink.
Penix at 11
2 2nds or 1st/2nd = WR and DT/OL with other 2nd
I'm feeding into my strength and continuing to build the Dline in this draft- so much DT talent in that 2nd/3rd round range. For WR, so much talent in that 15-60 range. I think we get a ready-made QB, top talent WR and talented DL/OL just with the first 3 picks. Add 2 more 3rds and possibly a 1st next year and I'm loving this draft.
Penix
Thomas/Mitchel
Fiske/Sweat
Penix at 11
2 2nds or 1st/2nd = WR and DT/OL with other 2nd
I'm feeding into my strength and continuing to build the Dline in this draft- so much DT talent in that 2nd/3rd round range. For WR, so much talent in that 15-60 range. I think we get a ready-made QB, top talent WR and talented DL/OL just with the first 3 picks. Add 2 more 3rds and possibly a 1st next year and I'm loving this draft.
Penix
Thomas/Mitchel
Fiske/Sweat
If you like Penix that much, you don't get cute. There are 4 picks between 6 and 11, and a team could easily trade up for him.
Rinse and repeat .
Somebody also posted some trade down scenarios from #47 yesterday, which I think is more likely.
Actually, Bill Simmons was trying to make the case for the Giants being in dire straights this morning but Mina Kimes kinda talked him off of it, citing the defensive line strength.
My viewpoint is, this team needs a quarterback. I'm amazed at how many people don't want to trade up to get one. Do we forget that is how we acquired Eli (essentially, though not technically), after which we built around him? I get it, the roster isn't good, but you get the QB first and build around him, not the other way around. I know there are many who would disagree with me, but if you get the QB right, the other pieces will fall into place, whereas if you build a good team then spend 2-3 years searching for the right QB, those players start to leave in free agency, get traded, retire, etc. 16 of the last 23 Super Bowls (since Brady's first) have been won by 5 QB's.
Playoffs!
1. the draft is NOT about plugging holes
2. QB is one of the positions that they need to upgrade, AND its the most difficult to fill. They have their best shot this year.
3. There are ways to "fill holes" besides the draft. The draft is the BEST place to get cost controlled, difference makers.
Get the QB!! if it means you end up with only 4 picks and he ends up the Home Run, nobody will care you gave up draft capital.
The roster is still, at best, mediocre. BUT, as listed above, you can identify around 10 players who are a core.
When Schoen took over, you had AT and Dex. That was it.
So the roster IS improving, just not as quickly as we fans would like. Better player development would help.
The one thing I may absolutely get burned by the most this season is expecting KT to take a big jump.
Pass rushers never fared well in Wink's system, it was always chocked up to his scheme, but after the way things shook down this year I'm wondering if Wilkins was just a crappy coach and that was the real reason why.
Our new OLB coach has a very good track record and I'm hoping KT also gets to work with Andre Patterson a little bit, the fact he wasn't the last two seasons is mind boggling to me.