-Daboll loves Nabers
-RV and Woodstock's connected friend say we aren't interested in JJM
-We have been trying to trade up for Maye, but unwilling to pay whatever it takes (reportedly more than 3 1sts)
-Hughes said we like JJM a lot, supposedly this leak angered Schoen
-Vikings are supposedly all in on Maye and appear likely to outbid the Giants if NE is dealing
What this tells me:
Schoen isn't going to pay an insane price for Maye at 3 and that is smart on his part. The odds aren't in our favor trading all that draft capital for a boom or bust prospect when our roster needs a lot of help.
Nabers is our top WR target and as many have speculated Daboll loves the possibilities of having a true Z receiver able to attack defenses from everywhere on the field.
JJM is likely on the table at 6, but not via tradeup, the recent reports about us not liking him smell like they could be an attempt at spreading disinformation knowing we aren't likely to trade up.
My takeaway:
Schoen is planning on letting the draft come to him knowing he will get MHJ, Nabers or JJM at 6 unless he is blown away with a trade-down offer. This is the safest and statistically most sound approach for a team with so many holes.
What do you think?
Its not so bad if you imagine Nabers with Jaxon Dart or Cam Ward or Shedeur Sanders or maybe even Quinn Ewers in 2025, plus full use of the rookie qb contract since DJ could be completely off the books then.
You can never know, even when you have conviction in a guy it's still you just betting on his traits having a good chance to evolve into an elite NFL QB. Maye is not a generational talent, he's a boom or bust guy and odds are he will be more mediocre than elite. If our roster was solid, we could afford to take that gamble for 3+ 1sts.
Experts are wrong as often as they are right. The best player can go south for a myriad of reasons.
Any non-"blue chip" player could be the next TFB.
If the current regime is playing scared they are already fired.
The meaningless wins put the team in the draft position they are in. I think they should play it out and take their BPA or trade down if it makes the team better.
Either way I'll check the homepage after the draft and see where the chips fell. I won't be filtering through the dissent here in Pete's corner.
I meant RV separately reported a lack of interest in JJM, Woodstock's source was a very credible guy in the know. I think these leaks are more likely smokey misinformation this late in the process. Who knows though, I do get a very strong feeling we are staying at 6 and taking MHJ, Nabers or JJM unless we get a ridiculous trade down offer.
Daboll wants to juice up the offense, fine. Let's see the juice.
In comment 16460749 Woodstock said:
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I usually never get inside info but I was told 2nd hand from an impeccable source that the Giants are not interested in McCarthy. WR was implied.
This isn't a troll
No his name is just Woodstock
Daboll wants to juice up the offense, fine. Let's see the juice.
I generally do not agree with you- at all but there a few times that I do. This is one of those times. If, IF the Giants play the Jones at QB for 2024 (without a viable drafted replacement) then they have to win at least 9 games and Jones himself has to account for 30 TD's (with at least 24 of those being via the air.
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I think if the Giants are running it back with Jones the expectation should be 10+ wins and a playoff appearance at minimum.
Daboll wants to juice up the offense, fine. Let's see the juice.
I generally do not agree with you- at all but there a few times that I do. This is one of those times. If, IF the Giants play the Jones at QB for 2024 (without a viable drafted replacement) then they have to win at least 9 games and Jones himself has to account for 30 TD's (with at least 24 of those being via the air.
+2. No excuses. No talk of rebuilds. Paying Jones $40M and not identifying it as a mistake would require a playoff appearance for me at minimum.
Maye cannot be compared to CJ Stroud. CJ Stroud had a safe floor with a real upside to his ceiling. What he did against an NFL level defense against Georgia in the semifinals was truly elite and no QBs in this draft have anything close to that performance on their resumè. Most of the actual football people in Carolina wanted Stroud, but Tepper loved Young based on who knows what.
Also, the Texans didn't trade up for Stroud. Look at the more relevant example: Bryce Young was more of a boom or bust QB and Carolina traded their future for him. It's looking more than likely they will struggle to get out of the hole they're in for a long time.
Third, all of our scouts have different opinions that filter up to Schoen. There is no way all of our Scouts are unanimously telling Schoen Maye is the answer. If Maye was that sure of a thing and not a boom or bust prospect, NE would never entertain trading down and it wouldn't matter because Maye would go 1 or 2. That is undoubtedly not the situation though.
Oh I completely agree, and as Terps said if we run it back with DJ and Nabers + Benson or something then 9-10 wins is the minimum. I can still dream about Cam Ward or Jaxon Dart being our pick in 2025 and turning into an elite QB with a great supporting cast and clean slate for QB cap, can't I? We all have to dream.
-Caleb goes 1...no chance trade up.
- Daniels goes 2...no chance to trade up
- Maye goes 3...either Pats won't trade or they want something insane. Either way we can't feasibly get him.
- Vikings offer 3 one's and two 2's for JJM at 4...Cards tell us we'd need something similar just to move up from 6. Daboll and Schoen don't think he's a prospect to do that for.
- Daboll doesn't love Nix or Pennix and doesn't see them as close to a first round prospect.
I see people saying if we don't take a QB at 6 it means this regime is "doubling down" on Jones or proving that they are just going business as usual for the giants. But what about that scenario above? What if they love the top 3 and literally don't have the opportunity to get one? What if they've offered three ones to the Pats and been rebuffed? Can we really say that black and white that no QB at 6 means they are all in on jones? I don't think that's reality.
At that point Jones is their guy, and I'm my opinion they should sink or swim with him.
A sixth year of Daniel Jones. You have got to be fucking kidding me.
-Caleb goes 1...no chance trade up.
- Daniels goes 2...no chance to trade up
- Maye goes 3...either Pats won't trade or they want something insane. Either way we can't feasibly get him.
- Vikings offer 3 one's and two 2's for JJM at 4...Cards tell us we'd need something similar just to move up from 6. Daboll and Schoen don't think he's a prospect to do that for.
- Daboll doesn't love Nix or Pennix and doesn't see them as close to a first round prospect.
I see people saying if we don't take a QB at 6 it means this regime is "doubling down" on Jones or proving that they are just going business as usual for the giants. But what about that scenario above? What if they love the top 3 and literally don't have the opportunity to get one? What if they've offered three ones to the Pats and been rebuffed? Can we really say that black and white that no QB at 6 means they are all in on jones? I don't think that's reality.
Good point, they are rebuilding what was one of the worst run franchises in the league for better part of a decade. They have to take the best bets possible to build. We aren't in a position to take boom or bust gambles with inordinate trade packages. For the record, I do not think the Vikings are going to trade the same package for JJM as they would for Maye. The Vikings Asshat report makes a lot of sense saying they are all in on Maye with Penix at 11 as the fallback. I think the odds of JJM making it to 6 are higher than the odds of Nabers making it to 6 honestly.
Jones is working very hard and still hope to be ready, but i can verify, his neck remains a concern.
His knee is progressing fine.
Jones is working very hard and still hope to be ready, but i can verify, his neck remains a concern.
His knee is progressing fine.
That is so sad, that diving slide attempt in the Cowboys game when he had his Neck crunched down with 250+ lbs of force just seemed really worrisome. And sure enough, it's a very scary and sad problem. Thanks for the info, really sad though.
-Caleb goes 1...no chance trade up.
- Daniels goes 2...no chance to trade up
- Maye goes 3...either Pats won't trade or they want something insane. Either way we can't feasibly get him.
- Vikings offer 3 one's and two 2's for JJM at 4...Cards tell us we'd need something similar just to move up from 6. Daboll and Schoen don't think he's a prospect to do that for.
- Daboll doesn't love Nix or Pennix and doesn't see them as close to a first round prospect.
I see people saying if we don't take a QB at 6 it means this regime is "doubling down" on Jones or proving that they are just going business as usual for the giants. But what about that scenario above? What if they love the top 3 and literally don't have the opportunity to get one? What if they've offered three ones to the Pats and been rebuffed? Can we really say that black and white that no QB at 6 means they are all in on jones? I don't think that's reality.
They are petrified that Jones might play well and DOOM the franchise.
You can’t make it up.
Jones is a risk, we are drafting a QB, we wont give up the world to do it.
Put the tanto away and cast aside your thoughts of Seppuku.
It’s April, it will be OK even if the Giants lose.
At that point Jones is their guy, and I'm my opinion they should sink or swim with him.
A sixth year of Daniel Jones. You have got to be fucking kidding me.
Wait until the excuses next year at this time!
At that point Jones is their guy, and I'm my opinion they should sink or swim with him.
A sixth year of Daniel Jones. You have got to be fucking kidding me.
I agree, but I have hope that Schoen might have a good idea of a QB he can get at 6 without having to give up anything extra. I think the odds are in his favor right now. Nabers isn't a bad fallback option, or trade down for a haul. I think he's playing his hand well, the worst thing he could do is trade the farm for a mediocre or less QB.
At that point Jones is their guy, and I'm my opinion they should sink or swim with him.
A sixth year of Daniel Jones. You have got to be fucking kidding me.
I have no inside info and I could be completely wrong, and you may think no more of Lock than you do of Jones, but I think overall BBI is discounting too much the possibility that Lock either outplays Jones, or Jones isn't ready/gets banged up, and Lock is our starting QB for much of the season. He should at least be given a shot at it unless Jones is playing great, which is unlikely.
Jones is working very hard and still hope to be ready, but i can verify, his neck remains a concern.
His knee is progressing fine.
Then why was he cleared and why did he play against the Raiders?
But I’m a nobody.
It will be cool to start seeing mock draft threads before the leaves change colors this fall.
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In those three years they will have paid him $82M and drafted zero QBs (assuming they don't get one in a couple weeks).
At that point Jones is their guy, and I'm my opinion they should sink or swim with him.
A sixth year of Daniel Jones. You have got to be fucking kidding me.
I have no inside info and I could be completely wrong, and you may think no more of Lock than you do of Jones, but I think overall BBI is discounting too much the possibility that Lock either outplays Jones, or Jones isn't ready/gets banged up, and Lock is our starting QB for much of the season. He should at least be given a shot at it unless Jones is playing great, which is unlikely.
While I agree with you, I don't think that provides solace for Mr Terps.
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Healed completely.
Jones is working very hard and still hope to be ready, but i can verify, his neck remains a concern.
His knee is progressing fine.
Then why was he cleared and why did he play against the Raiders?
Maybe Jones was overly optimistic about his condition? Perhaps he wasn't fully forthcoming in the tests? Myriad reasons that could happen.
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Healed completely.
Jones is working very hard and still hope to be ready, but i can verify, his neck remains a concern.
His knee is progressing fine.
Then why was he cleared and why did he play against the Raiders?
Because this organization is run by idiots from the top on down.
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Healed completely.
Jones is working very hard and still hope to be ready, but i can verify, his neck remains a concern.
His knee is progressing fine.
Then why was he cleared and why did he play against the Raiders?
Sean, I think it's very clear that they panicked after Taylor went down in the Jets game and DeVito had to play. More medical mismanagement from NYG. An underrated, yet common theme around here for several years running now.
Regardless I will agree it's nice that there's a lot of information out there that doesn't necessarily jive with one another. We shouldn't be letting draft strategy out there..
But I’m a nobody.
It will be cool to start seeing mock draft threads before the leaves change colors this fall.
Are you on record for QB no matter what at 6? Would you trade 2024, 2025 & 2026 first round picks to move to 3?
At that point Jones is their guy, and I'm my opinion they should sink or swim with him.
A sixth year of Daniel Jones. You have got to be fucking kidding me.
I agree and want jones oiut. I'm just asking a realistic question - what if they have no realistic shot at the top 4 and they have negative views of pennix and nix in regards to first round picks? You would honestly say they have to take pennix at 6 despite not liking him just to prove a point about jones?
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In those three years they will have paid him $82M and drafted zero QBs (assuming they don't get one in a couple weeks).
At that point Jones is their guy, and I'm my opinion they should sink or swim with him.
A sixth year of Daniel Jones. You have got to be fucking kidding me.
I agree and want jones oiut. I'm just asking a realistic question - what if they have no realistic shot at the top 4 and they have negative views of pennix and nix in regards to first round picks? You would honestly say they have to take pennix at 6 despite not liking him just to prove a point about jones?
He loves Penix and would absolutely take him at 6 if he was Schoen. I wouldn't be unhappy if they took Penix at 6, but barring a trade-down I don't see Penix to NYG in rd1. It's Nabers or JJM at 6 if you ask me.
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I think the Giants are idiots hitching their wagon to Jones, given his subpar play and injury history.
But I’m a nobody.
It will be cool to start seeing mock draft threads before the leaves change colors this fall.
Are you on record for QB no matter what at 6? Would you trade 2024, 2025 & 2026 first round picks to move to 3?
I know you're not asking me, but I wouldn't make that trade because there are 2 QBs who will be on the board at 6 that are as likely to succeed in the NFL as the guys you'd need to trade up for.
I think saying Maye and McCarthy are clearly better than Penix and Nix is nuts. I think all four are talented in different ways, and perfectly fine options at 6 around which to start building an offense around their respective qualities.
And what would we be missing out on? A Myles Garrett/Nick Bosa type the rusher? Nope. A Trent Williams type offensive tackle? Nope.
A wide receiver. The position college football is turning out like widgets.
It's one thing to look at this from a scouting and raw scoring perspective. It's another to look at this from a team building perspective.
Schoen likely has a feel for this and knows he can get Daboll's boy Nabers or JJM at 6. I believe it will come down to those two at 6. In all likelihood one of the two will be there at 6 unless JJM goes before Maye and MHJ goes before Nabers, which seems highly improbable for both of those surprises to happen.
Of course it could be a total disaster. Who knows? But swing for the fences. We’re in QB hell as it is.
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In comment 16462243 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
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I think the Giants are idiots hitching their wagon to Jones, given his subpar play and injury history.
But I’m a nobody.
It will be cool to start seeing mock draft threads before the leaves change colors this fall.
Are you on record for QB no matter what at 6? Would you trade 2024, 2025 & 2026 first round picks to move to 3?
I know you're not asking me, but I wouldn't make that trade because there are 2 QBs who will be on the board at 6 that are as likely to succeed in the NFL as the guys you'd need to trade up for.
I think saying Maye and McCarthy are clearly better than Penix and Nix is nuts. I think all four are talented in different ways, and perfectly fine options at 6 around which to start building an offense around their respective qualities.
And what would we be missing out on? A Myles Garrett/Nick Bosa type the rusher? Nope. A Trent Williams type offensive tackle? Nope.
A wide receiver. The position college football is turning out like widgets.
It's one thing to look at this from a scouting and raw scoring perspective. It's another to look at this from a team building perspective.
To be fair, Nabers is up there with the most promising WR prospects of the past decade. I agree WRs are being churned out by CFB, but Nabers is very special and I see why Daboll is supposedly salivating at the thought of Nabers.
Sometimes Jordan seems like he is winging it.
The assumption is we suck in 2024 and will be drafting near the top again, but what if we luck into a few more wins. Stranger things have happened (see last year). Trying to get a top QB at 6 would typically take a lot less draft capital than trying to move up from the 10 - 15 range. If we have a chance this year, take it! don't want to keep hearing wait until next year.
Right now, Jones' neck is a problem.
That's the huge take-away.
Right now, Jones' neck is a problem.
That's the huge take-away.
Man, a neck injury is nothing to trifle with.
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Raanan has said that Daniels is the first choice, followed by JJM, and that they like Maye but not as much as assumed.
Sometimes Jordan seems like he is winging it.
Yeah, I see no chance the Giants all the sudden changed their minds about Maye after working for months on trading up for him. I just don't think we are in the position roster wise to pay the price and Schoen isn't the type to get fleeced in a deal for everything he's got. The Vikings being all in on Maye makes sense because their roster (especially on offense) is ready go be truly elite with the right QB.