He said he thinks Maye is the QB they want. However, he thinks the only way they land him is if Maye lasts to #4 and then the Giants trade up.
Barring that scenario, he thinks they stand pat at #6 and "let the draft come to them."
Does think it is possible they trade back up into the first round to take Penix or Nix.
Spending time with a QB does not mean, you are getting the answers you want....
I think that's my dream scenario right now for something that I feel could realistically happen. I like JJM a lot, but I don't think he lasts to 6 and even then Schoen might prefer Odunze. Penix sliding is much stronger of a possibility than many realize here.
I seriously doubt they spend the #3 pick on JJ McCarthy.
He doesn’t say they wouldn’t draft McCarthy at 6.
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Then the way to 3 is by going up to 4 first. Who knows though, you can't believe anything you hear right now. I do believe we have been adamantly working to trade up for Maye. Will be interesting, T-11 days 7 hrs 39 minutes and counting..
I seriously doubt they spend the #3 pick on JJ McCarthy.
I'm saying if NE likes JJM then we could entice them by trading up to 4 then 3 so NE is guaranteed a QB they like (Maybe more than Maye as many analysts do).
What?
I don't see Wolf trading down. He'd be an idiot to do so. You don't trade down if you need a QB and can take one at your pick. Whiffing on a QB you take with a top-five pick might get you fired. But trading that pick to a team that then used it to take a franchise QB almost certainly will. It could also mean never getting another GM job.
NE could also miss out on JJM if they trade with us. There is no guarantee they could then trade up to #4 or #5 if they did so. Arizona and San Diego might refuse to trade or take a better offer from another team. They would then have to overdraft Nix or Penix at #6 or probably lose both of them as well, since neither will likely make it to their second round pick.
If Maye gets to #4, then I assume Minnesota will offer Arizona #11, #23, and their #1 and #3 next year. Schoen could counter with #6, #47, and our #1 next year. That should be competitive, because at worst Arizona would still have their choice of two of the top three WRs at #6. They also have a lot of draft capital this year.
If the QBs go Williams, Daniels, Maye, then I assume based on some of the asshat reports that the Giants will not trade up for JJM. What would be interesting is if they took one of the WRs instead of JJM at #6, or traded down with another team that wanted to move up to take him. I would take JJM in that situation.
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would be very, very nice.
I think that's my dream scenario right now for something that I feel could realistically happen. I like JJM a lot, but I don't think he lasts to 6 and even then Schoen might prefer Odunze. Penix sliding is much stronger of a possibility than many realize here.
I don’t see any scenario where the Giants end up with Odunze and Penix. Penix is not making it to 46, and if they trade down to pick up another 1st rounder, Odunze won’t be there.
I don't see Wolf trading down. He'd be an idiot to do so. You don't trade down if you need a QB and can take one at your pick. Whiffing on a QB you take with a top-five pick might get you fired. But trading that pick to a team that then used it to take a franchise QB almost certainly will. It could also mean never getting another GM job.
NE could also miss out on JJM if they trade with us. There is no guarantee they could then trade up to #4 or #5 if they did so. Arizona and San Diego might refuse to trade or take a better offer from another team. They would then have to overdraft Nix or Penix at #6 or probably lose both of them as well, since neither will likely make it to their second round pick.
If Maye gets to #4, then I assume Minnesota will offer Arizona #11, #23, and their #1 and #3 next year. Schoen could counter with #6, #47, and our #1 next year. That should be competitive, because at worst Arizona would still have their choice of two of the top three WRs at #6. They also have a lot of draft capital this year.
If the QBs go Williams, Daniels, Maye, then I assume based on some of the asshat reports that the Giants will not trade up for JJM. What would be interesting is if they took one of the WRs instead of JJM at #6, or traded down with another team that wanted to move up to take him. I would take JJM in that situation.
Agreed on all accounts, good post.
LSU QB Jayden Daniels is a top choice to be the No. 2 pick in the 2024 NFL Draft.
Jayden Daniels -150
Drake Maye +130
J.J. McCarthy +600
Caleb Williams +5000
Marvin Harrison Jr. +5000
Bo Nix +15000
Brock Bowers +15000
Joe Alt +15000
J.C. Latham +15000
Dallas Turner +15000
Jared Verse +15000
Laiatu Latu +15000
Malik Nabers +15000
Michael Penix Jr +15000
Olumuyiwa Fashanu +15000
Rome Odunze +15000
Taliese Fuaga +15000
Odds & Players Provided by bet365 - Subject to Change
NFL Draft No. 3 Overall Pick Odds
Drake Maye -110
Jayden Daniels +160
J.J. McCarthy +400
I don't see Wolf trading down. He'd be an idiot to do so. You don't trade down if you need a QB and can take one at your pick. Whiffing on a QB you take with a top-five pick might get you fired. But trading that pick to a team that then used it to take a franchise QB almost certainly will. It could also mean never getting another GM job.
NE could also miss out on JJM if they trade with us. There is no guarantee they could then trade up to #4 or #5 if they did so. Arizona and San Diego might refuse to trade or take a better offer from another team. They would then have to overdraft Nix or Penix at #6 or probably lose both of them as well, since neither will likely make it to their second round pick.
If Maye gets to #4, then I assume Minnesota will offer Arizona #11, #23, and their #1 and #3 next year. Schoen could counter with #6, #47, and our #1 next year. That should be competitive, because at worst Arizona would still have their choice of two of the top three WRs at #6. They also have a lot of draft capital this year.
If the QBs go Williams, Daniels, Maye, then I assume based on some of the asshat reports that the Giants will not trade up for JJM. What would be interesting is if they took one of the WRs instead of JJM at #6, or traded down with another team that wanted to move up to take him. I would take JJM in that situation.
this is how i see it. if JJM gets to 6 i think they'd pull the trigger.
so i guess i think JJM vs Maye to NE at #3 is where the draft starts because i think that's a close call that could go either way.
followed by arizona at 4. do they do what they did last year or take the star? will anderson ended up a star and he had arguably as much "best player in the draft" hype as MHJ so they know both sides well.
I really think given how close they're rated they would take odunze over Nabers. Between Toney and Neal with his burger flipping comment I think they need a guy who you know isn't going to be a headache
I don't either, I believe it's Odunze or Nabers. I'm assuming Minnesota trades up to 4 or 5 for JJ in any case.
We currently have no hope at QB and also only 6 picks in this draft.
I’d love to gain from the fact that there will be actual non QB blue chip talent available at 6. Game the Falcons and then the Bears. Get a 2nd and a 3rd. Take JJM or Penix at 9 and build with two 2nds and two 3rds.
One can dream.
Is Penix and Nix worth a 1st and 2nd? Not to me. That's the problem with not picking a QB at 6. Rattler or Pratt would be more viable in the 3rd.
Is Penix and Nix worth a 1st and 2nd? Not to me. That's the problem with not picking a QB at 6. Rattler or Pratt would be more viable in the 3rd.
Do not get the rattler appeal whatsoever
Is Penix and Nix worth a 1st and 2nd? Not to me. That's the problem with not picking a QB at 6. Rattler or Pratt would be more viable in the 3rd.
Don't be silly. Rattler and Pratt may as well be DeVito.
Harbaugh certainly is, so the QBs go 1-4 and he gets the top non-QB pick in the draft.
Yep, that's what I think. The other day, Schoen said something about "if the 4 QBs are gone before pick 6..." it almost seemed like he was trying to give the impression that he viewed JJM in the same group as the others, but came across to me like it was a preconceived misdirection
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Up will involve the 2025 1st.
Is Penix and Nix worth a 1st and 2nd? Not to me. That's the problem with not picking a QB at 6. Rattler or Pratt would be more viable in the 3rd.
Don't be silly. Rattler and Pratt may as well be DeVito.
And Penix has had numerous shoulder and ACL surgeries and people want go give up the 2nd and next years 1st rounder. Too huge of a risk.
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In comment 16468295 Toth029 said:
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Up will involve the 2025 1st.
Is Penix and Nix worth a 1st and 2nd? Not to me. That's the problem with not picking a QB at 6. Rattler or Pratt would be more viable in the 3rd.
Don't be silly. Rattler and Pratt may as well be DeVito.
And Penix has had numerous shoulder and ACL surgeries and people want go give up the 2nd and next years 1st rounder. Too huge of a risk.
Penix is so superior a QB to those two, he is worth taking a chance on picking.
This is very hard to follow.
Are you actually saying trade up for any QB not named Maye?
My current guess is:
1) Williams - Chicago
2) Daniels - DC
3) JJM - Minnesota
I don't think the move from 6 > 4 will be as costly as some predict. But given Arizona doesn't need picks in 2024, I think the 2025 first round pick will be the cost.
4) Maye - NYG
5) MHJr - LA
6) Nabers - AZ
My current guess is:
1) Williams - Chicago
2) Daniels - DC
3) JJM - Minnesota
I don't think the move from 6 > 4 will be as costly as some predict. But given Arizona doesn't need picks in 2024, I think the 2025 first round pick will be the cost.
4) Maye - NYG
5) MHJr - LA
6) Nabers - AZ
If Minnesota trades up with NE - would we have too? Shouldn’t Maye be available at 6? I don’t think Vegas or Denver has the ammo to jump us.
I would rather take a chance on next year's draft or have the Gants sign a free-agent QB, i.e. Prescot.
The worst-case scenario is drafting a QB who does not have the potential to be great and tying the future to mediocrity.
That would perpetuate QB hell.
I do not see greatness in Penix, Nix, et al.
My current guess is:
1) Williams - Chicago
2) Daniels - DC
3) JJM - Minnesota
I don't think the move from 6 > 4 will be as costly as some predict. But given Arizona doesn't need picks in 2024, I think the 2025 first round pick will be the cost.
4) Maye - NYG
5) MHJr - LA
6) Nabers - AZ
If Minnesota trades up with NE - would we have too? Shouldn’t Maye be available at 6? I don’t think Vegas or Denver has the ammo to jump us.
The Chargers have a ton of needs. If the Eagles and Cowboys can make a draft day trade, the Chargers and Raiders can. 12, 44, and next year's first for instance could do it.
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I think Minnesota will do what it takes to move to three and I think they will pick JJM.
My current guess is:
1) Williams - Chicago
2) Daniels - DC
3) JJM - Minnesota
I don't think the move from 6 > 4 will be as costly as some predict. But given Arizona doesn't need picks in 2024, I think the 2025 first round pick will be the cost.
4) Maye - NYG
5) MHJr - LA
6) Nabers - AZ
If Minnesota trades up with NE - would we have too? Shouldn’t Maye be available at 6? I don’t think Vegas or Denver has the ammo to jump us.
The Chargers have a ton of needs. If the Eagles and Cowboys can make a draft day trade, the Chargers and Raiders can. 12, 44, and next year's first for instance could do it.
Gotcha. Thanks.
A trade down with Minny, our #6 for their #11 and #23 would be good too. We could then grab Nix or Penix at #11, and then come back with a top WR at #23.
He mentioned in their video how heavy defensively it is in next years class notably on the ends and for corners. Two very much premium positions.
I'd be for Schoen trading next years first in a move up from 6 but not from the 2nd round to pick a QB who's had numerous injuries and has warts himself with middle of the field work and working against pressure.
1) Williams - Chicago
2) Daniels - DC
3) Maye - NE
4) MHjr - AZ
5) JJMc - Minn
6) Odunze/Nabers
My current guess is:
1) Williams - Chicago
2) Daniels - DC
3) JJM - Minnesota
I don't think the move from 6 > 4 will be as costly as some predict. But given Arizona doesn't need picks in 2024, I think the 2025 first round pick will be the cost.
4) Maye - NYG
5) MHJr - LA
6) Nabers - AZ
I have a friend who is a big Vikings fan. He says KOC loves Maye, and if they have a choice between Maye and McCarthy, it's going to be Maye.
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In comment 16468295 Toth029 said:
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Up will involve the 2025 1st.
Is Penix and Nix worth a 1st and 2nd? Not to me. That's the problem with not picking a QB at 6. Rattler or Pratt would be more viable in the 3rd.
Don't be silly. Rattler and Pratt may as well be DeVito.
And Penix has had numerous shoulder and ACL surgeries and people want go give up the 2nd and next years 1st rounder. Too huge of a risk.
If Minnesota gets JJM or Maye, I think there's a better chance of Penix sliding into the end of rd1 than not.
My current guess is:
1) Williams - Chicago
2) Daniels - DC
3) JJM - Minnesota
I don't think the move from 6 > 4 will be as costly as some predict. But given Arizona doesn't need picks in 2024, I think the 2025 first round pick will be the cost.
4) Maye - NYG
5) MHJr - LA
6) Nabers - AZ
If Minnesota gets pick 3 I'd bet the farm they are taking Maye.
The Maye to Minnesota connections are strong and he fits their offense to a T. Anything can happen, but I would be incredibly surprised if they traded up to 3 for JJM over Maye.
This is what I think about your post..
Just for you - ( New Window )
A top WR without a functional QB is a waste of resources when there is an significant upgrade at QB on the board. Maye represents a potential huge upgrade at QB. If Maye hits, he'll be more valuable to the Giants than any WR.
Do any sportsbooks have any O/U odds on Penix at 47?
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One of the WRs I’m going to be livid. If they’re not taking a QB in the first six picks I would absolutely hate wasting a pick on a QB in this draft. Either go all in or punt completely. Don’t go half assed.
A top WR without a functional QB is a waste of resources when there is an significant upgrade at QB on the board. Maye represents a potential huge upgrade at QB. If Maye hits, he'll be more valuable to the Giants than any WR.
One of the only things we can count on right now is that Schoen has been hard at work trying to tradeup for Maye, imp. Other than that, it seems like a lot of smoke and mirrors with no certainty on the path forward whether it be Nabers, Odunze, JJM or trade down.
Dear god, anyone routing for a WR on a team bereft of QB can't be serious. You do understand WR's cannot achieve to their talent level without the ball being thrown to them right..
Maye is the GUY hands down and we should be begging the Football gods that we can get him.
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One of the WRs I’m going to be livid. If they’re not taking a QB in the first six picks I would absolutely hate wasting a pick on a QB in this draft. Either go all in or punt completely. Don’t go half assed.
What?
I hate Maye and I want no part of Penix, Nix, or any of the other guys after that.
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In comment 16468309 section125 said:
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In comment 16468295 Toth029 said:
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Up will involve the 2025 1st.
Is Penix and Nix worth a 1st and 2nd? Not to me. That's the problem with not picking a QB at 6. Rattler or Pratt would be more viable in the 3rd.
Don't be silly. Rattler and Pratt may as well be DeVito.
And Penix has had numerous shoulder and ACL surgeries and people want go give up the 2nd and next years 1st rounder. Too huge of a risk.
Penix is so superior a QB to those two, he is worth taking a chance on picking.
Completely disagree.
Where would you take Bo Nix and where would you take Penix if both were available via trade up into the end of rd1?
"In order to move up, the Ravens sent their 52nd, 125th picks and a 2019 second-round selection to Philadelphia in exchange for the 32nd and 132nd selections this year."
Not sure how the value chart is. From here, it feels like they would trade the 2nd, 3rd and next years 1st. That's a decent haul for Balt to move up and Jackson was a better prospect coming out than both Penix and Nix.
My current guess is:
1) Williams - Chicago
2) Daniels - DC
3) JJM - Minnesota
I don't think the move from 6 > 4 will be as costly as some predict. But given Arizona doesn't need picks in 2024, I think the 2025 first round pick will be the cost.
4) Maye - NYG
5) MHJr - LA
6) Nabers - AZ
I'd be very pleased with this scenario. However, I'm not sure 3 is for sale. If it is for sale, I think NYG makes the deal with NE. That's a big drop off for NE going down to 11.
"In order to move up, the Ravens sent their 52nd, 125th picks and a 2019 second-round selection to Philadelphia in exchange for the 32nd and 132nd selections this year."
Not sure how the value chart is. From here, it feels like they would trade the 2nd, 3rd and next years 1st. That's a decent haul for Balt to move up and Jackson was a better prospect coming out than both Penix and Nix.
I've done a bunch of mock trades in the PFN simulator. Typically it takes the 2025 2nd round pick to move from 47 to 33.
If you want 31 or 32 it also costs the 2025 4th round pick.
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some teams like the Giants are feigning interest in McCarthy in hopes that another team will draft him.
Yep, that's what I think. The other day, Schoen said something about "if the 4 QBs are gone before pick 6..." it almost seemed like he was trying to give the impression that he viewed JJM in the same group as the others, but came across to me like it was a preconceived misdirection
There are two potential misdirection points in that passage, IMO: the *four* QBs, certainly; but also, the passive, *stay-put-at-6* message is just as likely to be a check-raise bluff as well (or instead).
"In order to move up, the Ravens sent their 52nd, 125th picks and a 2019 second-round selection to Philadelphia in exchange for the 32nd and 132nd selections this year."
Not sure how the value chart is. From here, it feels like they would trade the 2nd, 3rd and next years 1st. That's a decent haul for Balt to move up and Jackson was a better prospect coming out than both Penix and Nix.
2nd, 3rd and next year's first for what? That is quite a haul
People want Schoen to move up to draft Penix, and he will presumably go higher than 32. I feel that includes a 1st of next year and probably another pick this year.
People want Schoen to move up to draft Penix, and he will presumably go higher than 32. I feel that includes a 1st of next year and probably another pick this year.
If Penix slides to the end of rd2 I think it could be done for pick 47 and our 5th rounder or 2025 4th. Look at the Vikings trade for pick 23. It was pick 42, 2025 2nd and 5th round pick swap.
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Ravens used quite a bit just to go to 32. Their own 2nd, similar spot to where NYG is right now, a future 2nd and a swap of late 4ths. To move twenty spots, that is.
People want Schoen to move up to draft Penix, and he will presumably go higher than 32. I feel that includes a 1st of next year and probably another pick this year.
If Penix slides to the end of rd2 I think it could be done for pick 47 and our 5th rounder or 2025 4th. Look at the Vikings trade for pick 23. It was pick 42, 2025 2nd and 5th round pick swap.
Oops forgot to say 47, 2025 2nd and 5th rounder or 2025 4th.
If they do not want McCarthy, they could probably get a great trade for #6. Drop down a bit and take Penix.
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and McCarthy is there at six and the Giants pass on him they were never that high on him. Pick the WR of their choice. The thing I would be reluctant to do is give up a number one in 25. However if they do I hope they are right because the Giants might be picking in the top ten next year.
If they do not want McCarthy, they could probably get a great trade for #6. Drop down a bit and take Penix.
Trading Minnesota for 11 and 23, then moving up to 9 to take Odunze would be amazing if possible. And I'm a big JJM fan. I'm not dumb though, if they don't want him then hopefully we can play it to our advantage. Just passing on him without trading would seem like a missed opportunity.
Have you watched Drake Maye play football?
2 trade ups. 3 team deals.
Never going to happen.
Yes