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Is WR a Smart Move at 6?

BleedBlue46 : 4/16/2024 1:05 pm
I love both Odunze and Nabers as prospects. They are both elite. Nevertheless, I can't help but think it would not be wise taking one of them at 6 when we have needs at QB, CB, DL, TE, S, RB, OL and more. What good does a WR do when we have so many holes on the roster and a big question mark at QB?

We could get Odunze and Melton in the first 2 rounds or we could get Fautanu, Orhorhoro, Melton, and Benson just as an example.

I say if Schoen can't or doesn't get a QB with pick 6 then he needs to tradedown, perhaps multiple times. This is a very strong draft in the top 100. Either get a QB via pick 6 or stack picks in the top 100 and properly build the roster.
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I don’t have a problem trading down  
jeff57 : 4/16/2024 4:43 pm : link
The more day 1 and 2 picks the better.
For the record,  
BleedBlue46 : 4/16/2024 5:08 pm : link
I won't be throwing anything if we take WR at 6. It's not like taking a RB or S or TE at 6. I just question if it's the best approach to take with our roster. That's all.
I started with the bias that WR  
KraZee : 4/16/2024 5:10 pm : link
at 6 was not the best use of the pick if we dont have a QB currently that can take advantage of the new wideout. And then I read along on this thread throughout the day thinking that the argument makes less and less sense to me. The top VALUE positions to draft are the same ones that are the top VALUE positions for salaries in the game. And WR is one of the top earning positions in football PERIOD. We all agree QB is the most important and highest salaried position followed in some order that I don't profess to know of OT, Edge, WR, CB with IDL, IOL, LB, TE, RB and S all less valued. But you would not overlook taking a CB high in the draft with a 90 rating because you don't have a quality pass rusher. And you would not condition getting a great OT because you have lousy QB and RB on the current team. Drafting is about securing the most talented players you can throughout the draft and building your team for the future...not just the next year. With that in mind, I'd vote for taking the 90 plus rated WR at 6 rather than a low 80 ranked QB who might project to be awesome but might not. If you have roughly equal rated QB and WR available at 6, take the QB by all means. But if the gulf is big, then take the surer thing and plan to keep on the lookout for the next QB. I want a complete team...and to get there...we need lots of players who are better than what we currently have and we need difference makers on both sides of the ball. We do have some already IMV 2 good Edges, 1 great IDL, 1 promising CB, 1 very good ILB (okereke), we have almost none on the offensive side of the ball outside of 1 OT. That is where we need to start finding talent. More OL talent plus difference makers at WR, TE and RB
If we could somehow get Odunze then  
BleedBlue46 : 4/16/2024 5:11 pm : link
Penix somewhere between the end of rd1 and pick 47. I would be ecstatic. It's risky, but it would be one of the best uses of our top 2 picks possible in my mind.
RE: RE: The draft is such a crap shoot  
Rjanyg : 4/16/2024 6:10 pm : link
In comment 16470951 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16470944 Rjanyg said:


Quote:


You should draft the safest, blue chip player and that may be Odunze.

Every team has a different board. Every team has different priorities.

Every team falls in love with players and as you know from the top 30 visits, we tend to draft quite a few from that list.

WR is a smart move if you have a deep conviction on the player and the person. Culture matters as does elite talent.

Imagine if OBJ wasn't a diva WR and still had all that talent. He was drafted at pick 12. Odunze is a high quality player, person, teammate. Off the charts work ethic.

A very clean player. If we select a WR at 6 I hope it is him.



Everyone keeps bringing up OBJ, but we had Eli Manning ballin then. We have Lock and DJ now.

Plus, the draft is more like poker than a crapshoot. Good GMs get good players in the top 100 like the 49ers and Rams and others.


I don’t care who is throwing the ball in this discussion. If you are asking if drafting a solid blue chip WR with high character is worth the 6th pick I say yes if you have done the work and have a conviction.

Look, NFL teams spend shit loads of money scouting players and the process. Just look at the new video on the Giants high tech draft room. You don’t want to whiff on your first round pick. If Odunze is the pick or MHJ possibly, that wouldn’t be a wasted pick. We all know what a viable number 1 WR will do for an offense. We have other good young WR that would get open just by the presence of a top WR.

Odunze, Hyatt, Robinson, Slayton, Bellinger and Waller, assuming he plays, is a solid group.

The offensive line has a much better chance of being improved with the 5 linemen they have been signed along with the group we have.

Singletary is a solid back. I can see them drafting another back on day 2.

Jones, Lock and DeVito won’t scare anybody, I get it, but saying a great WR prospect won’t improve the offense along with an improved OL is just a massive unknown.

And I want a QB in round 1. So don’t think they I’m all in on WR.
RE: RE: RE: The draft is such a crap shoot  
BleedBlue46 : 4/16/2024 6:34 pm : link
In comment 16471145 Rjanyg said:
Quote:
In comment 16470951 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16470944 Rjanyg said:


Quote:


You should draft the safest, blue chip player and that may be Odunze.

Every team has a different board. Every team has different priorities.

Every team falls in love with players and as you know from the top 30 visits, we tend to draft quite a few from that list.

WR is a smart move if you have a deep conviction on the player and the person. Culture matters as does elite talent.

Imagine if OBJ wasn't a diva WR and still had all that talent. He was drafted at pick 12. Odunze is a high quality player, person, teammate. Off the charts work ethic.

A very clean player. If we select a WR at 6 I hope it is him.



Everyone keeps bringing up OBJ, but we had Eli Manning ballin then. We have Lock and DJ now.

Plus, the draft is more like poker than a crapshoot. Good GMs get good players in the top 100 like the 49ers and Rams and others.



I don’t care who is throwing the ball in this discussion. If you are asking if drafting a solid blue chip WR with high character is worth the 6th pick I say yes if you have done the work and have a conviction.

Look, NFL teams spend shit loads of money scouting players and the process. Just look at the new video on the Giants high tech draft room. You don’t want to whiff on your first round pick. If Odunze is the pick or MHJ possibly, that wouldn’t be a wasted pick. We all know what a viable number 1 WR will do for an offense. We have other good young WR that would get open just by the presence of a top WR.

Odunze, Hyatt, Robinson, Slayton, Bellinger and Waller, assuming he plays, is a solid group.

The offensive line has a much better chance of being improved with the 5 linemen they have been signed along with the group we have.

Singletary is a solid back. I can see them drafting another back on day 2.

Jones, Lock and DeVito won’t scare anybody, I get it, but saying a great WR prospect won’t improve the offense along with an improved OL is just a massive unknown.

And I want a QB in round 1. So don’t think they I’m all in on WR.


I never said it wouldn't improve the offense. I'm just questioning if a trade down would he wiser if we can't get a QB via pick 6.
RE: BleedBlue46  
Torn Tendon : 4/16/2024 6:42 pm : link
In comment 16470770 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I'm going to talk about this on the podcast tomorrow.


I didn't know there was a podcast. I'll have to look for it.
No  
WillVAB : 4/16/2024 7:02 pm : link
Taking a WR at 6 would be just as dumb as taking a RB at 2.
I really think  
Giantsbigblue : 4/16/2024 7:05 pm : link
The Defense has a chance to be good this year. A lot of young developing players there and you can't have stars everywhere.

I'm hopeful the offensive line can improve with Neal and JMS and the 2 free agents and new line coach.

Getting a QB now  
DefenseWins : 4/16/2024 7:22 pm : link
Is like getting a kick ass stereo for your car before fixing the engine
RE: Getting a QB now  
BleedBlue46 : 4/16/2024 7:26 pm : link
In comment 16471209 DefenseWins said:
Quote:
Is like getting a kick ass stereo for your car before fixing the engine


I'd argue it's much better to get the QB then work on skill positions. The QB is the engine of the offense, OL is the transmission, and skill position players are the stereo and aftermarket stuff.
RE: RE: Getting a QB now  
Mike in NY : 4/16/2024 7:33 pm : link
In comment 16471214 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16471209 DefenseWins said:


Quote:


Is like getting a kick ass stereo for your car before fixing the engine



I'd argue it's much better to get the QB then work on skill positions. The QB is the engine of the offense, OL is the transmission, and skill position players are the stereo and aftermarket stuff.


Not all skill positions are created equal. Having the WR1 who can allow others to face single coverage and prevent 7 and 8 man boxes goes a long way. Without spreading the field, our RB’s are always facing more in the box than blockers.
It's easy to just say trade down  
TrueBlue56 : 4/16/2024 7:39 pm : link
It has been said every year, but the fact of the matter is you have to have a team willing to trade up and be willing to pay that price. Most times you can get that value if there is a quarterback teams are vying for. I don't see that being the case.

The giants should not and will not trade down just for the sake of trading down. You do not get the value, just as you don't take a quarterback just because you have to take one.

If you don't have your quarterback available and you don't have a very good offer from another team to trade down, then you take the best player on your board.

As it looks right now it is most likely Rome or Nabers. Take the best player. The talk last year was that the Giants were looking at the wide receivers with their 1st round pick. They went off the board and they got banks. Nothing wrong with taking a wide receiver this year with their 1st round pick. It fills a need and the value is there.
RE: It's easy to just say trade down  
BleedBlue46 : 4/16/2024 8:29 pm : link
In comment 16471232 TrueBlue56 said:
Quote:
It has been said every year, but the fact of the matter is you have to have a team willing to trade up and be willing to pay that price. Most times you can get that value if there is a quarterback teams are vying for. I don't see that being the case.

The giants should not and will not trade down just for the sake of trading down. You do not get the value, just as you don't take a quarterback just because you have to take one.

If you don't have your quarterback available and you don't have a very good offer from another team to trade down, then you take the best player on your board.

As it looks right now it is most likely Rome or Nabers. Take the best player. The talk last year was that the Giants were looking at the wide receivers with their 1st round pick. They went off the board and they got banks. Nothing wrong with taking a wide receiver this year with their 1st round pick. It fills a need and the value is there.


If these WRs are seen by the NFL as elite as BBI sees them, someone will be willing to trade up for one. Plus, Joe Alt and other tackles.
RE: RE: Getting a QB now  
DefenseWins : 4/16/2024 8:49 pm : link
In comment 16471214 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16471209 DefenseWins said:


Quote:


Is like getting a kick ass stereo for your car before fixing the engine



I'd argue it's much better to get the QB then work on skill positions. The QB is the engine of the offense, OL is the transmission, and skill position players are the stereo and aftermarket stuff.


I actually meant to say getting the WR now... not QB
RE: RE: It's easy to just say trade down  
TrueBlue56 : 4/16/2024 8:54 pm : link
In comment 16471288 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16471232 TrueBlue56 said:


Quote:


It has been said every year, but the fact of the matter is you have to have a team willing to trade up and be willing to pay that price. Most times you can get that value if there is a quarterback teams are vying for. I don't see that being the case.

The giants should not and will not trade down just for the sake of trading down. You do not get the value, just as you don't take a quarterback just because you have to take one.

If you don't have your quarterback available and you don't have a very good offer from another team to trade down, then you take the best player on your board.

As it looks right now it is most likely Rome or Nabers. Take the best player. The talk last year was that the Giants were looking at the wide receivers with their 1st round pick. They went off the board and they got banks. Nothing wrong with taking a wide receiver this year with their 1st round pick. It fills a need and the value is there.



If these WRs are seen by the NFL as elite as BBI sees them, someone will be willing to trade up for one. Plus, Joe Alt and other tackles.


It's not about seeing them as elite or not. The only position in regards to the draft that you can premium value to trade up is quarterback. You do not see that for any other positions, because a quarterback is that valuable.

As far as offensive tackles go, there isn't a demand to trade up. For instance, Sy has 5 offensive tackles ranked close together at the top. A team may view one of the offensive tackles above the rest, but they will like more than one. More than likely all 5 would still be on the board at 6. Teams will wait and see who might drop.
A WR1  
Scooter185 : 4/16/2024 10:57 pm : link
Is a force multiplier

But anything multiplied by zero is still zero, and right now our QB room is exactly that
RE: RE: RE: It's easy to just say trade down  
BleedBlue46 : 4/16/2024 11:12 pm : link
In comment 16471322 TrueBlue56 said:
Quote:
In comment 16471288 BleedBlue46 said:


Quote:


In comment 16471232 TrueBlue56 said:


Quote:


It has been said every year, but the fact of the matter is you have to have a team willing to trade up and be willing to pay that price. Most times you can get that value if there is a quarterback teams are vying for. I don't see that being the case.

The giants should not and will not trade down just for the sake of trading down. You do not get the value, just as you don't take a quarterback just because you have to take one.

If you don't have your quarterback available and you don't have a very good offer from another team to trade down, then you take the best player on your board.

As it looks right now it is most likely Rome or Nabers. Take the best player. The talk last year was that the Giants were looking at the wide receivers with their 1st round pick. They went off the board and they got banks. Nothing wrong with taking a wide receiver this year with their 1st round pick. It fills a need and the value is there.



If these WRs are seen by the NFL as elite as BBI sees them, someone will be willing to trade up for one. Plus, Joe Alt and other tackles.



It's not about seeing them as elite or not. The only position in regards to the draft that you can premium value to trade up is quarterback. You do not see that for any other positions, because a quarterback is that valuable.

As far as offensive tackles go, there isn't a demand to trade up. For instance, Sy has 5 offensive tackles ranked close together at the top. A team may view one of the offensive tackles above the rest, but they will like more than one. More than likely all 5 would still be on the board at 6. Teams will wait and see who might drop.


If the trade down offers aren't there, then so be it, I still think a team would trade a good amount for Alt or Nabers or Odunze. Or if JJM is there and we don't want him.
The analysis of Odell Beckham‘s career was sorely lacking in one area:  
Reese's Pieces : 4/17/2024 5:10 am : link
Injuries. After his first three terrific years, in his fourth year, Beckham joined Barkley and many other skill players by fracturing an ankle and only playing in four games. After that, he was never as good. In his first three seasons, he scored 10 touchdowns or more, after that his high was six. His long gains his first three years were all over 75 yards, but after that in only one year did his long gain exceed 56 yards.

And worst of all, in his seventh, eighth, and ninth years, when an offensive lineman or tight end is still near peak performance helping the run and the pass, Beckham played in but seven, six and eight games.

George Young, in building the Giants, did not use a premium pick on a wide receiver until 1985 when he picked Stacey Robinson second. And two years later after the Giants won their first Super Bowl, and were pretty well set in the running game and the defense, did he use a first and a third to draft Ingram and Baker.
RE: BleedBlue46  
Paulie Walnuts : 4/17/2024 2:30 pm : link
In comment 16470770 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I'm going to talk about this on the podcast tomorrow.

We assume it isn't weird for the Cardinals and Chargers, two teams with a desperate need for WRs, to pass on the top three. But somehow it would be for the Giants.
take the stud WR he makes your whole offense more effective. Giants have shored up the OL I would take A WR at one trade up and take a Nix or penix. They may even take a 2nd WR later.
RE: RE: BleedBlue46  
BleedBlue46 : 4/17/2024 2:32 pm : link
In comment 16472391 Paulie Walnuts said:
Quote:
In comment 16470770 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


I'm going to talk about this on the podcast tomorrow.

We assume it isn't weird for the Cardinals and Chargers, two teams with a desperate need for WRs, to pass on the top three. But somehow it would be for the Giants.


take the stud WR he makes your whole offense more effective. Giants have shored up the OL I would take A WR at one trade up and take a Nix or penix. They may even take a 2nd WR later.


If Schoen has some intel Penix will last into the end of rd1, then I'd be thrilled with Odunze at 6 and Penix later.
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