But we don't. Caleb is out of our reach. Probably Daniels and Maye are as well. I prefer all 3 to JJM and I personally like Penix more.
And JJM doesn't have the high end traits of those four.
But what he has shown is that he can lead a college team to a championship by executing within a system. Could the Giants bring him along within a confined system as he starts to turn the glimpses into superior traits into a fuller NFL arsenal? It's possible. I think he has a lower floor than Williams and Daniels and a higher bust potential. That's why he'll likely be the 4th QB off the board and not the 2nd.
With all these caveats it will still be an exciting move by the Giants. With all the caveats, there is still a sky high upside. And presently, we have no upside at the position.
I think if I'm at 6 and CW, JD and DM are all off the board, I give serious consideration to taking JJM. We might be about to usher in a new era for the G-Men. I know we're ready for it.
lost me when he started musing that someone might trade for Jones before the trade deadline this year.
And as someone else said, he's a UM alum.
I'm fine taking Maye or McCarthy at #6, but think both have too many questions to justify trading a ton of draft capital to move up to get, except maybe to #5 for #70. But I do think the Giants will try and aggressively move up to #4 if Maye is still available. I am a lot less certain they would do so for JJM.
Couple things that Eisen said are just his opinion.
1. Jones “not being ready until midseason.” By all accounts, Jones will be fine by training camp.
By what accounts? Jones? A photo of him running with no pads on? I don't think we can say with any certainty if Jones will be fine by training camp or not ready until midseason.
Remember Eisen said the Giants were done with Jones
in one of his shows from what he heard at the Combine. I think that's why he's pounding the table for a QB to be picked with the 6th pick or a trade up, whether it's Maye or McCarthy on his recent shows.
Couple things that Eisen said are just his opinion.
1. Jones “not being ready until midseason.” By all accounts, Jones will be fine by training camp.
By what accounts? Jones? A photo of him running with no pads on? I don't think we can say with any certainty if Jones will be fine by training camp or not ready until midseason.
Yes, I agree. I think it's highly dubious that Jones will be ready by the first week.
Would you hold your nose and support a McCarthy pick if it prevented, "We've done everything we could to screw this kid up." Year 6.
Not me...I do not want to blow the 6th pick on something that will never help our team.
We cannot afford to make a mistake here
Never help the team? You’re 100% certain?
Holy fuck. Some posters here need a new sport to watch. The complete rooting against a player is just amazingly asinine.
Of course I am not certain...
Odds say he will be a bust,I don't want to chase good money after bad.
Roll with DJ/Lock behind an improved line and fill other needed gaps
None of this QB class strikes me as all pro calliber...Maye has a chance
Teams get frothy over QBs,understandably so.
I'd prefer to trade out to another idiotic team and get 3 or 4 yop 50 picks in return
I'm just really looking forward to seeing how all 6 of these QBs
Here said the Mayfield propaganda was in full force back in 2018..
It amazes me how some folks just lock in on an opinion and no matter what anyone else says their opinions stay unwavering..
It's pretty obvious JJM is seen in higher standing with folks in the know more than most here believe..
In the know? Or just following the bandwagon?
Why can’t someone stand by their opinion until McCarthy puts up some NFL achievements though. Most of these posts anyway are just to balance out the nonsense many of you eat up like flies to shit. If he goes to the Giants I will be hoping for the best he can ever be. Hell, if he replaces Jones asap that alone is a small victory. Until then though, I hope my favorite team goes in a different direction.
Than some of the draft pundits. There is no uniformity of opinion on any of these QBs, including Caleb Williams.
There are plenty of knowledgeable people who love JJM. Just because that is true, that doesn’t mean every fan has to agree, or that their opinion is shit. It also doesn’t mean they hate the player. It means they don’t see it. That’s ok.
If you don’t like Penix, there are plenty of draft guys who think he is elite, including Waldman who has him as his QB2 in this class. If you don’t like Penix, that’s fine. Difference of opinion.
I just don’t get all the hysteria and angst from some posters here when an opinion differs from their own. It is so weird.
RE: I'm just really looking forward to seeing how all 6 of these QBs
Pan out in the NFL. If Schoen doesn't get one, I guarantee you he will have missed an opportunity or two or three.
Agreed. Aside from the fact that they may not be this high next year, the competition next year for QB won't get any better and arguably might be much tougher. This year, assuming they like all 6 QBs, they really only need to compete with 6 other teams for one of those 6 QBs (Chicago, Washington, NE, Denver, Minnesota and Las Vegas). Next year, I think there are at least 4 teams that will be full on looking for a QB next year (Dallas, NO, TB and LAR) and 7 more teams that reasonably could be looking for a QB (Atlanta, Arizona, Detroit, Tennessee, Pittsburgh, NYJ and Miami). The Giants are here now. Roll the dice and get the QB.
Than some of the draft pundits. There is no uniformity of opinion on any of these QBs, including Caleb Williams.
There are plenty of knowledgeable people who love JJM. Just because that is true, that doesn’t mean every fan has to agree, or that their opinion is shit. It also doesn’t mean they hate the player. It means they don’t see it. That’s ok.
If you don’t like Penix, there are plenty of draft guys who think he is elite, including Waldman who has him as his QB2 in this class. If you don’t like Penix, that’s fine. Difference of opinion.
I just don’t get all the hysteria and angst from some posters here when an opinion differs from their own. It is so weird.
Than some of the draft pundits. There is no uniformity of opinion on any of these QBs, including Caleb Williams.
There are plenty of knowledgeable people who love JJM. Just because that is true, that doesn’t mean every fan has to agree, or that their opinion is shit. It also doesn’t mean they hate the player. It means they don’t see it. That’s ok.
If you don’t like Penix, there are plenty of draft guys who think he is elite, including Waldman who has him as his QB2 in this class. If you don’t like Penix, that’s fine. Difference of opinion.
I just don’t get all the hysteria and angst from some posters here when an opinion differs from their own. It is so weird.
I'm totally open to differences of opinion, I think the weird thing is speaking in absolutes about these QB prospects. It's all part of the fun though. Will make for great conversation down the road.
*An almost cursed, years long "embarrassing" Offensive Line that was one of the worst in league history last year.
*A bottom 3rd skill group (to be kind) that could arguably be the worst in the league.
They need a #1 WR, a TE, a RB and that is assuming the OL calms down, which it hasn't for years. This certainly is not the ideal situation for a rookie QB (or any QB) to step into.
Here said the Mayfield propaganda was in full force back in 2018..
It amazes me how some folks just lock in on an opinion and no matter what anyone else says their opinions stay unwavering..
It's pretty obvious JJM is seen in higher standing with folks in the know more than most here believe..
In the know? Or just following the bandwagon?
Why can’t someone stand by their opinion until McCarthy puts up some NFL achievements though. Most of these posts anyway are just to balance out the nonsense many of you eat up like flies to shit. If he goes to the Giants I will be hoping for the best he can ever be. Hell, if he replaces Jones asap that alone is a small victory. Until then though, I hope my favorite team goes in a different direction.
That's perfectly fine, I for one didn't form my opinion based on others opinions. I like to do my research on players before absorbing any pundits or analysts' info. No prospects are guarantees, but I like him as a prospect. I haven't even listened to Harbaugh speak about him, I also think that talk is hilarious.
And I feel like I need to qualify this on every thread
I am not an Ohio State fan. I just lived in Ohio when I registered on this site. I don’t have any bias for or against Michigan. I just think McCarthy has less on tape than the other guys and is therefore more of a gamble. If the Giants draft him, I will root like hell for him.
RE: And I feel like I need to qualify this on every thread
I am not an Ohio State fan. I just lived in Ohio when I registered on this site. I don’t have any bias for or against Michigan. I just think McCarthy has less on tape than the other guys and is therefore more of a gamble. If the Giants draft him, I will root like hell for him.
Personally, I see him having a higher floor than Penix (due to injuries Penix floor is very low) and Maye (due to his mechanics, footwork and response to pressure in the pocket Maye is very boom or bust). GiantGrit said we won't draft him at 6 anyways, so don't worry everyone. Maybe we can fleece some qb needy team into trading up for him if he's there.
I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open.
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open.
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open.
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
I think his floor is lower. Only twice as a starter was he asked to throw more than 35 passes in a game and never more than 37. The offense was also more simplistic than what he will have in the NFL. A lot of running game to set up play action and other easy reads. In a 3rd and 15+ can he throw it down the field? Can he perform if the situation dictates throwing 40+ times? He also did not throw guys open as much as others in this draft. The windows in the NFL are smaller in college and if he plays scared we have seen the side effects.
Six weeks ago few if any were talking about McCarthy
in the same tier with the top three. Now many are, but many are not. Penix, Bo Nix and JJ are too close to separate, so don't give up your two 1sts and a 2nd and maybe more to pick one of the three.
There isn't even a solid consensus on the top three.
McCarthy has an excellent chance of being available at 6. Many believe that the top six or seven players taken will all be quarterbacks or wide receivers. But the reporters tend to be copy cats who mostly arrange the same top players around in a different order to be on the safe side.
The teams have been scouting some players for two or three years, and almost certainly at least one will think it's a gift from heaven that they can pick the best offensive lineman or the best defensive lineman or linebacker.
Why are so many in favor of taking an elite wide receiver given their experience with Beckham? He pretty much lived up to expectations and had three fine seasons. But the team record was 6-10 the first two years. The third season they made the playoffs with 11-5 but lost the first playoff game.
Beckham's fourth season was what we see with so many offensive skill players. Like Barkley and Jones he was hurt and played in only a few games and he was never really the same player.
RE: RE: The vibe I get from McCarthy is Alex Smith
I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open.
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
His floor is absolutely not Alex Smith. Alex Smith was a Pro Bowler 3 times. Alex Smith might be most of JJM's ceiling, sure there is a miniscule chance he is much better than that, but unlikely. The problem with JJM is that there are a high pct of outcomes that he is not better than Zach Wilson. I'm excited to move on from Jones and if it has to be McCarthy, so be it, but I like to be realistic. It reminds me of Jones comps back in 2019-2020 and some people were saying on social media that his floor was Kirk Cousins. Well it turns out that Jones is not half the QB that Cousins is.
RE: RE: RE: The vibe I get from McCarthy is Alex Smith
I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy[b] will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open. [/b
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
His floor is absolutely not Alex Smith. Alex Smith was a Pro Bowler 3 times. Alex Smith might be most of JJM's ceiling, sure there is a miniscule chance he is much better than that, but unlikely. The problem with JJM is that there are a high pct of outcomes that he is not better than Zach Wilson. I'm excited to move on from Jones and if it has to be McCarthy, so be it, but I like to be realistic. It reminds me of Jones comps back in 2019-2020 and some people were saying on social media that his floor was Kirk Cousins. Well it turns out that Jones is not half the QB that Cousins is.
I bolded what I meant by his floor being that kind of player. Not his floor being Alex Smith, I apologize for the confusion
RE: RE: RE: RE: The vibe I get from McCarthy is Alex Smith
I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open.
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
His floor is absolutely not Alex Smith. Alex Smith was a Pro Bowler 3 times. Alex Smith might be most of JJM's ceiling, sure there is a miniscule chance he is much better than that, but unlikely. The problem with JJM is that there are a high pct of outcomes that he is not better than Zach Wilson. I'm excited to move on from Jones and if it has to be McCarthy, so be it, but I like to be realistic. It reminds me of Jones comps back in 2019-2020 and some people were saying on social media that his floor was Kirk Cousins. Well it turns out that Jones is not half the QB that Cousins is.
I bolded what I meant by his floor being that kind of player. Not his floor being Alex Smith, I apologize for the confusion
Oops there
I can’t believe the people on this site that quote Rich Eisen
lost me when he started musing that someone might trade for Jones before the trade deadline this year.
......
Some team that lost their starting QB and is in the playoff hunt would absolutely trade for Jones. Jones took an awful NYG to the playoffs, like it or not, it did happen. Put him with a team with a half decent line and more than Isaiah Hodgins at WR and he might be able to win a few games. I know he has issues and I want him gone, but a desperate team would take a chance with him.
RE: I'm just really looking forward to seeing how all 6 of these QBs
He said he's development. So is Drake. They've only started two years and not 4 or 5 like Daniels, Nix and Penix. Said his strengths were scrambling and throwing on the run.
Also find the Alex Smith comps off. His arm is better. Rich Gannon and his name is brought up as a comp too.
Than some of the draft pundits. There is no uniformity of opinion on any of these QBs, including Caleb Williams.
There are plenty of knowledgeable people who love JJM. Just because that is true, that doesn’t mean every fan has to agree, or that their opinion is shit. It also doesn’t mean they hate the player. It means they don’t see it. That’s ok.
If you don’t like Penix, there are plenty of draft guys who think he is elite, including Waldman who has him as his QB2 in this class. If you don’t like Penix, that’s fine. Difference of opinion.
I just don’t get all the hysteria and angst from some posters here when an opinion differs from their own. It is so weird.
Agreed. And the other thing we don't know about these guys is how teams feel about them. The media often gets it wrong. And then there's the reality of how their careers will go --many QBs don't live up to or exceed expectations. So this isn't a fact based business at this point. Everything is opinion.
It is so entertaining watching you dismiss literally everyone that like McCarthy, lol. Completely useless amateur sitting on his couch that pretends he’s a QB guru because he likes college football and dabbles in YouTube videos. They need to make a cartoon out of you 😂
Why should I put any stock what Eisen, a professional broadcaster/entertainer, says about a prospect?
Exactly. Eisen's a shill for the Shield and Michigan.
Couple things that Eisen said are just his opinion.
1. Jones “not being ready until midseason.” By all accounts, Jones will be fine by training camp.
2. “They will love McCarthy and he will love them back.” Well Rich is basically saying that he doesn’t need to start and then when he does eventually start he’s going to be awesome and fans will love him. And that McCarthy will have all these opportunities after playing football. Again, he must not know the Giants/New York fan base that well. There is next to zero patience.
3. He’s using the “32 straight hand offs” and the fact that McCarthy didn’t freak out or get upset about that as a positive. Again, this is a pointless argument.
Zero patience. And Daniel Jones is going into his 6th season and still has defenders. LOL
And the poster you’re replying to is one of them. But the irony of pointing out how impatient Giant fans would be with a new QB is totally lost on Ryan.
What I wonder about is if the info he reported on about the Giants being done with Jones because of the injuries is true. Jones may be strong & tough but he is not reliable.
RE: RE: RE: The vibe I get from McCarthy is Alex Smith
I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open.
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
I think his floor is lower. Only twice as a starter was he asked to throw more than 35 passes in a game and never more than 37. The offense was also more simplistic than what he will have in the NFL. A lot of running game to set up play action and other easy reads. In a 3rd and 15+ can he throw it down the field? Can he perform if the situation dictates throwing 40+ times? He also did not throw guys open as much as others in this draft. The windows in the NFL are smaller in college and if he plays scared we have seen the side effects.
If you think UM’s Offense is simple, you can add that line in for every QB in the draft.
RE: RE: RE: RE: The vibe I get from McCarthy is Alex Smith
I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy[b] will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open. [/b
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
His floor is absolutely not Alex Smith. Alex Smith was a Pro Bowler 3 times. Alex Smith might be most of JJM's ceiling, sure there is a miniscule chance he is much better than that, but unlikely. The problem with JJM is that there are a high pct of outcomes that he is not better than Zach Wilson. I'm excited to move on from Jones and if it has to be McCarthy, so be it, but I like to be realistic. It reminds me of Jones comps back in 2019-2020 and some people were saying on social media that his floor was Kirk Cousins. Well it turns out that Jones is not half the QB that Cousins is.
I bolded what I meant by his floor being that kind of player. Not his floor being Alex Smith, I apologize for the confusion
And JJM doesn't have the high end traits of those four.
But what he has shown is that he can lead a college team to a championship by executing within a system. Could the Giants bring him along within a confined system as he starts to turn the glimpses into superior traits into a fuller NFL arsenal? It's possible. I think he has a lower floor than Williams and Daniels and a higher bust potential. That's why he'll likely be the 4th QB off the board and not the 2nd.
With all these caveats it will still be an exciting move by the Giants. With all the caveats, there is still a sky high upside. And presently, we have no upside at the position.
I think if I'm at 6 and CW, JD and DM are all off the board, I give serious consideration to taking JJM. We might be about to usher in a new era for the G-Men. I know we're ready for it.
100%.
I've repeatedly said McCarthy is more talented than Jones. I just don't think he's dynamic enough for a lottery investment.
Not me...I do not want to blow the 6th pick on something that will never help our team.
We cannot afford to make a mistake here
Quote:
Would you hold your nose and support a McCarthy pick if it prevented, "We've done everything we could to screw this kid up." Year 6.
Not me...I do not want to blow the 6th pick on something that will never help our team.
We cannot afford to make a mistake here
Never help the team? You’re 100% certain?
Holy fuck. Some posters here need a new sport to watch. The complete rooting against a player is just amazingly asinine.
And as someone else said, he's a UM alum.
I'm fine taking Maye or McCarthy at #6, but think both have too many questions to justify trading a ton of draft capital to move up to get, except maybe to #5 for #70. But I do think the Giants will try and aggressively move up to #4 if Maye is still available. I am a lot less certain they would do so for JJM.
1. Jones “not being ready until midseason.” By all accounts, Jones will be fine by training camp.
By what accounts? Jones? A photo of him running with no pads on? I don't think we can say with any certainty if Jones will be fine by training camp or not ready until midseason.
Quote:
Couple things that Eisen said are just his opinion.
1. Jones “not being ready until midseason.” By all accounts, Jones will be fine by training camp.
By what accounts? Jones? A photo of him running with no pads on? I don't think we can say with any certainty if Jones will be fine by training camp or not ready until midseason.
Yes, I agree. I think it's highly dubious that Jones will be ready by the first week.
Classic.
The JJ propaganda machine is out in full force till the very end. Would make Goebbels look like an amateur.
Harbaugh has been quiet lately so expect another pep rally coming from him soon too.
It amazes me how some folks just lock in on an opinion and no matter what anyone else says their opinions stay unwavering..
It's pretty obvious JJM is seen in higher standing with folks in the know more than most here believe..
Quote:
University of Michigan, Bachelor of Arts, 1990.
Classic.
The JJ propaganda machine is out in full force till the very end. Would make Goebbels look like an amateur.
Harbaugh has been quiet lately so expect another pep rally coming from him soon too.
He went really far with that BOA though, you gotta admit ;)
Quote:
In comment 16471433 Sean said:
Quote:
Would you hold your nose and support a McCarthy pick if it prevented, "We've done everything we could to screw this kid up." Year 6.
Not me...I do not want to blow the 6th pick on something that will never help our team.
We cannot afford to make a mistake here
Never help the team? You’re 100% certain?
Holy fuck. Some posters here need a new sport to watch. The complete rooting against a player is just amazingly asinine.
Of course I am not certain...
Odds say he will be a bust,I don't want to chase good money after bad.
Roll with DJ/Lock behind an improved line and fill other needed gaps
None of this QB class strikes me as all pro calliber...Maye has a chance
Teams get frothy over QBs,understandably so.
I'd prefer to trade out to another idiotic team and get 3 or 4 yop 50 picks in return
Quote:
In comment 16471381 bw in dc said:
Quote:
University of Michigan, Bachelor of Arts, 1990.
Classic.
The JJ propaganda machine is out in full force till the very end. Would make Goebbels look like an amateur.
Harbaugh has been quiet lately so expect another pep rally coming from him soon too.
He went really far with that BOA though, you gotta admit ;)
Bank of America?
The one who will succeed the most will be the one who gets quality coaching and the a very good supporting cast.
I’ve said this numerous times - the QB who goes to Minnesota has a leg up on every QB in this draft. It’s just an ideal situation to start.
It amazes me how some folks just lock in on an opinion and no matter what anyone else says their opinions stay unwavering..
It's pretty obvious JJM is seen in higher standing with folks in the know more than most here believe..
In the know? Or just following the bandwagon?
Why can’t someone stand by their opinion until McCarthy puts up some NFL achievements though. Most of these posts anyway are just to balance out the nonsense many of you eat up like flies to shit. If he goes to the Giants I will be hoping for the best he can ever be. Hell, if he replaces Jones asap that alone is a small victory. Until then though, I hope my favorite team goes in a different direction.
QB's bust all the time. Go back ten or so years and see how often they work out. But why draft scared? They will never draft a QB by doing this.
There are plenty of knowledgeable people who love JJM. Just because that is true, that doesn’t mean every fan has to agree, or that their opinion is shit. It also doesn’t mean they hate the player. It means they don’t see it. That’s ok.
If you don’t like Penix, there are plenty of draft guys who think he is elite, including Waldman who has him as his QB2 in this class. If you don’t like Penix, that’s fine. Difference of opinion.
I just don’t get all the hysteria and angst from some posters here when an opinion differs from their own. It is so weird.
Agreed. Aside from the fact that they may not be this high next year, the competition next year for QB won't get any better and arguably might be much tougher. This year, assuming they like all 6 QBs, they really only need to compete with 6 other teams for one of those 6 QBs (Chicago, Washington, NE, Denver, Minnesota and Las Vegas). Next year, I think there are at least 4 teams that will be full on looking for a QB next year (Dallas, NO, TB and LAR) and 7 more teams that reasonably could be looking for a QB (Atlanta, Arizona, Detroit, Tennessee, Pittsburgh, NYJ and Miami). The Giants are here now. Roll the dice and get the QB.
There are plenty of knowledgeable people who love JJM. Just because that is true, that doesn’t mean every fan has to agree, or that their opinion is shit. It also doesn’t mean they hate the player. It means they don’t see it. That’s ok.
If you don’t like Penix, there are plenty of draft guys who think he is elite, including Waldman who has him as his QB2 in this class. If you don’t like Penix, that’s fine. Difference of opinion.
I just don’t get all the hysteria and angst from some posters here when an opinion differs from their own. It is so weird.
It’s the legion of whiny Michigan fans on here.
Quote:
In comment 16471450 ThomasG said:
Quote:
In comment 16471381 bw in dc said:
Quote:
University of Michigan, Bachelor of Arts, 1990.
Classic.
The JJ propaganda machine is out in full force till the very end. Would make Goebbels look like an amateur.
Harbaugh has been quiet lately so expect another pep rally coming from him soon too.
He went really far with that BOA though, you gotta admit ;)
Bank of America?
Bachelors of Arts, duh
There are plenty of knowledgeable people who love JJM. Just because that is true, that doesn’t mean every fan has to agree, or that their opinion is shit. It also doesn’t mean they hate the player. It means they don’t see it. That’s ok.
If you don’t like Penix, there are plenty of draft guys who think he is elite, including Waldman who has him as his QB2 in this class. If you don’t like Penix, that’s fine. Difference of opinion.
I just don’t get all the hysteria and angst from some posters here when an opinion differs from their own. It is so weird.
I'm totally open to differences of opinion, I think the weird thing is speaking in absolutes about these QB prospects. It's all part of the fun though. Will make for great conversation down the road.
*An almost cursed, years long "embarrassing" Offensive Line that was one of the worst in league history last year.
*A bottom 3rd skill group (to be kind) that could arguably be the worst in the league.
They need a #1 WR, a TE, a RB and that is assuming the OL calms down, which it hasn't for years. This certainly is not the ideal situation for a rookie QB (or any QB) to step into.
Quote:
Here said the Mayfield propaganda was in full force back in 2018..
It amazes me how some folks just lock in on an opinion and no matter what anyone else says their opinions stay unwavering..
It's pretty obvious JJM is seen in higher standing with folks in the know more than most here believe..
In the know? Or just following the bandwagon?
Why can’t someone stand by their opinion until McCarthy puts up some NFL achievements though. Most of these posts anyway are just to balance out the nonsense many of you eat up like flies to shit. If he goes to the Giants I will be hoping for the best he can ever be. Hell, if he replaces Jones asap that alone is a small victory. Until then though, I hope my favorite team goes in a different direction.
That's perfectly fine, I for one didn't form my opinion based on others opinions. I like to do my research on players before absorbing any pundits or analysts' info. No prospects are guarantees, but I like him as a prospect. I haven't even listened to Harbaugh speak about him, I also think that talk is hilarious.
Personally, I see him having a higher floor than Penix (due to injuries Penix floor is very low) and Maye (due to his mechanics, footwork and response to pressure in the pocket Maye is very boom or bust). GiantGrit said we won't draft him at 6 anyways, so don't worry everyone. Maybe we can fleece some qb needy team into trading up for him if he's there.
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None of this QB class strikes me as all pro calliber...Maye has a chance
Teams get frothy over QBs,understandably so.
This class will absolutely produce stars and at least one all pro.
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
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I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open.
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
I think his floor is lower. Only twice as a starter was he asked to throw more than 35 passes in a game and never more than 37. The offense was also more simplistic than what he will have in the NFL. A lot of running game to set up play action and other easy reads. In a 3rd and 15+ can he throw it down the field? Can he perform if the situation dictates throwing 40+ times? He also did not throw guys open as much as others in this draft. The windows in the NFL are smaller in college and if he plays scared we have seen the side effects.
There isn't even a solid consensus on the top three.
McCarthy has an excellent chance of being available at 6. Many believe that the top six or seven players taken will all be quarterbacks or wide receivers. But the reporters tend to be copy cats who mostly arrange the same top players around in a different order to be on the safe side.
The teams have been scouting some players for two or three years, and almost certainly at least one will think it's a gift from heaven that they can pick the best offensive lineman or the best defensive lineman or linebacker.
Why are so many in favor of taking an elite wide receiver given their experience with Beckham? He pretty much lived up to expectations and had three fine seasons. But the team record was 6-10 the first two years. The third season they made the playoffs with 11-5 but lost the first playoff game.
Beckham's fourth season was what we see with so many offensive skill players. Like Barkley and Jones he was hurt and played in only a few games and he was never really the same player.
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I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open.
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
His floor is absolutely not Alex Smith. Alex Smith was a Pro Bowler 3 times. Alex Smith might be most of JJM's ceiling, sure there is a miniscule chance he is much better than that, but unlikely. The problem with JJM is that there are a high pct of outcomes that he is not better than Zach Wilson. I'm excited to move on from Jones and if it has to be McCarthy, so be it, but I like to be realistic. It reminds me of Jones comps back in 2019-2020 and some people were saying on social media that his floor was Kirk Cousins. Well it turns out that Jones is not half the QB that Cousins is.
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In comment 16471493 Go Terps said:
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I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy[b] will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open. [/b
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
His floor is absolutely not Alex Smith. Alex Smith was a Pro Bowler 3 times. Alex Smith might be most of JJM's ceiling, sure there is a miniscule chance he is much better than that, but unlikely. The problem with JJM is that there are a high pct of outcomes that he is not better than Zach Wilson. I'm excited to move on from Jones and if it has to be McCarthy, so be it, but I like to be realistic. It reminds me of Jones comps back in 2019-2020 and some people were saying on social media that his floor was Kirk Cousins. Well it turns out that Jones is not half the QB that Cousins is.
I bolded what I meant by his floor being that kind of player. Not his floor being Alex Smith, I apologize for the confusion
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In comment 16471494 BleedBlue46 said:
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In comment 16471493 Go Terps said:
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I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open.
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
His floor is absolutely not Alex Smith. Alex Smith was a Pro Bowler 3 times. Alex Smith might be most of JJM's ceiling, sure there is a miniscule chance he is much better than that, but unlikely. The problem with JJM is that there are a high pct of outcomes that he is not better than Zach Wilson. I'm excited to move on from Jones and if it has to be McCarthy, so be it, but I like to be realistic. It reminds me of Jones comps back in 2019-2020 and some people were saying on social media that his floor was Kirk Cousins. Well it turns out that Jones is not half the QB that Cousins is.
I bolded what I meant by his floor being that kind of player. Not his floor being Alex Smith, I apologize for the confusion
Oops there
......
Some team that lost their starting QB and is in the playoff hunt would absolutely trade for Jones. Jones took an awful NYG to the playoffs, like it or not, it did happen. Put him with a team with a half decent line and more than Isaiah Hodgins at WR and he might be able to win a few games. I know he has issues and I want him gone, but a desperate team would take a chance with him.
I think about this too.
Historically, the likelihood of Williams, Daniels, Maye and McCarthy all making it as credible NFL starters is pretty low.
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Would you hold your nose and support a McCarthy pick if it prevented, "We've done everything we could to screw this kid up." Year 6.
Not me...I do not want to blow the 6th pick on something that will never help our team.
We cannot afford to make a mistake here
All of BBI knows how you feel about JJM. Along with bw in dc, who repeatedly called JJM ‘DJ McCarthy’ on one of the college football game threads.
As to Jones - I continue to think he starts the season on the PUP. He cannot stay healthy.
He said he's development. So is Drake. They've only started two years and not 4 or 5 like Daniels, Nix and Penix. Said his strengths were scrambling and throwing on the run.
Also find the Alex Smith comps off. His arm is better. Rich Gannon and his name is brought up as a comp too.
There are plenty of knowledgeable people who love JJM. Just because that is true, that doesn’t mean every fan has to agree, or that their opinion is shit. It also doesn’t mean they hate the player. It means they don’t see it. That’s ok.
If you don’t like Penix, there are plenty of draft guys who think he is elite, including Waldman who has him as his QB2 in this class. If you don’t like Penix, that’s fine. Difference of opinion.
I just don’t get all the hysteria and angst from some posters here when an opinion differs from their own. It is so weird.
Agreed. And the other thing we don't know about these guys is how teams feel about them. The media often gets it wrong. And then there's the reality of how their careers will go --many QBs don't live up to or exceed expectations. So this isn't a fact based business at this point. Everything is opinion.
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In comment 16471381 bw in dc said:
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University of Michigan, Bachelor of Arts, 1990.
It is so entertaining watching you dismiss literally everyone that like McCarthy, lol. Completely useless amateur sitting on his couch that pretends he’s a QB guru because he likes college football and dabbles in YouTube videos. They need to make a cartoon out of you 😂
Why should I put any stock what Eisen, a professional broadcaster/entertainer, says about a prospect?
Exactly. Eisen's a shill for the Shield and Michigan.
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Couple things that Eisen said are just his opinion.
1. Jones “not being ready until midseason.” By all accounts, Jones will be fine by training camp.
2. “They will love McCarthy and he will love them back.” Well Rich is basically saying that he doesn’t need to start and then when he does eventually start he’s going to be awesome and fans will love him. And that McCarthy will have all these opportunities after playing football. Again, he must not know the Giants/New York fan base that well. There is next to zero patience.
3. He’s using the “32 straight hand offs” and the fact that McCarthy didn’t freak out or get upset about that as a positive. Again, this is a pointless argument.
Zero patience. And Daniel Jones is going into his 6th season and still has defenders. LOL
And the poster you’re replying to is one of them. But the irony of pointing out how impatient Giant fans would be with a new QB is totally lost on Ryan.
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In comment 16471493 Go Terps said:
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I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open.
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
I think his floor is lower. Only twice as a starter was he asked to throw more than 35 passes in a game and never more than 37. The offense was also more simplistic than what he will have in the NFL. A lot of running game to set up play action and other easy reads. In a 3rd and 15+ can he throw it down the field? Can he perform if the situation dictates throwing 40+ times? He also did not throw guys open as much as others in this draft. The windows in the NFL are smaller in college and if he plays scared we have seen the side effects.
If you think UM’s Offense is simple, you can add that line in for every QB in the draft.
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In comment 16471494 BleedBlue46 said:
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In comment 16471493 Go Terps said:
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I think it was Brugler (but I'm not sure) that said McCarthy[b] will take what the defense gives him and not run out of patience doing it. If that's accurate, he could be a good pair with Daboll and what we hope is his ability to scheme people open. [/b
That's not the kind of QB you pay $50M/year, but I'm ok drafting that at 6. It's not my preference but I think we'd probably see immediate improvement in the offense if he started day one.
I think his floor is that kind of player. His ceiling is hard to say because of his limited offense and age. I'll take that.
His floor is absolutely not Alex Smith. Alex Smith was a Pro Bowler 3 times. Alex Smith might be most of JJM's ceiling, sure there is a miniscule chance he is much better than that, but unlikely. The problem with JJM is that there are a high pct of outcomes that he is not better than Zach Wilson. I'm excited to move on from Jones and if it has to be McCarthy, so be it, but I like to be realistic. It reminds me of Jones comps back in 2019-2020 and some people were saying on social media that his floor was Kirk Cousins. Well it turns out that Jones is not half the QB that Cousins is.
I bolded what I meant by his floor being that kind of player. Not his floor being Alex Smith, I apologize for the confusion
Gotcha.. agree with that general assessment.