Would Jones waive his injury clause?

This is not a thread advocating for jones to be the starter, just business side of the injury clause and competition.

I would be shocked if Mara let Schoen propose that and even more shocked if DJ’s agent let him agree to it.

A chance

I still would love to know what compelled Joe to sign off on that injury clause guarantee.

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In comment 16473943 eric2425ny said:

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He wouldn’t. And his agent would never allow it.

Anything he makes at this point is icing on the cake. He doesn’t need to waive an injury clause to protect his career.

In comment 16473940 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:

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I still would love to know what compelled Joe to sign off on that injury clause guarantee.

Seem like it’s just a byproduct of standard negotiation. Would you rather 3 fully or close to fully guaranteed years or this?

He gets the same amount of money if the Giants cut him vs if he doesn’t.

Early, they work out an injury settlement with DJ so he can find a new team. That’s the way the Giants do business. I highly doubt they would put him on the shelf for the season. So they either keep him to play out the season, hope he has a good season and trade him. Cut him at the end of the season.

I don’t think he would waive his injury clause, that wouldn’t be in his best interest.

I’ll gladly profess my ignorance on this, but is an injury clause guarantee common?

No reason or incentive for him to do that. Not happening.

a LTE for Barkley would have been much easier to digest in the event of an injury and in terms of the size of the deal.

He ain’t Stupif

Why would this crack team, who clearly took the Giants to the woodshed, suddenly behave like rubes? They won't.

If the Giants draft a QB, the writing is on the wall in permanent marker, DJ you are not going to be here next year. While that is most likely true either way, this solidifies it from DJ's perceptive.

If I am reading over the cap correctly, cutting him only saves a 750,000 which is nothing in NFL money.

The Giants then say to Jones, we have Lock, Rookie, and Devito. Sorry DJ there is no way we are putting you on the field while you have an injury clause.

So what are the options for Jones at that point.

option 1, sit the whole year and then hit the market with what he has on film and no risk of injury and never be seen since multiple neck injuries and a torn ACL. What would the market be for him?

option 2, waive his clause and get a chance to perform on the field to give him self a chance a better contract for his next team. Chance of getting injured but chance to make even more money.

Am I missing something?

were him?

In comment 16473991 Tom from LI said:

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were him?

Probably, if I am athlete, I would do whatever I could to get back on the field as soon as possible. I already got paid and I want to play. So if signing the paper means I play, then I would sign the waiver.

In comment 16473955 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:

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I’ll gladly profess my ignorance on this, but is an injury clause guarantee common?

In a word, yes

There's no incentive, minus trying to leverage a trade out of NY.

Has no incentive to let them off the hook.

In comment 16473940 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:

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I still would love to know what compelled Joe to sign off on that injury clause guarantee.

It's called "agents." He had no choice other than to let him test FA.

Or maybe he just did it to piss you off.

You have been really vitriolic lately. Relax dude. It’s a forum about sports with a bunch of strangers conversing. It isn’t life or death.

That's ok.

The incentive is the play football.
There are people everyday that do dangerous sports for ZERO money.

This a guy who put hundreds of hours into training, which makes believe he must really like to play football.

What is he is risking by not waiving his injury clause if the Giants tell him they are not going to play him with that clause being there.

I think this is an unique case, but I think it reasonable.

Lets say the Giants draft Maye. If I am Joe, I am totally fine having Lock and Maye as my QBs in 24.

Then it would be Jones' decision if he wants to play in the NFL or not.

In comment 16473955 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:

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I’ll gladly profess my ignorance on this, but is an injury clause guarantee common?

I think it's SOP in the NFL. If I recall correctly, this was a big issue for Denver with Wilson last year.

In comment 16473978 SteelGiant said:

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If the Giants draft a QB, the writing is on the wall in permanent marker, DJ you are not going to be here next year. While that is most likely true either way, this solidifies it from DJ's perceptive. If I am reading over the cap correctly, cutting him only saves a 750,000 which is nothing in NFL money. The Giants then say to Jones, we have Lock, Rookie, and Devito. Sorry DJ there is no way we are putting you on the field while you have an injury clause. So what are the options for Jones at that point. option 1, sit the whole year and then hit the market with what he has on film and no risk of injury and never be seen since multiple neck injuries and a torn ACL. What would the market be for him? option 2, waive his clause and get a chance to perform on the field to give him self a chance a better contract for his next team. Chance of getting injured but chance to make even more money. Am I missing something?

Well said, that’s what I’m thinking as well. Competitor may bet on himself similar to playing out the last year of a contract.

Thanks.

In comment 16474049 Bourne ‘86 said:

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In comment 16473978 SteelGiant said: Quote: If the Giants draft a QB, the writing is on the wall in permanent marker, DJ you are not going to be here next year. While that is most likely true either way, this solidifies it from DJ's perceptive. If I am reading over the cap correctly, cutting him only saves a 750,000 which is nothing in NFL money. The Giants then say to Jones, we have Lock, Rookie, and Devito. Sorry DJ there is no way we are putting you on the field while you have an injury clause. So what are the options for Jones at that point. option 1, sit the whole year and then hit the market with what he has on film and no risk of injury and never be seen since multiple neck injuries and a torn ACL. What would the market be for him? option 2, waive his clause and get a chance to perform on the field to give him self a chance a better contract for his next team. Chance of getting injured but chance to make even more money. Am I missing something? Well said, that’s what I’m thinking as well. Competitor may bet on himself similar to playing out the last year of a contract.

Thanks, yep same page
DJ already has 80 Million dollars
DJ is not going to get the future money from the Giants

So what is left for him to care about?

1. Actually playing football
2. A chance to make more money from another team

Which option allows him to get do both of those things? Waiving the clause

Now if the giants do not draft a QB, then I would at this a little differently possibly.

In comment 16474047 bw in dc said:

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In comment 16473955 SFGFNCGiantsFan said: Quote: I’ll gladly profess my ignorance on this, but is an injury clause guarantee common? I think it's SOP in the NFL. If I recall correctly, this was a big issue for Denver with Wilson last year.

You are right on Wilson. The story was that DEN asked Wilson to waive the guarantee. He said no, so they shut him down for the rest of the season. That cold hearted approach was in the best interest of DEN. I have a feeling that Mara would find such hard ball distasteful and won’t allow Schoen to ask DJ to waive. Real question is, when will DJ get medically cleared to play.

If Jones doesnt waive it, and the Giants dont play him, what is he getting next year?

I would say his is getting a 1 year prove it deal.

So if he waives it, isnt he just betting on himself one year earlier. So that would get him chance to prove himself and get more than a 1 year deal next year from another team?

So instead of being 27 signing a one year deal, then hitting the market at 28. He would be getting a chance of getting a deal at 27. That year difference could be significant.

In comment 16474080 SteelGiant said:

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If Jones doesnt waive it, and the Giants dont play him, what is he getting next year? I would say his is getting a 1 year prove it deal. So if he waives it, isnt he just betting on himself one year earlier. So that would get him chance to prove himself and get more than a 1 year deal next year from another team? So instead of being 27 signing a one year deal, then hitting the market at 28. He would be getting a chance of getting a deal at 27. That year difference could be significant.

Unless of course with his history he gets injured.

In comment 16474068 MojoEd said:

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In comment 16474047 bw in dc said: Quote: In comment 16473955 SFGFNCGiantsFan said: Quote: I’ll gladly profess my ignorance on this, but is an injury clause guarantee common? I think it's SOP in the NFL. If I recall correctly, this was a big issue for Denver with Wilson last year. You are right on Wilson. The story was that DEN asked Wilson to waive the guarantee. He said no, so they shut him down for the rest of the season. That cold hearted approach was in the best interest of DEN. I have a feeling that Mara would find such hard ball distasteful and won’t allow Schoen to ask DJ to waive. Real question is, when will DJ get medically cleared to play.

That’s the other big part of this scenario.. when is he medically cleared? I don’t want to hear anything about grievances. Either cut him or stash him as QB 3 if he doesn’t waive it.

It might be worth it to Jones to waive the clause if he's going to be benched absent waiving it. The waiver would allow Jones a chance to start some more games and perhaps either (a) earn a chance to not get cut and pick up a lot of year 3 money on the contract, or (b) showcase himself and earn more money as a UFA after Giants cut him.

Comparing the case of Jones to Russell Wilson is pretty different.

In comment 16474087 GFAN52 said:

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In comment 16474080 SteelGiant said: Quote: If Jones doesnt waive it, and the Giants dont play him, what is he getting next year? I would say his is getting a 1 year prove it deal. So if he waives it, isnt he just betting on himself one year earlier. So that would get him chance to prove himself and get more than a 1 year deal next year from another team? So instead of being 27 signing a one year deal, then hitting the market at 28. He would be getting a chance of getting a deal at 27. That year difference could be significant. Unless of course with his history he gets injured.

Ok, what is he losing out on if he gets injured, a 1 year vet min deal?

which is the same risk he would be have on that 1 year deal next year.

There's no reason for him to take that risk. Maybe negotiate down.

He is not going to give up a penny of gueatnteed money. Nor should he. No sure I understand how this is even a question.

In comment 16474114 k2tampa said:

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There's no reason for him to take that risk. Maybe negotiate down.

The clause is worthless to him if he's benched.

In comment 16474008 JonC said:

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There's no incentive, minus trying to leverage a trade out of NY.

If the Giants aren't going to play you because of that clause then waiving it would be in your best interest. If you play well you can then use that to make more next year. You can't show you are healthy and good if you don't play.

In comment 16474114 k2tampa said:

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There's no reason for him to take that risk. Maybe negotiate down.

Yes, if the other option is essentially 3rd/4th string.

In comment 16474130 Giant John said:

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He is not going to give up a penny of gueatnteed money. Nor should he. No sure I understand how this is even a question.

He is not giving up a penny at all. That penny is never going to happen is the Giants dont play him.

The injury guarantees his money the year following the year he gets injured.

So he is has in a way already used the clause.
He got hurt in 23 and if he does not pass his physical by day X then his gets his contract guaranteed for 2024. Which is where we are.

If he gets injured in 24, then his contact for 25 is guaranteed. This is the scenario we talking about. So in this Case the Giants would be saying Sorry Daniel we are putting ourselves in that position again, so we drafted a QB and we are not playing you in 24 unless you waive the clause because we are paying your 2025 contact. We already have a different QB in 2025 so this risk is not worth it us anymore. However, if you want to play in order for other teams to see what you have, then waive you clause and we will play you

In comment 16474139 Bourne ‘86 said:

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In comment 16474114 k2tampa said: Quote: There's no reason for him to take that risk. Maybe negotiate down. Yes, if the other option is essentially 3rd/4th string.

As opposed to getting a career ending injury and getting cut with nothing to show for it? Glad you're not my retirement advisor.
He negotiated that for a reason, and after last season's injuries it turns out it was a pretty smart move.

so my guess is that they'll be dumb enough to play him next season and hope for the best.

In comment 16474177 Jim in Tampa said:

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so my guess is that they'll be dumb enough to play him next season and hope for the best.

Hate to say it but this is exactly how I feel.

Jones is on the Giants for the 2024 season. If for no other reason, the impact to the salary cap is probably too great for the team to absorb at this point.

In comment 16473978 SteelGiant said:

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If the Giants draft a QB, the writing is on the wall in permanent marker, DJ you are not going to be here next year. While that is most likely true either way, this solidifies it from DJ's perceptive. If I am reading over the cap correctly, cutting him only saves a 750,000 which is nothing in NFL money. The Giants then say to Jones, we have Lock, Rookie, and Devito. Sorry DJ there is no way we are putting you on the field while you have an injury clause. So what are the options for Jones at that point. option 1, sit the whole year and then hit the market with what he has on film and no risk of injury and never be seen since multiple neck injuries and a torn ACL. What would the market be for him? option 2, waive his clause and get a chance to perform on the field to give him self a chance a better contract for his next team. Chance of getting injured but chance to make even more money. Am I missing something?

I don't think you are reading it right. If Daniel Jones is cut, his guaranteed money for 2024 ($36m) becomes dead cap and another $21.5m of his remaining prorated signing bonus accelerates to the 2024 salary cap. Right now the team has $5.5m in space, they would have to clear enough to cover the $21.5m, sign their draft picks, and have a buffer for the upcoming season.

In comment 16474164 k2tampa said:

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In comment 16474139 Bourne ‘86 said: Quote: In comment 16474114 k2tampa said: Quote: There's no reason for him to take that risk. Maybe negotiate down. Yes, if the other option is essentially 3rd/4th string. As opposed to getting a career ending injury and getting cut with nothing to show for it? Glad you're not my retirement advisor. He negotiated that for a reason, and after last season's injuries it turns out it was a pretty smart move.

What if I told you that not waiving the clause is just as career ending, you don't play this year there is a good chance you never play in the league again.

Some team will sign you as a backup for a million dollars and you still could get a career ending injury. Because we have not seen you play since your second neck injury and a torn ACL. If you waive the class you get to start at least 6 games and then another team could sign you to be their starter.

DJ is already getting the money guaranteed to him there is no loss of money because you are never going to get the opportunity.

This could be the harsh reality for Jones, and I think that is good advice.

In comment 16474008 JonC said:

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There's no incentive, minus trying to leverage a trade out of NY.

it would not surprise me if Jones demanded a trade or release if they take a QB in the first. In such a case he may need to agree to waive injury clause.

Though I think Jones is banking on getting released after the season regardless of what else happens to hit the open market. I think he knows as well as everyone else that his cap hit in 2025 is not affordable. So either he gets new guarantees from the Giants as an extension or get released.

In comment 16474308 Hades07 said:

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In comment 16474008 JonC said: Quote: There's no incentive, minus trying to leverage a trade out of NY. it would not surprise me if Jones demanded a trade or release if they take a QB in the first. In such a case he may need to agree to waive injury clause. Though I think Jones is banking on getting released after the season regardless of what else happens to hit the open market. I think he knows as well as everyone else that his cap hit in 2025 is not affordable. So either he gets new guarantees from the Giants as an extension or get released.

No one is trading for a QB of his current caliber with his contract and his injury history.

Which is why it would be his best interest to waive the clause he can play while the rookie learns.

Also speaking about career ending, how do you think this looks from Joe S camp, if Jones plays and gets hurt, Joe S is toast in this league

If he plays well and we have a good season then he gets the $30M base salary next year - we won’t cut him. If we decide not to play him with the injury guarantee then he gets a 1-year backup deal which will probably by <$5M.

He has over $25M on the line if we play hardball with him - that’s a lot to lose and a lot of incentive to work something out.

Draft qb at 6, then he’s playing. There is no competition.

Draft qb at 6, then he’s playing. There is no competition.

In comment 16474426 Ron Johnson said:

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Draft qb at 6, then he’s playing. There is no competition.

I think Lock will be starting if we draft a QB.

Our o-line coach is new, we have new lineman everywhere, and Neal and Schmidt to figure their shit out.

I would prefer lock to be in there while they do that.

Hopefully 6 games they look competent. Then the rookie

Include his being tripped by a blade of grass on the 8 yard line?
Just askin....