It sounds like one or both of Vikings/Broncos will be jumping the Giants for quarterbacks. Haven't seen it mentioned, but maybe we could make a deal with one of them if NE (or one of Vikings/Broncos) takes Maye and JJM is there at 6?
I'd prefer to take JJM if he's there, but I could see Schoen wanting to trade down in that scenario.
Not sure what to believe right now (kudos to Schoen), but it does seem like indications are that the Giants will stay put and take a receiver or trade down. The rumors of them moving up seem to have died down.
Who is your ideal team for a trade down? And what would you want?
Sit tight and take the next Larry Fitzgerald, or get an absolute haul of picks.
You listen to the offers and react.
If the offer is underwhelming, you stand pat and take the WR.
If they offer you a tremendous deal, you trade down, and possibly maneuver for Penix or Nix.
Or you acquire draft capital to move up in 2025.
You listen to the offers and react.
If the offer is underwhelming, you stand pat and take the WR.
If they offer you a tremendous deal, you trade down, and possibly maneuver for Penix or Nix.
Or you acquire draft capital to move up in 2025.
Well, yes, you are correct that fans can't decide that lol. I was just trying to spur a discussion. I'll delete if you don't think it's one worth having.
If the Broncos did offer the Giants #12, next year's #1, and Surtain, you take that offer.
If the Broncos did offer the Giants #12, next year's #1, and Surtain, you take that offer.
If that deal from the Broncos were real you take that in a heartbeat.
You also have to keep in mind though, it's entirely possible that is exactly what he wants other teams trying to jump the Giants to think
If the Broncos did offer the Giants #12, next year's #1, and Surtain, you take that offer.
100% this. If you don't absolutely love McCarthy and that's the offer, take it and don't look back. (Then I would try to swing back up and snag Odunze at 8, but that's just me.)
I agree. One, if he is telling the truth then he gave a lot of details into that and he isn't just saying it to say it. Two, if he isn't telling the truth then he's trying to create a market for the pick.
I've been saying for awhile that if they can't move up, they should move down. This is a pretty deep draft and taking a WR in our current state doesn't make a ton of sense. Collect assets for next year when we'll need to make a move for a QB and continue building the lines in the meantime.
Your idea of a “reach” is possibly not remotely close to what the Giants may or may not consider a reach. You have less than zero idea of how the Giants feel about the QBs and where they think they should go
Quote:
press conference, I'm more convinced Schoen is strongly considering trading down.
You also have to keep in mind though, it's entirely possible that is exactly what he wants other teams trying to jump the Giants to think
I've taken that into account (see my post in the pinned thread above about the presser).
I agree, me too. It's that, but it's also the desperation of teams behind us. I get the sense they are in throw the charts out the window mode to get their hands on one of these guys.
Joe Schoen:
“We’re not one or two players away.”
Quote:
press conference, I'm more convinced Schoen is strongly considering trading down.
You also have to keep in mind though, it's entirely possible that is exactly what he wants other teams trying to jump the Giants to think
+1
I was thinking the sane thing. In fact, one reason to mention all the action at 6 already is to drive up the cost- create competition..
I still think we are locked in on Maye but no way of knowing if he will bevthere for them.
I disagree. There are a bunch.
Penix
Nix
Sinnot
Turner
Robinson
McKinstry
And more
Actually, Sy'56 e-mailed me a couple of days ago saying that he felt the team was looking at a bunch of players with their 30 visits that are currently in the no-man's land between our two picks.
If we pair Odunze with Daniel Jones his career will look more like Laquan Treadwill than Jerry Rice. This team needs a quarterback.
Quote:
if you look at their top 30 visits there aren't many guys projected to go mid to late 1st round
Actually, Sy'56 e-mailed me a couple of days ago saying that he felt the team was looking at a bunch of players with their 30 visits that are currently in the no-man's land between our two picks.
I've noticed this as well. They've had a ton of visits with guys that will go in the first round but not top 10.
@rydunleavy
TAKEAWAY: Overvalued self-assessments have been a problem for #Giants for a decade.
Joe Schoen sounded today like he sees the roster for what it is. That's a good thing.
"I think we're not one player away or two players"
+
"We’ve gotten a lot of (trade) calls from people behind us"
=
could be laying groundwork to trade down and fill more holes if the desired QB is not available.
I didn't think #nygiants would pass on a WR at 6 until recently. Now I wonder if a 3-for-1 package that produces a starting WR, starting DB and Bo Nix could be tempting.
Remember, Schoen admitted that he sped up the rebuild last year after signing Daniel Jones to the $160M extension.
Jerry Rice career With Lock and Jones as QB's. Yeah right.
Quote:
Odunze at #6. There's no way he lasts past da Bears at 9, or, GASP, the Jets at 10. I see a Jerry Rice-type career for him, with us.
If we pair Odunze with Daniel Jones his career will look more like Laquan Treadwill than Jerry Rice. This team needs a quarterback.
Odunze is a *much* better athlete than Treadwell, and there's a pretty small chance at this point that Jones is the QB in 2025. This can take more than one year to solve.
I think this is extremely viable. I think Penix is on the table in a trade back. Get and additional 2nd or 3rd this year and next years 1 or 2 from some team. Pick up Penix and a WR or DT in the 2nd. They need quality players from day 2 and as light trade back would help.
same here, and I hope so
Because maybe at 12 you also get another second round pick or a second round pick in next years draft.
You listen to the offers and react.
If the offer is underwhelming, you stand pat and take the WR.
If they offer you a tremendous deal, you trade down, and possibly maneuver for Penix or Nix.
Or you acquire draft capital to move up in 2025.
That's my preference eight now, for Penix not Nix.
Because if you can get him at 12, why do you take him at six?
Medicals.
Quote:
My question would be if you can draft Penix at 12, why can't you draft him at 6?
Because maybe at 12 you also get another second round pick or a second round pick in next years draft.
If they are trading up for JJM you could get a 2025 1st and a day 2 pick, the Broncos have a 2nd this year though. Just 76.
Quote:
My question would be if you can draft Penix at 12, why can't you draft him at 6?
Because maybe at 12 you also get another second round pick or a second round pick in next years draft.
So you don't want Penix to be the Giants QB, unless we get an additional second round pick next year. Then you do?
Do you imagine his success as the Giants QB hinges on that 2025 second round pick?
But I have some difficulty seeing the Giants replacing an injury-prone QB with another one.
If Penix didn't have the medicals, he would go before McCarthy.
Quote:
In comment 16474341 Go Terps said:
Quote:
My question would be if you can draft Penix at 12, why can't you draft him at 6?
Because maybe at 12 you also get another second round pick or a second round pick in next years draft.
So you don't want Penix to be the Giants QB, unless we get an additional second round pick next year. Then you do?
Do you imagine his success as the Giants QB hinges on that 2025 second round pick?
It would be a 2025 1st from a team that will most likely be top 5 or top 10 worst in the league next year
I thought that too, but then I thought, if he likes Penix, he wants other teams to think that.
He said they eliminated very few players and how player plays after injuries is very important to them. I would not exclude Penix based on his comments. At this point, if we could trade down and get Penix I'm all for it.
As for trading down to take Penix, the idea is given his medical you hedge your bet by getting additional assets in case it doesn’t work out. You don’t get those assets if you take him at 6.
Who's more likely to get hurt? Penix, or say Jayden Daniels who runs like he's looking for a truck to collide with?
Easy, he is not worth the #6 pick. He has too many issues. He is, in reality a day 2 pick. If Bo Nix is able to be drafted at 47, why not draft him at #6? Same thing.
We can go round and round on semantics all day long. But you very well know Penix is not a top 6 talent in this draft. I like Penix, but why would you draft him at 6 when you can trade back to #12(for example) and get him along with a #2 and next year #2 or maybe even a #1? That is how yo leverage a draft and fill the roster.
Easier - Should Brock Purdy have been drafted in the 1st or 2nd round? His play says he should have been. But his rating was late day 3 or UDFA.
Who's more likely to get hurt? Penix, or say Jayden Daniels who runs like he's looking for a truck to collide with?
I hear what you are saying. And it has merit. But the guy has had two ACLs and two shoulder injuries that ended four seasons.
Quote:
My question would be if you can draft Penix at 12, why can't you draft him at 6?
Easy, he is not worth the #6 pick. He has too many issues. He is, in reality a day 2 pick. If Bo Nix is able to be drafted at 47, why not draft him at #6? Same thing.
We can go round and round on semantics all day long. But you very well know Penix is not a top 6 talent in this draft. I like Penix, but why would you draft him at 6 when you can trade back to #12(for example) and get him along with a #2 and next year #2 or maybe even a #1? That is how yo leverage a draft and fill the roster.
Easier - Should Brock Purdy have been drafted in the 1st or 2nd round? His play says he should have been. But his rating was late day 3 or UDFA.
If they really want JJM it would be Surtain and a 2025 1st. They don't have a 2nd this year
Quote:
He threw more passes than anyone else in that time. He's a pocket passer and excels at getting the ball out quickly and decisively.
Who's more likely to get hurt? Penix, or say Jayden Daniels who runs like he's looking for a truck to collide with?
I hear what you are saying. And it has merit. But the guy has had two ACLs and two shoulder injuries that ended four seasons.
Yeah, I don't see us taking him at 6. That's why it was my pick for the surprise pick at 6. It would shock me and excite me at the same time.
Quote:
In comment 16474341 Go Terps said:
Quote:
My question would be if you can draft Penix at 12, why can't you draft him at 6?
Because maybe at 12 you also get another second round pick or a second round pick in next years draft.
So you don't want Penix to be the Giants QB, unless we get an additional second round pick next year. Then you do?
Do you imagine his success as the Giants QB hinges on that 2025 second round pick?
It is not his success, but the future success of the team. If you can get him at 12 for an additional #2 or #3 this year and next years #2 or possibly #1, that definitely increases the chances of future success. More premium picks increases the chance of getting better players and improving the roster.
7 days, bud.
I like Jaxon Dart and Cam Ward personally. Idk where they will go, but they are my two favorites currently.
If a team trades up in front of us we could still beat their offer and come away with extra draft capital vs taking him at 6.
Quote:
but endorsing it at 12, while also ignoring the risk of him potentially being gone at 12.
If a team trades up in front of us we could still beat their offer and come away with extra draft capital vs taking him at 6.
That argument hinges on all things working out in our favor with no mistakes made. There is no way a GM looking for a top QB prospect is going to punt a sure thing for a maybe.
No matter where you draft a QB, all that matters is the results
Its like the people who think the Giants should have drafted Jones at 17 but not 6. Would you somehow be happier with his 22 wins in 5 seasons because we got him a few picks later?
He’s going to need a solid line on the right side and if he suffers a career ending injury, The owners and most of the fan base will want them gone, especially if DJ has a halfway decent career as a game manager type qb.
Quote:
In comment 16474412 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
but endorsing it at 12, while also ignoring the risk of him potentially being gone at 12.
If a team trades up in front of us we could still beat their offer and come away with extra draft capital vs taking him at 6.
That argument hinges on all things working out in our favor with no mistakes made. There is no way a GM looking for a top QB prospect is going to punt a sure thing for a maybe.
This situation is based on them not being able to get their guy and liking Penix but not seeing him as a sure thing due to injury history. Without the injury history he would be a top 3 pick. I want a QB so bad that I would take Penix AT 6, but I don't think Schoen would.
Quote:
In comment 16474415 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16474412 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
but endorsing it at 12, while also ignoring the risk of him potentially being gone at 12.
If a team trades up in front of us we could still beat their offer and come away with extra draft capital vs taking him at 6.
That argument hinges on all things working out in our favor with no mistakes made. There is no way a GM looking for a top QB prospect is going to punt a sure thing for a maybe.
This situation is based on them not being able to get their guy and liking Penix but not seeing him as a sure thing due to injury history. Without the injury history he would be a top 3 pick. I want a QB so bad that I would probably take Penix AT 6, but I don't think Schoen would.
It's a great point.
But we all know the problem with Penix. I just watched Fowler say he could go anywhere from the teens to day two.
I could see him go as high a 6.
However, if you trade down, and acquire more draft capital, it would take the sting out of him tearing his ACL the third time.
I just don't feel terribly comfortable taking him at #6.
But I have some difficulty seeing the Giants replacing an injury-prone QB with another one.
If Penix didn't have the medicals, he would go before McCarthy.
That is a stretch..
Quote:
discount Penix at six.
But I have some difficulty seeing the Giants replacing an injury-prone QB with another one.
If Penix didn't have the medicals, he would go before McCarthy.
That is a stretch..
I'm a big JJM fan, and I can say without a doubt without the medicals Penix would be ahead of JJM and probably a top 3 pick. That's why he could be worth the risk. He's as a legit of a passer as you'll find in the draft.
Quote:
discount Penix at six.
But I have some difficulty seeing the Giants replacing an injury-prone QB with another one.
If Penix didn't have the medicals, he would go before McCarthy.
That is a stretch..
A stretch? Take away the medicals and Penix blows away what McCarthy has done in terms of passing the ball, arm strength, and productivity.
He’s going to need a solid line on the right side and if he suffers a career ending injury, The owners and most of the fan base will want them gone, especially if DJ has a halfway decent career as a game manager type qb.
Why is his wearing a knee brace an issue? Actually it is smart. Why not take additional protection?
DJ is not going to have a decent career with the Giants.
So you don't see a scenario where Joe Schoen would take Penix later in the draft?
We'll agree to disagree.
That's valid, but there's a big difference between Penix at 6 and Penix plus the Broncos 2025 1st and maybe Surtain or 2025 2nd.
Who's more likely to get hurt? Penix, or say Jayden Daniels who runs like he's looking for a truck to collide with?
Yep, he is going to be 4 years removed from his knee injuries when camp starts. There has to be a point where it is not an issue any more.
But what scares teams is what Fowler just said on Eisen's show. He said some teams feel the injuries won't be a huge problem but he will have to be "managed" because of them. So in other words, some of these past injuries still may even impact how he practices.
Quote:
In comment 16474268 Strahan91 said:
Quote:
if you look at their top 30 visits there aren't many guys projected to go mid to late 1st round
Actually, Sy'56 e-mailed me a couple of days ago saying that he felt the team was looking at a bunch of players with their 30 visits that are currently in the no-man's land between our two picks.
I've noticed this as well. They've had a ton of visits with guys that will go in the first round but not top 10.
Agreed.
Quote:
IMO
So you don't see a scenario where Joe Schoen would take Penix later in the draft?
We'll agree to disagree.
Yes, in the 2nd or via trade up back into the first if he falls. I don’t see a scenario where he doesn’t like him at 6 and trades down thinking he can pick up an extra pick and sneak in his new QB at 12.
Can that happen? I guess. But that’s a hell of a gamble if you actually like the player and have a 1st round grade on him with a few QB needy teams picking between 6-11 or right after within striking distance of a trade up.
Quote:
As good as he is, Read that he wears a brace and intends to keep doing so.
He’s going to need a solid line on the right side and if he suffers a career ending injury, The owners and most of the fan base will want them gone, especially if DJ has a halfway decent career as a game manager type qb.
Why is his wearing a knee brace an issue? Actually it is smart. Why not take additional protection?
DJ is not going to have a decent career with the Giants.
To me, I just feel it will somewhat limit his movement.
I do agree that DJ won’t have a decent year here. However I think if he ends up with a team that doesn’t ask him to do much he might be ok.
My preferences are
1) Drake Maye
2) Trade down to a team that wants JJM, hopefully a trade where we can potentially get a top 5 2025 pick, broncos rumor sounds good and get a project qb later in the draft
3) one of the top wr’s minus Nabers,
Quote:
He threw more passes than anyone else in that time. He's a pocket passer and excels at getting the ball out quickly and decisively.
Who's more likely to get hurt? Penix, or say Jayden Daniels who runs like he's looking for a truck to collide with?
Yep, he is going to be 4 years removed from his knee injuries when camp starts. There has to be a point where it is not an issue any more.
10+ years ago it would be a real issue, surgeries have exponentially evolved so much that it's different nowadays. Even after 2 acl surgeries and individual could potentially have a stronger acl than they did before their first acl tear.
Quote:
In comment 16474392 Go Terps said:
Quote:
He threw more passes than anyone else in that time. He's a pocket passer and excels at getting the ball out quickly and decisively.
Who's more likely to get hurt? Penix, or say Jayden Daniels who runs like he's looking for a truck to collide with?
Yep, he is going to be 4 years removed from his knee injuries when camp starts. There has to be a point where it is not an issue any more.
10+ years ago it would be a real issue, surgeries have exponentially evolved so much that it's different nowadays. Even after 2 acl surgeries and individual could potentially have a stronger acl than they did before their first acl tear.
He is at a 20% greater risk of having another ACL on that same right knee then if he hadn't already had two grade 3 ACL's on his right knee. You can't undo his prior injuries even if he's been lucky in the last 4 college seasons. Now you are talking about the NFL, with bigger, faster and stronger defensive players against a Giant OL that has been far below average over the last few years. No way do I take that risk with the 6th pick.
I think we'd have to draft JJM (presumably who Denver wants at 6) and wait to see if Penix is still available when Denver picks. And even that's risky because you could get "stuck" with JJM.
Quote:
My question would be if you can draft Penix at 12, why can't you draft him at 6?
Because maybe at 12 you also get another second round pick or a second round pick in next years draft.
If 6 to 12 you better be getting a lot more than a 2nd round pick
Quote:
In comment 16474469 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
In comment 16474392 Go Terps said:
Quote:
He threw more passes than anyone else in that time. He's a pocket passer and excels at getting the ball out quickly and decisively.
Who's more likely to get hurt? Penix, or say Jayden Daniels who runs like he's looking for a truck to collide with?
Yep, he is going to be 4 years removed from his knee injuries when camp starts. There has to be a point where it is not an issue any more.
10+ years ago it would be a real issue, surgeries have exponentially evolved so much that it's different nowadays. Even after 2 acl surgeries and individual could potentially have a stronger acl than they did before their first acl tear.
He is at a 20% greater risk of having another ACL on that same right knee then if he hadn't already had two grade 3 ACL's on his right knee. You can't undo his prior injuries even if he's been lucky in the last 4 college seasons. Now you are talking about the NFL, with bigger, faster and stronger defensive players against a Giant OL that has been far below average over the last few years. No way do I take that risk with the 6th pick.
93.2% of stats are made up.
Quote:
In comment 16474488 BleedBlue46 said:
Quote:
In comment 16474469 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
In comment 16474392 Go Terps said:
Quote:
He threw more passes than anyone else in that time. He's a pocket passer and excels at getting the ball out quickly and decisively.
Who's more likely to get hurt? Penix, or say Jayden Daniels who runs like he's looking for a truck to collide with?
Yep, he is going to be 4 years removed from his knee injuries when camp starts. There has to be a point where it is not an issue any more.
10+ years ago it would be a real issue, surgeries have exponentially evolved so much that it's different nowadays. Even after 2 acl surgeries and individual could potentially have a stronger acl than they did before their first acl tear.
He is at a 20% greater risk of having another ACL on that same right knee then if he hadn't already had two grade 3 ACL's on his right knee. You can't undo his prior injuries even if he's been lucky in the last 4 college seasons. Now you are talking about the NFL, with bigger, faster and stronger defensive players against a Giant OL that has been far below average over the last few years. No way do I take that risk with the 6th pick.
93.2% of stats are made up.
He's also implying the size and speed of defenders plays a part in ACL injuries when most are non-contact.
He has too much risk for where he will be drafted. But we have the same risks already sticking with Jones so maybe you can look past it.
Prefer to draft the stud WR and then work for a QB later, if it ends up Penix we better be readyt to do this again in 2 year.
Quote:
In comment 16474341 Go Terps said:
Quote:
My question would be if you can draft Penix at 12, why can't you draft him at 6?
Because maybe at 12 you also get another second round pick or a second round pick in next years draft.
If 6 to 12 you better be getting a lot more than a 2nd round pick
According to the charts, 6 to 12 is almost exactly a 2nd round pick - about 400 points.
So a 2nd and next years 2nd is a good deal.
This is like criticizing Reggie Miller's shooting form.
Quote:
In comment 16474349 LW_Giants said:
Quote:
In comment 16474341 Go Terps said:
Quote:
My question would be if you can draft Penix at 12, why can't you draft him at 6?
Because maybe at 12 you also get another second round pick or a second round pick in next years draft.
If 6 to 12 you better be getting a lot more than a 2nd round pick
According to the charts, 6 to 12 is almost exactly a 2nd round pick - about 400 points.
So a 2nd and next years 2nd is a good deal.
Those charts are useless for 1st rd picks, especially when a qb is involved. According to that logic, we could get pick 4 for pick 70 and 6 and that would even be overpaying or we could get pick 3 for pick 6, 47 and 70 (and that would be an overpay too).
If the Broncos did offer the Giants #12, next year's #1, and Surtain, you take that offer.
That’s a no brainer for the Giants but I’m also not a fan of McCarthy at all.
But even if the giants had 2 high 1sts next year, nothing is guaranteed in terms of being able to trade up for a QB. Look at this years top 3- the teams have to be willing to trade down. It’s not always what you can offer.
And there isn't a great comeback for saying if you are going to take him at 12, why don't you take him at 6?
That's why I do think there is a possibility he could be in play at 6.
Again, it depends on the medicals.
Inconsistent over the middle
Poor footwork
Not mobile.
Struggles to throw on the run.
These things are imperative in todays games.
And there isn't a great comeback for saying if you are going to take him at 12, why don't you take him at 6?
That's why I do think there is a possibility he could be in play at 6.
Again, it depends on the medicals.
medical when major injuries concerned always a big if and the lack of mobility is a significant differentiator.
any QB who doesn't run is playing a significantly harder game than any qb who can run. even herbert/stroud run a little (200ish yards, a few carries per game, 1 first down per game, 4+ ypc). penix has been a total non-runner the last 4 years around or under 2 ypc.
Quote:
but endorsing it at 12, while also ignoring the risk of him potentially being gone at 12.
It's a great point.
But we all know the problem with Penix. I just watched Fowler say he could go anywhere from the teens to day two.
I could see him go as high a 6.
However, if you trade down, and acquire more draft capital, it would take the sting out of him tearing his ACL the third time.
I just don't feel terribly comfortable taking him at #6.
The penix at 6 takes are going to age like milk come next Sunday
I'll have what he's having.
Maybe Penix has more arm strength but McCarthys is plenty strong enough
Maybe Penix has more arm strength but McCarthys is plenty strong enough
There's plenty of guys that can throw a football hard or far. Kyle Boller's "kneel at the 50" stunt comes to mind. Give me the guy that has done it accurately in games time and again.
Penix slings it no doubt, McCarthy has plenty of arm strength. He does need to adjust his throwing motion though. It's his biggest area to work on I think.
Quote:
The guys that throw the out patterns accurately and on time - that's arm strength. And at the Combine Penix was ahead of everybody. Milton included.
Penix slings it no doubt, McCarthy has plenty of arm strength. He does need to adjust his throwing motion though. It's his biggest area to work on I think.
I thought McCarthy looked the best, after Penix. One thing about McCarthy is his deep ball isn't great.
Quote:
In comment 16474755 Go Terps said:
Quote:
The guys that throw the out patterns accurately and on time - that's arm strength. And at the Combine Penix was ahead of everybody. Milton included.
Penix slings it no doubt, McCarthy has plenty of arm strength. He does need to adjust his throwing motion though. It's his biggest area to work on I think.
I thought McCarthy looked the best, after Penix. One thing about McCarthy is his deep ball isn't great.
Yeah, I think his issues can all be alleviated with an improved throwing motion like how Josh Allen did. He had similar issues with touch and accuracy on the intermediate to deep throws. I think this is something teams see with JJM, some teams think he could take exponential strides with a rehoned throwing motion. Sounds like we don't want him anyways, so it won't matter for us. I'd much rather get Penix than trade a haul for Maye.
Inconsistent over the middle
Poor footwork
Not mobile.
Struggles to throw on the run.
These things are imperative in todays games.
I don't feel great about McCarthy, but he has more dimensions than Penix. He's much more athletic and accomplished off-script.
And while I wouldn't touch McCarthy in the lottery and probably not round one, I definitely wouldn't touch Penix in the first round.
He can hum it, but that one dimension isn't worth a big investment in today's game where a dual-threat is much more valuable.
It's about value, and weighing against the risk of his medicals. If you work out the scenarios and felt Penix will be there at #12, walking away with Surtain Jr and Penix (if he's a target and you're ok with his medicals) is a no-brainer. Obviously, there's scenarios where it could be too cute, but that's the rationale. Value and impact.
I'd be happy if we ended up with Penix, although my only caveat is that the perceived value is 6 is too high. I'd hope they could drop down, add picks and still get him.
Didn’t Chad Pennington throw accurate out-routes that were on-time?
Quote:
The guys that throw the out patterns accurately and on time - that's arm strength. And at the Combine Penix was ahead of everybody. Milton included.
Didn’t Chad Pennington throw accurate out-routes that were on-time?
Not in my memory. If he did, he has to throw them really early. A 10 yard out, if the QB is 5 yards behind the LOS between the hashes, requires a 30 yard throw. Not an easy throw on a line.
Quote:
In comment 16474755 Go Terps said:
Quote:
The guys that throw the out patterns accurately and on time - that's arm strength. And at the Combine Penix was ahead of everybody. Milton included.
Didn’t Chad Pennington throw accurate out-routes that were on-time?
Not in my memory. If he did, he has to throw them really early. A 10 yard out, if the QB is 5 yards behind the LOS between the hashes, requires a 30 yard throw. Not an easy throw on a line.
gotcha, I don't remember it being a detriment to his game (not a strength). I am not trying to nit-pick. To me, arm strength is made up of velocity and the distance a player can throw accurately. Arm talent on the other hand in my view describes a player that uses both their mind and arm to accurately deliver passes that are also on-time. Players like Kerry Collins had very good arm strength, but his anticipation was not the best in my view which lead to passes arriving with a high velocity or at a great distance, but perhaps late and somewhat inaccurate.
Pennington was very good anticipating the defense and his wide receivers which helped make up for his lack of velocity and throwing distance. Anyway, not important. Just a different view.
Quote:
The guys that throw the out patterns accurately and on time - that's arm strength. And at the Combine Penix was ahead of everybody. Milton included.
Didn’t Chad Pennington throw accurate out-routes that were on-time?
He was a noodle arm, at least as compared to NFL QBs
The odds have come back towards even from at one point, -300
@prettyrickey213
BREAKING: Hearing from reputable sources that Jayden Daniels is actively trying to tank his draft stock because he wants to play for Antonio Pierce in LV. I still believe he ends up in Washington but think this is why the betting markets are acting kooky. #HTTC #RaiderNation
Quote:
Rickey
@prettyrickey213
BREAKING: Hearing from reputable sources that Jayden Daniels is actively trying to tank his draft stock because he wants to play for Antonio Pierce in LV. I still believe he ends up in Washington but think this is why the betting markets are acting kooky. #HTTC #RaiderNation
I love Rickey, but is this a fallback for him if JD doesn't go 3 he can use this to explain why his guarantee was wrong? I'm not seeing how JD is tanking his draft stock?
I don’t really believe this, but it would be hilarious if true.
Quote:
Quote:
Rickey
@prettyrickey213
BREAKING: Hearing from reputable sources that Jayden Daniels is actively trying to tank his draft stock because he wants to play for Antonio Pierce in LV. I still believe he ends up in Washington but think this is why the betting markets are acting kooky. #HTTC #RaiderNation
I love Rickey, but is this a fallback for him if JD doesn't go 3 he can use this to explain why his guarantee was wrong? I'm not seeing how JD is tanking his draft stock?
Nobody is tanking their draft positioning and in the process costing themselves millions because they want a particular team
Quote:
Rickey
@prettyrickey213
BREAKING: Hearing from reputable sources that Jayden Daniels is actively trying to tank his draft stock because he wants to play for Antonio Pierce in LV. I still believe he ends up in Washington but think this is why the betting markets are acting kooky. #HTTC #RaiderNation
LOL. This news came out YESTERDAY from Schrager.
what is he saying, several points have been made above.
Quote:
.
what is he saying, several points have been made above.
Daniels still favorite for washington, but there is some stuff going on behind the scenes. Something like that.
Quote:
In comment 16475404 Sean said:
Quote:
.
what is he saying, several points have been made above.
Daniels still favorite for washington, but there is some stuff going on behind the scenes. Something like that.
thanks..
Quote:
.
what is he saying, several points have been made above.
Daniels has doubts about playing in WSH.
Inconsistent over the middle
Poor footwork
Not mobile.
Struggles to throw on the run.
These things are imperative in todays games.
Quote:
He threw more passes than anyone else in that time. He's a pocket passer and excels at getting the ball out quickly and decisively.
Who's more likely to get hurt? Penix, or say Jayden Daniels who runs like he's looking for a truck to collide with?
Yep, he is going to be 4 years removed from his knee injuries when camp starts. There has to be a point where it is not an issue any more.
Now, I'm not saying he will be. But, it is a possibility. My take hasn't wavered on him. I have felt all year that he has the highest ceiling of any QB this draft, including Williams and Daniels. His ability to get rid of the ball, throw it deep, make quick decisions, etc. are where that comes from. Hoewer, I also feel he has the lowest floor of any of the top 6 QBs because of his injuries and that he has had the luxury of sitting in a VERY clean pocket the last couple of years.
I know his injuries are a few years behind him. But 2 ACLs are worrisome in and of itself. What really bothers my are the 2 shoulder injuries. That joint is the most susceptible for re-injury in sports. I love his talent and would be excited to have it on our roster. But, I would also be scared at the same time.