Hello all. I’ve finally been given the OK to post SOME of what has been in the works with the draft around the corner. This post also includes some information regarding the TOP 10. Let’s get started.
- It is fully believed that the 1st two picks will be Caleb Williams and Jayden Daniels respectively. Conversations have already been had with Daniels representatives and the Commanders FO. They have told Daniels that he is the pick.
- The Patriots are highest on (Caleb Williams assumed not available) Daniels, followed by Michael Penix Jr. and Bo Nix. They don’t like the inconsistency they see from Drake Maye and are scared only the lack of volume shown by McCarthy. They want a QB that is mature and tested. Someone they feel comfortable playing Year 1 and can execute at a high level. If Daniels is gone, the Patriots seem keen on trading down. However, they seem to be less likely to trade with the Giants as they value having multiple picks in the 2024 draft rather than future 2025 picks (which would bode well for the Vikings). While they need help at WR, they are likely to pass up one of the top options for more draft capital and one of Penix/Nix.
- If the Patriots trade out with Minnesota, the strong belief now is that Minnesota would go with JJ McCarthy over Drake Maye at 3. Kevin O’ Connell is said to like McCarthy’s ability to efficiently read defenses and properly distribute the ball to the correct read. McCarthy also has the arm strength to challenge all parts of the field. It’s said the Vikings are throwing the smokescreen that they like Maye as a way not to alarm the Giants, who many believe want McCarthy over Maye as well.
- The Giants have seemingly boxed out of #3. But they have a good shot at a trade to #4 as GM Ossenfort doesn’t want to trade out of the top 8. Arizona has a good haul of picks as is, but they would take a slight trade back to #6 if it meant an extra pick or two. (Reportedly it would take #6, #70, and a 2025 2nd)
- The Giants HAVE been throwing QB smokescreens and it’s viewed that they ideally want McCarthy over Maye as well. They have been using the Eli connection and the Josh Allen comps to lead teams to believe they want Maye via trade up, however, they see where Josh Allen was as a prospect and where Drake Maye is a prospect as vastly different. Allen famously didn’t have a QB coach during his time at Wyoming and was strictly succeeding off pure athletic ability. Maye has had coaching and tutelage, yet his fundamentals and processing are notably off compared to others in the class.
The belief that is building around McCarthy is that Harbaugh kind of handcuffed him a bit in Michigan’s offense. “He routinely had to convert 3rd and 5+ when he was called on to throw and he ranks right there with Caleb Williams in those situations.”
- if McCarthy, Nabers, and MHJ are off the board, the Giants would rather trade back and accumulate more picks. They like Rome Odunze, but would rather more picks to fill other areas and taking another option later in the draft at WR.
- In a trade down scenario the Giants strongly favor Quinyon Mitchell and DTs Johnny Newton and Byron Murphy.
- If the Giants can get a QB in the first, they will attempt to flip a pick for a Vet WR (Brandon Aiyuk, Tee Higgins, DeAndre Hopkins)
I should be getting one more check in before the draft.
If he has strong conviction on a QB go get him via a trade up otherwise we will always be in rebuild mode unfortunately imo.
Well written and very concise
Great job!
@art_stapleton
Who is privy to Joe Schoen's thinking regarding #NYGiants draft plans?
Here's my best guess at his inner circle, and I'm not even sure he will have shared exact details with this entire group (not in specific order):
John Mara
Brandon Brown
Tim McDonnell
Dennis Hickey
Brian Daboll
Ryan Cowden
Yeah, that's it for me. There are others very involved in the process. But as far as what Joe shares, I don't think it'd go beyond that group.
Something to keep in mind. In 2019, the asshats were all saying defense at 6 and QB at 17.
Start Maye in 2025 with most of your draft capital and healthy cap in tact.
McCarthy would be the opposite of what they are looking for in a franchise QB.
I fully expect JJM to be off the board, therefore I think Nabers will be the pick.
Again, based on what the “wink wink” was by the OP, it is way more believable that the Giants’ draft plan is actually:
1) Drake Maye
2) Rome Odunze
3) Trade down
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I read the whole thread... GoDeep said if JJM is gone and Nabers is there... they will take Nabers.
I fully expect JJM to be off the board, therefore I think Nabers will be the pick.
Again, based on what the “wink wink” was by the OP, it is way more believable that the Giants’ draft plan is actually:
1) Drake Maye
2) Rome Odunze
3) Trade down
RE: With Maye and Nabers as my top choices
GoDeep13 : 4/19/2024 5:55 pm : link : reply
In comment 16475787 UberAlias said:
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I REALLY hope that you're wrong, lol. But love that you're sharing!
They would take Nabers at 6 if there so don’t be sad just yet!
You deserve to have Daniel Jones trotting back out there for season number 6 and you deserve the fucking shit fest that is sure to follow. You can keep repeating this same bullshit over and over again all you want but bw is right. If they honestly looked at ALL of the QBs available not only in this draft but also QBs that were available in FA/trades this offseason and came away thinking NONE of them were worth moving on from Jones for, then they absolutely suck at their jobs and they deserve the same outcome as you do
You’ve got the wrong guy. I’m perfectly happy to replace Jones. I’m also not so myopic about it to believe that any QB will be an improvement. The idea that we have to get a QB is what got us Jones.
When you know that Jones isn't your solution and/or in your future plans at QB then you should start taking some measurable risks to replace him. The risk of doing nothing has to be worse than taking some swings with prospects to find a better starting QB.
Even last year, Schoen and Daboll should have learned when the backup QBs played that the offense's and their respective performances weren't all that much different than when their $160M man played. You can even argue it was better throwing the ball downfield and passing TDs. And these were clear-cut backup NFL players.
They simply have to TRY to get better at QB.
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Art Stapleton
@art_stapleton
Who is privy to Joe Schoen's thinking regarding #NYGiants draft plans?
Here's my best guess at his inner circle, and I'm not even sure he will have shared exact details with this entire group (not in specific order):
John Mara
Brandon Brown
Tim McDonnell
Dennis Hickey
Brian Daboll
Ryan Cowden
Yeah, that's it for me. There are others very involved in the process. But as far as what Joe shares, I don't think it'd go beyond that group.
Something to keep in mind. In 2019, the asshats were all saying defense at 6 and QB at 17.
They switched it very late due to worry Jones wouldn't make it to #17. I got the word a couple nights before the draft but didn't think they'd pick him at #6. Disbelief.
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I read the whole thread... GoDeep said if JJM is gone and Nabers is there... they will take Nabers.
I fully expect JJM to be off the board, therefore I think Nabers will be the pick.
Again, based on what the “wink wink” was by the OP, it is way more believable that the Giants’ draft plan is actually:
1) Drake Maye
2) Rome Odunze
3) Trade down
It never ceases to amaze me how all the signs (to you) always point to the Giants having the same exact player evaluations as you.
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In comment 16476362 KingBlue said:
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I read the whole thread... GoDeep said if JJM is gone and Nabers is there... they will take Nabers.
I fully expect JJM to be off the board, therefore I think Nabers will be the pick.
Again, based on what the “wink wink” was by the OP, it is way more believable that the Giants’ draft plan is actually:
1) Drake Maye
2) Rome Odunze
3) Trade down
RE: With Maye and Nabers as my top choices
GoDeep13 : 4/19/2024 5:55 pm : link : reply
In comment 16475787 UberAlias said:
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I REALLY hope that you're wrong, lol. But love that you're sharing!
They would take Nabers at 6 if there so don’t be sad just yet!
Yes but if you keep reading he also says he is allowed to say only what he has said, not some other stuff he seems to know, and this could very well be misdirection. Him, or Eric, even go wink-wink, so we don't know if he was told this as fact or misdirection. Plus other asshats on this thread were told no way we take JJM. So who really knows.
Something to keep in mind. In 2019, the asshats were all saying defense at 6 and QB at 17.
With what we know now,that was the plan until the last second.
I'm right there with you, Eric but something tells me GD13 is on to something. I'm warming up to trading down and accumulating more picks. Also, I am curious to see if Daboll can get something out of Lock as I think he could very well be the starter on day 1.
fwiw to Sean’s 8:40 AM Schoen mentions Hickey in his pre-draft presser. The involvement in Schoen’s assessment of how to approach this inflection draft (we hope) of multiple professionals allows me some confidence they will make the best decisions given the constraints, e.g., Vikings and draft capital.
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Art Stapleton
@art_stapleton
Who is privy to Joe Schoen's thinking regarding #NYGiants draft plans?
Here's my best guess at his inner circle, and I'm not even sure he will have shared exact details with this entire group (not in specific order):
John Mara
Brandon Brown
Tim McDonnell
Dennis Hickey
Brian Daboll
Ryan Cowden
Yeah, that's it for me. There are others very involved in the process. But as far as what Joe shares, I don't think it'd go beyond that group.
Something to keep in mind. In 2019, the asshats were all saying defense at 6 and QB at 17.
They switched it very late due to worry Jones wouldn't make it to #17. I got the word a couple nights before the draft but didn't think they'd pick him at #6. Disbelief.
This is just unbelievable. I put more care into drafting a team in Madden.
We are currently entering into year 3 of the current organization....they should not be responsible for the previous decade.....as most of the current leaders were not here.
+1
Schoen/Daboll were brought due to their success building a top NFL offense in Buffalo, centered in the passing game. Yet if this rumor is true, They will have taken ZERO swings on an offensive skill player in the first two rounds other than an overdrafted gadget guy in 2022. They need to stop hiding behind Gettleman guys on offense, whether it’s Jones, Slayton, or Barkley - I thought letting Barkley go was as major step in an overhaul but apparently not.
You say there’s too many holes in the roster? Well, the time for filling holes was Schoen’s first two years at the helm, where he had a surplus of picks that have mostly turned out to be question marks or simply have been traded. No more holes excuses, get some actual difference makers.
You say they need to build the trenches? That’s what the OL signings and Burns trade was for. Plus, trench building is not what Schoen and Daboll are even known for! If we want a big tough 80s cliche team with anonymous guys at the skill positions, just put the Titans people in charge.
They switched it very late due to worry Jones wouldn't make it to #17. I got the word a couple nights before the draft but didn't think they'd pick him at #6. Disbelief.
Josh Allen was sitting there at 6 and, I’m guessing in most all our minds, he was to be the pick, felt very good about that. gobsmacked
Or get neither one..
Take a WR
or Dont take a WR and trade down... unless no one wants to trade up..
Got it.. crystal clear..
The Giants will not be able to pull off a trade with NE because the Pats like what Minn has to offer (two 1sts this year) so they are boxed out.
If the Giants target (Maye) makes it to 4, they will explore trading up. AZ is a good partner because they ideally would stay in range for one of the big 3 WR.
If the Giants land a QB, they will want a vet WR - which leads us to Aiyuk, Higgins, or Hopkins - which I imagine is a cheaper alternative if they cannot swing a trade for one of the younger guys.
My best case scenario is walking away from this draft with Maye, Aiyuk, and Sinnott or Benson.
The Giants will not be able to pull off a trade with NE because the Pats like what Minn has to offer (two 1sts this year) so they are boxed out.
If the Giants target (Maye) makes it to 4, they will explore trading up. AZ is a good partner because they ideally would stay in range for one of the big 3 WR.
If the Giants land a QB, they will want a vet WR - which leads us to Aiyuk, Higgins, or Hopkins - which I imagine is a cheaper alternative if they cannot swing a trade for one of the younger guys.
My best case scenario is walking away from this draft with Maye, Aiyuk, and Sinnott or Benson.
This is a quality take.
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They switched it very late due to worry Jones wouldn't make it to #17. I got the word a couple nights before the draft but didn't think they'd pick him at #6. Disbelief.
Josh Allen was sitting there at 6 and, I’m guessing in most all our minds, he was to be the pick, felt very good about that. gobsmacked
Then they would have traded up for DJ and not gotten Dexy. The smart move would have been Allen and Dexy, but we know Gettleman wasn't smart.
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I respect the hell out of GoDeep, but I have a hard time with passing at Maye at #6 given the state of the QB room.
I'm right there with you, Eric but something tells me GD13 is on to something. I'm warming up to trading down and accumulating more picks. Also, I am curious to see if Daboll can get something out of Lock as I think he could very well be the starter on day 1.
No problem with the trade down. Possible problem with passing on Maye if he's there at #6. We have to get the QB this year or next. Obviously don't take a guy you aren't thrilled with. Not sure I buy they don't like Maye. I heard the opposite just a couple of months ago.
The Giants will not be able to pull off a trade with NE because the Pats like what Minn has to offer (two 1sts this year) so they are boxed out.
If the Giants target (Maye) makes it to 4, they will explore trading up. AZ is a good partner because they ideally would stay in range for one of the big 3 WR.
If the Giants land a QB, they will want a vet WR - which leads us to Aiyuk, Higgins, or Hopkins - which I imagine is a cheaper alternative if they cannot swing a trade for one of the younger guys.
My best case scenario is walking away from this draft with Maye, Aiyuk, and Sinnott or Benson.
If we trade up for Maye at 4 and trade for Aiyuk, we won't have a pick for Sinnott or Benson.
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In comment 16475809 Eric from BBI said:
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I respect the hell out of GoDeep, but I have a hard time with passing at Maye at #6 given the state of the QB room.
I'm right there with you, Eric but something tells me GD13 is on to something. I'm warming up to trading down and accumulating more picks. Also, I am curious to see if Daboll can get something out of Lock as I think he could very well be the starter on day 1.
No problem with the trade down. Possible problem with passing on Maye if he's there at #6. We have to get the QB this year or next. Obviously don't take a guy you aren't thrilled with. Not sure I buy they don't like Maye. I heard the opposite just a couple of months ago.
Schefter is suggesting Maye could slide and be there at 6, did anyone see that?
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I didn't see it answered in the OP but I apologize if it's been answered elsewhere in the thread:
Do we know what the plan is at QB if they pick a WR at 6?
Godeep said Rd 1 QB or punt to next year.
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In comment 16476205 Sean said:
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In comment 16476151 Go Terps said:
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People can go into a draft saying "we need a WR", "we need an edge rusher", "we need a corner"...
But you can't say "we need a quarterback". You CAN say "we need a quarterback that fits an extremely precise physical, mental, and emotional profile. If this draft doesn't have that guy we can wait."
The Giants are the guy with the associate's degree in English holding out for a job that pays six figures.
What's incredible is that the far majority of BBI did NOT want any part of Daniel Jones leading up to the draft. And now, those same people don't want to move off him unless the perfect QB prospect falls in their lap.
The Giants need an upgrade at QB. They also need a cheaper QB. Maye, McCarthy, Penix & Nix solve that.
And by the way, the thread linked below is an asshat thread from April 2019 linking NYG with Jones. Some reaction.
I didn't mind the Jones pick. Because I believe in taking swings at QB. I just wanted to move on a lot faster. See the Niners. Link - ( New Window )
The best part of BBI is that it is a record and receipt of historical opinions. I actually uttered the phrase on this historical thread that "Gettleman is too smart to do something as stupid as drafting Daniel Jones at six". How utterly wrong I was!!! And I literally just said on today's thread that no GM in the NFL would be dumb enough to pass on Drake Maye or Jayden Daniels at six! Praying I am not wrong again.
Oh and by the way, I feel exactly the same way about JJM today as I did about DJ exactly five years ago. He is a second/third round talent who would be grossly overdrafted at six.
Go back to 1983, when 26 GMs passed on Dan Marino, who threw the ball as well as anyone I've ever seen. If that many GMs could pass on Marino, they sure as hell could pass on Maye.
You are absolutely right! To this day, that is the most head scratching draft day miss I have ever seen. It was shocking he wasn't the first quarterback off the board in the first round, let alone the last. I was pounding the table hard for Marino and instead we took Terry Kinard. Good player, but yet another gruesome "reach for need" with Marino sitting there.
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In comment 16476235 The Mike said:
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In comment 16476205 Sean said:
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In comment 16476151 Go Terps said:
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People can go into a draft saying "we need a WR", "we need an edge rusher", "we need a corner"...
But you can't say "we need a quarterback". You CAN say "we need a quarterback that fits an extremely precise physical, mental, and emotional profile. If this draft doesn't have that guy we can wait."
The Giants are the guy with the associate's degree in English holding out for a job that pays six figures.
What's incredible is that the far majority of BBI did NOT want any part of Daniel Jones leading up to the draft. And now, those same people don't want to move off him unless the perfect QB prospect falls in their lap.
The Giants need an upgrade at QB. They also need a cheaper QB. Maye, McCarthy, Penix & Nix solve that.
And by the way, the thread linked below is an asshat thread from April 2019 linking NYG with Jones. Some reaction.
I didn't mind the Jones pick. Because I believe in taking swings at QB. I just wanted to move on a lot faster. See the Niners. Link - ( New Window )
The best part of BBI is that it is a record and receipt of historical opinions. I actually uttered the phrase on this historical thread that "Gettleman is too smart to do something as stupid as drafting Daniel Jones at six". How utterly wrong I was!!! And I literally just said on today's thread that no GM in the NFL would be dumb enough to pass on Drake Maye or Jayden Daniels at six! Praying I am not wrong again.
Oh and by the way, I feel exactly the same way about JJM today as I did about DJ exactly five years ago. He is a second/third round talent who would be grossly overdrafted at six.
Go back to 1983, when 26 GMs passed on Dan Marino, who threw the ball as well as anyone I've ever seen. If that many GMs could pass on Marino, they sure as hell could pass on Maye.
You are absolutely right! To this day, that is the most head scratching draft day miss I have ever seen. It was shocking he wasn't the first quarterback off the board in the first round, let alone the last. I was pounding the table hard for Marino and instead we took Terry Kinard. Good player, but yet another gruesome "reach for need" with Marino sitting there.
He was a partner that liked cochise, I thought that was the reason he slid?
The Giants will not be able to pull off a trade with NE because the Pats like what Minn has to offer (two 1sts this year) so they are boxed out.
If the Giants target (Maye) makes it to 4, they will explore trading up. AZ is a good partner because they ideally would stay in range for one of the big 3 WR.
If the Giants land a QB, they will want a vet WR - which leads us to Aiyuk, Higgins, or Hopkins - which I imagine is a cheaper alternative if they cannot swing a trade for one of the younger guys.
My best case scenario is walking away from this draft with Maye, Aiyuk, and Sinnott or Benson.
I agree with this approach. Maye or Nabers would be the most sensible outcome for the first pick, with a trade up to four likely required to get Maye if the Pats do not take him. If it is Nabers at six, though, it sounds like a quarterback is then off the table and we are running it back with DJ for a sixth year. Hopefully they will still consider moving up to take a Penix or take a Milton as a development pick on day three. Hard to believe they will not take a quarterback at any point in this draft.
Also, what if we have a deal in place with AZ and we are happy with either Maye, JJM or in the unlikely event Daniels is there? That's one scenario where I could see GoDeep being given the green light to post this. Maybe the part he's leaving out is that we have a deal in place to get to 4 and they like JJM+Maye both in the same tier? Perhaps they prefer Maye slightly to JJM and their trying to influence that, but they are good with either at the reported cost of pick 6, 70 and 2025 1st. That's one of the only scenarios in which I could see him being the greenlight to leak this info. In that situation, leaking this info can't hurt us if we are set to get either one.
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publicly on an internet website? Is letting the world know they we don't want Maye really useful?
I won’t say you or right or wrong. I will even potentially undercut myself by saying I have been told what I CAN say and what I CAN’T say.
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In comment 16475807 PatersonPlank said:
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publicly on an internet website? Is letting the world know they we don't want Maye really useful?
I won’t say you or right or wrong. I will even potentially undercut myself by saying I have been told what I CAN say and what I CAN’T say.
Wink, wink, nod, nod.
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You are wrong on the Vikings, however. They are ALL IN on Maye. And if they trade up, it will be for him.
Love to hear this, if we could get JJM without having to trade a king's ransom that has been my ideal first round for months. Are you the one with the Vikings insider friend?
Yes.
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In comment 16475850 Sky King said:
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You are wrong on the Vikings, however. They are ALL IN on Maye. And if they trade up, it will be for him.
Love to hear this, if we could get JJM without having to trade a king's ransom that has been my ideal first round for months. Are you the one with the Vikings insider friend?
Yes.
Then we will see if GoDeep's source was telling outright lies or not soon.
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In comment 16476121 BleedBlue46 said:
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In comment 16475850 Sky King said:
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You are wrong on the Vikings, however. They are ALL IN on Maye. And if they trade up, it will be for him.
Love to hear this, if we could get JJM without having to trade a king's ransom that has been my ideal first round for months. Are you the one with the Vikings insider friend?
Yes.
Then we will see if GoDeep's source was telling outright lies or not soon.
His source might not be telling lies. The person his source got the info from could be or the team changed directions.
Leading up to the 2014 NFL Draft my friend was in a lower position than he currently is. He told me around 3 weeks prior to the draft that his team was going to select a player and it was a done deal provided the player was available at their pick. Maybe an hour before the draft he sent me corrected info saying they were choosing a different player (They did in fact pass on the original player and take the 2nd player) So did they really change directions in the hour leading up to the draft or was the original info given to him complete bullshit? He's someone that's involved in the draft process, but up until a couple hours before the draft he had no clue who his own team was going to take.
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In comment 16476857 Sky King said:
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In comment 16476121 BleedBlue46 said:
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In comment 16475850 Sky King said:
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You are wrong on the Vikings, however. They are ALL IN on Maye. And if they trade up, it will be for him.
Love to hear this, if we could get JJM without having to trade a king's ransom that has been my ideal first round for months. Are you the one with the Vikings insider friend?
Yes.
Then we will see if GoDeep's source was telling outright lies or not soon.
His source might not be telling lies. The person his source got the info from could be or the team changed directions.
Leading up to the 2014 NFL Draft my friend was in a lower position than he currently is. He told me around 3 weeks prior to the draft that his team was going to select a player and it was a done deal provided the player was available at their pick. Maybe an hour before the draft he sent me corrected info saying they were choosing a different player (They did in fact pass on the original player and take the 2nd player) So did they really change directions in the hour leading up to the draft or was the original info given to him complete bullshit? He's someone that's involved in the draft process, but up until a couple hours before the draft he had no clue who his own team was going to take.
True, I didn't write that correctly. I should have said we will see how much smoke there is here soon. I appreciate the correction.
Any link to this? I must have missed it.
Good points on both posts. We had some near losses and near wins that canceled out, but failing to trade Saquon really hurt our chances at a higher pick. That wad dumb.
Is someone really going to take him at #3 ahead of Maye?
The NFL drafts the most talented college players. What separates players in the NFL is the ability to handles adversity. It is why it is so hard to project and evaluate college. In most cases these kids have been the best players on their respective teams their entire lives. In many cases it has been easy for t hem. they can just play and everyone loves them.
It builds low character. When these low character dudes are suddenly punched in the mouth every day by people as good or better, most of them fold. This is amplified at the QB position. I don’t get the interviews but my suspicion is the guy most ready to handle the NFL is McCarthy IMO and it is not close. His age is a big plus. The ceiling is a cleaner Brett Favre.
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Are you saying that if Maye is there at #6, they would pass on him?
Yes. They would use him for trade bait
It was GoDeep13 not prettyrickey that said this. My bad